About 5 years ago my heart began to question everything ... myself and my best friend would discuss things we dare not share with anyone else lest they think we were out in the woods but our souls knew there was more. I remember sheepishly saying what if I never knew you is the evil the sin and that was to be cast in the lake of fire NOT Gods creation. When we opened our hearts to trust the Holy Spirit to lead us God left breadcrumbs everywhere for us to learn and understand His true unchanging nature. Thank you BZ for your diligence.
There is an arminian christian who uploads in youtube that for him many christians and many people are in hell fire now burning in hell fire thats his belief and he upload on youtube that many people are in hell fire burning what is your response in this isue?
Love this - our true essence is divine - God loves us and we love God - glorifying in the divine nature as ‘children of God’ - what a beautiful existence we have
The Bible does not teach that our essence is divine. We are created. We are not immortal beings. We were created in the image and likeness of God. The image can attain the likeness by participation, not through our nature. We are created for something. That does not mean we automatically get it. John 1:12 teaches that Jesus gives us the power to become a real child of God. This option will be open to every human being. However, it comes with a cost. Only a Child of God inherits the Kingdom of God, not a friend, and certainly not a foe. Only Sons and Daughters inherit the Kingdom. Let us embrace the call now!
@@byzantinedeaconTo be created for something means that the seed of that something must exist within. Like can only participate with like. You maintain that we are still made in the image of God but have lost his likeness. If we have no likeness at all, then we are not an image of him. Participation is only possible if that which participates has some link to that with which it participates, otherwise how could we desire to participate? I wouldn’t desire food unless I had something that is related to an in essence is linked to food. If our essence is not divine, then we are not made in the image of God. Orthodox theology makes more sense of this as us being a marred image of God.
@@brianbachinger6357 we are created. We are not eternal beings. Image and likeness are not the same things in Orthodox theology. Image is potential, and likeness is achieved by participation. Image only becomes what it is by attaining the likeness. The image is obscured, not lost. it can still attain likeness through Christ. Participation is necessary for the image to become what it is.
British philosopher Bertrand Russell said that no one can sit at the bedside of a dying child and still believe in God. My response to Mr. Russell is, “What would you say to a dying child?” What could an atheist say? “Too bad”? “Tough luck”? “Bum deal”? You see, in that circumstance, there’s no possibility of redemption for that evil. In fact, it doesn’t seem to make sense to even call it evil at all if there is no God. Yes, evil appears to be something ontological (= something has a form of being), but is not, and God is not a fan of "fake stuff", because He only created "real stuff" and called it multiple times "good". My mind is not big enough to imagine the nature and structure of evil, but I know one thing for sure: There is probably no space and no time, absolutely nothing without God! And although I find indications in the Bible that God also created evil, for example Isa 45:7, I have to live with the reality and experience evil. However, I find hope in abundance - not only does God regard me as having died, but as "having died with Christ", and I am completely included in Christ, καὶ ἐστὲ ἐν αὐτῷ πεπληρωμένοι, as it says in Col 2:10 with a participle construction, "and you are in Him (= Christ) being completed ones". And the person of Christ appears to be God´s ordained deputy before Him to all humankind, in Christ there happens to be living the full Godhead becoming human thus being a model for all humans - evil has no final chance to be & perform anything. Thank you, Mr Brian Zahnd, for your excellent reminder of God´s "ontological insistance"! So long from Germany!
@@doriesse824 ,Satan. Surely we must be afraid of him, suspect him everywhere, fear him around every corner, right? I'm afraid that with such an attitude to life, it will certainly be quite possible to live with the victory of Christ over all evil, won't it? All joking aside! If you fear the devil, that's your business. In any case, it is not difficult for me to say that the devil is ineffective because I am in Christ, and I am non-existent in Christ for the devil and his hordes because I died with Christ, died on the cross, Gal 2:20. I am virtually a beloved of God living in Christ & a non-living zombie for the devil, that's really all! As Gal 2:20 goes on to say, I live by the faith of the Son of God, ὃ δὲ νῦν ζῶ ἐν σαρκί ἐν πίστει ζῶ τῇ τοῦ υἱοῦ τοῦ θεοῦ τοῦ ἀγαπήσαντός με καὶ παραδόντος ἑαυτὸν ὑπὲρ ἐμοῦ = And that which I now live in the flesh, I live through faith of the Son of God. PS: To translate ἐν πίστει ζῶ τῇ τοῦ υἱοῦ τοῦ θεοῦ as "I live by faith in the Son of God", as is usually understood, is grammatically on shaky ground - it could and should also be called correctly: I live through faith of the Son of God. Anyway - best regards from Germany!
@@doriesse824 right, God never finished his creation. We are not finished, and the angels are not finished. Hebrews 4:9 says the end is something we must enter. Brian Zahnd demonstrates that evil is a possibility by deviating from the purpose of creation. Creation has a destiny that’s in God and not the primordial uncreated abyss from which we all come. Unfortunately, the purpose can be undone, broken, and altered. God gave humanity and the angles the power and freedom to participate in the creative process. We are the gods of this world and that should be obvious. Being incomplete and having freedom we can willfully error. Evil is an error. Something that cannot be sustained in the completion but can be present now. There may not be a force or embodiment of evil but it’s certainly a reality. It’s a reality that can frustrate and obscure the finality of the created order. That’s what Satan is doing. Satan is the God of this world as Paul said. When Christ met him in the wilderness, he told him all the Kingdoms of the world belonged to him. God sent Christ as an invader into this fallen world to rescue us from the Kingdom of Darkness (Colossians 1:13) and gave us the power to get the creation back on track.
An atheist would be more caring than a Christian. You Christians seek to leverage a bad situation into a preaching opportunity. What about the average of 25,000 children a day who die from starvation? Where is your worthless god?
@catholicbible , Paul as an apostle to the Gentiles (Gal 2:8) does not connect gospel with Torah but with Christ - for Paul gospel is the same as Christ, see Rom 1:16 & 1 Cor 1:24. In any case, the gospel of Jesus is not the Pauline gospel! Jesus demands the keeping of God's commandments, and Paul has a totally different approach - Christ practically acts as a human representative before God with HIS faith, with HIS infallibility, with HIS life. In this way, Paul does not focus on the law, but on the deputy Christ for us, and thus it becomes understandable why Paul puts faith at the center, because this is in truth the faith of the deputy Christ! The Greek supports this approach grammatically and human-logically - Rom 3:22 as a basic Pauline text has a genitivus subjectivus plus a genitive preposition διά in the construct: δικαιοσύνη δὲ Θεοῦ (= genitive subject) διὰ (= genitive preposition) πίστεως Ἰησοῦ Χριστοῦ which leads to the grammatically correct translation: "But the righteousness of God is through faith of (= genitive) Jesus Christ". The usual translation "...through faith IN Jesus Christ" appears wrong & misleading, because it unnecessarily puts the believer under stress, because it unnecessarily stresses the believer by making him desperate to find a firm and strong faith! Paul makes Christ the standard and model for mankind - Christ covers all hope and fulfillment, all judgment and all creation for mankind. Paul is the one in whom Christ brings the work of God into HIC ET NUNC, into HERE AND NOW! However, after many years of research as a believing theologian and after three strokes with total despair and a visit from God, one thing seems quite certain to me - It appears crystal clear to me that after all this loveless arguing among believers, after all these undignified mutual insults and squabbles about the true gospel with the approval of God, BOTH ways - the way of Jesus and circumcision with the Torah & the way of Paul for the uncircumcised and without the Torah are justified and possible ways of God for people. Ultimately, ALL live on the deep grace of God, conscious or unconscious, and ultimately ALL appear fallible and weak people who live with a flaw - the flaw of not being able to please God in any way! And therefore also ALL of them do need the Lord Jesus Christ - possibly, as Paul in 1. Cor 15:23 designates, ἕκαστος δὲ ἐν τῷ ἰδίῳ = but each in the own order! I remain with kindest greetings from beyond the Atlantic as yours truly, Paul Paulsen, retired Lutheran minister & lover of God, SIMUL IUSTUS ET PECCATOR!
Thank you for this verse. It actually fits his point perfectly. In creating light, he allowed for the by-product of darkness. In creating peace, he allowed for the potentiality of a byproduct of chaos. So good!
@@papi77on No, this does not "fit his point perfectly." It contradicts it perfectly; or rather he contradicts the scripture. You're just presumptuously condescending with your own light-hearted reverie. The video narrator said that God does not create evil. God not only creates evil, as His word says, but He also creates the wicked for the day of evil. - "The Lord hath made all things for Himself, yea, even the wicked for the day of evil." For God made not death: neither hath he pleasure in the destruction of the living. For he created all things, that they might have their being: and the generations of the world were healthful; and there is no poison of destruction in them, nor the kingdom of death upon the earth: (For righteousness is immortal:) But ungodly men with their works and words called it to them: for when they thought to have it their friend, they consumed to nought, and made a covenant with it, because they are worthy to take part with it.
Evil, here, is the opponent of peace or prosperity, not goodness. It is also translated “calamity”. The NT authors would call God the “God of peace”. You’ll never read “the God of peace and evil”. John always says that “God is light and in him is no darkness at all.” I find these two motifs run throughout the NT. Hopefully this helps shed some light on this. 😊
the verb "know" in biblical times was not used as we understand it today. "I never knew you" doesn't mean, in this modern sense "I don't know who you are" - therefore it doesn't contradict God's omniscience. To "know" in the Bible is used to signify (sexual) intimacy, as in "Adam knew Eve". "Knowing God" means, to be intimate with God. "knowing" in this rationalistic sense is one-sided; I can know all things and they don't have to know me back. Intimacy is always necessarily mutual, or else it's a violation. God can't be intimate with you if you won't come into his company. This passage, very simply, means that you might profess your belief in God and you might say all the right words and do all the right things, but you're not actually intimate with God. In other words, you're a pretender. It's not your outward behavior that counts, you can't bribe your way into the Kingdom. Christ didn't come to offer you some kind of deal (if you do this, you will be rewarded), he came to invite you into his intimate company so that you might be transformed by it. I think this is what this passage signifies and it is straightforward enough.
Not to be rude, seriously. I don’t want to be mean or ugly. We really need to remember, however, that just because the water is muddy does not mean it’s deep.
“But while they were on their way to buy the oil, the bridegroom arrived. The virgins who were ready went in with him to the wedding banquet. And the door was shut. “Later the others also came. ‘Lord, Lord,’ they said, ‘open the door for us!’ “But he replied, ‘Truly I tell you, I don’t know you.” (Matt.25.10-11)
Revelation 22:17 And the Spirit and the BRIDE say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.
Over the years I've often thought deeply about what "I never knew you" must mean. Adam knew Eve. Many if not nearly most professors of religion i.e. of the "christian" faith have it all right in their heads, and how they can intellectualize about doctrine is flawless. They believe all that the bible says and even practise their religion but that one critical element is missing of being lovingly joined in spiritual union and intimacy to Christ. He doesn't know them; they don't have a beautiful childlike guile-less relationship with God. Everywhere I see on TH-cam it's all talk talk talk, a lot of blabbermouths with no real Christ-like- ness about them. I can actually understand why there's so many atheists and agnostics and God haters, and why Moslems see Christians as false and hypocrites. I believe I have actually come to see how the unbelieving world sees christianity and Christians, and how they see it is right. They see the utter hypocrisy and how nearly all of it is about personal gain and enrichment with all it's fake evangelism efforts and helping pastors' salaries and church "growth". It's all false all of it.
There is so much truth in what you say here. It would be so much better if all Christians were actually Christ-like. And yet perhaps there is more to Christ than we currently often see in Christianity.
@@MikeSmith-sc5we "Perhaps" more to Christ than what we see in Christianity" ? What an understatement. I would say there's a million times more to him that what is portrayed in christendom.. Besides, christianity is just a worldly movement that has set up certain standards and a moral code to live by. Boils down to that they believe in another jesus. The REAL Christ: "For the whole multitude sought to touch him: for there went virtue out of him, and healed them all." Luke6:19. This is the REAL Christ, not the imaginary fairy tale one that churches profess to believe in.
Beautifully said. Dear Jesus I hope you are right 🙏 still seeking the truth on him. Second person of the Trinity? Idk man, I never saw Him. Praying to know the truth
@@MikeSmith-sc5wetrue. But then again.. God’s telling this story haha. man, the path to life really is narrow. That used to scare me because of all the people that would get left behind. But in reality… God is telling the story and if hes okay with the masses being the masses, I’ve gotta be too. However, still not sure how to read the Bible as a whole though, because Christ’s actions and words about never being forgiven in this age or the next seem hard to work around.
When we struggle with some of Jesus's sayings remember He was a man a Rabi with desciples and yes He used persuasive rhetoric to turn people's hearts to God and His Kingdom on earth.
CS Lewis mentioned that verse in one of his books and explained it in a similar way. Those told to depart from God are those who used religion to hurt others ("The Inquisitor or Pharisee is far more likely to be condemned than a prostitute or crook").
As in all the scriptures that scared me long ago, if one asks God what does this mean, then quietly expect an answer as you ponder and revisit, you will get an answer that isn’t what you initially thought but one that soothes the soul and make you to know, nothing will snatch you from his hands and he will never leave you or forsake you. It’s even better than this but poor translations here and there make things sometimes look worse than they are.
In the Sodom and Gomorrah story in the Bible Abraham fell down on the job because he stopped haggling with God too soon. If he had kept going, he could have gotten God to agree that if there was one person in Sodom who, for one split second of his life, was moved to compassion for man or beast, that God would have spared the cities for the sake of who that man was at that one split second.
But if that's what Jesus "meant to say", why doesn't he just say it? Why does it require so much explanation to take the edge of what he "seems" to say?
because translations are imperfect and it is a book of mystery to be worked through to be understood. it is not a "white person's guidebook", written in many different styles and languages.
Luke 8:10 And He said, “To you (those who have understanding) it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that ‘seeing they may not see, And hearing they may not understand.’
The biblical writers write to us knowing that some are little children and need correction until we reach full maturity (Christ). Others who have been trained in righteousness and love and goodness recognize this to be true for all.
When Peter said to Jesus, Depart from me for I am a sinful man, that's NOT when Jesus said I will make you fishers of men. He said suffer it to be so for the fulfilling of all righteousness. Nothing implied there where he was washing the disciples' feet that the idea or purpose of his washing their feet was to make them fishers of men. If you quote from bible passages quote it correctly otherwise it could be misleading to people's understanding.
Luke 5:8-10 - 8 But when Simon Peter saw it, he fell down at Jesus' knees, saying, “Depart from me, for I am a sinful man, O Lord.” 9 For he and all who were with him were astonished at the catch of fish that they had taken, 10 and so also were James and John, sons of Zebedee, who were partners with Simon. And Jesus said to Simon, “Do not be afraid; from now on you will be catching men.” Matthew 3:14-15 - 14 John would have prevented him, saying, “I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?” 15 But Jesus answered him, “Let it be so now, for thus it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness.” Then he consented.
The part about evil is true, but about "depart from me" you are wrong. In that passage, Jesus warns us how he will answer to the wicked on the judgement day, when they will ask to be granted entry into heaven. He refuses them and says: "I never knew you, depart from me you evildoers". God is merciful, yes, but that passage is about the wicked souls being refused entry into eternal kingdom. If you read the whole sermon on the mount, the message is more obvious. It will take you 10 minutes, go read it yourself (those of you readting this comment).
One must consider the audience to whom He was speaking & the time period. They were under the Old Covenant Law system. So truly He didn’t ‘qavah’ (meaning intimate knowing) them b/c they ( the 1st century religious leaders) were too wrapped up in performance based rules.
I believe the entire 7th chapter is about the battle between Gods righteousness ( His gift of Grace, Jesus) versus self righteousness, or mans righteousness which is always a result of our works ( in our minds). Verse 2 defines the entire chapter, "as you judge so shall you be judged". You can't judge others by their behavior, works or sins and then say you believe The Gospel of salvation by Grace. The way you judge others defines your true belief. The entire chapter then gives examples such as narrow gate (Grace) or the wide road (works the old covenant mentality). Or false teachers with bad fruits (bad theology, the old covenant mentality). Also building your life on the rock (Jesus the Grace of God the New Covenant Reality) or sand (the old covenant mentality of works and law keeping).
Yeah but doesn’t that just sound absolutely insane? What God would do this? I believed that for so long but it’s so beyond all imaginative darkness and horror that I don’t think you’ve really considered it. Do you realize the kind of God that means you worship?
@@bradvincent2586 the one who grants us free will and judges us based on our choices. The one who is good and doesn't tolerate evil. The one who gives us a chance of redemption through his own blood, but on no other terms.
I cannot follow the exegesis. Jesus as the gate keeper of the Kingdom of Heaven says to those false disciples that they never did the will of the Father, though apparently they were full of religious deed. Zahnd brings it back to one who might refuse to embrace their Telos, but that in such a non-committed manner. I do see where Jesus is saying, "Your evildoing is not the full potential of who you are meant to be as a disciple/human." However, Jesus is still rejecting someone trying to enter - he is turning them away. He is not saying, "I reject your deeds, but please let your spirit enter into my Father's house."
They still have to go through judgment but Isaiah prophesied that when God's judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world would learn righteousness. Everyone doesn't "inherit" the kingdom but that doesn't mean that everyone is cast away forever. In Revelation 22:17, an invitation is being made by the Spirit and the Bride but who could they be talking to? Jesus said in Matthew 21:31 that harlots and tax collectors will enter the kingdom of God before religious hypocrites.
@@therealgospelofchrist6823 Thank you for your reply. It is interesting to consider. I do wish to know which Isaiah prophecy you're speaking of to consider that fully. However, in Revelation 22, I agree with your assertion that the Spirit and the church (bride) will call out to the evil ones remaining outside the city (v. 14-15). I do not doubt that those Jesus rejects at the gates (Matt 7:23) will still hear the Spirit's call to repent and drink of the free water mentioned in Rev 22:17. I also agree that 17 does concur with Matt 21:31 in which the thirsty and poor (e.g., harlots and tax collectors) are the first to embrace his free drink, while the religious attempt to gain access via their own acts. I'm also very curious about your statement that , though not everybody inherits the kingdom, this does not mean all are cast away forever. Is your statement a comment of the rejection of both eternal conscious torment and of annihilationism? I understand that is where Zahnd would take it as he holds to Christian Universalism - but is that where you're also leaning into your interpretation of Matt 7:23? Or were you moving toward a different stance on the topic?
@@ericmiller6828 Sure! Isaiah 26:9 With my soul I have desired You in the night, Yes, by my spirit within me I will seek You early; For when Your judgments are in the earth, The inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness. Those who inherit the kingdom have a more special calling from God and they are heirs to the kingdom which is why they receive the inheritance of the kingdom. James 2:5 Listen, my beloved brethren: Has God not "chosen" the poor of this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which He promised to those who love Him? Everyone isn't chosen to be an heir to the kingdom but there is more to this special calling that goes far beyond what Christianity has ever taught us. Who or what are God's "judgments" that Isaiah speaks of in Isaiah 26:9? Do you not know that the saints will judge the world (1 Corinthians 6:2)? The saints are God's judgments and these judgments serve to instruct in righteousness. We see similar language in Daniel 12:3 when the wise will turn many to righteousness after they rise from their sleep to shame and age-during (not everlasting) contempt. Obadiah 1:21 Then saviors shall come to Mount Zion To judge the mountains of Esau, And the kingdom shall be the Lord’s. Everyone will eventually be allowed to enter into the kingdom after Christ puts down all rule, authority, and power. Not even death will be able to claim victory once Christ defeats all of His enemies which culminates with God being all in all. I am a Christian Universalists btw...
@@therealgospelofchrist6823 Thank you again for your reply :) I am glad you brought in Isaiah 26 into the conversation above. That makes much sense as I re-read your initial commentary to my comment. I can see your hermeneutic and it does make more sense of where Zahnd was progressing in this video clip. I also love the question you ask of "Who or what are God's judgments that Isaiah speaks of" in v.9 (though I understand yours was rhetorical). I have nostalgia regarding that question because I had originally believed it to be Yahweh's punishment for the wicked discussed in v.9.b and into v.10-11. However, diving further into the Hebrew - I learned the word mispateka leans to God's laws or ordinances (with the imagery of a judgment made from the wise king and then written down to be taught as precedent law). This makes so much sense as Isaiah uses it in this early half of ch.26 and does not use it in the concluding verses, instead using lipqod hawonm i.e., punishment for wrongdoing, in place of the "wrath" judgment poured out in a Passover-like fashion in v. 21. Though I cannot fully agree with Zahnd's interpretation (and your own if you share his), I am very happy to ponder on your thoughts on these scriptures. As I've been studying Origen's Universalism, as well as his prose on Pauline Universalism, I appreciate the extra modern-day insight into this specific area from the perspective of a more personal conversation. If I may also commend you, I appreciate your willingness to dialogue with a brother and share your thoughts. God bless and God speed.
@@ericmiller6828 I don't completely agree with Zahnd's interpretation of Matthew 7:23 but I can respect that he sees grace and mercy in that scripture than one might readily conclude. I think we can still apply judgment that is shameful with contempt and still leave room for grace and mercy after the judgment has completed its work. Thanks for offering your thoughts brother and God bless!
Brian. Brian, Brian. How can you say things that mislead people? Sure, a message of love and grace is wonderful. But not if it's not true. Jesus just said, prior to this verse, that not everyone will enter into heaven. The WHOLE person, not just the evil that they harbor. Jesus' point here is that a person must do the will of God. Anyyhing else is lawlessness, and will prevent them from entering heaven. When you try to sugarcoat what Jesus said and change it to mean domething else, you are doing your listeners a grave disservice. It's dangerous, and will cause people to go to hell. Jesus never pretended that sin was not deadly serious. He said it would be better to gouge out your eye and cut off your hand than to commit sin. Because if you sin and keep sinning, you will NOT go to heaven. Jesus is not telling sin to depart, he is telling people to depart. You need to take the entire chapter 7 of Matthew in context. Otherwise, Brian, YOU may be the one Jesus tells to depart. Because you are speaking like the devil, spreading deception.
What IS the will of God my friend? What is the whole law that Jesus stated? In this context Brian mentions, nothing is stated that remotely resembles God’s will. It’s why God doesn’t know them. There are too many passages that give hope that in the end, all will be made new and reconciled to God. 😊
@@benjaminwhitley1986 Pick up a Bible and read it. Old Testament and New Testament. Ignore heretical extra books such as the Book of Mormon, the writings of Ellen White, or other false teachings.
@@Razmatazz522 whole law summed up in this: love God with all your heart soul mind and strength and love your neighbor as yourself. In the context Brian quotes, those who say “Lord Lord” have not been perfected in love. It’s why they are turned away. Nothing though in the immediate context precludes them from returning again. Hope this helps. 😊
@@benjaminwhitley1986In the immediate context it says "in that day." What day? The day of judgement. Final Judgement. There is no coming back after that. You must not give people false hope. Many people will be eternally lost. There is no such thing as universal salvation. If you don't understand this, you are taking God too lightly. I do not write these comments because I lack understanding, but because I do not want people to be deceived. God is a consuming fire, and his word is not to be trifled with. You cannot make it say what you want it to say.
@@Razmatazz522 I think when the verse says “the kingdom of heaven” it is talking about the millennial kingdom, The 1000 year reign of Jesus Christ, not about the new heavens and new earth where you are. that’s just my interpretation though.
Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. Matthew 25:41 . Hell is an act of Mercy.
@@bradvincent2586 As that other comment said from St. John Chrysostom "“For if the wrath of God were a passion, one might well despair as being unable to quench the flame which he [a wicked man] had kindled by so many evil doings; but since the Divine nature is passionless, even if He punishes, even if He takes vengeance, He does this not with wrath, but with tender care, and much loving-kindness; wherefore it behooves us to be of much good courage, and to trust in the power of repentance." The judgments of God are good things. They can not be ignored in the scriptures. When Christ says, "I never knew you" or "Depart for me" its an act of judgment. The aposlte Paul also said, "do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God?" 1Cor. 6:9. This is a severe judgment, it does not mean God is torturing people. A Universalism without consequences is unbiblical.
@@byzantinedeaconThen you have replaced God the torturer with God the executioner. If ECT is true evil exists forever. If hell as annihilation is true, death exists forever. For God to be all in all like 1 Corinthians 15 says, not a single soul could be lost. For death to be put to death, death must be destroyed by life.
@@brianbachinger6357 No, God is the judge and his his judgment is good. Hell is mercy. Divine Revelation is silent on the ultimate fate of the damned. What they experience ends in the love of God. Hell is a real place and a state. The destruction of Death and decay by Christ does not negate the judgment. As Christ teaches, some will be resurrected to life and others condemnation. The scriptures teach there will be eternal consequences for what we do in this life.
@@byzantinedeacon Christ never taught that anyone would be resurrected to condemnation. You are parroting what certain bibles say but the Greek is "krisis" which means judgment and when God's "judgments" are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will LEARN RIGHTEOUSNESS (Isaiah 26:9)! The judgment of God is good and that is why everyone will be salted with fire because everyone needs correction. Hell is a Christian lie that only lives because of people like you that repeat the lie of hell. Hell is mercy is asinine. Like @brianbachinger6357 stated, death cannot be abolished if billions are still locked in the state of death. Love and righteousness will never win if there is a place called hell where billions are tortured for all eternity. The scriptures do NOT teach that there are eternal consequences for what we do in this life which is a worthless life full of vanity. Eternal consequences for finite sins is a false balance which God says is an abomination (Proverbs 11:1). Your views are extremely twisted.
Maybe you’re the only one… lol maybe not. Maybe, however, it reveals something else entirely to others. Maybe a different way of seeing. Maybe this helps many of us reconcile strong warnings from Jesus with the character of God revealed in Jesus and also taught by Jesus. I think for most of us here, this is helpful. Maybe even hopeful. 😊
@@benjaminwhitley1986 I love this channel, but this particular video and exposition of this passage was not very good and reaching at best. Just read the passage being talked about. Jesus Himself doesn't talk like this and says YOU who do these things, depart from me. Not The bad things depart from me but YOU are all good. Context is King...well, Jesus is King but you get the point ;) ....Again, I LOVE this channel, just don't think it is a good idea to get into the habit of pulling things out of nothing like I believe Mr Zahnd is doing here, even if he doesn't mean to. God Bless.
@@determinedchristian I love this channel too. I do recognize some talks will resonate more with some than with others. And some will be more persuasive than others. God bless my friend. :)
I hope universal reconciliation is true. I don’t believe it is, but I hope it is. Either way, this little talk is a twisting of the biblical text beyond recognition. This kind of sophistry is not the way forward for universalists. It’s not helpful to your cause. Stick to the texts that can plausibly be interpreted in a universalist sense and you’ll be much better off.
@@cody2901There’s not room for a detailed exegetical demonstration here. The reading in this video will not be found in any commentary. It’s not exegesis; it’s wishful thinking and utterly foreign to the text. Here’s the text. Matthew 7:21-23 (NA28): 21 Οὐ πᾶς ὁ λέγων μοι·* κύριε κύριε, εἰσελεύσεται εἰς τὴν βασιλείαν τῶν οὐρανῶν, ἀλλʼ ὁ ποιῶν τὸ θέλημα τοῦ πατρός μου τοῦ ἐν °τοῖς οὐρανοῖς. ⸆ 22 πολλοὶ ἐροῦσίν μοι ἐν ἐκείνῃ τῇ ἡμέρᾳ· κύριε κύριε,* οὐ τῷ σῷ ὀνόματι ἐπροφητεύσαμεν,* καὶ τῷ σῷ ὀνόματι δαιμόνια ⸆ ἐξεβάλομεν, καὶ τῷ σῷ ὀνόματι δυνάμεις πολλὰς ἐποιήσαμεν; 23 καὶ τότε ὁμολογήσω αὐτοῖς ὅτι οὐδέποτε ἔγνων ὑμᾶς·* ἀποχωρεῖτε ἀπʼ ἐμοῦ οἱ ἐργαζόμενοι τὴν ἀνομίαν. “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter into the Kingdom of the heavens.” That’s the *subject* of the saying. Nothing could be more obvious in Matthew than that “entering into the Kingdom of the heavens” means salvation. The proclamation of the gospel is “Repent and believe the gospel, for the Kingdom of the heavens is near.” That’s what Jesus is talking about here. Our salvation depends on our response to the Gospel. Our response of repentance is demonstrated by our doing the will of God, “but the one who does/is doing the will of My Father in the heavens.” “Many shall say to Me on that day (The Day of the Lord)…” The following statements are merely words, “shall say”, and are not obedience of faith. These are they who will not enter into the Kingdom. So, “they shall say”… and then Jesus says, “I shall confess to them that ‘I never knew YOU.’” Not that He didn’t acknowledge a *part* or portion of them, but that He didn’t know == have a *relationship* (this has nothing to do with omniscience, a silly suggestion) with them. Jesus knew who they were, but He had no relationship with them. John 17 says “This IS eternal life, to know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ Whom You have sent.” Knowing means being in a relationship of love and peace. This is obviously Jesus meaning. “Depart from Me, you *workers of iniquity!” This is the judgment articulated throughout the Bible, especially the NT. There is a finality here and it is the separation of the WHOLE PERSON - the worker of iniquity - into outer darkness. Again, there’s no room for a full treatment of the text… but it’s unnecessary anyway. Brian’s reading is impossible, though I appreciate his hope for apokatastasis. He’s importing gobs of theological speculation and baggage into the text. If this were the way we read texts, it’s a free for all.
1 Timothy 2:3-4 This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. Isaiah 46:10 At the beginning I declare the outcome; from of old, things not yet done. I say that my plan shall stand, I accomplish my every desire. Isaiah 55:11 So will My word be which goes out of My mouth; It will not return to Me empty, Without accomplishing what I desire, And without succeeding in the purpose for which I sent it.
There is nothing in this text where Jesus says the sinner is beyond returning. “Depart from me” may be interpreted several different ways. I think Jesus along with other biblical authors gives us strong language to change our thinking and life (repentance). My hope of universal salvation isn’t in warnings but rather in the character and nature of God who IS LOVE. But there are many and varied ways that God gives hope and security for the mind and comfort of the believer whose hope is in God, the Savior of all people (as Paul says). Maybe this helps. 😊
He’s just not speaking in Evangelical terms. But this stuff has its roots in historic Christianity going all the way back to the earliest days of the patristics. Try reading Gregory Of Nyssa, Maximus the Confessor, Basil the Great. You will hear this same stuff talked about by the very folks who were part of the counsel that decided the cannon of scripture.
@@GabrielKerr He's also not speaking in Biblical terms. And thats exactly the problem. Zahnd gets his theology from many works outside of the Bible but never the Bible. He never sources his thoughts from the Scripture only the outside sources hes read.
In the immediate context, it says "in that day." What day? The day of Judgement. Final Judgement. There is no returning after that. You must not give people false hope. There is no universal salvation. Many people will be eternally lost. I do not write these comments because I lack understanding, but because I do not want others to be deceived.
@Razmatazz522 the words “final judgment” do not appear in the Bible. That’s reading something into the text that’s not there. Judgment throughout scripture takes on different meanings. Isaiah 26:9 states that “when your judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the earth learn righteousness”. Judgment is spoken of as learning righteousness. Leviticus 19:16 says “in righteousness you shall judge your neighbor”. Jesus in John 7:24 says “do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment.” Jesus also says “judge not, lest you be judged. For with the same judgment you judge another, it will also be unto you.” Judgment here is a picture of equal weight and reaping what one sows. James tells us that “mercy triumphs over judgment”. Even in God’s judgment, there is mercy. Hanakkuk 3:2 states that “even in your wrath, you remember mercy”. 1 Peter 3:19-20 states that Jesus preached to the disobedient spirits who died in the flood implying that even in death Christ frees and give life to the disobedient. Even in death (the wages of sin) the gift of God is life in Jesus Christ (mercy). We will set no limits to the love of God for Paul says that “not even death nor anything created (devil, fallen angels, etc) can ever separate us from the love of God. Strong warnings from Jesus about anything contrary to the love of God should not cause us fear because as Paul says “we do not have a spirit of fear, but of power and love and a sound mind. The angel proclaimed “fear not! I bring you good news which will be for all people.” Hopefully something in these verses of hope and healing will help your fear subside and trust in “the living God who is the savior of all people.” Peace friend. 😊
So you believe God won’t be ‘all in all’? You believe Jesus Christ is either a failure or a liar and is NOT the ‘Savior of the World’? You believe New Jerusalem’s are forever shut? You believe in a callous, weak, and cruel version of ‘God’ and I pity you for it. The Father is better, greater, more loving, more kind, more perfect, and more wise than any man can fathom. So I wonder why so many of the religious types make him LESSER than even human goodness. Jesus is Lord. Not man’s will, or man’s sin.
@YoshiBlad3 I never said, or implied, anything like that. Who are you, to subvert what I believe? Certainly I believe that Jesus is the savior, and that God is completely sufficient. I also believe that Jesus means what he says. I don't know why you don't.
Don't be fooled into thinking that God is Almighty in only bringing good things, He is also just as Almighty in bringing eternal punishment to those that refuse Him.
Refusing your evil religion is not refusing God. No one can come to Christ unless the Father "draws" them but if Christ be "lifted up" (on the cross), He will "draw" all humanity to Himself. This man was handed over to you (the Jews) by God’s deliberate plan and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross. But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels to suffer death, crowned with glory and honor, so that He, by the grace of God, should experience death for everyone so that at the name of Jesus, every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Eternal punishment as stated by Jesus does in fact bring good things. The Greek word for punishment as Jesus says it is “kolasis”. In Greek literature, it’s a gardening term meaning to prune in order to bring health to the plant. This punishment is a corrective or chastening punishment meant to reform or bring life. The Greek word “timoria” does in fact mean retributive punishment but that is never cited by scriptures as relating to God’s methods with man. So, yes eternal punishment is God’s corrective punishment that takes place in eternity which leads to good things. 😊
About 5 years ago my heart began to question everything ... myself and my best friend would discuss things we dare not share with anyone else lest they think we were out in the woods but our souls knew there was more.
I remember sheepishly saying
what if I never knew you is the evil the sin and that was to be cast in the lake of fire NOT Gods creation.
When we opened our hearts to trust the Holy Spirit to lead us God left breadcrumbs everywhere for us to learn and understand His true unchanging nature.
Thank you BZ for your diligence.
Oh wow dude , as one that struggles with sin and assurance of salvation this helped .Thank you now I understand.
Beautiful and much needed truth - thank you!
There is an arminian christian who uploads in youtube that for him many christians and many people are in hell fire now burning in hell fire thats his belief and he upload on youtube that many people are in hell fire burning what is your response in this isue?
Beautiful and hopeful.
Love this - our true essence is divine - God loves us and we love God - glorifying in the divine nature as ‘children of God’ - what a beautiful existence we have
The Bible does not teach that our essence is divine. We are created. We are not immortal beings. We were created in the image and likeness of God. The image can attain the likeness by participation, not through our nature. We are created for something. That does not mean we automatically get it. John 1:12 teaches that Jesus gives us the power to become a real child of God. This option will be open to every human being. However, it comes with a cost. Only a Child of God inherits the Kingdom of God, not a friend, and certainly not a foe. Only Sons and Daughters inherit the Kingdom. Let us embrace the call now!
@@byzantinedeaconTo be created for something means that the seed of that something must exist within. Like can only participate with like. You maintain that we are still made in the image of God but have lost his likeness. If we have no likeness at all, then we are not an image of him.
Participation is only possible if that which participates has some link to that with which it participates, otherwise how could we desire to participate? I wouldn’t desire food unless I had something that is related to an in essence is linked to food.
If our essence is not divine, then we are not made in the image of God.
Orthodox theology makes more sense of this as us being a marred image of God.
@@brianbachinger6357 we are created. We are not eternal beings. Image and likeness are not the same things in Orthodox theology. Image is potential, and likeness is achieved by participation. Image only becomes what it is by attaining the likeness. The image is obscured, not lost. it can still attain likeness through Christ. Participation is necessary for the image to become what it is.
Well I can only resent the ghastly deity Christianity proclaims to be 'love'.
British philosopher Bertrand Russell said that no one can sit at the bedside of a dying child and still believe in God. My response to Mr. Russell is, “What would you say to a dying child?” What could an atheist say? “Too bad”? “Tough luck”? “Bum deal”? You see, in that circumstance, there’s no possibility of redemption for that evil. In fact, it doesn’t seem to make sense to even call it evil at all if there is no God.
Yes, evil appears to be something ontological (= something has a form of being), but is not, and God is not a fan of "fake stuff", because He only created "real stuff" and called it multiple times "good".
My mind is not big enough to imagine the nature and structure of evil, but I know one thing for sure:
There is probably no space and no time, absolutely nothing without God! And although I find indications in the Bible that God also created evil, for example Isa 45:7, I have to live with the reality and experience evil.
However, I find hope in abundance - not only does God regard me as having died, but as "having died with Christ", and I am completely included in Christ, καὶ ἐστὲ ἐν αὐτῷ πεπληρωμένοι, as it says in Col 2:10 with a participle construction, "and you are in Him (= Christ) being completed ones".
And the person of Christ appears to be God´s ordained deputy before Him to all humankind, in Christ there happens to be living the full Godhead becoming human thus being a model for all humans - evil has no final chance to be & perform anything. Thank you, Mr Brian Zahnd, for your excellent reminder of God´s "ontological insistance"! So long from Germany!
Whom do you say Jesus and Paul were speaking of when they mentioned the "god of this world"? Jesus mentioned him three times.
@@doriesse824 ,Satan.
Surely we must be afraid of him, suspect him everywhere, fear him around every corner, right? I'm afraid that with such an attitude to life, it will certainly be quite possible to live with the victory of Christ over all evil, won't it? All joking aside! If you fear the devil, that's your business. In any case, it is not difficult for me to say that the devil is ineffective because I am in Christ, and I am non-existent in Christ for the devil and his hordes because I died with Christ, died on the cross, Gal 2:20. I am virtually a beloved of God living in Christ & a non-living zombie for the devil, that's really all! As Gal 2:20 goes on to say, I live by the faith of the Son of God, ὃ δὲ νῦν ζῶ ἐν σαρκί ἐν πίστει ζῶ τῇ τοῦ υἱοῦ τοῦ θεοῦ τοῦ ἀγαπήσαντός με καὶ παραδόντος ἑαυτὸν ὑπὲρ ἐμοῦ = And that which I now live in the flesh, I live through faith of the Son of God.
PS: To translate ἐν πίστει ζῶ τῇ τοῦ υἱοῦ τοῦ θεοῦ as "I live by faith in the Son of God", as is usually understood, is grammatically on shaky ground - it could and should also be called correctly: I live through faith of the Son of God.
Anyway - best regards from Germany!
@@doriesse824 right, God never finished his creation. We are not finished, and the angels are not finished. Hebrews 4:9 says the end is something we must enter. Brian Zahnd demonstrates that evil is a possibility by deviating from the purpose of creation. Creation has a destiny that’s in God and not the primordial uncreated abyss from which we all come. Unfortunately, the purpose can be undone, broken, and altered. God gave humanity and the angles the power and freedom to participate in the creative process. We are the gods of this world and that should be obvious. Being incomplete and having freedom we can willfully error. Evil is an error. Something that cannot be sustained in the completion but can be present now. There may not be a force or embodiment of evil but it’s certainly a reality. It’s a reality that can frustrate and obscure the finality of the created order. That’s what Satan is doing. Satan is the God of this world as Paul said. When Christ met him in the wilderness, he told him all the Kingdoms of the world belonged to him. God sent Christ as an invader into this fallen world to rescue us from the Kingdom of Darkness (Colossians 1:13) and gave us the power to get the creation back on track.
An atheist would be more caring than a Christian. You Christians seek to leverage a bad situation into a preaching opportunity. What about the average of 25,000 children a day who die from starvation? Where is your worthless god?
@catholicbible , Paul as an apostle to the Gentiles (Gal 2:8) does not connect gospel with Torah but with Christ - for Paul gospel is the same as Christ, see Rom 1:16 & 1 Cor 1:24. In any case, the gospel of Jesus is not the Pauline gospel! Jesus demands the keeping of God's commandments, and Paul has a totally different approach - Christ practically acts as a human representative before God with HIS faith, with HIS infallibility, with HIS life.
In this way, Paul does not focus on the law, but on the deputy Christ for us, and thus it becomes understandable why Paul puts faith at the center, because this is in truth the faith of the deputy Christ! The Greek supports this approach grammatically and human-logically - Rom 3:22 as a basic Pauline text has a genitivus subjectivus plus a genitive preposition διά in the construct:
δικαιοσύνη δὲ Θεοῦ (= genitive subject) διὰ (= genitive preposition) πίστεως Ἰησοῦ Χριστοῦ which leads to the grammatically correct translation:
"But the righteousness of God is through faith of (= genitive) Jesus Christ". The usual translation "...through faith IN Jesus Christ" appears wrong & misleading, because it unnecessarily puts the believer under stress, because it unnecessarily stresses the believer by making him desperate to find a firm and strong faith!
Paul makes Christ the standard and model for mankind - Christ covers all hope and fulfillment, all judgment and all creation for mankind. Paul is the one in whom Christ brings the work of God into HIC ET NUNC, into HERE AND NOW!
However, after many years of research as a believing theologian and after three strokes with total despair and a visit from God, one thing seems quite certain to me - It appears crystal clear to me that after all this loveless arguing among believers, after all these undignified mutual insults and squabbles about the true gospel with the approval of God, BOTH ways - the way of Jesus and circumcision with the Torah & the way of Paul for the uncircumcised and without the Torah are justified and possible ways of God for people.
Ultimately, ALL live on the deep grace of God, conscious or unconscious, and ultimately ALL appear fallible and weak people who live with a flaw - the flaw of not being able to please God in any way! And therefore also ALL of them do need the Lord Jesus Christ - possibly, as Paul in 1. Cor 15:23 designates, ἕκαστος δὲ ἐν τῷ ἰδίῳ = but each in the own order!
I remain with kindest greetings from beyond the Atlantic as yours truly, Paul Paulsen, retired Lutheran minister & lover of God, SIMUL IUSTUS ET PECCATOR!
Isaiah 45:7
“I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.”
King James Version (KJV)
Good point. Let's see him dance around this one😮
Thank you for this verse. It actually fits his point perfectly. In creating light, he allowed for the by-product of darkness. In creating peace, he allowed for the potentiality of a byproduct of chaos. So good!
Isaiah 43:1 follows a same pattern. There is a creation that is is fundamental, there is a formation that is of the Lord
@@papi77on No, this does not "fit his point perfectly." It contradicts it perfectly; or rather he contradicts the scripture. You're just presumptuously condescending with your own light-hearted reverie. The video narrator said that God does not create evil. God not only creates evil, as His word says, but He also creates the wicked for the day of evil. - "The Lord hath made all things for Himself, yea, even the wicked for the day of evil."
For God made not death: neither hath he pleasure in the destruction of the living.
For he created all things, that they might have their being: and the generations of the world were healthful; and there is no poison of destruction in them, nor the kingdom of death upon the earth:
(For righteousness is immortal:)
But ungodly men with their works and words called it to them: for when they thought to have it their friend, they consumed to nought, and made a covenant with it, because they are worthy to take part with it.
Evil, here, is the opponent of peace or prosperity, not goodness. It is also translated “calamity”.
The NT authors would call God the “God of peace”. You’ll never read “the God of peace and evil”. John always says that “God is light and in him is no darkness at all.” I find these two motifs run throughout the NT.
Hopefully this helps shed some light on this. 😊
Torturing people without end is twisted and sadistic. Only a monster would do that. God is Love 2 samuel 14:14.
the verb "know" in biblical times was not used as we understand it today. "I never knew you" doesn't mean, in this modern sense "I don't know who you are" - therefore it doesn't contradict God's omniscience. To "know" in the Bible is used to signify (sexual) intimacy, as in "Adam knew Eve". "Knowing God" means, to be intimate with God. "knowing" in this rationalistic sense is one-sided; I can know all things and they don't have to know me back. Intimacy is always necessarily mutual, or else it's a violation. God can't be intimate with you if you won't come into his company.
This passage, very simply, means that you might profess your belief in God and you might say all the right words and do all the right things, but you're not actually intimate with God. In other words, you're a pretender. It's not your outward behavior that counts, you can't bribe your way into the Kingdom. Christ didn't come to offer you some kind of deal (if you do this, you will be rewarded), he came to invite you into his intimate company so that you might be transformed by it. I think this is what this passage signifies and it is straightforward enough.
This guy is profound . Wow
Profound as a puddle.
Not to be rude, seriously. I don’t want to be mean or ugly. We really need to remember, however, that just because the water is muddy does not mean it’s deep.
Can you please link the full video 🙏
“But while they were on their way to buy the oil, the bridegroom arrived. The virgins who were ready went in with him to the wedding banquet. And the door was shut. “Later the others also came. ‘Lord, Lord,’ they said, ‘open the door for us!’ “But he replied, ‘Truly I tell you, I don’t know you.” (Matt.25.10-11)
Revelation 22:17 And the Spirit and the BRIDE say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.
so who are the workers of iniquity? who was Jesus referring to ?
Over the years I've often thought deeply about what "I never knew you" must mean. Adam knew Eve. Many if not nearly most professors of religion i.e. of the "christian" faith have it all right in their heads, and how they can intellectualize about doctrine is flawless. They believe all that the bible says and even practise their religion but that one critical element is missing of being lovingly joined in spiritual union and intimacy to Christ. He doesn't know them; they don't have a beautiful childlike guile-less relationship with God. Everywhere I see on TH-cam it's all talk talk talk, a lot of blabbermouths with no real Christ-like- ness about them. I can actually understand why there's so many atheists and agnostics and God haters, and why Moslems see Christians as false and hypocrites. I believe I have actually come to see how the unbelieving world sees christianity and Christians, and how they see it is right. They see the utter hypocrisy and how nearly all of it is about personal gain and enrichment with all it's fake evangelism efforts and helping pastors' salaries and church "growth". It's all false all of it.
There is so much truth in what you say here. It would be so much better if all Christians were actually Christ-like.
And yet perhaps there is more to Christ than we currently often see in Christianity.
@@MikeSmith-sc5we "Perhaps" more to Christ than what we see in Christianity" ? What an understatement. I would say there's a million times more to him that what is portrayed in christendom.. Besides, christianity is just a worldly movement that has set up certain standards and a moral code to live by. Boils down to that they believe in another jesus. The REAL Christ: "For the whole multitude sought to touch him: for there went virtue out of him, and healed them all." Luke6:19. This is the REAL Christ, not the imaginary fairy tale one that churches profess to believe in.
Beautifully said. Dear Jesus I hope you are right 🙏 still seeking the truth on him. Second person of the Trinity? Idk man, I never saw Him. Praying to know the truth
@@MikeSmith-sc5wetrue. But then again.. God’s telling this story haha. man, the path to life really is narrow. That used to scare me because of all the people that would get left behind. But in reality… God is telling the story and if hes okay with the masses being the masses, I’ve gotta be too. However, still not sure how to read the Bible as a whole though, because Christ’s actions and words about never being forgiven in this age or the next seem hard to work around.
When we struggle with some of Jesus's sayings remember He was a man a Rabi with desciples and yes He used persuasive rhetoric to turn people's hearts to God and His Kingdom on earth.
Jesus said "I never knew you because" "He who doesn’t love doesn’t know God, for God is love" - 1 John 4:8
CS Lewis mentioned that verse in one of his books and explained it in a similar way. Those told to depart from God are those who used religion to hurt others ("The Inquisitor or Pharisee is far more likely to be condemned than a prostitute or crook").
Michael, well said, and I love you.
As in all the scriptures that scared me long ago, if one asks God what does this mean, then quietly expect an answer as you ponder and revisit, you will get an answer that isn’t what you initially thought but one that soothes the soul and make you to know, nothing will snatch you from his hands and he will never leave you or forsake you. It’s even better than this but poor translations here and there make things sometimes look worse than they are.
In the Sodom and Gomorrah story in the Bible Abraham fell down on the job because he stopped haggling with God too soon. If he had kept going, he could have gotten God to agree that if there was one person in Sodom who, for one split second of his life, was moved to compassion for man or beast, that God would have spared the cities for the sake of who that man was at that one split second.
But if that's what Jesus "meant to say", why doesn't he just say it? Why does it require so much explanation to take the edge of what he "seems" to say?
because translations are imperfect and it is a book of mystery to be worked through to be understood. it is not a "white person's guidebook", written in many different styles and languages.
Luke 8:10 And He said, “To you (those who have understanding) it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that ‘seeing they may not see, And hearing they may not understand.’
The biblical writers write to us knowing that some are little children and need correction until we reach full maturity (Christ). Others who have been trained in righteousness and love and goodness recognize this to be true for all.
When Peter said to Jesus, Depart from me for I am a sinful man, that's NOT when Jesus said I will make you fishers of men. He said suffer it to be so for the fulfilling of all righteousness. Nothing implied there where he was washing the disciples' feet that the idea or purpose of his washing their feet was to make them fishers of men. If you quote from bible passages quote it correctly otherwise it could be misleading to people's understanding.
Luke 5:8-10 -
8 But when Simon Peter saw it, he fell down at Jesus' knees, saying, “Depart from me, for I am a sinful man, O Lord.” 9 For he and all who were with him were astonished at the catch of fish that they had taken, 10 and so also were James and John, sons of Zebedee, who were partners with Simon. And Jesus said to Simon, “Do not be afraid; from now on you will be catching men.”
Matthew 3:14-15 -
14 John would have prevented him, saying, “I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?” 15 But Jesus answered him, “Let it be so now, for thus it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness.” Then he consented.
@@MikeSmith-sc5we Okay, I was wrong, sorry. Thanks for the correction.
@@glennrobinson7193 No problem 🙂
@@glennrobinson7193what a pleasant exchange haha. check dat religion at the door
The part about evil is true, but about "depart from me" you are wrong. In that passage, Jesus warns us how he will answer to the wicked on the judgement day, when they will ask to be granted entry into heaven. He refuses them and says: "I never knew you, depart from me you evildoers". God is merciful, yes, but that passage is about the wicked souls being refused entry into eternal kingdom. If you read the whole sermon on the mount, the message is more obvious. It will take you 10 minutes, go read it yourself (those of you readting this comment).
That is incorrect
One must consider the audience to whom He was speaking & the time period. They were under the Old Covenant Law system. So truly He didn’t ‘qavah’ (meaning intimate knowing) them b/c they ( the 1st century religious leaders) were too wrapped up in performance based rules.
I believe the entire 7th chapter is about the battle between Gods righteousness ( His gift of Grace, Jesus) versus self righteousness, or mans righteousness which is always a result of our works ( in our minds). Verse 2 defines the entire chapter, "as you judge so shall you be judged". You can't judge others by their behavior, works or sins and then say you believe The Gospel of salvation by Grace. The way you judge others defines your true belief. The entire chapter then gives examples such as narrow gate (Grace) or the wide road (works the old covenant mentality). Or false teachers with bad fruits (bad theology, the old covenant mentality). Also building your life on the rock (Jesus the Grace of God the New Covenant Reality) or sand (the old covenant mentality of works and law keeping).
Yeah but doesn’t that just sound absolutely insane? What God would do this? I believed that for so long but it’s so beyond all imaginative darkness and horror that I don’t think you’ve really considered it. Do you realize the kind of God that means you worship?
@@bradvincent2586 the one who grants us free will and judges us based on our choices. The one who is good and doesn't tolerate evil. The one who gives us a chance of redemption through his own blood, but on no other terms.
I cannot follow the exegesis. Jesus as the gate keeper of the Kingdom of Heaven says to those false disciples that they never did the will of the Father, though apparently they were full of religious deed. Zahnd brings it back to one who might refuse to embrace their Telos, but that in such a non-committed manner. I do see where Jesus is saying, "Your evildoing is not the full potential of who you are meant to be as a disciple/human." However, Jesus is still rejecting someone trying to enter - he is turning them away. He is not saying, "I reject your deeds, but please let your spirit enter into my Father's house."
They still have to go through judgment but Isaiah prophesied that when God's judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world would learn righteousness. Everyone doesn't "inherit" the kingdom but that doesn't mean that everyone is cast away forever. In Revelation 22:17, an invitation is being made by the Spirit and the Bride but who could they be talking to? Jesus said in Matthew 21:31 that harlots and tax collectors will enter the kingdom of God before religious hypocrites.
@@therealgospelofchrist6823 Thank you for your reply. It is interesting to consider. I do wish to know which Isaiah prophecy you're speaking of to consider that fully. However, in Revelation 22, I agree with your assertion that the Spirit and the church (bride) will call out to the evil ones remaining outside the city (v. 14-15). I do not doubt that those Jesus rejects at the gates (Matt 7:23) will still hear the Spirit's call to repent and drink of the free water mentioned in Rev 22:17. I also agree that 17 does concur with Matt 21:31 in which the thirsty and poor (e.g., harlots and tax collectors) are the first to embrace his free drink, while the religious attempt to gain access via their own acts.
I'm also very curious about your statement that , though not everybody inherits the kingdom, this does not mean all are cast away forever. Is your statement a comment of the rejection of both eternal conscious torment and of annihilationism? I understand that is where Zahnd would take it as he holds to Christian Universalism - but is that where you're also leaning into your interpretation of Matt 7:23? Or were you moving toward a different stance on the topic?
@@ericmiller6828 Sure! Isaiah 26:9 With my soul I have desired You in the night, Yes, by my spirit within me I will seek You early; For when Your judgments are in the earth, The inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.
Those who inherit the kingdom have a more special calling from God and they are heirs to the kingdom which is why they receive the inheritance of the kingdom.
James 2:5 Listen, my beloved brethren: Has God not "chosen" the poor of this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which He promised to those who love Him?
Everyone isn't chosen to be an heir to the kingdom but there is more to this special calling that goes far beyond what Christianity has ever taught us. Who or what are God's "judgments" that Isaiah speaks of in Isaiah 26:9?
Do you not know that the saints will judge the world (1 Corinthians 6:2)?
The saints are God's judgments and these judgments serve to instruct in righteousness. We see similar language in Daniel 12:3 when the wise will turn many to righteousness after they rise from their sleep to shame and age-during (not everlasting) contempt.
Obadiah 1:21 Then saviors shall come to Mount Zion To judge the mountains of Esau, And the kingdom shall be the Lord’s.
Everyone will eventually be allowed to enter into the kingdom after Christ puts down all rule, authority, and power. Not even death will be able to claim victory once Christ defeats all of His enemies which culminates with God being all in all.
I am a Christian Universalists btw...
@@therealgospelofchrist6823 Thank you again for your reply :) I am glad you brought in Isaiah 26 into the conversation above. That makes much sense as I re-read your initial commentary to my comment. I can see your hermeneutic and it does make more sense of where Zahnd was progressing in this video clip.
I also love the question you ask of "Who or what are God's judgments that Isaiah speaks of" in v.9 (though I understand yours was rhetorical). I have nostalgia regarding that question because I had originally believed it to be Yahweh's punishment for the wicked discussed in v.9.b and into v.10-11. However, diving further into the Hebrew - I learned the word mispateka leans to God's laws or ordinances (with the imagery of a judgment made from the wise king and then written down to be taught as precedent law). This makes so much sense as Isaiah uses it in this early half of ch.26 and does not use it in the concluding verses, instead using lipqod hawonm i.e., punishment for wrongdoing, in place of the "wrath" judgment poured out in a Passover-like fashion in v. 21.
Though I cannot fully agree with Zahnd's interpretation (and your own if you share his), I am very happy to ponder on your thoughts on these scriptures. As I've been studying Origen's Universalism, as well as his prose on Pauline Universalism, I appreciate the extra modern-day insight into this specific area from the perspective of a more personal conversation. If I may also commend you, I appreciate your willingness to dialogue with a brother and share your thoughts. God bless and God speed.
@@ericmiller6828 I don't completely agree with Zahnd's interpretation of Matthew 7:23 but I can respect that he sees grace and mercy in that scripture than one might readily conclude. I think we can still apply judgment that is shameful with contempt and still leave room for grace and mercy after the judgment has completed its work. Thanks for offering your thoughts brother and God bless!
Brian. Brian, Brian. How can you say things that mislead people? Sure, a message of love and grace is wonderful. But not if it's not true. Jesus just said, prior to this verse, that not everyone will enter into heaven. The WHOLE person, not just the evil that they harbor. Jesus' point here is that a person must do the will of God. Anyyhing else is lawlessness, and will prevent them from entering heaven. When you try to sugarcoat what Jesus said and change it to mean domething else, you are doing your listeners a grave disservice. It's dangerous, and will cause people to go to hell. Jesus never pretended that sin was not deadly serious. He said it would be better to gouge out your eye and cut off your hand than to commit sin. Because if you sin and keep sinning, you will NOT go to heaven. Jesus is not telling sin to depart, he is telling people to depart. You need to take the entire chapter 7 of Matthew in context. Otherwise, Brian, YOU may be the one Jesus tells to depart. Because you are speaking like the devil, spreading deception.
What IS the will of God my friend? What is the whole law that Jesus stated?
In this context Brian mentions, nothing is stated that remotely resembles God’s will. It’s why God doesn’t know them. There are too many passages that give hope that in the end, all will be made new and reconciled to God. 😊
@@benjaminwhitley1986 Pick up a Bible and read it. Old Testament and New Testament. Ignore heretical extra books such as the Book of Mormon, the writings of Ellen White, or other false teachings.
@@Razmatazz522 whole law summed up in this: love God with all your heart soul mind and strength and love your neighbor as yourself. In the context Brian quotes, those who say “Lord Lord” have not been perfected in love. It’s why they are turned away. Nothing though in the immediate context precludes them from returning again.
Hope this helps. 😊
@@benjaminwhitley1986In the immediate context it says "in that day." What day? The day of judgement. Final Judgement. There is no coming back after that. You must not give people false hope. Many people will be eternally lost. There is no such thing as universal salvation. If you don't understand this, you are taking God too lightly. I do not write these comments because I lack understanding, but because I do not want people to be deceived. God is a consuming fire, and his word is not to be trifled with. You cannot make it say what you want it to say.
@@Razmatazz522 I think when the verse says “the kingdom of heaven” it is talking about the millennial kingdom, The 1000 year reign of Jesus Christ, not about the new heavens and new earth where you are. that’s just my interpretation though.
Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. Matthew 25:41 . Hell is an act of Mercy.
Hell, like that, would literally be an act of wrath so what are you even talking about?
@@bradvincent2586 As that other comment said from St. John Chrysostom "“For if the wrath of God were a passion, one might well despair as being unable to quench the flame which he [a wicked man] had kindled by so many evil doings; but since the Divine nature is passionless, even if He punishes, even if He takes vengeance, He does this not with wrath, but with tender care, and much loving-kindness; wherefore it behooves us to be of much good courage, and to trust in the power of repentance." The judgments of God are good things. They can not be ignored in the scriptures. When Christ says, "I never knew you" or "Depart for me" its an act of judgment. The aposlte Paul also said, "do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God?" 1Cor. 6:9. This is a severe judgment, it does not mean God is torturing people. A Universalism without consequences is unbiblical.
@@byzantinedeaconThen you have replaced God the torturer with God the executioner.
If ECT is true evil exists forever. If hell as annihilation is true, death exists forever. For God to be all in all like 1 Corinthians 15 says, not a single soul could be lost.
For death to be put to death, death must be destroyed by life.
@@brianbachinger6357 No, God is the judge and his his judgment is good. Hell is mercy. Divine Revelation is silent on the ultimate fate of the damned. What they experience ends in the love of God. Hell is a real place and a state. The destruction of Death and decay by Christ does not negate the judgment. As Christ teaches, some will be resurrected to life and others condemnation. The scriptures teach there will be eternal consequences for what we do in this life.
@@byzantinedeacon Christ never taught that anyone would be resurrected to condemnation. You are parroting what certain bibles say but the Greek is "krisis" which means judgment and when God's "judgments" are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will LEARN RIGHTEOUSNESS (Isaiah 26:9)! The judgment of God is good and that is why everyone will be salted with fire because everyone needs correction. Hell is a Christian lie that only lives because of people like you that repeat the lie of hell. Hell is mercy is asinine. Like @brianbachinger6357 stated, death cannot be abolished if billions are still locked in the state of death. Love and righteousness will never win if there is a place called hell where billions are tortured for all eternity. The scriptures do NOT teach that there are eternal consequences for what we do in this life which is a worthless life full of vanity. Eternal consequences for finite sins is a false balance which God says is an abomination (Proverbs 11:1). Your views are extremely twisted.
We are all now dumber having listened to Brian Zahnd attempt to sound brilliant in explaining this passage.
Maybe you’re the only one… lol maybe not. Maybe, however, it reveals something else entirely to others. Maybe a different way of seeing. Maybe this helps many of us reconcile strong warnings from Jesus with the character of God revealed in Jesus and also taught by Jesus. I think for most of us here, this is helpful. Maybe even hopeful. 😊
@@benjaminwhitley1986 I love this channel, but this particular video and exposition of this passage was not very good and reaching at best. Just read the passage being talked about. Jesus Himself doesn't talk like this and says YOU who do these things, depart from me. Not The bad things depart from me but YOU are all good. Context is King...well, Jesus is King but you get the point ;) ....Again, I LOVE this channel, just don't think it is a good idea to get into the habit of pulling things out of nothing like I believe Mr Zahnd is doing here, even if he doesn't mean to. God Bless.
@@determinedchristian I love this channel too. I do recognize some talks will resonate more with some than with others. And some will be more persuasive than others.
God bless my friend. :)
@@benjaminwhitley1986 ❤
I hope universal reconciliation is true. I don’t believe it is, but I hope it is. Either way, this little talk is a twisting of the biblical text beyond recognition. This kind of sophistry is not the way forward for universalists. It’s not helpful to your cause. Stick to the texts that can plausibly be interpreted in a universalist sense and you’ll be much better off.
Demonstrate, otherwise your statement is of no use and bound by your own understanding of interpretation.
@@cody2901There’s not room for a detailed exegetical demonstration here. The reading in this video will not be found in any commentary. It’s not exegesis; it’s wishful thinking and utterly foreign to the text.
Here’s the text.
Matthew 7:21-23 (NA28): 21 Οὐ πᾶς ὁ λέγων μοι·* κύριε κύριε, εἰσελεύσεται εἰς τὴν βασιλείαν τῶν οὐρανῶν, ἀλλʼ ὁ ποιῶν τὸ θέλημα τοῦ πατρός μου τοῦ ἐν °τοῖς οὐρανοῖς. ⸆ 22 πολλοὶ ἐροῦσίν μοι ἐν ἐκείνῃ τῇ ἡμέρᾳ· κύριε κύριε,* οὐ τῷ σῷ ὀνόματι ἐπροφητεύσαμεν,* καὶ τῷ σῷ ὀνόματι δαιμόνια ⸆ ἐξεβάλομεν, καὶ τῷ σῷ ὀνόματι δυνάμεις πολλὰς ἐποιήσαμεν; 23 καὶ τότε ὁμολογήσω αὐτοῖς ὅτι οὐδέποτε ἔγνων ὑμᾶς·* ἀποχωρεῖτε ἀπʼ ἐμοῦ οἱ ἐργαζόμενοι τὴν ἀνομίαν.
“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter into the Kingdom of the heavens.”
That’s the *subject* of the saying. Nothing could be more obvious in Matthew than that “entering into the Kingdom of the heavens” means salvation. The proclamation of the gospel is “Repent and believe the gospel, for the Kingdom of the heavens is near.” That’s what Jesus is talking about here. Our salvation depends on our response to the Gospel. Our response of repentance is demonstrated by our doing the will of God, “but the one who does/is doing the will of My Father in the heavens.”
“Many shall say to Me on that day (The Day of the Lord)…” The following statements are merely words, “shall say”, and are not obedience of faith. These are they who will not enter into the Kingdom.
So, “they shall say”… and then Jesus says, “I shall confess to them that ‘I never knew YOU.’” Not that He didn’t acknowledge a *part* or portion of them, but that He didn’t know == have a *relationship* (this has nothing to do with omniscience, a silly suggestion) with them. Jesus knew who they were, but He had no relationship with them. John 17 says “This IS eternal life, to know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ Whom You have sent.” Knowing means being in a relationship of love and peace. This is obviously Jesus meaning.
“Depart from Me, you *workers of iniquity!” This is the judgment articulated throughout the Bible, especially the NT. There is a finality here and it is the separation of the WHOLE PERSON - the worker of iniquity - into outer darkness.
Again, there’s no room for a full treatment of the text… but it’s unnecessary anyway. Brian’s reading is impossible, though I appreciate his hope for apokatastasis. He’s importing gobs of theological speculation and baggage into the text. If this were the way we read texts, it’s a free for all.
1 Timothy 2:3-4 This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Isaiah 46:10 At the beginning I declare the outcome; from of old, things not yet done. I say that my plan shall stand, I accomplish my every desire.
Isaiah 55:11 So will My word be which goes out of My mouth; It will not return to Me empty, Without accomplishing what I desire, And without succeeding in the purpose for which I sent it.
There is nothing in this text where Jesus says the sinner is beyond returning. “Depart from me” may be interpreted several different ways.
I think Jesus along with other biblical authors gives us strong language to change our thinking and life (repentance). My hope of universal salvation isn’t in warnings but rather in the character and nature of God who IS LOVE. But there are many and varied ways that God gives hope and security for the mind and comfort of the believer whose hope is in God, the Savior of all people (as Paul says).
Maybe this helps. 😊
He works so hard to twist scripture its embarrasing.
He’s just not speaking in Evangelical terms. But this stuff has its roots in historic Christianity going all the way back to the earliest days of the patristics.
Try reading Gregory Of Nyssa, Maximus the Confessor, Basil the Great. You will hear this same stuff talked about by the very folks who were part of the counsel that decided the cannon of scripture.
@@GabrielKerr He's also not speaking in Biblical terms. And thats exactly the problem. Zahnd gets his theology from many works outside of the Bible but never the Bible. He never sources his thoughts from the Scripture only the outside sources hes read.
If you can make an assertion, please provide supporting evidence. 😊
@@benjaminwhitley1986 The evidence is the word of God taken without a dose of Brian Zahnd.
@@GabrielKerr Please provide a reference.
In the immediate context, it says "in that day." What day? The day of Judgement. Final Judgement. There is no returning after that. You must not give people false hope. There is no universal salvation. Many people will be eternally lost. I do not write these comments because I lack understanding, but because I do not want others to be deceived.
@Razmatazz522 the words “final judgment” do not appear in the Bible. That’s reading something into the text that’s not there. Judgment throughout scripture takes on different meanings. Isaiah 26:9 states that “when your judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the earth learn righteousness”. Judgment is spoken of as learning righteousness. Leviticus 19:16 says “in righteousness you shall judge your neighbor”. Jesus in John 7:24 says “do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment.” Jesus also says “judge not, lest you be judged. For with the same judgment you judge another, it will also be unto you.” Judgment here is a picture of equal weight and reaping what one sows.
James tells us that “mercy triumphs over judgment”. Even in God’s judgment, there is mercy.
Hanakkuk 3:2 states that “even in your wrath, you remember mercy”. 1 Peter 3:19-20 states that Jesus preached to the disobedient spirits who died in the flood implying that even in death Christ frees and give life to the disobedient. Even in death (the wages of sin) the gift of God is life in Jesus Christ (mercy).
We will set no limits to the love of God for Paul says that “not even death nor anything created (devil, fallen angels, etc) can ever separate us from the love of God.
Strong warnings from Jesus about anything contrary to the love of God should not cause us fear because as Paul says “we do not have a spirit of fear, but of power and love and a sound mind.
The angel proclaimed “fear not! I bring you good news which will be for all people.”
Hopefully something in these verses of hope and healing will help your fear subside and trust in “the living God who is the savior of all people.”
Peace friend. 😊
So you believe God won’t be ‘all in all’? You believe Jesus Christ is either a failure or a liar and is NOT the ‘Savior of the World’? You believe New Jerusalem’s are forever shut? You believe in a callous, weak, and cruel version of ‘God’ and I pity you for it. The Father is better, greater, more loving, more kind, more perfect, and more wise than any man can fathom. So I wonder why so many of the religious types make him LESSER than even human goodness.
Jesus is Lord. Not man’s will, or man’s sin.
@YoshiBlad3 I never said, or implied, anything like that. Who are you, to subvert what I believe? Certainly I believe that Jesus is the savior, and that God is completely sufficient. I also believe that Jesus means what he says. I don't know why you don't.
That's possibly the most twisted logic I ever heard. Its the one verse his woke theology cant get around and yet I admire his failed attempt.
Don't be fooled into thinking that God is Almighty in only bringing good things, He is also just as Almighty in bringing eternal punishment to those that refuse Him.
Refusing your evil religion is not refusing God. No one can come to Christ unless the Father "draws" them but if Christ be "lifted up" (on the cross), He will "draw" all humanity to Himself. This man was handed over to you (the Jews) by God’s deliberate plan and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross. But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels to suffer death, crowned with glory and honor, so that He, by the grace of God, should experience death for everyone so that at the name of Jesus, every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Eternal punishment as stated by Jesus does in fact bring good things. The Greek word for punishment as Jesus says it is “kolasis”. In Greek literature, it’s a gardening term meaning to prune in order to bring health to the plant. This punishment is a corrective or chastening punishment meant to reform or bring life. The Greek word “timoria” does in fact mean retributive punishment but that is never cited by scriptures as relating to God’s methods with man.
So, yes eternal punishment is God’s corrective punishment that takes place in eternity which leads to good things. 😊