Hey trent, I'm from brazil. Here we strongly use brass instruments due to our typical music and culture. Unfortunately we don't have people like you with a brass-specialized youtube channel. Also I didn't see another channel like yours. You information is very relevant for for me. I wish it would relevant for my friends too but we have the language barrier ..🙁. I'm here just to say keep going! There's someone watching you on the other side of the world. Abraços dos músicos de sopro do Brasil!🎺🎷📯👏👍
Over the course of this video I was shown six advertisements. Hope TH-cam has been paying you well despite all the new hoops we as creators have to jump through, Trent.
trent hamilton, pulling out the second tuning slide with the strange color: me: oh that's weird looking, huh it's interesting and kinda cool him: it has a very ugly brass patina on it, it's an odd brown me: oh yeah no that tuning slide sucks, really gross color, the other one is so much better
One thing I've always wanted is a sequel to your diy hot glue mouthpiece project but with a trombone mouthpiece. As a trombonist I'd find this especially amusing and relatable. Good morning, good night, and good luck!
Make sure to reattach the bell in a manner so that it may be taken off again. This is required for Thayers to be maintained (you might know this already).
You have to take the valve off of the horn to disassemble it rather than leaving the casing on like a traditional rotor. This is also why the valve set came in parts instead of one whole.
If you're trying to take off red rot or unlacquer an instrument, make sure that you are not using sandpaper. You said you sanded it so it seemed like you used sandpaper but a better option would be to use something like the green scrubbers on the back of a sponge, I think ScottchBrite is one brand of them. These won't take off the metal of the horn and keep it more in tact.
After having extensive experience with this model of horn, I can tell you that the resistance problems of this horn will almost undoubtedly be solved by the Thayer valves. The design of the rotors that Bach had used in this horn are absolutely atrocious and completely choke off the low register.
In future, could you please mention the titles of the pieces you play for the montage/sped-up sections? I really enjoy some of them and would like to play, but I'm not really in the brass band scene so I don't know the repertoire.
I have a Bach 50B2 that Osmun Music converted to inline rotary valves and open wrap which helped the "playability" of the horn, but never tried thayer valves.
I totally agree ab the Bach rotors. My school has a bass with them and it took me about two weeks and I just couldn’t play Ds below staff and things the way I would like. Switched over to a similar Tim period Yamaha and had a much better time
You mentioned that the first valve section is bent. Do bear in mind that there will be a certain amount of bend there by design so the slide will comfortably clear the bell.
The wrap being tight does not affect the feel of playing in the valves. Michael McLemore of M&W trombones has talked about testing the open vs closed wrap on professional players and there wasn’t a noticeable difference due to the wrap shape. I have play several Bach’s from that era and I feel that the valve register is tight and a bit miserable to play in as you suggest because the valves are very small. Modern day rotors are much bigger and more open than the old stock Bach ones and they vastly improve the feel of the traditional or closed wrap. That being said I think this is a cool project
Why am I the only one upset about the destruction of this beautiful vintage Bach Stradivarius Bass Trombone? I don’t think the valves have as much to do with the “stuffiness” as the tubing wrap. Oh well. Sad.
It is 100 percent the horrible design of these valves, there is a reason why many people prefer Thayer valves for their trombones, if you compare the Thayer and Rotary versions of this horn the resistance is much worse on the rotary valves
So you are saying that there is no difference in resistance or back pressure of a trombone with an open wrap versus a traditional wrap? You are saying that the valve is the one and only (you said 100%) reason that a trombone might sound “stuffy” when you push the trigger(s) down? That’s what you’re saying? Let’s throw a Hagmann valve into the mix. What do you think about those? With all of these valves, you’re basically talking about the distance of the “throw”. A traditional rotor valve can work just fine with an open wrap. As a matter of fact, a traditional rotor can work just fine with a traditional wrap if you are a good player. That may be your problem.
@@mikeretzer6235 You make a fair point, but why even try to mangle the original rotary valve section enough to modify it to an open-wrap design when you can just remove the rotors altogether and remove them with an open-wrap Thayer system? I think Trent actually has a reasonably sensible way of doing this.
Interesting you say that you found this instrument restrictive. I had a 50B2L also from 1983 and it was also very restrictive to play in F and a nightmare in Eb! Subsequently I've got a 50B3L from the 1990s and what a difference, with either just the F or Gb plug in use you can hardly tell they are in and with both plugs, yes there is somewhat more resistance but nothing like the old 'bone. Yes ok not the same instruments being compared but I never expected such a significant change by moving one rotary valve. Maybe Bach did some mods from the '80's to the '90's to improve things? Be interesting to see if anyone else has found this.
Trent, I am curious about the re-lacquering. I have seen you do this on other horns in your videos and I wonder why you go through the trouble? Is it worth the time? Is there a benefit to the integrity of the instrument? Would a plating of some kind be better. I ask these questions because, to me, it seems like such a huge pain in the lower digestive tract to really be worth the time, energy, and money. I say that without really understanding your desire or need, if I may, to do this. If this trombone improves as much as we hope, would not a silver or gold plate be better in the long run? By the way, I agree with an earlier post. Make sure that you can take the valves off easily. I cannot wait to hear you play this instrument. Love the channel!!
It's not the wrap, it's the valves. Bach bass trombone valves are notorious for having undersized ports/passages. Opening up the ports used to be a pretty standard modification in the days before axial flow and other "improved" valve designs became available.
Hi, I'm gonna sound very old in this comment, but I remember seeing a particular trumpet on your channel (or atleast i hope it was on your channel) that I cannot find again that I'm wondering what was, it had like an odd angle that to me made it look a lot more comfortable to play than the normal trumpet, but this is hard to google, cause when I search "angled trumpet" I just get the dizzy gillespie kind of angled trumpet, while what I'm talking about is more the angle of the horn/last bit of conical tubing compared to the angel of the valves. I hope you or someone else can help me find the words to describe this, or maybe the specific model. Thanks in advance.
Hi Trent, I had an interesting question, I own a older Yamaha YBB-103 3/4 concert tuba and am curious about a few things. First, off, my leadpipe is cracked and I wanted to know what the best course of action would be for fixing it, my main concern is that the leadpipe for the horn is out of production. Second, and this is going to sound a bit odd, but would it be possible at all for me to replace the piston valves with rotors, would it require basically gutting the thing and replacing all the valve slides? Anyway, hope you're doing well, huge fan of all your work, you're a huge inspiration to me.
Hi, there are several routes you can take with the lead pipe. Depending on the crack it could be patched over, braised, or the lead pipe could be remade by someone. As for the Yamaha, yes, it would need to be gutted. Really not worth it.
Didn't cost you much? Wow, those things cost about as much a small starter home when new. And they are no better to today than they were in the 1980's.
“On my lap and *Securely* in my hand”
The Moment flashed before my eyes when he said that
Contra flashbacks
Stephen Owens haha yeah I came straight to the comments to type about that but you beat me to it
Jack McGee gottem
Hey trent, I'm from brazil. Here we strongly use brass instruments due to our typical music and culture. Unfortunately we don't have people like you with a brass-specialized youtube channel. Also I didn't see another channel like yours. You information is very relevant for for me. I wish it would relevant for my friends too but we have the language barrier ..🙁. I'm here just to say keep going! There's someone watching you on the other side of the world. Abraços dos músicos de sopro do Brasil!🎺🎷📯👏👍
Sou br também e adoro os videos dele hahaha, precisavamos de um Trent Br
"Have a fantastic whatever period of time it is" is going to become my new official way to say ciao to people.
Over the course of this video I was shown six advertisements. Hope TH-cam has been paying you well despite all the new hoops we as creators have to jump through, Trent.
trent hamilton, pulling out the second tuning slide with the strange color:
me: oh that's weird looking, huh it's interesting and kinda cool
him: it has a very ugly brass patina on it, it's an odd brown
me: oh yeah no that tuning slide sucks, really gross color, the other one is so much better
Exactly what I did
One thing I've always wanted is a sequel to your diy hot glue mouthpiece project but with a trombone mouthpiece. As a trombonist I'd find this especially amusing and relatable. Good morning, good night, and good luck!
Thank you for uploading! I love each and every one of your videos and it fills me with great joy to see that you've uploaded. Thank you and God bless
Make sure to reattach the bell in a manner so that it may be taken off again. This is required for Thayers to be maintained (you might know this already).
This is usually done via a bell screw system like that of a Shires, Edwards, or Rath trombone.
For the rest of us why?
You have to take the valve off of the horn to disassemble it rather than leaving the casing on like a traditional rotor. This is also why the valve set came in parts instead of one whole.
If you're trying to take off red rot or unlacquer an instrument, make sure that you are not using sandpaper. You said you sanded it so it seemed like you used sandpaper but a better option would be to use something like the green scrubbers on the back of a sponge, I think ScottchBrite is one brand of them. These won't take off the metal of the horn and keep it more in tact.
After having extensive experience with this model of horn, I can tell you that the resistance problems of this horn will almost undoubtedly be solved by the Thayer valves. The design of the rotors that Bach had used in this horn are absolutely atrocious and completely choke off the low register.
Isn't the low register the entire point of this instrument? Smh
@@PebProductions46 yep. This horn honestly just is not that good and I'm not really sure why anyone would've purchased it given it's issues
In future, could you please mention the titles of the pieces you play for the montage/sped-up sections? I really enjoy some of them and would like to play, but I'm not really in the brass band scene so I don't know the repertoire.
If you look in my multi-tracks playlist you'll find them. :)
Trent Hamilton for president
Once again!! Addicted to you show, man! Urging everyone to donate to Trents show! I do...
This trombone makes me happy
I have a Bach 50B2 that Osmun Music converted to inline rotary valves and open wrap which helped the "playability" of the horn, but never tried thayer valves.
Even for the satin finishes you like, it might be a good idea to invest in a buffing wheel or something similar.
Yeah I've got one that I'll be using to finish up with.
I totally agree ab the Bach rotors. My school has a bass with them and it took me about two weeks and I just couldn’t play Ds below staff and things the way I would like. Switched over to a similar Tim period Yamaha and had a much better time
You mentioned that the first valve section is bent. Do bear in mind that there will be a certain amount of bend there by design so the slide will comfortably clear the bell.
The wrap being tight does not affect the feel of playing in the valves. Michael McLemore of M&W trombones has talked about testing the open vs closed wrap on professional players and there wasn’t a noticeable difference due to the wrap shape. I have play several Bach’s from that era and I feel that the valve register is tight and a bit miserable to play in as you suggest because the valves are very small. Modern day rotors are much bigger and more open than the old stock Bach ones and they vastly improve the feel of the traditional or closed wrap. That being said I think this is a cool project
lit
You should de lacquer and sand the valve slides and tubes down to they match the bell
Why am I the only one upset about the destruction of this beautiful vintage Bach Stradivarius Bass Trombone? I don’t think the valves have as much to do with the “stuffiness” as the tubing wrap.
Oh well. Sad.
It is 100 percent the horrible design of these valves, there is a reason why many people prefer Thayer valves for their trombones, if you compare the Thayer and Rotary versions of this horn the resistance is much worse on the rotary valves
So you are saying that there is no difference in resistance or back pressure of a trombone with an open wrap versus a traditional wrap? You are saying that the valve is the one and only (you said 100%) reason that a trombone might sound “stuffy” when you push the trigger(s) down? That’s what you’re saying? Let’s throw a Hagmann valve into the mix. What do you think about those? With all of these valves, you’re basically talking about the distance of the “throw”. A traditional rotor valve can work just fine with an open wrap. As a matter of fact, a traditional rotor can work just fine with a traditional wrap if you are a good player. That may be your problem.
@@mikeretzer6235 You make a fair point, but why even try to mangle the original rotary valve section enough to modify it to an open-wrap design when you can just remove the rotors altogether and remove them with an open-wrap Thayer system? I think Trent actually has a reasonably sensible way of doing this.
I am screaming silently.
I love playing the trombone
Imagine a bass trombone with piston valves
Interesting you say that you found this instrument restrictive. I had a 50B2L also from 1983 and it was also very restrictive to play in F and a nightmare in Eb! Subsequently I've got a 50B3L from the 1990s and what a difference, with either just the F or Gb plug in use you can hardly tell they are in and with both plugs, yes there is somewhat more resistance but nothing like the old 'bone. Yes ok not the same instruments being compared but I never expected such a significant change by moving one rotary valve. Maybe Bach did some mods from the '80's to the '90's to improve things? Be interesting to see if anyone else has found this.
Turns out that the original rotors were smaller and restricted the airflow; they fixed that in later versions.
Trent, I am curious about the re-lacquering. I have seen you do this on other horns in your videos and I wonder why you go through the trouble?
Is it worth the time? Is there a benefit to the integrity of the instrument? Would a plating of some kind be better. I ask these questions because, to me, it seems like such a huge pain in the lower digestive tract to really be worth the time, energy, and money. I say that without really understanding your desire or need, if I may, to do this. If this trombone improves as much as we hope, would not a silver or gold plate be better in the long run? By the way, I agree with an earlier post. Make sure that you can take the valves off easily. I cannot wait to hear you play this instrument. Love the channel!!
It's not the wrap, it's the valves. Bach bass trombone valves are notorious for having undersized ports/passages. Opening up the ports used to be a pretty standard modification in the days before axial flow and other "improved" valve designs became available.
Trent how's that toaster? Also, are there brass instruments with mouthpiece sizes (rim diameter) in between the trumpet and the trombone?
Hi, I'm gonna sound very old in this comment, but I remember seeing a particular trumpet on your channel (or atleast i hope it was on your channel) that I cannot find again that I'm wondering what was, it had like an odd angle that to me made it look a lot more comfortable to play than the normal trumpet, but this is hard to google, cause when I search "angled trumpet" I just get the dizzy gillespie kind of angled trumpet, while what I'm talking about is more the angle of the horn/last bit of conical tubing compared to the angel of the valves. I hope you or someone else can help me find the words to describe this, or maybe the specific model. Thanks in advance.
@2:12 Yo! I meat a man too!
Hey Trent, I'm from Turkey. Here it's very difficult to get a second-hand bass trombone. So I was hoping that you can guide me so I can buy one.
Hi i have a conn j112h bass and it is the same age and with the same problems this may be the solution I'm
That horn is pre open wrap
is it normal to find brass instruments easier to play and master than wind instruments
Whatever happened to your accordion project?
Is J. Michael trumpet good?
I played a version of this horn in college. I know about the F valve, what is the other valve used for?
Do you plan to make any french horn videos soon?
Hi Trent, I had an interesting question, I own a older Yamaha YBB-103 3/4 concert tuba and am curious about a few things. First, off, my leadpipe is cracked and I wanted to know what the best course of action would be for fixing it, my main concern is that the leadpipe for the horn is out of production. Second, and this is going to sound a bit odd, but would it be possible at all for me to replace the piston valves with rotors, would it require basically gutting the thing and replacing all the valve slides? Anyway, hope you're doing well, huge fan of all your work, you're a huge inspiration to me.
Hi, there are several routes you can take with the lead pipe. Depending on the crack it could be patched over, braised, or the lead pipe could be remade by someone.
As for the Yamaha, yes, it would need to be gutted. Really not worth it.
Me: F
Trent: Iff
i play on that same bass but silver plated
Can you review the cheapest soprano trombone
What website do you use to buy your instruments?
I’m 13, 8th grade, in band, good for my age.........and I want a bass trombone!!!!!!......when will I get it?........someday.......
I couldn’t see the bottom of your shirt. To avoid injury...avoid plastic mats under your desk chair?
It finishes with “don’t tell me how to do my job”
May I ask what happened to your old king, if you sold it yet?
No, I've still got it. Don't plan on selling it.
Didn't cost you much? Wow, those things cost about as much a small starter home when new. And they are no better to today than they were in the 1980's.
"he managed to salvage the valves"
Don't you mean he... Valvaged them?
Don’t Drop it
Trumpet give away please
Ooh, you should add a third valve, make it in Eb.
I am ur first view like and comment Trent