Putting the basic shields in S tier and others that are straight up better below it is why I love your tier lists. Most people wouldn't do it, but it makes perfect sense, in that getting any normal shield is a huge upgrade and after that most of them are not that big of a change.
He doesn't ever explicitly say what the purpose of the tier list is but I suppose it's to help you decide what items to appreciate the most. I would contend that that's not particularly helpful. I would much rather have a tier list which helped you with the choices that you are presented with in the game. I believe that if he thought about it and said explicitly what good the list is to anyone he would see that himself. It seems like you're saying that the tier list should show somehow how big of an upgrade you get when first encounter the item. But that's a) a little less useful to know, and b) obscures which items are even upgrades of what you currently have or not and c) there is very little consensus as to what you're upgrading from. I have to decode his tier lists and reorganize them to make any relevant choices while playing.
@@MrTkharris a) How so? It's a measure of power taking into consideration the totality of options available to the player up to the first possibility of acquisition. b) This takes into account any and all items you have available to acquire at that time. Effectively ranking them in power/utility versus any and all other available options you might or might not have. c) Completely irrelevant, see b. He also takes into account the long-term value of an item (i.e. best in slot) but he seems to weigh that less than the power/utility offered at the time you can acquire the item. The whole purpose of the tier list is to compare the value of an item against all other potential items you might have at the time of acquisition to help you determine at that time if you should consider using it (in the case of building for optimal play). You don't need to compare an item individually to all other options, you compare it to the best option and if it's worse you compare it to the next best option until you determine which item it is better than and which item it is worse than. That's how tier lists work. The only difference is that he compares an item only to items that could have been acquired prior to or at the same time as the item being compared.
Kethric’s Shield & the Sentinel Shield have saved so many multiclass builds for me. Only two feats? No problem. Here’s another +1 to your save DCs or +3 to your initiative.
I wish melee damage dealers weren't so incentivized to use two-handed weapons. The fact that archers and casters have the biggest use for shields is just goofy imo.
@FinalOven_Mint Yeah I tried that on Minthara but great weapon fighting is just too good to pass up since it rerolls smite dice. Plus if you're out of spell slots you still do good damage thanks to GWM. I wish there was an equivalent feat for one handed weapons.
@@austingoodman2177 maybe a feat or an enhancement to two-weapon fighting to give you a free offhand attack when you attack with your main hand (instead of using a bonus action).
I love those tier lists, The only suggestion I have in terms of editing would be to have a screenshot of the in-game tooltip of the item you are currently talking about, on the right side of the screen where there is a lot of empty space anyway. It would help a lot following along and visually place the item within the context of the game.
Agreed and it'd be nice to see the item equipped on a character, as well. The BG of these videos gets really boring after a while and honestly, who doesn't care what their items look like. Granted, the rest is pretty good and obviously the most important... so these are pretty minor issues. Thanks for your work.
Abdell trusted shield may not be great, but has a amazing history beyond The character that gives it to you is based in the father of a played, who was a big fan of the first two games, but passed way before the game came. I don't remember the details and can't search it now, but def worth for you to search about it
U forgot to mention something, bout knocking ppl prone with shield bash and being prone in general makes, all of the remainder characters that have actions available, can make an attack roll on the prone target with advantage! Insane ability as a reaction. Thx for all the work and passion u put into the videos they're really detailed, to let the player base know the how and why to optimize something that we can CHOOSE to do. And not do so because we lack the knowledge of something. Vs we chose to not optimize (cause of RP purposes, lazyness or whatever)
46:25 I think the reason for that is how the effect is coded. It probably says something like "If targetting this character with a ranged attack, target self instead." Since the "self" is always within 5 feet, the game sees it as making a ranged attack in melee and imposes disadvantage on the attack roll. Edit: Just tested it out, characters with Crossbow Expert do indeed not get disadvantage on the attack (or at least the game says they do not). So it is very likely coded that way.
Would actually be pretty easy to find out if it that is true, just equip someone with it, go into turn-based mode, activate Reflective Shell and have someone with Crossbow Expert attack them with a crossbow. If the attack has disadvantage, its something else.
I think the safeguard shield should be S tier just because early game +1 to saving throws is amazing and it can be gotten as your first shield very easily (sold by dammon in druid grove) and it isnt outclassed ever as no other shield boosts saving throws directly, its also exceptionally good on melee characters that have poor spell saves or MAD characters that cant take high wisdom. Very very good shield to use until the adamantine can be unlocked or even after if you have other shield users/want other adamantine gear.
Because this comment is getting decent traction i wanted to add some reasons this is lowkey my pick for top 3 shields regardless of being gotten in early act 1. +1 to every saving throw is simply insane, ring/cloak of protection are considered the best ring and cloak not just because of the ac but because of the saving throw too and this is effectively just those with one more ac. It synergizes massively with shield master feat negating dmg on successful dex saves. Most other shield benefits can be gotten from other equipment but better whereas a +1 to all saving throws is basically a ring/cloak of protection exclusive. There is not a single build in this game that doesnt get good benefit from +1 saving throws where every other shield works best in a single build (ketherics is just meh on a non-spellcaster, adamantine works best with heavy armour/high dex, etc) making this the most versatile. I just cannot stop gushing about this thing, the only bad thing about it is that it doesnt fit any one build the best as most builds benefit more from one specific shield. Uncommon rarity and being sold in act 1 are the only reason i think this doesnt get talked about more, lowkey op til you get the more build specific shields.
I went back and forth between S and A tier for the safeguard - it's obviously a totally free early upgrade, so you'll wear it 100% of the time, which makes it S tier according to my ranking criteria, but I also wanted to differentiate between the adamantine shield and the other act 1 shields in terms of sheer power level, so in the end I went with A
Just discovered your channel like a week ago but I've already watched like 10 of your videos. Finsing someone who gputs out daily high quality content each day is truly special and I especially love your most fun subclasses videos. I know your guides are supposed to make it easier for Player who try to accomplish playing the game in honor mode but I belive giving the people just hits and tips and letting them the Chance to discover themselves is the way to go for atleast the majority of players. Love your content, could listen to you for hours and greetings from germany! Here are just some video ideas which I would personaly really enjoy to watch: romance options (which have the most depth), unique party compositions, races tier list (unique dialogue options) and which is would probably enjoy the most a whole playthrough of yours :)
Perfect timing as always! Just started a wildmagic barbarian/Ancients Paladin for an attempt at Pelinal Whitestrake from The Elder Scrolls and he uses a mace and shield.
My current honour mode run has two Adamantine shields in the party (only took me 10 months to figure out you can use the same mould twice). Three combats from the end of the game and nobody has taken a critical hit since Act 2
I know it would take much more work, but showing footage of the item/spell/whatever you’re ranking while you’re talking about it would definitely push your content to another level. Great vid tho!!
I love that this video exists because I feel that shields are somewhat underrated by the community. I use them wherever feasible even if it's a damage downgrade for a melee character. The exceptions are anyone who has access to mage shield and rogues.
The Shield of Shielding is nice to have in the end game when you’re just trying to make it up a ramp without being slammed by magic missile attacks, if you’re not a wizard with the shield spell.
Thanks for the videos, they’re very helpful! Have you thought about doing a “rate my party” series? People could send you game files from different points in their play through, and you could help them out / rate their party by telling them how they could respec for optimization, what equipment they could still get (before moving on to the next act for instance), and see if they have managed to create any game breaking builds. That could be fun!
The Shield of Scorching reprisal is pretty fun addition for a radiant orb/cleric spirit guardian runner. I like adding it with the Hat of Fire Acuity. If I am using the luminous armor, I am already max stacking radiant orbs with grouped up enemies, so the extra spell attack roll and damage on opportunity attacks is nice replacement to the holy lance helm. So, run around stacking radiant orb, opportunity attacks deal fire damage and stack fire acuity. Then cast Fireball or scorching ray. Rinse and repeat. Cleans up mobs VERY nicely with a nice combination of damages. It compliments my Fear Sword bard who's applying frighten & reverberation on mass.
I would add that safeguard shield is an incredible utility shield for things with saving throws like the zathisk. Ring of protection etc can stack with this and will make those rolls much easier
Swires Sledboard can be abused with Skinburster. You swing the polearm twice then you switch it to the Sledboard, that way you can keep your force conuit on 4 stacks. Adding in resistances, magical plate and heavy armor master can result in a pretty formidable damage reduction of 10, all that WITHOUT being an abjuration wizard. You may not end up being 100% untouchable, but simply recasting AoA is perfectly fine.
@@AlwaysGrowing0 any improvement to iniciative in Baldur's Gate 3 is very good only because it's a d4 instead of a d20. If it was a d20, this shield would be B tier at max.
Super solid! I really appreciate this line of videos. I wonder with mod support if some items could be moved to drop or be available earlier and then be relevant. If I have one planning and design critique of Larian if is that they made some very cool items that are irrelevant by the time you get them. That and all rhe hidden items they didn't make active. It really limits itemization, especially in weapons. The dearth of good weapons except for swords is disheartening. Dwarves get to use battle axes and Warhammer, cool. Then basically no good battle axes and only a couple of hammers.
Comment to support you! I was ironically looking for this list a few weeks ago when I helped my friends run and we got to moonrise and I was like initiative sheild!? And could hear your advice guiding me to beg him to use it.
shield of devotion is really good on a bladelock, especially if you're using hex frequently, cause hex gets no bonus damage when cast at higher levels, wyll has had this shield since i got it in my honor mod run
I am playing a cool Ironvine Shield build, though it's by no means min maxed. I'm playing a Cleric/Paladin multiclass focusing on Wisdom, Charisma and then Constitution, shoring up my deficiencies with Shillelagh provided by Nature cleric, and the Alert feat, and eventually the Dexterity gloves for my low Dexterity. I wanted to play a dark urge who was saved from death in his mind flayer pod when he was visited by Selune. Thus he begins as a nature cleric, but adds 6 paladin levels for Smite and the level 6 aura. 6/6 cleric paladin of Selune who wants to attack and smite things with his Shillelagh staff most turns while concentrating on Spirit Guardians.
I totally agree thay the normal shield is great, but seeing strict upgrades to it valued below it, especially ones ypu also easily get early on in act one, seems crazy. I feel it should be ranked way lower, maybe B or C, but with noting how its still incredibly good when you dont have the strict upgrades yet.
I am going to actually push back a bit on Sentinel Shield. The +3 initiative is definitely very good, but it doesn't eliminate surprised which is actually very important. Sure it gives advantage on the perception to avoid being surprised, but there are a number of encounters where that doesn't help and you will be surprised no matter what. Also Alert feat and Alert elixirs do completely eclipse this shield and I think it's easy enough to work those into builds. It's still very good for a short time but I would actually put it in A. Also, I wonder if a consideration should be made for the Adamantine shield because it is only accessible if you beat an extremely difficult and completely optional boss encounter.
I never thought of the +1 shield as being that low. I suppose I value total armor class a little more than extra features became it allows me to play lazily haha.
A random guess for why Viconia's reflective shell makes the attack rolls going back have disadvantage: Maybe since most attack rolls are ranged attack rolls, and if someone targets themselves, they are in melee with themselves (by default - at least my guess in how it's been coded), so the attack roll has disadvantage?
Do a party build for explorer difficulty!! I’m trying to get my gf into it and she’s receptive so far, I just wanna make sure she has the best first impression and a lot of fun!!
The Sentinel Shield is just too good. My bard has 14 DEX but with gear that gives initiative bonus I can always have my turn before all other characters, including 20 DEX Astarion. It is amazing to ensure crowd control spells go first and as many enemies as possible are dissabled for their turns so the rest of the party obliterates them one by one.
I submitted a bug report regarding shield bash using the wielder's spellsave DC a few months ago and their response was that they're aware of the issue, so I wouldn't count on it staying this way once patch 7 drops.
I usually skip on the Adamantine shield and take both versions of the Adamantine armour. But thinking about it, I probably should stop doing that. I retire the adamantine armours far faster than I'd retire the shield, both because I hate how they look and because there're better options available faster than I'd get better shields.
It’s here! It happened! Only about 500 more items to rank now ❤ (Not sure I see the logic in putting the ordinary shield in S tier though. It will be replaced as soon as you have access to anything even slightly better. Wouldn’t the same argument then have to apply to the starting medium armours, since they are clearly better than having basic clothes or light armour?)
The difference is a lot of characters with shield proficiency don't start with shields, and going from no shield to any shield is one of the biggest power spikes equipping a new shield can give you. +0 AC bonus to +2 AC bonus is a much bigger difference than eg. +2 AC to +2 AC and +1 to saves
@@Cephalopocalypse right, but by the time you can equip that first shield you’re probably only a fight or 2 away from getting a better one, which will presumably last a lot longer! And to reiterate my point above, there are also characters that will have medium armour proficiency but start with either no armour or poor medium armour.
@@Cephalopocalypse my recollection is that the only non-magical medium armour in your S tier is the Gith half plate, which is an AC upgrade on anything that any class starts with. I see the basic shield as being analogous to the ordinary 13/14 AC medium armours (chain shirt, scale mail) - a significant upgrade for anyone who is proficient but doesn’t start with it, yet replaced fairly quickly. I’m reasonably sure those weren’t in S tier. (I realise I’m massively nitpicking here lol)
I'd put the basic non magical shield in A tier. Even if it is a really really good important early game item, the fact that it sits with the OP shields somewhat diminishes the relative value of said OP shields. The adamantine one is so much better it shouldn't be in the same category for example.
21:05 with respect to the absolute's protector, you wouldn't happen to know if the (with brand of the absolute) -1magic damage taken with the shield, applies to warding bond redirected damaged? it might be useful (if not camp casting warding bond) on a cleric maintaining warding bonds on the party to stack a lot of damage reduction such as: absolute's protector defender flail helldusk armor heavy armor mastery feat combined with the usual hellrider's pride/reviving hands combo to get resistances to physical damage.
I am 99% sure the Wood Woad’s Shield is intended to be used in tandem with Nature’s Snare (a club that has a chance to ensnare upon hit) for a Druid with shillelagh. The fact that it uses Spell Save DC, and the woad’s ensnaring strike is a bonus action (perfect for if you don’t snare on your attack) just makes it such a perfect combo. Truly one of my favorite early game combos for Druid or Nature Cleric. P.S. You can activate shillelagh before a fight so you don’t have to use a bonus action during.
What do you recommend to forge in adamantine forge for general playthrough (without a specific niche build in mind)? The medium armor/ heavy armor/ shield/ something else?
I usually get two armors - usually 1 mid + 1 heavy, or maybe 2 heavy if I have two characters that can use it. But maybe I'll try the shield next time because the heavy armors get outclassed later...
I think the two Armours are better at the time you can get them, but sense they get outclasses in act 3, I found getting two shields is better in the long term. You can basically swap around and have all 4 characters have crit hit removed by act 3
What about hopes +4 ac shield that you get after the house of hope if you kill her after the Raphael fight ;p my paladin who was ac stacking used that one
I didn't think you'd like shields. I knew many shields were great, but I thought the meta was "deal maximal damage" and that would imply using dual weapons or 2 handed
That's definitely one way to play (and what you usually see recommended in youtube guides, in part because big dps numbers are what brings in views). I strongly disagree that it's the only only way to play though, and do a lot of more defensively-focused builds!
Does the shield of devotion still work for multiple sorcerer sorcery points? I got it to work when I first picked it up But stopped working the second time I played with it.
my only problem with this tier list is that you have the basic shield in S, because by that logic since the nonmagical one is S then every other magical shield must be S because its better then the mundane version (tier list is awesomesauce and i dont really care about my comment)
@@Cephalopocalypse yea true, just its a thing that i felt like pointing out cause I'm an ass. but i mean it really doesn't matter tbh and i have watched all of the armor tier lists and cant wait to see what you pump out next!
Irritatingly, tiermaker won't let you save a template without an account, and only allows you to login using your twitter account (I don't have one) or google account (deeply unsecure to share with a random website). So these are made using the single-use templates and not saved anywhere.
I can't believe you put a mundane shield in S tier, and then shields that can be obtained very early that are better in a lower tier. I sort of understand your logic, but it looks insane to see tiered this way. I can't see this being higher than B tier. Essentially you are saying having any shield (other than broken) is great to have, but a mundane shield is quickly made obsolete due to the presence of magical shields. Again, a really whacky decision to tier it this way. I otherwise feel that you have a lot of really solid logic in this list.
@@Cephalopocalypse I did listen to your full explanation. And as I stated, I "sort of" understand your logic -- essentially you are saying that the benefit of a shield is so great that it becomes S tier to have one compared to not. But where I disagree is this is now what the bar is for S, and a shield you get shortly after that has +2 AC AND a boost to saves being only A tier creates an inconsistency. A better shield is rated worse than an inferior shield. I think the issue is you are trying to use your tier list to do 2 things at the same time. One is a traditional rating of all shields. The second is to show the value of a shield overall -- which probably isn't something requires a tier list, and this is what results in the inconsistency.
I mean, the first 3-4 levels of your character will be using that shield. That's pretty prolific and you need 4 magical shields to replace them all for you party. Until then you are certainly using this shield and since he's doing a tier relative to the level you find it in the game. I can't see how it's NOT going to make it
![[FULL] RETROSPECTIVE : Final Fantasy Tactics](/img/n.gif)
Putting the basic shields in S tier and others that are straight up better below it is why I love your tier lists. Most people wouldn't do it, but it makes perfect sense, in that getting any normal shield is a huge upgrade and after that most of them are not that big of a change.
Yep exactly - as a bonus it also makes some people extremely mad so they go nuts in the comments :P
He doesn't ever explicitly say what the purpose of the tier list is but I suppose it's to help you decide what items to appreciate the most. I would contend that that's not particularly helpful. I would much rather have a tier list which helped you with the choices that you are presented with in the game. I believe that if he thought about it and said explicitly what good the list is to anyone he would see that himself.
It seems like you're saying that the tier list should show somehow how big of an upgrade you get when first encounter the item. But that's a) a little less useful to know, and b) obscures which items are even upgrades of what you currently have or not and c) there is very little consensus as to what you're upgrading from. I have to decode his tier lists and reorganize them to make any relevant choices while playing.
@@MrTkharris a) How so? It's a measure of power taking into consideration the totality of options available to the player up to the first possibility of acquisition. b) This takes into account any and all items you have available to acquire at that time. Effectively ranking them in power/utility versus any and all other available options you might or might not have. c) Completely irrelevant, see b.
He also takes into account the long-term value of an item (i.e. best in slot) but he seems to weigh that less than the power/utility offered at the time you can acquire the item.
The whole purpose of the tier list is to compare the value of an item against all other potential items you might have at the time of acquisition to help you determine at that time if you should consider using it (in the case of building for optimal play). You don't need to compare an item individually to all other options, you compare it to the best option and if it's worse you compare it to the next best option until you determine which item it is better than and which item it is worse than. That's how tier lists work. The only difference is that he compares an item only to items that could have been acquired prior to or at the same time as the item being compared.
Kethric’s Shield & the Sentinel Shield have saved so many multiclass builds for me. Only two feats? No problem. Here’s another +1 to your save DCs or +3 to your initiative.
First??? Please name D tier “Gale Food” I beg
I second the name "Gale Food"
I third the name
I second this! Or the F tier!
the broken shield might not be magical enough to be Gale food, but the idea of calling that tier Gale food still is amazing!
Whenever I play, I send all the rotten food I find to Gale
I wish melee damage dealers weren't so incentivized to use two-handed weapons. The fact that archers and casters have the biggest use for shields is just goofy imo.
And then the strongest melee users are just casters using melee spells anyways (or just swords bard but we dont talk about that class)
Yeah, the huge potential to-hit bonus in bg3 makes the choice either gwm or dual wielding.
Ngl sword and board Paladin builds go hard since smites don’t lose much damage with one handers
@FinalOven_Mint Yeah I tried that on Minthara but great weapon fighting is just too good to pass up since it rerolls smite dice. Plus if you're out of spell slots you still do good damage thanks to GWM. I wish there was an equivalent feat for one handed weapons.
@@austingoodman2177 maybe a feat or an enhancement to two-weapon fighting to give you a free offhand attack when you attack with your main hand (instead of using a bonus action).
I love those tier lists,
The only suggestion I have in terms of editing would be to have a screenshot of the in-game tooltip of the item you are currently talking about, on the right side of the screen where there is a lot of empty space anyway.
It would help a lot following along and visually place the item within the context of the game.
bump
Agreed and it'd be nice to see the item equipped on a character, as well. The BG of these videos gets really boring after a while and honestly, who doesn't care what their items look like. Granted, the rest is pretty good and obviously the most important... so these are pretty minor issues. Thanks for your work.
Abdell trusted shield may not be great, but has a amazing history beyond
The character that gives it to you is based in the father of a played, who was a big fan of the first two games, but passed way before the game came. I don't remember the details and can't search it now, but def worth for you to search about it
Love your videos. You have a fantastic voice, deep knowledge and a wicked sense of humour! Appreciate all your effort to put these together for us.
Thanks very much! I appreciate the kind words :D
U forgot to mention something, bout knocking ppl prone with shield bash and being prone in general makes, all of the remainder characters that have actions available, can make an attack roll on the prone target with advantage! Insane ability as a reaction.
Thx for all the work and passion u put into the videos they're really detailed, to let the player base know the how and why to optimize something that we can CHOOSE to do.
And not do so because we lack the knowledge of something. Vs we chose to not optimize (cause of RP purposes, lazyness or whatever)
Ceph this is exactly what I was hoping to see next. I think you will soon have created the definitive BG3 guide. Terrific work!
Your videos made me a BG3 addict. Thank you for all of your hard work in making this game so much more enjoyable.
Thanks very much!
46:25 I think the reason for that is how the effect is coded. It probably says something like "If targetting this character with a ranged attack, target self instead." Since the "self" is always within 5 feet, the game sees it as making a ranged attack in melee and imposes disadvantage on the attack roll.
Edit: Just tested it out, characters with Crossbow Expert do indeed not get disadvantage on the attack (or at least the game says they do not). So it is very likely coded that way.
Would actually be pretty easy to find out if it that is true, just equip someone with it, go into turn-based mode, activate Reflective Shell and have someone with Crossbow Expert attack them with a crossbow. If the attack has disadvantage, its something else.
Good point! That's probably it
I think the safeguard shield should be S tier just because early game +1 to saving throws is amazing and it can be gotten as your first shield very easily (sold by dammon in druid grove) and it isnt outclassed ever as no other shield boosts saving throws directly, its also exceptionally good on melee characters that have poor spell saves or MAD characters that cant take high wisdom. Very very good shield to use until the adamantine can be unlocked or even after if you have other shield users/want other adamantine gear.
Completely agree.
Because this comment is getting decent traction i wanted to add some reasons this is lowkey my pick for top 3 shields regardless of being gotten in early act 1. +1 to every saving throw is simply insane, ring/cloak of protection are considered the best ring and cloak not just because of the ac but because of the saving throw too and this is effectively just those with one more ac. It synergizes massively with shield master feat negating dmg on successful dex saves. Most other shield benefits can be gotten from other equipment but better whereas a +1 to all saving throws is basically a ring/cloak of protection exclusive. There is not a single build in this game that doesnt get good benefit from +1 saving throws where every other shield works best in a single build (ketherics is just meh on a non-spellcaster, adamantine works best with heavy armour/high dex, etc) making this the most versatile. I just cannot stop gushing about this thing, the only bad thing about it is that it doesnt fit any one build the best as most builds benefit more from one specific shield. Uncommon rarity and being sold in act 1 are the only reason i think this doesnt get talked about more, lowkey op til you get the more build specific shields.
I went back and forth between S and A tier for the safeguard - it's obviously a totally free early upgrade, so you'll wear it 100% of the time, which makes it S tier according to my ranking criteria, but I also wanted to differentiate between the adamantine shield and the other act 1 shields in terms of sheer power level, so in the end I went with A
@@Cephalopocalypse yeah that’s very fair
That can be said with any weapon and armor with 1+, but does less damage with some gear and weapon options that the game provides.
Excellent video! You even got the safeguard shield info correct which I was surprised by bc I think a lot of ppl overlook it
Just discovered your channel like a week ago but I've already watched like 10 of your videos. Finsing someone who gputs out daily high quality content each day is truly special and I especially love your most fun subclasses videos. I know your guides are supposed to make it easier for Player who try to accomplish playing the game in honor mode but I belive giving the people just hits and tips and letting them the Chance to discover themselves is the way to go for atleast the majority of players. Love your content, could listen to you for hours and greetings from germany! Here are just some video ideas which I would personaly really enjoy to watch: romance options (which have the most depth), unique party compositions, races tier list (unique dialogue options) and which is would probably enjoy the most a whole playthrough of yours :)
I see a Ceph video, I watch. Great content as usual!
Safeguard shield can help you get through a lot of story events when you need to make saving throws
Very true!
Perfect timing as always! Just started a wildmagic barbarian/Ancients Paladin for an attempt at Pelinal Whitestrake from The Elder Scrolls and he uses a mace and shield.
That is a very cool build idea
@@joegallagher23 why thank you, I can say with certainty it's a fun build so far.
Great guide and very helpful, thank you Ceph! and I agree on naming D Tier "Gale Food" Tier :-)
Great video. It is always disappointing when you get something so late in act III and don’t really get to use it all that much.
My current honour mode run has two Adamantine shields in the party (only took me 10 months to figure out you can use the same mould twice). Three combats from the end of the game and nobody has taken a critical hit since Act 2
I never use shields and now that I've heard you breakdown why they're so good I feel like I'm missing out.
I know it would take much more work, but showing footage of the item/spell/whatever you’re ranking while you’re talking about it would definitely push your content to another level. Great vid tho!!
Absolutely loving these videos, they have been super helpful for optimizing my classes. Keep up the awesome vids man!
I love that this video exists because I feel that shields are somewhat underrated by the community. I use them wherever feasible even if it's a damage downgrade for a melee character. The exceptions are anyone who has access to mage shield and rogues.
The Shield of Shielding is nice to have in the end game when you’re just trying to make it up a ramp without being slammed by magic missile attacks, if you’re not a wizard with the shield spell.
Man, your videos are awesome
Thanks!
Thanks for the videos, they’re very helpful! Have you thought about doing a “rate my party” series? People could send you game files from different points in their play through, and you could help them out / rate their party by telling them how they could respec for optimization, what equipment they could still get (before moving on to the next act for instance), and see if they have managed to create any game breaking builds. That could be fun!
Awesome info as always. Especially appreciate the front end general strategy.
The Shield of Scorching reprisal is pretty fun addition for a radiant orb/cleric spirit guardian runner.
I like adding it with the Hat of Fire Acuity. If I am using the luminous armor, I am already max stacking radiant orbs with grouped up enemies, so the extra spell attack roll and damage on opportunity attacks is nice replacement to the holy lance helm. So, run around stacking radiant orb, opportunity attacks deal fire damage and stack fire acuity.
Then cast Fireball or scorching ray. Rinse and repeat. Cleans up mobs VERY nicely with a nice combination of damages.
It compliments my Fear Sword bard who's applying frighten & reverberation on mass.
I would add that safeguard shield is an incredible utility shield for things with saving throws like the zathisk. Ring of protection etc can stack with this and will make those rolls much easier
Swires Sledboard can be abused with Skinburster. You swing the polearm twice then you switch it to the Sledboard, that way you can keep your force conuit on 4 stacks. Adding in resistances, magical plate and heavy armor master can result in a pretty formidable damage reduction of 10, all that WITHOUT being an abjuration wizard. You may not end up being 100% untouchable, but simply recasting AoA is perfectly fine.
Pretty cool interaction.
The sentinel shield should be legendary, it's that good.
I play a lot of D&D 5e. When I found the Sentinel Shield in Act II, I immediately thought "This is probably the best shield in the game."
@@AlwaysGrowing0 any improvement to iniciative in Baldur's Gate 3 is very good only because it's a d4 instead of a d20. If it was a d20, this shield would be B tier at max.
It looks like C-Tier tho 🤕
Super solid! I really appreciate this line of videos. I wonder with mod support if some items could be moved to drop or be available earlier and then be relevant.
If I have one planning and design critique of Larian if is that they made some very cool items that are irrelevant by the time you get them. That and all rhe hidden items they didn't make active. It really limits itemization, especially in weapons. The dearth of good weapons except for swords is disheartening. Dwarves get to use battle axes and Warhammer, cool. Then basically no good battle axes and only a couple of hammers.
Comment to support you!
I was ironically looking for this list a few weeks ago when I helped my friends run and we got to moonrise and I was like initiative sheild!? And could hear your advice guiding me to beg him to use it.
Finally!!!! Great job, excellent content
shield of devotion is really good on a bladelock, especially if you're using hex frequently, cause hex gets no bonus damage when cast at higher levels, wyll has had this shield since i got it in my honor mod run
basic vendor shield S tier, sounds about right. might be obvious but being immune to crits means being paralyzed won't cause auto crits you.
Good breakdown.
Thanks!
I am playing a cool Ironvine Shield build, though it's by no means min maxed. I'm playing a Cleric/Paladin multiclass focusing on Wisdom, Charisma and then Constitution, shoring up my deficiencies with Shillelagh provided by Nature cleric, and the Alert feat, and eventually the Dexterity gloves for my low Dexterity. I wanted to play a dark urge who was saved from death in his mind flayer pod when he was visited by Selune. Thus he begins as a nature cleric, but adds 6 paladin levels for Smite and the level 6 aura. 6/6 cleric paladin of Selune who wants to attack and smite things with his Shillelagh staff most turns while concentrating on Spirit Guardians.
w00t!
Glad to see ya' did this! :)
I look forward to these video drops
I totally agree thay the normal shield is great, but seeing strict upgrades to it valued below it, especially ones ypu also easily get early on in act one, seems crazy. I feel it should be ranked way lower, maybe B or C, but with noting how its still incredibly good when you dont have the strict upgrades yet.
I am going to actually push back a bit on Sentinel Shield.
The +3 initiative is definitely very good, but it doesn't eliminate surprised which is actually very important. Sure it gives advantage on the perception to avoid being surprised, but there are a number of encounters where that doesn't help and you will be surprised no matter what. Also Alert feat and Alert elixirs do completely eclipse this shield and I think it's easy enough to work those into builds.
It's still very good for a short time but I would actually put it in A.
Also, I wonder if a consideration should be made for the Adamantine shield because it is only accessible if you beat an extremely difficult and completely optional boss encounter.
Active melee bonuses on a character wielding ranged weapons is a baffling design decision, but I might as well take full advantage of it.
Yeah, my Gale, Wyll and Shadowheart are my primary shield users.
I never thought of the +1 shield as being that low. I suppose I value total armor class a little more than extra features became it allows me to play lazily haha.
Silly idea for a quick one - an Illithid Power tier list.
Already done!
Justiciar's great shield I usually give to Shadowheart for storytelling reasons
I rarely run 2h or dual wield melee builds just because shields are so great in this game
A ring list would be sweeeeeet
6:00 My boy Astarion know that well...
Ceph have you played Pathfinder Kingmaker or Wrath of the Righteous? would love to watch a playthrough of those by you.
thanks for the vids!
Seconded! Those games were what I delved into next after completing my 3rd BG3 run
A random guess for why Viconia's reflective shell makes the attack rolls going back have disadvantage:
Maybe since most attack rolls are ranged attack rolls, and if someone targets themselves, they are in melee with themselves (by default - at least my guess in how it's been coded), so the attack roll has disadvantage?
Do a party build for explorer difficulty!! I’m trying to get my gf into it and she’s receptive so far, I just wanna make sure she has the best first impression and a lot of fun!!
The Sentinel Shield is just too good. My bard has 14 DEX but with gear that gives initiative bonus I can always have my turn before all other characters, including 20 DEX Astarion. It is amazing to ensure crowd control spells go first and as many enemies as possible are dissabled for their turns so the rest of the party obliterates them one by one.
I submitted a bug report regarding shield bash using the wielder's spellsave DC a few months ago and their response was that they're aware of the issue, so I wouldn't count on it staying this way once patch 7 drops.
Yeah - in fact they claimed to fix it (to use maneuver DC) in a previous patch but didn't
@@Cephalopocalypse I believe it didn't even do anything between patch 5 and 6. It was just a waste of a reaction before patch 6.
There is one instance in which I would move the Ironvine Shield to B tier. Paring it with the Rat Bat is an awesome effect
The rat bat is a 2H greatclub though. You can’t use it with a shield and you can’t cast shillelagh on it. Do you mean the ironwood club?
@@ProbeAway yes the one that falls from the shambling mound.
I think we're gonna need a lightning charge theme build
maybe storm cleric of talos or something
I usually skip on the Adamantine shield and take both versions of the Adamantine armour. But thinking about it, I probably should stop doing that. I retire the adamantine armours far faster than I'd retire the shield, both because I hate how they look and because there're better options available faster than I'd get better shields.
great work
Wild to see the standard Sheild in s tier and sheilds that do exactly the same thing but with a bonus effect or spell in lower tiers?
The ironvine shield seems to have been built for Spores druids.
It’s here! It happened! Only about 500 more items to rank now ❤
(Not sure I see the logic in putting the ordinary shield in S tier though. It will be replaced as soon as you have access to anything even slightly better. Wouldn’t the same argument then have to apply to the starting medium armours, since they are clearly better than having basic clothes or light armour?)
The difference is a lot of characters with shield proficiency don't start with shields, and going from no shield to any shield is one of the biggest power spikes equipping a new shield can give you. +0 AC bonus to +2 AC bonus is a much bigger difference than eg. +2 AC to +2 AC and +1 to saves
@@Cephalopocalypse right, but by the time you can equip that first shield you’re probably only a fight or 2 away from getting a better one, which will presumably last a lot longer! And to reiterate my point above, there are also characters that will have medium armour proficiency but start with either no armour or poor medium armour.
Yep exactly - that's why the good early game medium armors to upgrade your starting set to are all also in S tier!
@@Cephalopocalypse my recollection is that the only non-magical medium armour in your S tier is the Gith half plate, which is an AC upgrade on anything that any class starts with.
I see the basic shield as being analogous to the ordinary 13/14 AC medium armours (chain shirt, scale mail) - a significant upgrade for anyone who is proficient but doesn’t start with it, yet replaced fairly quickly. I’m reasonably sure those weren’t in S tier.
(I realise I’m massively nitpicking here lol)
I'd put the basic non magical shield in A tier. Even if it is a really really good important early game item, the fact that it sits with the OP shields somewhat diminishes the relative value of said OP shields. The adamantine one is so much better it shouldn't be in the same category for example.
Can you do a tier list for weapons in their respective weapon types
21:05 with respect to the absolute's protector, you wouldn't happen to know if the (with brand of the absolute) -1magic damage taken with the shield, applies to warding bond redirected damaged?
it might be useful (if not camp casting warding bond) on a cleric maintaining warding bonds on the party to stack a lot of damage reduction such as:
absolute's protector
defender flail
helldusk armor
heavy armor mastery feat
combined with the usual hellrider's pride/reviving hands combo to get resistances to physical damage.
Did you skip the fossilized shell shield? I dont see it on the list
I know thats my fave one 😆
Apart from the really distinctive look, it is still just a regular shield
Sadly it's identical to a normal shield even though it looks sweet
I am 99% sure the Wood Woad’s Shield is intended to be used in tandem with Nature’s Snare (a club that has a chance to ensnare upon hit) for a Druid with shillelagh.
The fact that it uses Spell Save DC, and the woad’s ensnaring strike is a bonus action (perfect for if you don’t snare on your attack) just makes it such a perfect combo.
Truly one of my favorite early game combos for Druid or Nature Cleric.
P.S. You can activate shillelagh before a fight so you don’t have to use a bonus action during.
What do you recommend to forge in adamantine forge for general playthrough (without a specific niche build in mind)? The medium armor/ heavy armor/ shield/ something else?
I usually get two armors - usually 1 mid + 1 heavy, or maybe 2 heavy if I have two characters that can use it. But maybe I'll try the shield next time because the heavy armors get outclassed later...
I think the two Armours are better at the time you can get them, but sense they get outclasses in act 3, I found getting two shields is better in the long term. You can basically swap around and have all 4 characters have crit hit removed by act 3
I typically do medium armor and shield. These can be used on the most characters.
Lets get a best hairstyle for each race tierlist lol
Nice, I like shields
To be fair to the AI in regard to the walking fortress, I have shot at Gortash immediately after he activated reflecto guard.
I've never been this early
Oh no, I sold shield of scorching reprisal, I somehow thought fire resistance applies only on activated ability
Yes
Danke!
Thank you so much for the support! I really appreciate it - it really means a lot!
the question is should you get the adamantine shield over the adamantine armor you can get
What about hopes +4 ac shield that you get after the house of hope if you kill her after the Raphael fight ;p my paladin who was ac stacking used that one
That was a bug and has been patched out of the game!
Which is better, 3 AC shield or 2 AC + 1 Saving Throw shield?
🔥🔥🔥
People seem to struggle with this one, but I always thought that Shillelagh was pronounced "Shi-lay-luh".
It's pronounced the way I said it
I didn't think you'd like shields. I knew many shields were great, but I thought the meta was "deal maximal damage" and that would imply using dual weapons or 2 handed
That's definitely one way to play (and what you usually see recommended in youtube guides, in part because big dps numbers are what brings in views). I strongly disagree that it's the only only way to play though, and do a lot of more defensively-focused builds!
Please try golam & Bull 🐂 in BROTATO
Why os the +1 shield an act 2 item? It is available in the emerald grove when you first arrive.
Never tested it, but does the iron one shield stay active if you cast shillelleigh and then wild shape?
I didn’t think to test it
Does the shield of devotion still work for multiple sorcerer sorcery points? I got it to work when I first picked it up But stopped working the second time I played with it.
Why isnt the Iron-Banded Shield +1 not on this tierlist?
SHIELDS!
my only problem with this tier list is that you have the basic shield in S, because by that logic since the nonmagical one is S then every other magical shield must be S because its better then the mundane version (tier list is awesomesauce and i dont really care about my comment)
I explain this in the video - we're ranking their strength by how powerful they are when you first have access to them.
@@Cephalopocalypse yea true, just its a thing that i felt like pointing out cause I'm an ass. but i mean it really doesn't matter tbh and i have watched all of the armor tier lists and cant wait to see what you pump out next!
Do battle masters use their maneuver dc for their spell dc?
WEAPON GUIDE NEXT
Does force conduit AoE from sledboard shield damages allies?
Where that generic +3 AC shield. To be honest though, there is far too many shields in the game for how few classes use them.
Even when I can rock shields I choose not to for drip purposes.
@@CMiY0thats why you go gwm for melee and shield for archers lol
Me: Wow, this shield of shielding is one of the best!
Others: Look at this Noob! 😂😂😂
It's my first run.
I think the tier should be renamed to G, for Gale.
do you have a link to these templates?
Irritatingly, tiermaker won't let you save a template without an account, and only allows you to login using your twitter account (I don't have one) or google account (deeply unsecure to share with a random website). So these are made using the single-use templates and not saved anywhere.
@@Cephalopocalypse dammit, guess i'll make them myself
how about +2 shild from hope?
It's been patched and is just a normal shield now, no special benefit
@@Cephalopocalypse i missed thst, thanks for answer
What about hope's shield?
What an incredibly pointless and stupid idea. I love it
@@coreytaylor3633 ? it's the only 4AC shield in the game
I can't believe you put a mundane shield in S tier, and then shields that can be obtained very early that are better in a lower tier. I sort of understand your logic, but it looks insane to see tiered this way. I can't see this being higher than B tier. Essentially you are saying having any shield (other than broken) is great to have, but a mundane shield is quickly made obsolete due to the presence of magical shields. Again, a really whacky decision to tier it this way. I otherwise feel that you have a lot of really solid logic in this list.
It'll be easier to believe if you listen to the detailed explanation in the video ;)
@@Cephalopocalypse I did listen to your full explanation. And as I stated, I "sort of" understand your logic -- essentially you are saying that the benefit of a shield is so great that it becomes S tier to have one compared to not. But where I disagree is this is now what the bar is for S, and a shield you get shortly after that has +2 AC AND a boost to saves being only A tier creates an inconsistency. A better shield is rated worse than an inferior shield. I think the issue is you are trying to use your tier list to do 2 things at the same time. One is a traditional rating of all shields. The second is to show the value of a shield overall -- which probably isn't something requires a tier list, and this is what results in the inconsistency.
I mean, the first 3-4 levels of your character will be using that shield. That's pretty prolific and you need 4 magical shields to replace them all for you party. Until then you are certainly using this shield and since he's doing a tier relative to the level you find it in the game. I can't see how it's NOT going to make it
I think you've missed the +4AC "Shield (hope)"
That was taken out of the game
@@kingofgrim4761 huh, didn't know about that. Shame