NT Wright! I met him in seminary ... a little dark waiting room. When an old gentleman sat beside me, and we started chatting casually. Did not know it was him, until his conference was over. He was a humble, approachable man, with wit and humor.
This was so good it deserves a second listen. I think breaking out parts of the conversation for a staff discussion would be so helpful. Thank you for this thought provoking and practical conversation.
Thanks Denise. I include a few questions you can review with your team based on the podcast in the show notes. You can find them here: careynieuwhof.com/episode674/
Sameeee. Knew it would be great before I watched. 'If it's the churches role to critic those in power, we need the critic ourselves." So so good. I can't wait to dive straight into Mark 10, as he suggested because it's really insightful as a way to combine politics and the gospel. Thank you for this podcast, Carey 🎉
I like how well-appointed the space of Mr. Wright seems to be. It seems intentionally so and keeps him in the flow. Including that bear in the corner. :) Great discussion, Carey.
Desmond Tutus sharing Lord's Prayer with those in power is inspiring. It was tried with Trump and he was pressed to lead with the Lord's Prayer He started "As I lay me down to sleep "
Thank you Carey & N.T. A good application of Christian Political Theology being the reign of Jesus over the principalities and powers is by Frank Viola: Insurgence: Reclaiming the Gospel of the Kingdom. Carey, you may want to seek out Frank for an interview.
Deep respect for Wright I read his book for the first time through our university bible study group. This discussion was so engaging, rich and enriching.. I am from Nagaland India.
Great theologian and incredible mind, although I disagree about his stance regarding gun ownership. It is not a contradiction to be against abortion and also be willing to use a gun in self-defense. The difference is an innocent life vs. the consequences of someone's wrong choice. London prohibits guns and yet is the world leader in stabbings, so it is not about the weapon but the person.
Respectfully, England is not the world leader in stabbings as some would have us believe. They are among the leaders in knife crimes in the EU, which includes carrying a knife. As for knife homicides, the US outranks the UK in that catagory as well, 4.96/million to 3.26/million. With regards to stabbings, South Africa is #1 and it is not even close.
@vialarmsecurityandfire8145 respectfully, I never said England or the U.K., I clearly said the city of London. I suggest you look at the stats. In addition, you are using raw numbers instead of percentages of the total population, which is not a fair comparison of a country of 333 million vs. 66 million. Even taking your numbers the U.S. is still safer, which goes against your argument.
@@-the_dark_knight I assume we can agree that guns are capable of more damage than knives. I assume we can also agree that the majority of states have bans on knives that have no utility beyond assaulting people (butterfly, switchblades, etc). I own guns. I am in no way anti-gun. But this conversation has become so dysfunctional that pro-gun people aren't willing to consider common sense gun regulations, like licensure and registry (both are willingly accepted for drivers and car owners), red flag laws, safe storage, etc. A 14-yo just killed four people yesterday with a gun he was somehow able to procure, despite prior threats and FBI investigations. If law enforcement cannot keep guns out of the homes and hands of known threats, we simply cannot continue with the notion that we have sufficient laws on the books.
@pnw_jordan Yes, there are points we can both agree with. Nevertheless, I would contend that the stories highlighted in the media, such as your example, should not be ignored, but they always go in one direction. They fit a certain narrative. When was the last time you saw a story about how a gun saved a person's life from a criminal? That is why bans only affect law-abiding citizens. When you remove criminal use of guns from the stats, it's amazing to see how low gun deaths are in the U.S., not the big numbers the media has portrayed. Yet when you look at gun deaths in other countries where they are banned from the general populace, such as in Mexico, they have a larger gun death toll. The bottom line is that criminals will always find a way to obtain weapons, but people should have a way to defend themselves.
Though I love and respect both Carey and Dr. Wright, regarding gun ownership in the US, they present a false dichotomy: one must choose between gun ownership and being pro-life. Rightful gun ownership in the US is in defense of life, not in favor of taking it. It is rich hypocrisy indeed to point a finger at gun ownership in the US and not thoroughly condemn the 2,000+ innocent Americans slaughtered in cold blood by the abortion industry, (ie the Democratic party).
I can’t understand it either… when a righteous man uses force as a last result to protect the innocent, that feels very aligned with being pro-life in my view.
@@jcortizrojas This is an amazing thing to say. Somehow its like you say you are disagreeing with him, but then you are stating his premise. One's view on abortion should not entail one's view on weapon proliferation. That is how things are in America. Its like political consumers are granted two bundle packs, and they just have to take or leave all of it. That we don't recognize this is happening is proof that it works.
I don’t own a gun nor do I want one but really? Of course you and Tom have made it just fine living in a country where guns are the exception. Here, once that anyone can own a gun and the wrong people will never give them up, how do you think those who do will give them up, knowing the wrong side, gangs, weirdos and the like have amassed Fort Knox? This is a complex issue; I need to rethink where I walk, when I walk or go out to eat. In my city, Kansas City, MO, teenagers with guns, with no value for life, are no longer merely killing each other in their own eastside neighborhoods, but more frequently, shooting to kill others elsewhere for no reason. I don’t see a way forward politically that will touch the crisis we’re in. Your comments came off dismissive and naive. Real solutions are needed.
I was surprised that he doesn't recognize a feotus as a person with rights equal to those of the mother. It must be the Anglican in him. They even have women priests.
This is an enlightening and helpful conversation about christian political theology. I'm trying to wrap my mind and heart around the real question for political theology, which is "What does it look like when God becomes king on earth as in heaven?" It's a great question that touches on so much of what the Christian life is about, humbly serving the poor and oppressed, mourning the woes of the world, seeking God with a pure heart, etc. Thanks for that clarifying question! It seems that many listeners who've commented have been unable to understand the point that Dr. Wright was making in minutes 16-18. He emphasized that there is a "bundling" of political beliefs that goes on in the U.S. that simply does not go on in other countries. As an observer, he has been puzzled by this, as if these beliefs by necessity belonged together. And the question then is why do certain Christian Americans bundle anti-abortion beliefs with gun-ownership rights? I do not see that question fully answered in any of his listeners' comments made about minutes 16-18.
Thank you such a thoughtful and thorough look at Christianity as a political force. Someone who did this well, I think, was Fred Rogers. He spoke truth to the powers for respect and nurturing of children.
Thank you for acknowledging the need for all camps to hear the humble wisdom of NTW. I thought you led the conversation masterfully. Engaging and challenging.
"Culture wars." This isn't a culture war. This is about theology and purity culture. Can we stop talking about the theologies that are in conflict are a war?
""To outside observers like me, the gun is surely in the Olympian superleague of American gods. It reigns over all its opponents and defeats every attempt to restrict its sovereignty. The gun-god exacts the most horrific sacrifices of human lifeblood-child sacrifice no less-and shrugs off every wave of revulsion that follows such events." - Christopher J. H. Wright [Here are Your Gods]
Dr Wright doesn't know the gun toting people I do. They are the sefest, most responsible people. They would only use their guns to prevent violence. Millions of times every year guns areyused in the US to prevent violence. The places in the US with the most guns per capita have the lowest murder rates. Dr Wright should stick to theology and comments on his own culture.
You know that's not universally true. Like the father in Georgia just this week who gave his son an AR that he then used to kill four people at school. And that after law enforcement had previously interviewed the son as a known risk.
I do appreciate the range of people on the podcast but Tom is terribly uninformed on the gun rights issue in America. Automatic weapons have been banned for ages. Apparently he doesn’t even know the difference between semiautomatic and automatic. There is a reason we have a 2nd amendment and Jesus himself at one point mentioned to now bring a sword or two. There are times to fight even though that is not the norm for Christians. Tom seems to be buying into the left rhetoric he is listening to “over the pond”. I also find it somewhat odd that he is talking on a series about the current polarization but said things in a very divisive manner himself. Was probably not a good series to have an NT Wright interview.
Has Wright become and American or is he just meddling? One would think that fixing the apostasy that fills what is left of Anglicanism might consume his time.
NT Wright! I met him in seminary ... a little dark waiting room. When an old gentleman sat beside me, and we started chatting casually. Did not know it was him, until his conference was over. He was a humble, approachable man, with wit and humor.
This was so good it deserves a second listen. I think breaking out parts of the conversation for a staff discussion would be so helpful. Thank you for this thought provoking and practical conversation.
Thanks Denise. I include a few questions you can review with your team based on the podcast in the show notes. You can find them here: careynieuwhof.com/episode674/
The practical wisdom of Carey combined with the scholarly knowledge of NT Wright - this is my dream podcast! 🤩
Wow, thank you!
All good till Tom said right to life culture battles resulted from someone being scared off free sex!! Seemingly short sighted
Tom Wright is the man of the hour! So happy to see him on your show bro. He’s life transforming .
So glad you enjoy Tom on the show!
What a wonderful video with such a learned man of God. Thank you!
Our pleasure!
My favorite living theologian. I'm commenting before I watch because I know it's gonna be good 😅
I hope it lived up to expectations!
Absolutely!
Sameeee. Knew it would be great before I watched.
'If it's the churches role to critic those in power, we need the critic ourselves." So so good. I can't wait to dive straight into Mark 10, as he suggested because it's really insightful as a way to combine politics and the gospel. Thank you for this podcast, Carey 🎉
I like how well-appointed the space of Mr. Wright seems to be. It seems intentionally so and keeps him in the flow. Including that bear in the corner. :)
Great discussion, Carey.
Thanks so much!
Desmond Tutus sharing
Lord's Prayer with those in power is inspiring.
It was tried with Trump and he was pressed to lead with the Lord's Prayer
He started "As I lay me down to sleep "
Excellent points! Thank you!
Thank you Carey & N.T. A good application of Christian Political Theology being the reign of Jesus over the principalities and powers is by Frank Viola: Insurgence: Reclaiming the Gospel of the Kingdom. Carey, you may want to seek out Frank for an interview.
Thanks for sharing!
this is so helpful, I will be sharing it with my church.
So glad!
Feel like Wright has caricatures of Americans that live in his head that are constructed off the macro picture
Deep respect for Wright I read his book for the first time through our university bible study group. This discussion was so engaging, rich and enriching.. I am from Nagaland India.
Thanks for watching
Great theologian and incredible mind, although I disagree about his stance regarding gun ownership. It is not a contradiction to be against abortion and also be willing to use a gun in self-defense. The difference is an innocent life vs. the consequences of someone's wrong choice. London prohibits guns and yet is the world leader in stabbings, so it is not about the weapon but the person.
Respectfully, England is not the world leader in stabbings as some would have us believe. They are among the leaders in knife crimes in the EU, which includes carrying a knife. As for knife homicides, the US outranks the UK in that catagory as well, 4.96/million to 3.26/million. With regards to stabbings, South Africa is #1 and it is not even close.
@vialarmsecurityandfire8145 respectfully, I never said England or the U.K., I clearly said the city of London. I suggest you look at the stats. In addition, you are using raw numbers instead of percentages of the total population, which is not a fair comparison of a country of 333 million vs. 66 million. Even taking your numbers the U.S. is still safer, which goes against your argument.
@@-the_dark_knight I have. Still not close.
@@-the_dark_knight I assume we can agree that guns are capable of more damage than knives. I assume we can also agree that the majority of states have bans on knives that have no utility beyond assaulting people (butterfly, switchblades, etc). I own guns. I am in no way anti-gun. But this conversation has become so dysfunctional that pro-gun people aren't willing to consider common sense gun regulations, like licensure and registry (both are willingly accepted for drivers and car owners), red flag laws, safe storage, etc. A 14-yo just killed four people yesterday with a gun he was somehow able to procure, despite prior threats and FBI investigations. If law enforcement cannot keep guns out of the homes and hands of known threats, we simply cannot continue with the notion that we have sufficient laws on the books.
@pnw_jordan Yes, there are points we can both agree with. Nevertheless, I would contend that the stories highlighted in the media, such as your example, should not be ignored, but they always go in one direction. They fit a certain narrative. When was the last time you saw a story about how a gun saved a person's life from a criminal? That is why bans only affect law-abiding citizens. When you remove criminal use of guns from the stats, it's amazing to see how low gun deaths are in the U.S., not the big numbers the media has portrayed. Yet when you look at gun deaths in other countries where they are banned from the general populace, such as in Mexico, they have a larger gun death toll. The bottom line is that criminals will always find a way to obtain weapons, but people should have a way to defend themselves.
How is the right to self defense in opposition to protecting innocent human life in the womb?
Though I love and respect both Carey and Dr. Wright, regarding gun ownership in the US, they present a false dichotomy: one must choose between gun ownership and being pro-life. Rightful gun ownership in the US is in defense of life, not in favor of taking it. It is rich hypocrisy indeed to point a finger at gun ownership in the US and not thoroughly condemn the 2,000+ innocent Americans slaughtered in cold blood by the abortion industry, (ie the Democratic party).
@@DaleBrown7771.5 million per year you mean
the exact same thing I thought…unrelated issues. LOL
I can’t understand it either… when a righteous man uses force as a last result to protect the innocent, that feels very aligned with being pro-life in my view.
@@jcortizrojas This is an amazing thing to say. Somehow its like you say you are disagreeing with him, but then you are stating his premise. One's view on abortion should not entail one's view on weapon proliferation. That is how things are in America. Its like political consumers are granted two bundle packs, and they just have to take or leave all of it. That we don't recognize this is happening is proof that it works.
I love Dr. Wright’s observations on how British view elections as a vote for the least objectionable and not the next savior.
That was an interesting insight
Or the lessor of two evils, either way, one chooses evil.
I don’t own a gun nor do I want one but really? Of course you and Tom have made it just fine living in a country where guns are the exception. Here, once that anyone can own a gun and the wrong people will never give them up, how do you think those who do will give them up, knowing the wrong side, gangs, weirdos and the like have amassed Fort Knox? This is a complex issue; I need to rethink where I walk, when I walk or go out to eat.
In my city, Kansas City, MO, teenagers with guns, with no value for life, are no longer merely killing each other in their own eastside neighborhoods, but more frequently, shooting to kill others elsewhere for no reason. I don’t see a way forward politically that will touch the crisis we’re in.
Your comments came off dismissive and naive. Real solutions are needed.
I'll admit it, I am vitriolically opposed to abortion.
It is too bad that Tom is not.
Tom is totally pro Life.
I was surprised that he doesn't recognize a feotus as a person with rights equal to those of the mother. It must be the Anglican in him. They even have women priests.
So good! Thanks Carey. Ask a good question and let him speak. Seems simplistic but so few interviewers do it!
Glad you enjoyed it!
This is an enlightening and helpful conversation about christian political theology. I'm trying to wrap my mind and heart around the real question for political theology, which is "What does it look like when God becomes king on earth as in heaven?" It's a great question that touches on so much of what the Christian life is about, humbly serving the poor and oppressed, mourning the woes of the world, seeking God with a pure heart, etc. Thanks for that clarifying question!
It seems that many listeners who've commented have been unable to understand the point that Dr. Wright was making in minutes 16-18. He emphasized that there is a "bundling" of political beliefs that goes on in the U.S. that simply does not go on in other countries. As an observer, he has been puzzled by this, as if these beliefs by necessity belonged together. And the question then is why do certain Christian Americans bundle anti-abortion beliefs with gun-ownership rights? I do not see that question fully answered in any of his listeners' comments made about minutes 16-18.
Thank you such a thoughtful and thorough look at Christianity as a political force. Someone who did this well, I think, was Fred Rogers. He spoke truth to the powers for respect and nurturing of children.
Thank you for acknowledging the need for all camps to hear the humble wisdom of NTW. I thought you led the conversation masterfully. Engaging and challenging.
Thanks Tony!
There are many Americans who don’t understand gun ownership….
Carey: enjoyed this discussion with NT. What would he or you say about Bonhoeffer’s involvement in taking down Hitler?
this was SUCH a wonderful conversation. it is so validating to my faith when i realize i have similar beliefs/interpretations as Tom Wright!!
So glad it resonated with you
You should interview william federer
"Culture wars." This isn't a culture war. This is about theology and purity culture. Can we stop talking about the theologies that are in conflict are a war?
Can you explain your last sentence?
""To outside observers like me, the gun is surely in the Olympian superleague of American gods. It reigns over all its opponents and defeats every attempt to restrict its sovereignty. The gun-god exacts the most horrific sacrifices of human lifeblood-child sacrifice no less-and shrugs off every wave of revulsion that follows such events." - Christopher J. H. Wright [Here are Your Gods]
Dr Wright doesn't know the gun toting people I do. They are the sefest, most responsible people. They would only use their guns to prevent violence. Millions of times every year guns areyused in the US to prevent violence. The places in the US with the most guns per capita have the lowest murder rates. Dr Wright should stick to theology and comments on his own culture.
You know that's not universally true. Like the father in Georgia just this week who gave his son an AR that he then used to kill four people at school. And that after law enforcement had previously interviewed the son as a known risk.
@@dv9360So? Gun owners are neither universally safe nor unsafe.
@@dv9360 Nor is it universally true that guns are only used to harm. So?
Sad. I just discovered this guy. But his naive take on guns makes me question his ability to rightly assess anything.
A valuable resource for analyzing politics from the Christian worldview is Al Mohler’s Daily Briefing
Thanks for sharing!
I do appreciate the range of people on the podcast but Tom is terribly uninformed on the gun rights issue in America. Automatic weapons have been banned for ages. Apparently he doesn’t even know the difference between semiautomatic and automatic. There is a reason we have a 2nd amendment and Jesus himself at one point mentioned to now bring a sword or two. There are times to fight even though that is not the norm for Christians. Tom seems to be buying into the left rhetoric he is listening to “over the pond”. I also find it somewhat odd that he is talking on a series about the current polarization but said things in a very divisive manner himself. Was probably not a good series to have an NT Wright interview.
These guys need to stick to theology because they know nothing about firearms.
Shared on Instagram. It will be important to equip me as I lead my church during this season and financially it would be a great blessing!
Thanks for sharing this Arthur!
Seriously cool.
Glad you enjoyed it!
watched on youtube, as it seemed to stream quicker...ironic that a political ad came up during the break at the 30:00 minute mark.
Haha, The pope regards our election as a toss up for the least bad option.
Has Wright become and American or is he just meddling? One would think that fixing the apostasy that fills what is left of Anglicanism might consume his time.
"Collaborate without compromise" seems to be his approach to "the American way" and to Anglicans.
Whew! Way to call out the anti-abortion/pro-gun situation here in America. It makes zero sense.