Vertical phoenixes vs horizontal: Vertical positioning staggers the phoenix shots, lowering the chance that they will shoot at the same thing at the exact same time, reducing overkill. If the first phoenix shot would kill, the second won't get the chance to waste a shot. Can see it a lot with lvl 2 phoenix vs lvl 1 vertical sledges.
I did deploy vertical but before it was mostly a "feelings" kinda thing. "I feel like vertical is better here". Iirc only thing i knew for sure was to better survive stormcallers. Or i was copying better players positioning without actually thinking about context. I just put something vertically on map cuz i saw video, stream or was spectating high mmr player position in that way. I hope with this video i start to actually think when and if i should put vertically.
I love this sort of guide. It's knowledge that you really only get from hours of experience, but can be packaged and handed on. "Shoulders of giants," as they say.
I use a lot of sledge and discovered that vertical is almost always better for sledge. They tend to do slightly better at chaff duty and scorpions almost never kill the full pack in one shot. The one exception is when you are facing a crawler pack into immediate shooting distance (on the line). Then matching the crawler positioning gives better results. One more thing worth mentioning is due to the delayed effect of stormcaller missiles vertical packs tend to take more casualties, especially when fire is involved.
@@antares3030 How. It literally only works if used skilfully. You face shit the way you want it to go, you still spend 100 and you still need to get it right, how is that an exploit? That’s like calling rocket jumping in DOOM an exploit, was it intentional? No. Does it add to the game by existing? Yes. There’s zero point in removing something like that.
I think there’s a certain point where positioning units in the same orientation also gives diminishing returns. Like, individual purpose of having a squad horizontal or vertical is most important, but sometimes I feel like my army has problems if it happens to be mostly vertical or horizontal. Problems like bunching up or massively overkilling enemies. Idk, just sometimes I feel like placing units with a different orientation as the majority of your army leads to the best outcomes.
Is that beacon manipulation thing a bug? I wonder if devs want to change it eventually or if it is a feature/mechanic they are happy with. Seems weird that u can use beacon kinda multiple times in a turn if needed/wanted. Pretty strong if u can manipulate 2 flanks AND actually use the beacon for push for example.
was discovered 9 months ago (th-cam.com/video/kwfH3jdJQfs/w-d-xo.html) and hasn't been patched so either its very hard to get rid of or they dont care it is in the game
@@SurreyEZ can't be that hard to fix, the unit should revert to the default front-facing position after canceling the beacon. It's free MMR for people who know about the trick, guess they don't care.
@@Gaze73 Depends on how its coded. Units may only reset between rounds or when first purchased. IF it resets to the original facing after every round then you would need to use the beacon trick each round resulting in its usage being skill related and not necessarily an exploit. The devs may leave it in since it is available to everyone and doesn't require any obscure tricks to pull off.
Thanks for the explanations, your tutorials are great! Do you think it's a mistake to recruit different units that essentially do the same job? Example 1: arclights, stormcallers and fire badgers (AOE units) against chaff Example 2: marksmans, phoenixes and steelballs (single unit dmg) against tanky units
most of the time yes. Some units have different shelf life though. Like for example sabertooth is great early while something like phoenix is very strong later also. So having overlap for a couple of turns and then selling some units is pretty normal. Also the roles are not that clear, like having steel balls and phoenixes in the same comp means that the phoenix will counter enemy wraith and the balls will kill his tower and prevent him from building giants. You need to understand the game a lot to know exactly when you can go different unit types for the same role
Great video! I am thinking it could be useful to talk about formations, what units work well together, and what are some of the effective ways to set them up. I am now experimenting with steel ball, crawler builds, and success varies greatly on how you set them up, using the exact same units.
It's not been known to me. Nothing in the game explains it or even hints at this behaviour. Until there's an explanation added to the tooltip, I consider this an exploit and not a feature.
@@Mamelarde Unfortunately, the devs are aware of it and have chosen not to remove it. So right now it is currently an undocumented feature. The best thing we can do is spread the word about it so that it's not an unfair advantage to only the people who know about it.
Comment what I missed in this tutorial!
- I'll start: slow units positioned vertically are very vulnerable to storm callers
Vertical phoenixes vs horizontal: Vertical positioning staggers the phoenix shots, lowering the chance that they will shoot at the same thing at the exact same time, reducing overkill. If the first phoenix shot would kill, the second won't get the chance to waste a shot. Can see it a lot with lvl 2 phoenix vs lvl 1 vertical sledges.
@@dai8217
Always wondered if I should deploy my Wraith vertical or horizontal. It finally has been answered. Beep boop.
The vertical wraith is better against horizontal melter
Wtf 😂@@SurreyEZ
Exactly what i needed. I never deploy vertical because i just dont know why i should.
This will help.
I did deploy vertical but before it was mostly a "feelings" kinda thing. "I feel like vertical is better here". Iirc only thing i knew for sure was to better survive stormcallers. Or i was copying better players positioning without actually thinking about context. I just put something vertically on map cuz i saw video, stream or was spectating high mmr player position in that way. I hope with this video i start to actually think when and if i should put vertically.
I love this sort of guide. It's knowledge that you really only get from hours of experience, but can be packaged and handed on. "Shoulders of giants," as they say.
On the shoulders of a giant rat.
I use a lot of sledge and discovered that vertical is almost always better for sledge. They tend to do slightly better at chaff duty and scorpions almost never kill the full pack in one shot. The one exception is when you are facing a crawler pack into immediate shooting distance (on the line). Then matching the crawler positioning gives better results.
One more thing worth mentioning is due to the delayed effect of stormcaller missiles vertical packs tend to take more casualties, especially when fire is involved.
That bit with the beacon was really cool
I didnt know that either
Genius Rat has mastered the art of unit placement, very inspirational 👍👍👍👍👍
Keep up the good videos man
The beacon trick was so cool! Thanks for sharing, I was always confused on which to use lol
When mechabellum accidentaly uses naopleonic line infantry tactics
Thank RAT for your guides. Got me to 1.8k mmr. I even got offered game against you, but I chickened out :D
for the glory !
Holy fuck bro the mobile beacon trick is so gooood!
Looks like an exploit, how can it work like that?
@@Gaze73 I agree it looks like a bug
Thank you! These are the best videos!
Lots of valuable infos here, thank you!
OK, brauche ich dir also keinen Link mehr schicken! 😉
@@HolgFromHell Jop, ich guck hier eh regelmäßig. 😄
really great video! Would love to see more guides 👍
will do more, have you seen the other ones i have?
Oh okay! I've had some understanding if this but now it all make sense
(also beacon tech should be patched out imo, looks like an exploit)
Why? Seems purely skill based.
@@yeeticus6519 the one that changes the direction of your troops w/o actually using the beacon? def an exploit
@@antares3030 How. It literally only works if used skilfully. You face shit the way you want it to go, you still spend 100 and you still need to get it right, how is that an exploit? That’s like calling rocket jumping in DOOM an exploit, was it intentional? No. Does it add to the game by existing? Yes. There’s zero point in removing something like that.
@@yeeticus6519 there's no skill in exploiting bugs I'm sorry
@@antares3030 At this point you’re just wilfully ignorant of anything I actually say, so I’m done.
I think there’s a certain point where positioning units in the same orientation also gives diminishing returns. Like, individual purpose of having a squad horizontal or vertical is most important, but sometimes I feel like my army has problems if it happens to be mostly vertical or horizontal. Problems like bunching up or massively overkilling enemies.
Idk, just sometimes I feel like placing units with a different orientation as the majority of your army leads to the best outcomes.
Is that beacon manipulation thing a bug? I wonder if devs want to change it eventually or if it is a feature/mechanic they are happy with. Seems weird that u can use beacon kinda multiple times in a turn if needed/wanted. Pretty strong if u can manipulate 2 flanks AND actually use the beacon for push for example.
They are definitely aware of it and have not fixed it. Previously you could do it to the enemy's units and they fixed that
was discovered 9 months ago (th-cam.com/video/kwfH3jdJQfs/w-d-xo.html) and hasn't been patched so either its very hard to get rid of or they dont care it is in the game
@@SurreyEZ can't be that hard to fix, the unit should revert to the default front-facing position after canceling the beacon. It's free MMR for people who know about the trick, guess they don't care.
@@Gaze73 Depends on how its coded. Units may only reset between rounds or when first purchased. IF it resets to the original facing after every round then you would need to use the beacon trick each round resulting in its usage being skill related and not necessarily an exploit. The devs may leave it in since it is available to everyone and doesn't require any obscure tricks to pull off.
It has been a while I wonder how it works ! Thank you !
I really liked this, thank you!
Thank you for the Video Surrey!
Ha. And I thought it was the other way around. Thank you a lot!
Thanks for the explanations, your tutorials are great!
Do you think it's a mistake to recruit different units that essentially do the same job?
Example 1: arclights, stormcallers and fire badgers (AOE units) against chaff
Example 2: marksmans, phoenixes and steelballs (single unit dmg) against tanky units
most of the time yes. Some units have different shelf life though. Like for example sabertooth is great early while something like phoenix is very strong later also. So having overlap for a couple of turns and then selling some units is pretty normal. Also the roles are not that clear, like having steel balls and phoenixes in the same comp means that the phoenix will counter enemy wraith and the balls will kill his tower and prevent him from building giants. You need to understand the game a lot to know exactly when you can go different unit types for the same role
@@SurreyEZ damn bro sensei great explanation
Good stuff Rat, tyvm
Thanks! Very useful 👍
Great video! I am thinking it could be useful to talk about formations, what units work well together, and what are some of the effective ways to set them up. I am now experimenting with steel ball, crawler builds, and success varies greatly on how you set them up, using the exact same units.
thanks for the idea!
Thanks for the content!
That beacon trick has to be an oversight. Have the devs ever mentioned it?
no, we discovered it 9 months ago: th-cam.com/video/kwfH3jdJQfs/w-d-xo.html
I thought shields always block one instance of damage? So how homes the scorpion hit takes the shield down straight away?
They do block the one instance of damage, the scorpion shot, and are depleted afterwards
i feel like this tip gave me 300 mmr ez
1:46 this is an exploit, please do not do this
Lol.
Says who? Got a link to devs saying it's not being used as intended? It's been known for 9+ months now.
It's not been known to me. Nothing in the game explains it or even hints at this behaviour. Until there's an explanation added to the tooltip, I consider this an exploit and not a feature.
@@Mamelarde Unfortunately, the devs are aware of it and have chosen not to remove it. So right now it is currently an undocumented feature. The best thing we can do is spread the word about it so that it's not an unfair advantage to only the people who know about it.