Iron Reapers update has been getting a lot of heat but... once you figure out a few of the quirks on the Unit they are gross nasty. I only have mine Green Doctrined right now & I still roll people with them. Personally I got top Line, pick up the first Blunt Node in Middle, then take the Heal in Bottom Line. While using IR I think Tiger Step with Sword is actually a Mistake, I tested it quite a bit & the interaction of switching weapons & using Tiger Step hampers the damage output for sure. You want to Charge in with Flails, make sure the Charge finishes, then Tiger Step while keep the Flail out. It basically is a 2nd Charge point blank damage wise. Then switch to swords, the massive double hit of Blunt Damage then combined with the attack Speed of Swords is gross. My perspective may be skewed a bit because I play Maul with them so between Charge, Tiger Step, & me going in with the Maul, just about everything dies every time. The exception is dont charge half the Team in a Blob by yourself that's about it.
For a unit with 1k + piercing defence and a unit description that mentions they are bullet resistant they have to tiptoe around any piercing damage like crazy, and I think that is their biggest drawback. -Pike damage when braced gets increased if you charge into them with high speed but the reaper's charge isn't really all that fast yet still kills them all in a matter of frames rather than seconds. Same for modao who i think do mainly piercing damage when braced. -I've charged into unbraced fortes who where fighting already and i still lost 2 of my reapers. -Cav has a lot of piercing damage and if they charge your reapers they are dead.
IPG advance deletes charging reapers... While you can easily delete advancing IPGs with Tiger Step, this still means IPG are effective at preventing you from using your charge. And if they are hidden with a silly attire or behind shields and you don't realise it in time, your "super tanky omg chunky boys" get deleted by a T4 pike unit that usually only really does noticable dmg to cav.
@@Jixxor I have all units but reapers. I have not tried them since update. But as I remember they have cc imune when charge and tiger skill so they should counter imp hard right?
I need to mention a few things about them. 1. F1 and F2 formations make the Reapers not aggressive (In fact, they won't attack nearby enemies in them). 2. The reapers can get up to 1400 piercing with 17%+15% (Against Ranged) damage reduction, compared to 20%+15%(Against Ranged) of MoDao. 3. Reaper charge is useless right now, and their 2nd ability with swords give them 12s of cc immunity. This is not the case with flails 4. With Top+bottom vet on reapers, they are very good flank units, but they do struggle with their lack of speed 5. Reapers with swords now hit up to 5 units every hit, making them the highest melee damage dealers in the entire game When compared to the MoDao, they do suffer. But considering how the devs like to nerf next season, the reapers are in a good spot I believe.
If they aren't relevant now, they are unlikely to be relevant in the future. True Modao are likely to get nerfed next season but with it there will be even stronger and better T5 units. There is no practical application for Iron Reapers outside of fighting on the wall where cavalry cannot reach and in most cases Palace Guards and other T4 shock unit would be much more effective to use. Plus Palace Guards and Grandpas are arguably tankier thanks to their block and better as they are faster and have lower CD CC immunity abilities.
@@BearBrownies That is very strange then, if you play Ranked, you can usually see a few teams of Iron Reapers going around. They are surely not the best all-rounders, but they are one of the best into the fray units much like the berserkers but with more damage potential. I guess it could be because I have the Sprint doctrine (15%) and +10% movement speed on top of the 25% LS speed boost. These combined with skill 2 make them VERY strong cleaners, being the better choice to bring in bandit raids than MoDao if you want better clearing times.
@@AlanApogee not on EU1, you'd be a troll to take Iron Reapers in to high level ranked games over Modao. We don't have access to leadership doctrines so it really is a choice between Modao or Reapers and not both. I'm sure things are different on Frontier since you can take 2x T5 + 1 T4 or even 3x T5 with leadership doctrines. Edit: LS on EU1 is also a troll pick in high level ranked. Also berserkers are by far the best for clear time with maul for bandit raid.
@@BearBrownies Berserkers are always being beaten by Shield Maidens, garrisons, and Iron reapers nowadays in raid clearing (not expedition). Or that every other berserker I've come across is just not as good as you. For Ranked in Frontier, yep 3xT5 or at least 2xT5+T4 is the bare minimum for higher levels. Iron Reapers are the 'charge the wall and kill everything' death ball unit much like berserkers, especially if the enemy has MoDao, Iron reapers are the only long-lasting cc immunity high tier unit that can hit multiple units. I think in 2v2 Iron reapers will win with some to spare due to their ability to multi-hit, and that's why they are used in frontier against the MoDao spam.
imo Reapers aren't comparable to Modao, Modao are Anti-Cav, and the type of unit to hold the line. Whilst Reapers are the type of unit to charge into the entire enemy team, get a ton of kills and either all die out, or half of them do.
just crunched a unit of maidens, palace guards, and stalwarts 1 v 3 with them and their mauls, then procceded to use the 2 ablility with their swords to pick up three heroes lol. I think they are good against armored units and thats their purpose, swords are just nice to kill squishy things and heroes.
Kind of agree that iron reapers are just outclassed. They're supposed to be the top of sword and shield type units, meaning they should be excellent for flanking and taking on archers or adding mass to a pike push, where pikes are easily shot down by ranged, but because iron reapers don't have a shield they're just as vulnerable as pike units, minus their reach, meaning they're in closer which leaves them vulnerable to get knocked down and swamped, as well as trampled by cav. It's for this reason that they have a really weird niche where they are supposed to kill other sword and shield units and completely undefended shieldwalls (lol). Meaning their prime targets are paladins, azaps, berserkers and palace guards. Only palace guards are in the meta and generally they are on the front Line rather than flanking because of their low speed. And even berserkers give iron reapers a run for their money, meaning you can more effectively trade leadership than iron reapers do, so yea, just not great
I appreciate the comparison. I can't comment on which of the two is better as I haven't tried Modao. However, I did notice two omissions for the Reapers and one error. No mention of the massive AoE sweeps of the sword. This is huge against unarmoured units as they will just swat 5-6 enemies with every swing, each for big boy damage. Does Modao have that? Similarly, I didn't see a mention that Iron Reaper mace totally ignores block. They will swat through stalwarts, imperials and even greyhair as if they don't have any block at all. I feel like their charge with the mace (not sword), which ignored block, just instant kills most shield walls. Does Modao do that? That leads to the one error. Charging into a unit of greyhairs with the mace out, you will kill the entire unit without a single loss (going full top vet and bottom for the heal). Did this only yesterday in Siege an my Reapers are only level 13. I am not disagreeing that Modao are better as I can't compare them. Just not sure you gave the complete picture on the Reaper potential. Keep up the good work!
I didn't feel the need to include those things as it wasn't a unit overview, rather why I think the Reapers are bad. Modao carnage knocks down units so they are far superior in terms of charging. It also doesn't matter that Reapers can hit 5 units at once bec they will die instantly in most cases compared to Modao's in the same scenario. The Modao's are just stupid broken OP where as the Reapers are just okay.
The amount of cc reapers actually give us kind of nuts because I have interuptrr a shit ton of ultra with reapers both swords and maces and in TW I have been rolling people even maodao if the mess up I go middle line for sweeping strike then top line I think for 48% swing speed so their swords cc with super fast attacks. Charge with flails swap and tiger step to cancel animation and they burst anything
The Iron Reaper doesn't have shield like Azaps or Paladin and low unit count which makes them squishy. They also have short attack range so they bungle up easily and take a lot of damage, unlike polearms unit which can attack from further
I wish I had seen this before unlocking them after a few people said they had been buffed. The iron reapers feel so squishy for being so "tanky". I'd rather bring in condottieri guards any day over them.
I do like the reapers but as soon as their 2 ability expires, they become useless. Modao are much more versatile and work in pretty much any scenario that reapers would do well in plus more.
@@yuliusjrt9917 no because reapers leadership cost is too high to be able to run reapers + 2x T4 units (you need atleast 770-780 leadership). You're much better off running 3x T4 units such as palace guards, berserkers, armiger lancers, axe raiders or grandpas. These units will be much more cost effective too than taking reapers. I don't recommend using T5 units in casual siege games at all as it is a waste of bronze.
Naah yes they are weaker then madaos , but almost beat everyother meele unit and in casual sieges combo madaos + reapers make me 150+ average units kills.
I have no idea what you are talking about. I don't find them squishy, I can take on 4 heroes and win with minimal casualties, I destroy whole units of palace guards in a single charge, paladins are free kills, same with stalwarts. T he only thing I agreed about was that they were slow, couldn't beat high level greyhairs or modao and were vulnerable to cav.
It's playstyle, theyre definitely weak when the cc duration is out. It's like saying the hussars are useless without their charge. It is up to you if you wish to throw the unit away or wait for the cooldown then engage again.
i tried something crazy by making them faster with two doctrine to reach up to 25% speed, and it worked quite well, their new ia retargets faster and attack multiple enemies and since their charge are unstoppable with high def they can break any shield or brace formation. Modaos are still my favorites for their versatility but their charge are not equal to the reapers at all.
Imagine how good this game would be if all the weapons had 2 or 3 more ultimates to chose from, and about 7 or 8 other normal skills per weapon
Iron Reapers update has been getting a lot of heat but... once you figure out a few of the quirks on the Unit they are gross nasty. I only have mine Green Doctrined right now & I still roll people with them. Personally I got top Line, pick up the first Blunt Node in Middle, then take the Heal in Bottom Line. While using IR I think Tiger Step with Sword is actually a Mistake, I tested it quite a bit & the interaction of switching weapons & using Tiger Step hampers the damage output for sure. You want to Charge in with Flails, make sure the Charge finishes, then Tiger Step while keep the Flail out. It basically is a 2nd Charge point blank damage wise. Then switch to swords, the massive double hit of Blunt Damage then combined with the attack Speed of Swords is gross. My perspective may be skewed a bit because I play Maul with them so between Charge, Tiger Step, & me going in with the Maul, just about everything dies every time. The exception is dont charge half the Team in a Blob by yourself that's about it.
For a unit with 1k + piercing defence and a unit description that mentions they are bullet resistant they have to tiptoe around any piercing damage like crazy, and I think that is their biggest drawback.
-Pike damage when braced gets increased if you charge into them with high speed but the reaper's charge isn't really all that fast yet still kills them all in a matter of frames rather than seconds. Same for modao who i think do mainly piercing damage when braced.
-I've charged into unbraced fortes who where fighting already and i still lost 2 of my reapers.
-Cav has a lot of piercing damage and if they charge your reapers they are dead.
Summarised my experience with the Reapers perfectly thank you!
IPG advance deletes charging reapers... While you can easily delete advancing IPGs with Tiger Step, this still means IPG are effective at preventing you from using your charge. And if they are hidden with a silly attire or behind shields and you don't realise it in time, your "super tanky omg chunky boys" get deleted by a T4 pike unit that usually only really does noticable dmg to cav.
@@Jixxor I have all units but reapers. I have not tried them since update. But as I remember they have cc imune when charge and tiger skill so they should counter imp hard right?
I need to mention a few things about them.
1. F1 and F2 formations make the Reapers not aggressive (In fact, they won't attack nearby enemies in them).
2. The reapers can get up to 1400 piercing with 17%+15% (Against Ranged) damage reduction, compared to 20%+15%(Against Ranged) of MoDao.
3. Reaper charge is useless right now, and their 2nd ability with swords give them 12s of cc immunity. This is not the case with flails
4. With Top+bottom vet on reapers, they are very good flank units, but they do struggle with their lack of speed
5. Reapers with swords now hit up to 5 units every hit, making them the highest melee damage dealers in the entire game
When compared to the MoDao, they do suffer. But considering how the devs like to nerf next season, the reapers are in a good spot I believe.
If they aren't relevant now, they are unlikely to be relevant in the future. True Modao are likely to get nerfed next season but with it there will be even stronger and better T5 units.
There is no practical application for Iron Reapers outside of fighting on the wall where cavalry cannot reach and in most cases Palace Guards and other T4 shock unit would be much more effective to use. Plus Palace Guards and Grandpas are arguably tankier thanks to their block and better as they are faster and have lower CD CC immunity abilities.
@@BearBrownies That is very strange then, if you play Ranked, you can usually see a few teams of Iron Reapers going around. They are surely not the best all-rounders, but they are one of the best into the fray units much like the berserkers but with more damage potential. I guess it could be because I have the Sprint doctrine (15%) and +10% movement speed on top of the 25% LS speed boost. These combined with skill 2 make them VERY strong cleaners, being the better choice to bring in bandit raids than MoDao if you want better clearing times.
@@AlanApogee not on EU1, you'd be a troll to take Iron Reapers in to high level ranked games over Modao. We don't have access to leadership doctrines so it really is a choice between Modao or Reapers and not both.
I'm sure things are different on Frontier since you can take 2x T5 + 1 T4 or even 3x T5 with leadership doctrines.
Edit: LS on EU1 is also a troll pick in high level ranked. Also berserkers are by far the best for clear time with maul for bandit raid.
@@BearBrownies Berserkers are always being beaten by Shield Maidens, garrisons, and Iron reapers nowadays in raid clearing (not expedition). Or that every other berserker I've come across is just not as good as you.
For Ranked in Frontier, yep 3xT5 or at least 2xT5+T4 is the bare minimum for higher levels. Iron Reapers are the 'charge the wall and kill everything' death ball unit much like berserkers, especially if the enemy has MoDao, Iron reapers are the only long-lasting cc immunity high tier unit that can hit multiple units.
I think in 2v2 Iron reapers will win with some to spare due to their ability to multi-hit, and that's why they are used in frontier against the MoDao spam.
Point 5: Laughing in Siladhars abilities hitting infinite number of units
charge with flail to shield break then switch press attack the redirect the ones in the back then use tiger step
imo Reapers aren't comparable to Modao, Modao are Anti-Cav, and the type of unit to hold the line.
Whilst Reapers are the type of unit to charge into the entire enemy team, get a ton of kills and either all die out, or half of them do.
just crunched a unit of maidens, palace guards, and stalwarts 1 v 3 with them and their mauls, then procceded to use the 2 ablility with their swords to pick up three heroes lol. I think they are good against armored units and thats their purpose, swords are just nice to kill squishy things and heroes.
Kind of agree that iron reapers are just outclassed. They're supposed to be the top of sword and shield type units, meaning they should be excellent for flanking and taking on archers or adding mass to a pike push, where pikes are easily shot down by ranged, but because iron reapers don't have a shield they're just as vulnerable as pike units, minus their reach, meaning they're in closer which leaves them vulnerable to get knocked down and swamped, as well as trampled by cav. It's for this reason that they have a really weird niche where they are supposed to kill other sword and shield units and completely undefended shieldwalls (lol). Meaning their prime targets are paladins, azaps, berserkers and palace guards. Only palace guards are in the meta and generally they are on the front Line rather than flanking because of their low speed. And even berserkers give iron reapers a run for their money, meaning you can more effectively trade leadership than iron reapers do, so yea, just not great
Since Modao nerf, reapers are the best infantry unit.
I appreciate the comparison. I can't comment on which of the two is better as I haven't tried Modao. However, I did notice two omissions for the Reapers and one error.
No mention of the massive AoE sweeps of the sword. This is huge against unarmoured units as they will just swat 5-6 enemies with every swing, each for big boy damage. Does Modao have that? Similarly, I didn't see a mention that Iron Reaper mace totally ignores block. They will swat through stalwarts, imperials and even greyhair as if they don't have any block at all. I feel like their charge with the mace (not sword), which ignored block, just instant kills most shield walls. Does Modao do that?
That leads to the one error. Charging into a unit of greyhairs with the mace out, you will kill the entire unit without a single loss (going full top vet and bottom for the heal). Did this only yesterday in Siege an my Reapers are only level 13.
I am not disagreeing that Modao are better as I can't compare them. Just not sure you gave the complete picture on the Reaper potential. Keep up the good work!
I didn't feel the need to include those things as it wasn't a unit overview, rather why I think the Reapers are bad.
Modao carnage knocks down units so they are far superior in terms of charging. It also doesn't matter that Reapers can hit 5 units at once bec they will die instantly in most cases compared to Modao's in the same scenario.
The Modao's are just stupid broken OP where as the Reapers are just okay.
The amount of cc reapers actually give us kind of nuts because I have interuptrr a shit ton of ultra with reapers both swords and maces and in TW I have been rolling people even maodao if the mess up I go middle line for sweeping strike then top line I think for 48% swing speed so their swords cc with super fast attacks. Charge with flails swap and tiger step to cancel animation and they burst anything
The Iron Reaper doesn't have shield like Azaps or Paladin and low unit count which makes them squishy. They also have short attack range so they bungle up easily and take a lot of damage, unlike polearms unit which can attack from further
I wish I had seen this before unlocking them after a few people said they had been buffed. The iron reapers feel so squishy for being so "tanky". I'd rather bring in condottieri guards any day over them.
I do like the reapers but as soon as their 2 ability expires, they become useless. Modao are much more versatile and work in pretty much any scenario that reapers would do well in plus more.
@@BearBrownies would you still recommend reapers as a first t5 for someone who doesn’t exactly like seasonal challenges?
@@yuliusjrt9917 no because reapers leadership cost is too high to be able to run reapers + 2x T4 units (you need atleast 770-780 leadership). You're much better off running 3x T4 units such as palace guards, berserkers, armiger lancers, axe raiders or grandpas. These units will be much more cost effective too than taking reapers. I don't recommend using T5 units in casual siege games at all as it is a waste of bronze.
@@BearBrownies oh ok, but if you could recommend one t5 (seasonal or honour) would it be the modao?
@@yuliusjrt9917 modao or shenjis, shenjis are really fun to play top line.
U should make a vid about wich hero class the best is to use
I cover this in my class tier list video: th-cam.com/video/Y-or-0Q-8dE/w-d-xo.html
They just die too fast for supposedly “tough” unit. Even to some mediocre blue units.
Naah yes they are weaker then madaos , but almost beat everyother meele unit and in casual sieges combo madaos + reapers make me 150+ average units kills.
I have no idea what you are talking about. I don't find them squishy, I can take on 4 heroes and win with minimal casualties, I destroy whole units of palace guards in a single charge, paladins are free kills, same with stalwarts. T he only thing I agreed about was that they were slow, couldn't beat high level greyhairs or modao and were vulnerable to cav.
It's playstyle, theyre definitely weak when the cc duration is out. It's like saying the hussars are useless without their charge. It is up to you if you wish to throw the unit away or wait for the cooldown then engage again.
I have no idea what you are talking about, I never use the cc immunity and I always get over 90 kills
@@DannyDimes311 as I said, playstyle. How you play it is up to you
i tried something crazy by making them faster with two doctrine to reach up to 25% speed, and it worked quite well, their new ia retargets faster and attack multiple enemies and since their charge are unstoppable with high def they can break any shield or brace formation. Modaos are still my favorites for their versatility but their charge are not equal to the reapers at all.