Arch actually did give a reason for why you can’t use graceful flame, that also explains why the portable lantern doesn’t exist yet. He said that it’s because the light from the flame and/or the lantern will call the 8 snowman’s, which would instantly eat your light hook and wipe you.
@fedydespooky7025 basically in his playthrougj of blox fruits he got to the winter island or Smith and the quest said "kill 8 snowmans" and proceeded to shit on it
You basically hit ever complaint I had about layer 2 on the head. Too bad the devs are too busy working on league of legends. Hopefully layer 3 will be more of what people want when it comes out in 3 years.
I was so disappointed when they said conquest is gonna you making your current build again. Half the fun of league is the build crafting. I'm playing the casual freshie version instead, ranked is cheeks.
The deep is calling… it’s calling… I can’t stop playing… the deep… the deep… the deep! Must play Deepwoken… must gank freshies! Must play chime of conflict!
Layer 2 not only is it just something i speedrun without thinking about it, it's also losing its value more and more. It used to be the best way to get loot, but now that the Diluvian mechanism exists, there really isn't a point in doing floor 2 apart from getting dawnwalker/a couple dye packets. As for floor 1, chaser is now pretty much useless, and there really isn't a need to get the deepshore fossil now that Maestro can just drop any enchant stone you could possibly want, as well as more legendary weapons than even Ethiron. Also eclipse I wanted to ask you: have you ever worked on non jojo games before ? you make really good suggestions and remarks all the time and i was wondering if it comes from experience
@@EclipseGameplaysOn the idea of special layer 2 armor, instead of just getting one either op talent for your build or one that is shit, you should get no talent, but in return you get like 2x the durability of a master armor and way more armor against stuff in general (Don’t dunk on me I’ve gotten to 19 as my highest power and some random guy was so sorry for m1ing me once he basically gave me everything for black diver)
@@50gritsandpaper1 Fair but black diver should have a talent where your willpower scaling is 2x more, so say you have 40 willpower, you’ll have the sanity of 80 willpower, 100 would equal 200 (idk if this should work on lft)
I’ve seen people talk to devs about the Maestro & Diluvian loot problem. Hopefully Maestro gets the rates on enchant stones dropped and cbow & crypt no longer drop.
11:32 Lorewise, there is a diver in floor 1 that asks you to save her by completing the entirety of layer 2. However, she is being controlled and that trap there is meant to kill you for attempting to save her.
WHAT DO YOU MEAN LOREWISE, YOU ENCOUTER IT IN THE ACTUAL GAME, IT'S IN THE GAMEPLAY, THERE'S NO DIVIDE, IT'S RIGHT THERE, IT'S NOT LOCKED TO SOME 5 DOLLAR BOOK BOUGHT FROM WISH
There's no way bro went from yba, through reviewing roblox games, to getting addicted to deepwoken while the game is dry asf. It's really fun watching how your gameplay improved from your deepwoken review, to actually doing l2. edit: Alright y'all are right, eclipse is probably at a point where the game still seems exciting to him, unlike many people. My main problem with the game is that the balancing team seems to be non-existent, and flamecharm is heavily prioritized by the devs for some reason
deepwoken is not dry at all. but obviously the lake will be empty if you play/drink for 2000 hours. every single game in existence would have that problem dude
Hard agree on not being usable in combat, however I have to disagree with manually using it in terms of being flung off the map. There are many instances where bugs, ping, etc can lead to going off the map. Would suck to wipe to that, wouldn't feel "oh thats my fault i wiped" it would be "wow thats like 4 hours of my life grinding this build wasted." Just make it so if you die in combat in L2 the Light Hook wont save you, but it saves you from parasites and falling off the map. This is also better for players who are first going into Layer 2, who wouldn't know about parasites and falling off the map is inconsistent sometimes where there is and isnt floor. Meanwhile any player going into Layer 2 would understand dying to a Bonekeeper and any other mob, is, well, dying.
But the Bonekeeper isn't fightable anywhere else except for the 20+ drown depths trial. If only for the exclusive enemies that would make you wipe every damn time you die because you haven't had a chance to learn them, Lighthook would become exponentially less useful and making layer 2 much more annoying to get into
@@dominicballinger6536 probably the only solution is to make it lighthook will work as usual before u beat chaser and reported to Claris for the first time, and then the light hook will be weaken so it doesnt work in combat or some changes. they could probably rework how light hook work lorewise
Eclipse should become a tester tbh, like i really love the blacksmith idea and the portable lantern, like parasites arent even a problem at this point you will use the respite lantern anyways, keep it up eclipse gl with deep
there are reasons to lighthook, eclipse (do not include me in DDOS) 1. if it would be risky then nobody would even do l2 2. back in the day, when verse 2 came out l2 came out too, and that was the most anticipated update in deepwoken, that overhauled everything. if it were to be this difficult, while nobody even KNEW how to beat it, who would even bother?? dw would js lose its players 3. some people dont play the game for pure fun, some prefer grinding for loot. LH ensures safety while that is being done. 4. sometimes, going to L2 isnt necessarily to beat chaser, its for getting some minor talents, and if you had to waste that much time everytime you even went down to L2, then it'll get annoying for the players. i tried
@@NylonEpoxy Of course. But this is a whole level of difficulty. L2 is incredibly risky, and often buggy. A lag spike? Instant wipe. I know same goes for depths, but It’s not nearly guaranteed for you to wipe during it Unlike Layer 2. Also? Guess what? Unlike depths deaths that are not your fault, deaths in L2 are mostly non-restorable. Going hookless l2 everytime is torture, and would be the most boring thing ever for some, and an instant wipe to others. No one wins here. Making layer 2 THIS hard will make it unplayable to half the people. No one will even try and play it, unless you’re good at the game. I wont even bother bringing up the difficulty spike from depths mobs, where you safely log if you see anything bad (or run from it) and L2.
5:38 You can actually! There's a piece of equipment in game called the Winter Corps Parka, pretty common drop from Layer 2 chests. It gives you a talent that works similarly to Survivalist, where the parasites take longer to have an effect on you. I get your point though, it doesn't completely/heavily negate the parasites, but it is something you can obtain directly.
the problem is that item gives a very poor amount of health so you kind of brush by one problem and create another since you're going to be more squishy against high dmg mobs
last friday they added a new weapon, its obtainment coming from an npc in layer 2. talking to this npc will wipe you if you do not meet the requirements. the requirements are not mentioned or hinted at
The ignition union did make a portable lamp of sorts but only in lore, as the railblade is said to "Generate a warding heat that protects the wearer against the insidious chill of the Eternal Gale.", i still do hope one day we get stuff that acts as counters to the parasitic snow though
There's a reason for the Light Hook. Layer 2 was Deepwoken's first MAJOR content addition, a whole new dungeon with new monsters and 2 incredible boss fights, the update was hyped and awaited for a LOT. So to make it so that everyone could play this long awaited layer 2 they added the Light Hook in the purpose of letting everyone including less skilled players play the dungeon without risking anything, but gave it a timer and removed it during the Ethiron fight to make things still somewhat risky if you go too deep into it.
good point dont mind these weirdos when layer 2 released it reworked a TON of game mechanics and added so many different mobs and people had been perfecting builds for a long time that if they lost cuz of some bullshit from the game would be not so fun
The main problem with layer 2 is how badly Deepwoken's permadeath mechanic interacts with it This might be a controversial take but, personally, I feel like layer 2 would be a hundred times over better if light hook was kept permanently throughout the exploration parts of floor 1 and 2, but removed upon reaching bosses, because: 1. The main risk of wiping (atleast as a new player) comes from bosses anyways, the fact that the travelling sections of floor 2 can also get you wiped leads you to just use the quickest and safest route to the boss 2. Layer 2 actively discourages exploring, floor 2 is the biggest offender of this even though floor 2 has the most exploration to offer The literal start of floor 2 has a trap npc that when talked with spawns 3 lancers, the place is filled with trap rooms with enemies that are way too hardcore for people who've gone there for the first time, and on top of that there's also a timer that basically forces you to hurry up instead of explore the place Imagine you're playing layer 2 with a friend of yours who's new to Deepwoken, what would you prefer: Option A. Have only the risk of wiping at bosses (which is the main part that causes wiping anyway) but be able to mess around and explore all the trap rooms/npcs/easter eggs throughout layer 2 without a worry and ACTUALLY fight enemies to learn their attack pattern and secure loot next time youre actually ready to tackle on the boss(keep in mind this hypothetical idea would work just like floor 1, loot isnt kept until you beat the boss) Option B. Know that layer 2 will basically insta wipe you if you dont take the shortest route, so just go through the same boring motion telling your friend to just follow your lead without questioning else his character will get wiped (which is currently how layer 2 is played) ALSO PLEASE PLAY RANDOMLY GENERATED DROIDS 🦆
72 free attempts each day just to do layer 2 without wiping (yes you have to speedrun each floor for maximum rewards with light hook) Edit: 31 runs. Sheesh.
To be fair, I think Deepwoken, in general, sacrifices a lot just for the permadeath mechanic to work in an MMO. I'm not saying they should get rid of it entirely or anything, although I have my own hot take on that. There are just a lot of things Deepwoken either can’t do or requires a significant amount of balancing and tweaking to work that other games just don’t have to deal with. Like you can’t make bosses too difficult because you can’t do trial and error in a game where if you mess up you have to grind again for potentially hours just for one more chance to win, this ain’t Elden Ring. Progression must also be very quick to make it easier to start over from wiping and keep players away from mental exhaustion. This structure also limits exploration to how much it affects progression. If it doesn’t make progression faster, then people aren’t going to explore it, especially when their lives are at risk. As a result, people become more willing to forgo potentially fantastic experiences if it makes their progression easier. I could go on, but you’ve hit many of them on the head already. The more I think about it, the more I feel that Deepwoken is a pretty challenging game to develop for; there’s always a fine line you have to tread, or else you break the entire game, and each new addition has to be very methodical and meticulous in its approach just to work, not even be good, just to work.
Tbh I'm fine with the permadeath lol, I think they did some great things with it, but imo a big problem for my friends (and a bit for me) is the pvp, while my main gripe is just voidwalker my friends would love a pve version of deepwoken and tbh I would kinda too@@t3qnix110
8:22 I think this puzzle is intended for multiple people. Outside the library, there’s a mural that will light up when you use the obelisks. One person recons to the person in the maze how many times to press the obelisk, and you get through. Needless to say, this has its flaws. Especially us solo gamers without friends who live on playing video games for a living/don’t have as much time as us. We don’t have someone to tell us the code while we are in the library, thus are left with either taking too long and getting teleported back with a progress wipe, or make friends with the wiki.
@@hoovy_thepooter8489That was only from a way more recent update, if you didn’t have a voice chat you were screwed and even then no one would really understand how that library in the map would work anyway
In my opinion light hook is necessary to function the way it does now, except for the part where you have to wait for your light hook to give you 20 minutes of light hook in your next run.
Just found out you can craft the lantern in layer 2. Looks like the devs found your video! I haven't seen anyone else talking about it, but it is very very cool that it's in the game you.
I'm glazing this so hard. This is actually so peak. Eclipse cooked hard throughout the whole video Layer 2 has actually become such a mindless speedrun that the playerbase has gotten used to, mostly subconsciously, this video was such a good reminder of the problems everyone feels. Agamatsu also reacted to your vid on stream, I'd just like to bring up an idea he came up. Essentially the suggestion is to give lighthook a couple seconds to charge before it pulls you up. This way if a player's is low percent hp in a fight, they'd still be stressing as the lighthook is winding up. Maybe this would only apply in combat ctag, so players unfairly knocked by the gale into the void can still safely exit.
No way , eclipse is my god, his ideas already in the game, with the first weekly from the video upload, pls make more videos on deepwoken with suggestions to improve my davourite game. With best wishes, avarage deepwoken player
Completely agree with the ignition's drill, some of my friends that play the game don't have the confidence to even try chaser without a full squad. Leading to them not getting ANYTHING until they have backup, which can take WEEKS.
Layer 2 isn't bad, but they should add more content to it. Nowadays, Layer 2 is primarily a place for loot farming and doesn't offer much else to do. Here are my opinions on how to improve it: Quests: They should add more quests, such as speaking with an NPC and completing missions to receive a chest with a higher chance of rare drops. Additionally, some quests could involve tasks outside of Layer 2, like sending "X" item to "X" NPC in Layer 1, and as a reward, you get a talent card. Floor 1: In my opinion, Floor 1 should be a more open-world area with more quests, monsters, civilizations, etc. The idea of portable lamps is excellent. My suggestion is to have an open-world map to explore, with portable lamps that have a limited number of uses and need to be recharged at the Ignition Union base to use them again. As you mentioned, there should be a blacksmith in Firfire where you can craft certain armors. In my opinion, you should only be able to craft master armors at this blacksmith, since it's already easy to make them; you only need to be level 15 and have a storage slot with the necessary items or have the items in the bank. Floor 2: For Floor 2, they should remove the trap NPCs and provide more assistance to players entering this area, such as a quest like "Activate all the Lamps 0/5" when you enter Layer 2. In the library, your idea of making the code to pass through it random is a great idea that would make the game more enjoyable and immersive for non-speedrunners. In the city on Floor 2, they need to redesign it entirely, in my opinion. Currently, you can bypass the entire city and activate the lamps without fighting a single mob, which removes the challenge from Layer 2. This makes the only challenging parts the Scion Of Ethiron fight and the escape sequence. Sorry for some mistakes in my writing, im from Brazil and im learning English (Used Translator after making my text)
Would be cool but probably too ambitious because of the way the devs work. A neat way to expand Layer 2 floor 1 would be the gate thing you get near Diver Journal 3. In one of the first twitter posts for Layer 2, it says the divers finally found a shrine or something implying that divers mostly explored outside what we did possibly
I think it'd be cool if you could use the light hook and wouldn't run out until layer 2, but at the cost of nerfing your drops. This would be cool for newer players who might want to just have a fun replayable option in an otherwise punishing game, that they could attempt layer 1 at lower levels without as much penalty.
I think the main issue this game is not *perfect* or has some really huge cons is because devs took too much on them. They have to make lore, have to make lore events/bosses, have to expand the game following the same lore, have to think of PVP and not only PVE and some of the people right now would like a storymode for sure which might be even harder if not impossible to make. Plus the weekly updates are forcing them to make the least so they can do something bigger later.
I liked the idea of the Life Hook, as it prevented newcomers to just wipe out of curiosity.. However, I think it would have been better executed if it was a tool to "Explore" and do a research of the dungeon, and then, to be able to actually complete it, you would have to go in without it. Imagine like, if you go with the life hook, you can do your normal run but with no rewards, no chests. But you can figure How to complete the dungeon in a safe way. And then, after you have the mindset to do it, you will have to go in without the life hook; Chaser spawns and so does the chests and rewards idk, lemme know your thoughts lol
16:30, this mechanic wasn't really meant for keeping the loot if your light hook ran out. Its purpose was just another way to escape floor 1 if the player could not beat chaser (like you said) but entered layer 2 floor 1 through falling into the void in layer 1 of the depths while meeting these conditions: Power 3 and above, and 50% or more health. Entering layer 2 floor 1 through this method is also called "Hookless" because when you enter layer 2 floor 1 with this method, you dont have a light hook.
I really like the idea of firfire being a rest stop town. In many roguelike dungeon crawlers, this kind of feature exists at some point whether it be a shop or special event to reforge items, etc. Layer 2 is a dungeon-designed map. Making firfire have some cool unique npcs or unique features from the overworld would be great.
You know, if deepwoken had a single player option or even private servers I feel like I would have enjoyed the game more. I've always enjoyed single player and Co op games over pvp and deepwoken has things that really interest me, but I really don't like the pvp aspects of the game, all my interactions with other players basically boiled down to either they want to kill me or they don't want to interact whatsoever. I had about 2 interactions I would call good/fun with other players but they were pretty nice. I really wish they added a way to play single player, preferably separate from the mmo part so people can't use this as a way to Max out a character without needing to meet another player. I hope some other people think a single player deepwoken would be fun cause I genuinely would probably play more of the game, if I didn't feel the constant stress and fear of my progress being wiped by someone who played the game more and leveled more who just decided to choose me to pick on.
Experiencing deepwoken like my first time playing elden ring. Without any invaders, letting me explore the world and figure thing out for my self without any worries of someone just killing me with a meta build or something would be wonderful.
good points, though I do want to suggest the idea of (since there are peaceful beings in new kyrsa), maybe an underground society like the divers (hell could be ignition union) who have found a way to negate the time dilation, and have set up shop in the railways possibly. kinda like your firfire rework idea, but the place would serve to give a place to stay, craft armor and maybe do something with medallions, such as purchasing certain kyrsgarde armor blue prints n stuff. I think this is a good idea, though obviously flawed, it’d be a neat way to add more lore to floor 2 along with making it a bit more involved ( maybe the time dilation timer could be a non factor while inside or something). tldr: small refugee town inside of new kyrsa with sane npcs. great video as always, keep these up, they’re really entertaining to watch.
The light hook is awesome feature, I see your point but it helps people who have never gone into layer 2 start learning how to traverse it instead of not knowing where to go and dying to parasites
Honestly I just love the direction your content is going, a few years ago when I first started watching you it was only for the specific games you played at the time, I felt like the commentary you had on them was refreshing and taking a more critical approach was so nice to see. But even after all those years and finally coming back I feel like I can just watch your stuff for you, you’re very funny and that more critical analytical side aids in that as well. It’s funny laughing at how horrible some things are and how you actually try and help them become better, I hope you can continue to do what you do.
1:58 the lighthook released with layer 2 because that was a new environment with a couple of new mechanics. Before layer two, builds were completely based on luck, luck was even a stat. Imagine how frustrrating it would be if you wiped your "one in a million" build because the game bugged or didnt register you changing directions to avoid the wind and got flung anyways. This was a really good strategy to avoid an even bigger influx of restore tickets. Furthermore, light hooks having the timer means that the clueless playerbase couldn't bruteforce their way through layer two, making the content last longer. Also, an average layer 2 floor 1 (chaser fight) can be completed with like 5-10 min without tryharding as long as you know where to go, so the loop for those who didnt want to risk their builds would be to run floor 1 until you get a route fast enough that you can start exploring floor 2 while still having the lighthook. In the end, in order to make the game less risky, you need to take proper time inbetween runs (if you fail or bail out) I really like this, it solves oretty much every potential problem they could've had with layer two at launch
what i like but don't like at the same time about layer 2 is how it's just so linear it's a > b > c > boss | a > b > c > d > boss there little to no exploration to be done theres nothing to find other than a random monster or useless lore npc they really should just do a massive layer 2 expansion for the new conquest update making lighthook as a way to just leave whenever instead of a safety net like you said earlier i want to explore layer 2 but i know damn well that theres really nothing out there outside of the boss or floor 2 i want to explore it but im not trying to get infinite comboed by the snipers and wipe over that the only good monster they added to layer 2 is the bonekeeper everything else is just stat check
Honestly initially I thought the lighthook changes you made were odd, but considering all the other changes you made, i'm completely for basically everything in this video. This is an amazing take.
Great points! I can get to chaser in 5 minutes, that’s With killing the bounders, with killing the bonekeepers, for extra chest which are good. I really wanted more quest, more rivalry between the divers and the ignition union, seeing them fight down there over an abandoned settlement. Where you could choose a side to help to gain reputation and specific loot for each one, helping the ignition union would give you guns, ignition deepdelver etc, while the divers would give you black diver, and depths loot. I think that the light hook should be changed completely; instead make it possibly 30-45 minutes, to do quest, kill different bosses, help the ignition union or the divers, obtain special items to counter layer 2. And have multiple ways to go to floor two, having the ministry have a small camp, and people can choose to help them, I think it would be cool if you could choose only one to help, and expand their base but I have no clue how this would work with multiplayer so there’s that. Of course with all this make it so that the map is far bigger, in all directions. Floor two could stay a dungeon while floor one could be more like an exploration, this would come with new enemies, bosses, quest, items, secrets etc etc. I think it would be amazing if you had to do this to go to layer 3 forcing players to actually explore and do layer two before going to layer 3. It’s a lot, and definitely has a shit ton of flaws. I’m no game designer just what I think would be cool!
The reason the light hook exists was to pad the release. Imagine thousands of players wiping being oblivious to parasites, all the enemies, hell even the wind is dangerous. layer 2 is a puzzle structure learned piece by piece and it allowed people to do trial and error without wiping everytime they learn something new and having to get power 15 again
So glad to see you got into deepwoken on the brink of another huge update nearing, I hope with your input you make deepwoken more of a balance and greater experince.
16:40 I completely agree with this. I think a good change for this would be that using the deepdrill allows you to keep at the VERY LEAST 5 items (with the ignition union taking the rest since they are a generally "greedy" group). This would mean there would be an option for newer players to get valuable loot without having to confront a boss that will most likely wipe them, but there is still an incentive to kill chaser to obtain more. This would further mean that floor 1 doesn't become this "free loot zone" for experienced players who would be able to get to most chest spots without ever losing their light hook.
love the video eclipse, this laid back content were u criticise games from a game design stand point has really made me change the perspective from which i programme games and add new features
Yeah the fire thing is odd. Just as you I would like to see a developer’s reasoning for graceful flame not working in Layer 2. Not quite the same thing but we have functional lanterns. We have the Gale Wax puzzle which curiously enough, is lit with azure flames. We also have the name Firfire for the town on floor 1. Recently the name might sort of make sense since its where you can find a disciple of Pleetsky and there is a fiery heat emanating from there but that is about it. To sum it up, really odd that graceful flame doesn’t work here when as you mentioned, it should work a lot better in a snowy landscape with parasitic snow that is susceptible to heat as opposed to an ocean
They did something cool to Firfire, adding some legendary weapon, then again it is almost impossible to find without the wiki and causes you to instantly die if you manage to get to it without flamecharm and a specific outfit.
6:22 layer 2 eternal gale is also stuck in the cycle from new krsya and there's a piece of clothing to do that also its not that risky to do layer 2 without a hook (as long as you can beat chaser or only came for the exp) you can skip firfire carvens entrace after getting the hook
I’m surprised that as someone who really enjoys the world design you didn’t bring up the monsters. I’ve always been bothered by the lack of variety and quantity but the quality is still there I think. Take Scyphozia for instance, it feels a lot more lively in comparison and even got two new mobs but more practically one since the Brute and Broodlord are reskins of each other with different stats. Layer 1 has about 14 different enemies. A lot of these are also found in the surface(Crustaceous Rex and the two jellyfish) but this makes sense even if you think its lazy. These even have cool lore implications, like how are a bird and a spider in a deep sea? Layer 2 technically has 8 fightable monsters I think including Scion of Ethiron but Kyrsgarde variants make a majority of these and are more like another race like how elves are in fantasy stories outside of a gameplay perspective. Now we are left with the Diver Husk, Carbuncle, Bounder, and Bonekeeper. The Diver Husks and presumably Carbuncles too(emphasizing on this because idk why they exist outside Layer 2) can be grouped up into Gale Parasites. We are fighting the parasites with varying hosts eventually. So we get 3 unique types of mobs here, Bounder, Bonekeeper, and parasites. It feels oddly empty in Layer 2 which is supposed to be a whole new realm essentially. It is a dungeon that plays way more linearly than Layer 1 but in terms of size are probably relative and Layer 1 probably gets outsized if you include Layer 2 Floor 2. They’re not even talked about by npcs for some reason like Megalodaunts are and I think that is a missed opportunity. They’re almost as obscure as Primadon. Supposedly there was meant to be a crab monster thing from an Agamatsu video and that would’ve been cool to have. To sum it up, Layer 2 does not have a very interesting monster pool. Also, a bestiary would be a cool way to give monsters some spotlight. Could be implemented as a book series starting with archivist megalodaunt or whatever it was
I do really enjoy the “speedrunning,” as you say, of layer 2, but your suggestions would generally improve the experience as a whole. I’m most fond of your take on firfire, as I believe it is a land of missed opportunity for what it’s worth. Having an alien settlement said to be “foreign yet familiar,” a tagline which instantly attracted my interest towards firfire immediately disappointed me when I found out firfire’s purpose in layer 2, and how much more it could have been expanded on.
I believe the lighthook is designed to explore and learn the mechanics of l2. As you said once in your previous videos, Deepwoken is a trial and error game. Its what allowed you and many other players to learn the patterns of the Bonekeeper fight. Its what allowed players to learn how the parasites and the wind works.
When it comes to how the lighthook time recharge is calculated, i found it to be 2 minutes waiting before starting to recharge at a 1:1 rate. Although important to note is im pulling this from personal experience and I havent taken the time to extensively confirm this theory yet
Eclipse, i think that many of the points you have mentioned are being saved up for layer 3, for example, the firfire race might have left to layer 3 for some unknown reason maybe they saw pleeksty's potential for power and decided to join him and helped him ascend to godhood or some stuff while these firfire dudes that are in L2 have been uninformed of it, for example this is how it cojld have went: an exploration team of firfires went to explore l2 to the fullest or maybe go back to layer 1 (there are yurts (buildings looking like bubble houses) in a part of L1 possibly signifying firfire's influence) and while they were oit of the main area, pleeksty and the others left to L3. Upon coming back, the exploration group noticed everyone was missing and assumed that they just were the last of their kind. And so, we would get to see the firfire race in their fullest in L3, with some of the points you have mentioned such as armour/clothing, a blacksmith specifically for that equipment and whatever else there could be.
20:32 Hi Eclipse! So yes, I do agree with you on some standpoints. But I don’t agree with you on some as well, I agree with your thought of making it more involved; like perhaps making floor 1 (and maybe 2) randomly generated with extra loot in certain spots. That way it encourages exploration, however as for stuff like your lighthook proposals… to put it lightly they can go to hell and burn in a lake of boiling blood.
About the light hook. Perhaps i didn't properly understand what you were saying but its timer only goes to 10 minites if you use it as an item or die while holding it. Beating floor 1 and escaping it via the light hook spawned by klaris gives you a full 20 minute light hook on your next run no matter what. Anyway, overall thoughts on layer 2? Sort of wasted potential in some areas but what we got in the end is still great. Personally i dont just speedrun layer 2, I start exp farming there too whenever i hit level 15. Floor 1/2 and the fight against scion of ethiron seem like a joke to me and is just free exp to me nowadays. Funny how killing scion of ethiron used to give you only like 8 investment points ot something lmao.
fun fact on firfire , theres a hidden cliff and theres a kyrsgarde sitting beside a cliff , he will ask you to sit next to him and if you use the resting emote next to him he says speical stuff
Personally speaking, I agree on a lot of your points made in this video. Honestly at this point I just think that the Timeloop effect of Floor 2 is just there for the fun of it. As even if you do it without a guide, you can simply leave and rejoin which would reset the timer completely while also resetting the obelisks. However, I do find it infeasible for the Kyrsgardes in Floor 1 to have a blacksmith or a campfire. As cool as it would be, they're stated to be as peaceful, religious nomads. They don't really have a need for a blacksmith. And I doubt the nomadic Kyrsgardes actually have the resources to build a campfire immune to the "Eternal Gale", but that's just me tho.
hi eclipse first thing i want to say is thanks for the awsome video and since i dont usually leave long comments i wanted to leave my first one on an good channel but let's stop glazing so im a casual player of roblox and i got deepwoken becouse i saw youtubers play this game it seems fun so i got it what the first 2 hours told me was pain and still i realized im one of those player that cant play this type of game since i get really stressed over iniziating combat with another player and i tried pve as i played over 10 hour just doing the trial of 1 spoiler i died at sharko over 50 times i want to joke about this but i cant so i guess it's just skill issue in my part but still i want to continue to play and start over again (i dont know how to dash in the air too ;( ) so to finish i want to thank you becouse you enspired me to continue play this game as witouth you i would have stopped a long time ago P.S. i hope this dosent go in a ddos becouse now that i red it again it kinda is have a nice day!
personally i dont play deepwoken (mainly because im not a fan of getting wiped in games and i dont feel like spending money on it) but watching your videos on this game is super fun and i hope you make more
I agree with pretty much all of these takes although the one argument for the Light Hook take is a little contradictory, reason why they added the light hook is to prevent builds from being wiped quickly, due to the fact that they knew Layer 2 was a new area. Adding the factor of the lack in knowledge about the area when it first dropped. Layer 2 requires you to have a barely maxed account to explore which is not fun after spending 3-5 hours building a slot only (Unlike Floor 1 which you almost always gets exposed to) for you to wipe it in less than 10 minutes cause of parasites. To make things clear, this argument is only relevant to new players exploring Layer 2 without a guide or a guide depends on how you see it. I fully agree with how the Light Hook works as a safety net, it feels such a breeze going through Layer 2 thinking I wouldn't get wiped every-time I do Layer 2 which completely removes the cautious factor when doing a run as an experienced player. Maybe Klaris would feel the responsibility for your survival but maybe after finishing your first run, she would completely trust you to make things easier for her cause she knows that you can handle yourself. TLDR: Maybe I suggest making the Light Hook more of a recall or rescue rope, putting a timer until you get extracted and be completely vulnerable when using it than an invincibility shield.
Well yes, everything ur saying is mostly right, i do speedrun basically layer 2 whenever i want to, basically always use light hook and all of that, my fastest layer 2 run was actually 6 or 7 minutes or something and i did not have ANY agility mantras, since i was using silentheart, i managed to 2 cycle chaser once and theres a shit crap of one cycle chaser builds, i can, well, was ABLE to singlehandely solo wave 25 in the diluvian, wich is basically hellmode, and that pretty consistently! i have mixed opinions on pve stuff, like its actually somehow a bit fun to just be able to shred to giant waves of monsters alone, on the other hand, its really unrealistic that im able to kill like 6 bounders at once without even going below half hp and no dvm kit really! i didnt even have my build fully completed. one thing tough that makes this good is that you do not need people to play deepwoken, you do not need friends, if you have a good enough pve build you can do ANYTHING, well, almost anything lol! And if exploration would be more of a thing, i feel like there is WAY to little quests and WAY to little rewards for these, in my entire 400+ hours of playing deepwoken, i have done around 7 or 8 quests maybe, some quests even never, since there is just no point in them, if you need knowledge, you either do layer 2 or the diluvian mechanism, if you need lvls, you just farm in the depths and get max in like 2 hours, OR JUST GET MAX IN 1 HOUR IF YOU GET CARRIED IN DILUVIAN, (i got lvl 13 in half an hour in the diluvian and i did NOTHING, i did not even move a single finger!) if they was to make pve WAY harder and more exploration, i think something like companions or something like that would be good, since i basically always play solo, it does get a little lonely sometimes and yes, companions are just ai or something but it just makes the battle more fun, like humanoid people you can talk to and fight with, maybe if you have enough charisma you can even get the higher level people like maybe akira or klaris, at the end of the day this is just my point of view (from a basically ONLY solo player so if you have a different one i dont mind.
I can practically do L2 Hookless with my eyes closed, I even got Chain of Perfection from Chaser (took a jillion runs just due to the tiny ticks of blood damage when Chaser gets knocked, which gave me unnecessary amounts of experience in the dungeon). Honestly one of the biggest things I'd like to see is the non-required encounters being randomized. Like, for example, the static bounder spawn outside of the Ethironal Shrine Sanctuary. Just my two cents, good video as always
Layer 2 has a couple of unique equipment drops that cannot be obtained anywhere else (or are just VERY difficult to find anywhere else) 1. Chaser's Bloodforged Crown. A red crown with a blood-reducing talent that is SO rare barely anyone has held one. 2. Delver's Duster. A leather jacket from an Ignition Union Deepdelver. It's a mythical equipment you usually get in Ethiron or Chaser But i agree, Layer 2 needs some more love.
I really like everything you said and wished that’s what actually occurred. My first time in layer 2 I was too scared because I didn’t want to die and get wiped, from there forth I learned about the light hook and began just having fun and trying to beat chaser. I wish it was more on the side of explore and learn like east luminant and the other seas, because that’s where I had the most fun in deepwoken exploring and fighting random dudes with my friends.
With your videos, i feel like playing the game again, your ideas for the game are to be honest good, if i had to say one specific idea, it would be the Firfire one, the devs should hear you out
eclipse, there is a lore reason for why specific kyrsgarde aren't hostile, it's because the ones in the city are being controlled by ethiron, influencing their actions, that's why the ones in firfire village are friendly and so is the one outside the city, because they haven't gotten close to the city to be controlled.
17:27 Actually, since recent update THERE IS some secret quest in firfire. It even allows you get special weapon. But sadly it's more about dealing with Pleeksty, not with this race.
deepwoken is the most noob friendly game i have ever played in my life, I love how it tells you everything at the start and exactly what to do and not just "build a boat".
on the closing thoughts question, I'm one of those people that's realized how beautiful Eternal Gale looks and how infuriating it is to have Parasites act as a artificial and unnecessary timer that doesnt let me freely explore the layer even after completing it tenths of times over and over. I just hate the unneeded timers especially when they give us maps as extensive as these with no chance of fully appreciating the whole scope of the map-maker's vision. Also your Firfire idea is so good man
Tbh i was disappointed that Layer 2 turned out to be a dungeon instead of a completely new hub, a dungeon you have to complete under a time limit on top of that
about the parasite part, ive talked about the arc suit protecting against the parasites, as its a main point of the arc suit in lore as the flame req is too keep you warm in layer 2.
I think many games can learn from the foundation of Deepwoken, not the Perma death, but how the world feels lived in itself many games feel dry with the places (looking at you type:// soul, yba, aut. blox fruits, gpo). sometimes the feel of the game is much more important than the gameplay. I don't know how you all feel about it, but I like it when my game has a story, tales of others who walked the same path making you feel like just another part of the larger world you live in, unlike the chosen hero. well, this is my little rant I wish that more games made esthetic and worlds as immersive as deep visual, and gameplay-wise. the game is not perfect but with polish and fresh ideas it sure as hell can be.
Good news about the firfire section, they did indeed add something to firefire which is a miniboss that drops the new legendary weapon they added like 3 days ago. What an amazing start, just ignore the fact that to fight this boss you must have a bell, have no light hook and when speaking to the npc you must have specific stat requirements or else he just insta kills you.
Beside those problems listed above by eclipse, I think Layer 2 also got a very, gnarly issue , and it is optimization. Your FPS could drop from 25 to 1.4-7 extremely quickly whenever stalactites fall, and guess what, one of Chaser's attack is the stalactites. It also randomly drops time to time, or drop when the winds are blowing. Back to Chaser, when he enters phase two, he collapse the ceiling, yeah? That'll be an automatic lost for those without strong computer as their FPS could drop too low that even blocking is impossible -> Get hit by Stalactites. Random FPS drops also stop the players from even reaching Chaser to attack him during his stun if it occurs, which is frustrating. The developers really blocked getting A/S/W Rank behind optimization, it's impossible to get those if you don't got a 1500$ Setup. Yes, those are from my own experiences also: *Those FPS drops still occur while I got roblox on 144p graphic along with disabling shadows, using Voxel lighting technology, no anti aliasing , Texture Quality 0, 0 Quality, and of course it still happens. And that's rather strange considering I could run TF2, Deepwoken Overworld and depths without all those setting listed in "*", Terraria, etc.... But Deepwoken layer 2 just, straight up unplayable for me, Low Graphic setting don't help either and Ping Compensation does nothing for low FPS. Well , eclipse I hope you'd say something about this problem too, the game need more optimization I can't lie.
I agree with most things in this video heres somethings that I personally think that they should change/improve 1. Lighthook should not expire until you get into floor two, then it breaks (as stated in the video) 2. Firfire is a massive waste of opportunity, it would be nice if we could have more quest and more character development 3. Chaser bossfight, chaser is an off-brand enderdragon, it would be nice if they changed the boss fight to make it more unique 4. Ethiron buff, I know that for new players, ethiron can be hard, however, for already experienced players ethiron should be harder. I think they should make it so the first time you get into the ethiron fight it stays the same, but after like 2 times beating ethiron then ethiron should be buffed.
Personally I prefer the speed running route through layer 2 now since I’ve done it over 100 times and atp it becomes really tedious trying to farm loot or get medallions, although the new secret passage to floor 2 and double chest weekends have helped with this. However I also do really enjoy first time exploration of places and going in blind but only for a little while before it’s actually gets tedious. I think it would be worthwhile to have a system in place for layer 2 and future dungeons where if it’s new to you and it’s your first time, the risks of wiping your character should be reduced or maybe just removed for the first few runs. And maybe for future dungeons when they drop there can be a week grace period of no wiping to allow blind exploration without requiring a guide
Hey Eclipse, just wanted to say regarding the loot section that most people when making pve build do not look at the talents, I saw how you brought up the immortal helm with indeed is very good but with a pve build people mainly focus on the actual stats and not the given talent. Although you may be correct that the loot between layers is not good, there is still very good items when it comes to how you dress in deepwoken, which is a whole other area of fun for people to dress up and cosplay.
As a speed runner for layer 2 I think that having more interactions would be great, there’s just no point in going out of your way to kill mobs for mediocre chests and doing a galewax to get a horrible enchant stone, I think they should make a reason for people to kill mobs or do something in layer 2 except for just doing bonekeeper and immediately getting to chaser. I think floor 2 was designed perfectly tho to speed run you have to have advanced strategies and there’s a reason to kill things and to get medallions.
I'd like to mention that with the layer 2 instakills, they actually did add a new one in which you must go to a specific spot at a cave near the town in floor 1 (which you can easily fall off into the deathpit below at) and go through doors that dont open unless you went down with no light hook, and you are then burnt to death and wiped if you do not meet multiple requirements when talking to an NPC to obtain a new weapon
Eclipse, when u say L2 is like a speedrunning place, i remember that in the last update made Wind Passage cant clip through walls. Afterwards, they made it clippable by saying "Making Wind Passage clippable through walls for speedrunning".
There is also a fourth trap in layer 2, in New Kyrsa you can enter in a building that once you get in, will lock most (except one) of its doors and spawn a lot of kyrs mobs so you can have so much fun
The drill IMO makes sense, in the depths if you fall in the void instead of an instant wipe.You are granted a chance to escape through the drill. The reason why don’t keep anything is that you are meant to beat the boss chaser. What would end up happening is people would just farm the mudskipper npcs and do the wax and leave through the drill without risking fighting chaser.
While i agree with some of your takes, such as nerfing the light hook and forcing players to activate it in order to get saved (which i believe shouldn't be applied to fall related things, cuz Klaris's the one keeping an eye on you in that case), i also disagree with some others. While being an hard area, the layer 2 is not supposed to be the final one (they're planning on making other 7 layers), and a mechanic such as the light hook would both spare most players' time by not making they wipe their builds to minor issues, such as the wind, along with allowing them to explore the second part of it after having mastered the first one, which's loot is highly inferior to other farming places (such as the diluvian mechanism). Then, secondly, about the timer, I agree with it being annoying, but after having mastered floor 1 and having become able to deal against it in less than 10 minutes, players will be able to utilize part of their light hook to expand their knowledge regarding this riskier part, but, while the loss of character should be expected due to it being an hard game, i partially agree with you on it being a section of the game people will most likely have trouble dealing with in game, and instead, recurring to youtube guides, which i agree on not being an advantage for a game seen from an objective point of view. Don't really find the need to fix it, but i'd definitely add some way to either expand your time (such as clearing it once the next layers comes out, or by donating either knowledge or medallions respectively to miserables(goat npc you'll find in said place) or klaris) or, if not there, some npc to give you better advice on what to actually do and where to. On the npc traps section, idk tbh, but if i'm not wrong, while not being clearly stated, the kyrsgarde agressiveness in the deeper floor is hinted by floor 1 npcs, also being racist in some scenarios. Also, once you get to know it, you'll have an easier time browsing around it and discovering everything you want, 45 minutes are def enough, you could also repeat it in case of having the fear of having missed something. On the loot section, i agree on adding more unique loot (despite you not having adressed the unique drops from chaser, such as his weapon and crown, along with other items which result into being turned into mantras with the help of dr carrion, npc which you can find in the deeper floor), with it's stats not outclassing other harder dungeons' one, such as the diluvian mechanism, and that's to make it an actual place worth exploring which won't be totally outclassed in terms of lootpool by other current and future areas, due to it having unique items which may improve someone's drip up to their likings. About firfire, i think it serves it's purpose, with it hinting some things about lore along while still holding other secrets that you've not yet explored (Pleeksty's calling you Eclipse), plus, it's just a settlement. This was my take on yours, also, regarding the "Undying flame" talent if that's it's name, i believe it doesn't work there due to the wind's strength, which is Ethiron's main power, but still, if not changed in future layers, i'd rather have a quest strengthening your mantra than having to pick another talent as those are really expensive for actual good builds. Keep up the content.
Layer 2 is by far the best part of deepwoken and also the reason why i got into it in the first place. An amazing atmosphere , fantastic music (especially the one when you are in danger) and that dreaded feeling that you can lose everything you worked on. It's an amazing dungeon.. the first time you get on it , after that it's just quite boring , same path and , as you mentioned, because of the timer you have to hurry if you want to have a no risk route with a light hook. It's normal for dungeons to get boring especially if you are only doing it for loot so that's not really a problem for me. However I do agree that the loot is extremely disappointing , but the weapons that were made specifically for the layers are very well designed and are good end game weapons. I do wish the chests were filled with less stuff , but the items from the chests would be items that are ONLY OBTAINABLE from LAYER 2. Not from layer 1 (overworld) , except for maybe deep gems and relics. Floor 2 of layer 2 is the most stressful experience i've had in the game by far and it wasn't a fun one either. The atmosphere and etc are amazing again! However it pisses me off that we are on a timer and are not really allowed to explore the place. Even after you get all the obelisks (or whatever they are called) and the timer halts , you still can't really explore it without getting attacked by a million spears that deal A LOT of damage (if you are not on a pve build and even if you are on an average pve build), enemies that basically are unavoidable because they activate from 20 million studs away , even if you are hidden. While I was learning layer 2 F2 (with a guide for the path atleast) it was frustrating to die and having to get another power 20 build just to try again (mostly getting power 20 part is annoying because leveling up in this game is so boring). But now that I can beat ethiron and enjoy the dungeon just a little bit more , it's actually quite relaxing to explore for whatever reason , maybe because of the relaxing yet chilling music that is Kyrie. Now Ethiron is an okay boss , it's not too difficult and it's easy once you get a hang of it. But in all honesty it's not the boss that is hard , it's the fact that if you fail , you die and you have to repeat everything and that stress (yes i get stressful over a roblox game) does get to you and you fail to parry and everything and you die in the end , so my advice to people who have the same issue is to be in a call with someone and talk about random stuff or listen to some upbeat music , it helps. Learning layer 2 was overall annoying as a solo player but the feeling once you actually beat ethiron , get the loot and get out of there is amazing on the first try. The experience was great tho and i did learn more about build making because of the many failed attempts i had (skill issue). If you are gonna play deepwoken to try out layer 2, just be wary of the many timers it has , just like the video said , they're annoying (also light hook is obtainable at around power 15-16 not sure!)
20:22 at the end of the day, the goal for entering layer 2 is to get loot/xp and to get out. so if in the case that they do make layer 2 more exploration based and methodical, people would still just blaze through the entire thing to get the loot as fast as possible instead of slowing down. that's just what i think though
As someone whose played deepwoken since launch seeing layer 2 for the first time was cool, scary and fresh. Keyword being “first” as once you know where things are and what do to it just turns into a checklist. I do think the fault of it being a dungeon rather than an open world makes it this way and I pray for the day layer 2 gets some kind of rework to make it more exciting than a glorified speedrun every time .
Me and my frends were one of those few psycos who did layer 2 without a guide, and let me say, that experiece was magical seing all this new stuff, actually talking to the NPC's failing with light hook and having to try over and ofer again loosing our shit when we finally beat chaser, and floor 2 was equaly magic (even the kyrsan kill). But yea as time went on it became more of a speedrun, not even for loot but just for money and it really lost it's magic.
![A Noobs Perspective in Roblox Deepwoken [PART 1]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/10SeLDZ6wRE/mqdefault.jpg)
![A Noobs Perspective in Roblox Deepwoken [PART 1]](/img/tr.png)
![งมหอย จับปลา มือเปล่า หาอยู่หากินแบบวีถีอีสานกับแก๊งเซียนหรั่ง ม่วนคัก! [ขอนแก่น] @Sianstudio](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/JEJZg6N-AbU/mqdefault.jpg)
Arch actually did give a reason for why you can’t use graceful flame, that also explains why the portable lantern doesn’t exist yet. He said that it’s because the light from the flame and/or the lantern will call the 8 snowman’s, which would instantly eat your light hook and wipe you.
tf is the 8 snowman’s ima a day one and don’t know
@@fedydespooky7025bros bowl is cooked
Darn those 8 snowmans!!
@@mrbrownlol3637 bruh yall trollin💀
@fedydespooky7025 basically in his playthrougj of blox fruits he got to the winter island or Smith and the quest said "kill 8 snowmans" and proceeded to shit on it
You basically hit ever complaint I had about layer 2 on the head. Too bad the devs are too busy working on league of legends.
Hopefully layer 3 will be more of what people want when it comes out in 3 years.
League of legends update better be packed or ima be mad 😡😡😡
Cant believe archmage got hired by riot games
@@trucoteca1924wait fr?
I was so disappointed when they said conquest is gonna you making your current build again. Half the fun of league is the build crafting. I'm playing the casual freshie version instead, ranked is cheeks.
@@ultimateking88 no
eclipse officially has a deepwoken addiction
The deep is calling… it’s calling… I can’t stop playing… the deep… the deep… the deep! Must play Deepwoken… must gank freshies! Must play chime of conflict!
Skibidi rizzler mogged
@@codenameloser8488 I read this in ikit claw's voice and i have no regrets
Cant wait for someone to ignore "I dont mean that layer 2 is bad", shit in comments, end up in DDOS and continue complaining 😔🙏
lol deadass though
It’s a canon Eclipse event. It happens in every video. If you break the canon, it all falls apart
layer 2 is lowkey...bad though...
this aged poorly lmao
Consider doing oaths as stories. Some oaths obtainment have crazy lore and adventure. Please try getting them
eclipse please notice this person 🙏🙏
This is actually a good idea for all oaths expect oathless,jetstriker and dawnwalker cuz we seen that already.
Silentheart bout be go crazy
I love the crazy adventure of “find me 5 void feathers” or the incredibly immersive “kill 5 guys with other oaths Ty”
So peak…
@@Yes-xj6ifnotice the word some
Layer 2 not only is it just something i speedrun without thinking about it, it's also losing its value more and more. It used to be the best way to get loot, but now that the Diluvian mechanism exists, there really isn't a point in doing floor 2 apart from getting dawnwalker/a couple dye packets. As for floor 1, chaser is now pretty much useless, and there really isn't a need to get the deepshore fossil now that Maestro can just drop any enchant stone you could possibly want, as well as more legendary weapons than even Ethiron.
Also eclipse I wanted to ask you: have you ever worked on non jojo games before ? you make really good suggestions and remarks all the time and i was wondering if it comes from experience
I have never worked directly in game design, but that's extremely high praise for an industry noobie like myself lmao, thank you
@@EclipseGameplaysOn the idea of special layer 2 armor, instead of just getting one either op talent for your build or one that is shit, you should get no talent, but in return you get like 2x the durability of a master armor and way more armor against stuff in general (Don’t dunk on me I’ve gotten to 19 as my highest power and some random guy was so sorry for m1ing me once he basically gave me everything for black diver)
@@Lunarinzo thats pretty much just black diver armor
@@50gritsandpaper1 Fair but black diver should have a talent where your willpower scaling is 2x more, so say you have 40 willpower, you’ll have the sanity of 80 willpower, 100 would equal 200 (idk if this should work on lft)
I’ve seen people talk to devs about the Maestro & Diluvian loot problem. Hopefully Maestro gets the rates on enchant stones dropped and cbow & crypt no longer drop.
eclipse is evolving he says glazing now
the deep got into him, now he's learning
Your (ECLIPSE) is evolving!!!!
Your (ECLIPSE) has evolved into (GRIFFITH!!1!!!)
@@johannawilliams1039wait- hold on, how do i undo?!? B button, B BUTTON!!!!!
@johannawilliams1039 Shit! Go back go back go back!
@@johannawilliams1039OH HELL NAW
11:32 Lorewise, there is a diver in floor 1 that asks you to save her by completing the entirety of layer 2. However, she is being controlled and that trap there is meant to kill you for attempting to save her.
She's not being controlled that's just straight up Ethiron lying to you.
WHAT DO YOU MEAN LOREWISE, YOU ENCOUTER IT IN THE ACTUAL GAME, IT'S IN THE GAMEPLAY, THERE'S NO DIVIDE, IT'S RIGHT THERE, IT'S NOT LOCKED TO SOME 5 DOLLAR BOOK BOUGHT FROM WISH
@@historicflame972what??
@@historicflame972dude are you on crack cocaine
@@historicflame972 Most sane and calm Deepwoken player
There's no way bro went from yba, through reviewing roblox games, to getting addicted to deepwoken while the game is dry asf. It's really fun watching how your gameplay improved from your deepwoken review, to actually doing l2.
edit: Alright y'all are right, eclipse is probably at a point where the game still seems exciting to him, unlike many people. My main problem with the game is that the balancing team seems to be non-existent, and flamecharm is heavily prioritized by the devs for some reason
deepwoken ain't even dry but aight
@@oggaraggairoaawfauhaiu31_UN when u have like 3000 hours then it is, im just so thirsty for conquest along with the overworld addons to it
deepwoken isnt dry its just we have done everything
To be completely fair, the game is only dry for us long time players because we've played it for so long
deepwoken is not dry at all.
but obviously the lake will be empty if you play/drink for 2000 hours.
every single game in existence would have that problem dude
Hard agree on not being usable in combat, however I have to disagree with manually using it in terms of being flung off the map. There are many instances where bugs, ping, etc can lead to going off the map. Would suck to wipe to that, wouldn't feel "oh thats my fault i wiped" it would be "wow thats like 4 hours of my life grinding this build wasted."
Just make it so if you die in combat in L2 the Light Hook wont save you, but it saves you from parasites and falling off the map. This is also better for players who are first going into Layer 2, who wouldn't know about parasites and falling off the map is inconsistent sometimes where there is and isnt floor. Meanwhile any player going into Layer 2 would understand dying to a Bonekeeper and any other mob, is, well, dying.
not even 4 hours,
for most normal people a build could take days to make lol
Just make it same rules as falling into Layer 2. Above half hp you live below you die.
What happens if a bounder flings you off the edge?
But the Bonekeeper isn't fightable anywhere else except for the 20+ drown depths trial. If only for the exclusive enemies that would make you wipe every damn time you die because you haven't had a chance to learn them, Lighthook would become exponentially less useful and making layer 2 much more annoying to get into
@@dominicballinger6536 probably the only solution is to make it lighthook will work as usual before u beat chaser and reported to Claris for the first time, and then the light hook will be weaken so it doesnt work in combat or some changes. they could probably rework how light hook work lorewise
Eclipse has now fell into the trap of deepwoken
he stuck in the depths
The Deep calls him.
Eclipse should become a tester tbh, like i really love the blacksmith idea and the portable lantern, like parasites arent even a problem at this point you will use the respite lantern anyways, keep it up eclipse gl with deep
he should NOT bro he yaps about light hook being bad yet its good it makes sense
@@justtyler1092 In fact, the only thing I don't agree with here was the light hook, but it really has a lot of very nice ideas
there are reasons to lighthook, eclipse (do not include me in DDOS)
1. if it would be risky then nobody would even do l2
2. back in the day, when verse 2 came out l2 came out too, and that was the most anticipated update in deepwoken, that overhauled everything. if it were to be this difficult, while nobody even KNEW how to beat it, who would even bother?? dw would js lose its players
3. some people dont play the game for pure fun, some prefer grinding for loot. LH ensures safety while that is being done.
4. sometimes, going to L2 isnt necessarily to beat chaser, its for getting some minor talents, and if you had to waste that much time everytime you even went down to L2, then it'll get annoying for the players.
i tried
Deepwoken is a difficult game with permanent character loss, losing characters is a part of the game that should be expected.
can we just like this so that dude can get on DDOS and the comment above me is shown
@@NylonEpoxy Of course. But this is a whole level of difficulty. L2 is incredibly risky, and often buggy. A lag spike? Instant wipe. I know same goes for depths, but It’s not nearly guaranteed for you to wipe during it Unlike Layer 2. Also? Guess what? Unlike depths deaths that are not your fault, deaths in L2 are mostly non-restorable. Going hookless l2 everytime is torture, and would be the most boring thing ever for some, and an instant wipe to others. No one wins here. Making layer 2 THIS hard will make it unplayable to half the people. No one will even try and play it, unless you’re good at the game. I wont even bother bringing up the difficulty spike from depths mobs, where you safely log if you see anything bad (or run from it) and L2.
You saying to not include you on DDOS will probably be the very thing that gets you on DDOS...
He brings up some pretty fair points so I don't think that he necessarily belongs in an entire separate video that's borderline calling him retarded 😭
5:38 You can actually! There's a piece of equipment in game called the Winter Corps Parka, pretty common drop from Layer 2 chests. It gives you a talent that works similarly to Survivalist, where the parasites take longer to have an effect on you. I get your point though, it doesn't completely/heavily negate the parasites, but it is something you can obtain directly.
the problem is that item gives a very poor amount of health so you kind of brush by one problem and create another since you're going to be more squishy against high dmg mobs
@@suopd true, you can always switch it out while you're not in combat though. I think it's a fair compromise for 10 - 20HP
@@thehexofficial you can't switch equipment in layer 2
@@Reeeas You can? I think you're getting confused with not being able to equip things you've found until you exit the dungeon
yeah but what kinda sucks is that you can also get it from crypt of unbroken, which proves his point about no special layer 2 exclusive loot
last friday they added a new weapon, its obtainment coming from an npc in layer 2. talking to this npc will wipe you if you do not meet the requirements. the requirements are not mentioned or hinted at
They never learn LMAO
Like, WHO THINKS OF THIS SHIT?
its supposed to be secret bro. obviously there wont be hints. was there hints about the deep angels cave? no.
@@navuwatr it's not a secret dumbass, Google exists
@@navuwatr it would be a mid secret but the fact you get wiped for requirements you dont know unless you google it makes it total dog shit dude
never played deepwoken but plan to and these videos are making me want it more
you should!, its one of the only really really good games on roblox
dont
Don't play this atrocious dogshit
Go for it
just a heads up the beginner stage is a nightmare
The ignition union did make a portable lamp of sorts but only in lore, as the railblade is said to "Generate a warding heat that protects the wearer against the insidious chill of the Eternal Gale.", i still do hope one day we get stuff that acts as counters to the parasitic snow though
Captain Rex
There's a reason for the Light Hook. Layer 2 was Deepwoken's first MAJOR content addition, a whole new dungeon with new monsters and 2 incredible boss fights, the update was hyped and awaited for a LOT. So to make it so that everyone could play this long awaited layer 2 they added the Light Hook in the purpose of letting everyone including less skilled players play the dungeon without risking anything, but gave it a timer and removed it during the Ethiron fight to make things still somewhat risky if you go too deep into it.
did you watched the video before typing this?
You didn't even watch his vid before typing that did you
this has the possibility of getting on DDoS
good point dont mind these weirdos when layer 2 released it reworked a TON of game mechanics and added so many different mobs and people had been perfecting builds for a long time that if they lost cuz of some bullshit from the game would be not so fun
@@TotallyEvervin
Did you even watch the video either 😀
another deep vidoe! thanks eclipse.
The main problem with layer 2 is how badly Deepwoken's permadeath mechanic interacts with it
This might be a controversial take but, personally, I feel like layer 2 would be a hundred times over better if light hook was kept permanently throughout the exploration parts of floor 1 and 2, but removed upon reaching bosses, because:
1. The main risk of wiping (atleast as a new player) comes from bosses anyways, the fact that the travelling sections of floor 2 can also get you wiped leads you to just use the quickest and safest route to the boss
2. Layer 2 actively discourages exploring, floor 2 is the biggest offender of this even though floor 2 has the most exploration to offer
The literal start of floor 2 has a trap npc that when talked with spawns 3 lancers, the place is filled with trap rooms with enemies that are way too hardcore for people who've gone there for the first time, and on top of that there's also a timer that basically forces you to hurry up instead of explore the place
Imagine you're playing layer 2 with a friend of yours who's new to Deepwoken, what would you prefer:
Option A. Have only the risk of wiping at bosses (which is the main part that causes wiping anyway) but be able to mess around and explore all the trap rooms/npcs/easter eggs throughout layer 2 without a worry and ACTUALLY fight enemies to learn their attack pattern and secure loot next time youre actually ready to tackle on the boss(keep in mind this hypothetical idea would work just like floor 1, loot isnt kept until you beat the boss)
Option B. Know that layer 2 will basically insta wipe you if you dont take the shortest route, so just go through the same boring motion telling your friend to just follow your lead without questioning else his character will get wiped (which is currently how layer 2 is played)
ALSO PLEASE PLAY RANDOMLY GENERATED DROIDS 🦆
72 free attempts each day just to do layer 2 without wiping (yes you have to speedrun each floor for maximum rewards with light hook)
Edit: 31 runs. Sheesh.
To be fair, I think Deepwoken, in general, sacrifices a lot just for the permadeath mechanic to work in an MMO. I'm not saying they should get rid of it entirely or anything, although I have my own hot take on that. There are just a lot of things Deepwoken either can’t do or requires a significant amount of balancing and tweaking to work that other games just don’t have to deal with. Like you can’t make bosses too difficult because you can’t do trial and error in a game where if you mess up you have to grind again for potentially hours just for one more chance to win, this ain’t Elden Ring. Progression must also be very quick to make it easier to start over from wiping and keep players away from mental exhaustion. This structure also limits exploration to how much it affects progression. If it doesn’t make progression faster, then people aren’t going to explore it, especially when their lives are at risk. As a result, people become more willing to forgo potentially fantastic experiences if it makes their progression easier. I could go on, but you’ve hit many of them on the head already. The more I think about it, the more I feel that Deepwoken is a pretty challenging game to develop for; there’s always a fine line you have to tread, or else you break the entire game, and each new addition has to be very methodical and meticulous in its approach just to work, not even be good, just to work.
Randomly generated droids is mid
Tbh I'm fine with the permadeath lol, I think they did some great things with it, but imo a big problem for my friends (and a bit for me) is the pvp, while my main gripe is just voidwalker my friends would love a pve version of deepwoken and tbh I would kinda too@@t3qnix110
I ain’t reading allat
your firfire idea is BRILLIANT
only the blacksmith]
8:22 I think this puzzle is intended for multiple people. Outside the library, there’s a mural that will light up when you use the obelisks. One person recons to the person in the maze how many times to press the obelisk, and you get through.
Needless to say, this has its flaws. Especially us solo gamers without friends who live on playing video games for a living/don’t have as much time as us. We don’t have someone to tell us the code while we are in the library, thus are left with either taking too long and getting teleported back with a progress wipe, or make friends with the wiki.
and what if someone doesn’t have vc?
@@Ben_E2 your messages are broadcast to everyone in dungeons
@@hoovy_thepooter8489That was only from a way more recent update, if you didn’t have a voice chat you were screwed and even then no one would really understand how that library in the map would work anyway
In my opinion light hook is necessary to function the way it does now, except for the part where you have to wait for your light hook to give you 20 minutes of light hook in your next run.
Just found out you can craft the lantern in layer 2. Looks like the devs found your video!
I haven't seen anyone else talking about it, but it is very very cool that it's in the game you.
I'm glazing this so hard. This is actually so peak. Eclipse cooked hard throughout the whole video
Layer 2 has actually become such a mindless speedrun that the playerbase has gotten used to, mostly subconsciously, this video was such a good reminder of the problems everyone feels.
Agamatsu also reacted to your vid on stream, I'd just like to bring up an idea he came up. Essentially the suggestion is to give lighthook a couple seconds to charge before it pulls you up. This way if a player's is low percent hp in a fight, they'd still be stressing as the lighthook is winding up.
Maybe this would only apply in combat ctag, so players unfairly knocked by the gale into the void can still safely exit.
No way , eclipse is my god, his ideas already in the game, with the first weekly from the video upload, pls make more videos on deepwoken with suggestions to improve my davourite game. With best wishes, avarage deepwoken player
Why would we want to go into layer2 and risk instantly dying?
The light hook is good, I'm a PVP build, you want me to fight chaser with a dagger?
Completely agree with the ignition's drill, some of my friends that play the game don't have the confidence to even try chaser without a full squad. Leading to them not getting ANYTHING until they have backup, which can take WEEKS.
No way the just added portable lamps in layer 2 right after this video 💀
Layer 2 isn't bad, but they should add more content to it. Nowadays, Layer 2 is primarily a place for loot farming and doesn't offer much else to do. Here are my opinions on how to improve it:
Quests:
They should add more quests, such as speaking with an NPC and completing missions to receive a chest with a higher chance of rare drops. Additionally, some quests could involve tasks outside of Layer 2, like sending "X" item to "X" NPC in Layer 1, and as a reward, you get a talent card.
Floor 1:
In my opinion, Floor 1 should be a more open-world area with more quests, monsters, civilizations, etc.
The idea of portable lamps is excellent. My suggestion is to have an open-world map to explore, with portable lamps that have a limited number of uses and need to be recharged at the Ignition Union base to use them again.
As you mentioned, there should be a blacksmith in Firfire where you can craft certain armors. In my opinion, you should only be able to craft master armors at this blacksmith, since it's already easy to make them; you only need to be level 15 and have a storage slot with the necessary items or have the items in the bank.
Floor 2:
For Floor 2, they should remove the trap NPCs and provide more assistance to players entering this area, such as a quest like "Activate all the Lamps 0/5" when you enter Layer 2.
In the library, your idea of making the code to pass through it random is a great idea that would make the game more enjoyable and immersive for non-speedrunners.
In the city on Floor 2, they need to redesign it entirely, in my opinion. Currently, you can bypass the entire city and activate the lamps without fighting a single mob, which removes the challenge from Layer 2. This makes the only challenging parts the Scion Of Ethiron fight and the escape sequence.
Sorry for some mistakes in my writing, im from Brazil and im learning English (Used Translator after making my text)
Would be cool but probably too ambitious because of the way the devs work. A neat way to expand Layer 2 floor 1 would be the gate thing you get near Diver Journal 3. In one of the first twitter posts for Layer 2, it says the divers finally found a shrine or something implying that divers mostly explored outside what we did possibly
I think it'd be cool if you could use the light hook and wouldn't run out until layer 2, but at the cost of nerfing your drops. This would be cool for newer players who might want to just have a fun replayable option in an otherwise punishing game, that they could attempt layer 1 at lower levels without as much penalty.
layer 2 is flashy but is lacking a lot of things. Like a golden bowl without anything inside of it.
I think the main issue this game is not *perfect* or has some really huge cons is because devs took too much on them. They have to make lore, have to make lore events/bosses, have to expand the game following the same lore, have to think of PVP and not only PVE and some of the people right now would like a storymode for sure which might be even harder if not impossible to make. Plus the weekly updates are forcing them to make the least so they can do something bigger later.
I liked the idea of the Life Hook, as it prevented newcomers to just wipe out of curiosity.. However, I think it would have been better executed if it was a tool to "Explore" and do a research of the dungeon, and then, to be able to actually complete it, you would have to go in without it.
Imagine like, if you go with the life hook, you can do your normal run but with no rewards, no chests. But you can figure How to complete the dungeon in a safe way.
And then, after you have the mindset to do it, you will have to go in without the life hook; Chaser spawns and so does the chests and rewards
idk, lemme know your thoughts lol
16:30, this mechanic wasn't really meant for keeping the loot if your light hook ran out. Its purpose was just another way to escape floor 1 if the player could not beat chaser (like you said) but entered layer 2 floor 1 through falling into the void in layer 1 of the depths while meeting these conditions: Power 3 and above, and 50% or more health. Entering layer 2 floor 1 through this method is also called "Hookless" because when you enter layer 2 floor 1 with this method, you dont have a light hook.
I really like the idea of firfire being a rest stop town. In many roguelike dungeon crawlers, this kind of feature exists at some point whether it be a shop or special event to reforge items, etc. Layer 2 is a dungeon-designed map. Making firfire have some cool unique npcs or unique features from the overworld would be great.
Even if I haven't watched the video, Eclipse is really reaching a peak right now!
You know, if deepwoken had a single player option or even private servers I feel like I would have enjoyed the game more. I've always enjoyed single player and Co op games over pvp and deepwoken has things that really interest me, but I really don't like the pvp aspects of the game, all my interactions with other players basically boiled down to either they want to kill me or they don't want to interact whatsoever. I had about 2 interactions I would call good/fun with other players but they were pretty nice. I really wish they added a way to play single player, preferably separate from the mmo part so people can't use this as a way to Max out a character without needing to meet another player.
I hope some other people think a single player deepwoken would be fun cause I genuinely would probably play more of the game, if I didn't feel the constant stress and fear of my progress being wiped by someone who played the game more and leveled more who just decided to choose me to pick on.
Experiencing deepwoken like my first time playing elden ring. Without any invaders, letting me explore the world and figure thing out for my self without any worries of someone just killing me with a meta build or something would be wonderful.
no
no.
@@thebloodynine5665 care to elaborate ?
Try deepbound, its mostly jolly cooperation against stronger enemies
good points, though I do want to suggest the idea of (since there are peaceful beings in new kyrsa), maybe an underground society like the divers (hell could be ignition union) who have found a way to negate the time dilation, and have set up shop in the railways possibly. kinda like your firfire rework idea, but the place would serve to give a place to stay, craft armor and maybe do something with medallions, such as purchasing certain kyrsgarde armor blue prints n stuff.
I think this is a good idea, though obviously flawed, it’d be a neat way to add more lore to floor 2 along with making it a bit more involved ( maybe the time dilation timer could be a non factor while inside or something).
tldr: small refugee town inside of new kyrsa with sane npcs.
great video as always, keep these up, they’re really entertaining to watch.
The light hook is awesome feature, I see your point but it helps people who have never gone into layer 2 start learning how to traverse it instead of not knowing where to go and dying to parasites
Honestly I just love the direction your content is going, a few years ago when I first started watching you it was only for the specific games you played at the time, I felt like the commentary you had on them was refreshing and taking a more critical approach was so nice to see. But even after all those years and finally coming back I feel like I can just watch your stuff for you, you’re very funny and that more critical analytical side aids in that as well. It’s funny laughing at how horrible some things are and how you actually try and help them become better, I hope you can continue to do what you do.
1:58 the lighthook released with layer 2 because that was a new environment with a couple of new mechanics. Before layer two, builds were completely based on luck, luck was even a stat. Imagine how frustrrating it would be if you wiped your "one in a million" build because the game bugged or didnt register you changing directions to avoid the wind and got flung anyways.
This was a really good strategy to avoid an even bigger influx of restore tickets.
Furthermore, light hooks having the timer means that the clueless playerbase couldn't bruteforce their way through layer two, making the content last longer.
Also, an average layer 2 floor 1 (chaser fight) can be completed with like 5-10 min without tryharding as long as you know where to go, so the loop for those who didnt want to risk their builds would be to run floor 1 until you get a route fast enough that you can start exploring floor 2 while still having the lighthook.
In the end, in order to make the game less risky, you need to take proper time inbetween runs (if you fail or bail out)
I really like this, it solves oretty much every potential problem they could've had with layer two at launch
Also, there are quite a few things you can only get without a lighthook so it is really just training wheels
this guy gets it
what i like but don't like at the same time about layer 2 is how it's just so linear it's a > b > c > boss | a > b > c > d > boss there little to no exploration to be done theres nothing to find other than a random monster or useless lore npc they really should just do a massive layer 2 expansion for the new conquest update making lighthook as a way to just leave whenever instead of a safety net like you said earlier i want to explore layer 2 but i know damn well that theres really nothing out there outside of the boss or floor 2 i want to explore it but im not trying to get infinite comboed by the snipers and wipe over that the only good monster they added to layer 2 is the bonekeeper everything else is just stat check
Honestly initially I thought the lighthook changes you made were odd, but considering all the other changes you made, i'm completely for basically everything in this video. This is an amazing take.
Great points! I can get to chaser in 5 minutes, that’s With killing the bounders, with killing the bonekeepers, for extra chest which are good. I really wanted more quest, more rivalry between the divers and the ignition union, seeing them fight down there over an abandoned settlement. Where you could choose a side to help to gain reputation and specific loot for each one, helping the ignition union would give you guns, ignition deepdelver etc, while the divers would give you black diver, and depths loot. I think that the light hook should be changed completely; instead make it possibly 30-45 minutes, to do quest, kill different bosses, help the ignition union or the divers, obtain special items to counter layer 2. And have multiple ways to go to floor two, having the ministry have a small camp, and people can choose to help them, I think it would be cool if you could choose only one to help, and expand their base but I have no clue how this would work with multiplayer so there’s that. Of course with all this make it so that the map is far bigger, in all directions. Floor two could stay a dungeon while floor one could be more like an exploration, this would come with new enemies, bosses, quest, items, secrets etc etc. I think it would be amazing if you had to do this to go to layer 3 forcing players to actually explore and do layer two before going to layer 3.
It’s a lot, and definitely has a shit ton of flaws. I’m no game designer just what I think would be cool!
It’s official:
The Deep calls him.
(Like actually why the fuck do I keep coming back to this game.)
The reason the light hook exists was to pad the release. Imagine thousands of players wiping being oblivious to parasites, all the enemies, hell even the wind is dangerous. layer 2 is a puzzle structure learned piece by piece and it allowed people to do trial and error without wiping everytime they learn something new and having to get power 15 again
So glad to see you got into deepwoken on the brink of another huge update nearing, I hope with your input you make deepwoken more of a balance and greater experince.
16:40 I completely agree with this. I think a good change for this would be that using the deepdrill allows you to keep at the VERY LEAST 5 items (with the ignition union taking the rest since they are a generally "greedy" group). This would mean there would be an option for newer players to get valuable loot without having to confront a boss that will most likely wipe them, but there is still an incentive to kill chaser to obtain more. This would further mean that floor 1 doesn't become this "free loot zone" for experienced players who would be able to get to most chest spots without ever losing their light hook.
love the video eclipse, this laid back content were u criticise games from a game design stand point has really made me change the perspective from which i programme games and add new features
3:00 if you have roblox premium the dev makes money from playtime and I think that is scummy, but it is still a valid argument
paid access games dont make money off of premium payouts
Paid access games dont have premium payouts.
paid access games don't include premium payouts.
He's just a bit silly.
Yeah the fire thing is odd. Just as you I would like to see a developer’s reasoning for graceful flame not working in Layer 2. Not quite the same thing but we have functional lanterns. We have the Gale Wax puzzle which curiously enough, is lit with azure flames. We also have the name Firfire for the town on floor 1. Recently the name might sort of make sense since its where you can find a disciple of Pleetsky and there is a fiery heat emanating from there but that is about it. To sum it up, really odd that graceful flame doesn’t work here when as you mentioned, it should work a lot better in a snowy landscape with parasitic snow that is susceptible to heat as opposed to an ocean
As PVE demon i could say "holy yap, stop him now!", but this is just straight facts. Also big respect from yba years yk
They did something cool to Firfire, adding some legendary weapon, then again it is almost impossible to find without the wiki and causes you to instantly die if you manage to get to it without flamecharm and a specific outfit.
6:22 layer 2 eternal gale is also stuck in the cycle from new krsya and there's a piece of clothing to do that also its not that risky to do layer 2 without a hook (as long as you can beat chaser or only came for the exp) you can skip firfire carvens entrace after getting the hook
I’m surprised that as someone who really enjoys the world design you didn’t bring up the monsters. I’ve always been bothered by the lack of variety and quantity but the quality is still there I think. Take Scyphozia for instance, it feels a lot more lively in comparison and even got two new mobs but more practically one since the Brute and Broodlord are reskins of each other with different stats. Layer 1 has about 14 different enemies. A lot of these are also found in the surface(Crustaceous Rex and the two jellyfish) but this makes sense even if you think its lazy. These even have cool lore implications, like how are a bird and a spider in a deep sea? Layer 2 technically has 8 fightable monsters I think including Scion of Ethiron but Kyrsgarde variants make a majority of these and are more like another race like how elves are in fantasy stories outside of a gameplay perspective. Now we are left with the Diver Husk, Carbuncle, Bounder, and Bonekeeper. The Diver Husks and presumably Carbuncles too(emphasizing on this because idk why they exist outside Layer 2) can be grouped up into Gale Parasites. We are fighting the parasites with varying hosts eventually. So we get 3 unique types of mobs here, Bounder, Bonekeeper, and parasites. It feels oddly empty in Layer 2 which is supposed to be a whole new realm essentially. It is a dungeon that plays way more linearly than Layer 1 but in terms of size are probably relative and Layer 1 probably gets outsized if you include Layer 2 Floor 2. They’re not even talked about by npcs for some reason like Megalodaunts are and I think that is a missed opportunity. They’re almost as obscure as Primadon. Supposedly there was meant to be a crab monster thing from an Agamatsu video and that would’ve been cool to have. To sum it up, Layer 2 does not have a very interesting monster pool. Also, a bestiary would be a cool way to give monsters some spotlight. Could be implemented as a book series starting with archivist megalodaunt or whatever it was
I do really enjoy the “speedrunning,” as you say, of layer 2, but your suggestions would generally improve the experience as a whole. I’m most fond of your take on firfire, as I believe it is a land of missed opportunity for what it’s worth. Having an alien settlement said to be “foreign yet familiar,” a tagline which instantly attracted my interest towards firfire immediately disappointed me when I found out firfire’s purpose in layer 2, and how much more it could have been expanded on.
Eclipse switched to playing a good game, Glad you're enjoying deepwoken Eclipse!
I believe the lighthook is designed to explore and learn the mechanics of l2. As you said once in your previous videos, Deepwoken is a trial and error game. Its what allowed you and many other players to learn the patterns of the Bonekeeper fight. Its what allowed players to learn how the parasites and the wind works.
When it comes to how the lighthook time recharge is calculated, i found it to be 2 minutes waiting before starting to recharge at a 1:1 rate. Although important to note is im pulling this from personal experience and I havent taken the time to extensively confirm this theory yet
Eclipse, i think that many of the points you have mentioned are being saved up for layer 3, for example, the firfire race might have left to layer 3 for some unknown reason maybe they saw pleeksty's potential for power and decided to join him and helped him ascend to godhood or some stuff while these firfire dudes that are in L2 have been uninformed of it, for example this is how it cojld have went: an exploration team of firfires went to explore l2 to the fullest or maybe go back to layer 1 (there are yurts (buildings looking like bubble houses) in a part of L1 possibly signifying firfire's influence) and while they were oit of the main area, pleeksty and the others left to L3. Upon coming back, the exploration group noticed everyone was missing and assumed that they just were the last of their kind. And so, we would get to see the firfire race in their fullest in L3, with some of the points you have mentioned such as armour/clothing, a blacksmith specifically for that equipment and whatever else there could be.
20:32 Hi Eclipse! So yes, I do agree with you on some standpoints. But I don’t agree with you on some as well, I agree with your thought of making it more involved; like perhaps making floor 1 (and maybe 2) randomly generated with extra loot in certain spots. That way it encourages exploration, however as for stuff like your lighthook proposals… to put it lightly they can go to hell and burn in a lake of boiling blood.
About the light hook. Perhaps i didn't properly understand what you were saying but its timer only goes to 10 minites if you use it as an item or die while holding it. Beating floor 1 and escaping it via the light hook spawned by klaris gives you a full 20 minute light hook on your next run no matter what.
Anyway, overall thoughts on layer 2? Sort of wasted potential in some areas but what we got in the end is still great. Personally i dont just speedrun layer 2, I start exp farming there too whenever i hit level 15. Floor 1/2 and the fight against scion of ethiron seem like a joke to me and is just free exp to me nowadays. Funny how killing scion of ethiron used to give you only like 8 investment points ot something lmao.
fun fact on firfire , theres a hidden cliff and theres a kyrsgarde sitting beside a cliff , he will ask you to sit next to him and if you use the resting emote next to him he says speical stuff
What does he say
@@Decaying_bacon "you're a good friend" or something like that
Personally speaking, I agree on a lot of your points made in this video.
Honestly at this point I just think that the Timeloop effect of Floor 2 is just there for the fun of it.
As even if you do it without a guide, you can simply leave and rejoin which would reset the timer completely while also resetting the obelisks.
However, I do find it infeasible for the Kyrsgardes in Floor 1 to have a blacksmith or a campfire.
As cool as it would be, they're stated to be as peaceful, religious nomads.
They don't really have a need for a blacksmith.
And I doubt the nomadic Kyrsgardes actually have the resources to build a campfire immune to the "Eternal Gale", but that's just me tho.
hi eclipse first thing i want to say is thanks for the awsome video and since i dont usually leave long comments i wanted to leave my first one on an good channel but let's stop glazing so im a casual player of roblox and i got deepwoken becouse i saw youtubers play this game it seems fun so i got it what the first 2 hours told me was pain and still i realized im one of those player that cant play this type of game since i get really stressed over iniziating combat with another player and i tried pve as i played over 10 hour just doing the trial of 1 spoiler i died at sharko over 50 times i want to joke about this but i cant so i guess it's just skill issue in my part but still i want to continue to play and start over again (i dont know how to dash in the air too ;( ) so to finish i want to thank you becouse you enspired me to continue play this game as witouth you i would have stopped a long time ago
P.S. i hope this dosent go in a ddos becouse now that i red it again it kinda is have a nice day!
it takes ages to get good, just stick through it. i believe in you man
personally i dont play deepwoken (mainly because im not a fan of getting wiped in games and i dont feel like spending money on it) but watching your videos on this game is super fun and i hope you make more
I agree with pretty much all of these takes although the one argument for the Light Hook take is a little contradictory, reason why they added the light hook is to prevent builds from being wiped quickly, due to the fact that they knew Layer 2 was a new area. Adding the factor of the lack in knowledge about the area when it first dropped. Layer 2 requires you to have a barely maxed account to explore which is not fun after spending 3-5 hours building a slot only (Unlike Floor 1 which you almost always gets exposed to) for you to wipe it in less than 10 minutes cause of parasites. To make things clear, this argument is only relevant to new players exploring Layer 2 without a guide or a guide depends on how you see it. I fully agree with how the Light Hook works as a safety net, it feels such a breeze going through Layer 2 thinking I wouldn't get wiped every-time I do Layer 2 which completely removes the cautious factor when doing a run as an experienced player.
Maybe Klaris would feel the responsibility for your survival but maybe after finishing your first run, she would completely trust you to make things easier for her cause she knows that you can handle yourself.
TLDR: Maybe I suggest making the Light Hook more of a recall or rescue rope, putting a timer until you get extracted and be completely vulnerable when using it than an invincibility shield.
Well yes, everything ur saying is mostly right, i do speedrun basically layer 2 whenever i want to, basically always use light hook and all of that, my fastest layer 2 run was actually 6 or 7 minutes or something and i did not have ANY agility mantras, since i was using silentheart, i managed to 2 cycle chaser once and theres a shit crap of one cycle chaser builds, i can, well, was ABLE to singlehandely solo wave 25 in the diluvian, wich is basically hellmode, and that pretty consistently! i have mixed opinions on pve stuff, like its actually somehow a bit fun to just be able to shred to giant waves of monsters alone, on the other hand, its really unrealistic that im able to kill like 6 bounders at once without even going below half hp and no dvm kit really! i didnt even have my build fully completed.
one thing tough that makes this good is that you do not need people to play deepwoken, you do not need friends, if you have a good enough pve build you can do ANYTHING, well, almost anything lol! And if exploration would be more of a thing, i feel like there is WAY to little quests and WAY to little rewards for these, in my entire 400+ hours of playing deepwoken, i have done around 7 or 8 quests maybe, some quests even never, since there is just no point in them, if you need knowledge, you either do layer 2 or the diluvian mechanism, if you need lvls, you just farm in the depths and get max in like 2 hours, OR JUST GET MAX IN 1 HOUR IF YOU GET CARRIED IN DILUVIAN, (i got lvl 13 in half an hour in the diluvian and i did NOTHING, i did not even move a single finger!)
if they was to make pve WAY harder and more exploration, i think something like companions or something like that would be good, since i basically always play solo, it does get a little lonely sometimes and yes, companions are just ai or something but it just makes the battle more fun, like humanoid people you can talk to and fight with, maybe if you have enough charisma you can even get the higher level people like maybe akira or klaris,
at the end of the day this is just my point of view (from a basically ONLY solo player so if you have a different one i dont mind.
Eclipse I know your going through rough times, but just know that a lot of us really appreciate you!
I can practically do L2 Hookless with my eyes closed, I even got Chain of Perfection from Chaser (took a jillion runs just due to the tiny ticks of blood damage when Chaser gets knocked, which gave me unnecessary amounts of experience in the dungeon).
Honestly one of the biggest things I'd like to see is the non-required encounters being randomized. Like, for example, the static bounder spawn outside of the Ethironal Shrine Sanctuary.
Just my two cents, good video as always
Layer 2 has a couple of unique equipment drops that cannot be obtained anywhere else (or are just VERY difficult to find anywhere else)
1. Chaser's Bloodforged Crown. A red crown with a blood-reducing talent that is SO rare barely anyone has held one.
2. Delver's Duster. A leather jacket from an Ignition Union Deepdelver. It's a mythical equipment you usually get in Ethiron or Chaser
But i agree, Layer 2 needs some more love.
I really like everything you said and wished that’s what actually occurred. My first time in layer 2 I was too scared because I didn’t want to die and get wiped, from there forth I learned about the light hook and began just having fun and trying to beat chaser. I wish it was more on the side of explore and learn like east luminant and the other seas, because that’s where I had the most fun in deepwoken exploring and fighting random dudes with my friends.
With your videos, i feel like playing the game again, your ideas for the game are to be honest good, if i had to say one specific idea, it would be the Firfire one, the devs should hear you out
eclipse, there is a lore reason for why specific kyrsgarde aren't hostile, it's because the ones in the city are being controlled by ethiron, influencing their actions, that's why the ones in firfire village are friendly and so is the one outside the city, because they haven't gotten close to the city to be controlled.
you made a lot of interesting points hope the devs see some of these and steer it in the right direction for the game
17:27 Actually, since recent update THERE IS some secret quest in firfire. It even allows you get special weapon. But sadly it's more about dealing with Pleeksty, not with this race.
The devs actually listened and added most of the things you talked about in this update.
Cheers to good weekly updates
deepwoken is the most noob friendly game i have ever played in my life, I love how it tells you everything at the start and exactly what to do and not just "build a boat".
on the closing thoughts question, I'm one of those people that's realized how beautiful Eternal Gale looks and how infuriating it is to have Parasites act as a artificial and unnecessary timer that doesnt let me freely explore the layer even after completing it tenths of times over and over. I just hate the unneeded timers especially when they give us maps as extensive as these with no chance of fully appreciating the whole scope of the map-maker's vision. Also your Firfire idea is so good man
Tbh i was disappointed that Layer 2 turned out to be a dungeon instead of a completely new hub, a dungeon you have to complete under a time limit on top of that
about the parasite part, ive talked about the arc suit protecting against the parasites, as its a main point of the arc suit in lore as the flame req is too keep you warm in layer 2.
I think many games can learn from the foundation of Deepwoken, not the Perma death, but how the world feels lived in itself many games feel dry with the places (looking at you type:// soul, yba, aut. blox fruits, gpo). sometimes the feel of the game is much more important than the gameplay. I don't know how you all feel about it, but I like it when my game has a story, tales of others who walked the same path making you feel like just another part of the larger world you live in, unlike the chosen hero. well, this is my little rant I wish that more games made esthetic and worlds as immersive as deep visual, and gameplay-wise. the game is not perfect but with polish and fresh ideas it sure as hell can be.
this. lore games are actuallly the best games sm1 can have
Yeah games like Deepwoken and rogue and games based off them like Lore Game and Saisei and Verdant Moon are amazing.
Good news about the firfire section, they did indeed add something to firefire which is a miniboss that drops the new legendary weapon they added like 3 days ago. What an amazing start, just ignore the fact that to fight this boss you must have a bell, have no light hook and when speaking to the npc you must have specific stat requirements or else he just insta kills you.
This guy got vow of mastery on the whole dev team he made them add layer 2 items 4 days after the video 😭😭😭😭
Beside those problems listed above by eclipse, I think Layer 2 also got a very, gnarly issue , and it is optimization.
Your FPS could drop from 25 to 1.4-7 extremely quickly whenever stalactites fall, and guess what, one of Chaser's attack is the stalactites. It also randomly drops time to time, or drop when the winds are blowing. Back to Chaser, when he enters phase two, he collapse the ceiling, yeah? That'll be an automatic lost for those without strong computer as their FPS could drop too low that even blocking is impossible -> Get hit by Stalactites.
Random FPS drops also stop the players from even reaching Chaser to attack him during his stun if it occurs, which is frustrating.
The developers really blocked getting A/S/W Rank behind optimization, it's impossible to get those if you don't got a 1500$ Setup.
Yes, those are from my own experiences also:
*Those FPS drops still occur while I got roblox on 144p graphic along with disabling shadows, using Voxel lighting technology, no anti aliasing , Texture Quality 0, 0 Quality, and of course it still happens.
And that's rather strange considering I could run TF2, Deepwoken Overworld and depths without all those setting listed in "*", Terraria, etc....
But Deepwoken layer 2 just, straight up unplayable for me, Low Graphic setting don't help either and Ping Compensation does nothing for low FPS.
Well , eclipse I hope you'd say something about this problem too, the game need more optimization I can't lie.
I agree with most things in this video heres somethings that I personally think that they should change/improve
1. Lighthook should not expire until you get into floor two, then it breaks (as stated in the video)
2. Firfire is a massive waste of opportunity, it would be nice if we could have more quest and more character development
3. Chaser bossfight, chaser is an off-brand enderdragon, it would be nice if they changed the boss fight to make it more unique
4. Ethiron buff, I know that for new players, ethiron can be hard, however, for already experienced players ethiron should be harder. I think they should make it so the first time you get into the ethiron fight it stays the same, but after like 2 times beating ethiron then ethiron should be buffed.
Personally I prefer the speed running route through layer 2 now since I’ve done it over 100 times and atp it becomes really tedious trying to farm loot or get medallions, although the new secret passage to floor 2 and double chest weekends have helped with this. However I also do really enjoy first time exploration of places and going in blind but only for a little while before it’s actually gets tedious. I think it would be worthwhile to have a system in place for layer 2 and future dungeons where if it’s new to you and it’s your first time, the risks of wiping your character should be reduced or maybe just removed for the first few runs. And maybe for future dungeons when they drop there can be a week grace period of no wiping to allow blind exploration without requiring a guide
Hey Eclipse, just wanted to say regarding the loot section that most people when making pve build do not look at the talents, I saw how you brought up the immortal helm with indeed is very good but with a pve build people mainly focus on the actual stats and not the given talent. Although you may be correct that the loot between layers is not good, there is still very good items when it comes to how you dress in deepwoken, which is a whole other area of fun for people to dress up and cosplay.
As a speed runner for layer 2 I think that having more interactions would be great, there’s just no point in going out of your way to kill mobs for mediocre chests and doing a galewax to get a horrible enchant stone, I think they should make a reason for people to kill mobs or do something in layer 2 except for just doing bonekeeper and immediately getting to chaser. I think floor 2 was designed perfectly tho to speed run you have to have advanced strategies and there’s a reason to kill things and to get medallions.
I'd like to mention that with the layer 2 instakills, they actually did add a new one in which you must go to a specific spot at a cave near the town in floor 1 (which you can easily fall off into the deathpit below at) and go through doors that dont open unless you went down with no light hook, and you are then burnt to death and wiped if you do not meet multiple requirements when talking to an NPC to obtain a new weapon
Eclipse, when u say L2 is like a speedrunning place, i remember that in the last update made Wind Passage cant clip through walls. Afterwards, they made it clippable by saying "Making Wind Passage clippable through walls for speedrunning".
I love your videos eclipse! keep making great content and keep going with these deepwoken videos!
There is also a fourth trap in layer 2, in New Kyrsa you can enter in a building that once you get in, will lock most (except one) of its doors and spawn a lot of kyrs mobs so you can have so much fun
The drill IMO makes sense, in the depths if you fall in the void instead of an instant wipe.You are granted a chance to escape through the drill. The reason why don’t keep anything is that you are meant to beat the boss chaser. What would end up happening is people would just farm the mudskipper npcs and do the wax and leave through the drill without risking fighting chaser.
While i agree with some of your takes, such as nerfing the light hook and forcing players to activate it in order to get saved (which i believe shouldn't be applied to fall related things, cuz Klaris's the one keeping an eye on you in that case), i also disagree with some others.
While being an hard area, the layer 2 is not supposed to be the final one (they're planning on making other 7 layers), and a mechanic such as the light hook would both spare most players' time by not making they wipe their builds to minor issues, such as the wind, along with allowing them to explore the second part of it after having mastered the first one, which's loot is highly inferior to other farming places (such as the diluvian mechanism).
Then, secondly, about the timer, I agree with it being annoying, but after having mastered floor 1 and having become able to deal against it in less than 10 minutes, players will be able to utilize part of their light hook to expand their knowledge regarding this riskier part, but, while the loss of character should be expected due to it being an hard game, i partially agree with you on it being a section of the game people will most likely have trouble dealing with in game, and instead, recurring to youtube guides, which i agree on not being an advantage for a game seen from an objective point of view.
Don't really find the need to fix it, but i'd definitely add some way to either expand your time (such as clearing it once the next layers comes out, or by donating either knowledge or medallions respectively to miserables(goat npc you'll find in said place) or klaris) or, if not there, some npc to give you better advice on what to actually do and where to.
On the npc traps section, idk tbh, but if i'm not wrong, while not being clearly stated, the kyrsgarde agressiveness in the deeper floor is hinted by floor 1 npcs, also being racist in some scenarios.
Also, once you get to know it, you'll have an easier time browsing around it and discovering everything you want, 45 minutes are def enough, you could also repeat it in case of having the fear of having missed something.
On the loot section, i agree on adding more unique loot (despite you not having adressed the unique drops from chaser, such as his weapon and crown, along with other items which result into being turned into mantras with the help of dr carrion, npc which you can find in the deeper floor), with it's stats not outclassing other harder dungeons' one, such as the diluvian mechanism, and that's to make it an actual place worth exploring which won't be totally outclassed in terms of lootpool by other current and future areas, due to it having unique items which may improve someone's drip up to their likings.
About firfire, i think it serves it's purpose, with it hinting some things about lore along while still holding other secrets that you've not yet explored (Pleeksty's calling you Eclipse), plus, it's just a settlement.
This was my take on yours, also, regarding the "Undying flame" talent if that's it's name, i believe it doesn't work there due to the wind's strength, which is Ethiron's main power, but still, if not changed in future layers, i'd rather have a quest strengthening your mantra than having to pick another talent as those are really expensive for actual good builds.
Keep up the content.
Layer 2 is by far the best part of deepwoken and also the reason why i got into it in the first place. An amazing atmosphere , fantastic music (especially the one when you are in danger) and that dreaded feeling that you can lose everything you worked on. It's an amazing dungeon.. the first time you get on it , after that it's just quite boring , same path and , as you mentioned, because of the timer you have to hurry if you want to have a no risk route with a light hook. It's normal for dungeons to get boring especially if you are only doing it for loot so that's not really a problem for me. However I do agree that the loot is extremely disappointing , but the weapons that were made specifically for the layers are very well designed and are good end game weapons. I do wish the chests were filled with less stuff , but the items from the chests would be items that are ONLY OBTAINABLE from LAYER 2. Not from layer 1 (overworld) , except for maybe deep gems and relics. Floor 2 of layer 2 is the most stressful experience i've had in the game by far and it wasn't a fun one either. The atmosphere and etc are amazing again! However it pisses me off that we are on a timer and are not really allowed to explore the place. Even after you get all the obelisks (or whatever they are called) and the timer halts , you still can't really explore it without getting attacked by a million spears that deal A LOT of damage (if you are not on a pve build and even if you are on an average pve build), enemies that basically are unavoidable because they activate from 20 million studs away , even if you are hidden. While I was learning layer 2 F2 (with a guide for the path atleast) it was frustrating to die and having to get another power 20 build just to try again (mostly getting power 20 part is annoying because leveling up in this game is so boring). But now that I can beat ethiron and enjoy the dungeon just a little bit more , it's actually quite relaxing to explore for whatever reason , maybe because of the relaxing yet chilling music that is Kyrie. Now Ethiron is an okay boss , it's not too difficult and it's easy once you get a hang of it. But in all honesty it's not the boss that is hard , it's the fact that if you fail , you die and you have to repeat everything and that stress (yes i get stressful over a roblox game) does get to you and you fail to parry and everything and you die in the end , so my advice to people who have the same issue is to be in a call with someone and talk about random stuff or listen to some upbeat music , it helps. Learning layer 2 was overall annoying as a solo player but the feeling once you actually beat ethiron , get the loot and get out of there is amazing on the first try. The experience was great tho and i did learn more about build making because of the many failed attempts i had (skill issue). If you are gonna play deepwoken to try out layer 2, just be wary of the many timers it has , just like the video said , they're annoying (also light hook is obtainable at around power 15-16 not sure!)
The music composer for deepwoken is called "Naktigonis", check him out , great music even outside deepwoken ost!
20:22 at the end of the day, the goal for entering layer 2 is to get loot/xp and to get out. so if in the case that they do make layer 2 more exploration based and methodical, people would still just blaze through the entire thing to get the loot as fast as possible instead of slowing down. that's just what i think though
As someone whose played deepwoken since launch seeing layer 2 for the first time was cool, scary and fresh. Keyword being “first” as once you know where things are and what do to it just turns into a checklist. I do think the fault of it being a dungeon rather than an open world makes it this way and I pray for the day layer 2 gets some kind of rework to make it more exciting than a glorified speedrun every time .
Me and my frends were one of those few psycos who did layer 2 without a guide, and let me say, that experiece was magical seing all this new stuff, actually talking to the NPC's failing with light hook and having to try over and ofer again loosing our shit when we finally beat chaser, and floor 2 was equaly magic (even the kyrsan kill). But yea as time went on it became more of a speedrun, not even for loot but just for money and it really lost it's magic.
ECLIPSE THEY LISTENED!!! partially but STILL LISTENED TO YOUR IDEAS KINDA!!!!