Dumbledore referring to Voldemort as "Tom" seems like the ultimate sign of disrespect or simply his way of showing that he still sees him as that young boy from the orphanage and therefore not much of a threat. No matter how strong or powerful Voldemort may become, Dumbledore will always have Tom's number
I think it's more because of familiarity, despite being adversaries. He was his teacher after all. Imagine for example musician, who uses stage name meeting his primary school teacher. I wouldn't imagine that teacher would call them by that name, rather use their real name, even if whole world know them under this name. After all, lord voldemort was a made up name.
Well Voldemort thought of himself as a god like being and dumbledor calling him Tom on purpose is to remind him that no matter what he’s still just human
Insane that Dumbledore owned Voldemort, trapped Bellatrix, protected Harry and sent word to Fudge all at the same time. You may not like him but you can’t deny, Dumbledore’s got style.
Did you not read or hear? Are you OK? He literally was saved by tons of third parties. Are you mad? He only trapped bellatrix instead of duelling cuz she blocked his spells prior to this. He literally didn't want to duel her ( not to waste time although only 2 minutes and bella is defeated) and got a bird to save his old ... whatever.
@@jihanessa4132 the thing is he wasn't actually being serious with his comment about Dumbledore, he's powerfull but nobody can handle all that, hence the exaggeration. Also, another "hint" is in the quote "you may not like him but you can’t deny, Dumbledore’s got style.", which is what Shacklebolt says to Fudge when Dumbledore escapes going to Azkaban "with style" earlier in the story. Sorry for coming across a bit rude, it just looked kinda obvious to me that his comment was not supposed to be taken so seriousy.
@@axolyn4504 K man but I didn't remember/recall kingsley saying that at the moment I wrote the comment so OK sorry I take that back. Of course we don't deny his power.
i feel like the only time we see dumbledore's real power is when he destroys the inferi army with one spell, whilst literally dying and driven half crazy by the evil potion. i think he was always holding back, maybe because last time he went all out his sister was killed.
@@oguzelinc2048 elderwand tho enhances your power but isn't the sole power itself. Moreover by going through books, we see elderwand is rather overrated. It only enhances your magical abilities upto some extent. You can be disarmed nd you lose it's ownership at the exact same moment. For that we can have two conclusions. 1. JK Rowling failed to draw a proper character ketch of the elderwand. 2. Elderwand was a deathly hallows nd that's why it's overrated. A wizards power and magical abilities play the most important role rather than the elderwand. As we know the elderwand changed it's allegence time to time and from one weilder to the other. That didn't particularly had to do something with the power of the weilder but if in anyway their opponent is able to disarm the weilder, he/she'd be the new owner of the wand. It can be done either in face to face confrontations or by cleverly disarming the weilder. One more interesting fact we know about wands is that they're used to channelise the power of their weilder more precisely. The elderwand being the lord of wands would do the exact same thing with the best accuracy. Dumbledore was the most powerful wizard of his time from the very beginning. By no means he'd be dependent on the elder wand for everything. He was powerful, had surpassed every single wizard or witch he came accross nd was even the supreme mugwomp at a point of time. Even his his weak and fragile state, he was able to channelise thehis energy to perform some of the most powerful spells. Saying that it was just because of the elderwand highly diminishes his importance as a character and his feats of strength. He was wisest among all. He knew when nd where to use his immense power nd upto what extent. In reality as well as in fiction, there are some characters far more powerful than protagonist and the villian but there's always some sort of situation in which they can't straight away kill the villian. In the 5th book as well we can see that Dumbledore never tried to kill voldemort. He could've defeated him but he chose to protect Harry. Knowing that voldemort can't be killed nd even if he was defeated, soon he'd be back. Moreover, in order to kill voldemort, one hadda destroy the hocruxes. Dumbledore only feared one thing. It wasn't his death nor voldemort. But he feared what would happen to the wizarding world after him. Not untill he knew the exact number of hocruxes voldy had, he chose not to put himself in a situation where he's vulnerable to death. Nd even after that, he chose to die on his will and according to his plan.
I honestly don’t find the fire in the cave overly impressive for him. It’s literally just a massive ring of magical fire, which of course looks incredible, but Dumbledore was capable of much more powerful magic than something as simple as that in my opinion!
Dumbledore was just buying time. His intentions were to make the minister and the others see by themselves that Voldemort was back To achieve that, he needed to buy lots of time. He was not worried about losing, he is way more powerful than Tom, but he was worried in buying enough time.
If he was that much more powerful then why didn't he just finish off voldemort there and then? Turning him back into his spirit form would have made it much easier to go around destroying the other horcruxes.
I guess I’d say I’m in between. I think Dumbledore was more powerful at this point on paper, but Voldemort was more brutal and willing to kill. Dumbledore was holding back just enough to buy time and keep his intentions to not outright kill Voldemort.
The person who chose to have absolutely no music in this scene was a hero. one of the greatest scenes in movie history, certainly the best duel in the original series of 8 HP movies. Although I think Dumbeldore vs Creedance is a favourite of mine due to the advancements of movie technique and visuals.
@@stianaandal1488 agree and disagree? I wish we saw Dumbledore teleporting around to dodge spells but i also like the display of both users skills, Voldemort with mastery over destruction, casting large scale attacks without wand movements nor words, and Dumbledore using mastery of alteration to counter all these large scale attacks with minimal effort (using a despell on the fire snake and pushing the flames back, using the water from a fountain to trap Voldemort, turning the shards of glass into sand) it was a great display of their strengths
@@stianaandal1488 seriesly. I thought the scene was underwhelming at best. Everything we knew about magic and how duels worked were just thrown out the window. It’s like in anime when every character has to get stronger and stronger till they’re doing things that undermine how the whole series works. Statues coming to life and tackling chasing people down. So unexpected and mysteries. It really showcases dumbledore skills. Dumbledore was a badass and this scene cemented himself into his already Legendary status. The dialog really strung everything together and made each scene more impactful. Idk why they thought it was a good idea to leave out all the dialog that made the scene what it was.
Dumbledore is such an enigma. It seems like he can obliterate the entire Harry Potter universe by himself. He steps in when he needs to but only to the level he needs to.
Certainly book Dumbledore. I wonder if the things we see him do take more preparation beforehand than we see. Like; he expects a duel with Voldemort, so he does a month long preparation, lots of meditation, creating complex preprepared spells he can do during the duel like the push on a button. Like; just disapparet, apparet and then send 4 inanimate objects on complex tasks like alerting other people through the flu network? That's something you don't do on the fly but sounds like you could prepare, like a potion.
Dukblefore obviously wasn’t doing it to defeat Voldemort. He was trying to stall time for the Aurors to come and see the truth. Plus he had to protect harry. He was smart and Voldemort fell into his trap
@@donis3722 you got the best comment!! That literally is exactly what happened and I can deduce that not even being fanatically into the series like that even tho i love the harry potter universe in all its forms book movie games etc
Do you know that it was Dumbledore in the book who actually expressed true horror when Voldy possesed Harry? Because he have never seen such dark magic before.
"It's foolish of you to come here tonight, the aurors will be here soon." "By that time, I shall be gone and you be dead." "You do not wish to kill me Dumbledore, above such brutality, are you?" The duel in the book is one of my fav moment of all. Just something about Dumbledore just casually blocking the curses while speaking to tom how death isn't the worst thing that could befall on a man.
Idk, Dumbledore was acting casual in their talk (he was not worried) but it's not like he easily defeated Voldemort. In reality he almost died, he would've been hit by the last Killing Curse without Fawkes' help.
@@thayspamacheno628 It's not like it was an accident that Fawkes was there. Dumbledore brought him for a reason. If Fawkes wasn't there Dumbledore would have summoned something else to protect him or dissapparate, and he was protecting Harry, while restraining Bellatrix all the while casually holding Voldie at bay. A Voldemort mind you that was trying to kill outright.
@@basicallybasic8697 Not really, Dumbledore does not "bring" Fawkes anywhere, Fawkes as a phoenix that is loyal to Dumbledore can find him wherever he is (just like it found Harry in Chamber of Secrets) and sense if he is in danger. These are powers they possess. And Dumbledore did have ways to defend himself as he was shown doing (statues), but everytime one of the statues blocked in the Killing Curse would destroy them, and by that time there were none left, Dumbledore wasn't able to apparate quickly enough and it's been clearly stated multiple times throughout the series that it is impossible to block the Killing Curse with magic (you may only use physical objects). So I can easily say Fawkes actually saved Dumbledore's life at that point and he would have died otherwise, because that's exactly what happened in the scene - for a moment it seems Dumbledore will be hit, then Fawkes swoops in and dies in his place (but since it is a phoenix, it is immediately reborn afterwards). Dumbledore wasn't holding Bellatrix at all, she was hit by one of his spells but it is not like he was actively keeping her in place with his powers, that's not how spells work, they don't need to be "kept" through concentration once they've been cast. That aside, Dumbledore was acting casual when he interact with Voldemort, but he not even once was duelling him in a casual way, they were both exchanging extremely powerful spells, elemental magic and transfiguration are extremely advance forms of magic to use in a duel, just using them already is far from "casual", Dumbledore was >talking< casually to Voldemort, but so was Voldemort when addressing him, even if he was way more aggressive. Anyway, I'm not saying Dumbledore is not more powerful than Voldemort. He is, and that has been both stated and proven multiple times through the books. He was the most powerful wizard in the world, perhaps in wizarding history. But it is not like Voldemort was SO much weaker than Dumbledore that he could easily defeat him. I'm just pointing out that even if Dumbledore was more powerful than he was, the difference was not that huge and Dumbledore could easily die duelling him if he was not careful, because Voldemort is the only person in the world who can spam the Killing Curse rapidly (even Bellatrix was not able to simply spam it like Voldemort does) and he went deeper in the dark arts than any other dark wizard before him, to the point it has been clearly stated by Dumbledore himself that "Voldemort possessed powers I will never have" (ofc, he won't have them by choice, but it is still an advantage of Voldemort over him, since dark arts have been shown to be much harder to defend against than ordinary magic).
@@gregnelson9379 They were closer now. Apparating does no happen instantly (think of Dobby at the Malfoy Manor). Dumbledore was defenseless at that moment, he would've died if Fawkes did not sweep in
Dumbledore: "Even though the devastating loss, Harry, you must not sacrifice yourself" Harry: *jumps towards the next Killing Curse* Dumbledore: *Blows the tip of his two fingers as if extinguishing smoke from gun barrel* thinking "and that's the end of Harry-Horcrux. Touché".
Dumbledore didn't know at this point that voldemort had horcruxes but dumbledore realized all the attacks he gives to voldemort don't harm him at all and that's when dumbledore became sceptical because the dark lord doesn't get any damage and voldemort just keeps coming back for more
He might have been a tiny bit more powerful but that’s because of the elder wand. With equal wands, Voldemort is slightly more powerful, not to mention if Voldemort has the elder wand. Just check how he destroyed the whole shield at the Hogwarts battle in a matter of seconds. Dumbledore wouldn’t be able to produce such a power, even with the elder wand (and it wasn’t even loyal to Voldemort in that scene)
@@paulgraf5746 As much as i like Voldemort and obviously voldemort is the most powerful and dangerous dark wizard of all time but Dumbledore still edge out voldemort with power because dumbledore is the powerful sorcerer in the world and holds the title of Grand Sorcerer. On harry potter and the hall blood prince dumbledore produced a massive fire storm and that was dumbledore at his weakest because of the poison he drank. The correct rankings is 1)Dumbledore 2)Voldemort 3)Grindelwald And it has been confirmed by jk Rowling herself period
See, Dumbledore always had a plan. Book 4 he was basically elated that voldemort took Harry's blood, therefore keeping Lily's protective charm alive in him. Dumbledore also knew that Harry was a Horcrux. Book 6, he admitted to caring for Harry too much. Dumbledore knew the prophecy, "neither can live while the other survives." His whole plan was to give Harry the best chance at living, even if he had to die (destroy him being horcrux) to get the job done. Dumbledore killing Voldemort's body in book 5 would have taken away Lily's protective spell which would have meant certain death for Harry once he figured out he HAS to die to destroy the horcrux in him. Tldr: Dumbledore loved Harry and gave him the only way to come out of this alive in the end. Edit: Dumbledore claps at any other time.
Except Petunia is also able to sustain Harry's charm until his 17th birthday or if he moved out before that this is why Dumbledore made Harry go back to the Dursley's every summer. Because so long as he could call a blood relative of Lily's house home the bond of blood charm would stay active. The movie did a really bad job of explaining this because its also the one thing that shows Petunia in a new light. She had to willingly accept Harry for the charm to work. Even as much as she hated his magic blood she still willingly accepted him to protect him. Or simply put this is how Dumbledore explained it. "While you can still call home the place where your mother's blood dwells, there you cannot be touched or harmed by Voldemort. He shed her blood, but it lives on in you and her sister. Her blood became your refuge. You need return there only once a year, but as long as you can still call it home, there he cannot hurt you. Your aunt knows this. I explained what I had done in the letter I left, with you, on her doorstep. She knows that allowing you houseroom may well have kept you alive for the past fifteen years." - Dumbledore explaining how the charm works
@@LavitosExodius I've always seen Petunia as a way to bide Harry time. Yes, you are factually correct, but Dumbledore eventually came to love Harry enough to want him to survive the prophecy. By Dumbledore's reaction at the end of the 4th book, he had already had some concept of that endgame, and that was Riddle taking Harry's blood to resurrect, meaning the charm would live in Voldemort regardless of how old Harry was. Now, the only explanation for this is really left to speculation. Why would the charm continue to work? The only thing I can think of is the specificity Dumbledore used....Petunia, a blood relative, had to accept Harry, versus Voldemort willingly taking Harry's blood. It's obviously not explained in detail, but I'd love to hear more of your perspective.
@@2B_S5 No the charm itself will automatically remove at 17 that has been stated by JK at a conference as far back as 2005 even. Dumbledores charm just made the sacrificial protection last longer but not permanently. Ani Morison for Sunday Star Times New Zealand - My question is why does Harry keep going back to the Dursleys, when he is closer to the Weasleys than he is to them? JK Rowling: That has been explained in the books to an extent, it has been explained in the books but possibly you haven't yet finished this book when it is made very clear. Harry receives magical protection from his mother's sacrifice as long as he remains close to her blood. In other words, Aunt Petunia. That protection won't continue to hold once he is a man, once he turns 17 - he is no longer given that protective aura by his mother, so Dumbledore wants him to go back one more time to ensure the protection continues to his 17th birthday and after that he really is on his own.
@@LavitosExodius Then do you know why Dumbledore had that triumphant look in his eyes, briefly, after Harry told him that Voldemort took his blood?? It was always my understanding that this led to Harry having the option to return back to life or not after his horcrux was destroyed
@@2B_S5 See that whole thing is a plot hole though because it stands to reason if Harry can't be killed while Voldemort is alive neither can Voldemort as he also shares the protection now. As Harry was very much still alive. Unless were going to say by destroying his last horcrux Voldemort was already dying. Unless were also going to say well Voldemort killed himself with his own curse. Well then Harry could have just been Imperiused by somebody that wasn't Voldemort to kill himself. Which again invalidates the whole neither can die while the other lives which is what the charm implies. Because if were saying Harry's blood is what makes Voldemort unable to kill Harry well highly unlikely the charm can tell the different between people and just goes by blood then Harry would also be unable to kill Voldemort. Or much more likely JK forgot she had stated that about how the charm worked.
The reason D was so calm and confident is because he looked a lot like Jude Law when he was younger... that level of handsome confidence sticks with you for life.
It's strange that you think Fawkes' appearance shows a weakness on Dumbledore's part rather than his using the full range of magic at his disposal, and that the righteousness of his cause makes other magical creatures want to fight with him whereas Voldemort mostly has supporters because he kills all the no men. Dumbledore in many other instances has plans that involve Fawkes, who typically shows up to do one simple task and then is done for a bit. It's almost like a summoned pet in a video game, who shows up to do a thing or two on a limited timer and then has a somewhat lengthy cooldown before being available again. A Phoenix is, after all, said to be highly intelligent and fiercely loyal. Why anyone would think his presence in a battle would be for something other than as part of the team is curious: why on Earth would a Phoenix befriend and be loyal to a wizard so weak or stupid that he wouldn't be able to make use of a Phoenix's intellect and skills? Who is the only member of the team in the Order named after Fawkes' species who could be hit with a killing curse without dying? Fawkes. Who would Dumbledore fight who uses killing curses? How useful would it be to have Voldemort mistake a good time to waste his time using a curse that looked as though he'd be able to land it but which was actually meant to be a waste of precious casting time because at no point was Dumbledore actually vulnerable? Remember, Dumbledore is the most strategic and tactical thinker in the story. He's planned out everything in fine detail including how and when he himself must be killed, how and when Voldemort must be killed, and so on down the line. Do you think he recruited as a pet one that can apparate at will, and whose apparition ability is unaffected by the magic of wizards, all willy-nilly? Or is this just another bit of Dumbledore's ability to plan out when, where and how to engage with Voldemort so that the battle and war both are profitably pursued to the advantage of the good and great?
The thought was running through my mind the first time he mentioned Fawkes showed a weakness in Dumbledore and I cringed at every time he repeated the statement. Thanks for taking the time to fully flesh out the idea, and adding much more. It was great you mention Dumbledore tactical abilities and the loyalty of such a magnificent creature seeing good in him.
I fully agree with your explanation. Plus, honestly, I think it would have been more entertaining if the movie actually followed the book and showed Dumbledore basically dog-walk Tom like he was dealing with a child throwing a tantrum, because it would have driven home to the audience who might not have read the book as to why Tom had made such effort to avoid direct conflict with Dumbledore. That is one of the things that drove me nuts about the movies, was they did not due Dumbledore true justice in just how capable he really is, and the only reason Tom was as successful as he was during the 1st Deatheater war was cause he used misdirection and avoided directly fighting Dumbledore and want after everyone else, cause while he is no mach against Albus, 1 thing is certain, Dumbledore could not be everywhere.
Yeah. It's sad that the movie folks decided not to do justice to Dumbledore and is power... including how he simultaneously and singlehandedly battled all of the death eaters and bested them. They downplayed his magical power and the power of his wand. It's a real pity and a totally lost opportunity to show that Voldemort had excellent reasons for fearing only Dumbledore. In addition to their respective power levels, Voldemort had a further weakness: he was too arrogant to have realized that Dumbledore's magical power wasn't the only thing he had to fear about Dumbledore. Dumbledore had learned that his knowing and being too proud of being more powerful than everyone and their brother was the one weakness he had that would lead him to ruin. Voldemort couldn't learn that lesson, and that as much as anything else is how Dumbledore worked out how to defeat him once and for all. And Dumbledore recognized that embracing a just and righteous death was itself the key. Voldemort ran from death and in the process ran himself to ruin. The deathly hallows tales told in the story is actually the allegory that appropriately frames the solution to the Voldemort problem and explains the whole of how Harry and crew would defeat Voldemort and crew. But the moviemakers screwed that beautiful piece of storytelling nineteen ways to Friday.@@darkwulf4862
“You do not seek to kill me, Dumbledore?” called Voldemort, his scarlet eyes narrowed over the top of the shield. “Above such brutality, are you?” “We both know that there are other ways of destroying a man, Tom,” Dumbledore said calmly, continuing to walk toward Voldemort as though he had not a fear in the world, as though nothing had happened to interrupt his stroll up the hall. “Merely taking your life would not satisfy me, I admit -” “There is nothing worse than death, Dumbledore!” snarled Voldemort. “You are quite wrong,” said Dumbledore, still closing in upon Voldemort and speaking as lightly as though they were discussing the matter over drinks. Harry felt scared to see him walking along, undefended, shieldless. He wanted to cry out a warning, but his headless guard kept shunting him backward toward the wall, blocking his every attempt to get out from behind it. “Indeed, your failure to understand that there are things much worse than death has always been your greatest weakness -”
Book Dumbledore gave me the chills in this scene. He is standing in front of the Most powerful Dark Wizard yet whose name brings terror to the entire Wizarding world and yet he's talking to him like he's just another student who needs to be punished.
So, one of D's weaknesses was his pride. He knows he's clever. He knows that he's prideful, and he's learned humility from his resulting mistakes. One of the things worse than death for a very smart person is humiliation. D knows this from experience, and he aims to give it to Tom in this moment. Tom leaves that fight not having beaten Harry or D, AND everyone discovers he's back, blowing his secretive advantage. Tom was humiliated.
Also, have to consider that he was fighting while suppressing Bellatrix and protecting harry while trying to stall for the Aurors. Despite his old age, Dumbledore might just be the most powerful wizard of all time.. maybe merlin is his equal.
@@GenichiSojo Nah, modern wizards are far weaker than those of the past. Wizards in the past would fight armies, modern wizards would struggle against a few goblins. Modern wizards rely too much on wands and lack in both physique and variety, limited to a much smaller variety of spells they consider 'light'. Wizards of old could single-handedly kill a dragon whereas modern freak out about a mere werewolf. Wizards of old spent every moment trying to improve before they die, modern spend their time engorging on sweets and gold.
@@necromancer6405 Was that ever actually established, though? Could it be like with sports, where we glorify the older guys (Bill Russel, Jerry West, etc), when in reality the new era of players are much better (jordan, lebron, etc)?.. I know the wizards in book had basically mythologized merlin and morganna, wasnt morrigan (the celtic goddess of war) a historical witch, too, as an ancestor to Isolt? Also, dragons can't be too deadly to wizards since they have highschoolers fight them as part of a competition..
I loved this duel in the books and I think it showed so much of what high level wizard dueling actually could be. The killing curse is directly uncounterable, but it has a travel time and can apparently be intercepted by other objects, which means that the way a master wizard actually kills another master wizard is not by doing something more powerful, but by being creative and unexpected in their spellcasting. If you're powerful enough and know what your opponent is going to do, there's always some spell you can cast that will nullify it (or at the very least let you escape), so to defeat an opponent of a high enough level, you need to do something that takes them longer to figure out a response than they have to cast it. That's so much more interesting than all the wand-clashes that we got in most fights.
I think it's a huge plot hole in this whole universe. Every death eater would just spam Avada kedavra and there wouldn't even exist such thing as duels
@@Drymarro ,Exactly,they could just kill everything in their way,I guess the movies corrected this from the books to be honest,I sure there are many things JKR would change in the story if she could and this would be one of these things,the best thing in the frachise is a duel wand to wand without all these complicated spell casting,Tom and Dumbledore duel is simple,better and more badass in the movie cause he wasn't asking anything "calmly" 😂
@@shadowagent6051 yes I'd design a better spell and dueling system. but can't take away credit from her creativity. Quidditch is also a stupid game but it is what it is. the duel with Tom and Dumbledore is brilliant in the movies because it highlights the different powers available for high-level wizards. There is a ton of inconsistency in these movies. For example, why didn't more wizards just buy Weasleys' magic tricks to win duels? For example the smoke bomb that Harry buys. They just resort to using their wand. Also, why don't more wizards use petrificus totalem? it seems a rather amazing spell to disable your opponent.
@@Drymarro ,There's also the potions,I sure there are more forbidden potions out there that could give some advantage in spells,the "Petrificus Totalus" is effective to get someone off guard cause otherwise it can be counter with "Finite Incantatem",I think Quidditch is a awesome game but the Bludgers are very unnecessary and dangerous,it should be only the Quaffles and the Golden Snitch.
@@shadowagent6051 I'm more about the side that Quidditch is dumb because the seeker and the 150 points makes everyone else useless! It was to make Harry the star tbh. Also yes, potions are literally almost never explored in the books/movies apart from polyjuice, with some small exceptions. So unfortunate. I think potions are one of my favorite aspects that could be explored deeper.
Fawkes has a special connection to Dumbledore. It is theorized that Dumbledore may even have inadvertently created a horocrux out of Fawkes via his sister. Either way Fawkes seems to be an extention of Dumbledore, so I think it doesn't disqualify him in any wins.
@@PaTrick-cf6evRowling has seen that theory, and was far from impressed by it. In fact she said it upset her that people would even think of Dumbledore would actually think of doing this.
@@lxena8033which just made her more unlikeable since the entire theory was based around him accidentally doing it out of love, thus creating something completely different to a normal Horcrux which is made purposely out of fear.
I agree with all of your comments ...except for Fawkes indicating Dumbledore as the loser. He brought Fawkes with him for such a need, and was ready for the snake...letting Fawkes deal with the curse. The REAL indication of the losing wizard is the moment the duel stops....when Voldemort possesses Harry. He could not use DIRECT means to defeat Dumbledore...so he chose an indirect route...to defeat Harry. And that also failed. So Voldemort lost twice... And while I think it was not possible for Dumbledore to WIN, he certainly didnt lose.
@@emankcin1701 not sure where that came from. But, i do not think Dumbledore would want to destroy Nagini, Voldemort may have chosen to just make another horcrux.
I wondered this as well but considering what you find out in book 6 and seven about Voldemort‘s past encounters with Dumbledore. I think the other big factor is that Dumbledore is completely inside Voldemort‘s head. Even as a child, Dumbledore new what riddle was up to in ways that riddle never fully understood, same as an adult. Dumbledore always tends to know who Voldemort is travelling with, and how he tix. So I think the book implies that Dumbledore has this psychological edge over Voldemort because Voldemort is only wary around Dumbledore. And he never fully grasp how Dumbledore actually knows what he knows about the way riddle operates. Dumbledore clearly knows things that Voldemort doesn’t, and Voldemort fundamentally doesn’t know how Dumbledore has this power. That’s my take on it. Voldemort never moved past being the little weirdo kid that got up to no good and Dumbledore always seemed to know what was going on. This makes Dumbledore a complete unknown entity in many ways as far as Voldemort is concerned, which probably makes him behave differently than he would with anybody else. To a lesser extent it even happens with Harry and Voldemort, Voldemort just doesn’t understand why he can’t kill him, so he sends other people to do it for him until he can figure out why. As Dumbledore says to him “the fact that he can’t consider anything worse than death is actually one of Voldemort‘s weaknesses because it makes him blind to lots of other things that may be just as powerful which he completely disregards.
Dude if Grindelwald couldn't kill Dumbledore with that elder wand as we saw in Fantastic beasts 3, I bet Voldemort couldn't stand any chance, he would be 10 times down than Grindelwald, he didn't even use elder wand and his dark skills wouldn't beat Dumbledore like legit❗☝️, Dumbledore is too talented, and have lots of experiences.
Yep, even in old age, dumbledore would have walked over voldi Dumbledore is more than 150years old , voldi is barely 60 Its like when frieza had a new body and rushed to fight goku
Dumbledore's such a badass in this scene in the book. The movie kind of ruined it. The dialogue also reinforces (it's even the chapter title) why Dumbledore is the only one Voldemort is afraid of. You can tell the people who either only watched the movies or watched the movies first because they tend to think Dumbledore is kind of useless.
Maybe I’m different from the masses but I saw movie dumbledore absolutely handle Tom. Tom had to resort to possessing Harry THEN ran at the end. Plus I came from the world of anime where the old and very young tend to be overpowered lol
Idk, I kind of like the idea of the movies never really needing to show or explain how much Voldemort is afraid of Dumbledore. The books kinda have to cause, well, they’re books. It’s easier to explain emotion and feeling through dialogue and over the top scene description since all you have are words and paper. Voldemorts fear has already been so implied. Michael Gambon’s Dumbledore had such an intimidating presence, especially when he first shows up at the Ministry. With one line he proved he wasn’t afraid of him. And then, to me, Voldemort threw some of his best stuff at him, and Dumbledore not only blocked a seemingly unblockable curse, he stopped all of it with relative ease, and Voldys fright could be seen all over his face, no words necessary besides “…oh”. The books Dumbledore kinda made it feel like he could just, blink or fart, and save the world. Then again Im maybe just more of a cinematic guy, and we can all agree the cinematography of the movie scene was fantastic. Maybe Richard Harris’ Dumbledore would have worked well being closer to the book with more dialogue, but Gambon’s version was brooding, a show of force was the right move for him
Never read the books, and I find Dumbledore far from useless. Maybe I'm an outlier, because I do love hearing about the books, just never cared to sit down and read that much. I fully subscribe to the idea/fact that Harry nearly completely ruined Dumbledore's plans several times over by being a dumb kid and nearly getting himself killed every book. Without Dumbledore, Harry would have probably died a pointless death or if he did manage to survive, simply spend his days in hiding as Voldemort took over the world.
I actually like Dumbledore carrying himself like he's not worried about dueling Voldemort. Through the whole series, you feel like although Harry is in danger, as long as Dumbledore is around, he'll probably be OK. Which makes his eventual death that much more impactful, no more safety net.
Because dumbledore is too strong and experienced for riddle to be able to in his prime dumbledore would have wiped the floor with him, quite literally giving the floor a nice shine afterwards
This WAS prime Dumbledore Magic doesn't get weaker with age, powerful wizards are usually depicted with white long beards He isnt wiping anything, Voldemort was stronger than Grindelwald canonically and he was relatively on par with Albus Stop hyping Dumbledore
Bro, you are so delusional. Voldemort is highly skilled duelist and wizard. He went so far that Dumbledore had to ask Snape in regards of dark magic. If you read the book you would know that Dumbledore survived only thanks to the phoenix. Voldy dueled 3 Hogwartz professors (one of them McGonagal) together and they couldn't stop him.
Dumbledore didnt want to kill Voldemort because the Horcruxes would have prevented it anyways. So his plan obviously was to either delay Voldemort until he would get encircled by the Aurors, or to actively incapacitate him himself to then capture him and make Voldi feel what true horror actually is.
I'm not sure he needed Fawkes. I think that maybe Dumbledore bought Fawkes on purpose either way (how would the bird have got their in time) and that was the easiest way for Dumbledore to block the attack in that moment. Just a personal interpretation but it seems to me that Dumbledore let Fawkes take the hit and just let it happen. Considering the ease with which he blocked all the other killing curses, I think that he probably could have managed either way. Guess we'll never know!
In the same book Fawkes was used by dumbledore as a portkey when he was escaping from the officials trying to send him to prison, so I can only assume he bought Fawkes along incase he had to make a hasty escape.
My guess is that he used fawks to show Tom that Death isn't the end of all beeing and nothing that he be feared about, a Phoenix is the perfect example in this place
@@woodstock7799 ok yeah, we are on 2022 an everyone can do what he want and even a pet doesn't has to serve his master, I mean the basilisk was just snaking around (pun intended) and wanted to make eye contact do build up relationships with humans and he was just a very sad snake
I think the fight from the book would have worked on screen. There’s more going on and it would be more visually interesting and maybe forestall the endless dull stalemate duels of the later films. There are snakes, transfiguration of the fountain, fire, shields, Fawkes and more. You also miss Dumbledore arriving in the death chamber “framed in the doorway from the brain room” which I’m almost glad is still how I originally imagined it in my head. The immensely scary, powerful, silently furious Dumbledore that is “the only one he ever feared” of the books is never really shown. Film Dumbledore is weaker and less agile. The rest of the department of mysteries would have also been amazing to see on screen, but I’m also kind of glad that that’s still exactly as I originally imagined it. Brains attacking Ron, the spinning room, the bell jar of time, the room that can’t be opened that contains a force (love) that melts Harry’s knife given to him by Sirius. Sirius laughing at belatrix, Lupin explaining to Harry that sirius is dead (not clearly hit by Avada kedavera in book, it’s just Belatrix’s “spell”). It’s a lot of great action that would have been a suspenseful (though in need of adaptation of course) ending. This is a shame because otherwise I like the film. I like the book too, I know some don’t, but it is very long and there is some that should probably have been lost. I would probably have cut grawp rather than the department of mysteries. Cutting quidditch was a good choice, having Dan Radcliffe assault Tom Felton would have been weird. Hagrid’s mission to the giants is lovely in the book, but you can’t really do story time in a film, but it would be nice to do it somehow (much shorter), would explain where the giants in no. 7ii come from. Generally this combines two of the biggest unfortunate parts about the films; that the climax of no. 5 is rushed, and that Gambon’s Dumbledore is terrible. Stephen Fry’s audiobook Dumbledore is the one for me.
I like the first two movies Dumbledore. But I think he seemed genuinely old as if he wouldn't have been able to do scenes like the one in order of the phoenix
@solesurvivor1142 anyone who claims Richard Harris's Dumbledore looked "genuinely old" and weak has no idea about acting or cinema and dont deserve to call themself knowledgeable, unless if they r a child. Gambon's Dumbledore, HE looked like an old man and not in the slightest does he pass as the Dumbledore from the HP franchise, the powerful leader and figure of significance that has been pulling the strings all along
That's the thing. People who fear death above all rarely can test themselves to the max if they can't point it all on the line. Dumbledore isn't afraid to die. Not afraid to sacrifice himself if it'll give him the ultimate victory in the end.
I think Fawkes was written in because of Tom's fear of death and his loneliness Fawkes died and was reborn. He also took a bullet willingly. Self sacrifice and martyrdom create immortality. Who would do that for Voldemort? Without being forced? He's still trying to help Voldemort. To teach him, and ultimately save him. Edit: by recognizing his mistake and having remorse Dumbledore has the elder wand, that's a special circumstance so it can make sense to deflect killing cutse
Keep in mind that Rowling didn't write the film's script and also didn't reveal the secrets of the later books to Knowles or anyone else. Thus the scriptwriter didn't know of the Elderwand subplot and the true extent of Dumbledore's power. Additionally Albus knew from the prophecy that it was not in his remit to defeat Voldemort.
Let's be real here, there is no elder wand subplot before the 7th book. At no point in any of the previous books is attention drawn to Dumbledore's wand, nor any other wand (substantively) other than Harry's and Voldemort's. She came up with the Hallows for the 7th books and has retconned their relevance on Pottermroe and twitter. That Harry's cloak is notably better than others, qnd that Dumbledore had it (possibly to study, though that may have been revealed in the last book too) is as close as she come to bringing up the Hallows.
I dont buy the prophecy plot device. Lets be real, If voldy was the mustache man who started ww2, and you had the ability to kill him, would you not do it because of some riddle of a prophecy that said you weren't the chosen one?
@@falseprophet1024 Dumbledore needed Voldemort alive to kill Harry AFTER the destruction of the other Horcruxes. He himself started looking for them, but after the ring's curse, he needed to teach Harry what was needed, because he would certainly die before. As Snape says while confronting him. He raised Harry to be slain in the proper time. He didn't know for certain if Harry would be back alive, but he did know that Voldemort should've been the one to kill him. Also, Dumbledore even says that who made the profecy true was Voldemort himself, when tried to kill Harry that night. But as the profecy was stablished, then Voldemort would be defeated by Harry, and any try to do it in any other way could have potentially gone wrong or have had unexpected consequences.
@@falseprophet1024 Also, killing Hitler would not certainly stop nazism. He was an idea, so the right way of doing it was to supress him to show that, no matter how big is your army, no matter how confident you are, we will win and you will be ashamed. The suicide was the best way of disbanding the army trust in its leader, and the best way of showing the world that not only he was weak, but also that the ones opposing him were not merciless. What I'm trying to say is that not everything gets resolved by simple killing or by targeting the main problem. In many cases, what makes the main problem big is exacty what lingers after such simple solutions. And if there are forces around wanting to support a model like that, then to disrupt that will is the most important thing to avoid the history to repeat itself.
@@GabrielPassarelliG Meh, thats a weak reason. Dumbeldore let hundred of innocent people be killed by voldy so he could potentially save Harry? In regards to the mustache man, you have a point, but it doesnt really apply here. You had 10 years with no voldy and nobody picked up the mantle. There was no Himler or Goerbels to step in for voldy..
Despite old age, Dumbledore, in both versions, that he truly is a great wizard. The case was the same in both versions, to keep Harry protected and Voldemort busy long enough for the aurors to arrive that Voldemort had in fact returned and thus prove to everybody what he and Harry had been saying of them the past year. I like how in the aftermath Dumbledore starts giving orders to the Minister of Magic himself to correct everything that been happening to Harry and the school since the start of the year.
I think the best notion is to not think of the elder wand as a be-all-end-all…it is powerful yes but it is also a placebo. If you think you are the most powerful with the wand then it shows that you could be. But dumbledore was the most powerful so why would it make a difference…”the wand chooses the wizard” doesn’t mean it can’t go another way…damn that was a rant that I hope makes sense
well in the book it is explained that The Elder Wand would switch allegiance if the more powerful wizard came along . So either Elder Wand behaved as a regular wand(with no boost of power ) if it sensed that Voldemort might be more powerful or it didnt sense that Voldemort was more powerful . Either way Voldemort couldnt beat Dumbledore . It has been said about Grindelwald and Dumbledore duel that The Elder Wand suppressed its power because it felt that Dumbledore might have been stronger and it wanted to see who was actually a more powerful wizard and who would win on pure merit , without the aid of extra power of The Elder Wand .
Adds another dimension to the dialogue about death, Tom's weakness, the fear of death, allies from fear and respect of power rather than love and respect of character. I think it for-shadows (or explains before they are introduced into the story) the horcruxes as a weakness (albeit also dark lord major strength) and that after death scene of that pitiful, weak, remnant thing that was Tom / Voldemort. I confess I speculate that J K Rowling took on board ideas of J R R Tolkien and C S Lewis about "True Myth" and the appeal to us of myths that contain elements similar to the story of Jesus Christ when planning and writing the overall story.
Dumbledore defeated an Elder wand wielding Grindelwald. Grindelwald who on his own without the wand was very powerful. If he could do that, Voldemort is nothing to him.
That argument can be turned around. Dumbledore.. who defeated Grindelwald and now Dumbledore has the elder wand couldn't defeat Voldemort. Lol however Dumbledore was older when he fought Voldemort and not in his prime. I think Dumbledore was the most powerful but I think Voldemort was more powerful than Grindelwald
Well Voldemort had horcruxes when he ran into Harry as a baby didn't he? Yes presumably he would come back quicker than he did before but it would be easier to hunt horcruxes when Voldemort was weakened. Don't forget the people that helped restore Voldemort were scared of him, many followers didn't try to bring him back, and not many knew of the horcruxes
Loving all the new videos. I do believe however that the true reason Dumbeldore did not show any fear of death when facing Lord Voldemort in the atrium of the ministry was the fact that he had mastered his acceptance of it. Like a samurai "the way of the warrior" knowing he had done his duty in protecting Harry & understanding that his life was merely a pawn in service of the greater good he faced his fate willingly. As you know; 'To the well-organized mind, death is but the next great adventure.'
While I get why they wanted to show Dumbledore as weaker than in the books, they might have missed an opportunity with this one. If anyone knows the anime OnePunch man it perfectly utilizes this sort of narrative setup. The main hero of that story is all powerful, being able to defeat anyone with 1 punch. Yet the stakes in that story are still great, because that is certainly not the case for all of the other heroes. I think if they showed how powerful Dumbledore actually is at the end of the 5th movie, they could have setup even better how big of a deal it is that he dies by the end of the 6th movie and that he is significantly weakened throughout Half blood prince. Dumbledore was the one person Voldemort feared. Despite what he might want you to believe, he did fear him up until the very end.
The Phoenix always strikes me as an extension of Dumbledore himself, as the two seem to be inextricably tied together. I see Fawkes and Dumbledore and two parts of the same being.
It is a picture of the trinity. Dumbledore in Kings Cross Limbo is the father. The flesh and bone version, that accepts his mortality and acts among men, and chooses to die is the son. The Phoenix is the spirit. After the death of his flesh, the spirit is still with them. It is in the world afterwards, but not in the office. It is out amongst them. I think you can say it is the same.
I always saw it that way too. Never really occurred to me that AD didn’t know fawkes would step in. Ideally it wouldn’t have been needed, but I didn’t really see it like fawkes saving him. More like a chess piece AD knew was there the whole time just in case.
@@falseprophet1024 not literally though. JKR even said dumbledore would never make a horcrux. Of course the movies are mutilating the cannon so we may discover Voldemort was actually grindelwald’s clone spliced with snake genes
The film's way of Dumbledore defending against the Killing Curse works for me, honestly. It's said to be un-blockable, but in Book 7, even when Voldemort isn't using his own Wand, thus removing the special circumstance, Harry's Wand was still able to repel it. So it stands to reason that ramming another Spell into it could "fight" or redirect it. Maybe in the film, Dumbledore is using Expeliarmus or Stupefy (both described as having the color of their energy being red) to "fight" it. I know, the simple explanation is that the CGI department was just reusing the Priori Incantaum effect from Book 4, but as an in-film-universe explanation, it works. Great video, though! Reminds me that I have to go back through these books and films myself again to relive the fun of them!
So apparently, Harry's fame as to the only person ever to have survived the killing curse was completely unfounded. Or maybe ppl in Britain never got to fully know wht happened in Bhutan
I agree with your point about the movie being confusing with Dumbeldore being able to block the killing curse with his magic. Maybe they decided to add to movie canon that Dumbeldore found a way to block it with the Elder Wand?
I hope we see Dumbledore go all out in the next fantastic beasts movies, or at least in his final duel with Grindelwald. Because we have never seen him at full power, and if they do make the first wizarding War movies I hope we see Dumbledore in action while using the elder wand.
I think it would make sense for dumbledore to have heroic entrance where he demolishes Voldemort completely, as I believe in 3rd movie it was stated by Ron that Hogwart is safe because Dumbledore is there. Then after Dumbledore's death it would make much more sense that everything became so grimm that Hogwart got overtaken completely.
Yes! Can't wait for your take 💜 Dumbledore was always the one Voldemort was scared of ... I have always wondered why the horicrux didn't react to Voldemort possessing Harry
Being calm is just a mind game - A way to unnerve and amplify Voldemort's insecurity towards Dumbledore as he has always operated under the shadow of Dumbledore's reputation. Dumbledore knows Voldemort is more Powerful than he is but Voldemort doesn't and it is imperative that he keeps it that way as it's the only thing keeping him from launching a full on frontal assault.
I've always preferred the movies version of the bravery quote, honestly. "It takes a great deal of courage to stand up to your enemies, but a great deal more to stand up to your friends."
Honestly, i feel that, with every year that has been passing. More and more plot holes are in the HP magic. Though when i think about how Dumbledore could have blocked the AK curse within the "special" circumstances. Might be because Dumbledore had the Elder Wand. I do think that the fact that the AK curse is described in HP as unstoppable, isn't really that great to be honest. I mean there is magic in this world. Surely after all this time, someone would've found or studied the curse to find a spell, or some kind of shield that comes out of the wand (like the special silver shield from Voldemort) to block/stop it. I just can't believe that Dumbledore wouldn't know this kind of defense. For more than one reason. He actually experienced a bit off both sides. Dark and light. Further more, i do agree. I would've actually liked seeing Dumbledore just taking on Voldemort very calmly, speak to him as a "normal" human. It would make Voldemort make more human which is what the producers wanted. (That's the reason they didn't give him red eyes.) To humanize him more which would make him more scary. At least, that's what i remember from the interview! Anyway, both wizards are very powerful and interesting in their own way!
Video idea for you to do: What additional effects do spells have that are not seen in the movies? For instance, what else can the patronus charm do besides ward off dementors?
The book portrayed this scene so much better. I remember asking myself why doesn't Dumbledore just kill him and it wasn't until the end I found out why. I also liked the book better when it came to Half Blood Prince when Dumbledore had to cast a spell on Harry to keep him from intervening on his death because he knew Harry would try and save him.
Dumbledore knew only Harry could kill Voldemort, he was just playing defense trying to get to hold Tom off long enough for the aurors to arrive and see him.
I always said there's certain parts of the book that should of most definitely be in the movies, like the duel between Harry & Voldemort ... The book was soooo much better than what the movie showed
In the books it clearly defines Voldemorts fear for Dumbledore as well as Dumbledores pitty for Tom not being able to love. I think Fawks dying for Dumbledore it a very important part because it represents the theme that love will triumph over fear and hate
I felt that Dumbledore's confidence was warranted, I don't feel Dumbledore didn't see Voldemort as a threat up until he had vanished. He knew Harry was his target then and feared for him. I know some people see Fawkes saving him as he would have lost if......But Dumbledore knew he had his Phoenix to protect him and knew head to head Voldemort wasn't a match for him. Also, this scene in the book made it that much more shocking and hurtful for me when Dumbledore died because at that moment Harry's last defense against Voldemort was gone, the most powerful Wizard to have ever lived in the century was gone. It also made the last fight scene in the book for me that much more exciting cause I felt Harry was just as confident as Dumbledore was in this fight.
That entire book was the best of the series. When the teenagers+OthP are losing to the death eaters, Dumbledore shows up with a white and furious face, giving Harry an electrical surge of hope. After dealing with all the death eaters (except Bellatrix who managed to kill off Sirious before fleeing from Dumbledore) he walks into the Voldemort duel with no cares of fears. Absolute legend.
I was always unhappy that they admitted the dialogue as I felt it was the dialogue that was the true battle far more than the magic being thrown at each other
Wow. this entire video is so well made. The editing, the book dialogues. The music. Made me revive the battle in an entire new experience combining the book and the film! So amazing! 🙌🔥
I think they should have gone more like the books in anime i love seeing the protagonist overpowering an enemy showing of and maybe humiliating his enemy
I always believed that Dumbledore had a certain connection with Fawkes, so he knew Fawkes was there to save him from the killing curse. Otherwise he would’ve either apparated somewhere else or conjure another statue (or object) to shield him. There’s no way Dumbledore would leave that up to chance, as it wouldn’t fit with his behavior during that duel. He was the greatest wizard of his time for a very good reason. I also don’t believe that the Elder wand made a big difference during the duel. Sure, it gave Dumbledore’s power a little boost, but with his exceptional skill and abilities he didn’t need that to duel Voldemort to a stalemate.
Naw Fawkes showing up was all apart of Dumbledore's strategy. He clearly brought the phoenix with him as another line of defense. This shows his preparedness and brilliant strategic mind. Dumbledore was in control the whole time. I doubt that even if voldemort had the elder wand he would have won. Part of how strong Dumbledore is isn't just with how powerful he is with magic, it's also how well he understands it and how his mind works. After all he did already beat someone who had the elder wand who was on his level.
This is something that hurts a littel... with something like magic, creatvitiy and strategie should be abel to bet raw power but its only about "Power". Still like the story but its kinda lame
@@woodstock7799 I mean dumbledore and voldemort have both. From dumbledore using the statues to voldemort turning fire into a snake. And them both being so insanely powerful.
I don't think Fawkes' act of taking the Avada Kedavra suggests that Dumbledore lost. Fawkes is in a sense an extension of Dumbledore, or perhaps it would be closer to accurate to say that there's a symbiotic relationship since I believe Fawkes has agency of his own - his own will. He didn't just happen to come to the rescue - he was part of why Dumbledore could be confident - a tool in his toolbox Riddle wouldn't expect. - and yet even more than a tool - more even than an ally. Fawkes is intimately connected to Dumbledore. He comes to Harry when Harry shows loyalty to Dumbledore. He alerts Dumbledore that Umbridge is coming the night Arthur Weasley is attacked and he whisks Dumbledore away when Fudge wants to arrest him. but most importantly, none of these things happen as a result of pre-planning. Fawkes just knows what is needed in the moment and acts, and he leaves when Dumbledore dies. In OotP, Fawkes was a part of how Dumbledore won in the Ministry.
Something to consider is that just because Dumblefore appeared fully confident and relaxed, that doesn’t necessarily mean he was. It’s entirely possible he was having to really exert himself, but was maintaining a facade of easy confidence in order to intimidate Voldemort. What’s scarier, fighting a guy who’s having to give his all to match you, or one who’s making it look like he’s not even trying? The fact that Fawkes had to step in makes me think Dumbledore wasn’t as firmly in control of the fight as he wanted Voldemort to believe.
The scene could have worked nicely as discribed at the book. But I like the possession thing. And really thinks that, if they made it right like in the book, and added that, it would've been perfect. You know, there are lots of ways to create tension and show that Dumbledor, even though not fearing him, was actually resonating power and concentration, and that Voldemort was worried but also angry and confident. Also, the scene would have an arc of "we know Voldy is done!" to "oh no, Dumb cannot die!" And all the statues thing and specially Fawkes would have been like jump scares, surprises that kept the audience in its toes. I think they didn't know how to film it, so they changed it. One of the most expected scenes, and that repeats itself when Harry defeats Voldemort, and they simply didn't do both.
Dumbledore had one hand tied behind his back due to the fact that he (Dumbledore) was never trying to really kill Voldemort, thusly not giving Tom everything in the book to help him win. It felt as if Dumbledore knew he couldn't be the one to kill Voldemort and was simply stalling until the aurors showed up! Also, Dumbledore was distracted heavily by protecting Harry knowing Harry was the one that had to kill Voldemort in the end. It's not revealed that Dumbledore knew this at the time, but if you remember, he was searching for Horcrux's long before him and Harry learned from Slughorn's memory in the pensive!
The movie has a shocking lack of transfiguration magic, especially considering it is considered the most dangerous and powerful branch of magic. Regarding the double attack from the snake and killing curse, I agree with u that it had cornered Dumbledore slightly. But we had seen earlier that he could use apparition there. So it wasn't that hard to just get out of the way. He probably used Fawkes interference as an opportunity to shift into the counterattack. After all, just like voldy uses snakes, Dumbledore can use his pet too considering he is immortal.
When the Harry potter movies where made, 3D modelling was still very time consuming and expensive. That's why they opted for flashy acting and light effects rather than 3D modeling statues and creatures. It's the same reason they tried to reduce the amount of magical creatures and the screen time they gave them. Events in the 4th and 5th book Vs movie where especially where effected by this.
My problem with the film’s Dumbledore is that you can clearly tell that the actor did not read the books and did not really understand the character. That can clearly be seen during the scene when the divination teacher gets fired. Instead of remaining calm, he gets angry. After the first two movies, they started straying further and further away from the source material.
Totally. Dumbledore is supposed to be polite, cool and collected. The actor was too mean and angry throughout the movie series. Dumbledore would never grab Harry by the collar and scream, " DID YOU PUT YOUR NAME IN THE GOBLET OF FIRE?!" Like... You know he didn't Albus.
You need to remember it’s not just the actors job to portray the character correctly, if anything it’s MORE the directors role to ensure the actors represent them all properly. Gambon likely did as he was told, and they probably felt him being more dramatic made for more exciting cinema to watch.
I COMPLETELY disagree that it wouldn't have been an absolute cinematic MARVEL to see the old man champion grandmaster all timer Dumbledore himself absolutely dominate this fight. Make the fight twice as long to shove those nails into the coffin. It would've made the audience put some deserved respect on the best ever and also the elder wand itself. Admit it, they just didn't have the budget. I love seeing credits where credits are due, and also just straight up OP characters like for example; Saitama.
Although during the fight, it may seem as though Voldemort and Dumbledore were evenly matched, I still do think Dumbledore was far more powerful. Voldemort was using Avada Kadavra and a lot of other dark spells. Dumbledore was able to counter all of this and stay on even ground without dark spells. Dumbledore didn't want to kill Voldemort because he knew the job must be left to Harry, so he only fought to defend Harry and himself, and get Voldemort to leave.
"Onesided battles are no fun" Speak for yourself! I loved it when in fantastic beasts, Dumbledore completely dominated Credence. (Or whatever his real name is.)
Just because he may have needed Fawkes doesn't mean he was the "loser" though. He used the statues to block the other killing curses and that didn't make him the loser, right? Whether he can communicate with Fawkes and he asked the bird to do it, or the bird did it on his own, it doesn't matter. He's a phoenix so it doesn't truly kill him, just like it didn't kill a statue that wasn't really alive to begin with. Seems like a rather silly conclusion to me. 🤷🏻♂️
@@headstrongbachelor3152 Your acting like there are only 2 sides of Dumbledore. There are the right and left sides where he could have escaped from. Even when he came back to full strength he still couldn't kill a 150 year old man, even with all that dark art knowledge
@@headstrongbachelor3152 Your speaking about almost. When even Voldemort acknowledged that Dumbledore was not trying to kill him, and he still couldn’t kill the man who wasn’t fighting to kill. You are going of almost and it nearly happened. Dumbledore almost drowned Voldemort, had he not ran off. It clear to me you have read the book, but your interpretation skills are non existent.
I read a bit a dialogue in a fanfic once about Harry describing this duel to sirius(Sirius survived in this fic), and Sirius barks in laughter before, “That’s what you get when two show offs duel. They make a spectacle of the whole thing”
You mention at 8:08 that Dumbledore doesn't use a "Fiery Whip" but at the beginning of their duel, Dumbledore's first move is him whipping his want around his head before he casts and it even makes a "Whip" noise.
Avada Kedavra may be unblockable, but let’s not forget that Dumbledore is using the Elder Wand, which is said to be unbeatable in a duel, when you’re it’s master. It’s basically an unstoppable force meeting an immovable object. So it kinda makes sense for Dumbledore to block it in the movie
Except that the Elder wand doesn't work. It has lost many duels. It's more likely that it just has the ability to detect magical prowess, presenting itself to the strongest wizard.
The mistake started in the 4th movie. (Impostor) Moody very explicitly said avada kedavra is unblockable in the book. The movie also made the priori incantatem effect seem like the most unusual part of Harry and Tom’s wands’ interaction, rather than Harry being able to block the killing curse.
What he meant is that there's no counter curse, no protection charm that can nullify it like Protego the shield charm ECT. But a physical barrier makes the spell miss basically Even Physical barriers that take the hit are blasted to dust but do "block" the spell in a roundabout way. But anything the spell hits is destroyed
I have a theory that Dumbledore was the only individual that took time to process, comprehend, and empathize with Voldemort’s fate. In that, the Professor understood enough about the Ancient Magic (love) that a young Tom Riddle would never understand love because of how he came to be conceived. Dumbledore, despite loathing the adult and monster that Tom eventually became, always sees the young, ill-fated boy and comes to see he still cares for him (Tom). This is perhaps why Dumbledore always tells Tom Riddle that it is something he (Tom) would never understand. So while it may appear that they are equally matched in this duel, consider that: - Voldemort is dueling to kill and Dumbledore is dueling to protect Harry - Despite possessing the Elder Wand, Dumbledore shows restraint not willing to cross the line - The line being that because Dumbledore does truly care about Tom Riddle, killing Tom would tear/split Dumbledore’s soul. And that was not a line he was willing to cross.
I don’t think you can say that Dumbledore would have lost without Fawkes because without Fawkes, he wouldn’t be Dumbledore. This was used to illustrate the fact that they were people ready to die for Dumbledore, people who truly cared about him which is something Voldemort would always be without. Fawkes sacrificing himself for Dumbledore isn’t a sign of Dumbledore‘s weakness but of a strength Dumbledore and others have that Voldemort never will
The point of Faux taking the blast is something Dumbledore constantly repeats in the books, love is the most powerful magic there is. Faux loves Dumbledore, and without that connection, there are probably countless times Dumbledore would not have survived. This is not a weakness on Dumbledore's part, it is a sign of his immense strength.
I love these stupid backpedalling arguments you all make to satisfy yourself that albus is better. No man. I could also use a meat shield to protect me. If this was a fair duel then albus would have lost. Voldy was fighting 2 technically. This is not fair. I don't care about the argument. If dumbledore really can kill voldemort why doesn't he return him to his previous non existence ? Who will care about the ministry anymore?
Why do people always think that high age is equal to being out of prime? I’m pretty sure that’s not how the wizarding world works. Experience and knowledge is clearly more important than having slightly faster reflexes. The physical condition doesn’t matter too much as long as you can move around and swing your wand. I’m pretty sure Dumbledore is actually in his prime here, he only got weakened from the event in the half blood prince. That being said, you can well argue that Dumbledore only dominated the duel and stood his ground because he had the elder wand.
Not really. The fact that the Elder Wand served him, and didnt abandon him for Voldy, demonstrates he was the more powerful (or worthy) master. Im pretty sure thats how the elder wand worked.
@@falseprophet1024 that makes no sense. The wand does not shift allegience in the middle of the duel, you have to beat or disarm the owner first. Harry vs Voldemort was special because the wand already belonged to Harry before the duel even started
@@paulgraf5746 Its impossible to defeat the master of the elder wand, according to the hallows.. and yet, people have lost while using it.. seems strange, right? And, of course, the Elder wand isnt the most loyal, changing its allegiance to the most powerful wizard in a group.. It seems like a loophole in the gift from death. The master of the wand will never lose, but the wand may switch allegiance to the wizard you are fighting, causing you to lose. But since the person that defeated you was the new master of the wand, the master of the wand is still undefeated..
This is why Fantastic Beasts is so awesome right now. The way Dumbledore duels in the recent series in incredibly like Dumbledore would in the books. The duel in the Order of The Phoenix movie really disappointed me.
Dumbledore referring to Voldemort as "Tom" seems like the ultimate sign of disrespect or simply his way of showing that he still sees him as that young boy from the orphanage and therefore not much of a threat. No matter how strong or powerful Voldemort may become, Dumbledore will always have Tom's number
I think it's more because of familiarity, despite being adversaries.
He was his teacher after all. Imagine for example musician, who uses stage name meeting his primary school teacher. I wouldn't imagine that teacher would call them by that name, rather use their real name, even if whole world know them under this name.
After all, lord voldemort was a made up name.
Calling Voldemort TOM pointed out YOU AFE NOT EXTRAORDINARY, rather common, mortal.
Well Voldemort thought of himself as a god like being and dumbledor calling him Tom on purpose is to remind him that no matter what he’s still just human
Seen this comment on about 4 different videos of this nature
It's Dumbledore's way of not allowing Voldemort to control the situation
Insane that Dumbledore owned Voldemort, trapped Bellatrix, protected Harry and sent word to Fudge all at the same time. You may not like him but you can’t deny, Dumbledore’s got style.
Did you not read or hear? Are you OK? He literally was saved by tons of third parties. Are you mad? He only trapped bellatrix instead of duelling cuz she blocked his spells prior to this. He literally didn't want to duel her ( not to waste time although only 2 minutes and bella is defeated) and got a bird to save his old ... whatever.
@@jihanessa4132 oh boy, his joke flew past waaaaaay over your tiny head
@@axolyn4504 doesn't seem like a joke and a lot of people are saying the same "joke" and basing arguments over it. So please elaborate more.
@@jihanessa4132 the thing is he wasn't actually being serious with his comment about Dumbledore, he's powerfull but nobody can handle all that, hence the exaggeration. Also, another "hint" is in the quote "you may not like him but you can’t deny, Dumbledore’s got style.", which is what Shacklebolt says to Fudge when Dumbledore escapes going to Azkaban "with style" earlier in the story.
Sorry for coming across a bit rude, it just looked kinda obvious to me that his comment was not supposed to be taken so seriousy.
@@axolyn4504 K man but I didn't remember/recall kingsley saying that at the moment I wrote the comment so OK sorry I take that back. Of course we don't deny his power.
i feel like the only time we see dumbledore's real power is when he destroys the inferi army with one spell, whilst literally dying and driven half crazy by the evil potion. i think he was always holding back, maybe because last time he went all out his sister was killed.
I absolutely agree with you!
And even that is not full power given his weakened state. If voldemort is scared of you, your powerful beyond comprehension
I tho always like that but its looks more like Elder Wand's forshadowin.
@@oguzelinc2048 elderwand tho enhances your power but isn't the sole power itself. Moreover by going through books, we see elderwand is rather overrated. It only enhances your magical abilities upto some extent. You can be disarmed nd you lose it's ownership at the exact same moment.
For that we can have two conclusions.
1. JK Rowling failed to draw a proper character ketch of the elderwand.
2. Elderwand was a deathly hallows nd that's why it's overrated. A wizards power and magical abilities play the most important role rather than the elderwand. As we know the elderwand changed it's allegence time to time and from one weilder to the other. That didn't particularly had to do something with the power of the weilder but if in anyway their opponent is able to disarm the weilder, he/she'd be the new owner of the wand. It can be done either in face to face confrontations or by cleverly disarming the weilder.
One more interesting fact we know about wands is that they're used to channelise the power of their weilder more precisely. The elderwand being the lord of wands would do the exact same thing with the best accuracy.
Dumbledore was the most powerful wizard of his time from the very beginning. By no means he'd be dependent on the elder wand for everything. He was powerful, had surpassed every single wizard or witch he came accross nd was even the supreme mugwomp at a point of time.
Even his his weak and fragile state, he was able to channelise thehis energy to perform some of the most powerful spells. Saying that it was just because of the elderwand highly diminishes his importance as a character and his feats of strength.
He was wisest among all. He knew when nd where to use his immense power nd upto what extent.
In reality as well as in fiction, there are some characters far more powerful than protagonist and the villian but there's always some sort of situation in which they can't straight away kill the villian. In the 5th book as well we can see that Dumbledore never tried to kill voldemort. He could've defeated him but he chose to protect Harry. Knowing that voldemort can't be killed nd even if he was defeated, soon he'd be back. Moreover, in order to kill voldemort, one hadda destroy the hocruxes. Dumbledore only feared one thing. It wasn't his death nor voldemort. But he feared what would happen to the wizarding world after him. Not untill he knew the exact number of hocruxes voldy had, he chose not to put himself in a situation where he's vulnerable to death. Nd even after that, he chose to die on his will and according to his plan.
I honestly don’t find the fire in the cave overly impressive for him. It’s literally just a massive ring of magical fire, which of course looks incredible, but Dumbledore was capable of much more powerful magic than something as simple as that in my opinion!
"It was foolish of you to come here tonight, Tom" so badass
Dumbledore was just buying time.
His intentions were to make the minister and the others see by themselves that Voldemort was back
To achieve that, he needed to buy lots of time.
He was not worried about losing, he is way more powerful than Tom, but he was worried in buying enough time.
he was also keeping harry safe
FACTS
If he was that much more powerful then why didn't he just finish off voldemort there and then? Turning him back into his spirit form would have made it much easier to go around destroying the other horcruxes.
@@Kewickviper simply because one of the horcruxes was Harry.
I guess I’d say I’m in between. I think Dumbledore was more powerful at this point on paper, but Voldemort was more brutal and willing to kill. Dumbledore was holding back just enough to buy time and keep his intentions to not outright kill Voldemort.
The person who chose to have absolutely no music in this scene was a hero. one of the greatest scenes in movie history, certainly the best duel in the original series of 8 HP movies. Although I think Dumbeldore vs Creedance is a favourite of mine due to the advancements of movie technique and visuals.
The scene would have been much better if they followed the book.
@@stianaandal1488 agree and disagree? I wish we saw Dumbledore teleporting around to dodge spells but i also like the display of both users skills, Voldemort with mastery over destruction, casting large scale attacks without wand movements nor words, and Dumbledore using mastery of alteration to counter all these large scale attacks with minimal effort (using a despell on the fire snake and pushing the flames back, using the water from a fountain to trap Voldemort, turning the shards of glass into sand) it was a great display of their strengths
It was pretty damn cool
Totally agree. No music was just brilliant
@@stianaandal1488 seriesly. I thought the scene was underwhelming at best. Everything we knew about magic and how duels worked were just thrown out the window. It’s like in anime when every character has to get stronger and stronger till they’re doing things that undermine how the whole series works. Statues coming to life and tackling chasing people down. So unexpected and mysteries. It really showcases dumbledore skills. Dumbledore was a badass and this scene cemented himself into his already Legendary status. The dialog really strung everything together and made each scene more impactful. Idk why they thought it was a good idea to leave out all the dialog that made the scene what it was.
Dumbledore is such an enigma. It seems like he can obliterate the entire Harry Potter universe by himself. He steps in when he needs to but only to the level he needs to.
Because he's a poor mans Gandalf.
Certainly book Dumbledore.
I wonder if the things we see him do take more preparation beforehand than we see.
Like; he expects a duel with Voldemort, so he does a month long preparation, lots of meditation, creating complex preprepared spells he can do during the duel like the push on a button.
Like; just disapparet, apparet and then send 4 inanimate objects on complex tasks like alerting other people through the flu network?
That's something you don't do on the fly but sounds like you could prepare, like a potion.
Another Collins! I too be a Collins sir!
@@FrostDJakki3529 fantastic name, sir! lol
well he is Death
I'd say Dumbledore still won in the movie but it was closer. Also the look on Voldemort's face when Dumbledore arrives is epic. True fear in his eyes.
Dukblefore obviously wasn’t doing it to defeat Voldemort. He was trying to stall time for the Aurors to come and see the truth. Plus he had to protect harry. He was smart and Voldemort fell into his trap
@@donis3722 you got the best comment!! That literally is exactly what happened and I can deduce that not even being fanatically into the series like that even tho i love the harry potter universe in all its forms book movie games etc
Do you know that it was Dumbledore in the book who actually expressed true horror when Voldy possesed Harry? Because he have never seen such dark magic before.
"It's foolish of you to come here tonight, the aurors will be here soon."
"By that time, I shall be gone and you be dead."
"You do not wish to kill me Dumbledore, above such brutality, are you?"
The duel in the book is one of my fav moment of all. Just something about Dumbledore just casually blocking the curses while speaking to tom how death isn't the worst thing that could befall on a man.
Idk, Dumbledore was acting casual in their talk (he was not worried) but it's not like he easily defeated Voldemort. In reality he almost died, he would've been hit by the last Killing Curse without Fawkes' help.
@@thayspamacheno628 It's not like it was an accident that Fawkes was there. Dumbledore brought him for a reason. If Fawkes wasn't there Dumbledore would have summoned something else to protect him or dissapparate, and he was protecting Harry, while restraining Bellatrix all the while casually holding Voldie at bay. A Voldemort mind you that was trying to kill outright.
@@basicallybasic8697 Not really, Dumbledore does not "bring" Fawkes anywhere, Fawkes as a phoenix that is loyal to Dumbledore can find him wherever he is (just like it found Harry in Chamber of Secrets) and sense if he is in danger. These are powers they possess. And Dumbledore did have ways to defend himself as he was shown doing (statues), but everytime one of the statues blocked in the Killing Curse would destroy them, and by that time there were none left, Dumbledore wasn't able to apparate quickly enough and it's been clearly stated multiple times throughout the series that it is impossible to block the Killing Curse with magic (you may only use physical objects). So I can easily say Fawkes actually saved Dumbledore's life at that point and he would have died otherwise, because that's exactly what happened in the scene - for a moment it seems Dumbledore will be hit, then Fawkes swoops in and dies in his place (but since it is a phoenix, it is immediately reborn afterwards). Dumbledore wasn't holding Bellatrix at all, she was hit by one of his spells but it is not like he was actively keeping her in place with his powers, that's not how spells work, they don't need to be "kept" through concentration once they've been cast. That aside, Dumbledore was acting casual when he interact with Voldemort, but he not even once was duelling him in a casual way, they were both exchanging extremely powerful spells, elemental magic and transfiguration are extremely advance forms of magic to use in a duel, just using them already is far from "casual", Dumbledore was >talking< casually to Voldemort, but so was Voldemort when addressing him, even if he was way more aggressive.
Anyway, I'm not saying Dumbledore is not more powerful than Voldemort. He is, and that has been both stated and proven multiple times through the books. He was the most powerful wizard in the world, perhaps in wizarding history. But it is not like Voldemort was SO much weaker than Dumbledore that he could easily defeat him. I'm just pointing out that even if Dumbledore was more powerful than he was, the difference was not that huge and Dumbledore could easily die duelling him if he was not careful, because Voldemort is the only person in the world who can spam the Killing Curse rapidly (even Bellatrix was not able to simply spam it like Voldemort does) and he went deeper in the dark arts than any other dark wizard before him, to the point it has been clearly stated by Dumbledore himself that "Voldemort possessed powers I will never have" (ofc, he won't have them by choice, but it is still an advantage of Voldemort over him, since dark arts have been shown to be much harder to defend against than ordinary magic).
@@thayspamacheno628 But he does apparate when Voldemort sends his first killing curse and appears behind Voldemort.
@@gregnelson9379 They were closer now. Apparating does no happen instantly (think of Dobby at the Malfoy Manor). Dumbledore was defenseless at that moment, he would've died if Fawkes did not sweep in
I simply believe even in power dumbledore was stronger and had no intention to kill voldemort since the horcruxes hadn't all been destroyed yet.
Thank you this was always my thought too
Dumbledore: "Even though the devastating loss, Harry, you must not sacrifice yourself"
Harry: *jumps towards the next Killing Curse*
Dumbledore: *Blows the tip of his two fingers as if extinguishing smoke from gun barrel* thinking "and that's the end of Harry-Horcrux. Touché".
Dumbledore didn't know at this point that voldemort had horcruxes but dumbledore realized all the attacks he gives to voldemort don't harm him at all and that's when dumbledore became sceptical because the dark lord doesn't get any damage and voldemort just keeps coming back for more
He might have been a tiny bit more powerful but that’s because of the elder wand. With equal wands, Voldemort is slightly more powerful, not to mention if Voldemort has the elder wand. Just check how he destroyed the whole shield at the Hogwarts battle in a matter of seconds. Dumbledore wouldn’t be able to produce such a power, even with the elder wand (and it wasn’t even loyal to Voldemort in that scene)
@@paulgraf5746 As much as i like Voldemort and obviously voldemort is the most powerful and dangerous dark wizard of all time but Dumbledore still edge out voldemort with power because dumbledore is the powerful sorcerer in the world and holds the title of Grand Sorcerer. On harry potter and the hall blood prince dumbledore produced a massive fire storm and that was dumbledore at his weakest because of the poison he drank. The correct rankings is
1)Dumbledore
2)Voldemort
3)Grindelwald
And it has been confirmed by jk Rowling herself period
See, Dumbledore always had a plan. Book 4 he was basically elated that voldemort took Harry's blood, therefore keeping Lily's protective charm alive in him. Dumbledore also knew that Harry was a Horcrux. Book 6, he admitted to caring for Harry too much. Dumbledore knew the prophecy, "neither can live while the other survives." His whole plan was to give Harry the best chance at living, even if he had to die (destroy him being horcrux) to get the job done. Dumbledore killing Voldemort's body in book 5 would have taken away Lily's protective spell which would have meant certain death for Harry once he figured out he HAS to die to destroy the horcrux in him.
Tldr: Dumbledore loved Harry and gave him the only way to come out of this alive in the end.
Edit: Dumbledore claps at any other time.
Except Petunia is also able to sustain Harry's charm until his 17th birthday or if he moved out before that this is why Dumbledore made Harry go back to the Dursley's every summer. Because so long as he could call a blood relative of Lily's house home the bond of blood charm would stay active. The movie did a really bad job of explaining this because its also the one thing that shows Petunia in a new light. She had to willingly accept Harry for the charm to work. Even as much as she hated his magic blood she still willingly accepted him to protect him. Or simply put this is how Dumbledore explained it.
"While you can still call home the place where your mother's blood dwells, there you cannot be touched or harmed by Voldemort. He shed her blood, but it lives on in you and her sister. Her blood became your refuge. You need return there only once a year, but as long as you can still call it home, there he cannot hurt you. Your aunt knows this. I explained what I had done in the letter I left, with you, on her doorstep. She knows that allowing you houseroom may well have kept you alive for the past fifteen years."
- Dumbledore explaining how the charm works
@@LavitosExodius I've always seen Petunia as a way to bide Harry time. Yes, you are factually correct, but Dumbledore eventually came to love Harry enough to want him to survive the prophecy. By Dumbledore's reaction at the end of the 4th book, he had already had some concept of that endgame, and that was Riddle taking Harry's blood to resurrect, meaning the charm would live in Voldemort regardless of how old Harry was. Now, the only explanation for this is really left to speculation. Why would the charm continue to work? The only thing I can think of is the specificity Dumbledore used....Petunia, a blood relative, had to accept Harry, versus Voldemort willingly taking Harry's blood. It's obviously not explained in detail, but I'd love to hear more of your perspective.
@@2B_S5 No the charm itself will automatically remove at 17 that has been stated by JK at a conference as far back as 2005 even. Dumbledores charm just made the sacrificial protection last longer but not permanently.
Ani Morison for Sunday Star Times New Zealand - My question is why does Harry keep going back to the Dursleys, when he is closer to the Weasleys than he is to them?
JK Rowling: That has been explained in the books to an extent, it has been explained in the books but possibly you haven't yet finished this book when it is made very clear. Harry receives magical protection from his mother's sacrifice as long as he remains close to her blood. In other words, Aunt Petunia. That protection won't continue to hold once he is a man, once he turns 17 - he is no longer given that protective aura by his mother, so Dumbledore wants him to go back one more time to ensure the protection continues to his 17th birthday and after that he really is on his own.
@@LavitosExodius Then do you know why Dumbledore had that triumphant look in his eyes, briefly, after Harry told him that Voldemort took his blood?? It was always my understanding that this led to Harry having the option to return back to life or not after his horcrux was destroyed
@@2B_S5 See that whole thing is a plot hole though because it stands to reason if Harry can't be killed while Voldemort is alive neither can Voldemort as he also shares the protection now. As Harry was very much still alive. Unless were going to say by destroying his last horcrux Voldemort was already dying. Unless were also going to say well Voldemort killed himself with his own curse. Well then Harry could have just been Imperiused by somebody that wasn't Voldemort to kill himself. Which again invalidates the whole neither can die while the other lives which is what the charm implies. Because if were saying Harry's blood is what makes Voldemort unable to kill Harry well highly unlikely the charm can tell the different between people and just goes by blood then Harry would also be unable to kill Voldemort. Or much more likely JK forgot she had stated that about how the charm worked.
The reason D was so calm and confident is because he looked a lot like Jude Law when he was younger... that level of handsome confidence sticks with you for life.
point
It's strange that you think Fawkes' appearance shows a weakness on Dumbledore's part rather than his using the full range of magic at his disposal, and that the righteousness of his cause makes other magical creatures want to fight with him whereas Voldemort mostly has supporters because he kills all the no men.
Dumbledore in many other instances has plans that involve Fawkes, who typically shows up to do one simple task and then is done for a bit. It's almost like a summoned pet in a video game, who shows up to do a thing or two on a limited timer and then has a somewhat lengthy cooldown before being available again. A Phoenix is, after all, said to be highly intelligent and fiercely loyal. Why anyone would think his presence in a battle would be for something other than as part of the team is curious: why on Earth would a Phoenix befriend and be loyal to a wizard so weak or stupid that he wouldn't be able to make use of a Phoenix's intellect and skills? Who is the only member of the team in the Order named after Fawkes' species who could be hit with a killing curse without dying? Fawkes. Who would Dumbledore fight who uses killing curses?
How useful would it be to have Voldemort mistake a good time to waste his time using a curse that looked as though he'd be able to land it but which was actually meant to be a waste of precious casting time because at no point was Dumbledore actually vulnerable?
Remember, Dumbledore is the most strategic and tactical thinker in the story. He's planned out everything in fine detail including how and when he himself must be killed, how and when Voldemort must be killed, and so on down the line. Do you think he recruited as a pet one that can apparate at will, and whose apparition ability is unaffected by the magic of wizards, all willy-nilly? Or is this just another bit of Dumbledore's ability to plan out when, where and how to engage with Voldemort so that the battle and war both are profitably pursued to the advantage of the good and great?
That's exactly how I saw it as well! If he didn't have fawkes there then it would have been another statue. He would have covered all his openings
The thought was running through my mind the first time he mentioned Fawkes showed a weakness in Dumbledore and I cringed at every time he repeated the statement. Thanks for taking the time to fully flesh out the idea, and adding much more. It was great you mention Dumbledore tactical abilities and the loyalty of such a magnificent creature seeing good in him.
@@m.caeben2578 thanks. Obviously, I thought he was so far wrong that I had to tear apart the bad argument. His view is just preposterous. =^_^=
I fully agree with your explanation.
Plus, honestly, I think it would have been more entertaining if the movie actually followed the book and showed Dumbledore basically dog-walk Tom like he was dealing with a child throwing a tantrum, because it would have driven home to the audience who might not have read the book as to why Tom had made such effort to avoid direct conflict with Dumbledore. That is one of the things that drove me nuts about the movies, was they did not due Dumbledore true justice in just how capable he really is, and the only reason Tom was as successful as he was during the 1st Deatheater war was cause he used misdirection and avoided directly fighting Dumbledore and want after everyone else, cause while he is no mach against Albus, 1 thing is certain, Dumbledore could not be everywhere.
Yeah. It's sad that the movie folks decided not to do justice to Dumbledore and is power... including how he simultaneously and singlehandedly battled all of the death eaters and bested them. They downplayed his magical power and the power of his wand. It's a real pity and a totally lost opportunity to show that Voldemort had excellent reasons for fearing only Dumbledore. In addition to their respective power levels, Voldemort had a further weakness: he was too arrogant to have realized that Dumbledore's magical power wasn't the only thing he had to fear about Dumbledore.
Dumbledore had learned that his knowing and being too proud of being more powerful than everyone and their brother was the one weakness he had that would lead him to ruin. Voldemort couldn't learn that lesson, and that as much as anything else is how Dumbledore worked out how to defeat him once and for all. And Dumbledore recognized that embracing a just and righteous death was itself the key. Voldemort ran from death and in the process ran himself to ruin. The deathly hallows tales told in the story is actually the allegory that appropriately frames the solution to the Voldemort problem and explains the whole of how Harry and crew would defeat Voldemort and crew.
But the moviemakers screwed that beautiful piece of storytelling nineteen ways to Friday.@@darkwulf4862
“You do not seek to kill me, Dumbledore?” called Voldemort, his scarlet eyes narrowed over the top of the shield.
“Above such brutality, are you?” “We both know that there are other ways of destroying a man, Tom,” Dumbledore said calmly, continuing to walk toward Voldemort as though he had not a fear in the world, as though nothing had happened to interrupt his stroll up the hall.
“Merely taking your life would not satisfy me, I admit -” “There is nothing worse than death, Dumbledore!” snarled Voldemort.
“You are quite wrong,” said Dumbledore, still closing in upon Voldemort and speaking as lightly as though they were discussing the matter over drinks. Harry felt scared to see him walking along, undefended, shieldless. He wanted to cry out a warning, but his headless guard kept shunting him backward toward the wall, blocking his every attempt to get out from behind it.
“Indeed, your failure to understand that there are things much worse than death has always been your greatest weakness -”
? yes the video shows that and tells that. no need to repeat it lol
Book Dumbledore gave me the chills in this scene. He is standing in front of the Most powerful Dark Wizard yet whose name brings terror to the entire Wizarding world and yet he's talking to him like he's just another student who needs to be punished.
Presence of Dumbledor in those situation gives relief to me, that Dumbledore is here, no one will harm you!! Even Voldemort,
So, one of D's weaknesses was his pride. He knows he's clever. He knows that he's prideful, and he's learned humility from his resulting mistakes. One of the things worse than death for a very smart person is humiliation. D knows this from experience, and he aims to give it to Tom in this moment. Tom leaves that fight not having beaten Harry or D, AND everyone discovers he's back, blowing his secretive advantage. Tom was humiliated.
Damn dumbledores first retort hit so hard i took splash damage
Also, have to consider that he was fighting while suppressing Bellatrix and protecting harry while trying to stall for the Aurors. Despite his old age, Dumbledore might just be the most powerful wizard of all time.. maybe merlin is his equal.
Merlin and Morgana La Fey would give him a hard time but Dumbledore is the most powerful wizard to ever exist and no one comes close to his power
@@GenichiSojo Nah, modern wizards are far weaker than those of the past. Wizards in the past would fight armies, modern wizards would struggle against a few goblins.
Modern wizards rely too much on wands and lack in both physique and variety, limited to a much smaller variety of spells they consider 'light'.
Wizards of old could single-handedly kill a dragon whereas modern freak out about a mere werewolf.
Wizards of old spent every moment trying to improve before they die, modern spend their time engorging on sweets and gold.
Merlin and Morgana are the most powerful wizard and witch to have ever existed, so they would rival Voldemort easily.
@@ATH-camCommentator Lets be honest, they would kill Voldemort in an instant and Dumbledore and Snape and Molly Weasly would actaully stand a chance.
@@necromancer6405
Was that ever actually established, though?
Could it be like with sports, where we glorify the older guys (Bill Russel, Jerry West, etc), when in reality the new era of players are much better (jordan, lebron, etc)?..
I know the wizards in book had basically mythologized merlin and morganna, wasnt morrigan (the celtic goddess of war) a historical witch, too, as an ancestor to Isolt?
Also, dragons can't be too deadly to wizards since they have highschoolers fight them as part of a competition..
I loved this duel in the books and I think it showed so much of what high level wizard dueling actually could be. The killing curse is directly uncounterable, but it has a travel time and can apparently be intercepted by other objects, which means that the way a master wizard actually kills another master wizard is not by doing something more powerful, but by being creative and unexpected in their spellcasting. If you're powerful enough and know what your opponent is going to do, there's always some spell you can cast that will nullify it (or at the very least let you escape), so to defeat an opponent of a high enough level, you need to do something that takes them longer to figure out a response than they have to cast it.
That's so much more interesting than all the wand-clashes that we got in most fights.
I think it's a huge plot hole in this whole universe. Every death eater would just spam Avada kedavra and there wouldn't even exist such thing as duels
@@Drymarro ,Exactly,they could just kill everything in their way,I guess the movies corrected this from the books to be honest,I sure there are many things JKR would change in the story if she could and this would be one of these things,the best thing in the frachise is a duel wand to wand without all these complicated spell casting,Tom and Dumbledore duel is simple,better and more badass in the movie cause he wasn't asking anything "calmly" 😂
@@shadowagent6051 yes I'd design a better spell and dueling system. but can't take away credit from her creativity. Quidditch is also a stupid game but it is what it is. the duel with Tom and Dumbledore is brilliant in the movies because it highlights the different powers available for high-level wizards. There is a ton of inconsistency in these movies. For example, why didn't more wizards just buy Weasleys' magic tricks to win duels? For example the smoke bomb that Harry buys. They just resort to using their wand. Also, why don't more wizards use petrificus totalem? it seems a rather amazing spell to disable your opponent.
@@Drymarro ,There's also the potions,I sure there are more forbidden potions out there that could give some advantage in spells,the "Petrificus Totalus" is effective to get someone off guard cause otherwise it can be counter with "Finite Incantatem",I think Quidditch is a awesome game but the Bludgers are very unnecessary and dangerous,it should be only the Quaffles and the Golden Snitch.
@@shadowagent6051 I'm more about the side that Quidditch is dumb because the seeker and the 150 points makes everyone else useless! It was to make Harry the star tbh. Also yes, potions are literally almost never explored in the books/movies apart from polyjuice, with some small exceptions. So unfortunate. I think potions are one of my favorite aspects that could be explored deeper.
Fawkes has a special connection to Dumbledore. It is theorized that Dumbledore may even have inadvertently created a horocrux out of Fawkes via his sister.
Either way Fawkes seems to be an extention of Dumbledore, so I think it doesn't disqualify him in any wins.
Rowling's gonna read this and go yeah, I like that, that can be😂
@@PaTrick-cf6evRowling has seen that theory, and was far from impressed by it. In fact she said it upset her that people would even think of Dumbledore would actually think of doing this.
@@lxena8033which just made her more unlikeable since the entire theory was based around him accidentally doing it out of love, thus creating something completely different to a normal Horcrux which is made purposely out of fear.
@@aidenharper6013 : Do you have any idea how a horcrux is actually made?
I agree with all of your comments ...except for Fawkes indicating Dumbledore as the loser. He brought Fawkes with him for such a need, and was ready for the snake...letting Fawkes deal with the curse. The REAL indication of the losing wizard is the moment the duel stops....when Voldemort possesses Harry. He could not use DIRECT means to defeat Dumbledore...so he chose an indirect route...to defeat Harry. And that also failed. So Voldemort lost twice...
And while I think it was not possible for Dumbledore to WIN, he certainly didnt lose.
Dumbledore should have went for the snake. This would have not exposed his knowledge of the Horcruxes.
@@emankcin1701 not sure where that came from. But, i do not think Dumbledore would want to destroy Nagini, Voldemort may have chosen to just make another horcrux.
Yeah a true powerful wizard is smart and PREPARED. Dumbeldor came prepared for the battle that makes him a better wizard already
@@jaysnow701 I don't think he could have, maybe he had no more of his soul to split.
agreed, all is the headmaster plan. Fawkes will always reborn by the way. 😌
I wondered this as well but considering what you find out in book 6 and seven about Voldemort‘s past encounters with Dumbledore. I think the other big factor is that Dumbledore is completely inside Voldemort‘s head. Even as a child, Dumbledore new what riddle was up to in ways that riddle never fully understood, same as an adult. Dumbledore always tends to know who Voldemort is travelling with, and how he tix. So I think the book implies that Dumbledore has this psychological edge over Voldemort because Voldemort is only wary around Dumbledore. And he never fully grasp how Dumbledore actually knows what he knows about the way riddle operates. Dumbledore clearly knows things that Voldemort doesn’t, and Voldemort fundamentally doesn’t know how Dumbledore has this power. That’s my take on it. Voldemort never moved past being the little weirdo kid that got up to no good and Dumbledore always seemed to know what was going on. This makes Dumbledore a complete unknown entity in many ways as far as Voldemort is concerned, which probably makes him behave differently than he would with anybody else. To a lesser extent it even happens with Harry and Voldemort, Voldemort just doesn’t understand why he can’t kill him, so he sends other people to do it for him until he can figure out why. As Dumbledore says to him “the fact that he can’t consider anything worse than death is actually one of Voldemort‘s weaknesses because it makes him blind to lots of other things that may be just as powerful which he completely disregards.
Dude if Grindelwald couldn't kill Dumbledore with that elder wand as we saw in Fantastic beasts 3, I bet Voldemort couldn't stand any chance, he would be 10 times down than Grindelwald, he didn't even use elder wand and his dark skills wouldn't beat Dumbledore like legit❗☝️, Dumbledore is too talented, and have lots of experiences.
Voldemort wouldn’t have stood a chance against the middle aged version of Dumbledore
Yep, even in old age, dumbledore would have walked over voldi
Dumbledore is more than 150years old , voldi is barely 60
Its like when frieza had a new body and rushed to fight goku
@@RandomMusingsOfLowMelanin Dumbledore was 115 or 116 at the time of his death.
@@RandomMusingsOfLowMelanin dumbledore was born in the late 1800 between 1885 and 1895.
Dumbledore's such a badass in this scene in the book. The movie kind of ruined it. The dialogue also reinforces (it's even the chapter title) why Dumbledore is the only one Voldemort is afraid of. You can tell the people who either only watched the movies or watched the movies first because they tend to think Dumbledore is kind of useless.
hey Adam yes absolutely right
Maybe I’m different from the masses but I saw movie dumbledore absolutely handle Tom. Tom had to resort to possessing Harry THEN ran at the end. Plus I came from the world of anime where the old and very young tend to be overpowered lol
Idk, I kind of like the idea of the movies never really needing to show or explain how much Voldemort is afraid of Dumbledore. The books kinda have to cause, well, they’re books. It’s easier to explain emotion and feeling through dialogue and over the top scene description since all you have are words and paper. Voldemorts fear has already been so implied. Michael Gambon’s Dumbledore had such an intimidating presence, especially when he first shows up at the Ministry. With one line he proved he wasn’t afraid of him. And then, to me, Voldemort threw some of his best stuff at him, and Dumbledore not only blocked a seemingly unblockable curse, he stopped all of it with relative ease, and Voldys fright could be seen all over his face, no words necessary besides “…oh”. The books Dumbledore kinda made it feel like he could just, blink or fart, and save the world. Then again Im maybe just more of a cinematic guy, and we can all agree the cinematography of the movie scene was fantastic. Maybe Richard Harris’ Dumbledore would have worked well being closer to the book with more dialogue, but Gambon’s version was brooding, a show of force was the right move for him
Never read the books, and I find Dumbledore far from useless. Maybe I'm an outlier, because I do love hearing about the books, just never cared to sit down and read that much. I fully subscribe to the idea/fact that Harry nearly completely ruined Dumbledore's plans several times over by being a dumb kid and nearly getting himself killed every book. Without Dumbledore, Harry would have probably died a pointless death or if he did manage to survive, simply spend his days in hiding as Voldemort took over the world.
@@r00234
Ignorant take
Voldemort: i will kill you and become the most powerful wizard alive.
Dumbledore: Ah...Mondays are such pain in the ass.
I actually like Dumbledore carrying himself like he's not worried about dueling Voldemort. Through the whole series, you feel like although Harry is in danger, as long as Dumbledore is around, he'll probably be OK. Which makes his eventual death that much more impactful, no more safety net.
I also loved how this chpt was titled The only one he ever feared
Because dumbledore is too strong and experienced for riddle to be able to in his prime dumbledore would have wiped the floor with him, quite literally giving the floor a nice shine afterwards
This WAS prime Dumbledore
Magic doesn't get weaker with age, powerful wizards are usually depicted with white long beards
He isnt wiping anything, Voldemort was stronger than Grindelwald canonically and he was relatively on par with Albus
Stop hyping Dumbledore
Bro, you are so delusional. Voldemort is highly skilled duelist and wizard. He went so far that Dumbledore had to ask Snape in regards of dark magic. If you read the book you would know that Dumbledore survived only thanks to the phoenix. Voldy dueled 3 Hogwartz professors (one of them McGonagal) together and they couldn't stop him.
4:25 "Dumbledore said calmly"
Oh shewt, Voldemort must have been dead scared.
I understood that referrence.
In the movies, to say it calmly was everything needed to make Voldemort run in fear hahaha
Dumbledore didnt want to kill Voldemort because the Horcruxes would have prevented it anyways. So his plan obviously was to either delay Voldemort until he would get encircled by the Aurors, or to actively incapacitate him himself to then capture him and make Voldi feel what true horror actually is.
Albus Dumbledore Is The Greatest Sorcerer In History. No Doubt Tom Wouldn't Stand A Chance!!
(Don't Tell Him I Said That!!)
Merlin might be better
If there were no Horcruxes left, Dumbledore would have toyed with Tom. A humiliating end to the reign of terror.
I'm not sure he needed Fawkes. I think that maybe Dumbledore bought Fawkes on purpose either way (how would the bird have got their in time) and that was the easiest way for Dumbledore to block the attack in that moment. Just a personal interpretation but it seems to me that Dumbledore let Fawkes take the hit and just let it happen. Considering the ease with which he blocked all the other killing curses, I think that he probably could have managed either way.
Guess we'll never know!
In the same book Fawkes was used by dumbledore as a portkey when he was escaping from the officials trying to send him to prison, so I can only assume he bought Fawkes along incase he had to make a hasty escape.
My guess is that he used fawks to show Tom that Death isn't the end of all beeing and nothing that he be feared about, a Phoenix is the perfect example in this place
@@TyogerYT cool! I like that explanation the best.
Could it be tha Fawkes does what he wants to do and is not a pet to Dumbeldore... has hes own will and motivation?
@@woodstock7799 ok yeah, we are on 2022 an everyone can do what he want and even a pet doesn't has to serve his master, I mean the basilisk was just snaking around (pun intended) and wanted to make eye contact do build up relationships with humans and he was just a very sad snake
I think the fight from the book would have worked on screen. There’s more going on and it would be more visually interesting and maybe forestall the endless dull stalemate duels of the later films. There are snakes, transfiguration of the fountain, fire, shields, Fawkes and more. You also miss Dumbledore arriving in the death chamber “framed in the doorway from the brain room” which I’m almost glad is still how I originally imagined it in my head. The immensely scary, powerful, silently furious Dumbledore that is “the only one he ever feared” of the books is never really shown. Film Dumbledore is weaker and less agile. The rest of the department of mysteries would have also been amazing to see on screen, but I’m also kind of glad that that’s still exactly as I originally imagined it. Brains attacking Ron, the spinning room, the bell jar of time, the room that can’t be opened that contains a force (love) that melts Harry’s knife given to him by Sirius. Sirius laughing at belatrix, Lupin explaining to Harry that sirius is dead (not clearly hit by Avada kedavera in book, it’s just Belatrix’s “spell”). It’s a lot of great action that would have been a suspenseful (though in need of adaptation of course) ending. This is a shame because otherwise I like the film. I like the book too, I know some don’t, but it is very long and there is some that should probably have been lost. I would probably have cut grawp rather than the department of mysteries. Cutting quidditch was a good choice, having Dan Radcliffe assault Tom Felton would have been weird. Hagrid’s mission to the giants is lovely in the book, but you can’t really do story time in a film, but it would be nice to do it somehow (much shorter), would explain where the giants in no. 7ii come from.
Generally this combines two of the biggest unfortunate parts about the films; that the climax of no. 5 is rushed, and that Gambon’s Dumbledore is terrible. Stephen Fry’s audiobook Dumbledore is the one for me.
Book Dumbledore is the Dumbledore from the first two movies. I wish we’d seen more of that actor.
Its too late for that line of thinking.
Finally someone said it. Thank you. Richard Harris will always be the one and only Dumbledore
RIP Richard Harris
I like the first two movies Dumbledore. But I think he seemed genuinely old as if he wouldn't have been able to do scenes like the one in order of the phoenix
@solesurvivor1142 anyone who claims Richard Harris's Dumbledore looked "genuinely old" and weak has no idea about acting or cinema and dont deserve to call themself knowledgeable, unless if they r a child. Gambon's Dumbledore, HE looked like an old man and not in the slightest does he pass as the Dumbledore from the HP franchise, the powerful leader and figure of significance that has been pulling the strings all along
That's the thing. People who fear death above all rarely can test themselves to the max if they can't point it all on the line. Dumbledore isn't afraid to die. Not afraid to sacrifice himself if it'll give him the ultimate victory in the end.
I think Fawkes was written in because of Tom's fear of death and his loneliness
Fawkes died and was reborn. He also took a bullet willingly. Self sacrifice and martyrdom create immortality.
Who would do that for Voldemort? Without being forced?
He's still trying to help Voldemort. To teach him, and ultimately save him.
Edit: by recognizing his mistake and having remorse
Dumbledore has the elder wand, that's a special circumstance so it can make sense to deflect killing cutse
Well said. Having remorse is also the only other way that a Horcrux can be destroyed as well, unfortunately, Voldemort is totally incapable of that.
Keep in mind that Rowling didn't write the film's script and also didn't reveal the secrets of the later books to Knowles or anyone else. Thus the scriptwriter didn't know of the Elderwand subplot and the true extent of Dumbledore's power. Additionally Albus knew from the prophecy that it was not in his remit to defeat Voldemort.
Let's be real here, there is no elder wand subplot before the 7th book. At no point in any of the previous books is attention drawn to Dumbledore's wand, nor any other wand (substantively) other than Harry's and Voldemort's. She came up with the Hallows for the 7th books and has retconned their relevance on Pottermroe and twitter. That Harry's cloak is notably better than others, qnd that Dumbledore had it (possibly to study, though that may have been revealed in the last book too) is as close as she come to bringing up the Hallows.
I dont buy the prophecy plot device.
Lets be real, If voldy was the mustache man who started ww2, and you had the ability to kill him, would you not do it because of some riddle of a prophecy that said you weren't the chosen one?
@@falseprophet1024 Dumbledore needed Voldemort alive to kill Harry AFTER the destruction of the other Horcruxes. He himself started looking for them, but after the ring's curse, he needed to teach Harry what was needed, because he would certainly die before. As Snape says while confronting him. He raised Harry to be slain in the proper time. He didn't know for certain if Harry would be back alive, but he did know that Voldemort should've been the one to kill him. Also, Dumbledore even says that who made the profecy true was Voldemort himself, when tried to kill Harry that night. But as the profecy was stablished, then Voldemort would be defeated by Harry, and any try to do it in any other way could have potentially gone wrong or have had unexpected consequences.
@@falseprophet1024 Also, killing Hitler would not certainly stop nazism. He was an idea, so the right way of doing it was to supress him to show that, no matter how big is your army, no matter how confident you are, we will win and you will be ashamed. The suicide was the best way of disbanding the army trust in its leader, and the best way of showing the world that not only he was weak, but also that the ones opposing him were not merciless.
What I'm trying to say is that not everything gets resolved by simple killing or by targeting the main problem. In many cases, what makes the main problem big is exacty what lingers after such simple solutions. And if there are forces around wanting to support a model like that, then to disrupt that will is the most important thing to avoid the history to repeat itself.
@@GabrielPassarelliG
Meh, thats a weak reason. Dumbeldore let hundred of innocent people be killed by voldy so he could potentially save Harry?
In regards to the mustache man, you have a point, but it doesnt really apply here. You had 10 years with no voldy and nobody picked up the mantle. There was no Himler or Goerbels to step in for voldy..
Despite old age, Dumbledore, in both versions, that he truly is a great wizard. The case was the same in both versions, to keep Harry protected and Voldemort busy long enough for the aurors to arrive that Voldemort had in fact returned and thus prove to everybody what he and Harry had been saying of them the past year. I like how in the aftermath Dumbledore starts giving orders to the Minister of Magic himself to correct everything that been happening to Harry and the school since the start of the year.
I highly recommend getting the Stephen Fry audio books for Harry Potter best purchases I've ever made in my life. He is an amazing narrator.
I didn’t know that was a thing!
On which platform are they available?
@@Karol-ei1fc platform? i wouldn't know. i have them on tapes i got them before platforms were a thing 😂
@@Karol-ei1fcI'm listening to them on Storytel the monthly subscription is peanuts
I think the best notion is to not think of the elder wand as a be-all-end-all…it is powerful yes but it is also a placebo. If you think you are the most powerful with the wand then it shows that you could be. But dumbledore was the most powerful so why would it make a difference…”the wand chooses the wizard” doesn’t mean it can’t go another way…damn that was a rant that I hope makes sense
well in the book it is explained that The Elder Wand would switch allegiance if the more powerful wizard came along . So either Elder Wand behaved as a regular wand(with no boost of power ) if it sensed that Voldemort might be more powerful or it didnt sense that Voldemort was more powerful . Either way Voldemort couldnt beat Dumbledore .
It has been said about Grindelwald and Dumbledore duel that The Elder Wand suppressed its power because it felt that Dumbledore might have been stronger and it wanted to see who was actually a more powerful wizard and who would win on pure merit , without the aid of extra power of The Elder Wand .
It just wasn't the right time yet. They both play 4d chess. I thought Fawkes jumped in without Dumbledore's say so, solely because he loved his owner.
Adds another dimension to the dialogue about death, Tom's weakness, the fear of death, allies from fear and respect of power rather than love and respect of character. I think it for-shadows (or explains before they are introduced into the story) the horcruxes as a weakness (albeit also dark lord major strength) and that after death scene of that pitiful, weak, remnant thing that was Tom / Voldemort. I confess I speculate that J K Rowling took on board ideas of J R R Tolkien and C S Lewis about "True Myth" and the appeal to us of myths that contain elements similar to the story of Jesus Christ when planning and writing the overall story.
Dumbledore defeated an Elder wand wielding Grindelwald.
Grindelwald who on his own without the wand was very powerful.
If he could do that, Voldemort is nothing to him.
That argument can be turned around. Dumbledore.. who defeated Grindelwald and now Dumbledore has the elder wand couldn't defeat Voldemort. Lol however Dumbledore was older when he fought Voldemort and not in his prime. I think Dumbledore was the most powerful but I think Voldemort was more powerful than Grindelwald
@@shaynevaughn3164 well there would have been no point as Voldemort had the horcruxes and would just come back
@@shaynevaughn3164 so if dumbledore could have killed Voldemort, it would’ve been pointless
Well Voldemort had horcruxes when he ran into Harry as a baby didn't he? Yes presumably he would come back quicker than he did before but it would be easier to hunt horcruxes when Voldemort was weakened. Don't forget the people that helped restore Voldemort were scared of him, many followers didn't try to bring him back, and not many knew of the horcruxes
While I do think Dumbledore would win, don't forget Voldemort dueled Kingsley, McGonagall, and slughorn at the same time so it wouldn't easy
Loving all the new videos.
I do believe however that the true reason Dumbeldore did not show any fear of death when facing Lord Voldemort in the atrium of the ministry was the fact that he had mastered his acceptance of it. Like a samurai "the way of the warrior"
knowing he had done his duty in protecting Harry & understanding that his life was merely a pawn in service of the greater good he faced his fate willingly.
As you know;
'To the well-organized mind, death is but the next great adventure.'
While I get why they wanted to show Dumbledore as weaker than in the books, they might have missed an opportunity with this one. If anyone knows the anime OnePunch man it perfectly utilizes this sort of narrative setup. The main hero of that story is all powerful, being able to defeat anyone with 1 punch. Yet the stakes in that story are still great, because that is certainly not the case for all of the other heroes. I think if they showed how powerful Dumbledore actually is at the end of the 5th movie, they could have setup even better how big of a deal it is that he dies by the end of the 6th movie and that he is significantly weakened throughout Half blood prince. Dumbledore was the one person Voldemort feared. Despite what he might want you to believe, he did fear him up until the very end.
The Phoenix always strikes me as an extension of Dumbledore himself, as the two seem to be inextricably tied together. I see Fawkes and Dumbledore and two parts of the same being.
It is a picture of the trinity.
Dumbledore in Kings Cross Limbo is the father.
The flesh and bone version, that accepts his mortality and acts among men, and chooses to die is the son.
The Phoenix is the spirit.
After the death of his flesh, the spirit is still with them. It is in the world afterwards, but not in the office. It is out amongst them.
I think you can say it is the same.
I agree with u, like a snake is to voldey.
I always saw it that way too. Never really occurred to me that AD didn’t know fawkes would step in. Ideally it wouldn’t have been needed, but I didn’t really see it like fawkes saving him. More like a chess piece AD knew was there the whole time just in case.
I like the 'Fawkes was Dumbledore's horcrux' thoery.
@@falseprophet1024 not literally though. JKR even said dumbledore would never make a horcrux. Of course the movies are mutilating the cannon so we may discover Voldemort was actually grindelwald’s clone spliced with snake genes
The film's way of Dumbledore defending against the Killing Curse works for me, honestly. It's said to be un-blockable, but in Book 7, even when Voldemort isn't using his own Wand, thus removing the special circumstance, Harry's Wand was still able to repel it. So it stands to reason that ramming another Spell into it could "fight" or redirect it.
Maybe in the film, Dumbledore is using Expeliarmus or Stupefy (both described as having the color of their energy being red) to "fight" it.
I know, the simple explanation is that the CGI department was just reusing the Priori Incantaum effect from Book 4, but as an in-film-universe explanation, it works.
Great video, though! Reminds me that I have to go back through these books and films myself again to relive the fun of them!
So apparently, Harry's fame as to the only person ever to have survived the killing curse was completely unfounded. Or maybe ppl in Britain never got to fully know wht happened in Bhutan
hahaha good one
Man, Dumbledore was such a powerful, and brilliant wizard.
I agree with your point about the movie being confusing with Dumbeldore being able to block the killing curse with his magic. Maybe they decided to add to movie canon that Dumbeldore found a way to block it with the Elder Wand?
It was even blocked in Secrets of Dumbledore-before Albus even got the Elder Wand. It doesn't make much sense.
I hope we see Dumbledore go all out in the next fantastic beasts movies, or at least in his final duel with Grindelwald. Because we have never seen him at full power, and if they do make the first wizarding War movies I hope we see Dumbledore in action while using the elder wand.
I think it would make sense for dumbledore to have heroic entrance where he demolishes Voldemort completely, as I believe in 3rd movie it was stated by Ron that Hogwart is safe because Dumbledore is there. Then after Dumbledore's death it would make much more sense that everything became so grimm that Hogwart got overtaken completely.
Yes! Can't wait for your take 💜 Dumbledore was always the one Voldemort was scared of ... I have always wondered why the horicrux didn't react to Voldemort possessing Harry
because voldemort's soul was unstable and insensitive to himself, he only knew that harry was chasing the hucruxs when he stole hufflepuff's cup.
Book description sounds like a proper wizard battle as opposed to two people flailing clumsy weapons about.
I truly appreciate your videos there the closest thing to a new harry potter movie/book
I always enjoy your comparisons between the book and film.
Being calm is just a mind game - A way to unnerve and amplify Voldemort's insecurity towards Dumbledore as he has always operated under the shadow of Dumbledore's reputation. Dumbledore knows Voldemort is more Powerful than he is but Voldemort doesn't and it is imperative that he keeps it that way as it's the only thing keeping him from launching a full on frontal assault.
I've always preferred the movies version of the bravery quote, honestly.
"It takes a great deal of courage to stand up to your enemies, but a great deal more to stand up to your friends."
I think it's pretty clear in the book that DD was easily able to handle anything Voldy threw out, and he did it basically off-handedly.
but that’s basically because of the wand not his magic
@@chareloyele6158 its because he is much better wizard than Voldemort
@@chareloyele6158 Grindewald had the wand and yet he lost to Dumbledore
I love how he unbothered he says "Merely killing you would not satisfy me"
Honestly, i feel that, with every year that has been passing. More and more plot holes are in the HP magic. Though when i think about how Dumbledore could have blocked the AK curse within the "special" circumstances. Might be because Dumbledore had the Elder Wand. I do think that the fact that the AK curse is described in HP as unstoppable, isn't really that great to be honest. I mean there is magic in this world. Surely after all this time, someone would've found or studied the curse to find a spell, or some kind of shield that comes out of the wand (like the special silver shield from Voldemort) to block/stop it. I just can't believe that Dumbledore wouldn't know this kind of defense. For more than one reason. He actually experienced a bit off both sides. Dark and light.
Further more, i do agree. I would've actually liked seeing Dumbledore just taking on Voldemort very calmly, speak to him as a "normal" human. It would make Voldemort make more human which is what the producers wanted. (That's the reason they didn't give him red eyes.) To humanize him more which would make him more scary. At least, that's what i remember from the interview!
Anyway, both wizards are very powerful and interesting in their own way!
Video idea for you to do:
What additional effects do spells have that are not seen in the movies? For instance, what else can the patronus charm do besides ward off dementors?
The book portrayed this scene so much better. I remember asking myself why doesn't Dumbledore just kill him and it wasn't until the end I found out why. I also liked the book better when it came to Half Blood Prince when Dumbledore had to cast a spell on Harry to keep him from intervening on his death because he knew Harry would try and save him.
Dumbledore knew only Harry could kill Voldemort, he was just playing defense trying to get to hold Tom off long enough for the aurors to arrive and see him.
The book was far superior especially here. This should have been a yoda battle type fight lol
I always said there's certain parts of the book that should of most definitely be in the movies, like the duel between Harry & Voldemort ... The book was soooo much better than what the movie showed
Yoda got owned when he was facing his evil equivalent.
“TOM, DID YOU PUT YAH NAME IN THE GOBELT OF FIYAAAAAHHHHHH????!!!!” Dumbledore said calmly.
In the books it clearly defines Voldemorts fear for Dumbledore as well as Dumbledores pitty for Tom not being able to love. I think Fawks dying for Dumbledore it a very important part because it represents the theme that love will triumph over fear and hate
I felt that Dumbledore's confidence was warranted, I don't feel Dumbledore didn't see Voldemort as a threat up until he had vanished. He knew Harry was his target then and feared for him. I know some people see Fawkes saving him as he would have lost if......But Dumbledore knew he had his Phoenix to protect him and knew head to head Voldemort wasn't a match for him. Also, this scene in the book made it that much more shocking and hurtful for me when Dumbledore died because at that moment Harry's last defense against Voldemort was gone, the most powerful Wizard to have ever lived in the century was gone. It also made the last fight scene in the book for me that much more exciting cause I felt Harry was just as confident as Dumbledore was in this fight.
That entire book was the best of the series. When the teenagers+OthP are losing to the death eaters, Dumbledore shows up with a white and furious face, giving Harry an electrical surge of hope. After dealing with all the death eaters (except Bellatrix who managed to kill off Sirious before fleeing from Dumbledore) he walks into the Voldemort duel with no cares of fears. Absolute legend.
I was always unhappy that they admitted the dialogue as I felt it was the dialogue that was the true battle far more than the magic being thrown at each other
Wow. this entire video is so well made. The editing, the book dialogues. The music.
Made me revive the battle in an entire new experience combining the book and the film! So amazing! 🙌🔥
Literally one minute and I'm still not the first comment. Haha. You've got a huge following. Love the content. 💛
I think they should have gone more like the books in anime i love seeing the protagonist overpowering an enemy showing of and maybe humiliating his enemy
I always believed that Dumbledore had a certain connection with Fawkes, so he knew Fawkes was there to save him from the killing curse. Otherwise he would’ve either apparated somewhere else or conjure another statue (or object) to shield him. There’s no way Dumbledore would leave that up to chance, as it wouldn’t fit with his behavior during that duel. He was the greatest wizard of his time for a very good reason. I also don’t believe that the Elder wand made a big difference during the duel. Sure, it gave Dumbledore’s power a little boost, but with his exceptional skill and abilities he didn’t need that to duel Voldemort to a stalemate.
Naw Fawkes showing up was all apart of Dumbledore's strategy. He clearly brought the phoenix with him as another line of defense. This shows his preparedness and brilliant strategic mind. Dumbledore was in control the whole time. I doubt that even if voldemort had the elder wand he would have won. Part of how strong Dumbledore is isn't just with how powerful he is with magic, it's also how well he understands it and how his mind works. After all he did already beat someone who had the elder wand who was on his level.
This is something that hurts a littel... with something like magic, creatvitiy and strategie should be abel to bet raw power but its only about "Power". Still like the story but its kinda lame
@@woodstock7799 I mean dumbledore and voldemort have both. From dumbledore using the statues to voldemort turning fire into a snake. And them both being so insanely powerful.
I don't think Fawkes' act of taking the Avada Kedavra suggests that Dumbledore lost. Fawkes is in a sense an extension of Dumbledore, or perhaps it would be closer to accurate to say that there's a symbiotic relationship since I believe Fawkes has agency of his own - his own will. He didn't just happen to come to the rescue - he was part of why Dumbledore could be confident - a tool in his toolbox Riddle wouldn't expect. - and yet even more than a tool - more even than an ally. Fawkes is intimately connected to Dumbledore. He comes to Harry when Harry shows loyalty to Dumbledore. He alerts Dumbledore that Umbridge is coming the night Arthur Weasley is attacked and he whisks Dumbledore away when Fudge wants to arrest him. but most importantly, none of these things happen as a result of pre-planning. Fawkes just knows what is needed in the moment and acts, and he leaves when Dumbledore dies. In OotP, Fawkes was a part of how Dumbledore won in the Ministry.
The book shows Dumbledore has friends that care for him, to step in front and take the hit. V has no one.
Something to consider is that just because Dumblefore appeared fully confident and relaxed, that doesn’t necessarily mean he was. It’s entirely possible he was having to really exert himself, but was maintaining a facade of easy confidence in order to intimidate Voldemort. What’s scarier, fighting a guy who’s having to give his all to match you, or one who’s making it look like he’s not even trying? The fact that Fawkes had to step in makes me think Dumbledore wasn’t as firmly in control of the fight as he wanted Voldemort to believe.
The scene could have worked nicely as discribed at the book. But I like the possession thing. And really thinks that, if they made it right like in the book, and added that, it would've been perfect. You know, there are lots of ways to create tension and show that Dumbledor, even though not fearing him, was actually resonating power and concentration, and that Voldemort was worried but also angry and confident. Also, the scene would have an arc of "we know Voldy is done!" to "oh no, Dumb cannot die!" And all the statues thing and specially Fawkes would have been like jump scares, surprises that kept the audience in its toes. I think they didn't know how to film it, so they changed it. One of the most expected scenes, and that repeats itself when Harry defeats Voldemort, and they simply didn't do both.
Dumbledore had one hand tied behind his back due to the fact that he (Dumbledore) was never trying to really kill Voldemort, thusly not giving Tom everything in the book to help him win. It felt as if Dumbledore knew he couldn't be the one to kill Voldemort and was simply stalling until the aurors showed up! Also, Dumbledore was distracted heavily by protecting Harry knowing Harry was the one that had to kill Voldemort in the end. It's not revealed that Dumbledore knew this at the time, but if you remember, he was searching for Horcrux's long before him and Harry learned from Slughorn's memory in the pensive!
I love ur vids
The movie has a shocking lack of transfiguration magic, especially considering it is considered the most dangerous and powerful branch of magic.
Regarding the double attack from the snake and killing curse, I agree with u that it had cornered Dumbledore slightly. But we had seen earlier that he could use apparition there. So it wasn't that hard to just get out of the way. He probably used Fawkes interference as an opportunity to shift into the counterattack. After all, just like voldy uses snakes, Dumbledore can use his pet too considering he is immortal.
When the Harry potter movies where made, 3D modelling was still very time consuming and expensive. That's why they opted for flashy acting and light effects rather than 3D modeling statues and creatures.
It's the same reason they tried to reduce the amount of magical creatures and the screen time they gave them. Events in the 4th and 5th book Vs movie where especially where effected by this.
My problem with the film’s Dumbledore is that you can clearly tell that the actor did not read the books and did not really understand the character. That can clearly be seen during the scene when the divination teacher gets fired. Instead of remaining calm, he gets angry. After the first two movies, they started straying further and further away from the source material.
Totally. Dumbledore is supposed to be polite, cool and collected. The actor was too mean and angry throughout the movie series. Dumbledore would never grab Harry by the collar and scream, " DID YOU PUT YOUR NAME IN THE GOBLET OF FIRE?!" Like... You know he didn't Albus.
You need to remember it’s not just the actors job to portray the character correctly, if anything it’s MORE the directors role to ensure the actors represent them all properly. Gambon likely did as he was told, and they probably felt him being more dramatic made for more exciting cinema to watch.
I COMPLETELY disagree that it wouldn't have been an absolute cinematic MARVEL to see the old man champion grandmaster all timer Dumbledore himself absolutely dominate this fight. Make the fight twice as long to shove those nails into the coffin. It would've made the audience put some deserved respect on the best ever and also the elder wand itself. Admit it, they just didn't have the budget. I love seeing credits where credits are due, and also just straight up OP characters like for example; Saitama.
Although during the fight, it may seem as though Voldemort and Dumbledore were evenly matched, I still do think Dumbledore was far more powerful. Voldemort was using Avada Kadavra and a lot of other dark spells. Dumbledore was able to counter all of this and stay on even ground without dark spells. Dumbledore didn't want to kill Voldemort because he knew the job must be left to Harry, so he only fought to defend Harry and himself, and get Voldemort to leave.
Incredible job
"Onesided battles are no fun" Speak for yourself! I loved it when in fantastic beasts, Dumbledore completely dominated Credence. (Or whatever his real name is.)
Normal people: “You-know-who”
Chads: Voldemort
Omni-Chads: Tom
Just because he may have needed Fawkes doesn't mean he was the "loser" though. He used the statues to block the other killing curses and that didn't make him the loser, right? Whether he can communicate with Fawkes and he asked the bird to do it, or the bird did it on his own, it doesn't matter. He's a phoenix so it doesn't truly kill him, just like it didn't kill a statue that wasn't really alive to begin with. Seems like a rather silly conclusion to me. 🤷🏻♂️
Dumbledore is the loser because it was a position where he either would be hit by the killing curse or the snake. Voldemort attacked him from 2 sides.
Or he's not cause he deflected both
@@headstrongbachelor3152 Your acting like there are only 2 sides of Dumbledore. There are the right and left sides where he could have escaped from.
Even when he came back to full strength he still couldn't kill a 150 year old man, even with all that dark art knowledge
@@MS_132_SM And you have not read the books but speak BS to avoid the terrible truth that Voldemort almost killed Dumbledore...
@@headstrongbachelor3152 Your speaking about almost.
When even Voldemort acknowledged that Dumbledore was not trying to kill him, and he still couldn’t kill the man who wasn’t fighting to kill.
You are going of almost and it nearly happened.
Dumbledore almost drowned Voldemort, had he not ran off.
It clear to me you have read the book, but your interpretation skills are non existent.
Please do more such book to film scene comparison stuff
I read a bit a dialogue in a fanfic once about Harry describing this duel to sirius(Sirius survived in this fic), and Sirius barks in laughter before, “That’s what you get when two show offs duel. They make a spectacle of the whole thing”
You mention at 8:08 that Dumbledore doesn't use a "Fiery Whip" but at the beginning of their duel, Dumbledore's first move is him whipping his want around his head before he casts and it even makes a "Whip" noise.
That scene was badass. When Voldy screams and shatters the glass then Dumbledore does the water orb protection.
"Duel" with a d - not a j = "jewel" ;). Thank you for this thoughtfully-constructed upload.
Avada Kedavra may be unblockable, but let’s not forget that Dumbledore is using the Elder Wand, which is said to be unbeatable in a duel, when you’re it’s master. It’s basically an unstoppable force meeting an immovable object. So it kinda makes sense for Dumbledore to block it in the movie
Except that the Elder wand doesn't work. It has lost many duels. It's more likely that it just has the ability to detect magical prowess, presenting itself to the strongest wizard.
It is blockable? Just not with spells but u can throw objects
The mistake started in the 4th movie. (Impostor) Moody very explicitly said avada kedavra is unblockable in the book. The movie also made the priori incantatem effect seem like the most unusual part of Harry and Tom’s wands’ interaction, rather than Harry being able to block the killing curse.
What he meant is that there's no counter curse, no protection charm that can nullify it like Protego the shield charm ECT. But a physical barrier makes the spell miss basically
Even Physical barriers that take the hit are blasted to dust but do "block" the spell in a roundabout way. But anything the spell hits is destroyed
@mrdark9916 yes. In any case, that defining property is completely ignored in the movies. Instead, we get beam locks ala Godzilla.
@@Th0ughtf0rce true that lol
Dumbledore is the best wizard ever.
That duel is one of my favourite scenes in the books. It was quite underwhelming when I saw how it was portrayed in the films.
Because Dumbledore had the high ground!
Oops, wrong franchise.
I have a theory that Dumbledore was the only individual that took time to process, comprehend, and empathize with Voldemort’s fate. In that, the Professor understood enough about the Ancient Magic (love) that a young Tom Riddle would never understand love because of how he came to be conceived. Dumbledore, despite loathing the adult and monster that Tom eventually became, always sees the young, ill-fated boy and comes to see he still cares for him (Tom). This is perhaps why Dumbledore always tells Tom Riddle that it is something he (Tom) would never understand.
So while it may appear that they are equally matched in this duel, consider that:
- Voldemort is dueling to kill and Dumbledore is dueling to protect Harry
- Despite possessing the Elder Wand, Dumbledore shows restraint not willing to cross the line
- The line being that because Dumbledore does truly care about Tom Riddle, killing Tom would tear/split Dumbledore’s soul. And that was not a line he was willing to cross.
I don’t think you can say that Dumbledore would have lost without Fawkes because without Fawkes, he wouldn’t be Dumbledore. This was used to illustrate the fact that they were people ready to die for Dumbledore, people who truly cared about him which is something Voldemort would always be without. Fawkes sacrificing himself for Dumbledore isn’t a sign of Dumbledore‘s weakness but of a strength Dumbledore and others have that Voldemort never will
Well said
The point of Faux taking the blast is something Dumbledore constantly repeats in the books, love is the most powerful magic there is. Faux loves Dumbledore, and without that connection, there are probably countless times Dumbledore would not have survived. This is not a weakness on Dumbledore's part, it is a sign of his immense strength.
I love these stupid backpedalling arguments you all make to satisfy yourself that albus is better. No man. I could also use a meat shield to protect me. If this was a fair duel then albus would have lost. Voldy was fighting 2 technically. This is not fair. I don't care about the argument. If dumbledore really can kill voldemort why doesn't he return him to his previous non existence ? Who will care about the ministry anymore?
Why do people always think that high age is equal to being out of prime? I’m pretty sure that’s not how the wizarding world works. Experience and knowledge is clearly more important than having slightly faster reflexes. The physical condition doesn’t matter too much as long as you can move around and swing your wand. I’m pretty sure Dumbledore is actually in his prime here, he only got weakened from the event in the half blood prince. That being said, you can well argue that Dumbledore only dominated the duel and stood his ground because he had the elder wand.
Not really.
The fact that the Elder Wand served him, and didnt abandon him for Voldy, demonstrates he was the more powerful (or worthy) master.
Im pretty sure thats how the elder wand worked.
@@falseprophet1024 that makes no sense. The wand does not shift allegience in the middle of the duel, you have to beat or disarm the owner first. Harry vs Voldemort was special because the wand already belonged to Harry before the duel even started
@@paulgraf5746
Its impossible to defeat the master of the elder wand, according to the hallows.. and yet, people have lost while using it.. seems strange, right? And, of course, the Elder wand isnt the most loyal, changing its allegiance to the most powerful wizard in a group..
It seems like a loophole in the gift from death. The master of the wand will never lose, but the wand may switch allegiance to the wizard you are fighting, causing you to lose. But since the person that defeated you was the new master of the wand, the master of the wand is still undefeated..
@@falseprophet1024 thats a good theory but for now its just a theory
@@paulgraf5746
If you read the elder wood description on the wiki, it implies what im saying pretty heavily, if it doesn't outright say it..
This is why Fantastic Beasts is so awesome right now. The way Dumbledore duels in the recent series in incredibly like Dumbledore would in the books. The duel in the Order of The Phoenix movie really disappointed me.