Thank you for the video! Does it produce better and more readable score from MIDI than previous Cubase versions? I see in the comments that might be true. Then the next question is: does it produce a more readable score from MIDI even than Dorico, or is on the same level or still inferior - could it replace Dorico completely in that regard to create simple one instrument readable layouts, if you don't care about engraving and other advanced Dorico features? If you record MIDI, then edit it in the score editor, will it reflect back to the MIDI? How does visual quantize fit into editing in score editor?
You’re welcome! It does indeed produce more readable score than it used to. In my opinion, Dorico is still far superior in a number of important ways. I don’t think this would replace Dorico for people who are serious about notation - inconsistent key commands is one workflow example that remains a barrier here. Otherwise… yes, if you edit the midi, then the score Editor updates and vice versa. All in all, a really nice update to Cubase!
It uses mostly the same code as Dorico's MIDI import. In fact, it's really stress-tested the MIDI import code and exposed many cases that we've been able to improve. So the enhancements we've made for Cubase will also benefit Dorico. Notes in the Score Editor are the same notes as in the key editor, so editing one will update the other. Display Quantize lets you show the notated position of a note which may be slightly different to the played position, eg for cases like swing
@@PaulWalmsley_whams Thank you for replying! So I assume Cubase 14 is better in notation recognition from MIDI than both Cubase 13 and Dorico 5? That would be great, if it is true! How are the different durational articulations recognized - how should MIDI note events look like in order to be treated as legato, staccato or non-legato? For example do they need to have a slight overlapping to be treated as legato and what should be the gap between them to be treated like staccato and not a shorter note length? If you change the articulation of a note in the score editor, does it reflect back on the MIDI event length?
@@kristianborisov5928 Overlapping notes are recognised as legato, and notes less than about 50% are staccato. If you change the articulation in the score editor then it doesn't currently change the playback note length. Please download the free trial version to see if it works for you.
Steinberg says they are considering adding the capability to import Dorico projects into Cubase 14. Encouragement from users may push this along. The single best feature I see so far is the ability to enter notes via MIDI keyboard play into a Cubase project and then getting a very decent score from that input including even with some pretty decent articulation recognition. Exporting the score as a Dorico project allows the resultant score to be fine-tuned and finished in Dorico. Earlier versions of the Cubase Score "engine" are pretty funky in terms of one needing to play around with quantization and requiring the tweaking of MIDI in order to render the result into anything resembling a decent score. I look forward to your upcoming more in-depth video on C14 and its new Dorico inspired Score Editor. :-}
No need for encouragement -- we know it needs to be done! However we don't know yet what the form of this will be, because we want to come up with a solution that reflects the workflow when moving between Dorico and Cubase. The problem is: what happens if you've sent a Dorico project to Cubase and then you change something. Do you want that change to be reflected in the Dorico project?
@PaulWalmsley_whams I suggest to address this problem, you provide a means (such as a modal dialog box) to allow the user to make that choice either when exporting from Dorico, or when importing into Cubase, or perhaps eventually both. For composers and orchestrators who want a realistic sounding mockup in Cubase but wish to create a score in Dorico first, having user control over how the import into Cubase of that score effects MIDI, might be very useful. If however, the project starts in Cubase, moves to Dorico and then back to Cubase, that option to control how the re-importation effects MIDI in Cubase becomes much more critical. Of course a lot depends on the person's workflow. I say, let the user choose.
The ability to import Dorico projects would be really great! I agree with you about how nice the new score editor’s presentation is - it looks really decent. Exporting a Dorico project is definitely a nice touch, too.
I missed the livestream due to having so much fun with the new Score Editor. This is a huge update and I'm very happy with it. I've often felt that Cubase was designed for people who could not read music and were perfectly happy "reading" music from the Cubase Key Editor and basically writing their music almost entirely by ear. Nothing wrong with that . However there is a big chunk of users out that that write music from score and Cubase left those users pretty much out in the cold due to the PREVIOUSLY lackluster, difficult to use built-in Score Editor. So with Cubase 14 the Score Editor has made a great leap forward. It won't replace Dorico, but integration is getting a whole lot closer.
I agree, totally. The new Score Editor in Cubase 14 will not replace Dorico. It just isn’t feature rich enough to do that. However, it’s now a very usable and useful tool. I love the flexibility of selecting midi parts in the project window and having them automatically update in the score editor below. I’m much prefer seeing my music on a staff :-)
Well, that’s always interesting to see how peoples feeling about the Cubase score edit, I’m using it since the beginning of Cubase and always feel confortable. The first point making me happy is the Display quantize, not in relation with the midi part 😊
Yes, I’m finding more to like about it. Since Cubase already has so many keyboard shortcuts (and Steinberg can’t just overwrite them), my familiar Dorico shortcuts won’t (can’t) work in the new Cubase Score Editor. That’s a bummer, but I’m really happy with this update and I’ll be using it, no doubt!
Agreed! It is not that it couldn't do it - it was more about the learning curve.- I have always preferred to use Cubase for what scoring I need to do - because having my production tool tied to my needed scores is a great workflow. And for most use cases Cubase's score editor can do whatever is needed - the problem is the learning curve and working methods you must use to get those results - other products have been more intuitive, and there are certain functions that pro copyists I suspect would need to work much faster.... that Dorico may always have the upper hand on.
Yes, workflow is just so, so important. It is such a buzzkill when one is trying to be creative and has to navigate a bunch of menus and tabs to get music written :). I don’t imagine the score editor’s presentation will every mature enough to be the tool of choice for copyists, but for composers… I think Steinberg just made a massive leap in the right direction.
Looks promising. I'm sure we can expect that the Score Editor is going to be updated with some frequency now, so just think of this as Score Editor 1.0
I’m sure it’s likely. I think this sets a good stage for the Dorico team and the Cubase team to collaborate on their integration in the coming months and years. That’s all great news for composers like me!
Thanks for your feedback. This video was requested and I thought I explained clearly that I was discovering the software update at the outset. I'll make an effort to be clearer about what to expect in my future videos.
@@mannmusica I hear what you’re saying and you make a fair point. My channel is intended to share my experiences as a composer, and that usually reflects whatever is top of mind for me. Additionally, I respond to requests in comments from my other videos. This checked off both boxes for my typical content - top of mind and a request from someone in my community. But, I know people don’t wanna waste time on TH-cam. It’s never my intention to just get views. Thanks again for your feedback!
![fellow fellow - พรุ่งนี้ไม่มีใครรู้ feat. INK WARUNTORN [OFFICIAL MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/QP6JyjYx_W0/mqdefault.jpg)
Thank you so very much for responding so quickly to my request for this video topic!
You are so welcome! This is a great update :-)
Thank you for the video! Does it produce better and more readable score from MIDI than previous Cubase versions? I see in the comments that might be true. Then the next question is: does it produce a more readable score from MIDI even than Dorico, or is on the same level or still inferior - could it replace Dorico completely in that regard to create simple one instrument readable layouts, if you don't care about engraving and other advanced Dorico features? If you record MIDI, then edit it in the score editor, will it reflect back to the MIDI? How does visual quantize fit into editing in score editor?
You’re welcome! It does indeed produce more readable score than it used to. In my opinion, Dorico is still far superior in a number of important ways. I don’t think this would replace Dorico for people who are serious about notation - inconsistent key commands is one workflow example that remains a barrier here.
Otherwise… yes, if you edit the midi, then the score Editor updates and vice versa. All in all, a really nice update to Cubase!
It uses mostly the same code as Dorico's MIDI import. In fact, it's really stress-tested the MIDI import code and exposed many cases that we've been able to improve. So the enhancements we've made for Cubase will also benefit Dorico. Notes in the Score Editor are the same notes as in the key editor, so editing one will update the other. Display Quantize lets you show the notated position of a note which may be slightly different to the played position, eg for cases like swing
@@PaulWalmsley_whams Thank you for replying! So I assume Cubase 14 is better in notation recognition from MIDI than both Cubase 13 and Dorico 5? That would be great, if it is true! How are the different durational articulations recognized - how should MIDI note events look like in order to be treated as legato, staccato or non-legato? For example do they need to have a slight overlapping to be treated as legato and what should be the gap between them to be treated like staccato and not a shorter note length? If you change the articulation of a note in the score editor, does it reflect back on the MIDI event length?
@@kristianborisov5928 Overlapping notes are recognised as legato, and notes less than about 50% are staccato. If you change the articulation in the score editor then it doesn't currently change the playback note length. Please download the free trial version to see if it works for you.
Steinberg says they are considering adding the capability to import Dorico projects into Cubase 14. Encouragement from users may push this along.
The single best feature I see so far is the ability to enter notes via MIDI keyboard play into a Cubase project and then getting a very decent score from that input including even with some pretty decent articulation recognition. Exporting the score as a Dorico project allows the resultant score to be fine-tuned and finished in Dorico. Earlier versions of the Cubase Score "engine" are pretty funky in terms of one needing to play around with quantization and requiring the tweaking of MIDI in order to render the result into anything resembling a decent score.
I look forward to your upcoming more in-depth video on C14 and its new Dorico inspired Score Editor. :-}
No need for encouragement -- we know it needs to be done! However we don't know yet what the form of this will be, because we want to come up with a solution that reflects the workflow when moving between Dorico and Cubase. The problem is: what happens if you've sent a Dorico project to Cubase and then you change something. Do you want that change to be reflected in the Dorico project?
@PaulWalmsley_whams I suggest to address this problem, you provide a means (such as a modal dialog box) to allow the user to make that choice either when exporting from Dorico, or when importing into Cubase, or perhaps eventually both. For composers and orchestrators who want a realistic sounding mockup in Cubase but wish to create a score in Dorico first, having user control over how the import into Cubase of that score effects MIDI, might be very useful. If however, the project starts in Cubase, moves to Dorico and then back to Cubase, that option to control how the re-importation effects MIDI in Cubase becomes much more critical. Of course a lot depends on the person's workflow. I say, let the user choose.
@@rawl747 These are the sort of use cases that we would look to address
The ability to import Dorico projects would be really great! I agree with you about how nice the new score editor’s presentation is - it looks really decent. Exporting a Dorico project is definitely a nice touch, too.
@@PaulWalmsley_whams Excellent. As someone who owns both products, I look forward to your solutions!
I missed the livestream due to having so much fun with the new Score Editor. This is a huge update and I'm very happy with it.
I've often felt that Cubase was designed for people who could not read music and were perfectly happy "reading" music from the Cubase Key Editor and basically writing their music almost entirely by ear. Nothing wrong with that . However there is a big chunk of users out that that write music from score and Cubase left those users pretty much out in the cold due to the PREVIOUSLY lackluster, difficult to use built-in Score Editor. So with Cubase 14 the Score Editor has made a great leap forward. It won't replace Dorico, but integration is getting a whole lot closer.
I agree, totally. The new Score Editor in Cubase 14 will not replace Dorico. It just isn’t feature rich enough to do that. However, it’s now a very usable and useful tool. I love the flexibility of selecting midi parts in the project window and having them automatically update in the score editor below. I’m much prefer seeing my music on a staff :-)
Well, that’s always interesting to see how peoples feeling about the Cubase score edit, I’m using it since the beginning of Cubase and always feel confortable.
The first point making me happy is the Display quantize, not in relation with the midi part 😊
It's looking interesting, Will.
Yes, I’m finding more to like about it. Since Cubase already has so many keyboard shortcuts (and Steinberg can’t just overwrite them), my familiar Dorico shortcuts won’t (can’t) work in the new Cubase Score Editor. That’s a bummer, but I’m really happy with this update and I’ll be using it, no doubt!
Cubase14 is definitely a good update. However, real-time synchronization between cubase and dorico is not yet possible. That's very sad.
Synchronization would be really nice!
Agreed! It is not that it couldn't do it - it was more about the learning curve.- I have always preferred to use Cubase for what scoring I need to do - because having my production tool tied to my needed scores is a great workflow. And for most use cases Cubase's score editor can do whatever is needed - the problem is the learning curve and working methods you must use to get those results - other products have been more intuitive, and there are certain functions that pro copyists I suspect would need to work much faster.... that Dorico may always have the upper hand on.
Yes, workflow is just so, so important. It is such a buzzkill when one is trying to be creative and has to navigate a bunch of menus and tabs to get music written :). I don’t imagine the score editor’s presentation will every mature enough to be the tool of choice for copyists, but for composers… I think Steinberg just made a massive leap in the right direction.
Looks promising. I'm sure we can expect that the Score Editor is going to be updated with some frequency now, so just think of this as Score Editor 1.0
I’m sure it’s likely. I think this sets a good stage for the Dorico team and the Cubase team to collaborate on their integration in the coming months and years. That’s all great news for composers like me!
This was painful to watch. You really should spend some time with the software before uploading a video.
Thanks for your feedback. This video was requested and I thought I explained clearly that I was discovering the software update at the outset. I'll make an effort to be clearer about what to expect in my future videos.
@ I know everyone wants to be the FIRST one to upload a video to get the views. I don’t think that’s a good strategy long term.
@@mannmusica I hear what you’re saying and you make a fair point. My channel is intended to share my experiences as a composer, and that usually reflects whatever is top of mind for me. Additionally, I respond to requests in comments from my other videos. This checked off both boxes for my typical content - top of mind and a request from someone in my community. But, I know people don’t wanna waste time on TH-cam. It’s never my intention to just get views. Thanks again for your feedback!