Use code MODERNMBA50 to get 50% off your first Factor box at bit.ly/3QtRqdt! Correction: The graph at 1:54 is incorrect. We mistakenly graphed Pizza Hut's system sales alongside company revenue for Domino's and Papa John's, which skews the graph to an unrealistic extreme. 0:00 Better Ingredients, Better Pizza 11:12 Rise of John Schnatter 21:54 An Invincible Reign 32:30 Overthrow of the Papa Dynasty
For the reactionary viewers: Instead of thinking of things in a binary fashion in that every incident must have one aggressor and one victim, you could consider that both can be true. One, John made a racist remark and by extension is a racist. Two, the Board and leadership was fully aware of his remarks and only weaponized it to take power. Steve was in the exact same call himself along with other Papa John’s executives - none of them stopped to reprimand or correct John when he said the n-word. In fact, none of them did anything about it with their collective silence on the call and after the fact. They all suddenly distanced themselves months later when the call finally leaked out pretending as if they had no idea why, how, and that John had said such an unacceptable word in the first place - which speaks volumes about their own agenda, the overall culture, and the implicit complicity. Hence, both can be true: John is a racist and the Board changed the narrative to seize control over the company. The video explicitly doesn’t refer to anyone - much less John - as a victim nor justifies any aspect of his misconduct. Even the narrative that he was such a “good” CEO that his misconduct could be “offset” is not even implied. Lastly, if you spend enough time in upper management, you will hear plenty of things said on calls, meetings, work events, client meals, etc that are much worse (and actually directed at specific individuals or groups) compared to what John said. The only difference is that John was recorded and the people on that call had the direct incentive / agenda to bury him.
It is, but the problem is that most of the time it’s a much better offer for big companies to pay up rather than call them out for blackmail, because the losses will be much higher than the demand
@@calvinandsnobs I don't know if it varies by state but I thought that blackmail is a crime. Lawsuits are civil disputes. Those Laundry Service employees should be in jail
Not every crime sends someone to jail, @@GyroCannon . Also I doubt they'd end up with jail time on something like this (probably just settle and get probation, maybe a couple days in jail at the worst). The best option for john specifically, like gyrocannon said, is a civil suit. That way, John could possibly collect restitution, or even bankrupt the company that got him and is reputation "sent out to pasture".
For real, Schnatter was obviously in the wrong, but who wants to work with a company that is recording stuff without your knowledge, and waiting for you to screw up so they can blackmail you? Who needs enemies with friends like that.
@@Spencerwalker21 dropping profanity in team calls, and especially the n-word, is generally frowned upon in most “professional” settings. I personally wouldn’t care that much, but it probably wouldn’t go over well in most meetings lol
Wow... I had no idea that they did John so dirty. I mean this is a hit job like no other. They didn't like him and just created a bunch of fake controversy to destroy him
@@RoboRoby321 That's the real lesson, and after I heard about what gamergate was actually about it got scary to think about what goes on behind closed doors. I still have some hope that sites/apps like ground news might help, but there's always someone who ends up able to control the story, and you start thinking the "Well who check's snopes?" kinda questions.
I worked for sixteen years as a driver at one of the busier Papa Johns in suburban San Diego (we were the store closest to the Miramar Naval/Marine Corps Base with about 25000 hungry military personnel) and watched as the quality of our products steadily deteriorated (we went from freshly cut vegetables, which I would personally have to prep daily to canned, and from premium brands of meats and cheeses to far cheaper quality products) and the care taken with our products plummeted….it was depressing
I used to have their ordering app and I noticed the difference over the years . Now, I either eat a premade grocery store pizza that I heat up myself or spend the money on a local pizza place that uses fresh ingredients
Can confirm, did delivery at Papa Johns in the mid 2000s - did it again in 2018- holy hell, totally different I was disappointed af when I saw the veggie quality At least the chicken fingers still bop
That's a shame. I worked for pjohns from about 2011-2015, and I remember loads of veggie slicing. Honestly it's still better than dominos and pizza hut though. Dominos fell off super hard in the last 4-5 years and I am baffled.
That's a flat-out lie. I'm a general manager of a papa johns and while we did switch to pre-sliced veggies 2 years ago, they most definitely come in a cardboard box and are stored in the walk-in cooler for a maximum of 10 days. The meats were never downgraded. They are still 100% meat, no preservatives or fillers, and our cheese is very high quality as well. Most pizza chains use small amounts of sawdust as an anti-clumping agent for cheese, but we use cane dust. Dough is not allowed in store for more than 7 days to ensure its quality, along with constant dough temp checks and inspections from my district manager. I'm not sure why you're lying, but my name is Damyon Padilla. I'm the General Manager of the store 2520 SE 145th Ave. Portland Oregon. Took over that store 6 months ago, I moved here from Wyoming 1 year ago, where we used the same processes and same distributor. I love my job, and Papa John's. I've gone from shift lead to running my own store in 2 years at 21 years old. Please, come have a bite to eat at my store, and I'll gladly show you a pizza well worth $9.99 for a large one topping. 😊 Have a wonderful day everyone hope to see you in my store ❤
Celebrity CEOs are difficult enough to separate from their business when it's not named after them. That's how you end up with headlines like "Papa John sues Papa John's".
Good luck to Olive Garden surviving. When a Hedge Fund takes over a business, product and line employee quality tend to be squeezed to fatten the bottom line profits.
The lesson as I see it is it's more about the company than the ad agency or John himself. The board and the CEO were interested in seeing John gone, so when the opportunity came, they took it. They might have battled through it, but instead amplified the message to get rid of him. It's interesting that the metrics are better than ever. I have to admit that the new products and options are a turnoff for me, but I'm not a big pizza consumer, so my opinion doesn't count much.
@@TheCbone1979it's actually pretty simple, clearly since the whole NFL thing, the black Americans were pissed of and did not like John, but then a random call comes to light where he is using the N-word casually. I think now you can see the problem now. It's like first he was seen anti-consumer and as a scumbag while now racist gets added, on top of that he probably burned A lot of bridges while backstabbing people over the years and rolling back things Nigel started.... It all ads up after all. The simple fact that he was forced out once but came in on his own, should tell you there probably was not a lot of good will with the executives to begin with
I only knew about Papa John through what went through the media, so I'm shocked that i feel bad for the guy after watching He does sound a bit egotistical with how he handled Nigel, but his ousting during his second tenure and forced stepping down from his chair position were definitely undeserved. The media defintely screwed him over.
Nigel seemed to have good performance, and I respect that, however the man that built Papa Johns, and its rightful owner/founder is Papa John. He cares about his business, is honest, maintains cash flow, and successfully built a brand that was stronger than any of its competitors. It is sad that Nigel had to be deposed in such a way, but it was fair in as much as everyone knows that Johns was the best man for the job, and had earned his position.
The betrayal was the book John published which basically defamed the poor man. That was a dick move from John and karma came later when shitty news outlets did the same to him@@user-nu8in3ey8c
yeah, I had no idea that was what happened. I thought it was a just a "goofy old white guy says the N word" but I never even thought to think of the context of why the recording was even happening.
Full context was they did a rug pull on him and he essentially took the bait before realizing it was too late. Full unedited call surely is boring, but that's not what the public and a public company responds to. Goes without saying Papa John should have dropped off the call before saying something that couldn't be taken back. Sure is odd the full context sees him dropping off a minute after the kill shot, while the Dirty Laundry agency brags they hope he F'n gets put out to pasture for it. PS anybody who has heard the Colonel Sanders story knows he's not somebody you want to cite: Wikipedia says his career as a lawyer abruptly ended when he got into a courtroom brawl with his _own_ client. Among other misadventures.
@@davidgladeven the bit that was edited everyone I knew was like "I wouldn't have said that but he wasn't calling people 'nword' just saying that col Sanders did"
I worked at Papa John's for 5 years and Papa John would come in and visit every store each year and he seemed like a genuinely nice guy that cared about the product and the people.
I had a similar experience. He came into our store, saw me busting my ass and he says about me "wow this n$&#% works hard!" smacked my butt and cartwheeled away. I stayed through that summer but never came back when school started again. Quite a character.
25:00 John in his final form 😂😂😂😂😂 Modern MBA makes some of the best content to me on TH-cam. You've been on a tear lately keep up the good work my man.
Using celebrity spokespersons or making your CEO a celebrity is always risky. Celebrities can and often do discredit themselves - look at Jared from Subway and Gilbert Gottfried from AFLAC. The skills that make a successful CEO generally do not translate to celebrity. There are exceptions - Lee Iacocca did a great job as Chrysler’s front man in the 1980s while serving as CEO. But the few exceptions prove the rule. Rising to the top of your profession is like winning the lottery in that in both cases, people become more of what they already were.
Agree he gas a good business acumen understanding business models with balanced support of financial figures and qualitative areas of risk and he can articulate it well in words
Your channel is a favourite of mine, it's rare that information and facts are presented in such a coherent way. Appreciate the work that you're doing - best of luck and hope for many more!
Shoutout to Jason Stein for his comments getting leaked on a large call by his own colleagues not muting their mic. This is A+++ drama and its so fucking entertaining. Wow this might be the best Modern MBA video I've seen.
Papa John in China was my Friday dinner each week while I was in China nearly 8 years. Good taste, options to add your own toppings, good salad, and the garlic sauce/pizza dipping sauce were awesome. Now, it's a dirty place with only 1 side of a laminated paper as a menu. They don't offer options to add whatever toppings you want. Tuna salad was removed from the menu along with the potato wedges. Pizza sauce I feel lost flavor. Papa Johns closed in northeast China, so when I was in Dalian I went to a local small pizza shop which the owner made his own sauce and garlic bread from scratch. Best pizza I've ever had.
I've shopped/ worked at the grocery stores next to where Papa John lives in Louisville and I can confirm that he's always as sweaty as he is in adds. He's never rude and is generally pretty quiet, but I don't think I've ever seen him blink or wear anything that isn't red or black.
I remember him saying this during an interview on I believe valuetainment... It wasn't 40 different pizzas. It was 40 Papa John's pizzas that he was tasting for QC. Basically he was testing pizzas from different locations to ensure quality was being delivered consistently.
I feel bad for judging John based off the media articles. Thank you for telling the story and providing perspective. I've recently found your channel, it's fantastic. Please keep up the great work. My 60 year old father has also subscribed :)
What Papa Johns did to John was unforgiveable. I kind of liked ordering from there but when I heard they fired him I stopped and haven't been back since. I'd rather eat shoe leather. John was on a podcast talking about cultural issues and was not calling anyone the n-word, but using it to describe racism, and for this they crucified him. And, as the video shows, it proves John right to have taken extra measures in the company to monitor their behavior since the board leaked private information about him and used the scandal to fire him. The whole thing was a shitshow. But I guess this is just another reason not to sell your company and stay with it, or to ever go public with a company you still care about.
He was angry and defensive and made a boneheaded statement- a false statement slandering Colonel Sanders' name, and one in which saying the n word was not necessary at all.
Especially when people seeing the whole thing only ends up making the management that outed him the bad guys in the eyes of consumers. Now the best PJ management can hope for is ending up just seen as asses who tolerated things while waiting to stab their founder in the back. You just know they wouldn't have done it again if given the chance to do it all over
Well, you were right. Whether the celebrity is good or not is irrelevant. The media will follow even the slightest hint of drama because that’s profitable. Having a highly visible CEO just puts a target on the company’s back
After watching it all, I see the reverse A company with no CEO personality behind it will sell itself to random shareholders and follow none of its initial values He was unlucky that he was attacked at a time when media still had some power, if it was nowadays no one would fucking care, it would probably even turn out as good publicity
I’ve been to Papa John’s twice in two different locations. Both gave me minimal toppings and practically no cheese. Tasted funky too. Haven’t been back since
I stopped giving Papa John's business the moment they ousted John, because to me it was plain to see what was going on. I will continue to give them no business unless John is put in control again. I simply CANNOT support a company that takes such horrendous actions against their own founder.
Man this video made me hungry lol. Very interesting with the 2018 company take. I was actually one of those people who saw their solagan as just marketing, but figured quality was just on par with every other chain of pizzas; something I avoid.
They really did John dirty. I haven't a fan since the mid 2000s only because our local papa johns just started hiring people that couldn't get a pizza right to save their life, but I'll always take a perfect papa pizza over a perfect dominos or pizza hut pizza. Papa garlic sauce is also easily the best pizza chain garlic sauce.
i remember being in college when this place was taking off.. we all really liked it, it was miles better than everywhere else we had around. never felt ripped off buying their pies. sadly either way at the end of all this debacle its the same overpriced crummy junk as everywhere else now and not worth spending on. have had a much nicer and cheaper time buying a stand mixer and learning to make my own pizza dough.
Papa John's slogan should be: "IF YOU ARE YEARNING FOR A PIE THAT FEATURES PIZZA LIKE INGREDIENTS BUT IS DEVOID OF ANY DISCERNIBLE PIZZA TASTE... PAPA JOHN'S IS YOUR PIZZA!"
I've known some people who used to have regular interactions with John - not really close personal friends but did gardening type work, etc. for him and they all said that he was odd and a character but was usually pretty nice - almost magnanimous. Those who lived near by that didn't really know him (at all) all thought he had a temper and was crazy. I pretty much think he was somewhere in between. Just think - if he didn't become the "face" of Papa John's he'd likely be ousted a lot lot sooner.
Having read the full transcript of the call with Laundry Service and Steve, I think John is a little bit insane, and maybe an alcoholic at the time, but he’s not a racist. Dude directly compared the current alt-right to politics of the people who used to “disappear” Black people in the 60s and 70s, which is, imo, pretty baller of him.
I wish I could sit down with John and have him do the whole ancient aliens meme and try to sell me on all sorts of conspiracies and hot takes related to Papa John's and the pizza industry in general.
Wow usually you expect the founder ceo to be some rich snob who has lost touch, but papa john here was actually just dont durty and did nothing wrong, actually got backstabbed like they all like to claim they did to cover for their bad jobs. Poor dude, hope he gets some justice.
Oh he's very much a rich snob. He was just also targeted for removal. Any of his cringe content as a wannabe influencer and his sexual misconduct settlements attest to that.
Listening on headphones and at 35:00 I realized what was coming on the lead in for the phone conversation and just blurted out "No" on a packed but practically silent train car
Papa Johns was only the first to accept online orders nationally. The first online orders were accepted by pizza hut's pizza net. Source: unlicensed pizza historian
Not cheap enough for value, not good enough for quality... last time I ordered a Papa Jhons pizza was enough for me to scrap it from my delivery option list. It was a pizza with ham, where the ham was chopped into little strips instead of the regular square shapped ham. The entire pizza tasted like just dough.
@@jvanek8512 probably all the stores in my country are the same. So, when I want cheap and fast, I go for Dominos or Little Ceasars and when I want better taste, I go for mum and pop stores. Papa Johnes does not offer a clear target and that's why they will slowly fade away.
This is a good description of the issue with their pizza . They’re like the Sears of pizza . Not a cheap pizza option like little ceasars and not good enough to be quality local pizza
I'm sorry, I know you have to make money somehow. But Factor trying to advertise itself as restaurant quality, when it's looking like a microwaved pile of mush (in multiple creators videos), is maybe the next case study for this channel to cover. And the packaging approach is giving off soylent, or soylent green vibes.
So true, yes he needs to make money but it seems like a big oversight for this page. I'd be more content if they took an actually quality sponsor or something non-food. But hey at least they're getting their bag.
As a black man and a millennial, I did not upset due to the controversy. Of all of the pizza franchises, I believe Papa John's made the best pizza. I have not been to the franchise as much since his departure because they no longer have a presence. John Schnatter was papa john. He became a large part of their success and with him being gone there's no brand recognition. It's just another pizza chain.
Also it should be noted that when John was the CEO all full time employees had profit sharing bonuses, whe. John was fired the first thing thry did wad tk get rid of thoes bonuses and cut the quality of ingredients
@@MarvinPowell1 I personally always thought Domino’s tasted like cardboard. However, my post was less about food and more about image. I feel that they’re now a faceless pizza chain. Also, I hate seeing founders displaced from their companies.
The pizza wasn't that good in the first place and it was kind of expensive even before inflation I don't know there's a big difference between before John and after and I'm black... All I know is the shit cost too much 😂
I swear either synchronicity is a thing in this universe or some AI is controlling a hivemind because this guy and Papa Johns has been on my mind in the last 2 weeks for no reason at all 😄
@@BlueGamingRage We must take a stand against hate speech on the internet by actively promoting respectful dialogue, fostering empathy, and supporting diverse voices to create a safer and more inclusive digital community for everyone.
Ironically, I actually liked Papa John's as my favorite pizza brand before they kicked him out, now, not so much. it's dropped down to like 3rd with dominos in position 1. I personally don't care how you think as long as you make a good product I'm going to buy it, as long as we're in this screwed up economic system where money>people anyway...
@@sasukeuchiha998he probably would have had worse business practices leading to bad products. I, unlike most, can separate a creator's personal thoughts from their creation and judge the creation on its own merits rather than judging it for its creator. Horrible people are still capable of making beautiful things, in the same way that beautiful people are capable of some of the worst acts you can emagine.
Why’s dominos so successful with their supply chain sales model when that’s what everybody cites as the downfall of quiznos? Dominos not squeezing the franchisees as much as quiznos was?
@angoraramp Dominos is much cheaper to operate than a Quiznos. Ironically, Subway is the cheapest food chain of all to run, which is why there's so many of them internationally and why their subs are so overpriced, yet Quiznos is another sub chain, but costs much more to operate; possibly due to all those ovens.
@@MarvinPowell1subway has really high fees, and easy/cheap to open. That's why there's so many and their prices are way too high for the product, you still have to make money after all the fees.
Quizznos was poorly managed and was bankrupt when they should have been profitable. They drastically increased their raw ingredient prices to franchisees until the owners made zero money. They could not pay their own salaries and walked away.
What I am amazed by is this video saying Pizza Hit is making doubke what Dominos is making. Idk anyone who goes to Pizza Hut anymore. Our local pizza hut is always empty, ghetto and dirty.
I believe that Pizza Hut, KFC, and Taco Bell are all owned by PepsiCo. Can hardly imagine how cheap their product ingredients are. Corporate greed is everywhere.
Okay, if the use of the N word is "unacceptable under any circumstances", why in the fuck are modern rappers not on the chopping block? even sugarhill gang got called out and radio edited for its use, it still happened though....
I will say this....the pizza is shit after they ousted their CEO. Makes me think it was just a coup to increase profits and shitify the company and its products.
I worked at a papa johns in 2009. I also served as Mr. Slice, a pizza slice mascot who would make appearances at new openings or spin a sign on the street. I got fired for dancing "too provocatively" because I did a lot of up thrusts. I also ate a lot of the cheese. Good times
I think Mark Shapiro was on the Papa John's board because he made a deal with Papa John's to be the pizza in Six Flags when he was CEO. I actually agree with Schnatter that Shapiro probably doesn't know anything about pizza, he sure didn't know anything about running theme parks lol.
Lesson learned, founders should trademark brand names to them. They have spent a lot of time and moneh to buukd a brand or name thus the only incentive in case a company is taken away from you is that you still get royalty under that brand name
The kneeling and sport boycotts did hurt pizza sales. Anyone who couldn't see this need to rethink their thinking. There was plenty of data at the time to prove this point. This isn't 'old way thinking' it's just fact. Sometimes, often what's politically correct isn't correct at all. Often times the exact opposite. I remember hearing this claim and looking for myself to easily see the same conclusion. In hindsight I guess it makes sense. If people are not watching a sport that they normally would maybe they would order less pizza. Wow. Crazy, I know and when you studied year over year pizza sales it makes sense.
To be fair a lot of businesses opposed the affordable care act because of the increased cost. I remember an article saying 60% of businesses polled wanted it repealed and on the Germany 1867 I had to look that up and I found the article and he was talking about how his great grandfather left Germany in 1867 because it's lack of free enterprise and freedom and he felt with all the regulations on the United States it was becoming that way also.
Papa John's used to be so good. Once they cut corners but kept similar prices there was no reason to ever order from them. They went from my go-to pizza delivery to not ordering it in roughly a decade.
Nigel Travis had a champion strategy for the brand. He made the pizzas more accessible to more people without discounting and devaluing the product. Terrible how he was stabbed in the back but that's what happens to hard workers who focus on the task instead of playing social games. Glad he got a better job and a happy retirement.
Sheesh, that call was the epitomy of hostile business relations. I'm assuming the Laundry Services reps knew the call was being recorded (though maybe not that it would actually be used), and they put themselves, on record, essentially saying "Yeah, fuck that guy, I hope he gets bent".
It’s wild how all these random ass people can overtake and overthrow you from your own company that you started, built, grew and even named after yourself
I've not had a Papa John's pizza in the years since the last regime change - from the comments below I don't think I want to spend for premium now - appears there's little that's premium about the product.... With as expensive as everything food related is these days I'm beginning to believe that my OONI pizza oven was a great investment...
Unfortunatly company politics are the worst, even small ones like startups play game of thrones from time to time and this destroys the orginastion from no one wanting to work there to lower quality products/services
Use code MODERNMBA50 to get 50% off your first Factor box at bit.ly/3QtRqdt!
Correction: The graph at 1:54 is incorrect. We mistakenly graphed Pizza Hut's system sales alongside company revenue for Domino's and Papa John's, which skews the graph to an unrealistic extreme.
0:00 Better Ingredients, Better Pizza
11:12 Rise of John Schnatter
21:54 An Invincible Reign
32:30 Overthrow of the Papa Dynasty
What is your connection to Papa's John? You seem to be going hard in defending the former CEO John Schnatter ... for some reason.
For the reactionary viewers:
Instead of thinking of things in a binary fashion in that every incident must have one aggressor and one victim, you could consider that both can be true.
One, John made a racist remark and by extension is a racist. Two, the Board and leadership was fully aware of his remarks and only weaponized it to take power. Steve was in the exact same call himself along with other Papa John’s executives - none of them stopped to reprimand or correct John when he said the n-word. In fact, none of them did anything about it with their collective silence on the call and after the fact.
They all suddenly distanced themselves months later when the call finally leaked out pretending as if they had no idea why, how, and that John had said such an unacceptable word in the first place - which speaks volumes about their own agenda, the overall culture, and the implicit complicity.
Hence, both can be true: John is a racist and the Board changed the narrative to seize control over the company.
The video explicitly doesn’t refer to anyone - much less John - as a victim nor justifies any aspect of his misconduct. Even the narrative that he was such a “good” CEO that his misconduct could be “offset” is not even implied.
Lastly, if you spend enough time in upper management, you will hear plenty of things said on calls, meetings, work events, client meals, etc that are much worse (and actually directed at specific individuals or groups) compared to what John said. The only difference is that John was recorded and the people on that call had the direct incentive / agenda to bury him.
@@cr8593 better ingredients - better pizza ! 12:13
I NEVER SEEN YOU DO A VIDEO ON GODFATHER 🍕 PIZZA LIKE YOU DO WITH THE OTHER PIZZERIAS WHY
@@ModernMBATALK ABOUT GODFATHER PIZZA YOU MUST FORGOT ABOUT THEM
How the hell was Laundry Service threatening to leak those tapes to try and force a dispute settlement not considered blackmail?
it is, hence Jon's lawsuit against LS
It is, but the problem is that most of the time it’s a much better offer for big companies to pay up rather than call them out for blackmail, because the losses will be much higher than the demand
@@calvinandsnobs I don't know if it varies by state but I thought that blackmail is a crime. Lawsuits are civil disputes. Those Laundry Service employees should be in jail
Not every crime sends someone to jail, @@GyroCannon . Also I doubt they'd end up with jail time on something like this (probably just settle and get probation, maybe a couple days in jail at the worst). The best option for john specifically, like gyrocannon said, is a civil suit. That way, John could possibly collect restitution, or even bankrupt the company that got him and is reputation "sent out to pasture".
@@calvinandsnobs They need to get to sent to prison over this. Actually the worst could be a year or two in prison.
I hope no company ever works with that ad agency again. How can you trust a slimey company like that?
For real, Schnatter was obviously in the wrong, but who wants to work with a company that is recording stuff without your knowledge, and waiting for you to screw up so they can blackmail you? Who needs enemies with friends like that.
This rich nitwit deserved it because he wouldn't give his employees healthcare. All about profit with this guy.
@@CamF64how was he in the wrong
@@Spencerwalker21 dropping profanity in team calls, and especially the n-word, is generally frowned upon in most “professional” settings.
I personally wouldn’t care that much, but it probably wouldn’t go over well in most meetings lol
@@CamF64 idk but in context his usage of it was fine.
Wow... I had no idea that they did John so dirty. I mean this is a hit job like no other. They didn't like him and just created a bunch of fake controversy to destroy him
Not even Agent 47 could do a hit this good. You can't make this up.
Seeing how the media spun all this controversy out of thin air is a reminder that you just don't hate journalists enough
@RoboRoby321 This is where you need to be an intelligent consumer. In other parts of the world, it is called critical thinking.
@@RoboRoby321 That's the real lesson, and after I heard about what gamergate was actually about it got scary to think about what goes on behind closed doors.
I still have some hope that sites/apps like ground news might help, but there's always someone who ends up able to control the story, and you start thinking the "Well who check's snopes?" kinda questions.
Meanwhile at Little Caesars:
"Maybe we should cut costs and lower prices"
"Literally how?"
Stop using boxes. Hand the pizza directly to the customer.
@@Laotzu.Goldbug One step better stop making dough, build the pizza onto the customers palm
I wouldn't feed Papa Johns or Little Caesars to someone I hate, let alone someone I love. You have to pay me to eat either of them.
@@Laotzu.GoldbugHot and right in your hands!
@@KurtisRaderPapa John's is good.
I worked for sixteen years as a driver at one of the busier Papa Johns in suburban San Diego (we were the store closest to the Miramar Naval/Marine Corps Base with about 25000 hungry military personnel) and watched as the quality of our products steadily deteriorated (we went from freshly cut vegetables, which I would personally have to prep daily to canned, and from premium brands of meats and cheeses to far cheaper quality products) and the care taken with our products plummeted….it was depressing
I used to have their ordering app and I noticed the difference over the years . Now, I either eat a premade grocery store pizza that I heat up myself or spend the money on a local pizza place that uses fresh ingredients
Can confirm, did delivery at Papa Johns in the mid 2000s - did it again in 2018- holy hell, totally different
I was disappointed af when I saw the veggie quality
At least the chicken fingers still bop
thank you for your service
That's a shame. I worked for pjohns from about 2011-2015, and I remember loads of veggie slicing. Honestly it's still better than dominos and pizza hut though. Dominos fell off super hard in the last 4-5 years and I am baffled.
That's a flat-out lie. I'm a general manager of a papa johns and while we did switch to pre-sliced veggies 2 years ago, they most definitely come in a cardboard box and are stored in the walk-in cooler for a maximum of 10 days. The meats were never downgraded. They are still 100% meat, no preservatives or fillers, and our cheese is very high quality as well. Most pizza chains use small amounts of sawdust as an anti-clumping agent for cheese, but we use cane dust. Dough is not allowed in store for more than 7 days to ensure its quality, along with constant dough temp checks and inspections from my district manager. I'm not sure why you're lying, but my name is Damyon Padilla. I'm the General Manager of the store 2520 SE 145th Ave. Portland Oregon. Took over that store 6 months ago, I moved here from Wyoming 1 year ago, where we used the same processes and same distributor. I love my job, and Papa John's. I've gone from shift lead to running my own store in 2 years at 21 years old. Please, come have a bite to eat at my store, and I'll gladly show you a pizza well worth $9.99 for a large one topping. 😊 Have a wonderful day everyone hope to see you in my store ❤
Celebrity CEOs are difficult enough to separate from their business when it's not named after them. That's how you end up with headlines like "Papa John sues Papa John's".
As insufferable as his personality can be, it's admirable the pride John has in his product.
Good luck to Olive Garden surviving. When a Hedge Fund takes over a business, product and line employee quality tend to be squeezed to fatten the bottom line profits.
Honestly feel bad for John, that was disgraceful from the ad agency.
They made a trap, but it's his own fault for walking into it.
The lesson as I see it is it's more about the company than the ad agency or John himself. The board and the CEO were interested in seeing John gone, so when the opportunity came, they took it. They might have battled through it, but instead amplified the message to get rid of him. It's interesting that the metrics are better than ever. I have to admit that the new products and options are a turnoff for me, but I'm not a big pizza consumer, so my opinion doesn't count much.
@@Sorcerers_Apprentice don't get what it is he said that was so bad!?
@@TheCbone1979it's actually pretty simple, clearly since the whole NFL thing, the black Americans were pissed of and did not like John, but then a random call comes to light where he is using the N-word casually. I think now you can see the problem now. It's like first he was seen anti-consumer and as a scumbag while now racist gets added, on top of that he probably burned A lot of bridges while backstabbing people over the years and rolling back things Nigel started.... It all ads up after all. The simple fact that he was forced out once but came in on his own, should tell you there probably was not a lot of good will with the executives to begin with
I would LOVE to take a deeper look on the Starboard takeover of Olive Garden; sounds intriguing
Agreed
I only knew about Papa John through what went through the media, so I'm shocked that i feel bad for the guy after watching
He does sound a bit egotistical with how he handled Nigel, but his ousting during his second tenure and forced stepping down from his chair position were definitely undeserved. The media defintely screwed him over.
If there's one universal truth in this crazy world - it's that journalists for big liberal media are *scum*
Your default should be to always assume the media and the government are lying through their pointed teeth unless proven otherwise
And now the media cries about why no one believes in them. As if they aren't responsible for their own hate for spinning lies out of nowhere
Ngl the name Laundry Service should’ve been the first sign that something wasn’t right
I feel bad for Nigel. Did his job well, didn't cut corners, and took Papa John's further but got betrayed by John for basically no good reason
yeah right
You don't know what might have been happening behind closed doors.
Nigel seemed to have good performance, and I respect that, however the man that built Papa Johns, and its rightful owner/founder is Papa John. He cares about his business, is honest, maintains cash flow, and successfully built a brand that was stronger than any of its competitors. It is sad that Nigel had to be deposed in such a way, but it was fair in as much as everyone knows that Johns was the best man for the job, and had earned his position.
The betrayal was the book John published which basically defamed the poor man. That was a dick move from John and karma came later when shitty news outlets did the same to him@@user-nu8in3ey8c
@@Gamerad360same with John
I hope papa wins the lawsuit. Laundry service did him so dirty
yeah, I had no idea that was what happened. I thought it was a just a "goofy old white guy says the N word" but I never even thought to think of the context of why the recording was even happening.
The power of a marketing company @@MIKAEL212345
Full context was they did a rug pull on him and he essentially took the bait before realizing it was too late. Full unedited call surely is boring, but that's not what the public and a public company responds to. Goes without saying Papa John should have dropped off the call before saying something that couldn't be taken back. Sure is odd the full context sees him dropping off a minute after the kill shot, while the Dirty Laundry agency brags they hope he F'n gets put out to pasture for it. PS anybody who has heard the Colonel Sanders story knows he's not somebody you want to cite: Wikipedia says his career as a lawyer abruptly ended when he got into a courtroom brawl with his _own_ client. Among other misadventures.
Why are you siding with the racist?
@@davidgladeven the bit that was edited everyone I knew was like "I wouldn't have said that but he wasn't calling people 'nword' just saying that col Sanders did"
I worked at Papa John's for 5 years and Papa John would come in and visit every store each year and he seemed like a genuinely nice guy that cared about the product and the people.
I had a similar experience. He came into our store, saw me busting my ass and he says about me "wow this n$&#% works hard!" smacked my butt and cartwheeled away. I stayed through that summer but never came back when school started again. Quite a character.
@@kphaxxso he didn't use the hard R based on the number of symbols you used
@@TheMysteryDriver nah but the butt smacking is more suspicious.
doesnt really matter if he said hard r or soft a@@TheMysteryDriver
They did him dirty, real dirty.
25:00 John in his final form 😂😂😂😂😂
Modern MBA makes some of the best content to me on TH-cam.
You've been on a tear lately keep up the good work my man.
Using celebrity spokespersons or making your CEO a celebrity is always risky. Celebrities can and often do discredit themselves - look at Jared from Subway and Gilbert Gottfried from AFLAC. The skills that make a successful CEO generally do not translate to celebrity. There are exceptions - Lee Iacocca did a great job as Chrysler’s front man in the 1980s while serving as CEO. But the few exceptions prove the rule. Rising to the top of your profession is like winning the lottery in that in both cases, people become more of what they already were.
This is such a saga. You do an amazing job telling stories in a compelling, efficient and detailed way!
Agree he gas a good business acumen understanding business models with balanced support of financial figures and qualitative areas of risk and he can articulate it well in words
Your channel is a favourite of mine, it's rare that information and facts are presented in such a coherent way. Appreciate the work that you're doing - best of luck and hope for many more!
yea I guess its an ok channel
Shoutout to Jason Stein for his comments getting leaked on a large call by his own colleagues not muting their mic. This is A+++ drama and its so fucking entertaining. Wow this might be the best Modern MBA video I've seen.
Papa John in China was my Friday dinner each week while I was in China nearly 8 years. Good taste, options to add your own toppings, good salad, and the garlic sauce/pizza dipping sauce were awesome. Now, it's a dirty place with only 1 side of a laminated paper as a menu. They don't offer options to add whatever toppings you want. Tuna salad was removed from the menu along with the potato wedges. Pizza sauce I feel lost flavor. Papa Johns closed in northeast China, so when I was in Dalian I went to a local small pizza shop which the owner made his own sauce and garlic bread from scratch. Best pizza I've ever had.
I've shopped/ worked at the grocery stores next to where Papa John lives in Louisville and I can confirm that he's always as sweaty as he is in adds. He's never rude and is generally pretty quiet, but I don't think I've ever seen him blink or wear anything that isn't red or black.
I have a friend who used to work at Laundry Service, I should ask him about this.
If you eat 40 pizzas in 30 days, your taste buds cannot be trusted.
Untrue.
Source: Pizza.
Or your heart.
Its probably more likely he _tasted_ 40 different pizza, eating some portion of them, rather than literally consuming 40 whole pies.
I remember him saying this during an interview on I believe valuetainment... It wasn't 40 different pizzas. It was 40 Papa John's pizzas that he was tasting for QC. Basically he was testing pizzas from different locations to ensure quality was being delivered consistently.
or your bath scale.....
I feel bad for judging John based off the media articles. Thank you for telling the story and providing perspective. I've recently found your channel, it's fantastic. Please keep up the great work.
My 60 year old father has also subscribed :)
What Papa Johns did to John was unforgiveable. I kind of liked ordering from there but when I heard they fired him I stopped and haven't been back since. I'd rather eat shoe leather.
John was on a podcast talking about cultural issues and was not calling anyone the n-word, but using it to describe racism, and for this they crucified him. And, as the video shows, it proves John right to have taken extra measures in the company to monitor their behavior since the board leaked private information about him and used the scandal to fire him. The whole thing was a shitshow. But I guess this is just another reason not to sell your company and stay with it, or to ever go public with a company you still care about.
He was angry and defensive and made a boneheaded statement- a false statement slandering Colonel Sanders' name, and one in which saying the n word was not necessary at all.
Commenting before watching, but Papa John is just another story of why having a celebrity founder/CEO is just a huge liability
Especially when people seeing the whole thing only ends up making the management that outed him the bad guys in the eyes of consumers. Now the best PJ management can hope for is ending up just seen as asses who tolerated things while waiting to stab their founder in the back.
You just know they wouldn't have done it again if given the chance to do it all over
Yes, it reminds me a lot of what's going on with Tesla.
Well, you were right. Whether the celebrity is good or not is irrelevant. The media will follow even the slightest hint of drama because that’s profitable. Having a highly visible CEO just puts a target on the company’s back
Or, actually retain control of your own company so you can do whatever you want and there is nobody to kick you out
After watching it all, I see the reverse
A company with no CEO personality behind it will sell itself to random shareholders and follow none of its initial values
He was unlucky that he was attacked at a time when media still had some power, if it was nowadays no one would fucking care, it would probably even turn out as good publicity
I’ve been to Papa John’s twice in two different locations. Both gave me minimal toppings and practically no cheese. Tasted funky too. Haven’t been back since
I stopped giving Papa John's business the moment they ousted John, because to me it was plain to see what was going on. I will continue to give them no business unless John is put in control again. I simply CANNOT support a company that takes such horrendous actions against their own founder.
Man this video made me hungry lol. Very interesting with the 2018 company take. I was actually one of those people who saw their solagan as just marketing, but figured quality was just on par with every other chain of pizzas; something I avoid.
This is a classic example of why you never try to appease the mob. Stand strong in the face of public pressure.
They really did John dirty. I haven't a fan since the mid 2000s only because our local papa johns just started hiring people that couldn't get a pizza right to save their life, but I'll always take a perfect papa pizza over a perfect dominos or pizza hut pizza. Papa garlic sauce is also easily the best pizza chain garlic sauce.
i remember being in college when this place was taking off.. we all really liked it, it was miles better than everywhere else we had around. never felt ripped off buying their pies.
sadly either way at the end of all this debacle its the same overpriced crummy junk as everywhere else now and not worth spending on.
have had a much nicer and cheaper time buying a stand mixer and learning to make my own pizza dough.
Papa John's slogan should be: "IF YOU ARE YEARNING FOR A PIE THAT FEATURES PIZZA LIKE INGREDIENTS BUT IS DEVOID OF ANY DISCERNIBLE PIZZA TASTE... PAPA JOHN'S IS YOUR PIZZA!"
I've known some people who used to have regular interactions with John - not really close personal friends but did gardening type work, etc. for him and they all said that he was odd and a character but was usually pretty nice - almost magnanimous. Those who lived near by that didn't really know him (at all) all thought he had a temper and was crazy. I pretty much think he was somewhere in between. Just think - if he didn't become the "face" of Papa John's he'd likely be ousted a lot lot sooner.
Having read the full transcript of the call with Laundry Service and Steve, I think John is a little bit insane, and maybe an alcoholic at the time, but he’s not a racist. Dude directly compared the current alt-right to politics of the people who used to “disappear” Black people in the 60s and 70s, which is, imo, pretty baller of him.
John did nothing wrong except not actually reading Sanders' autobiography, and not keeping 51% equity.
Great video essay. I've always wondered what the full story was behind this.
The amount of ads in this video has left a really bad taste in my mouth
use brave browser
Wow the advert was painful nearly bombed out
"I never said I ate 40 pizza's in 30 days. I said I had 40 pizza's in 30 days." Papa John
People who ask, "how can pizza have so much drama?" Have never worked in pizza.
I wish I could sit down with John and have him do the whole ancient aliens meme and try to sell me on all sorts of conspiracies and hot takes related to Papa John's and the pizza industry in general.
What a story... thank you for digging in and sharing in such a compelling way!
This is one of the best business review channel out there, worthy of a best thesis in uni
I got to meet Papa John last June serendipitously. He had flown into Florida and visited the place I work. He was very sullen and quiet.
Never once have I thought papa johns had good ingredients
Better than the other big chains by a mile
That gotta be one of the top Anime betrayal at all times... maybe only beat by Griffith's betrayal to Guts.
This title is almost as insane as "The Quest to Beat JimmyPoopins"
how is TH-cam so small lol
Wow usually you expect the founder ceo to be some rich snob who has lost touch, but papa john here was actually just dont durty and did nothing wrong, actually got backstabbed like they all like to claim they did to cover for their bad jobs. Poor dude, hope he gets some justice.
Oh he's very much a rich snob. He was just also targeted for removal. Any of his cringe content as a wannabe influencer and his sexual misconduct settlements attest to that.
@@Stormthorn67you’re cringe for corporate bootlicking
I would never buy factor just because of your 15 minute plug
Listening on headphones and at 35:00 I realized what was coming on the lead in for the phone conversation and just blurted out "No" on a packed but practically silent train car
bro, I just wanted to drop a comment to say you have some of the best content on TH-cam, love it
Awesome work as always...but damn do I want a deep dive into shady hedge funds doing weird things to take over companies!
Papa Johns was only the first to accept online orders nationally. The first online orders were accepted by pizza hut's pizza net. Source: unlicensed pizza historian
binge your vids and usually lurk but I wanted to make a comment becaus I have learned so much from this channel. Love you guys please don't stop
That ad agency is nasty.
I hate how they say better ingredients but it’s actually terrible ingredients
It used to be better. They have to be cutting more corners to hit a price point.
It did used to be much better. Imo they made the best pizza of the big chains for a long time.
Very well made & insightful!!
Not cheap enough for value, not good enough for quality... last time I ordered a Papa Jhons pizza was enough for me to scrap it from my delivery option list. It was a pizza with ham, where the ham was chopped into little strips instead of the regular square shapped ham. The entire pizza tasted like just dough.
Maybe it was that location. When I do order Pizza I get Papa John's.
@@jvanek8512 probably all the stores in my country are the same. So, when I want cheap and fast, I go for Dominos or Little Ceasars and when I want better taste, I go for mum and pop stores. Papa Johnes does not offer a clear target and that's why they will slowly fade away.
This is a good description of the issue with their pizza . They’re like the Sears of pizza . Not a cheap pizza option like little ceasars and not good enough to be quality local pizza
I'm sorry, I know you have to make money somehow. But Factor trying to advertise itself as restaurant quality, when it's looking like a microwaved pile of mush (in multiple creators videos), is maybe the next case study for this channel to cover. And the packaging approach is giving off soylent, or soylent green vibes.
So true, yes he needs to make money but it seems like a big oversight for this page. I'd be more content if they took an actually quality sponsor or something non-food. But hey at least they're getting their bag.
As a black man and a millennial, I did not upset due to the controversy. Of all of the pizza franchises, I believe Papa John's made the best pizza. I have not been to the franchise as much since his departure because they no longer have a presence. John Schnatter was papa john. He became a large part of their success and with him being gone there's no brand recognition. It's just another pizza chain.
Also it should be noted that when John was the CEO all full time employees had profit sharing bonuses, whe. John was fired the first thing thry did wad tk get rid of thoes bonuses and cut the quality of ingredients
@samuelsummers4376
That, and their pizza is just horrible. Even Dominos tastes better. Papa John's is also the most expensive, despite all this.
@@MarvinPowell1 I personally always thought Domino’s tasted like cardboard. However, my post was less about food and more about image. I feel that they’re now a faceless pizza chain. Also, I hate seeing founders displaced from their companies.
Most of the time it's people who aren't black who care disproportionately about these things, idk why but that's how it is.
The pizza wasn't that good in the first place and it was kind of expensive even before inflation I don't know there's a big difference between before John and after and I'm black... All I know is the shit cost too much 😂
RIP Nigel, the Ned Stark of Pizza
I used to be ulta loyal to Papa Johns, once Papa was forced out, I never bought another pizza from them again!
I swear either synchronicity is a thing in this universe or some AI is controlling a hivemind because this guy and Papa Johns has been on my mind in the last 2 weeks for no reason at all 😄
My code worke.. i mean what a coincidence
Bro, same here. Last week he came up 3 times in conversation at work for no reason
Laundry Service is clearly trash, and John's comment is taken out of context, and CLEARLY not a slur. Slimey laundry service.
It's a slur and he wasn't prompted or tricked into saying it. It's not acceptable in any context.
@@stoogel NPC mode
@@BlueGamingRage We must take a stand against hate speech on the internet by actively promoting respectful dialogue, fostering empathy, and supporting diverse voices to create a safer and more inclusive digital community for everyone.
Ironically, I actually liked Papa John's as my favorite pizza brand before they kicked him out, now, not so much. it's dropped down to like 3rd with dominos in position 1. I personally don't care how you think as long as you make a good product I'm going to buy it, as long as we're in this screwed up economic system where money>people anyway...
Makes me wonder how good of a pizza Hitler would have made.
@@sasukeuchiha998he did have ovens at the ready
@@sasukeuchiha998he probably would have had worse business practices leading to bad products. I, unlike most, can separate a creator's personal thoughts from their creation and judge the creation on its own merits rather than judging it for its creator. Horrible people are still capable of making beautiful things, in the same way that beautiful people are capable of some of the worst acts you can emagine.
I will always prefer to open a pizza box with a container of garlic sauce in it.
Why’s dominos so successful with their supply chain sales model when that’s what everybody cites as the downfall of quiznos? Dominos not squeezing the franchisees as much as quiznos was?
Domino's does a better job using it as a subsidiary to supply third parties.
@angoraramp
Dominos is much cheaper to operate than a Quiznos. Ironically, Subway is the cheapest food chain of all to run, which is why there's so many of them internationally and why their subs are so overpriced, yet Quiznos is another sub chain, but costs much more to operate; possibly due to all those ovens.
@@MarvinPowell1subway has really high fees, and easy/cheap to open. That's why there's so many and their prices are way too high for the product, you still have to make money after all the fees.
Quizznos was poorly managed and was bankrupt when they should have been profitable. They drastically increased their raw ingredient prices to franchisees until the owners made zero money. They could not pay their own salaries and walked away.
35:14 O. M. G. I had no clue that Papa was set up this bad! That's insane! Goes to show that context is always important. FREE PAPA J
That is gross
What I am amazed by is this video saying Pizza Hit is making doubke what Dominos is making. Idk anyone who goes to Pizza Hut anymore. Our local pizza hut is always empty, ghetto and dirty.
I believe that Pizza Hut, KFC, and Taco Bell are all owned by PepsiCo. Can hardly imagine how cheap their product ingredients are. Corporate greed is everywhere.
My skin was crawling listening to Jason Stein.
Every. Single. Time.
Dude is a snake.
Okay, if the use of the N word is "unacceptable under any circumstances", why in the fuck are modern rappers not on the chopping block? even sugarhill gang got called out and radio edited for its use, it still happened though....
I will say this....the pizza is shit after they ousted their CEO.
Makes me think it was just a coup to increase profits and shitify the company and its products.
I worked at a papa johns in 2009. I also served as Mr. Slice, a pizza slice mascot who would make appearances at new openings or spin a sign on the street. I got fired for dancing "too provocatively" because I did a lot of up thrusts. I also ate a lot of the cheese. Good times
Not acceptable in any context? How the Hell do you tell people about it then?
I think Mark Shapiro was on the Papa John's board because he made a deal with Papa John's to be the pizza in Six Flags when he was CEO. I actually agree with Schnatter that Shapiro probably doesn't know anything about pizza, he sure didn't know anything about running theme parks lol.
NGL this is wayyyyy better than a telenovela. Call Schattner old fashioned, but the man did care about quality and product.
Papajohns has gotten BAD! Real BAD!!!!
Lesson learned, founders should trademark brand names to them. They have spent a lot of time and moneh to buukd a brand or name thus the only incentive in case a company is taken away from you is that you still get royalty under that brand name
The kneeling and sport boycotts did hurt pizza sales. Anyone who couldn't see this need to rethink their thinking. There was plenty of data at the time to prove this point. This isn't 'old way thinking' it's just fact. Sometimes, often what's politically correct isn't correct at all. Often times the exact opposite. I remember hearing this claim and looking for myself to easily see the same conclusion. In hindsight I guess it makes sense. If people are not watching a sport that they normally would maybe they would order less pizza. Wow. Crazy, I know and when you studied year over year pizza sales it makes sense.
I remember being jealous that my cousins school did the Papa John’s school lunch program so they always had papa John’s
Damn, I used to work at a Papa John's. Crazy to see lore for this shit
To be fair a lot of businesses opposed the affordable care act because of the increased cost. I remember an article saying 60% of businesses polled wanted it repealed and on the Germany 1867 I had to look that up and I found the article and he was talking about how his great grandfather left Germany in 1867 because it's lack of free enterprise and freedom and he felt with all the regulations on the United States it was becoming that way also.
REEEEEEEEE
Papa John's used to be so good. Once they cut corners but kept similar prices there was no reason to ever order from them. They went from my go-to pizza delivery to not ordering it in roughly a decade.
What's the world coming to when u can't trust a guy that makes pizza to lead the national dialogue on race?
The clear lesson here is that soft skills are just as important as hard skills.
Nigel Travis had a champion strategy for the brand. He made the pizzas more accessible to more people without discounting and devaluing the product. Terrible how he was stabbed in the back but that's what happens to hard workers who focus on the task instead of playing social games. Glad he got a better job and a happy retirement.
You’re cutting your segments too close, almost every cut chops off half or a whole word of narration.
Sheesh, that call was the epitomy of hostile business relations. I'm assuming the Laundry Services reps knew the call was being recorded (though maybe not that it would actually be used), and they put themselves, on record, essentially saying "Yeah, fuck that guy, I hope he gets bent".
I Loved that MW2 reference at the end. Great episode too
I know what is better than factor meals ....
Papa John's
It’s wild how all these random ass people can overtake and overthrow you from your own company that you started, built, grew and even named after yourself
Papa John's was and still is a better product than Pizza Hut.
I've not had a Papa John's pizza in the years since the last regime change - from the comments below I don't think I want to spend for premium now - appears there's little that's premium about the product.... With as expensive as everything food related is these days I'm beginning to believe that my OONI pizza oven was a great investment...
Cant wait for the 2057 biopic of Papa John. The man is the true king of pizza.
Unfortunatly company politics are the worst, even small ones like startups play game of thrones from time to time and this destroys the orginastion from no one wanting to work there to lower quality products/services
When you keep getting backstabbed by your best friends, it's more a commentary on you than them.
I think you mean 20th century Germany...
3:07 He definitely looks like he ate 40 pizzas and a 40oz right before the interview
He had Botox injected in his face obviously. And colored his hair. He is an attention seeking narcissist just like MyPillow guy.