Best Travel Cards For Australians (Top 11 Debit Cards Compared) + Sign Up Bonus
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 มิ.ย. 2024
- Enjoyed this video? Get a cash welcome bonus on the best travel cards in Australia with our referral link!
🇦🇺 Up Referral: Get $15 via our link free 👉 bit.ly/up-debit-card
🇦🇺 Ubank Referral: Get $10 after making 5 transactions free with code 👉 C7N1TAZ www.ubank.com.au/refer-a-friend
🇦🇺 Revolut Referral: Get $15 when you sign up via our link and make 1 transaction 👉flighthacks.com.au/recommends...
✅ Check out our expert guide on the best travel debit cards for Australians here: flighthacks.com.au/travel-deb...
▬ Contents of this video ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
0:00 - Intro
0:20 - Testing 11 Australian Travel Cards (debit)
0:59 - Using Overseas ATM Machines
1:02 - Debit Card Test Rules
1:35 - Best Cards For Taking Cash Out
1:55 - In-Person Payment Test
2:37 - Things You Should Know About Travel Debit Cards
3:06 - Should You Convert Money To Foreign Currency?
4:00 - Real World ATM Test - Best Travel Card
8:07 - Updated Result For Best Travel Card
8:20 - Worst Travel Cards
8:58 - Kit Kat Test - In-Person Transaction Best Travel Cards
10:16 - Australia Post Travel Card
11:43 - Travel Money Traps To Watch Out For
13:22 - Welcome Bonus Free Cash Offers On Travel Cards
14:45 - Wrapping Up Best Travel Debit Cards For Australians
▬ Best Travel Debit Cards For Australians 2024 Edition ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
No matter where you’re off to or how long your adventure lasts, a top-notch travel debit card can be your ultimate money-saving companion when you’re exploring the world. Forget about those pricey airport currency exchange booths and your run-of-the-mill bank, because they’ll likely rip you off with exorbitant fees.
They may claim “0% commission” or “zero fees,” but hidden charges and poor exchange rates can quickly add up. But fear not! With a little savvy research and planning, you can unlock substantial savings by wielding the right card as your travel weapon of choice! Get ready to embark on your journey with confidence and excitement, armed with a travel debit card that’s got your back!
In this video, we’re reviewing the best and worst travel cards in Australia using MasterCard exchange rates and Visa Exchange rates.
We will cover the following Australian debit cards:
1) Up
2) Ubank
3) Macquarie Platinum
4) Wise
5) Revolut
6) ING Orange Everyday
7) Westpac Worldwide Wallet
8) CashPassport Platinum
9) TravelEx Money Card
10) Qantas Money
11) Commbank Travel Money Card
▬ Social Channels ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
✅ Connect with us on Instagram! / flighthacks
✅ Follow us on Facebook: / flighthacks.au
📣 Join our free Discord chat group with 1000+ members: / discord
#travelcard #besttravelcardaustralia #traveldebit card
Let me know which travel debit card you're using? I feel like we definitely missed some so maybe I'll do a follow up video to test even more cards! Some key travel cards I though of after making the video are HSBC Global Wallet and the Suncorp debit card.
Ps. after checking my account, I noticed Revolut charges 1% "weekend surcharge", since we conducted the ATM test on a Sunday. So with that in mind, if you use Revolut during the week, the fees will be 1% lower!
Hey mate - with more and more places taking card I've been using the CommBank Ultimate rewards. 3 points per 1AUD. The exchange rate doesn't seem too bad. MasterCard carded... and no international fees. I wish there was a decent similar card cos I want another sign up bonus as the domestic earn rate is sh1t
Yep for international spending the Commbank credit cards are pretty good. Just domestically they are the worst. Not my FX free credit cards have good bonuses but sometimes Bankwest offers a good deal on their World MasterCard
thanks... what is UP invite Code?
@@minhhong3907 you get the $9 bonus via this link: hook.up.me/flighthacks
Great video. super informative.
Great video mate. 🍻
Thank you :D
Excellent video, well done!
Thank you :)
Great video 💪
Great video. I'm heading to Japan In October and do all my banking with ubank and up so this really put my mind at ease. Thanks.
super helpful, very cool
thank you! :)
Thank you Immanuel - that's the best comparison for travel cards I've seen - because you've given us actual results.
Thank you for the kind comment! It means a lot :)
Thx for information
Excellent content. Anyone who is planning to travel should watch this!
Enjoyable execution too with your no BS style.
Thank you, I really appreciate it :)
I have always used the up card - never had any issues and the app is user friendly! The chat function is helpful overseas so no need to sit on the phone 👍🏼
Same here, been with Up since Xinja closed down and no complaints!
What a legend. I salute you man for this service.
Thank you from the bottom of my heart. My wife and I are Up-siders. We knew Up is a great bank but didn't realise how good the account is for travel to Japan. That is what we'll use, and the icing on the cake in our case is that there's nothing to do.
With Qantas Travel Card - make sure you order it weeks in advance. Everyone in my travel group ordered one and had to wait a month for it to arrive. We ended up ordering Wise as a back up and that arrive in a few business days. Just something to consider when applying for a travel card!
Not to mention AVOID Qantas Travel Money card, it's one of the worst performers in our test :D
Amazing information and super clear thank you. I'm off to Japan in 13 days and this has made everything so easy I already have up and ing so I'm all set.
Thank you! Sounds like you’re good to go 😁 enjoy Japan
Thanks 💛
Just wondering, which one did you decide to use mainly whilst travelling?
Macquarie throughout Europe. Citibank in Japan. ING in South America
If you use your own debit or credit card, always choose to pay in local currency (country you are in) as you save money on not being charged an bad exchange rate if you were to pay in AUD.
10000%
How do I choose to pay in Local currency? Does the atm ask you? Or does you bank do that?
Thank you for the video. I want to know is that do I need to notify to Up bank before travelling. Thanks
Yes, always notify your bank of the dates you’ll be travelling overseas and using your debit or credit card or they may cancel the card.
@@micht8465 Thank you
Loved collecting debit cards from Aussie banks. Got UP , Wise, revolut, Ubank in hands. Didn't know it would come in handy when travelling to overseas. Ditch my conventional debit card which charged a fees to access my own money. Loving it❤❤🎉🎉
So good! Especially since they are all free, no harm in trying out to see which one you prefer :)
Great tips! I found out the hard way that the Travelex card is not the way to go. Earlier in the year I used it for our family trip to NZ. The app was a disgrace to be honest with a 48-72 hour delay in displaying the accurate account balance. Looking forward to trying some of these in the future!
Yep I knew from the start TravelEx would be a joke but wennt through the motions of obtaining a card for the video lol. Costly and painful is an accurate description of their product haha!
I try using a credit card while travelling. The last time I used my ING debit card, ended up paying about 3% in international transaction fee. Will apply for a UP card soon, thanks for the detailed video!
Same here, I used credit where possible as there's no good reason to use your own money first + I like earning points! But debit cards are super helpful for taking some money out, certain countries it's hard not to have cash on hand (unfortunately)
When I’m travelling I usually have the CBA Travel Money Card and my American Express Business Platinum Card. Depending on where I am and what I’m buying I switch between the two. The travel money card has low fees for money withdrawal and no fees for transactions when you load local currencies or even when you have AUD loaded. Business card is useful as the fees are actually quite reasonable at 3% and I’ve found the reference exchange rate used on the platinum Amex to be very competitive. Just depends whether earning points is important for you or keeping overall costs down. The Virgin Velocity American Express Platinum card is also great for points earn with similar fee structure. I recommend having a credit card for points earning and insurances when spending on bigger ticket items such as accomodation, luxury items etc but using the travel money card for day-to-day expenses. Last few trips I have kept very minimal cash on hand which has been great and very convenient.
I'd avoid the CBA travel money card if possible, it was one of the worst ones we tested...
Yes but the loading rate sucks worse rate
1. Cut the middle man and ask people in your network if they have any leftover currency and buy/sell at market rate.
2. Load your cards onto apple pay in the event a physical card is misplaced.
3. Make sure your card does not require a OTP (on your Australian mobile) when making online purchases (booking train tickets etc) while overseas.
Good tips! I also note down the card numbers in my Last Pass app, super handy.
This is the #1 challenge with competitive rate cards in Australia, they all require OTP to mobile. Do you know if UP or ubank require OTP for online purchases?
What is OTP, please?
simply look it up @@sunnisun398
I have up, wise and ubank. Wise is my favourite. I really dislike the up app but I love the branding.
Fair point! Do you don’t the Wise withdrawal limit an issue?
Thank you so much! Just the kind of video I was looking for. I have only just figured out that the exchange rate varies depending on the card. I have the SpendMe card from MeBank which seems to have no fees added on anything international so this makes me suspicious the exchange rate is bad though I can't find the rates anywhere. Do you know where to find the exchange rates for individual banks currency conversions?
Thanks for the kind words! To answer your question, we have to first understand international payment networks. The 2 big ones Australian banks use mostly are Visa and Mastercard. In order to take money out overseas or spend on your card we have to use these networks (ps there are others but Visa and MC are the main ones). Obviously, there's a price to pay but this is unavoidable. So here's where things get interesting, some banks (like many we highlight in this video) don't add any markup to the Visa/Mastercard spot rate, this is what we want. Other banks add their own markup on top which is what you will see in the fees list and this is also something we demonstrate in the video. Since MeBank doesn't add any fees, you're getting the Visa spot rate which is the network they use to facilitate transactions. In terms of Visa vs Mastercard, they both compete on rates so the difference is marginal and probably not worth fussing over. At the moment we notice that Mastercard has the superior rate. Hope that helps
Great video! Can't believe there was a 7% difference between the cards! I'd recommend ANZ travel rewards card, has no currency exchange fees & the emergency helpline team answer the phone quickly & the very best part, you speak to a person, who knows the policy & can provide guidance. Lifesaver when you have 9% phone battery & are somewhere remote.
Yes it's crazy to think people are happy to give away 7% of their hard earned money to a bank for convenience sake! I used to have an ANZ Adventurers card as well, just wish they had a better points earn rate but apart from that, great for international use.
Just looked for this but it is no longer available @@FlightHacks
I have used the Qantas Card, Commbank Card and Wise Card - I found wise the easiest app to us and they offered good exchange rates for AUD. Thanks for this video, I’ll be considering Macquarie Platinum 🙌
Yes Qantas and Commbank are some of the worst offenders when it comes to exchange rates. Best to stick with Macquarie, Up, Ubank, Revolut etc
With the ING ATM fee rebate now ending but they still do $0 international transaction costs if you meet the criteria. Which cost is rebated the $5 fee or the $1.25 fee? Or is it none at all! Thank you for the video too!
ING is my go to 👏🏼
ING will stop offering rebates from August 1st :'(
Great video, what do you think of the Charles Schwab debit card for use in South East Asia?
1. Use an UP Bank card when overseas (they've just partnered with Wise and use the Visa exchange rate)!
2. When paying with your UP card be sure to select the destinations currency to avoid getting stiffed by the ATM or Eftpos exchange rates!
The Up/Wise tie up is ok for sending money overseas but Up uses Mastercard spot rates which are slightly more competitive (see video). And point 2) yes, absolutely!
They been with wise for ages. Its just a api. Just do it in wise app lol
Bankwest Platinum Debit MasterCard I use and no issues thus far, hopefully lines up well. Thank you for doing this video very useful! 😅
Ah yes another one I forgot to order! I think it should be pretty similar to Up since it's also using the MasterCard spot rate.
hi. Bravo!splendid masterpiece~ =))
haha thank you :D
Perth Oz represent 🤜🤛🇦🇺
🤝
Im confused. Is the up card considered a "travel debit card"?
Am I better off just using a generic bank card for overseas transactions like NAB or HSBC?
Amazing video! I have an ING Orange everyday for the great saving rate. Been contemplating if I should get a Wise card for my overseas travel. After watching your video, I am happy to just use the ING card, thanks heaps
just make sure you meet the new requirements to get the fees waived on ING, personally i'm sticking to Up mostly and Ubank as my backup. Also have Revolut and I use wise for when I need to wire money overseas
Great video and also looking at your article one question… which is of the best cards in terms of safety if you have to contact them and your card has been lost or stolen and you need to put a hold on it etc also which is easier to move money from one account at home in Australia to your card? Thank you in advance🙏
All the top cards (Up, Ubank, Macquarie, Wise etc) have OSKO which means that transfers between banks is done instantly. As for safety, most of it can be done via their apps which I find helpful. For example Up let's you block your card instantly and you can chat to a person via the app. Up offers chat support while the other have a number you can call. I find that if such a situation occurs it's much faster to block your card online and a request a new one.
Thank you for doing a real world test with a wide range of cards available 👏 didn’t realise I already have one of the best travel cards with my UP one, will definitely be using this for my Euro travels! My biggest tip is the currency conversion when buying in store DO NOT do what I did and convert it back to AUD to pay. I lost so much money! And in this economy a little goes a long way.
Ha yes, in store eftpos conversion are a big scam! Up will do it all for you at the best rate :)
@@FlightHacks so we should not convert to AUD instead of that we should pay in local currency, is it what you saying?
Unless you like being ripped off, always pay in local currency.
Just got back from month in Europe, my hot tips from pre holiday research and lesson: 1 Commbank Ultimate card, no intl transaction fee + 1 qff per $ spent + free travel insurance + more. 2 GE 28 degrees platinum card as back up, no international transaction + no annual fee + excellent ex rate. 3 Citibank debit card for atm withdrawals, no atm fee + great ex rate. 4 If you need a sim card I got Vodafone prepaid when I landed, it's 20€ last 28 days + 150gb data + free roaming around most of EU. 5 enjoy everyday!
Great tips! Citi bank used to be great but they are closing down their Plus account soon since they've been bought by NAB. Vodafone for 20 euro is great! Much better than all the eSIMs out there espeically with 150gb!
AMAZING! Thank you! I have spent the past month researching trying to decipher from US and UK websites which is the best travel card without any annual/monthly fees because how many people use them all year round anyway?? Then I learned there is debit, credit and prepaid...baaaaaahh! Then there are 3 different fees: ATM, currency conversion fees, international transaction fees. Then there is customer service because just in case, it gets stolen or stuck etc. Anyway, I should have watched your video a month ago to save myself to coming to the same conclusion as you but you did it much better than I did and it's more thorough! I use the MacQuarie Platinum because I already had it with their amazingly high internet savings accounts. So I knew they were good and I had good experience with their customer service. I heard mixed reviews with UP and Ubank where people were randomly locked out of their accounts but for occasional use, they are reported to be good by my friends. If I did not already have Macquarie, I may have gone with Up. I have a Bankwest Platinum Zero Credit Card to use in areas where I need extra security against theft. They have no fees either but do charge 2% cash advance fees so I only use for card payments. Both excellent customer service and I have no problems with either. Their security against identity theft has been impressive so far. :D
So I’m going to Thailand in December I have the up card but I don’t see any conversion option on the app? Or does it do it automatically when I withdraw from an atm or use it in a store to pay in Thailand?
It converts it for you at the moment of the transaction. That's what you want. If you convert beforehand you're basically gambling/predicting the future of currency movement
If using a travel credit card with a small limit you probably might not be wanting or able to monitor and top it up as you normally would back home. Prior to going. Transfer and overload it with enough money to cover your holiday expenses to save needing to top it up. And don’t forget, always choose to pay in local currency
The local currency scam always gets people! From my calculations it's a markup of 5-7% yikes!
Could you please explain what a local currency scam is 😢
@@shelleywallis4569 if you select your home currency when you’re abroad. As you state, always select the currency form the country you’re in and let your card do the conversion for the best rate. If you do select your home currency you’re usually paying 5-7% extra.
@@FlightHacks so sorry not quite following you
My most useful travel hack after traveling this summer is putting an Apple AirTag in your suitcases! 🙌🏻🙌🏻
AMEN!
nice I just ordered the up bank card, thanks bro
I have Macqurie Debit Card. I love it.
I don't understand the transaction fee on the kit kat purchase for UBank - on their website it says no international transaction fees? Fantastic research - thank you.
Hey thanks! The reason for the difference in rate is because Ubank uses the Visa spot rate, this or Mastercard spot rate is the best we can access as consumers and it's not something Ubank makes money on but rather the providers of the network those being Visa/Mastercard (these 2 are the biggest). Hope that kinda makes sense :D
Favourite card to use is revolut, pretty easy to use and transfer money. Best part of the card is the referral bonus.
P.s, wouldnt mind the suitcase:)
Big revolut fan as well, especially cause you can top it up with credit card!
with my westpac travel card i get the business fx rates so its bit cheaper then wise
Cant do online transactions with Eurail pass as wants a authentication code to my old number but Bank Sa don't have a solution
Traveled South Korea , Singapore, Philippines last 5 weeks and been using Latitudes 28 Global. No problems and best exchange rates with purchases. Can also save with local delivery to Perth 😂🙃
Solid card but not earning points on a credit card is a dealbreaker for me
Nothing special it just uses master rate
Hi Immanuel, thanks for the informative video. Just wondering if UP bank requires OTP for online purchases abroad? this is always a deal breaker, and is why CBA has the upper hand on all banks with their highly reliable and convenient in-app OTP codes for when you're abroad. Cheers!
I've never received an OTP from Up bank so I can't comment on that aspect. While is use Commbank for business banking etc I don't even have my debit card activated and wouldn't dream of using it overseas, you'd be much better of paying 3% on Amex and at least still earn reward points :D
@@FlightHacks All good, found a solution. Superloop esim with free incoming texts on roaming. Just signed up for UP and will be using my Digital card soon! Thankyou for the reply.
I’m travelling to Türkiye next week for the first time. I got a commbank travel money card but after watching your video, I realised that it’s not the best option. If you’ve ever been to Turkiye, which card do you recommend I should go with? Thank you in advance 😊
Hey Joudy, I was actually just in Istanbul a couple of weeks ago, one of my favourite cities! Since Turkish Lyra is so unstable, you'd be mad to use a Commbank Travel card lol. Honestly, you can't go wrong with Up bank, it's free and of course no fees. Since you're going next week, you will have to hurry up though. Just get all the free ones and see which arrives first. Good luck and enjoy Türkiye!
I have always used Citi debit card while travelling as they don’t have any charges for ATM withdrawals across the world. The conversion rates might not be the best but saves you the worry of exchanging and returning currency while travelling a new country!!
Would love to see more content from Immanuel on best cards for UAE :)
Citi is/was great! From what I know the debit card will be discontinued at some stage since they are now owned by NAB in Australia.
@@FlightHacks
Do they retain the overseas benefits as before? Or has NAB reduced some of the benefits?
@@bornfree8487 I believe it will remain the same for existing customers but we should know more late May.
@@FlightHacks
Thank you. Keep well
@@FlightHacks have you heard any update on the above?
Great video! I found your review of the best travel debit cards in Australia extremely helpful. It's refreshing to see an honest assessment of the hidden charges and poor exchange rates that some cards come with. Your expert guide is a must-read for anyone planning their next adventure. I especially appreciated the real-world ATM test and the updated results for the best travel card. Keep up the great work, and I look forward to more informative content from your channel.
Thanks for the kind comment!! Really appreciate it ☺️
Speaking of travel hacks, here's a lesser-known one that can save you big bucks on flights: consider booking multi-city flights instead of round-trip tickets. Often, it can be cheaper to book a flight that stops in multiple cities along the way to your final destination, rather than flying directly there and back. Not only can this save you money, but it also gives you the opportunity to explore multiple destinations on the same trip! It's a win-win situation. So, don't forget to add this nifty trick to your travel hacking arsenal. Happy travels, everyone!
The more flights the better :)
I am trying to get a Ubank debit card - it says on line that you can't get them anymore? new customers that is
Do you mean Citi bank? Ubank is most definitely available. You can only apply once you download their app. Don’t forget to enter our code to get a bonus $20 after your first 3 transactions 😁
Use code: C7N1TAZ
I’m in Europe now and using 2 debit cards that both have no fees attached. They are Wise which has a fairly good exchange rate and HSBC global with a slightly lower rate. They are both very easy to use by moving money and checking exchange rates. My preference is Wise however there has been the occasional time where my wise card wasn’t accepted. Therefore my tip would be to have at least 2 cards just in case there is an issue with one & to compare exchange rates.
2 debit cards is essential! Good tip :D it's also a life saver when an ATM eats yourr card!
I use the latitude aswell. I live in poland
Test Hsbc global?
Best card travel hack is the - Qantas American Express ultimate card! 70.000 point sign up and 450$ per year travel budget
Using it overseas is expensive though at 3% (like most credit cards). But potentially worth it when you factor in the points :D
Can’t believe you went all the way to Japan and didn’t get a matcha kitkat
I don’t like matcha 🥹
What about Great Southern Bank?
"or not...." 😂
Travel cheques are my secret hack
travel cheques are still a thing?! Tell me more :D
Not sure where my comment went as i cant find it anymore?
Best tip (learnt the hard way) when using your card via ATM or at a store overseas is to convert to local currency rather than pay using home currency. But make sure your card has no currency conversion fees or foreign transaction fees. I used the Up card on my most recent trip and got pretty decent conversion rates with no additional fees!
Agreed :D
How do I convert to local currency?
Wise is the best
It’s very good but definitely not the best. Too many limitations and fees
Are you going fishing mate😉
Now ING direct debit stops international atm rebate 😢
Why does every avid traveler need reliable international debit/credit options? Because having those tools protect you from being taken advantage of. The fees layered onto cash withdrawals and forgiven exchange are crushing. Save yourself the future hassle and find a card that works within your budget and with your comfortability level.
Exactly, it's absolutely free to get the best cards in Australia so why not use them right!? Blows my mind that people would go out of their way to pay for an inferior product such as TravelEx or worse, convert their money in one of those airport kiosks.
Hope you also review me bank
Best tip I can think of as a broke student who blows all his money on a yearly Europe trip: make enough money to even be eligible for these cards first (still a work in progress)
Hey Jack, you don't need to have any money to get one of these cards, debit cards are free! Some of the ones in this video even GIVE you money for signing up, which is wild IMO.
How about ANZ bank derict debate
stay clear! ANZ will charge you 3% for overseas transactions. Yikes
8:20 - No wonder. How do you expect CBA to make ~$5 billion half yearly profit without screwing over struggling customers. As long as the CEOs are getting multi-million dollar bonuses, she's all good.
What happened with the atm part. It's like something is missing. Did you include overseas ATM fees. Not the Australian ATM fees, the overseas ATM fees. This can be by far the largest expense. $30 per transactions in some countries. ING refunds ALL fees with a couple of simple conditions. Just set up an auto deposit. You missed the boat with this one. I have had refunds of over $150 per month on ATM fees with ING on some trips. It's far and away the best.
Yep, for simplicity the final amount I show included all fees (including ATM fees)
@@FlightHacks including the overseas ATM fees?
Correct. Most of the cards tested don’t have ATM fees but obviously ATM providers themselves will almost always charge a fee. For the ones I used in Japan the fee charged by the ATM owner came to $1.25. As stated all these fees are included in the total to make it a straightforward comparison.
@@FlightHacks Thanks for the great reply, I have been using the ING card for 3 years, it's been great, they have refunded over $2000 in overseas ATM operator fees in that time. Thanks for the video.
@@bikepacker9850 yes it's a good product but from August I would avoid it. Since they charge you $5 for each ATM withdrawal overseas.
as of now in my Westpac worldwide wallet i am getting 10000 yen at 112.17aud
I use DM Charge card whenever I travel. Daddy’s Money. So what! Your daddy has the same 24hrs as mine. Tell that MF to work harder! Travel smart. #daddysmoney
So much microdetail and micromanaging for such a minuscule difference. My tip would be to have someone like you organise the trip and finances so that the other party could relax and enjoy the break. I would love to win the suitcase.
My wife and I just spent 8 weeks overseas in multiple countries and used Ubank for all our spending. I couldn’t fault Ubank, so simple and easy to use, great app and instant transfers. I found I was getting better rates with this card than my currency converter app!
Yep, Ubank is our runner up on the tests we did. No fuss and works as advertised... oh and it's free!! I'm a fan.
Up for the Win at home and overseas! With the occasional free coffee and low fees as well as spend tracking you can’t go wrong 👏🏼
Agreed, I use Up for my everyday banking as well now
My best money related travel tip: Use a pair of shorts with extra deep pockets as your "travel wallet" and keep all of your important documents and wallet safe inside. And we all know how much Immanuel loves his travel shorts! #sexylegs
hahahahaha gold!
Let’s be honest… the best travel money hack is spending someone else’s money! 🥳
The last few trips for me have been funded by an extremely generous Nigerian Prince who reached out to me offering to share his fortune with me! #blessed
hahahaha! I'm glad to know there are legitimate Nigerian princes out there :P
😂😂😂
Ho hum. Zzzzz.