Thanks again for yet another excellent video. I can watch the current ones now since I'm finally almost caught up through much binge watching of your catalog. Looking forward to the next one.
+scholagladiatoria *Some type of polearms had guards a short distance down the shaft from the head.* Some glaives had disc guards integrated into the tang retention, and boar spears had the wings at the double-edged head's base for rudimentary cross-guards. In Japan, not every fief's Lord-President had 鐔 _tuba_ specificated for 薙刀 _naginata._ In contrast, the Hindu developed parrying weapons such as demipikes with stirrup knuckleguards integrated into their grips.
You should do a video on the evolution of Indian swords and Sri Lankan swords. I can't really find any solid examples of pre 14th/15th century Indian swords or sri lankan swords. I mean like from the first century to the 14th. Like how did it compare to what the romans used etc.
I'd love something like that too. From my understanding in large northern india of that time Persian and mongolic designs dominated but I can't find anything comprehensive on south
One thing we tend to forget about is the symbolism: cross guarded swords remind people of a cross, which was a pretty powerful symbol in medieval Europe
Very unlikely that this actually influenced the design. Archeological finds in Germanic burial sites from around the 6th-7th century have included helmets which were completely plastered in Christian symbols like crosses, fish, etc. The people buried there were obviously devout Christians who wanted to display the fact that they were. Yet we don't see the familiar crossguard shape appear until several centuries later. If religious symbolism had been the reason for the crossguard design, you would expect it to appear much earlier than it did. It's more likely to have practical reasons, e.g. 1) advances in metallurgy made new armor designs feasible, 2) as a result of the better armor, shields didn't need to be as large, 3) which in turn meant larger hand guards were less likely to get caught on your own shield while fighting *and* also made hand protection other than the shield more important. I'm not saying this is the exact train of logic the development followed, but something along these lines is far more likely due to the fact that Christianity was established in Europe for a very long time before crossguards became a thing.
@@nindger4270 Yes, I'm not saying that the crossguard was invented for symbolic purposes only. What I meant is that once it was invented (for the reasons you stated), it became very popular also because of the symbolism. The idea of the knight as a defender of the Faith was spread during the Crusades (before that, knights and people who went to war in general were considered doomed to Hell). So, I'm not saying that the symbolism inspired the design, but I'm not excluding that it contributed a lot to its popularity.
8:10 “axes and maces, do these have hand protection?” After saying that, I can’t stop imagining a Dane axe with two basket hilts for each hand... And great video, cheers mate!
Problem I think with a Dane axe with basket hilts is that your hands don't always stay in the same position when using one, no? Like you'd hold it more toward the bottom for a power swing, but have a hand higher up the hilt for a thrust, or if you were parrying an overheard blow from a mace. And if that's the case, that would mean the basket hilt would impede your ability to adjust your hand position. If you look at polearms that do have a guard, it's usually about halfway up the handle, leaving plenty of room for sliding your hands around.
It is also worth noting that sword wounds were relatively rare in Japan for the 14th, 15th, and 16th centuries. Of the records we have, Swords caused a third of recorded wounds in 1333 to 1338, 12% in 1350-5, and somewhat under 19% of all hand held weapon wounds from 1467-1600 (pikes caused 81% of hand held injuries, so 19% were swords and Naginatas). A particular campaign from 1527 mentions 5 sword wounds vs 14 pike wounds. Arrows cause the other wounds in the earlier period, and from 1467 until 1600, arrows are 58%, bullets 28%, and stones 13% of projectile wounds (likely from chinese style three barrel hand cannon). Projectile wounds are 75% of total wounds for the same time period. Thomas D. Conlan in Graff, David A.. The Cambridge History of War: Volume 2, War and the Medieval World (p. 537, 547-550). Cambridge University Press. Of course, this is in a military context, so I don't know if civilian fighting wound were recorded in Japan (or Europe), so we wouldn't really know anything comparative without a huge amount of work.
It's very funny when everyone keep saying that the cross guard is safer than the disc guard but when i actually used both for sparring, the risk of getting hand snipes are the same from both weapons. I rarely use Longpoint although to alot of people, it's the safest guard despite the fact it's the guard that exposed your hand for snipings. So Longsword or katana, i always keep the sword rest on my shoulder since it's the most secure option for both offense and defense, the guard in this case doesn't matter unless you're in a bind or trying to use murder stroke. Only with late rswords with D guard or basket guard, i would put it forward since they're secure enough
"unless you're in a bind or trying to use a murderstroke" I think that's exactly the point. It's not hand protection so much as allows certain techniques. The European T shape of the guard is very useful in the winding and binding of HEMA wheras the small circle hand stop is far less so. However, that's kinda the point. They don't do winding and binding as much in Asia which makes such a T shape far less useful.
@@Alex_Fahey I'm not entirely sure I agree with crossguards being better in the bind. If you want to "trap" a blade or completely stop it perhaps, but crossguards only protect in one axis, and it's pretty easy to get a blade onto somebody's fingers in binding actions that a disc guard would prevent. I'm still relatively new to European sword work, though.
@@corrugatedcavalier5266 it's not as easg if they know what they're doing, also in binds real swords (aka sharp ones) tend to be very sticky unless you rotate one to connect with the flat which would make such a maneuver even harder. I've never tried hand sniping when practicing with sharp things for obvious reason though so I can't be sure >< However you're right that it is definitely easier than in case of a disc-kind of thing. Nagels and early baskets protect specifically the outside part of hand for a reason
@@Sk0lzky Absolutely, as Matt says skill in not getting your hands cut is one form of hand protection, so that always comes into play. And I'm glad you're not practicing hand sniping with sharps!
I think the point about disc guards projecting all around, especially on the flat of the blade, is often underestimated. It's like a previous point made on the width of the blade being protection, when a blade comes at an angle, the edge can still get your hand on the flat of the blade.
Yeah, messer nagels, side-rings, and the entire specialized hilts of parrying daggers were developments regarding that plane. A lot of the angles that they were used in leave the hand very exposed with a straight quillion set, where a third projection or disk guard will generally cover it.
It has something to do with keeping the edge facing upward in the scabbard so gravity isn't dulling your weapon as it rattles around inside or just resting on its edge, and the way it's drawn out of the scabbard from there. Basically it has something to do with keeping your sword sharper longer.
as far as I know, the scabbard was rotated to make archery more comfortable (and, more generally, to prevent the sword from hindering the use of the primary weapon, such as a polearm or a spear).
@@hrodvitnir6725 I would say stance and doctrine. Chinese and Korean martial arts have a more flexible stance on the draw. (Even Gurkhas are expected to be able to draw the Kukri from the back) As for doctrine, I believe it's customary to wear the swords at he back as a sign of politeness, especially at court. (Japanese do not wear their swords at court or avoid presenting them. Presumably the same for China and Korea)
This is a question I had aswell: in a lot of Kenjutsu schools of thought you see people practicing blocking with anything but the edge. Seeing the tendency for the hardened part of japanese swords to chip at edge on edge contact would encourage sideways blocking and thusly facitlitating a type of guard giving you sideways protection. Iincidentally chips were a reason why hamons on japanese swords over time developed from the straight "suguha" hamon towards more wavy hamons with Ashi, the little softer projections in towards the blade to limit the potential maximum size of a chip. Only the hardened area in between two ashi would tend to break out, kind of like a missing tooth if you will. With a suguha it could happen, that you would get a split all the way along the hamon and lose the entire hardened area. Ofc. there also were suguha hamons with ashi, though probably not achieving the same effect to the same extend.
3rd time I’m posting this, you can see from this 1214 Song dynasty painting that Song era swords had substantial cross guards. It’s only in the Qing dynasty 1644-1911 that large cross guards disappeared from Chinese swords upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ef/Four_Generals_of_Song.jpg
Those are cross guards, but they're still smaller than many European weapons and as I understand it swords before the Tang Dynasty did not have long quillons.
@@andrewk.5575 No, but Tang dynasty was pre-Viking Age. European swords didn’t have large guards either. Those early 13th century guards are not very large but still comparable to arming swords of the era.
@@Obi-WanKannabis They weren’t large but not out of place with European swords of the time. Here’s a painting from the Ming dynasty 1368-1644 upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/78/山文甲.jpg?1611726049192
if you haven't done it already, I'd love to see some time a video about the culture and circumstances that made 17-1900s Indian swords such a noted part of your collection; there seems to be such a diverse range there and I'd love to know more about it
I'm an aspiring artist and I've been following your content for a while now. I appreciate your approach to presenting information. I don't know how interested I'd be in prop design and drawing swords as I am now without videos like yours. Keep up the great work!
Could be a relation between the size of the guard and shield? Could using a larger shield lead to the use of smaller guards to make easier working around it? And when shields become smaller guards grow larger to compensate it
Yes for circle guard, not for the T shape. As long as the guard doesn't protrude to the left and right then it won't coflict much with shield. That is probably why the European style which relied heavily on shields developed into the relatively narrow and long T shape.
@Andrew Gray I think that just supports my point. The Japanese who rarely if ever used large shields in the hand had no need to narrow the guard perpendicularly to the blade and simply stuck with disc guards that varied in size. Those who did use shields in combat often (Europeans in general, Chinese, etc.) had guards that usually stuck out substantially on the front and back but not on the sides like with the innumerable variants of the European arming sword or the Chinese dao. When Europeans began moving away form that sword and shield style, they started adding additionally hand protection like ring guards or entire basket hilts. It seems that the perpendicular-to-the-blade hand protection is only a phenomenon when shields are not in play.
In a lot of chinese martial arts doctrines, you choke your hand up against the guard be it disc or cross to get more weapon control, like edge alignment or leverage for hacking, hand protection was secondary.
lovely video as always bud. it never occurred to me how these very minimal guards provide just enough guard to protect against the hand smashing against a shield during battle. thanks bud
Hey there, Matt, here's a little funny realization I've just had: Coming as it does from a traditionally "crossguard-centric" arms development tradition (if such a term even exists, that is), the katzbalger sports twisted quillons that are shaped like an S and pretty much cover the same surface area a disc guard would. Convergent evolution, or cross-pollination?
I think convergent evolution is more likely. As far as I know, only Portugal has examples of katanas appearing and that's in some artwork in the background.
Ive been watching quite a few videos lately with regards to swords and various other forms of weaponry. Im going to thank you for an honest comparison of handguards. I also want to add the most overlooked aspect of weapon design is the physical stature of the peoples in question. Smaller Hands dis not need a 6inch cross guard for a 3 or 4 inch hand. and also the modern Katana disc is quite a bit smaller than the original. well done sir. well done indeed.
You've gotten better in keeping things more concise. Thats great, especially for new watchers i think but I somewhat miss those long tangents. Thats often where the juicy details lie.
Really enjoy the historical what if type vids. I'm curious about the Portuguese and Japanese confrontations. I know way back you may have touched on it but that would be a nice hilt and hand protection cross examination video.
On my second class of longsword, one of the guys got his fingers injured. Handguards perhaps encourage you to "feel" that your hans are safe, which means less care in safe keeping them.
Great content, as always. You mentioned that there's been a lot of change in sword design in India. I've found that really interesting, I think that's a very cool topic for a future video.
I've seen the type of guard typically found on an Asian sword fitted on a polearm like a naginata before. I believe it's just something the asians do for the sake of mass production because they can fit on both interchangeably. Like mentioned in the video, a crossguard would probably not make sense for a polearm because a user would usually want to be able to retract the weapon. So I'm thinking maybe the popularity of disc guards isn't because they offer the most hand protection, but because weapons maker can mass produce them and fit then on every types of weapons.
i have it on good authority from reliable sources they were far more concerned about assassins jumping on them from 4th story windows, so it probably was all for show, yeah
I have heard something like that before, knights thought it was pretty cool that they carried around something that looks like a huge sharpened metal war-crucifix.
The ancient falcata having a knuckle guard has often perplexed me lately. Museum examples often have them but I rarely see these knuckle guards in artistic depictions (mainly vases), so I wonder whether some poor museum workers restored more knuckle bows than should rightly be there. could also be an issue of time period, I havent actually dug enough into when the vases were made compared to the surviving swords to conclude that it was a development of a certain time. Or even region for that matter although I doubt there are main surviving examples of theses swords with a known provenance.
Another thing to keep in mind: even in Japan and East Asia, there were times when more robust hand protection beyond the cross guard and disk guard did come in and out of fashion and even had parallels to certain complex guard designs of European swords. I think this was brought up before regarding the jian and the so-called Han Dynasty "fencing jian" that was mentioned in previous reviews of LK Chen swords ( lkchensword.com/sparring-shield-guard ) as well as the s-shaped guard seen on so-called "taiji dao" ( www.militariahub.com/wp-content/gallery/chinese-nationalist-dadao-sword/chinese-nationalist-dadao-sword-12.jpg?x70606 ), butterfly swords ( chinesemartialstudies.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/hudiedao-63cm-40mm-14mm.jpg ), and on Dadao ( archive.mandarinmansion.com/images/fine-dadao/dadao.jpg ) seen in late Qing and Republic of China Period. As for Japan, a similar design to the Han fencing jian with a knucklebow (sometimes multiple) was adopted during the Kofun period and seemed to have been remade multiple times throughout Japanese history called the Tamamaki no Tachi ( heritageofjapan.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/image9.jpg ) ( upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f8/Metals_and_metal-working_in_old_Japan_%281915%29_%2814780689391%29.jpg ) ( cdn.globalauctionplatform.com/db84815d-a49b-4586-baae-a5600101d894/87fbfc92-66ef-4c5f-edf2-3d955498cdd2/original.jpg ) ( livedoor.blogimg.jp/ohgetsu/imgs/6/5/65ee9461.jpg ). What also deserves a mention is that the Japanese did combine European designs of guard with traditional Japanese blades to create the Kyu-gunto ( stcroixblades.com/assets/uploads/images/03-01-17/naval_kyu-gunto_samurai_sword_7-001.JPG ).
I once watched the Princess Bride, and I feel that makes me qualified to comment. In that movie, the Carrie Strug defeats Mandy Rose despite Mandy having a heavier, more elaborate guard on their sword. This clearly demonstrates that, since mass scales to negatively to the speed at which a sword can be waved around, the smaller guard provides a massive tactical advantage. In fact, the closer the mass of the guard gets to zero, the more the waving around velocity would near the speed of light, as per Sergei Eisenstein's theory of Relationships, and the closer a sword's striking power would therefore be to infinite. Logically, a sword with no guard would be the most powerful weapon in the universe, obliterating both it, the user and the solar system in which it is located with a single swing. It is irrefutable science!
I think you're correct on that. Those were military swords with hilt designs that were based more on Western designs of the period. I know that by WWII the standard issue officer and NCO swords were more like traditional katanas but with a slightly different hilt design. I recall reading that there were cases of officers that had their family sword refitted with a regulation hilt but the blade dated back to who knows when.
I'm pretty sure I've seen one in a museum but it was a long time ago and I can't remember where it was. The hilt was like a katana but not quite as long and it had a knuckle bow.The sheath had two rings like a saber sheath.
You will find that is the mass-manufactured Kyu Gunto swords of the Meiji period (1868-1912) and Taisho Period (1912- 1926) though with the increased militarism and nativism going into the Early showa period (1926-1989) you will be getting swords which are more reminiscent of the Katana called Shin Gunto. With that being said even in Showa Period you still had the Kyu Gunto Sabers being used and if I remember correctly during the Showa it was more prominent in the Navy. Also while the Kyu Gunto is usually thought of as a saber hilt with a Katana or Wakizashi-looking blade sometimes it was just a curved Saber blade also other times it was a more straight thrust centric calvary blade. You will find different looking examples throughout the extensive Japanese art of the periods depicting military conquests but I don't believe they had different names for the different blades or at least I can't find any Western Sources listing them.
Also here is the only source I know which is the later Meiji Kendo Kyohan which teaches Saber, Bayonet, and Saber on Horseback . www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=14967 Unfortunately, though an interesting source, the Saber taught in it is clearly for Military Tournaments having a ruleset similar to Kendo and not a complete sword system. I had at one point wanted to try to reconstruct the Meiji saber system of mid to late 19th century and while I'm sure there were likely older and more practical treaties dealing with it chances of finding one and it being translated into English is close to nill. I have heard conflicting accounts of it being based on a French system but what happened after that but before the Kendo Kyohan I don't know.
The japanese adopted western-style sabre hilts as part of their westernization yes, so other militaries would take them more seriously. A fair few of the old samurai families who joined the new army had old family blades re-hilted in the same fashion, so you can actually find authentic katana blades sporting sabre-style hilts.
You gave maces as an example of weapons that were successful without a guard, however, did they not introduce maces with disk guards later? If anything that shows they did actually believe in the disk guard.
Hello friend, loved the video! I would love to see you talk about the wahaika on the wall! Also, which of the LK Chen swords you’ve handled so far is your favorite? Thanks!
I probably missed this. I'm not a sword person but is it possible that the smaller guard would still protect the hand from sliding forward, say, during a thrust? Thanks Matt, very enjoyable video.
Good video Matt, thank you! I just wanted to chime in with 2 things, [1] that Yuan dynasty (Mongol) sabers/dao had crossguards, as you know from the turko-mongolic sabers, and early Ming era essentially adopted this. During the Ming the concept of the disc guard popularized, giving rise to the forms we now associate with Chinese dao/sabers (Ming-Qing era). and... [2] The below are all post-1600 dao: Here's two late Qing "oxtail" sabers in hand: instagram.com/p/BvU7q-hgxBH/ Here's some more of them: instagram.com/p/BrPArXugu7K/ Here's another one in hand: instagram.com/p/BrNjC9sgrPz/ In the 1800s we do see some East Asian swords adopting ideas from European sword guards, and occasionally blades. Hope ya'll enjoy those pics. No I don't own them anymore, all sold off.
I mean it's not like east Asian warriors kept coming home with mangled hands and missing fingers because their hand guards were ineffective and nobody thought to put a bigger one on, they were obviously fit for purpose for a long time. Interesting to hear about the hand clearance provided for when hitting a shield, very similar concept to a roll hoop in a car.
Fun fact: Theres a metal band based around the whole Maori culture exposed to firearms thing. They're called Alien Weaponry. Check em out! Great video, as always, by the way.
8:00 great point, I mean most shashkas, which I generally consider to be terrible weapons (and I'm in agreement with some people who used it a hundred years ago lol) don't even have a typical hand stop. As to katanas I think that people wrongly associate it with the duelling/self defense context because of the early Edo culture (before the major crackdown on duels and standardisation of policing) and mythology surrounding it, while the weapon was developed as a cavalryman's, often horse archer's, sidearm (much like shashka), and remained largely unchanged without being developed because of cultural reasons (primarily incredible conservatism and traditionalism).
Same is true for Hawaiian history. Each island had various tribes and kings. They of course had periods of peace and conflict like the rest of the world. The Kamehameha line of kings attained rifles and cannons using them in warfare to unite the islands under one ruler.
Hey Matt 👋 I was wondering if you might ever have heard of a man named Thomas Hoyer Monstery, and if you have, what you think of him and his book (Self-defense For Gentlemen and Ladies). He's a very interesting man, and I'm pretty sure you'd love researching him if you haven't already.
A thought, linking a this with another recent video. Are disc guards more associated with differentially hardened blades. i.e. if the edge of you blade is more brittle are you more likely to parry with the side of your sword and therefore need hand protection there?
An unrelated question, but I was just watching a video by SandRhoman History, "The Rise of the Pikeman in Europe", and in one of the illustrations of the Landsknechts, he showed a Doppelsöldner with a two-handed sword that had a wavy blade, a "Flammenschwert" I believe it is called. Ages ago, Lindybeige made a video about how the "Zweihänder" swordsmen would fight their way into a pike block to disrupt them, and I wondered if the point(i know;)) of a wavy blade on such a sword would be to better control multiple pikes as you push them aside to get at the first rank? SandRhoman History video: th-cam.com/video/16U82cmYkEw/w-d-xo.html Lindybeige: th-cam.com/video/DiD3cI3RqJU/w-d-xo.html
Which sword families have more or less protection? I say, before we got things more complex than the simple crossguard, I say they all have more or less protection. In a serious note, I think one should also investigate the development of armor and surrounding aspects. Specifically talking about Japan, from what I could gather, gauntlets start showing up already around the 10th century, even before the samurai became the class more closer to what we think of them today. As I say every time, a disc(ish, plenty of tsuba designs that aren't exactly discs) closes the gaps that the gauntlet doesn't cover, so basically they just took the earlier trend and ran with it since it combines with hand armor so well. And quite honestly, if we are comparing viking era swords or earlier, disc guards do offer more protection overall. In Europe at the same time you have mail hand protection, so something longer might have seemed more attractive. By the time gauntlets become a popular option in Europe too, the crossguard trend is already set in. Honestly, when your hand armor is already more sturdy than mail, that is your primary protection, and both types of guard are just complementing it which they both do differently but about the same. It only makes notable difference in unarmored (including no shields) combat, and that involves many more social considerations than just combat, usually more so.
Are there european swords without cross guard, but WITH a "Nagel" or "pin guard" e. G. langmesser? Swords with a Nagel or hook like thing remind me of the japanese Sais dagger, so minimal protection but you have the chance to maybe catch you opponents weapon and maybe disarm him.
Yes, but those i know of, are more knife than sword. The rugger comes to mind. A large knife either with a nagel or shell guard. And I think some hunting swords come with only shell guards as well
What about ease of access for unseathing of far east swords and religious influence on the European medieval cross guard? Do you think they are a factor as well?
Surely the point of view of utility is dominant in arms , nevertheless what about the symbolic signification of the Cross guard in medieval chivalry ? and , perhaps of the round guard in Asia ( a flower , or something else ? ) ? Thank you Matt for your always interesting explanations
I thought one of the purposes of disc guards and small crossguards were meant to stop the wielder's hand from sliding onto the blade from the grip when thrusting the sword.
I like the comparison between "prevent being hit by enemy" vs "prevent hand sliding up blade", but could you address factors such as cross guard clearing shield/other armor (as in not getting caught on it) and portability (as in comfort of wear on say a long march)
Don't know if you look at that older video, but i have a question. You mentioned the swords of india before the 16th century. So i am interested i those swords, for i have no idea how they looked like. Specially from gupta era or even back in maurya time. Is there any remnants or idea from archeologists how those looked like or is there any archeological evident from that period, so we can say anything about those times sword or generally weapons? Thanks.
Id like to know when it comes to comparison. What about protective gountlets? How much were these in use in europe and in asia? What types of gountlets where there? And how effective were the different types?
samurai armor usually included full hand gauntlets known as 'han kote', which covered the back of the hand and all the fingers up to the first knuckle when the hand was closed. So even without a full hand guard the hand wasn't especially vulnerable.
So much passion, makes 20 min feel like 5 every time. I'm very happy chinese swords get more attention, they deserve it and it's time to put an end to this flimsy wushu blades misconception :)
To use an analogy, there are certain guards that prevent the sword from being comfortably used by the left hand. So if the right hand is injured, you can't really use your left. Similarly, a long cross guard prevents many chinese/japanese guard-and-slash "trick" manoeuvres, / styles. When you master the style, you do not want nor need a long cross guard. This appears to be the reason why the asian sword persists in the form that it does, and why disc guards are so popular here.
Am I the only one who felt like this video was all preamble? I feel like he had just set the stage for an interesting discussion when "well that's all for today folks, stay tuned for" etc. Obviously to some degree any TH-cam video is an ad, if you are getting something for free you are the product and all that, but it seemed much more pronounced in this particular video than what I'm used to from Matt.
The Japanese actually did use crossguard designs sometimes, there are even examples of Japanese made Rapiers, sabers and Smallswords prior to the arrival of the Black Ships.
@scolagladiatoria i know you're primarily a swordsman expert but i heard in one of your previous videos that you mentioned you've been shooting longbows since a teenager. based on your experience, could you do a video or talk about how you think mongols would've done vs Englishmen and/or French had they ever encountered? how do you see the horse archer hordes doing against Western knights and/or formations going up against each other ? thanks :D love the channel
The English developed archery as part of their primary military strategy well after the Mongol empire fell apart, so the two are not especially comparable. Different socioeconomic, logistical, and technological factors by a considerable breadth.
I would say that swords in japan in late medieval or early modern age were more like ceremonial and they were used to follow traditions and in battle they had mainly spears and other weapons, not katanas, so there was probably no reason to improving hand protection on katana, while in China, India, Korea and Europe mainly, people just adopted what was better and what worked and they had much more variety in their swords, they didn't follow some "honor codex" like Samurais which maybe says that you have to carry standardised katana with standardised suba guard. And as we can see in actual history, these honor codexes were followed only in peace time, in war time, Samurais were definitely not honest towards their enemies. Korean swords and other stuff is something we should explore more, I noticed that they have similar experience as my nation (Czechs) with beying smaller brother constantly occupied by some bigger brother and they actually adopted very similar weapons against their opressors, like farmers using flails against samurai, similarly as our peasants were using against crusades in 15th century. Koreans even have kind of similar sense of humor (while I would say that Chinese and Japanese people are very different), I think it's really related to this history of beying constantly occupied by someone.
Anyone know what (European) sword Matt is holding early on in the video when comparing the European & the Japanese sword? If anyone could help out w make and model / where I could get one - I'd highly appreciate it!
Matt, have you talked about langets and their purpose/use? Maybe I missed it... sometimes they seem to be for reinforcement, but sometimes there's a gap between the langet and sides of the blade (tulwars and such come to mind). Are those for binding the opponent's blade?
Erm.... so they say that the Chinese are part Buddhist, Part Confucian and part Taoist. The circle is an important part of the symbology of Taoism, as is the sword itself, and I think that the adoption of the disk guard may well be due to this receptivity to it as a symbol. The same applies, in the Christian Western context to the cross guard, the symbol being so deeply embedded in the culture that it's echo in the form of a sword makes it look 'right'. I don't know, I'm stoned.
With the Silk Road trade, Mongol Invasion of the Middle East, Alexander the Great into Eastern Asia and other trade, exposure to different weapons design and use would have had an effect on the changes in design. Some swords have no guard at all and blades changes are also noted. More research possibilities?
Hand guards for swords not normally used for parrying are likely just to keep your hand from riding up on the blade, not actual hand protection. If you are using a shield you don't need a basket around your hand.
Patreon & Extra Videos: www.patreon.com/scholagladiatoria
Why stop the discussion halfway through the topic? Hand guards clearly developed further in both Europe and Asia.
Thanks again for yet another excellent video. I can watch the current ones now since I'm finally almost caught up through much binge watching of your catalog. Looking forward to the next one.
Make a video about that Polynesian weapon next to your heater shield.
Try making a video series about comparing different armies and units from history for example napoleon's grand army vs the union army of the Potomac
The more you lean in to your archaeological background, the more I enjoy the content. Keep it up. 🍻
"the disk guard was around..."
And Matt Eason failed to realize the humor of the pun he had just made...
Lol
😂😂
@Screw Kalergi very true
That grizzled look really works for you, Matt.
lol that extra scruff made me think of Mads Mikkelsen right away. and that sweater looks so dang comfy
He's got to catch up with the rest of the Sword Gang
+scholagladiatoria *Some type of polearms had guards a short distance down the shaft from the head.* Some glaives had disc guards integrated into the tang retention, and boar spears had the wings at the double-edged head's base for rudimentary cross-guards. In Japan, not every fief's Lord-President had 鐔 _tuba_ specificated for 薙刀 _naginata._ In contrast, the Hindu developed parrying weapons such as demipikes with stirrup knuckleguards integrated into their grips.
The smith was like, "Must be good, no one comes back and complains".
You should do a video on the evolution of Indian swords and Sri Lankan swords. I can't really find any solid examples of pre 14th/15th century Indian swords or sri lankan swords. I mean like from the first century to the 14th. Like how did it compare to what the romans used etc.
Agree 💯 , very interesting subject!!
@Kshitij Raj thanks
I'd love something like that too. From my understanding in large northern india of that time Persian and mongolic designs dominated but I can't find anything comprehensive on south
One thing we tend to forget about is the symbolism: cross guarded swords remind people of a cross, which was a pretty powerful symbol in medieval Europe
Sound logic. In some way they may be believing they are ending enemy "rightly".
Not all pummels are easily removable
Very unlikely that this actually influenced the design. Archeological finds in Germanic burial sites from around the 6th-7th century have included helmets which were completely plastered in Christian symbols like crosses, fish, etc. The people buried there were obviously devout Christians who wanted to display the fact that they were. Yet we don't see the familiar crossguard shape appear until several centuries later. If religious symbolism had been the reason for the crossguard design, you would expect it to appear much earlier than it did.
It's more likely to have practical reasons, e.g.
1) advances in metallurgy made new armor designs feasible,
2) as a result of the better armor, shields didn't need to be as large,
3) which in turn meant larger hand guards were less likely to get caught on your own shield while fighting *and* also made hand protection other than the shield more important.
I'm not saying this is the exact train of logic the development followed, but something along these lines is far more likely due to the fact that Christianity was established in Europe for a very long time before crossguards became a thing.
@@nindger4270 Yes, I'm not saying that the crossguard was invented for symbolic purposes only. What I meant is that once it was invented (for the reasons you stated), it became very popular also because of the symbolism. The idea of the knight as a defender of the Faith was spread during the Crusades (before that, knights and people who went to war in general were considered doomed to Hell). So, I'm not saying that the symbolism inspired the design, but I'm not excluding that it contributed a lot to its popularity.
@@tommasoragghianti7735 thanks for the clarification, completely agree in that case.
Last time I was this early, the first Greek Kopis with a knucklebow was fresh from the forge.
8:10 “axes and maces, do these have hand protection?”
After saying that, I can’t stop imagining a Dane axe with two basket hilts for each hand...
And great video, cheers mate!
What if you mount basket hilts to your wrists? Stay protected even when you lose the weapon!
@@Sk0lzky
Armored gloves: *i sleep*
Hand-attached basket hilts: *I N V E S T M E N T*
Now I need a spear with a giant 4 ft long basket hilt
Problem I think with a Dane axe with basket hilts is that your hands don't always stay in the same position when using one, no? Like you'd hold it more toward the bottom for a power swing, but have a hand higher up the hilt for a thrust, or if you were parrying an overheard blow from a mace. And if that's the case, that would mean the basket hilt would impede your ability to adjust your hand position.
If you look at polearms that do have a guard, it's usually about halfway up the handle, leaving plenty of room for sliding your hands around.
It is also worth noting that sword wounds were relatively rare in Japan for the 14th, 15th, and 16th centuries. Of the records we have, Swords caused a third of recorded wounds in 1333 to 1338, 12% in 1350-5, and somewhat under 19% of all hand held weapon wounds from 1467-1600 (pikes caused 81% of hand held injuries, so 19% were swords and Naginatas). A particular campaign from 1527 mentions 5 sword wounds vs 14 pike wounds.
Arrows cause the other wounds in the earlier period, and from 1467 until 1600, arrows are 58%, bullets 28%, and stones 13% of projectile wounds (likely from chinese style three barrel hand cannon). Projectile wounds are 75% of total wounds for the same time period.
Thomas D. Conlan in Graff, David A.. The Cambridge History of War: Volume 2, War and the Medieval World (p. 537, 547-550). Cambridge University Press.
Of course, this is in a military context, so I don't know if civilian fighting wound were recorded in Japan (or Europe), so we wouldn't really know anything comparative without a huge amount of work.
It's very funny when everyone keep saying that the cross guard is safer than the disc guard but when i actually used both for sparring, the risk of getting hand snipes are the same from both weapons. I rarely use Longpoint although to alot of people, it's the safest guard despite the fact it's the guard that exposed your hand for snipings. So Longsword or katana, i always keep the sword rest on my shoulder since it's the most secure option for both offense and defense, the guard in this case doesn't matter unless you're in a bind or trying to use murder stroke. Only with late rswords with D guard or basket guard, i would put it forward since they're secure enough
"unless you're in a bind or trying to use a murderstroke"
I think that's exactly the point. It's not hand protection so much as allows certain techniques. The European T shape of the guard is very useful in the winding and binding of HEMA wheras the small circle hand stop is far less so. However, that's kinda the point. They don't do winding and binding as much in Asia which makes such a T shape far less useful.
@@Alex_Fahey I'm not entirely sure I agree with crossguards being better in the bind. If you want to "trap" a blade or completely stop it perhaps, but crossguards only protect in one axis, and it's pretty easy to get a blade onto somebody's fingers in binding actions that a disc guard would prevent. I'm still relatively new to European sword work, though.
@@Alex_Fahey I'd say they don't do winding and biding because those swords lack the T-shaped protrusions, not the other way around :v
@@corrugatedcavalier5266 it's not as easg if they know what they're doing, also in binds real swords (aka sharp ones) tend to be very sticky unless you rotate one to connect with the flat which would make such a maneuver even harder. I've never tried hand sniping when practicing with sharp things for obvious reason though so I can't be sure ><
However you're right that it is definitely easier than in case of a disc-kind of thing. Nagels and early baskets protect specifically the outside part of hand for a reason
@@Sk0lzky Absolutely, as Matt says skill in not getting your hands cut is one form of hand protection, so that always comes into play. And I'm glad you're not practicing hand sniping with sharps!
I think the point about disc guards projecting all around, especially on the flat of the blade, is often underestimated. It's like a previous point made on the width of the blade being protection, when a blade comes at an angle, the edge can still get your hand on the flat of the blade.
Yeah, messer nagels, side-rings, and the entire specialized hilts of parrying daggers were developments regarding that plane. A lot of the angles that they were used in leave the hand very exposed with a straight quillion set, where a third projection or disk guard will generally cover it.
Could you explain the pros and cons of wearing your scabbard backwards on your hip? I've seen it several time Chinese and Korean in art. Cheers!
It has something to do with keeping the edge facing upward in the scabbard so gravity isn't dulling your weapon as it rattles around inside or just resting on its edge, and the way it's drawn out of the scabbard from there. Basically it has something to do with keeping your sword sharper longer.
You normally do this if you cross-draw. In drawing you turn the hand to make the draw directly into a hit.
@@seattlesoundisgrunge No not upsideside down. I mean backwards as in having the hilt pointing backwards towards your butt, so to say.
as far as I know, the scabbard was rotated to make archery more comfortable (and, more generally, to prevent the sword from hindering the use of the primary weapon, such as a polearm or a spear).
@@hrodvitnir6725 I would say stance and doctrine.
Chinese and Korean martial arts have a more flexible stance on the draw.
(Even Gurkhas are expected to be able to draw the Kukri from the back)
As for doctrine, I believe it's customary to wear the swords at he back as a sign of politeness, especially at court.
(Japanese do not wear their swords at court or avoid presenting them. Presumably the same for China and Korea)
This is a question I had aswell: in a lot of Kenjutsu schools of thought you see people practicing blocking with anything but the edge. Seeing the tendency for the hardened part of japanese swords to chip at edge on edge contact would encourage sideways blocking and thusly facitlitating a type of guard giving you sideways protection.
Iincidentally chips were a reason why hamons on japanese swords over time developed from the straight "suguha" hamon towards more wavy hamons with Ashi, the little softer projections in towards the blade to limit the potential maximum size of a chip.
Only the hardened area in between two ashi would tend to break out, kind of like a missing tooth if you will. With a suguha it could happen, that you would get a split all the way along the hamon and lose the entire hardened area.
Ofc. there also were suguha hamons with ashi, though probably not achieving the same effect to the same extend.
The katzbalger is a good example of convergent evolution in hand protection, being a European sword with guard of similar dimensions to a large tsuba.
It also has a Top 10 sword name.
3rd time I’m posting this, you can see from this 1214 Song dynasty painting that Song era swords had substantial cross guards. It’s only in the Qing dynasty 1644-1911 that large cross guards disappeared from Chinese swords
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ef/Four_Generals_of_Song.jpg
Those are cross guards, but they're still smaller than many European weapons and as I understand it swords before the Tang Dynasty did not have long quillons.
those seem similar in size to the 2nd sword he showed in the video. A bit longer. Definitely a crossguard, not sure if I'd call them large.
@@andrewk.5575 No, but Tang dynasty was pre-Viking Age. European swords didn’t have large guards either. Those early 13th century guards are not very large but still comparable to arming swords of the era.
@@Obi-WanKannabis They weren’t large but not out of place with European swords of the time. Here’s a painting from the Ming dynasty 1368-1644
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/78/山文甲.jpg?1611726049192
if you haven't done it already, I'd love to see some time a video about the culture and circumstances that made 17-1900s Indian swords such a noted part of your collection; there seems to be such a diverse range there and I'd love to know more about it
I'm an aspiring artist and I've been following your content for a while now. I appreciate your approach to presenting information. I don't know how interested I'd be in prop design and drawing swords as I am now without videos like yours. Keep up the great work!
Great content, as usual. I‘d love to see a video on the Chinese S-Guards and more latter period Chinese swords in general.
Ass soon as Matt says he's gonna keep it short, you know it won't be short. 😂
In his defense, he never said short, he said concise x)
@@PhyreI3ird true!!! :)))
Could be a relation between the size of the guard and shield? Could using a larger shield lead to the use of smaller guards to make easier working around it? And when shields become smaller guards grow larger to compensate it
Yes, but not necessarily.
Not all Asian cultures relied on shields.
Yes for circle guard, not for the T shape. As long as the guard doesn't protrude to the left and right then it won't coflict much with shield. That is probably why the European style which relied heavily on shields developed into the relatively narrow and long T shape.
@Andrew Gray I think that just supports my point. The Japanese who rarely if ever used large shields in the hand had no need to narrow the guard perpendicularly to the blade and simply stuck with disc guards that varied in size. Those who did use shields in combat often (Europeans in general, Chinese, etc.) had guards that usually stuck out substantially on the front and back but not on the sides like with the innumerable variants of the European arming sword or the Chinese dao.
When Europeans began moving away form that sword and shield style, they started adding additionally hand protection like ring guards or entire basket hilts. It seems that the perpendicular-to-the-blade hand protection is only a phenomenon when shields are not in play.
In a lot of chinese martial arts doctrines, you choke your hand up against the guard be it disc or cross to get more weapon control, like edge alignment or leverage for hacking, hand protection was secondary.
So very similar to how the “Viking” sword was used.
lovely video as always bud. it never occurred to me how these very minimal guards provide just enough guard to protect against the hand smashing against a shield during battle. thanks bud
Hey there, Matt, here's a little funny realization I've just had: Coming as it does from a traditionally "crossguard-centric" arms development tradition (if such a term even exists, that is), the katzbalger sports twisted quillons that are shaped like an S and pretty much cover the same surface area a disc guard would. Convergent evolution, or cross-pollination?
I think convergent evolution is more likely. As far as I know, only Portugal has examples of katanas appearing and that's in some artwork in the background.
Ive been watching quite a few videos lately with regards to swords and various other forms of weaponry. Im going to thank you for an honest comparison of handguards. I also want to add the most overlooked aspect of weapon design is the physical stature of the peoples in question. Smaller Hands dis not need a 6inch cross guard for a 3 or 4 inch hand. and also the modern Katana disc is quite a bit smaller than the original. well done sir. well done indeed.
Great vid Matt. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experience with us. Always appreciate your work.
You've gotten better in keeping things more concise. Thats great, especially for new watchers i think but I somewhat miss those long tangents. Thats often where the juicy details lie.
Really enjoy the historical what if type vids. I'm curious about the Portuguese and Japanese confrontations. I know way back you may have touched on it but that would be a nice hilt and hand protection cross examination video.
On my second class of longsword, one of the guys got his fingers injured. Handguards perhaps encourage you to "feel" that your hans are safe, which means less care in safe keeping them.
It is 5 am in Malaysia. Morning folks 💪
Man, Matt's video quality has gotten SO good.
Great content, as always. You mentioned that there's been a lot of change in sword design in India. I've found that really interesting, I think that's a very cool topic for a future video.
Love your videos. Such a massive knowledgebase. Thank you
I've seen the type of guard typically found on an Asian sword fitted on a polearm like a naginata before. I believe it's just something the asians do for the sake of mass production because they can fit on both interchangeably.
Like mentioned in the video, a crossguard would probably not make sense for a polearm because a user would usually want to be able to retract the weapon. So I'm thinking maybe the popularity of disc guards isn't because they offer the most hand protection, but because weapons maker can mass produce them and fit then on every types of weapons.
How much of the crossguard was due to Templars needing a cross shaped thing to match their tabards?
i have it on good authority from reliable sources they were far more concerned about assassins jumping on them from 4th story windows, so it probably was all for show, yeah
Not much, seeing it was tiny group on virtually the other end of the world from Europe.
I have heard something like that before, knights thought it was pretty cool that they carried around something that looks like a huge sharpened metal war-crucifix.
@@petriew2018 lol
I'm so early hand guards haven't even been invented yet.
Please do more vids on Chinese dao and European falchions.
The ancient falcata having a knuckle guard has often perplexed me lately. Museum examples often have them but I rarely see these knuckle guards in artistic depictions (mainly vases), so I wonder whether some poor museum workers restored more knuckle bows than should rightly be there. could also be an issue of time period, I havent actually dug enough into when the vases were made compared to the surviving swords to conclude that it was a development of a certain time. Or even region for that matter although I doubt there are main surviving examples of theses swords with a known provenance.
Last time I was this early Donal McBain still praised the shearing sword.
Another thing to keep in mind: even in Japan and East Asia, there were times when more robust hand protection beyond the cross guard and disk guard did come in and out of fashion and even had parallels to certain complex guard designs of European swords. I think this was brought up before regarding the jian and the so-called Han Dynasty "fencing jian" that was mentioned in previous reviews of LK Chen swords ( lkchensword.com/sparring-shield-guard ) as well as the s-shaped guard seen on so-called "taiji dao" ( www.militariahub.com/wp-content/gallery/chinese-nationalist-dadao-sword/chinese-nationalist-dadao-sword-12.jpg?x70606 ), butterfly swords ( chinesemartialstudies.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/hudiedao-63cm-40mm-14mm.jpg ), and on Dadao ( archive.mandarinmansion.com/images/fine-dadao/dadao.jpg ) seen in late Qing and Republic of China Period.
As for Japan, a similar design to the Han fencing jian with a knucklebow (sometimes multiple) was adopted during the Kofun period and seemed to have been remade multiple times throughout Japanese history called the Tamamaki no Tachi ( heritageofjapan.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/image9.jpg ) ( upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f8/Metals_and_metal-working_in_old_Japan_%281915%29_%2814780689391%29.jpg ) ( cdn.globalauctionplatform.com/db84815d-a49b-4586-baae-a5600101d894/87fbfc92-66ef-4c5f-edf2-3d955498cdd2/original.jpg ) ( livedoor.blogimg.jp/ohgetsu/imgs/6/5/65ee9461.jpg ). What also deserves a mention is that the Japanese did combine European designs of guard with traditional Japanese blades to create the Kyu-gunto ( stcroixblades.com/assets/uploads/images/03-01-17/naval_kyu-gunto_samurai_sword_7-001.JPG ).
Wow, I'm a huge fan of your sweater
The beard is coming along nicely!
I once watched the Princess Bride, and I feel that makes me qualified to comment. In that movie, the Carrie Strug defeats Mandy Rose despite Mandy having a heavier, more elaborate guard on their sword. This clearly demonstrates that, since mass scales to negatively to the speed at which a sword can be waved around, the smaller guard provides a massive tactical advantage. In fact, the closer the mass of the guard gets to zero, the more the waving around velocity would near the speed of light, as per Sergei Eisenstein's theory of Relationships, and the closer a sword's striking power would therefore be to infinite. Logically, a sword with no guard would be the most powerful weapon in the universe, obliterating both it, the user and the solar system in which it is located with a single swing. It is irrefutable science!
I read somewhere that in 19th century Japan, they used swords with katana-like blades but with saber-like hilt. Might be a nice topic for a video? :)
I think you're correct on that. Those were military swords with hilt designs that were based more on Western designs of the period. I know that by WWII the standard issue officer and NCO swords were more like traditional katanas but with a slightly different hilt design. I recall reading that there were cases of officers that had their family sword refitted with a regulation hilt but the blade dated back to who knows when.
I'm pretty sure I've seen one in a museum but it was a long time ago and I can't remember where it was. The hilt was like a katana but not quite as long and it had a knuckle bow.The sheath had two rings like a saber sheath.
You will find that is the mass-manufactured Kyu Gunto swords of the Meiji period (1868-1912) and Taisho Period (1912- 1926) though with the increased militarism and nativism going into the Early showa period (1926-1989) you will be getting swords which are more reminiscent of the Katana called Shin Gunto. With that being said even in Showa Period you still had the Kyu Gunto Sabers being used and if I remember correctly during the Showa it was more prominent in the Navy.
Also while the Kyu Gunto is usually thought of as a saber hilt with a Katana or Wakizashi-looking blade sometimes it was just a curved Saber blade also other times it was a more straight thrust centric calvary blade. You will find different looking examples throughout the extensive Japanese art of the periods depicting military conquests but I don't believe they had different names for the different blades or at least I can't find any Western Sources listing them.
Also here is the only source I know which is the later Meiji Kendo Kyohan which teaches Saber, Bayonet, and Saber on Horseback . www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=14967
Unfortunately, though an interesting source, the Saber taught in it is clearly for Military Tournaments having a ruleset similar to Kendo and not a complete sword system. I had at one point wanted to try to reconstruct the Meiji saber system of mid to late 19th century and while I'm sure there were likely older and more practical treaties dealing with it chances of finding one and it being translated into English is close to nill. I have heard conflicting accounts of it being based on a French system but what happened after that but before the Kendo Kyohan I don't know.
The japanese adopted western-style sabre hilts as part of their westernization yes, so other militaries would take them more seriously. A fair few of the old samurai families who joined the new army had old family blades re-hilted in the same fashion, so you can actually find authentic katana blades sporting sabre-style hilts.
It's interesting to see Matt change the way he says "tachi"
If only he would say katana properly (it's not ka-taaaaa-na!).
'the Maori were perfectly happy killing each other'... I know, taken out of context, but this is quite macabre 😂
I think it would be a cool idea to show various binds of various longsword guards. S guard, U guard, either or with rings, etc.
Also, I wonder if the katana had a disc shaped guard due to usually being made out of something besides steel and and the shape strengthened it.
You gave maces as an example of weapons that were successful without a guard, however, did they not introduce maces with disk guards later? If anything that shows they did actually believe in the disk guard.
I would argue that spears provide the best hand protection: being out of measure of most cuts.
Hello friend, loved the video! I would love to see you talk about the wahaika on the wall! Also, which of the LK Chen swords you’ve handled so far is your favorite? Thanks!
More promises for future videos. More CONTEXT. Excellent.
disk guards also appeared on North east Asian pole arms.
The bit about large disc guards/tsubas reminds me of Kikuchiyo's nodachi(?) from Kurosawa's Seven Samurai.
I probably missed this. I'm not a sword person but is it possible that the smaller guard would still protect the hand from sliding forward, say, during a thrust? Thanks Matt, very enjoyable video.
Yeah, se said that! :)
Good video Matt, thank you! I just wanted to chime in with 2 things, [1] that Yuan dynasty (Mongol) sabers/dao had crossguards, as you know from the turko-mongolic sabers, and early Ming era essentially adopted this. During the Ming the concept of the disc guard popularized, giving rise to the forms we now associate with Chinese dao/sabers (Ming-Qing era). and... [2] The below are all post-1600 dao:
Here's two late Qing "oxtail" sabers in hand: instagram.com/p/BvU7q-hgxBH/
Here's some more of them: instagram.com/p/BrPArXugu7K/
Here's another one in hand: instagram.com/p/BrNjC9sgrPz/
In the 1800s we do see some East Asian swords adopting ideas from European sword guards, and occasionally blades.
Hope ya'll enjoy those pics. No I don't own them anymore, all sold off.
I mean it's not like east Asian warriors kept coming home with mangled hands and missing fingers because their hand guards were ineffective and nobody thought to put a bigger one on, they were obviously fit for purpose for a long time. Interesting to hear about the hand clearance provided for when hitting a shield, very similar concept to a roll hoop in a car.
Fun fact: Theres a metal band based around the whole Maori culture exposed to firearms thing. They're called Alien Weaponry. Check em out!
Great video, as always, by the way.
8:00 great point, I mean most shashkas, which I generally consider to be terrible weapons (and I'm in agreement with some people who used it a hundred years ago lol) don't even have a typical hand stop.
As to katanas I think that people wrongly associate it with the duelling/self defense context because of the early Edo culture (before the major crackdown on duels and standardisation of policing) and mythology surrounding it, while the weapon was developed as a cavalryman's, often horse archer's, sidearm (much like shashka), and remained largely unchanged without being developed because of cultural reasons (primarily incredible conservatism and traditionalism).
Same is true for Hawaiian history. Each island had various tribes and kings. They of course had periods of peace and conflict like the rest of the world. The Kamehameha line of kings attained rifles and cannons using them in warfare to unite the islands under one ruler.
Hey Matt 👋 I was wondering if you might ever have heard of a man named Thomas Hoyer Monstery, and if you have, what you think of him and his book (Self-defense For Gentlemen and Ladies). He's a very interesting man, and I'm pretty sure you'd love researching him if you haven't already.
Wow plans on doing a review on that tang dao with a cross guard? That’s a pretty sword
A thought, linking a this with another recent video. Are disc guards more associated with differentially hardened blades. i.e. if the edge of you blade is more brittle are you more likely to parry with the side of your sword and therefore need hand protection there?
After years of being on your channel,your voice still soothes me Matt..My wife think it's weird.
something on pre-14th century Indian armaments would be great! we need a little love here, we've been thoroughly ignored off late.
An unrelated question, but I was just watching a video by SandRhoman History, "The Rise of the Pikeman in Europe", and in one of the illustrations of the Landsknechts, he showed a Doppelsöldner with a two-handed sword that had a wavy blade, a "Flammenschwert" I believe it is called.
Ages ago, Lindybeige made a video about how the "Zweihänder" swordsmen would fight their way into a pike block to disrupt them, and I wondered if the point(i know;)) of a wavy blade on such a sword would be to better control multiple pikes as you push them aside to get at the first rank?
SandRhoman History video: th-cam.com/video/16U82cmYkEw/w-d-xo.html
Lindybeige: th-cam.com/video/DiD3cI3RqJU/w-d-xo.html
Which sword families have more or less protection? I say, before we got things more complex than the simple crossguard, I say they all have more or less protection.
In a serious note, I think one should also investigate the development of armor and surrounding aspects. Specifically talking about Japan, from what I could gather, gauntlets start showing up already around the 10th century, even before the samurai became the class more closer to what we think of them today. As I say every time, a disc(ish, plenty of tsuba designs that aren't exactly discs) closes the gaps that the gauntlet doesn't cover, so basically they just took the earlier trend and ran with it since it combines with hand armor so well. And quite honestly, if we are comparing viking era swords or earlier, disc guards do offer more protection overall. In Europe at the same time you have mail hand protection, so something longer might have seemed more attractive. By the time gauntlets become a popular option in Europe too, the crossguard trend is already set in. Honestly, when your hand armor is already more sturdy than mail, that is your primary protection, and both types of guard are just complementing it which they both do differently but about the same. It only makes notable difference in unarmored (including no shields) combat, and that involves many more social considerations than just combat, usually more so.
Are there european swords without cross guard, but WITH a "Nagel" or "pin guard" e. G. langmesser? Swords with a Nagel or hook like thing remind me of the japanese Sais dagger, so minimal protection but you have the chance to maybe catch you opponents weapon and maybe disarm him.
Yes, but those i know of, are more knife than sword.
The rugger comes to mind. A large knife either with a nagel or shell guard.
And I think some hunting swords come with only shell guards as well
Have you seen Skallagrim's Bauernwehr video?
What about ease of access for unseathing of far east swords and religious influence on the European medieval cross guard? Do you think they are a factor as well?
whats that red bean thing beside the shield on the left?
Looks like a wooden paddle like club
A war-club. Maori, I think.
Surely the point of view of utility is dominant in arms , nevertheless what about the symbolic signification of the Cross guard in medieval chivalry ? and , perhaps of the round guard in Asia ( a flower , or something else ? ) ?
Thank you Matt for your always interesting explanations
I thought one of the purposes of disc guards and small crossguards were meant to stop the wielder's hand from sliding onto the blade from the grip when thrusting the sword.
Thanks for the knowledge!
I like the comparison between "prevent being hit by enemy" vs "prevent hand sliding up blade", but could you address factors such as cross guard clearing shield/other armor (as in not getting caught on it) and portability (as in comfort of wear on say a long march)
What were the perceptions of the importance of the length of the crossguard for great swords during their period of use?
Don't know if you look at that older video, but i have a question. You mentioned the swords of india before the 16th century. So i am interested i those swords, for i have no idea how they looked like. Specially from gupta era or even back in maurya time. Is there any remnants or idea from archeologists how those looked like or is there any archeological evident from that period, so we can say anything about those times sword or generally weapons? Thanks.
Id like to know when it comes to comparison. What about protective gountlets? How much were these in use in europe and in asia? What types of gountlets where there? And how effective were the different types?
I know it was a common thing in Mainland Asia (predominantly Chinese influence).
The islands were a different case.
samurai armor usually included full hand gauntlets known as 'han kote', which covered the back of the hand and all the fingers up to the first knuckle when the hand was closed. So even without a full hand guard the hand wasn't especially vulnerable.
So much passion, makes 20 min feel like 5 every time. I'm very happy chinese swords get more attention, they deserve it and it's time to put an end to this flimsy wushu blades misconception :)
To use an analogy, there are certain guards that prevent the sword from being comfortably used by the left hand. So if the right hand is injured, you can't really use your left. Similarly, a long cross guard prevents many chinese/japanese guard-and-slash "trick" manoeuvres, / styles. When you master the style, you do not want nor need a long cross guard. This appears to be the reason why the asian sword persists in the form that it does, and why disc guards are so popular here.
Crossguards are used mostly in blade-on-blade contact, which European sword arts place a lot of emphasis on.
Am I the only one who felt like this video was all preamble? I feel like he had just set the stage for an interesting discussion when "well that's all for today folks, stay tuned for" etc. Obviously to some degree any TH-cam video is an ad, if you are getting something for free you are the product and all that, but it seemed much more pronounced in this particular video than what I'm used to from Matt.
do north east Asian disk guards interrupts with your thumb in a negative way?
The Japanese actually did use crossguard designs sometimes, there are even examples of Japanese made Rapiers, sabers and Smallswords prior to the arrival of the Black Ships.
@Andrew Gray I'd start by looking up the Minakuchi Rapier.
Would love to hear a little bit about American military service swords, specifically the Nathan Star contract models of the early 19tb century.
@scolagladiatoria i know you're primarily a swordsman expert but i heard in one of your previous videos that you mentioned you've been shooting longbows since a teenager. based on your experience, could you do a video or talk about how you think mongols would've done vs Englishmen and/or French had they ever encountered? how do you see the horse archer hordes doing against Western knights and/or formations going up against each other ? thanks :D love the channel
The English developed archery as part of their primary military strategy well after the Mongol empire fell apart, so the two are not especially comparable. Different socioeconomic, logistical, and technological factors by a considerable breadth.
Not enough knowledge regards How Used, but, could it be matter of point vs edge? Seems point dominance would drive for hand protection.
I would say that swords in japan in late medieval or early modern age were more like ceremonial and they were used to follow traditions and in battle they had mainly spears and other weapons, not katanas, so there was probably no reason to improving hand protection on katana, while in China, India, Korea and Europe mainly, people just adopted what was better and what worked and they had much more variety in their swords, they didn't follow some "honor codex" like Samurais which maybe says that you have to carry standardised katana with standardised suba guard.
And as we can see in actual history, these honor codexes were followed only in peace time, in war time, Samurais were definitely not honest towards their enemies.
Korean swords and other stuff is something we should explore more, I noticed that they have similar experience as my nation (Czechs) with beying smaller brother constantly occupied by some bigger brother and they actually adopted very similar weapons against their opressors, like farmers using flails against samurai, similarly as our peasants were using against crusades in 15th century. Koreans even have kind of similar sense of humor (while I would say that Chinese and Japanese people are very different), I think it's really related to this history of beying constantly occupied by someone.
Anyone know what (European) sword Matt is holding early on in the video when comparing the European & the Japanese sword?
If anyone could help out w make and model / where I could get one - I'd highly appreciate it!
I believe that is the Albion "Ringeck"
Thanks for sharing!
Matt, have you talked about langets and their purpose/use? Maybe I missed it... sometimes they seem to be for reinforcement, but sometimes there's a gap between the langet and sides of the blade (tulwars and such come to mind). Are those for binding the opponent's blade?
I think he has, although I do not recall. Check out his videos on Indian swords, I think it was on one of those.
how similar was the second tang Dao to the European arming sword?
What is that blade with edge on the inside curve hanging on the wall to the right?
Erm.... so they say that the Chinese are part Buddhist, Part Confucian and part Taoist. The circle is an important part of the symbology of Taoism, as is the sword itself, and I think that the adoption of the disk guard may well be due to this receptivity to it as a symbol. The same applies, in the Christian Western context to the cross guard, the symbol being so deeply embedded in the culture that it's echo in the form of a sword makes it look 'right'. I don't know, I'm stoned.
And muslims had crescent shaped swords.
What about blade catchment types like the Spanish notch?
Is there any historical data on hand injuries from combat with swords? Like, from graves or something?
I wonder how much the way the sword was worn effects the form of guard.
I wonder if anyone has tried the PC game "Hellish Quart" which is about realistic sword fighting ? I think it is available on Steam .
With the Silk Road trade, Mongol Invasion of the Middle East, Alexander the Great into Eastern Asia and other trade, exposure to different weapons design and use would have had an effect on the changes in design. Some swords have no guard at all and blades changes are also noted. More research possibilities?
Hand guards for swords not normally used for parrying are likely just to keep your hand from riding up on the blade, not actual hand protection. If you are using a shield you don't need a basket around your hand.
Anyone know where he got the bastard sword with the orange grip from? It looks absolutely badass!!!
I think that is the Albion "Ringeck"
@@NevisYsbryd I think you're right, thank you!
Love your talks on weapons though.