@@OverlandUnderBudget The thing is the rear lower panels of the 3rd gen 4runners are not flush with the back as they are with the Tacoma. So you'd have about a 2 1/2 inch gap (shouldn't matter - just have to make a more angled tire carrier and have the neck of the holder shorter to keep the gap at a minimum) . You can leave the rear lower side panels, take out the middle piece of the rear bumper, have the brackets come through there, then the bumper sits just behind - which would look great ( I hate that ALL the other aftermarket bumpers have you do take off the rear lower panels).
This is rad. This is basically exactly what my customer has in mind for his Tacoma. Slightly different. But a drop down table that will open off the swing arm for the spare tire. Pretty rad! Good work man
Great post as usual! I think you just convinced me to go with a single instead of double swingout when I build one for my FJ80. Instead of the 16 gauge metal table, I think I'll go with cutting board to be able to clean fish and prep food and still have easy clean up.
It is amazing how clean and nice is the offroad in USA . You can even cook from a table which is outside in the open behind the vehicle. There is no mud , or at least no mud that smells bad. No flies attracted from truck heat. You can put 270 degree awning and the vehicle can be the center of your camp. There is no need to carry everything away 20-30 meters. This is awesome.
Mistakes are a part of life, learning from them is a golden opportunity. You give us an opportunity to learn, while being thoroughly entertained, even in the comfort of home, thank you! A thought for your next table: try a medium gauge mesh steel; because of the holes it can be thicker than sheet, plus ... 😇
Enjoyed this as always! You did say a welder for 230.00? Gees!! Ya got my wife mad now. And you've got mad skills. Check out magnets. Rare earth are strongest. Super useful for a latch.
heck ya! the forney Easy weld and yep i used magnets for my first one. Worked really well but i was worried that a little kids hand could be in the wrong place at the wrong time and if the table was to be bumped open... i didnt want that to happen
I have been watching a lot of your content. Really refreshing to see someone produce excellent ideas in a non-professional workshop without thousands of £ worth of equipment. Thank you for showing what is possible on a budget. I do not own a Tacoma, but a Land rover Defender and your ideas are transferable to another vehicle. Keep the content coming.
I decided your reasoning for the lower view count is the fact you dont clickbait. Thanks for being genuine. For instance you could have been like BEST OVERLANDING BUMPER DIY
Congratulations on that table! Looks good! I would do an stop on the little latch, if it get loose it can scratch your tailgate and adding a little knob for ez latching on holding your table.
Excellent build! Your ideas and methods are really growing and your editing is awesome! Keep up the great work and thanks for posting. Your plate warped because of the weld heat. Next build, try a few small tacks, alternating sides to allow for heat to be moved around and it might not warp as much. In any case, great channel!
I’ve been welding/fabricating for nearly 20 years, starting with MIG building gates all the way up to aerospace doing Department of Defense contracts for warbird parts. You’re going places man. I’ve watched a few of your vids, and you’re doing really impressive work for a novice with basic tools. Nice work!
Micah, Nice custom table for the Taco. You could have save some time if you used a barrel bolt for the latch. Just drill a hole on the vertical frame of the table for the bolt to go through and welded the barrel bolt to your tire mount. Nice latch fabrication though. Now, if you want more shelf, you can make a portable shelf designed like those foldable tire steps that go over tires. You can mount the shelf on your spare tire while you are cooking . You can also use it on your truck tires as steps for getting stuff on top. Your Taco is becoming a true overland veh. Great job!!!
Thank you! And yes you are right. I thought about using that, but I didn’t want any rattle. If the hole was tight enough for the table not to rattle the pin wouldn’t want to slip in easy.
@@OverlandUnderBudget If you are worried about rattle, you can glue a soft thick rubber between the table and the tire rack that when you push it to secure the table, it will be rattle free or you can weld the end of the barrel bolt and shape it eccentric like a camshaft lobe , when you push the slide knob and lock it down it will push the table against the tire rack column. This will keep it from rattling also. The third idea is to use those cabinet door catch with plastic roller. It will keep it in place , I think. Just an ideas. Actually, there are so many possibilities. If you google, Spring Loaded Drawer Catch Pictures, there are tons of low budget products that can work or give you idea to build one for yourself. In my opinion, there nothing more satisfying than building something of your own. Be safe, keep building and share your nice ideas to the world. Thx
Another great video! 18:50 I'd consider making a second piece to fit over that tire support that would fit over the bracket and have holes for a lock to be passed through to secure it against theft. But I'm a little paranoid about theft ever since I lived in Nicaragua yrs ago. 23:00 Have you checked out bead rolling to stiffen thin sheet metal? 24:08 One thing you could do for a little more strength is to put a tack weld on the tops of the hinges to the swing out to keep the leverage of the shelf from bending the hinges... as is, all the torque from the weight of the table and mass on it is applied to the lower hinge mount about where the bolts are, it's trying to bend the hinge places as well as "tear-out" on the bolts' thread. The downside is that that would more permanently attach the shelf, but it'd 27:21 Another option is to cut your table frame pieces' ends at 45*, so that after welding, there is no open end. 26:12 For a super clean table top , it would be cool to put the hinges *under* the surface. The frame would need to be notched a bit, but I think it would be worth it for a *really clean look with the hinge piece was hidden from view vs welded on top as you did it. Since they'd be welded to the frame outter & cross pieces and not need to be welded to the surface material, you could also avoid the welding to the surface metal for the hinges , which would greatly reduce the warping issue you had with this. You're doing some really great fab work btw, I'm totally going to copy your design. I may purchase your brackets now that they go through to the extraction points, that's something I was wanting to do. When will those be available as CAD files?
Yep! all great advice and i appreciate you really watching all the details! Just waiting on my cnc plasma table to arrive in mid march then i can start cutting them out and shipping! super excited
nice table. and nice bumper rebuild too! maybe you could build some little organizers with magnets on the bottom so you can empty the whole case of utensils spices etc and set it all up on the table and bumper! (organizers thinking like desk organizers eg pen cup for utensils etc)
Great work and love your channel. My 84 FJ60 says Hi. Anyway, recommendation on the latch that holds that beautiful table upright. If your truck will be in the elements and sit for a couple of days... that hinge will wear/scrap off that protecting coating over time and cause rust to sit in over time. Recommend to cut a small piece of cutting board (thickesness can be minimal) the width of your latch, length = radius of latch travel). Make sure to cut the cutting board and 45° at the end where latch will slide on. Prep the metal and glue ( some type of strong marine adhension so its waterproof or what they use on top of RV to waterproof) the material vertically to the stainless steel. This way when you latch it, it will scrap only the piece of cutting board and protect the latch and help a little with noise and slight vibrations well. Happy Outlanding.
You should attach a sheet of 1/8 plastic to the top of of the table for a cleaner cooking surface and a cutting board :) Other than tat, it looks pretty damn perfect to me and would be great for DJ’ing 😂😂
I love your videos, I can relate to so much of the stuff you said in this video. I recently bought a welder and am currently building a project out of steel and it is getting too heavy and the part about not having a vise, that's my problem too. Great videos!
I honestly like this better then the 2k plus set ups i see pre built! How does one reach out to you for the plans for this? because Id love that whole rear bumper set up and it looks like it will be fun to fiddle with.
One day!!!! i am going to replicate your bumper for my rig!! Hahah, do u plan on making a how to video for the new bumper? 😬😬😬Haha thx,, great setup man!
remount the camera on the underside of the tire swing out. Once you open that the tire prevents impact form one side, your table from the other. Just an idea.
Love the bumper, swing out and table builds. Would love to try my own on my 2019 Tacoma. Is there any suggestions on the mounting plate design for 3rd Gen tacomas any feedback would greatly be welcomed.
Outstanding young man! You are quite talented indeed! I am the proud owner of a Tacoma as well, I would love to purchase one these from you, is that doable? 👍🏽
Love the build! Watching you fab that bracket and I kept wondering if you could have just mounted a neodymium magnet since the table is steel? Also, does it rattle like crazy?!
Really great video. Have been looking for a storage solution for a Coleman grill and kitchen gear lately. Love the Pelican with the pocket organizer. If you don’t mind me asking, which model # Pelican case is that?
Great work man, as always 💪 In your first bumper build video, in regards to the recovery points, you welded the shackle points off to the side of the chassis mounting plates. In this one you made it all one continuous piece, is that right?
Thank you and yes! The mounting plates and Clevis mounting points are all one continuous piece now. Ordered a cnc plasma table so I can make these parts for everyone. Should be ready mid March!
Just needs to be flat, I don't even have a metal welding table. My work surface is put together from scrap 4x4 posts, 2x4's, and some plywood. I actually thought about covering the top with some 1/4 plate and calling it done.
Aluminum and nut certs. Lighter quicker. Not wasting gas wire electricity and consumables (cut off whells,flap discs and it'll save life on the chop saw blade). Just a suggestion from an old tinker fabricator. Oh and try to stay off the floor your 50 year old self will thank you.
Haha thanks, aluminum will be the next frontier for sure. I like those cert nuts but haven’t tried them yet. Your right about the cost of the expendables adding up. I’ve been buy them bulk and that really helped though
![โรงเรียนตอนตี 2 โคตรหลอน..!! [โรงเรียนไดเม่]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/2MAEMwqVYh8/mqdefault.jpg)
rear bumper keeps getting cooler and cooler
Thanks man!
BEST COMMENT "I'm not a savage." AWESOME BUMPER/TABLE BUILD. ALL OF IT IS TWO THUMBS UP.
haha thanks Ray!
I wish other companies that charge $$$$ would do a design like this. Much Respect to you sir.
Now we want to see you put in a rain catch and cover canvas tarp pullout with two poles for your very neat prep and cook area. great vid thanks.
oh ya! ill have to do a updated walk around and show the diy 270 awning opened up and covering the cooking area
Spot on! Building something like this is way more satisfying than just buying something. Awesome job!
thanks! its so fun getting to use the things you build to.
I definitely needs some brackets for a 3rd gen 4runner. I'm itching to try this.
I plan to! definitely will post about that once they are ready!
@@OverlandUnderBudget The thing is the rear lower panels of the 3rd gen 4runners are not flush with the back as they are with the Tacoma. So you'd have about a 2 1/2 inch gap (shouldn't matter - just have to make a more angled tire carrier and have the neck of the holder shorter to keep the gap at a minimum) . You can leave the rear lower side panels, take out the middle piece of the rear bumper, have the brackets come through there, then the bumper sits just behind - which would look great ( I hate that ALL the other aftermarket bumpers have you do take off the rear lower panels).
Getting a plasma cutter is a game changer, also great idea to create your own parts and sell them as a diy kit, looking forward to see hows things go
Thanks man, yep plasma cutting is incredible
Smart Kid, You're a regular MacGyver. Remember to meaure three times and cut once!
This is rad. This is basically exactly what my customer has in mind for his Tacoma. Slightly different. But a drop down table that will open off the swing arm for the spare tire. Pretty rad! Good work man
hell ya! hope it gives some inspo, good luck with your build
Your videos are improving as well! My first gen Tundra is largely inspired by your Tacoma. Thank you for sharing your creativity!
Awesome! Thank you!
Great post as usual! I think you just convinced me to go with a single instead of double swingout when I build one for my FJ80. Instead of the 16 gauge metal table, I think I'll go with cutting board to be able to clean fish and prep food and still have easy clean up.
heck ya Kyle! FJ80s are sweet too. I like the idea of the cutting board be sure to let me know when thats done.
Yeah, im going single swing out to the passengers side! Other than the dude being an absolute SAVAGE - great job.
It is amazing how clean and nice is the offroad in USA . You can even cook from a table which is outside in the open behind the vehicle. There is no mud , or at least no mud that smells bad. No flies attracted from truck heat. You can put 270 degree awning and the vehicle can be the center of your camp. There is no need to carry everything away 20-30 meters. This is awesome.
Mistakes are a part of life, learning from them is a golden opportunity. You give us an opportunity to learn, while being thoroughly entertained, even in the comfort of home, thank you! A thought for your next table: try a medium gauge mesh steel; because of the holes it can be thicker than sheet, plus ... 😇
Fantastic Project! Just Beautiful and Practical!
Thank you!
I'm inspired... I have the identical green first gen as your buddie and its long over due to be built out... thank you for this channel😃
Enjoyed this as always! You did say a welder for 230.00? Gees!! Ya got my wife mad now. And you've got mad skills. Check out magnets. Rare earth are strongest. Super useful for a latch.
heck ya! the forney Easy weld and yep i used magnets for my first one. Worked really well but i was worried that a little kids hand could be in the wrong place at the wrong time and if the table was to be bumped open... i didnt want that to happen
I have been watching a lot of your content. Really refreshing to see someone produce excellent ideas in a non-professional workshop without thousands of £ worth of equipment. Thank you for showing what is possible on a budget. I do not own a Tacoma, but a Land rover Defender and your ideas are transferable to another vehicle. Keep the content coming.
I decided your reasoning for the lower view count is the fact you dont clickbait. Thanks for being genuine. For instance you could have been like BEST OVERLANDING BUMPER DIY
haha thanks man!
Congratulations on that table! Looks good!
I would do an stop on the little latch, if it get loose it can scratch your tailgate and adding a little knob for ez latching on holding your table.
good ideas!
One of my favorite small youtube channel
Excellent build! Your ideas and methods are really growing and your editing is awesome! Keep up the great work and thanks for posting. Your plate warped because of the weld heat. Next build, try a few small tacks, alternating sides to allow for heat to be moved around and it might not warp as much. In any case, great channel!
solid advice and thank you!
I didn't know I needed this, but I do.
Awesome build! Makes me want a swing out bumper for my truck! lol
Go for it! its such a fun build and the table makes all the difference when out camping
I’ve been welding/fabricating for nearly 20 years, starting with MIG building gates all the way up to aerospace doing Department of Defense contracts for warbird parts.
You’re going places man. I’ve watched a few of your vids, and you’re doing really impressive work for a novice with basic tools. Nice work!
I love it! I found your channel via the 4x4 podcast. Great video. Your honesty is refreshing.
A sheet if food grade stainless steel on the tail gate would round that set up off perfectly 👌🏻.
Awesome, this is what I’m looking for my 5th G. 4Runner.
Micah, Nice custom table for the Taco. You could have save some time if you used a barrel bolt for the latch. Just drill a hole on the vertical frame of the table for the bolt to go through and welded the barrel bolt to your tire mount. Nice latch fabrication though. Now, if you want more shelf, you can make a portable shelf designed like those foldable tire steps that go over tires. You can mount the shelf on your spare tire while you are cooking . You can also use it on your truck tires as steps for getting stuff on top. Your Taco is becoming a true overland veh. Great job!!!
Thank you! And yes you are right. I thought about using that, but I didn’t want any rattle. If the hole was tight enough for the table not to rattle the pin wouldn’t want to slip in easy.
@@OverlandUnderBudget If you are worried about rattle, you can glue a soft thick rubber between the table and the tire rack that when you push it to secure the table, it will be rattle free or you can weld the end of the barrel bolt and shape it eccentric like a camshaft lobe , when you push the slide knob and lock it down it will push the table against the tire rack column. This will keep it from rattling also. The third idea is to use those cabinet door catch with plastic roller. It will keep it in place , I think. Just an ideas. Actually, there are so many possibilities. If you google, Spring Loaded Drawer Catch Pictures, there are tons of low budget products that can work or give you idea to build one for yourself. In my opinion, there nothing more satisfying than building something of your own. Be safe, keep building and share your nice ideas to the world. Thx
It show that u can have a good equipment with out braking the bank thanks a lot for sharing
thank you!
Dude sooooo clean!!! Love your setup! Once my Wrangler is out of factory warranty I’m going back to an older Tacoma TRD 4wd with a 6’ bed!
My new favorite TH-cam channel
Thank you so much!
Micah the Legend!
lol well if you say so!
Great video. Love the gate hinges, definitely using that
Another great video!
18:50 I'd consider making a second piece to fit over that tire support that would fit over the bracket and have holes for a lock to be passed through to secure it against theft. But I'm a little paranoid about theft ever since I lived in Nicaragua yrs ago.
23:00 Have you checked out bead rolling to stiffen thin sheet metal?
24:08 One thing you could do for a little more strength is to put a tack weld on the tops of the hinges to the swing out to keep the leverage of the shelf from bending the hinges... as is, all the torque from the weight of the table and mass on it is applied to the lower hinge mount about where the bolts are, it's trying to bend the hinge places as well as "tear-out" on the bolts' thread. The downside is that that would more permanently attach the shelf, but it'd
27:21 Another option is to cut your table frame pieces' ends at 45*, so that after welding, there is no open end.
26:12 For a super clean table top , it would be cool to put the hinges *under* the surface. The frame would need to be notched a bit, but I think it would be worth it for a *really clean look with the hinge piece was hidden from view vs welded on top as you did it. Since they'd be welded to the frame outter & cross pieces and not need to be welded to the surface material, you could also avoid the welding to the surface metal for the hinges , which would greatly reduce the warping issue you had with this.
You're doing some really great fab work btw, I'm totally going to copy your design. I may purchase your brackets now that they go through to the extraction points, that's something I was wanting to do. When will those be available as CAD files?
Yep! all great advice and i appreciate you really watching all the details! Just waiting on my cnc plasma table to arrive in mid march then i can start cutting them out and shipping! super excited
nice table. and nice bumper rebuild too! maybe you could build some little organizers with magnets on the bottom so you can empty the whole case of utensils spices etc and set it all up on the table and bumper! (organizers thinking like desk organizers eg pen cup for utensils etc)
totally possible!
Awesome work Micah !
Thanks a lot!
You have plasma cutter, and welder, but no vice? Your funny. I do love watching your projects though.
haha its on the list!
Great work and love your channel. My 84 FJ60 says Hi. Anyway, recommendation on the latch that holds that beautiful table upright. If your truck will be in the elements and sit for a couple of days... that hinge will wear/scrap off that protecting coating over time and cause rust to sit in over time. Recommend to cut a small piece of cutting board (thickesness can be minimal) the width of your latch, length = radius of latch travel). Make sure to cut the cutting board and 45° at the end where latch will slide on. Prep the metal and glue ( some type of strong marine adhension so its waterproof or what they use on top of RV to waterproof) the material vertically to the stainless steel. This way when you latch it, it will scrap only the piece of cutting board and protect the latch and help a little with noise and slight vibrations well. Happy Outlanding.
You should attach a sheet of 1/8 plastic to the top of of the table for a cleaner cooking surface and a cutting board :) Other than tat, it looks pretty damn perfect to me and would be great for DJ’ing 😂😂
Nice! Really like your honesty and attitude. Hope the channel explodes for you.
I appreciate that!
Super rad! Love all your ideas for your rig.
Thanks Logan!
I want that bumper and tire carrier. Take my money 💰!
Haha yes sir!
@@OverlandUnderBudget I too would be honored to purchase one these, really. Please get back to at your earliest convenience, thanks brother.
Amazing execution! I'm just getting into outlanding and looking for ideas to set up for my 2012 Toyota Tacoma!
I love your videos, I can relate to so much of the stuff you said in this video. I recently bought a welder and am currently building a project out of steel and it is getting too heavy and the part about not having a vise, that's my problem too. Great videos!
heck ya! welding is pretty amazing right?
Awesome stuff brother. Keep it up! Making me want to get a welder 😁 Regards from Australia 🤙🏽🤙🏽
Thanks Jamil! get your self a welder !
@@OverlandUnderBudget Will do brother, once I find the right one. Definitely going to jump on it if I find a bargain.
I honestly like this better then the 2k plus set ups i see pre built! How does one reach out to you for the plans for this? because Id love that whole rear bumper set up and it looks like it will be fun to fiddle with.
Can’t wait until you build your own RTT 😂👍🏽
HAha really thinking hard on a full camper build!!
Great job.So versatile.Well done mate.
Sir you can use some heat shrink on the latching mechanism and the U clamp to dumping the metal to metal component contact
thats a great idea!
Awesome job !! I can't wait to build my own
Hell ya!
I so badly need to do this for my 4Runner!
Yes sir! It adds so much to the user
Love this stuff!
Thank you!!
That is Epic! I need one for my gen 1.
looks legit, great job!
Very nice work.
Nice man! Add a bump stop and it wont rub on the tire
Might consider using angle instead of tube for the frame and braces. Miter cuts at outer corners would close the corners for tube or angle frame.
A quality legit video. good job.
Awesome!! Thank you!
Nice job! I’m really enjoying your content.
Thank you Tim! I really appreciate it
Have you done any front bumpers? I would love to see a video on that. Loving the content!
One day!!!! i am going to replicate your bumper for my rig!! Hahah, do u plan on making a how to video for the new bumper? 😬😬😬Haha thx,, great setup man!
That's the plan!
@@OverlandUnderBudget awesome!! Thx man
Great job,thanks
thank you!
You kill it bro. 🤙❤️
Thanks man!
I need to rebuild mine. Looks good
Rebuilding is a lot of work, but being able to put all the things you learned into the new version is so worth it!
@@OverlandUnderBudget yep that's been my experience! I learn and reapply the next time 💪🏽⚡️. Great video and builds
remount the camera on the underside of the tire swing out. Once you open that the tire prevents impact form one side, your table from the other.
Just an idea.
Wanna build gen 3 version? Good excuse for a road trip from AZ!
Love the bumper, swing out and table builds. Would love to try my own on my 2019 Tacoma. Is there any suggestions on the mounting plate design for 3rd Gen tacomas any feedback would greatly be welcomed.
Try a stainless sheet riveted onto the steel table. Aluminum and still Corrode. 316 Stainless is perfect for cooking!
Thanks for the tip!
Really cool . l like this on my kl
Hey sweet build man! I like it!
Thanks man!
Great videos!
thanks sean i really appreciate it. Just trying to make each one a little better then the last
I built a similar one but my box has my air compressor hardwired in it :)
Outstanding young man! You are quite talented indeed! I am the proud owner of a Tacoma as well, I would love to purchase one these from you, is that doable? 👍🏽
Great video as always. What I wanna know about is that jack in the back of the truck!
Very nice job!! looks Great!! Cheers!!
Thank you! Cheers!
Love the build!
Watching you fab that bracket and I kept wondering if you could have just mounted a neodymium magnet since the table is steel?
Also, does it rattle like crazy?!
hahahaha "I'm not a savage" over all, great video and application. Keep it up!
Really great video. Have been looking for a storage solution for a Coleman grill and kitchen gear lately. Love the Pelican with the pocket organizer. If you don’t mind me asking, which model # Pelican case is that?
Heck ya! It’s the 1600 case 👍🏼
I want this bumper
I might be a bit biased but I think it’s my favorite haha
Nice...I don't like the latch design...seems it would loosen with trail vibration, like to see a mini version of swing a way latch...
Love the build, do you have a link to the red clasp handle upgraded you used
Great job on the table. What jack do you have in the bed?
Thanks man! It’s just a harbor fright jack I’ve owned before the truck. I made a aluminum skid for it haha post on this is on my Instagram
Great work man, as always 💪
In your first bumper build video, in regards to the recovery points, you welded the shackle points off to the side of the chassis mounting plates. In this one you made it all one continuous piece, is that right?
Thank you and yes! The mounting plates and Clevis mounting points are all one continuous piece now. Ordered a cnc plasma table so I can make these parts for everyone. Should be ready mid March!
I was able to come across this bumper and now own it, any idea if I can jack it up from the bumper?
Also you have any idea on how to make a roof rack for a extended cab 1999
Im sure it can be done, but i haven't tried that one yet
Use a flat surface for welding and weld your pieces little bits at a time. Let your pieces cool clamped to the table and you should have less warpage.
yep all great advice! building a welding table is on the list.
Just needs to be flat, I don't even have a metal welding table. My work surface is put together from scrap 4x4 posts, 2x4's, and some plywood. I actually thought about covering the top with some 1/4 plate and calling it done.
Do you sell this table? I don't have a plasma cuttter or welding equipment but would love this table.
Micah, what did you for the license plate light?? I can't see one on yours. Not sure what do to for mine
Where can you get one of those flush air coupler installed in the bumper?
Cool
Do you have a link to the air hose cover?
its a 7 pin trailer break connection housing. Just google that and pick your favorite! i got mine at a local autozone
When did you change your snorkel head ??
are the parts available now? all i see are the template files
What latch are you using? DStaticCo? Have a link?
i want this :( add music during the fast forward so i can groove to your welds
Where did you bought your front bumper? Is nice, I am a new sub 👍🏼
Its a self weld kit from coastal offroad this one is the "closed top winch bumper for 1st gen tacoma"
What are you using the orange case for on back of bumper?
how will you replace the lights?
Aluminum and nut certs. Lighter quicker. Not wasting gas wire electricity and consumables (cut off whells,flap discs and it'll save life on the chop saw blade). Just a suggestion from an old tinker fabricator. Oh and try to stay off the floor your 50 year old self will thank you.
Haha thanks, aluminum will be the next frontier for sure. I like those cert nuts but haven’t tried them yet. Your right about the cost of the expendables adding up. I’ve been buy them bulk and that really helped though