Task Force 34 and The Battle of Leyte Gulf
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- One of the most interesting parts of the Battle of Leyte Gulf was the battle that wasn't fought.
Special thanks to the Naval Institute Press for providing a free copy of The Battle of Leyte Gulf at 75: A Retrospective. www.amazon.com...
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"Taffy 3". Now there is a movie that needs to be made.
The battle as a hole was just under 4 hours to. The sea part was only 3 hours. If they made this into a 3-4 hour long movie and cut out or shorten the intro fluffing (cherictor backgrounds etc) we could get the hole battle in one movie.
@@kevind3974 Heh, there’s a vast difference between “hole” and “whole.” Lol
@@larryray3178 ya my bad. but hay atleaset it added some comedy into the comment
There was a Hollywood producer from Montana, Brandon Hogan, intent on making this movie. He got a script approved by the Navy several years ago. Unfortunately Mr. Hogan died in a small plane crash near Jackson, WY last summer. Waiting for others to take up the torch.
Such a movie would have to be told through visual story telling. Which is REALLY REALLY hard to do. In the last 20 years I can only think of a few examples of getting that right. It says something when the 03 clones wars miniseries is the only major one to come to mind. So such a movie would be EXTREMELY unlikely to be made as it is huge amounts of effort and skill are needed and Hollywood just doesn't have that anymore.
The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors by James Hornfischer is an incredible book on this story. I can’t recommend this enough.
Hornfischer is very good at capturing the experience of individuals and small units. Writing about the command level, though... Not so much.
I have this book too - I'm British, bought for me by American son-in-law's father - and it is very good. He makes one telling point at the end about Halsey. He never had a class of warships named for him.
@@DrivermanO OTOH Halsey *was* promoted to Fleet Admiral (5 stars), in Dec 1945.
I've read a couple of books by Hornfischer, including this one; I think it might actually cause him physical pain to write anything favorable about Halsey. That doesn't mean there isn't anything favorable to write.
Thank you...I couldn't remember the author...Hornfischer...I had the mistaken thought that it was Tom Clavin...
@Niko2100 I will definitely look for that book. As for Hornfischer's book all I can say is you don't want to be on a tin can when an 18 inch shell hits. It will rip a hole in the side of the ship the size of a bus!
Great video for all WWII history buffs. The Taffy 3 heroes fought with such courage that Kurita was convinced he had encountered a massive fleet. They covered a multitude of Halsey's sins and should never be forgotten.
"They covered a multitude of Halsey's sins and should never be forgotten."
Read James Hornfischer's "Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailor" and "The Fleet at Flood Tide".
Excellent books and also lays open Halsey's sins.
There were things to admire about Halsey.
His taking off to pursue the bait of the useless Japanese carriers and exposing those men on sea and land to annihilation is NOT one of them and is absolutely inexcusable.
He should have faced a Naval Board of Inquiry at the very least. ..the VERY least.
And as Hornfischer states: there is a reason only a single ship, the USS Halsey (DDG 97) is named after him.
Not a carrier, not a cruiser...just a destroyer.
The Navy can have a L O N G memory.
@@glenndower2513 "the Navy can have a L O N G memory."
They were still adamant more than 15 years after Billy Mitchell started demonstrating that air power could sink battleships, that they had in their 1941 Army v Navy football game program a page dedicated counter to that theory that to date (Nov 29, 1941) "it is significant that despite the claims of air enthusiasts, no battleship has yet been sunk by bombs." With a bow on view photo of the USS Arizona! As we all know, she was unfortunately sunk a week later at Pearl.
If ignorance is a state of bliss much of our naval brass at the time was in their own little heaven. It took a while for them to extract their heads from where they had them but they did finally get the message.
@@orcstr8d at that point the aircraft in service would struggle to sink capitol ships. Mitchell's demonstration was against a stationary target and it took hours for that ship to actually sink. Pretty much every navy in the world agreed with the USN. It would take more powerful aircraft and weapons to finally make it reality.
@@EliteF22 of course. And the Navy wasnt convinced after Pearl Harbor that battleships (stationary targets) were on their way out. But then HMS Prince of Wales and Repulse are sunk 3 days later while under power. Aerial torpedoes certainly help, or skip bombs.
And maybe that football game program was printed before the RN pulled off the successful attack at Taranto?
The charge of escort ships against the central force is an incredible tale of bravery in itself.
Hey, another bubblehead.
Especially since ALL of Taffy 3 was outweighed by Yamato.
My dad was on one of those escorts. It was a memory too horrific for him to share with us. But he wasn’t He despised Admiral Halsey
But he despised Halsey for the rest of his life.
The 49 people who down voted this video are Zero's.
They're probably all from another country.
One of the few battles my grandpa would talk about. He refused to buy a Japanese car his whole life after having so many planes hit his escort carrier.
My dad was on USS White Plains, an escort carrier, at Leyte. The ship was part of Taffy 3 and they crippled a Japanese heavy cruiser w/ their 5 inch gun. Thank you for another great story.
God Bless your father and the men of "Taffy 3". Is your HERO dad still with us?
Taffy 3 is probably the most epic combat story of WWII. I love a line laid out by another youtuber, Dracinifel: "Japanese commanders: Oh no! US Fletcher-class cruisers!"
My dad was a Seabee at Letye. A couple of years ago i created a couple of topics about that battle that includes photos from his album. You don't have to be a member to view the forum but you might have to click a couple of times to access.
forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/559048-the-general-returns
forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/559246-david-versus-goliath-on-the-high-seas/
X109 Thanks for sharing of pictures from your Dads photo album. My grandfather served in the Aleutian Campaign in a A/P Platoon and was part of the landing on both Attu and Kiska island.
Ahh, God bless your dad. There was a reason they're called the "Great Generation".
Excellent story. Though epic and often re-told, too few know of the courage and sacrifice of Task Force 3. I would be extremely grateful if you could do an episode detailing their story. Specifically the unequalled courage of Ernest E. Evans, _that's_ history that deserves to be remembered.
Taffy 3
I totally agree with you. The bravery of those men of Taffy 3 have never gotten enough attention. I would say a movie needs to be made about it, but a movie could never capture the sacrifice and bravery of the Taffy 3 sailors.
Thank you for the splendid recounting of the Battle of Leyte Gulf. Most accounts focus on the incredible courage shown by the defending force for the transports, but your take shows the errors of battle that so often occur when line commanders, who are human too, must make decisions without understanding, enough information, and under estimating their enemy's intentions.
James...And this also shows why accurate and timely communications is vital. Even back at the Battle of Gettysburg, if Lee had been able to communicate quickly with his other generals, there is a good possibility that Lee might have won at Gettysburg. Of course if the Northern commanders also had fast communications, then....well, we will never know. Today, communications are very well developed, and protected...I can only assume. With so much of it being satellite dependent, I wonder how vulnerable those satellites are to attack. Knock out the eyes of the enemy and the ballgame changes.
@@marbleman52...that is why it was a terrible mistake to retire the SR71. Real time recon that can NOT be interdicted by your enemy.
"It's history that never quite happened, and yet deserves... to be remembered" well said!
The balls on Taffy 3 is legendary. Thank you for another amazing story.
My father was fire control in the main battery plot on the West Virginia during the battle of Leyte Gulf. The old battleships, Mississippi, Maryland, West Virginia, Tennessee, California, and Pennsylvania all did their part in this historic battle. I have a small notebook Dad kept during the battle listing each round, type of round, and time. Reading this notebook while reading timelines of the battle stirs my imagination.
As both a “tin can sailor “ and a former unwilling guest of the Imperial Japanese Army in the Philippines, I have been well acquainted with the history of the Leyte landings and the battle off Samar. In fact after our liberation, we were evacuated via Leyte and spent time sleeping in a tent near Tacloban. I have enjoyed your other programs involving the Philippines (Los Banos raid and the Angels of Bataan and Corregidor). If you ever decide to do a program on the failed Iranian hostage rescue mission (Operation Eagle Claw), a late friend of mine was the only person involved in the both Los Banos (as a 4 year old liberated prisoner) and the failed hostage rescue operation (CIA operative). Please do more on Leyte and other WWII operations in the Philippines.
@Ron Lewenberg actually my parents and I were captured in early January 1942. I was about to turn a year old. We were liberated by the cavalry (1st Cavalry) on Feb. 3 , 1945 almost exactly 37 months later. I served on the USS Orleck (DD-886). I served on board from 1963 to '65 (Vietnam combat zone '64-'65). The Orleck was "Top Gun" in Vietnam having fired more rounds of Naval Gunfire Support than any ship since WWII. I was on board for the start of that run.
@@willoughby1888 As described in the reply above, I was so young that I only remember a very few things (Bowing to the Japanese sentries, the US planes attacking Manila, etc.). I always felt I owed a big debt to the US military for the daring and dangerous rescue that liberated me, my parents and thousands of civilian prisoners. As a very small repayment, I served as a Navy officer in Vietnam.
@@chrislehman255 When I was in the Navy, I served with a guy whose mother had been held in the Philippines as a child. When she was liberated, it was discovered that the camp had been ordered to be liquidated the very next day; he always said he was doubly blessed, and I believe it.
@@ex-navyspook Not sure which camp your shipmate's mother would have been in. Because it was the largest by far, it was probably Santo Tomas (the camp where we were interned). There is no absolute proof that the Japanese were planing to liquidate civilian prisoners and certainly not the day after liberation (Feb. 4, 1945). That said, there were orders issued to kill all allied prisoners before they could be liberated. The atrocity committed on the island of Palawan where the POWs were killed because it was feared that the island was about to be invaded led MacArthur to order a number of rescue missions. The first was to rescue the remnants of the Bataan Death March (the movie "The Great Raid"). The last was the Los Banos raid covered by THG several years ago. The middle one was the one that rescued us. It too was an extraordinary military feat consisting of a "flying column" going through 100 miles of Japanese held territory.
@@chrislehman255 "in early January 1942. I was about to turn a year old. " yea I was wondering about the age, that would make you about 90+ years old lol
Have you shown what Taffy 3 had done. My father was on the USS Johnston, a destroyer which was sunk. It took 2 days for anyone to find the survivors and because of this many fell prey to the sharks.
As did the crew of the escort carrier U.S.S. Gambier Bay, which was the only U.S carrier sunk by naval gunfire. From 1969 to 1970 I served with a survivor of the Gambier Bay, and I never knew it until I came across his name in "Men of the Gambier Bay," by Edwin Hoyt many years later.
I have read much of this before.
Much of the reading on the subject is confusing.
The fog of war.
The orders not given.
Strange decisions in the heat of the moment.
Thank for clarifying some of the aspects of the actions and inactions that took place.
Best channel on youtube.
Shawn R I wrote several term papers on this battle and the trouble with reading about this battle when reading from different sources is this was a very fluid battle and to make sense of it you need to take the after action reports read them carefully and then lay them out in order along with a chart and ship models and then fight the battle moving them about as you read the after action reports much like you see done in the war room in the movie Sink the Bismarck to truly get a sense how this battle was fought and how remarkable the actions of the Captains and Crews of the destroyers and jeep carriers were.
My father-in-law was on a minesweeper during the Leyte battle. He didn't know about until the early 80's when he read an article in a VFW or AL magazine. Small craft like minesweepers were used as patrol craft, like PT boats between invasions. His YMS was on patrol in a totally quiet region of the Philippines and knew nothing of the battle. Most people don't realize just how huge an area the Philippines cover. 7,641 islands in an area (approx 1,000 x 600 miles. That's from San Diego to Dallas then Dallas to South Dakota!
@@LuvBorderCollies My grandfather was in the Philippines sometime after early July 1945. The ship he was on passed through the Panama Canal on July the 4th. He was assigned to an engineer unit that combed the islands looking for Japanese holdouts in the jungles and the mountains.
This is the Best Channel on TH-cam. Thank you History Guy!
Growing up as a kid, I lived in a part of CT that was petty much the Bedroom for the Submarine Base in Groton CT. You were either in the Navy at that time or you worked for Electric Boat, the shipyard that built the Subs. There were still quite a few Submariners around that fought the war in the Pacific. My dad was friends with a retired Adm, a fellow by the name of Kimmel. I was also young then, and the War was much closer to us. Now I will be 65 in a few short months, Most of the veterans of that War that I knew have passed on, soon it will be all of them. Yet the War looms bigger than life for it was a War that dwarfed all others. Thankfully we have been living in fairly peaceful times ever since. All we have now is the history and the first-hand accounts and the Memory. Gee, they even got a New retelling of "Midway" coming in November to the movies. Just to show you there is still have an interest in those times when our Grandfathers and for some Great Grandfathers in their youths when forth to save civilization. As usual, you do a fine job of bringing the lesser-known parts of history to life.
WW2 touched everyone in the world and there were approximately 60 million deaths so there could be millions of stories and movies. For example, I am from Honduras. In our Caribbean waters we have the Bay Islands which were British up until 1820 or something. The original island population is english speaking. In the 1990s I lived there and made many friends including an old black gentleman named Sam Miller who owned a backpacker hotel. We chatted many tines and once he mentioned he once worked as a "wireless operator".
Some years later, I came back to the islands and went to see him. The conversation again turned to him being a wireless operator... on Liberty Ships... in World War 2!!! Being a ww2 buff I said What!
He described his work ferrying stuff to England and he demonstrated how he tapped the telegraph... tee tee teet teet tee.
He told me the Germans sank him three times including one day when he was sunk twice (sunk, rescued, sunk, rescued) and how he saw germans machine-gun people in the water!
All ww2 deserves to be remembered but Sam Miller's story will remain with me forever.
Viva Honduras! Viva USA, the UK, the Commonwealth and all sincere allies! And viva Trump!
Saludos amigos!
"A fellow by the name of Kimmel." I like how understated that was.
Best story ever told. Have 4 uniforms from survivors including one each from the Sammy B and Johnston.
Cool
Best story about it is on Drachinifel channel.
The USS JOHNSTON and her crew were fierce. Her skipper, Commander Evans set the tone when she was commissioned, stating " This is going to be a fighting ship. I intend to go in harm's way, and anyone who doesn't want to go along had better get off right now."
They exemplified the attitude of Tin Can Sailors.
The USS JOHNSTON'S CO Cmdr. Evans was awarded a post. Medal of Honor and a destroyer was named and commisdioned in his honor.
@@tokul76 I like that channel too!
Thank you,Sir. For this 75th anniversary presentation of what is the USN's primary doctrine "Do not give up the ship" as practiced by Taffy 3. "And our flag was still there"
He was correct the Carrier was the most important target. But forgot the most important responsibility was support and defense of the landing force.
A common Naval Sin...
Seeking Glory instead of sticking to the plan.
It's happened countless times before, and it will happen countless more times.
Halsy was an idiot. No, he was not correct. The carrier was _not_ the most important target.
By this point in the war they weren't, but it's easy to think why they were important. Halsey failed because he took all his assets with him. He could have left a small task force of 2 or 3 battleships, some cruisers, and one carrier to protect the fleet - his primary responsibility - and still sunk the Japanese carriers, but he got too focused on his own glory.
@@PelenTan He was most assuredly correct.
The carrier WAS the most important Target.
They were, however, not the MISSION.
The carrier wasn't the most important target. Protecting the beachhead was the most important task. By then the Japanese didn't even have competent pilots to fly off carriers or fuel for their planes. So sacrificing the carrier was nothing to them. That's why they did it. Halsey was just a hotheaded fool who took the bait hook, line and sinker. If the man had any pride he'd have committed suicide after that titanic blunder. But alas he lived to spin endless excuses for the rest of his life.
The fog of war. You never have enough assets to cover everywhere so you make a calculation. History determines if you were right. Desperate times.
And unfortunately for people like Halsey, hindsight is 20/20.
The Japanese totally played Halsey for the fool that he was. They knew precisely what he'd do and he did exactly that. The man should have been shot for his massive dereliction of duty and utter incompetence. Then to not man up and admit your blunder? The shame!
War does not determine who is right. War determines who is left.
@@1pcfred We don't have the experience he did, so we can't really know why he did what he did. Yes, he made a mistake, I'm not denying that, but we have all the information while he did not. It would be like putting a blindfold on you and asking you to navigate a room, and every time you bumped into something we start calling you an idiot. It just isn't always fair to look at history like that.
@@legogenius1667 he wasn't called Bull Halsey for no good reason. When someone exhibits a pattern of behavior it is not wrong to call them out on it. The guy was too type A for the people around him.
I -am- was a SUBPAC Sailor. So understand that when I say TAFFY-3 represents and demonstrates what United States Navy sailors are capable of, I do not do so lightly. They met, and exceeded, the standard set by generations of sailors the went before, and is still being met today.
I asked before, and I won't ask again, PLEASE DO AND EPISODE ON TAFFY-3. They deserve more than a passing comment.
This year at the Guam Navy ball I believe they had a special cake with the image of the Samuel B. Roberts on it. Even all these years later Taffy 3 is still officially celebrated.
Taffy 3 and the Battle of Samar deserve their own episode. Destroyer escorts fighting battleships and the invaluable help of the CVEs that still to that point were underrated
Halsey made many mistakes in his career, including running his fleet into two typhoons. Question how the battle would have gone if Spruance had been in command instead.
Maybe a better question, How would Leyte Gulf have gone if Halsey had been at the Philippine Sea instead of Spruance? (In which case no IJN CVs would likely have survived to join Sho-Go.)
Hard to say. But Halsey himself is said to have wished that he and Spruance could have traded places for those two battles.
@@Philistine47 Absolutely - they were better suited for those battles. For a WW I example, imagine that Jellicoe had commanded the Battle Cruiser Fleet at Jutland, and Beatty the Grand Fleet.
Much better...
As badly as movies are written today. I would go and see a movie about Taffy 3 stand against the Japanese navy.
I hope you do a story about the destroyers that attacked Kurita's battleships. It is a story that should be shouted from the roof tops. Heroism and sacrifice on a large scale.
My grandfather was a gunners mate on the USS Raymond, part of Taffy 3. He had a photo of the St Lo sinking on his office wall. Taffy 3 recieved a Presidential Unit Citation for this action.
My late father’s older brother Morgan “Dutch” Green was killed in the sinking of the USS Astoria in the Battle of Leyte Gulf.
Astoria was sunk at Savo Island. My father was on Uss Helm DD 388 which was escorting the 3 cruisers sunk.
@Ron Lewenberg You are correct.
The Japanese read Halsey like a book, they knew he couldn't resist that last battleship. As for Taffy 3, Sometimes its not the size of the dog in the fight, its the size of the fight in the dog!
sorry I just realized I wrote battleship in the original post and meant aircraft carrier
@@korbell1089 You are correct about Japanese knowing that Halsey would go after their aircraft carriers. Halsey always thought that he was "cheated" out of the Battles of the Coral Sea & Midway. For Coral Sea, he was escorting USS Hornet and the Doolittle Raiders and during Midway, he came down with a wicked rash of sorts, so he missed both battles.
"Taffy 3" Thank you!
My uncle, Howard B. Merrill FCO was on the USS Heermann, DD532. He was traumatized by that battle for the rest of his life. I've read several books on the battle, including one my uncle personally gave me. Halsey was greedy for personal glory and was not a team player. My uncle had nothing good to say about him. One of the messages sent to Halsey was, "Where is Task Force 34? The world wonders."
Lack of communication by all involved and the lack of Nimitz requiring timely SITREPs led to Halsey taking off after Ozawa. Had there been good comm between Halsey, Kinkaid, Sprague and Nimitz then Halsey would have been ordered to leave a task force , such as 34, behind off the coast of Samar while he pursued the decoy fleet. That the decoy fleet had enough firepower to sink the Princeton thus Halsey he had a worthy fish to chase. King never let Halsey believe he had done anything wrong even after he (Halsey) in retrospect thought he did. I agree with King’s post battle assessment that Kinkaid should have tasked his organic air assets to provide an early warning of the approach of kurita’s ships. Samuel Eliot Morison’s volume regarding Leyte Gulf is the best one and the first one those interested should read. I found the three other sources I read to be confusing because there is so much going on in different places all at the same time. Halsey’s actions are justified based on his orders, mission statement and commanders intent.
@@tjschakow The book, Afternoon of the Rising Sun, by Kenneth I. Friedman is one of the books my uncle gave me. That explains it very well in my opinion.
Awesome video, probably one of your finest!!! Also, great book to read about this battle is, "The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors", by James Hornfisher. That book focuses primarily on Taffy 3 and the American destroyers charging into battle against the Japanese fleet. Also gives the Japanese side of the battle as well.
My great uncle billy was a gunner in VT-18 and his torpedo bomber on the intrepid was shot down during their attack on the musashi
Admiral Halsey was my mothers great uncle! I've always been honored to have an admirals gene in our families bloodline. I'm 38 now and this story has been the most educational of everything I've ever tried to learn about him! Thank you for information and research, and not bashing him either. I know I take after him, just like a stubborn Halsey, "I've got this! "
My high school girlfriends father, Jess Lagos was on the USS Gridley...
My friends dad was on the escort carrier Gambier Bay which was the only US "Carrier" sunk by enemy ship fire and not torpedoed or destroyed by aircraft. He had quite the story to tell.
Mind-boggling on how many errors were made by both sides. Just the sheer amount of luck on the American side is unbelievable.
Thank you- found out one day that a survivor of the heroic crew of the USS Johnston went to the church I was attending. I remember that he was alive when I first started attending, but died before I heard his story (or knew him). I heard about the USS Johnston from brilliant friend. Later, I was with a home prayer group when I noticed a model of the USS Johnston on the mantle. His widow then related how he had to swim for four days. One by one the other men with him dropped off, and he kept swimming. He barely made it to shore and I think the local Philippine peoples helped out of the water (they almost shot him too). I shared that with my friend the next time I saw him. God is so good.
I live in Indianapolis and knew Jimmy O'Donnell who was the last survivor of the sinking of the USS Indianapolis from Indianapolis. I was in a men's group with him. He was involved in book signings for a book about it but never spoke to me or to my knowledge anyone else in our group about the tragedy. He came back home and got on the fire department and lived his life. The few times I spoke with him it was always about sports or events we were involved in.
@@steveoconnor7069 A regret of my life. I ran into a very old man at the Arby's on 86th St and Michigan, about 1999, wearing a U.S.S. Indianapolis survivor ball cap. Probably him. I was in awe and too timid to say hello and thank you. I wish I had had him shake hands with my 3 and 5 year old children, so when I told them the story years later they might have remembered the experience.
It very likely was Jimmy.
They discovered the USS Johnston yesterday.
Berry Tharp - oh wow! That’s incredibly cool and talk about the timing.
Long live Commander Evens and the USS Johnston, and the hero’s of Taffy 3
My grandfather was on the uss kitkun bay they were hit by a kamikaze. I have his whites, looking for the line print of ship to do a shadow box.
He lived 50miles north of Vanport, where the Kitkun Bay was made.
Nimitz to Halsey...Where is, Repeat where is TF 38? The world wonders.
Las vegas, Nv 1996.
"What a brawl it would have been/"
Don't worry....it happened in an alternate reality.
Report from inside the Battle of Layette Gulf...The Swanee and the Santee were the first two carriers hit by Kamikaze, The Santee was hit first. The Swanee was steaming in sight or her. It was a tactic nobody had ever seen before. My Father was a Baker on board the Swanee. He and 4 other bakers had gone up on the flight deck to smoke my Dad's Lucky's (LSMFT, Lucky Strike Means Fine Tobacco) They're at the stern rail with the Santee steaming behind them and all of a sudden a Zero drops out of the clouds and makes a Bee line for the bridge of the Santee, CRASH!!. The Bakers looked at each other and said. He looked like he did that on purpose! Then they said If that happened to us this wouldn't be a very safe place to be standing. So they started to walk back up the flight deck to go below and back to the Bake shop. as they were nearing the bulkhead the second Kamikaze attack in all of history crashed into the Flight Deck of the Swanee. Dad said Bodies just blew right past them. The two bakers walking behind and the two walking either side of my Dad got hit with shrapnel. Baker 3ird class John A Imhoff didn't get a scratch. Both the Swanee and the Santee were sister ships, They had been Oil Tankers before the war, Thick hulls and able to carry enough fuel to refuel their own battle groups without using other resources. There were 4 of them that were flat topped after The Battle of Midway and named after southern rivers. There were only three decks on these ships. Flight deck, Hanger deck and Fuel deck. Everything below the fuel deck was fuel. The Swanee got hit by a second Kamikaze that day which crashed through the flight deck at the main service elevator that brought planes up from the hanger deck. It crashed through the flight deck, through the hanger deck and landed on the fuel deck. That was bad enough. Had that zero penetrated the fuel deck the Swanee would have been lost and I would not be writing this. I would never have been born. The Swanee lost 500 of it's ship's company that day in a Battle that just does not fit into 20 minutes of a Henry Fonda Movie. A man named Fox Connor I have learned recently, had three rules about getting into fights. Never fight alone...Never fight for long...Never go to war unless you Absolutely have too. WWII The U. S. Had to go to war. The Empire of Japan had killed more Americans in one strike than any foreign power in history December 7th 1941. America would not see it's equal until 9-11-2001. Decades later politicians would ask, Why Nagasaki? Why Hiroshima? Then answer to those questions would be, Because of Per Harbor. Layette Gulf earned the name "Iron Bottom Bay" It was a fight, lots of Losses. I took care of a man from Brooklyn who was on the Mounson when it went down in that same battle...Story for a different day. History that deserves to be remembered...
Where is Task Force 34...the world wonders. Oh, were you going to say that? Halsey screwed up and the men of the Tin Can Navy paid the price. Recommend "Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors".
Yup, Halsey seemed to have gone to pieces and with quite a bit of inflexibility.
Aren't counter-factuals fun? I remember a talk given by a National Parks Service ranger concerning the battle of Gettysburg. He says people ask him if the outcome would have been different if Lee's Confederates had had a machine gun or two. His answer? Forget machine guns -- a pair of walkie talkies could have changed the outcome!
I was already very familiar with everything you covered in this presentation and I still found your narrative compelling. It is a testament to your enthusiasm and skill that you can tell me something I already know and make me enjoy it as much as when I first learned it.
Surprised you didn't mention the captain of the destroyer (USS Johnston) who attacked without orders and sacrificed his ship to save the escort carriers and the landing zone. I believe Ernest Evans was his name, he won the Medal of Honor, posthumously.
There is a memorial to Taffy III in San Diego near the USS Midway. You can go through it too.
Fascinating. I know Halsey made a bad decision, but if you're in command long enough that is bound to happen. Sad that he felt compelled to defend his decisions, as I'm a big believer in admitting, "I f#!*ed up."
Thank you for your compelling reflections on the Battle of Leyte Gulf. As a Navy vet and son of a Pearl Harbor attack survivor I am drawn to WWII actions in the Pacific.
One of the greatest acts of heroism and sacrifice involved USS SAMUEL B. ROBERTS (DE 413) of Taffy 3, often called the Destroyer Escort that fought like a Battleship. Her actions are featured in the book, Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors. I served aboard a DER in Vietnam in Operation Market Time, the coastal blockade of Vietnam.
Wish our forces had been pitted against the battleships of Japan at Leyte.
My grandfather was the Throttleman (a much more complex job than most think) on the USS Gambier Bay during that battle. He and his crewmates spent two days and three nights in the water before RADM Spruance could detach ships from supporting the landing to retrive them. Thanks for a great telling of the larger battle!
I knew someone who was on the Samuel B. Roberts in The Battle of Leyte Gulf
One her very first war cruise, as escort for an Atlantic convoy she struck a whale and damaged her propeller < doubt it did the whale much good > She returned to port, was repaired and then painted in Pacific dazzle: the crew knew where they were going next.
The man who used to live across from my dad for a great many years was the gun captain of the number four 5" gun mount of the destroyer USS Heermann which fought in this battle. He said that they were firing whatever came up the shell hoist; high capacity, armor piercing, star shells, whatever and that he could see through his gunsights pieces of enemy sailors flying through the air when hits were scored. After the battle, he was among eight men dispatched into the bowels of the ship with large tongs to retrieve the dog tags of fellow sailors who had been killed by enemy shell hits.
How about Taffy 3, the USS Johnston, and Commander Evans?
Hindsight is 20/20. With that as a modifier, Halsey was a fool. His task was to protect the landings. He could've done both if he'd paired off that task force. Sheer luck and tenacity saved his career.
Halsey was a carrier admiral, with a definite bias towards naval aviation. This innate preference and the indisputable success of the USN's carrier arm--plus his years-long rage over Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor--led him to over-emphasize that day's importance of destroying Japan's naval aviation. He wanted to bag those carriers, especially Shokaku. I think this left Halsey with a surface warfare blind spot. Combined with the circumstances that History Guy cited, and the fact that 7th Fleet did have half a dozen battleships of its own led Halsey to treat Center Force as distraction or complication rather than serious threat.
And the Japanese did smoke him, that day.
*Kinkaid's* job was to protect the landings. *Halsey's* job was to smash major elements of the IJN if they showed up - with priority attention to Japanese carriers because that was US Navy doctrine. And absent the benefit of hindsight, Ozawa's CVs appeared to be the primary threat to not only the landing force, but also Third Fleet itself.
Related. The Japanese didn't "lay a trap for Halsey," as is often claimed. They didn't know who they were laying a trap for specifically, they just knew from observation that the USN tended to go after CVs with extreme prejudice.
@@Philistine47 I would argue that Kinkaid's job was the southern force since he had the old "slow" battleships. As for the Japanese carriers, perhaps, but after the "Turkey Shoot"? That's not thinking straight. It would have been all-around better if Halsey just stayed there and waited for them to come to him since the Japanese were there to stop the landing after all. Not even leaving the task force was foolhardy.
@@alainarchambault2331 1) Kinkaid had enough force to guard both Surigao Strait and San Bernardino Strait, and both of those were his responsibility. He improperly left San Bernardino Strait uncovered because of an unverified communications intercept; that's on him, not Halsey.
2) Carriers had shown the ability to replenish depleted air groups within days of returning to port. And the Japanese clearly weren't short of aircraft, as they'd deployed hundreds to Formosa and the Philippine Islands. Halsey had no way to know - and would have been insane to assume - that the IJN had run out of pilots even minimally qualified to fly off Ozawa's CVs. That's pure hindsight talking.
Finally, in late 1944 "standing on the defensive" was exactly what Spruance was being roundly criticized for doing at the Philippine Sea, especially among the naval aviation community. Even more especially because it ran directly counter to USN doctrine, which was to aggressively go after enemy fleets (carriers in particular) rather than letting the enemy take their best shot and hoping for the best.
@@Philistine47 We have to agree to disagree. Sorry, good day.
My father was on the USS Heerman. Halsey was pretty much hated by the sailors of Taffy 3.
My uncle, Howard B. Merrill, was on the Heermann also. He was very traumatized by the battle for the rest of his life. He had nothing good to say about Halsey.
There was pretty much hated by the sailors of Taffy3, He was just plain Hated.
@Ron Lewenberg I know she took at least one big hit below the waterline at the bow and her cruise book showed superstructure damage. There was some serious concern about it going down from that hit. My father never talked about it, but the cruise book showed him being presented a Bronze star for the damage control effort for the bow damage. He was a shipfitter. I wish I still had the cruise book but it disappeared while I had it at work to show it to some people there.
@Ron Lewenberg It was interesting that their Unit Citation cleared up some of that. They were so close, that the Yamato and some of the cruisers couldn't depress their big guns enough to hit it.
Looks like footage from “Victory at Sea.”
SkylersRants what a great series that is!
There's an old anecdote that a naval gunfight (pre radar and night vision) is like a knife fight in a shower with the lights turned off.
Halsey made a terrible mistake. But he would never admit being wrong
Must have been kin to Trump. Never admit you are wrong, even when you are not right. Blunder...
Luckily, the Yamato wasn't too badly damaged to prevent if from later being refitted to defend Earth against the Gamilons.
It blew up underwater and is in a million bits on the sea floor.
KarlBunker LOL!
I love star blaster!!!!
@@bryancreech1236 star blazers lol
Bwahahaha, I remember that: "Space Cruiser Yamato".
Thank you so much for this. My wife's uncle was killed in the battle of Leyte Gulf. RIP, Richard Stultz...…...
Taffy 3 needs to be made into a full length movie... as does wake island!
"The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors" by James Hornfischer > USS Johnson
"The Ghost Ship" > USS Houston, Java Sea sunk Feb 1942, the POWs that built Bridge Over River Kwai
"I know this book. Your conclusions were all wrong, Ryan. Halsey acted stupidly."
--Captain First Rank Marko Aleksandrovich Ramius, captain of the Soviet ballistic missile submarine RED OCTOBER
History to be remembered? Hollywood History?
I immediately thought of this. The Vilnius school master.
And Ramius was correct. If the IJN would have pressed on things would have gone way differently. The IJN also acted incorrectly. Great video of a pivotal battle of the pacific theater.
@@chantellenew2331 I've heard that line for decades since that movie came out... and while I vaguely knew something of the battle, I understand it much better now.
History can be illuminated by fiction.
What you guys need to understand Clancy wrote that book from a perspective of a strategist. Most modern military historians agree Halsey acted stupidly indeed. That line has merit in reality because of Clancy's research.
Taffy 3 = The Dragons of Samar
In Herman Wouk's wonderful book, 'War and Remembrance', he details the Battle of Leyte Gulf in some detail. Had Halsey not been such as well-known figure in the war, he probably would have been in serious trouble, but his reputation saved him.
Wish I had seen this while my father was still here....he suffered his whole life from his physical and mental injuries
I love it when i find out new things about WWII. Id like to think im quite knowledgeable about it, but theres always something new here or there that i haven't seen in the countless documentaries I've watched. Youre channel LITERALLY IS the best source for forgotten history .
For more information on this battle I recommend the book _"The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors"_ (2003) and Drachinifel's video _"Battle of Samar - Odds? What are those?"_ from earlier this year.
I remember watching a Dogfights documentary and I was just amazed at what went down.
Thank you for another wonderful, detailed account from our nation's history. You have a gift for bringing the past back to life. I look forward to every episode your team produces!
Your consistent quality that satisfies your audience from the casual to hardcore history buffs makes you a true star in an otherwise messy TH-cam.
I'm telling you he's like a modern John Chancellor.
The Midway remake is about to drop in theaters. If it does well they may do a film on this the largest naval battle in history. Great video even mentioning the battle of Palawan passage with the subs Darter and Dace often overlooked.The subs actually sunk Admiral Kurita's flagship cruiser Atago and he had to swim awaiting rescue.
I left quite a lot of the battel vague because I plan to do several episodes on the battle eventually.
You did a great job within the limited time you have and I love it. Lets face it, you could fill a small library with all the books on this one battle.
Have you had the opportunity to read "The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors"? I like to remember that it was a fantastically written book, but that opinion might be skewed, since I had spent most of my college years reading books and documents from the Age of Sail and colonialism and TLSTCS was a welcome break.
Excellent book. Read it as well and it was captivating - kept my attention and learned a lot about the battle. Was great to get the views of the opposing sides as well.
One of the mistakes Halsey made.
Sailing through hurricanes was his another ones Ugh¿
William Ward I was just thinking about that. It’s amazing his career survived so many screw ups. I wonder how different Midway would’ve looked had he been there. The willingness to gamble along with intense aggressiveness can make Generals and Admirals look like geniuses or fools. Fate determines which.
@@Joker-jt3vn Midway probably wouldn't have been all that different. Remember that Spruance had no experience with aviation at that time, so he had to lean hard on his staff - who were in fact *Halsey's* staff.
Hey, I just read a book about this! "Last stand of the tin can sailors" by James d. Hornfisher. A real page turner of a book.
The story really hits home my grandfather was on the USS Gambier bay
So was mine, MM2 (later MM1) Donald Topczewski. He didn't talk much about it but we got him to tell quite a bit later and thank goodness we had the good sense to record it!
My grandfather was MM 3/c who knows perhaps they knew each other
@@joemantz4160 Completely possible. There may be records on the Gambier Bay Association website.
My father was on the Gambier Bay (Taffy 3) when it was sunk. He was in the water for three days before being rescued.
One of the greatest David vs Goliath sea battles of all time, there also a great book "Sea of Thunder" which covers the battle and the commanders involved.
Read it. Great book. Ernest Evans is a hero of mine.
Excellent video as always I enjoy watching your videos. Keep them coming
I was really hoping you would go in detail about Taffy 3 and the battle off Samar Island and the courage of Rear Admiral Clifton Sprague's Task Unit 77.4.3 ("Taffy 3") consisting of Carrier Division 25 Fanshaw Bay, St. Lo, White Plains, Kalinin Bay, and Rear Admiral Ralph A. Ofstie's Carrier Division 26 Kitkun Bay and Gambier Bay.
Screening for Taffy 3 were the destroyers Hoel, Heermann and Johnston, and destroyer escorts Dennis, John C. Butler, Raymond, and Samuel B. Roberts.
The heroics of the Johnston and the Samuel B. Roberts are esp history worth remembering.
You can call it Part 2.
Thank you. I am waiting with bated breath
My uncle, the husband of my mother's sister, was a naval aviator, a Corsair pilot in this action. He told of flying for almost three days straight, of having his original pocket carrier sunk while in the air, being told to land on any carrier available. He said he would land, be lifted out of his plane, stripped of his aviation overalls, washed and toweled off on deck, put in fresh clean overalls, while his cockpit was washed out, the plane fueled and rearmed, hot food from the galley served on deck. He would be hoisted back into the plane, given sacks of sandwiches and one or two thermoses of coffee and sent back off.
Night landings would have the carriers turn on landing lights. They were desperate to protect the fleet.
No Corsairs took part in the October Battle of Leyte Gulf. Marine Corsairs did later land on Leyte, possibly starting as early as November, to provide close air support to the army. The first VMF squadron served on a fast carrier in December. They were transported into the theater on CVEs, however.
@@blastulae I stand corrected, he flew a naval fighter aircraft off one of the pocket carriers. I know later he did fly a Corsair. When we would visit his house as kids his son being two years older than I would show the rest of us, his cousins, photos that he got from his dad's filing cabinet that were from the aircraft carriers his dad flew off of in the war showing planes as they landed or not, landing accidents, battle damaged planes... The photos must have been from cameras on deck and in the carrier island and cameras on the planes.
This about 1962 to 1965 of photos from 1944 to 1945. Actual pieces of history.
@@lynnwood7205 What great mementos! My dad flew Marine Corsairs, but we had few pictures. The Navy did operate Corsairs off carriers later in the war, once the Royal Navy figured out the trick to trapping them.
@@blastulae...the loooong looping approach so the boat is always visible to your left.
My dad Enrico Trotta served on USS Louisville CA 28 Flagship and this is his story with Rear Admiral Jesse B. Oldendorf aboard:
Battle of Surigao Strait: Oct. 24, 1944:
The Older Battleships and Older Cruisers did the Majority of the Pacific Bombardment for the Newer Battleships and New Cruisers screened the Aircraft carriers.
USS LOUISVILLE CA- 28 Heavy Cruiser
Greatest Sea Battle - Surigao Strait
Give Credit To The Cruisers Not the Battleships
From my diary and the Louisville Man of War Book this story should set the records straight
that the cruisers proved their weight in gold not the battleships like so many stories told.
It was October 24, 1944 aboard the flagship heavy cruiser U.S.S. Louisville CA-28 with the
7 th Fleet - Battleship/Cruiser Force Task Group 77.2 with Rear Admiral Jesse Oldendorf
aboard. I was a 20 year old seaman 1st class assigned to portside 20 mm anti-aircraft gun crew by turret B - 8 inch gun. I had a ring side seat to the greatest naval battle ever.
The U.S. Fleet consisted of:
6 Battleships
4 Heavy cruisers (Louisville CA-28 Flagship)
4 Light cruisers
24 Destroyers
At about 3:15 a.m. we stared to close in and were given the range of the Japanese ships. The
Louisville opened first at 3:50 a.m. with her 9 - 8 inch/55 cal. main battery guns. The second time she fired the 8 inch guns she scored a direct hit and other cruisers and battleships opened up - lighting up the night. The “Lady Lou” as she was known, main battery fired over and over shaking the 600 foot ship from bow to stern.
The Japanese ships were caught by surprise and were all a blaze. (Crossing the “T” with no way out for Japan).
At 4:00 a.m. a Japanese destroyer tried to make a run on us and our 5 inch/25 cal. and main
battery 8 inch guns opened up on it - sending death and destruction to sink it. When the battle
was over in 15 minutes the Japanese ship losses were:
2 Battleships
5 Cruisers
7 Destroyers
The U.S. ship losses were:
Destroyer USS Albert Grant hit but not sunk. 'friendly Fire from U.S. cruisers - 6 inch shells"
During the battle the Louisville fired more main battery 8 inch shells than the total of all calibers fired by the (6) battleships - from (Man of War).
The Louisville fired (37) salvos - 9 - 8 inch guns fired for a total of (333) - 8 inch shells.
The “Lady Lou” was honored for this by Rear Admiral Jesse Oldendorf.
I felt I had to write this article from information from my diary and Man of War - U.S.S. Louisville CA-28 book because documentaries and stories like Sea Classics always seem to give most credit to the battleships. I and others who read my story will know what really happened. Give credit to the cruisers for the greatest sea battle.
The total shells fired per battleship:
Appendix
US Battleship Ammunition at Surigao Strait
Ship Capacity Total On-Board AP HC Rounds Expended
(all AP)
West Virginia 800 375 200 175 93
Maryland 800 685 240 445 48
California 1200 318 240 78 63
Tennessee 1200 664 396 268 69
Mississippi 1200 744 201 543 12
Pennsylvania 1200 453 360 93 Did not fire
Data from "Two Ocean War" by S.E. Morrison.
The Cruisers fired well over 2000 rounds of 6 inch and 8 inch shells.
U.S.S. Louisville fired 333 rounds of 8 inch shells.
God Bless our servicemen and women - past and present!
By: Enrico Trotta (passed in 2017 at age 92)
Served aboard the USS Louisville CA- 28
From 1943-46 as a S1c
20 mm AA gun crew
My Dad was in the Merchant Marines, and his cargo ship delivered fuel and ammunition to the forces in Leyte Gulf.
He made it through the war, and came home to raise a family of 6 children.
He passed about 7 years ago.
I miss him still.
To be fair to adm. Kirita in the extended battle after he went for swim when his flagship was sunk along with whatever equipment he needed to command this battle, then the battle in the Subuyan sea and then the hornets nest on San Bernardino strait. He must have gone without sleep for several days now and it seemed like anything that floated, had a American flag and armed with at least a pistol was out to get him personally. You have to give it to Taffy 3 for being able to hit the Japanese harder than they were being hit. When they turned away a sailor on one of the carriers said: ' hey they're getting away". The planes attacking Kirita were the same as used by the fast carriers with the same weapons as sank the Musahi the day before. In any case, I wonder how much ammunition he still had to sink the transports if he decided to brush aside Taffy 3.
It is true that Kurita had already had two flagships sunk from under him. That might make any commander gun shy.
The most popular theory is that he overestimated the force he was facing. However, he expected to meet a force, and would likely have engaged anyway. Other theories are that he was attempting to regroup, as the torpedo attacks had broken up his formations. Once disengaged he did not see that there was more to gain. Another claims that he had reports of American carriers to the north and was moving to attack what turned out to be a false report. Another factor is that IJN doctrine stressed preserving the fleet, and his instinct may simply to have been defensive.
My Dad was part of Taffy 3. His Destroyer, USS Heermann, DD532, sank the Japanese Cruiser Chikuma during the battle, but the Heermann did take heavy damage from hits from Chikuma's guns. With the loss of so many of Heermann's officers during the battle, my Dad went from Ensign to Lt. Commander on that day.
Yaiks
LMAO!! Not even 10 seconds in and I'm laughing... brought to you by "Magellan TV" is so hilarious because Magellan and his men were killed in the Philippines on Cebu island, which is right next to Leyte. Waray Waray warrior ako ;)
I've an subject for a future "piece of forgotten history"
The story of the 3 sisters (HMS Cressy, Aboukir, Hogue). All lost on the same day within minutes and a few hundred feet of each other during the early days of the Great War.
Keep up the good work. 👍
My father, Augustin Joseph (A.J.) Ordogne, was an 18 year old sailor on the Destroyer USS Reid. It was hit by three Kamikaze's and ultimately sank during the battle of Leyte Gulf. My father was one of only 100 survivors. Otherwise, I would not be here today.
My uncle was on USS Abner Read at Leyte Gulf. He spent some time in the water after the ship was sunk by kamikaze, but he survived.
If not for the insanely heroic actions of the Commanding Officers and the Crews of the Destroyers USS Johnston, USS Hoel and the mightiest DE in the world USS Samuel B. Roberts, history would look much differently for Halsey and MacArthur!
I swear, T.H.G could read off a grocery receipt and I'd be on the edge of my seat!
Well done!👍
Lucrezia Borgia's grocery list would be interesting. So would Livia Julia Augusta's.
There are so many books written about these battles, all are worthy to read.
"What we've got here is failure to communicate." --Strother Martin
" There are some men you just can't reach..."
I have the movie on disk !!! Cool hand Luke!!!
@@bryancreech1236 Great movie, but that fall that Newman took was so fake...it's like the director said, now Paul, you fall down when Strother "hits" you but be careful you don't hurt yourself on the way down!
My Father was on the "Richard P. Leary" which was involve in a torpedo attack with 2 other Destroyers during the height of the Gunnery battle in the Sergio straits. Imagine being a 130 lb 5'7" 18 yr old at your 20 mm Anti Aircraft gun with a battle helm likely too big and a Life preserver wrapped around you as protection from drowning. Now take into account the 5', 6", 8", 14" and 16" Shells like freight cars zooming over your head in both directions as you race straight at the Japanese fleet at 35 Knots bow to bow and it's Night. No wonder my dad would not talk about his combat experience. Oh yes the DD behind the RP Leary was shelled and put out of action by 8" shells from the US Battle line. The Leary was only 1000s yards ahead of the disabled DD. The Leary assisted and took the damage DD into Tow during clearing operations after the Battle.
Work is going to have to wait. Class is in session!!
I have compared Halsy's dash north after the northern decoy without telling anyone of his plans as akin to Stuart leaving the Army of Northern Virginia blind in July 1863. Both commanders, otherwise quite good at their profession acted with complete irresponsibility. The fictional Marko Ramius put it well; Halsey acted stupidly! It's been called "The Battle of Bull's Run" by historians who may not have been Halsey's strongest supporters.
One of greatest stories to come out of WW2. Thank you, as always, for the awesome videos
as usual, Outstanding. I would have liked to hear more about Taffy 3. The USS Johnston, the USS Samuel B Roberts, USS Hoel, USS Heermann, The hand full of DDs and DEs that threw themselves against the center force. The IGN BB Musashi alone was bigger than the entire force of DDs and DEs that tenaciously counter attacked.
"but 18 inch guns of Yamato may suggest otherwise.."
I'm loving that phase..!😍
Correct, Yamato had eighteen inch guns.
@@TheHistoryGuyChannel thanks for the correction sir...
Thanks for all the effort you keep in preserving history for further generations 💟🔥
The fight would have actually been much more evenly matched than most think.
The Yamato did have the larger guns at 18 inches, but the Americans were (and still are) widely held to have the better quality steel (armor and penetrator cones) and more concentrated explosives, so the American 16 inch guns are quite often held to be on par with Japan's 18s despite the glaring difference in bore size.
That said, the edge would likely still go to America due to its vastly superior Fire Control Systems and astonishingly high accuracy rate for the era.
While the Japanese guns might do more damage on a successful hit, they would be relying on luck as much as skill, and statistically, the American guns would rack up more damage during the fight by dint of volume of fire and high (though not astounding) levels of damage from each strike.
Admiral Sprague of Taffy 3 reported that the Japanese shooting was “very bad”, so I’d have to agree that the showdown would have gone in America’s favor.
@@johncoe929 Well, to be fair, the Japanese were using the wrong tool for the job.
Battleships don't kill DDs and DEs at engagement range for DDs and DEs; you aren't killing a destroyer at point blank with anything larger than a 5 inch gun...the transverse is too high and the turrets track too slowly (if they can reach that angle of declination at all.)
So, of course the battleships and heavy cruisers under Kurita had terrible aim; Taffy 3 did exactly what destroyers are designed to do...get inside the range of the guns of the bigger ships, then move so fast that when they do take a shot you're nearly impossible to hit.
I really enjoyed that, thanks Lance and Heidi. I noticed that you skipped over the message from Nimitz that mistakenly ended in 'The world wonders.' Not necessary for your story I guess. Have you considered covering the collisions between HMAS Melbourne and HMAS Voyager and then USS Evans?
Thanks, I just recently read a book about this called"The Last of The Tin Can Sailors"
Best book I ever read
Fantastic book! I've read it several times... it's one of my favorites in my collection.
I've read several books on it. That was a good one. Another good one is, "The Afternoon of the Rising Sun" by Kenneth Friedman. My uncle was on the USS Heermann and he personally gave my that book.
A fantastic book! One of my favorites!
Loved this book
History Guy...there are certain famous quotes memorialized in battle. Could you tell us the actions happening surrounding them? Your story makes one comes to mind of an incident at Solomon Islands (?) where an American Naval commander said in effect: "Step aside boys - I'm coming through." Thanks!!