In this weeks Tech Talk, Danny Richie from GR-Research covers the importance in selecting the right driver for the job! +++ www.GR-Research.com Audiocircle: www.audiocircl...
Totally agree with you mate. The service you get over here is shocking compared to America. All you get is pushy salesmen trying to push the gear they make the most profit on! I would love to start a company like this that truly looks after the customer and their individual needs. I'm skint though so that's not going to happen.... :)
Good to see you Danny! I think you should make up a special set of speakers "The Twins Edition" for Sarah, she did all the hard work! Another great episode, I learn something every week. Ron, Sarah, and Georgia Congratulations!
No problem. Life happens, so we deal with it and move on! Congratulations Ron and Sara. Your going to have your hands full! I worked for an Auto Parts and Machine Shop company back in the 80's. It was a family owned and we'll run business and one of the best jobs I've ever had. The owner bought Parts in bulk direct from the manufacturer or Warehouse at a huge discount. It was a smart way to go because we could pass the savings on to the customers. One of our sales representatives, who sold us several product lines from Tucson, always came in looking well groomed and dressed. We didn't see him for a week and when he came in his shirt was wrinkled, hair disheveled, tie crooked and shoes scuffed.when he had finished conducting business my bass asked him what was going on, if everything was ok and if he could help if it wasn't. His answer was that he had missed a week because his wife had given birth..... to triplets! I hope you manage to get some sleep and everything is going well for your expanding family!
Another terrific video Danny! I'm wondering if you have an archive of redesigned crossovers for popular speakers people have sent in for measurements. If so and if someone owns one of those speakers would you be willing to sell that information?
Can you guys review the Lii Audio drivers, like the F15, F10, and Crystal-10? I hear they are phenomenal drivers, especially for their price. Very efficient, light mass, fast speed, really good range. Decware and Caintuck have been big on them: www.lii-audio.com/product/recommended-15-full-range-speaker-driver-for-music-loudspeaker-with-tube-amplifier-f-15-in-pair
Of cause did he get twins, he is a real hi-fi guy and only stereo is good enough:-) I hope you'll please will answer this maybe impossible question: If I chose to ask you to build a complete custom kit only to assemble at home. How much would that speaker cost, if I had to buy that speaker at a reputable mass producing high end brand? 2 x, 4 x, 10 x ? :-)
I need a really good 6" drivers for some JSE Infinite Slope model 2's. The speaker is 125 lbs...has 5 drivers. The third on down from the top is toast. I need to replace them. And thoughts? I think I need a full range driver for this thing...
Did You ever design a band pass using two inductively coupled swing circuits? And why if not. I ask because I think about building such a thing for my newly acquired Dayton Audio exciters.
Hi Danny,how Do I get intouch with you to order a complete kit,based on that polymer frame driver in front of you,matching tweeter and crossover, and cabinet size,baffle width and heighth,I am a cabinet maker so will make my own cabinets,with shipping to Australia.I have learnt a lot watching your videos,and glad Ron decided to make them. Regards John
Audio equipment engineering can trip over the physics of acoustical engineering. For bigger and bigger magnets (or bass components in general) to do what car audio people seem to imagine that they can do, either the car has to be opened up in a large space where the audio output is no longer particularly associated with the vehicle environment, or the vehicle interior has to be resized to something exceeding a half wavelength of the bass signals desired (around 30 ft.@20Hz!). Otherwise, the result will just be more of what I hear from these systems all the time--more standing waves and smothering and blurring going on than any amount of money, or any size magnets, will ever fix.
Thanks for the video. I have some Briklin DM250 speakers and have replaced the tweeters with Mission 733 tweeters. Is it better to use the crossover from the existing Briklin bass or should I substitute the crossover that I have from the mission tweeters?
What do you think of silk dome tweeters? I love their sound but so delicate and seem easy to pop and not take much volume. I like ribbons but did not know they were so fragile.
I got that need of Yours to have the speakers on ya work bench. But if one had to send his speakers from europe, the whole idea gets unattractive from the costs.
My first speakers that came with my Decca music center had egg-box cardboard cones and something weird going on with a clear plastic thing with a circular brush for the tweeters ^^
Hi Danny😉 Isn't it about time to do an episode on fullrange drivers.... pros and cons. I bought a pair of Cube Audio Magus 10" drivers last year, build a clone cabinet of their finished product....and behold🙃 I now have the best pair of speakers I have ever owned in my 30+ years of hi-fi. They are THAT good.
I really enjoy these videos. If I had professors in college that taught(and spoke English) in the same coherent way he does, I would have done much better.
I enjoyed watching this video. On some of the builder groups, a common argument is active vs passive crossovers. The active argument is that you can correct all those resonance and response curve issues using a DSP, but the reality is, like you did your research on cone materials, why spend so much time correcting it, when a proper driver could be chosen instead? I guess some people like to have to fix everything when the answer is proper research lol.
If that is the argument for active vs passive, then you are arguing the wrong merits of active. The exact same driver should be chosen for both, where active comes into it's own is in it's ability to smooth out the drivers flaws. If you spend any time researching drivers, you will quickly discover there is no such thing as a "perfect" driver. Even drivers costing thousands of dollars each are far from perfectly smooth, they all have peaks and troughs. Active allows you to smooth out those bumps with a lot more ease, but the real benefits of active is not in it's ability to smooth out a response curve, it is in how it sounds so much better removing the passive crossover. You would have to spend some SERIOUS cash on a passive crossover to come close to what can be applied digitally. The mere existence of the passive components is what wrecks the sound.
Hi ! first of all thank you very much for the excellent videos and advices. I have a question about drivers selection process ... is the selection done basically on the results from listening tests ? i am referring to the point where you mention good sounding drivers. Or do you also run measurements of any kind to help the selection ? Thanks a lot. Kind regards, gino
Measurements are looked at first and the T/S parameters have to be such that the drivers work well in the application that they are considered for. And then they are used in actual designs and listened to.
@@dannyrichie9743 thank you very much indeed for the kind and valuable advice. I am finding your videos exceptionally educational. And your creations are splendid indeed. Kindest regards, gino
Another great episode. Did you ever think of designing improved crossover for some super popular speakers like B&W 600 series, Elac latest models, Polk Signature S20... it would be lot easier to sell a crossover that fits inside the existing space for easy swap . Every B&W owner would pay say 200usd for a crossover that would have much higher quality caps in the tweeter filter , and better sounding crossover.... How much time do you spend on Tweeter filter capacitor voicing ? Do you think adding small 0.1uf or 0.01uf bypass to main value tweeter cap as upgrade?
I have upgraded some of those popular models. I have spent quite a bit of time comparing capacitors with different tweeters. I do have my favorites. And yes, by-passing a tweeter cap can make quite an improvement sometimes when done right.
@@dannyrichie9743 Thanks Danny, do you think that tweeters with freq response to say 47KHz( knowing we can hear up to 15KHz I'm 47 yrs old) make sense due to their airness , and better harmonics ? Specially for such tweeter (like in my current B&W 686s2 ) can tiny bypass cap of great quality like 0.01usd further elevate clarity and airy feeling to the highs and soundstage? I did notice it with my ears , but I can not confirm it by measurements as I do not have such equipment or knowledge , i did it all by ear tests....
@@kdomster9141 Imaging and spatial cues are maintained with a tweeter that extends out to 20kHz. I don't know just how much is improved by playing beyond that. And some of the B&W tweeters can be q bit aggressive way up high. That's where some of those metal dome really start to ring. And the by-pass caps can help discharge the stored energy in the larger cap and clean things will down into a range well below what will pass through the smaller by-pass cap.
@@dannyrichie9743 Thank you , these new b&w tweeters with dual ring have more lush sound but still have speed of metal dome after using my capacitor mix it is now sounding much less harsh , no siblance, and pin point harmonics of acoustic guitar or high treble are very fast and pleasant....with airness of almost AMT tweeters . Changing cheap poly cap from tweeter filter worked very well.... maybe one day I will get your open baffle kit ?
When you have a pair of speakers that need to have the drivers replaced, how can you pick the correct woofer for the size cabinet you have? Do you sell drivers, and if so are you still a Focal Dealer?
I am no longer a Focal dealer. I wish it were as easy as just swapping out drivers, but a driver change will also mean a change to the crossover design.
As a speaker builder myself, I like to take a nice crossover and add speakers that I know the response of, to match up the sound I want. I build very specialized boxes but it still comes down to what the crossover can do to make them sound right. This never changes,even when I build monster's. (for customers).
Great info!🤗🤗😁😁😁🤓🤓 Just GREAT!😎 I always thought using expensive material didn't have to mean better sound as usually is the advertised reason for the manufacture using that expensive material! Im a paper guy myself!😉 Are you also in the belief that midrange electonics is a good place to end the upgrade chase? I have an older 38 pound Japan made Denon 3801 and it sounds so good. Although atleast price wise there is sooo much more expensive out there! I can't imagine my system sounding much better but I sure my JBL 590s would really love a pair of Macintosh mono blocks!😁😁😁😁🤗
Mac Monoblocks? I think I would really love them too. My JBL 4341 Clones would love them too. But since I am a retired guy with not that big income, I must be satisfied with my Dynavox stereo Amps that I use as monoblocks. I did not bridge them, just vertical Bi-amping was the deal for me... And this also works great - to a price an AudioFile has to laugh hard about... And what can I say - in order to stay with a good relationship to my Neighbours, the Dynavox Amps sound great and loud enough! Just ONE Thing i must buy in the next time: Some equipment to measure the TSP of my Speakers, to be sure what they do beyond what my ears can judge ;-) 😁😁😁😁
Great video!!! Big fan of your tech talk. One of the reasons for bigger gaps in car audio woofers is because these drivers are extremely abused and pushed to insane excursion for spl and "cool" woofer cone flapping demos...the larger gap preventes damage to a certain extent
Yeah, it has a lot of powerful tools, but the quality of the D/A conversion, analog output stage, and power supply are about the same as a $49 CD player. Those things can really flatten the sound stage and suck the life out of the music. Spend a little on a decent DAC and a good passive filter and you will be miles ahead in performance and sound quality.
From an engineering standpoint they're great. They do everything you could ask for, but they don't sound good at all, really bad actually. Think about it. They sell direct so they build those devices for 1/2 to 1/3rd of retail. Take away all the functionality and everything else that goes into them and ask yourself what they had left for the parts that matter. What do they use for a power supply? Is it a $12 wall wart?
Danny Sorry didn’t understand U mean MiniDSP is not great or LXMini series speakers not great Linkwiz is a master in publishing the LXMini and Lx521 also all new high end system sellers all using active and class d. If my room has issue I can control with dsp not possible with passive
I was referring to the MiniDSP. Devices like that should never be in the signal path of any high end system. And room correction (above 200Hz) does not fix the problem. It is just a band aid. It will only adjust amplitude in that range. To correct room related issues requires room treatment.
@@dannyrichie9743 I meant what's on the spec sheet vs whats measured. In other words people think they can design a crossover based on the spec sheet and graphs of the driver manufacturer..which is most likely in an anechoic chamber..
@@OCDHIFiGuy Driver specs don't included the information needed for crossover design. The application (box size, baffle size, driver spacing, time alignment) dictates more about the crossover design.
@@OCDHIFiGuy If you try this, please make a video about it, when finished. Was thinking about it also, Open Baffle subs by GR-Research with Maggies should work great
Danny, What are the advantages and disadvantages of bi- or tri-amping a large (3-way) speaker system? This avoids the clipping of the bass amp bleeding distortion into the tweeters and mids, as I’m sure you know. Obviously the cost for more amps is significant, but how about signal path and crossover harmonic and phase distortions? Or other problems? I am the owner of 2 of the following speakers with drivers that obviously need repair in the “foam” surrounds. The mids are missing the soft “foam” surround rings and I think one or both of the ribbon tweeters are blown? However, I think the X-over components and wiring inside are decent. They’ve been in storage for years so I don’t know. These were set up to be bi-amped without an external crossover. I never fully understood that? I used them both ways. Very efficient (~93 dB) as advertised. My questions are: can these be salvaged? Or is the design so poor that it isn’t worth it? They are for a large but not gigantic room. Can any of the components be salvaged for use in a better cabinet using repaired drivers and the X-over and wiring components? They are gigantic and heavy. I live in NW Texas and could deliver them to you you myself so that mitigates the shipping costs. Or are they so poorly designed that selling them as is and buying a new speaker system would be more economical and satisfying? Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks. I tried everything I could to send a couple of photos. I failed. The VMPS Towers are Super Towers IIa/R with QSO HOLOSONICS. SPECIAL EDITION W/WONDERCAPS, SUPERDOMES. 8 Ohm Impedance and POWERLINE II. Probably a lot of marketing hocum? They were great for giant spaces but not for any clarity at all. I’ll work on sending you a couple of pictures if I can get your email address. Thanks again.  
Without even getting into the question about bi-amp or tri-amping those speakers, let's consider those speakers. I'm pretty familiar with most of their product line and have designed upgrades for a few models that could be fixed. Most models (like yours) suffer from a number of issues that are not fixable. I've measured the model up from that one and found that even though the woofers are very different they all shared the same air space. And none of the lower drivers had any crossover on them at all. They just all played as high up as they would reach. The large box was also unbraced and resonated wildly. The acoustic centers of the drivers or each group of drivers are too far apart. And the use of multiple tweeters causes significant comb filtering. Drivers were even acoustically in phase and had cancellation effects all over the place. And what few parts that were on them (I can't really call them a crossover) was just enough to keep the drivers from blowing up. Unfortunately there isn't much there worth salvaging.
Danny Richie Thanks for responding so quickly. From all have learned since I bought them I had figured as much. I moved on to better speakers years ago. Maybe I’ll look into building one of your DIY kits in the future. Thanks again.
Thank you for the inside perspective on the speaker and driver approach to making stuff, marqueting and some obvious mistakes like'Bigger is better' kind of thinking. I enjoy your videos greatly. Keep up the good work!
Firstly, a huge congratulations is in order to Ron and Sarah for the new additions to their family! On a lesser note, how can anyone expect a X-over to be designed fully and correctly for them without sending the entire spkr? That just seems silly to me. There’s just seems to be many more variables involved. You’d think that’d be common knowledge to a spkr manufacturer, but what do I know? I’m not in spkr design. Thanks for yet another great vid, Danny. Congrats again to you, Ron and Sarah!
Congratulations Ron! Thanks GR/ Danny for another informative video. What a great hobby..... answer yes or yes. Beats hunting defenseless deer, with night still cameras, blinds and powerful optics... *Its hunting season up here in the Frozen North....
For dipole open baffle , check the motor noise coming from the back of the driver . Ideally you would like it to be silent throughout the full stroke up to X-max , but a lot of drivers don't do that . Wrt TSP parameters , often overlooked is the Rms value (mechanical losses) . Lower is better for detailed reproduction at low listening levels . This should always be compared relative to Sd (surface area) . A value of 2 is great for a 12 inch woofer but lousy for a 5 inch which would need to be around 0.3
I appreciate your honesty and direct approach. I have asked another speaker distributor some simple questions and all I got back was an echo of what I already said and was left in the dark about my simple question as if I never asked it. I think a lot of the mystery of speaker drivers is the simple deception that is put out there and the misinformation by know-it-alls . . . who basically are ignorant and a bunch of windbags. In this video, there was simplicity, honesty, and plain language about driver design, cone material, and how to utilize them into a system. Yes, it is more complicated than just looking at specs and the appearance of a driver and saying I like that one, but even that was touched on in this video. A word to the wise should be sufficient, but I think many people in their arrogance not only set themselves up for failure, but also to be taken by a price tag, advertising hype, and the difficulty in finding real truth on all levels of speaker design and what goes into it. Thank you.
I am willing to bet the expensive driver that you are talking about Danny that didn't measure well was the 8" SEAS Exotic Driver, how did I do? Well at least its a beautiful driver to look at. BTW everyone, Danny is truly one of the good guys in the audio business . All the best & much happiness Ron & Sara!!!!!
I came accross you videos recently. The more I indulge in yr talk , the more I get engrossed with the content of a given subject . I recognise more clarity n detail for what matters more . I say in short that there is more "meat" in yr discourse . Well done Richie . Cheers from Philip
There are a lot of basic design principles that are ignored with design that will cause limitations. Those include driver spacing issues, heavy moving mass drivers handling the mid-range, large baffles, limited front to back wave separation of the low end, etc.
The crossover is not what you want to see in high end audio. There are connections made with screws and connectors. You never want to use an iron core inductor on any driver covering the mid-range (that causes smearing). They use decent but still budget level resistors. They use budget level binding posts. It's a budget level crossover. The real question is what does the measured response look like on axis and in the vertical and horizontal off axis. And swapping parts in and out to voice the speaker to the environment is a bit backwards. You want a speaker that has been voiced for accuracy. And then treat your room to control the voicing and room response.
Amazing how he films these videos all in one take, and speaks so eloquently and precisely. Anybody else notice that?
How I wish we had companies in the UK that offer such a helpful and reasonable service regarding d.i.y loudspeakers.
everything is overpriced there. BY A LOT.
Totally agree with you mate. The service you get over here is shocking compared to America.
All you get is pushy salesmen trying to push the gear they make the most profit on!
I would love to start a company like this that truly looks after the customer and their individual needs. I'm skint though so that's not going to happen.... :)
Congrats ron and fam on the new additions!!!
Good to see you Danny! I think you should make up a special set of speakers "The Twins Edition" for Sarah, she did all the hard work! Another great episode, I learn something every week. Ron, Sarah, and Georgia Congratulations!
A video of just keeping it real. Thumbs up!
Do you have a list of GR-Research crossover upgrades for various vintage speakers?
No problem. Life happens, so we deal with it and move on!
Congratulations Ron and Sara. Your going to have your hands full! I worked for an Auto Parts and Machine Shop company back in the 80's. It was a family owned and we'll run business and one of the best jobs I've ever had. The owner bought Parts in bulk direct from the manufacturer or Warehouse at a huge discount. It was a smart way to go because we could pass the savings on to the customers. One of our sales representatives, who sold us several product lines from Tucson, always came in looking well groomed and dressed. We didn't see him for a week and when he came in his shirt was wrinkled, hair disheveled, tie crooked and shoes scuffed.when he had finished conducting business my bass asked him what was going on, if everything was ok and if he could help if it wasn't. His answer was that he had missed a week because his wife had given birth..... to triplets! I hope you manage to get some sleep and everything is going well for your expanding family!
Thanks for taking a lot of the mystery out of speaker design!
Paper and Wood. Nature’s Composite materials.
anyone remember JVC that driver cone made from japanese sake barrel wood?? thats interesting one.
Yes. Was that in the 1990's?
thank you so much more making these videos
Another terrific video Danny! I'm wondering if you have an archive of redesigned crossovers for popular speakers people have sent in for measurements. If so and if someone owns one of those speakers would you be willing to sell that information?
Hundreds of them. Just ask me about what you have. You never know...
Hey@@dannyrichie9743 have you ever modified a the Definitive Technology Bp10 crossover?
Can you guys review the Lii Audio drivers, like the F15, F10, and Crystal-10? I hear they are phenomenal drivers, especially for their price. Very efficient, light mass, fast speed, really good range. Decware and Caintuck have been big on them:
www.lii-audio.com/product/recommended-15-full-range-speaker-driver-for-music-loudspeaker-with-tube-amplifier-f-15-in-pair
How would the M165NQ do in a sealed enclosure for mid range duty? The website specifies it was designed for open baffle applications. Thanks
GR will be getting my well earned money soon :)
Of cause did he get twins, he is a real hi-fi guy and only stereo is good enough:-)
I hope you'll please will answer this maybe impossible question: If I chose to ask you to build a complete custom kit only to assemble at home. How much would that speaker cost, if I had to buy that speaker at a reputable mass producing high end brand? 2 x, 4 x, 10 x ? :-)
I need a really good 6" drivers for some JSE Infinite Slope model 2's. The speaker is 125 lbs...has 5 drivers. The third on down from the top is toast. I need to replace them. And thoughts? I think I need a full range driver for this thing...
Congratulations!
Did You ever design a band pass using two inductively coupled swing circuits? And why if not. I ask because I think about building such a thing for my newly acquired Dayton Audio exciters.
Hi Danny,how Do I get intouch with you to order a complete kit,based on that polymer frame driver in front of you,matching tweeter and crossover, and cabinet size,baffle width and heighth,I am a cabinet maker so will make my own cabinets,with shipping to Australia.I have learnt a lot watching your videos,and glad Ron decided to make them.
Regards John
Audio equipment engineering can trip over the physics of acoustical engineering. For bigger and bigger magnets (or bass components in general) to do what car audio people seem to imagine that they can do, either the car has to be opened up in a large space where the audio output is no longer particularly associated with the vehicle environment, or the vehicle interior has to be resized to something exceeding a half wavelength of the bass signals desired (around 30 ft.@20Hz!). Otherwise, the result will just be more of what I hear from these systems all the time--more standing waves and smothering and blurring going on than any amount of money, or any size magnets, will ever fix.
Thanks for the video. I have some Briklin DM250 speakers and have replaced the tweeters with Mission 733 tweeters. Is it better to use the crossover from the existing Briklin bass or should I substitute the crossover that I have from the mission tweeters?
What do you think of silk dome tweeters? I love their sound but so delicate and seem easy to pop and not take much volume. I like ribbons but did not know they were so fragile.
I got that need of Yours to have the speakers on ya work bench. But if one had to send his speakers from europe, the whole idea gets unattractive from the costs.
My first speakers that came with my Decca music center had egg-box cardboard cones and something weird going on with a clear plastic thing with a circular brush for the tweeters ^^
Hi Danny😉 Isn't it about time to do an episode on fullrange drivers.... pros and cons.
I bought a pair of Cube Audio Magus 10" drivers last year, build a clone cabinet of their finished product....and behold🙃
I now have the best pair of speakers I have ever owned in my 30+ years of hi-fi. They are THAT good.
Hello Danny, what software could we use to take a snapshot of response time as you mention? Thank you.
What about large voice coils, underhung voice coils, copper shorting rings?
Thanks Danny loved this one and tweeter vid as well. Thanks as always for your time. Happy Thanksgiving. Thanks, NRD . AKA BigPoppa.❤️✌️
Lot of respect for what Danny is doing here. Great for the hobby as a whole.
I really enjoy these videos. If I had professors in college that taught(and spoke English) in the same coherent way he does, I would have done much better.
I enjoyed watching this video. On some of the builder groups, a common argument is active vs passive crossovers. The active argument is that you can correct all those resonance and response curve issues using a DSP, but the reality is, like you did your research on cone materials, why spend so much time correcting it, when a proper driver could be chosen instead? I guess some people like to have to fix everything when the answer is proper research lol.
If that is the argument for active vs passive, then you are arguing the wrong merits of active. The exact same driver should be chosen for both, where active comes into it's own is in it's ability to smooth out the drivers flaws. If you spend any time researching drivers, you will quickly discover there is no such thing as a "perfect" driver. Even drivers costing thousands of dollars each are far from perfectly smooth, they all have peaks and troughs. Active allows you to smooth out those bumps with a lot more ease, but the real benefits of active is not in it's ability to smooth out a response curve, it is in how it sounds so much better removing the passive crossover. You would have to spend some SERIOUS cash on a passive crossover to come close to what can be applied digitally. The mere existence of the passive components is what wrecks the sound.
Nice. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.
HOW LOUD THEY PLAY WITHOUT DISTORTION???
These videos are SOOOO good. Thank you, guys!
Do you have any opinion on Dayton Audio or HiVi?
Excellent and informative video.
Hi ! first of all thank you very much for the excellent videos and advices. I have a question about drivers selection process ... is the selection done basically on the results from listening tests ? i am referring to the point where you mention good sounding drivers. Or do you also run measurements of any kind to help the selection ? Thanks a lot. Kind regards, gino
Measurements are looked at first and the T/S parameters have to be such that the drivers work well in the application that they are considered for. And then they are used in actual designs and listened to.
@@dannyrichie9743 thank you very much indeed for the kind and valuable advice. I am finding your videos exceptionally educational. And your creations are splendid indeed. Kindest regards, gino
Another great episode.
Did you ever think of designing improved crossover for some super popular speakers like B&W 600 series, Elac latest models, Polk Signature S20... it would be lot easier to sell a crossover that fits inside the existing space for easy swap .
Every B&W owner would pay say 200usd for a crossover that would have much higher quality caps in the tweeter filter , and better sounding crossover....
How much time do you spend on Tweeter filter capacitor voicing ?
Do you think adding small 0.1uf or 0.01uf bypass to main value tweeter cap as upgrade?
I have upgraded some of those popular models.
I have spent quite a bit of time comparing capacitors with different tweeters. I do have my favorites.
And yes, by-passing a tweeter cap can make quite an improvement sometimes when done right.
@@dannyrichie9743 Thanks Danny, do you think that tweeters with freq response to say 47KHz( knowing we can hear up to 15KHz I'm 47 yrs old) make sense due to their airness , and better harmonics ?
Specially for such tweeter (like in my current B&W 686s2 ) can tiny bypass cap of great quality like 0.01usd further elevate clarity and airy feeling to the highs and soundstage? I did notice it with my ears , but I can not confirm it by measurements as I do not have such equipment or knowledge , i did it all by ear tests....
@@kdomster9141 Imaging and spatial cues are maintained with a tweeter that extends out to 20kHz. I don't know just how much is improved by playing beyond that.
And some of the B&W tweeters can be q bit aggressive way up high. That's where some of those metal dome really start to ring.
And the by-pass caps can help discharge the stored energy in the larger cap and clean things will down into a range well below what will pass through the smaller by-pass cap.
@@dannyrichie9743 Thank you , these new b&w tweeters with dual ring have more lush sound but still have speed of metal dome after using my capacitor mix it is now sounding much less harsh , no siblance, and pin point harmonics of acoustic guitar or high treble are very fast and pleasant....with airness of almost AMT tweeters .
Changing cheap poly cap from tweeter filter worked very well.... maybe one day I will get your open baffle kit ?
When you have a pair of speakers that need to have the drivers replaced, how can you pick the correct woofer for the size cabinet you have?
Do you sell drivers, and if so are you still a Focal Dealer?
I am no longer a Focal dealer. I wish it were as easy as just swapping out drivers, but a driver change will also mean a change to the crossover design.
As a speaker builder myself, I like to take a nice crossover and add speakers that I know the response of, to match up the sound I want. I build very specialized boxes but it still comes down to what the crossover can do to make them sound right. This never changes,even when I build monster's. (for customers).
Great info!🤗🤗😁😁😁🤓🤓 Just GREAT!😎 I always thought using expensive material didn't have to mean better sound as usually is the advertised reason for the manufacture using that expensive material! Im a paper guy myself!😉 Are you also in the belief that midrange electonics is a good place to end the upgrade chase? I have an older 38 pound Japan made Denon 3801 and it sounds so good. Although atleast price wise there is sooo much more expensive out there! I can't imagine my system sounding much better but I sure my JBL 590s would really love a pair of Macintosh mono blocks!😁😁😁😁🤗
Mac Monoblocks? I think I would really love them too. My JBL 4341 Clones would love them too. But since I am a retired guy with not that big income, I must be satisfied with my Dynavox stereo Amps that I use as monoblocks. I did not bridge them, just vertical Bi-amping was the deal for me... And this also works great - to a price an AudioFile has to laugh hard about... And what can I say - in order to stay with a good relationship to my Neighbours, the Dynavox Amps sound great and loud enough! Just ONE Thing i must buy in the next time: Some equipment to measure the TSP of my Speakers, to be sure what they do beyond what my ears can judge ;-) 😁😁😁😁
Written apology bi dia
What driver is that metal cone woofer? Great video!
I think it's a hivi driver. Silver version of the one from the overnight sensations.
what's heighth? height?
Congratulations on the births, Ron! Amazing!
Hey Congratulations Ron and Sarah. Another great Video Danny. Thank you very much!
Great video!!! Big fan of your tech talk. One of the reasons for bigger gaps in car audio woofers is because these drivers are extremely abused and pushed to insane excursion for spl and "cool" woofer cone flapping demos...the larger gap preventes damage to a certain extent
Congrats on the new additions and thanks Danny for sharing your experience based insights.
I am an active crossover fan love the functionality and flexibility rather than a passive crossover. MiniDSP is a superb product
Yeah, it has a lot of powerful tools, but the quality of the D/A conversion, analog output stage, and power supply are about the same as a $49 CD player. Those things can really flatten the sound stage and suck the life out of the music. Spend a little on a decent DAC and a good passive filter and you will be miles ahead in performance and sound quality.
Danny if that was the case why would SL allow active crossover in LXMini or 521 systems. LinkwiZ highly respected in DIY community
From an engineering standpoint they're great. They do everything you could ask for, but they don't sound good at all, really bad actually.
Think about it. They sell direct so they build those devices for 1/2 to 1/3rd of retail. Take away all the functionality and everything else that goes into them and ask yourself what they had left for the parts that matter. What do they use for a power supply? Is it a $12 wall wart?
Danny Sorry didn’t understand
U mean MiniDSP is not great or LXMini series speakers not great
Linkwiz is a master in publishing the LXMini and Lx521 also all new high end system sellers all using active and class d. If my room has issue I can control with dsp not possible with passive
I was referring to the MiniDSP. Devices like that should never be in the signal path of any high end system. And room correction (above 200Hz) does not fix the problem. It is just a band aid. It will only adjust amplitude in that range. To correct room related issues requires room treatment.
So true, Danny. Let me ask. Have you ever even once seen the manufacturer supplied TS parameters on the driver match what you measure ?
I often see them within normal tolerances one would expect between drivers.
@@dannyrichie9743 I meant what's on the spec sheet vs whats measured. In other words people think they can design a crossover based on the spec sheet and graphs of the driver manufacturer..which is most likely in an anechoic chamber..
@@OCDHIFiGuy Driver specs don't included the information needed for crossover design. The application (box size, baffle size, driver spacing, time alignment) dictates more about the crossover design.
@@dannyrichie9743 Cool My man. Looking forward to trying your open baffle sub designs for the Magnepans. Ill bet its a big difference.
@@OCDHIFiGuy If you try this, please make a video about it, when finished. Was thinking about it also, Open Baffle subs by GR-Research with Maggies should work great
Danny, What are the advantages and disadvantages of bi- or tri-amping a large (3-way) speaker system? This avoids the clipping of the bass amp bleeding distortion into the tweeters and mids, as I’m sure you know. Obviously the cost for more amps is significant, but how about signal path and crossover harmonic and phase distortions? Or other problems? I am the owner of 2 of the following speakers with drivers that obviously need repair in the “foam” surrounds. The mids are missing the soft “foam” surround rings and I think one or both of the ribbon tweeters are blown? However, I think the X-over components and wiring inside are decent. They’ve been in storage for years so I don’t know. These were set up to be bi-amped without an external crossover. I never fully understood that? I used them both ways. Very efficient (~93 dB) as advertised. My questions are: can these be salvaged? Or is the design so poor that it isn’t worth it? They are for a large but not gigantic room. Can any of the components be salvaged for use in a better cabinet using repaired drivers and the X-over and wiring components? They are gigantic and heavy. I live in NW Texas and could deliver them to you you myself so that mitigates the shipping costs. Or are they so poorly designed that selling them as is and buying a new speaker system would be more economical and satisfying? Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks. I tried everything I could to send a couple of photos. I failed. The VMPS Towers are Super Towers IIa/R with QSO HOLOSONICS. SPECIAL EDITION W/WONDERCAPS, SUPERDOMES. 8 Ohm Impedance and POWERLINE II. Probably a lot of marketing hocum? They were great for giant spaces but not for any clarity at all. I’ll work on sending you a couple of pictures if I can get your email address. Thanks again.
 
Without even getting into the question about bi-amp or tri-amping those speakers, let's consider those speakers.
I'm pretty familiar with most of their product line and have designed upgrades for a few models that could be fixed. Most models (like yours) suffer from a number of issues that are not fixable.
I've measured the model up from that one and found that even though the woofers are very different they all shared the same air space. And none of the lower drivers had any crossover on them at all. They just all played as high up as they would reach. The large box was also unbraced and resonated wildly. The acoustic centers of the drivers or each group of drivers are too far apart. And the use of multiple tweeters causes significant comb filtering. Drivers were even acoustically in phase and had cancellation effects all over the place. And what few parts that were on them (I can't really call them a crossover) was just enough to keep the drivers from blowing up.
Unfortunately there isn't much there worth salvaging.
Danny Richie Thanks for responding so quickly. From all have learned since I bought them I had figured as much. I moved on to better speakers years ago. Maybe I’ll look into building one of your DIY kits in the future. Thanks again.
Thank you for the inside perspective on the speaker and driver approach to making stuff, marqueting and some obvious mistakes like'Bigger is better' kind of thinking. I enjoy your videos greatly. Keep up the good work!
Firstly, a huge congratulations is in order to Ron and Sarah for the new additions to their family!
On a lesser note, how can anyone expect a X-over to be designed fully and correctly for them without sending the entire spkr? That just seems silly to me. There’s just seems to be many more variables involved. You’d think that’d be common knowledge to a spkr manufacturer, but what do I know? I’m not in spkr design.
Thanks for yet another great vid, Danny.
Congrats again to you, Ron and Sarah!
Congratulations Ron! Thanks GR/ Danny for another informative video. What a great hobby..... answer yes or yes. Beats hunting defenseless deer, with night still cameras, blinds and powerful optics... *Its hunting season up here in the Frozen North....
For dipole open baffle , check the motor noise coming from the back of the driver . Ideally you would like it to be silent throughout the full stroke up to X-max , but a lot of drivers don't do that . Wrt TSP parameters , often overlooked is the Rms value (mechanical losses) . Lower is better for detailed reproduction at low listening levels . This should always be compared relative to Sd (surface area) . A value of 2 is great for a 12 inch woofer but lousy for a 5 inch which would need to be around 0.3
I appreciate your honesty and direct approach. I have asked another speaker distributor some simple questions and all I got back was an echo of what I already said and was left in the dark about my simple question as if I never asked it.
I think a lot of the mystery of speaker drivers is the simple deception that is put out there and the misinformation by know-it-alls . . . who basically are ignorant and a bunch of windbags.
In this video, there was simplicity, honesty, and plain language about driver design, cone material, and how to utilize them into a system. Yes, it is more complicated than just looking at specs and the appearance of a driver and saying I like that one, but even that was touched on in this video. A word to the wise should be sufficient, but I think many people in their arrogance not only set themselves up for failure, but also to be taken by a price tag, advertising hype, and the difficulty in finding real truth on all levels of speaker design and what goes into it. Thank you.
I am willing to bet the expensive driver that you are talking about Danny that didn't measure well was the 8" SEAS Exotic Driver, how did I do? Well at least its a beautiful driver to look at. BTW everyone, Danny is truly one of the good guys in the audio business . All the best & much happiness Ron & Sara!!!!!
I came accross you videos recently. The more I indulge in yr talk , the more I get engrossed with the content of a given subject . I recognise more clarity n detail for what matters more . I say in short that there is more "meat" in yr discourse . Well done Richie . Cheers from Philip
thanks for another great video full of useful knowledge. i look forward to doing a diy build from u when i get some money
I love the Accuton ceramic driver and tweeters. They are just amazing.
is that help who need DIY speakers ?
This video was incredibly helpful.
Awesome information!! Thank You!!
Thanks Danny, for another good video.
Are speaker parameters/measurements deceptive?
Loved the video. Really informative !
Great video!
awesome
So much good information.
Would be really interested what you think about the components of the Trio15 Open Baffle Speakers by PureAudioProject?!?! Great Videos btw ;-)
Is this it? www.pureaudioproject.com/product/leonidas-variations/
There are a lot of basic design principles that are ignored with design that will cause limitations. Those include driver spacing issues, heavy moving mass drivers handling the mid-range, large baffles, limited front to back wave separation of the low end, etc.
The crossover is not what you want to see in high end audio. There are connections made with screws and connectors. You never want to use an iron core inductor on any driver covering the mid-range (that causes smearing). They use decent but still budget level resistors. They use budget level binding posts. It's a budget level crossover.
The real question is what does the measured response look like on axis and in the vertical and horizontal off axis.
And swapping parts in and out to voice the speaker to the environment is a bit backwards. You want a speaker that has been voiced for accuracy. And then treat your room to control the voicing and room response.
@@dannyrichie9743 Thank you for your fast respond. So i'll keep thinking about your NX-Oticas ;-)
Good advice👍
AUGURI PRE IL GEMELLI !!!!