Bro… we had every opportunity to save the Speaker and we didn’t. We have an agenda too. The last boss of the next story arc, (the one we face in 2045 irl) is going to be the guardians
The Witness was not losing and he knew it that's why he was with the Traveler the whole time. He knew one way or another he was going to link the Veil to the Traveler. He sent Calus on a suicide mission to the Veil knowing if he was killed it'd be by us Guardians and then possess our ghosts to create the link. If Calus succeeded then he would use the Radial Mist. That's why he didn't kill Calus off, he needed him there knowing we would be there too. 200 IQ play, kudos
Witness' speech while it's carving out the portal might be a red herring, as in it's not addressing the Traveler, but the being beyond the portal that it's going to free.
I was under the impression the Witness was speaking to the Pyramids, since after "be free" the Pyramids kindof escaped thru the triangle portal. It doesn't make sense to me that the Traveler is the one who can now be free, because it is still there and didn't change.
Well the witness isn’t talking to the tracker but what’s inside locked away, the girl is the key the trailer is the jail for… nezarac the true king of darkness
When the witness stated that it knows pain, it got me thinking as to what its motivations are. The witness seems to hate watching things suffer as it said in light there is pain and suffering which it has witnessed countless times as the traveller gardens a new civilisation which it abandones. This could explain all the faces in the smoke being the souls of the past world's the witness witnessed.
This campaign was probably the most disappointing Destiny expansion EVER. Bungie failed narratively here. This should have been an Infinity War. But instead we got pretty much nothing. This is the first expansion where I wish I kept my money. I expected big things, and it should have given big things. What we got was honestly pathetic. How on earth did Destiny go from being pretty good narratively in recent years to this? A failure at the worst possible time. This was the big one to draw people to Destiny. And they failed hard. At least the gameplay was good.
important note: the beam from the Veil didnt hit the traveller; it hit the witness that was standing in front of it, probably empowering him to carve that portal in the traveller. You can see the beam stops some distance away from the traveller, leaving only a dot of light exactly where the witness would be if we could see him from so far away. So its not that the veil weakaned the traveller, its that it allowed the witness to open the portal using the traveller (also explains why the witness didnt destroy the traveller... he needs it to open the passage. Even with the warsats, he may have aimed to cripple the traveller more than annihilate it, the very same action rasputin did consider to force the traveller to stay) Still doesnt tell us WHAT the veil is and what it exactly does... but hey, its clues.
Possible and i have a theory the travellers have the light mean i was thinking tgat the travellers is jas the big bang like creation and i think the witness wanted is the big bang or something like he want to create a world on his own image that tge traveller is a shell that he want to crack so tgat my theory and it just a theory
Interesting. Savathun wanted to lock the traveler away to protect it, just like the Veil was protected and locked away...coincidence? I think not. She knew where the veil was.
100% and she tried to lock the traveler away behind many different layers aswell to keep it away from the witness. this is why i think season of the deep is going to be us REVIVING savathun, as we know eris has her body and all we need do is reveal it in the open for immaru to revive her
I was also very much opposed to preventing Savvy from locking the traveler away. It just seemed like I was forced to follow orders and prevent her from locking it away, when I wanted to know more about why and not force her to stop. More and more, it seems like the decision to prevent her locking it away, could have been a bad one.
@noface Some coward to confront their own end. May have taken many aeons, but now it has leaned forward. So perhaps it could be the phrase, and on the other hand may have been more literal. Maybe even both. Concepts can have several manifestations, we will have to see how it plays out.
One thing I'm surprised nobody's mentioned yet is that both the veil and especially the portal look veeeeeeery similar to the strange moving "windows" inside Savathun's Throne World buildings
@@jasonrussell5265Destiny is dead anyways after Final Shape. One mobile spinoff for in-app purchase revenue and that’s it. Destiny 3 is just a backup in case their new f2p games flop.
lightfall and the final shape were supposed to be one expansion which is why i think there are plot holes as of right now. i feel as if the seasons will (hopefully) rectify this, if not TFS will definitely have most, if not all our answers. it also explains why there are so many TFS leaks already considering it was part of the "original" lightfall expansion
and if you guys remember during the beyond light showcase, they were labeling lightfall as the end of the saga iirc, then they revealed TFS a year later. too much ambition and not enough time were probably the reasons they completely changed what lightfall was supposed to be
I hope the seasons clear things up but a lot of the time the seasons don’t really have much to do with the overarching story. Or the seasons end up asking more questions than answering.
@@Earendil87 What do you mean? Every season leading up the Lightfall was setting up different aspects of the DLC. In Risen we ally with Caiatl, in Haunted we see Calus turn himself over to the darkness, in Plunder we bring Osiris out of his coma, and in Seraph we learn about Neomuna and see the Traveler fly up to prepare to fight the Witness
Lightfall was terribly executed, in the Witchqueen dlc, Savathun felt like more of a thread and you find out that there is a being more powerfull then everything we fought. I didnt really get the same feeling playing Lightfall. It wasnt us againsed impossible odds trying to defeand the last city, it was more like us getting a new power and destroying calus with it.
When I saw that weird harness underground when we started to go downward toward the veil in the final mission got me thinking. What if the concept of "The traveler we had was always wrong? What if this orb is almost like a ship or reality machine of some kind that belonged to the witness, and the great secret of the collapse and neomuna is that humanity actually found a way to usurp control through obtaining the veil. With the witness cut off perhaps it could not enter the realm within that was it's goal. Thus giving reason to why it could control our ghost, it wears darkness because it's light was stolen. Overall i think how little they told us was not okay for this expansion and i am let down.
I think the traveler has a species locked away. It can grant life to anyone it chooses again. I wonder if the witness was talking to a species locked away. He wants to set them free
Was so hyped going through this campaign, amazing visuals, amazing gameplay, amazing boss fights to then be completely disappointed by an extremely confusing and lacklustre end.
I dont get why people dont like it.. other expansions are just bland because the story is the same. New big bad guy with big bad plan. We kill bad guy foil plan save the world the. Wait for the next bad guy. At least in this expansion there is more to it. Maybe more questions are arised than answered even. But why is that bad. We completed the campaign and the story has progressed but now we actually have things to look forward to. We need to know what all this means and we will learn in the future. I think its nice having a story that spans over expansions.
I personally love the autonomy our character has in this campaign we actively make decisions and choices in the story that affect the outcome of the story and I mean personally i like that our guardian hesitates to shoot ghost I Will always remember the khovostov quest ending where ghost basically thanks us for being his guardian funny how we have khovostov in that cutscene to idk there’s a lot of subtle stuff in the campaign little dialogue bits that will go over your head if you don’t pay attention it’s really good stuff there are criticisms but man I enjoyed it heavily
I agree and like the autonomy but to be fair after all our gaurdian has gone through and knowing the stakes they should have taken the shot and killed our ghost, our hesitation cost us the traveller (atm anyway) and seeing other characters such as rohan sacrificing themselves for the overall cause would surely highlight how important our mission is, its a bit weird that we would throw away everything to not kill our ghost when the witness may have killed everyone and everything anyway. It's not like we don't know the stakes and that death is more than likely so to fold at the most important moment was kinda the opposite of what really should have happened.
@@Kilo_23 ehhh I have to disagree this may be subjective. but as someone whose played since day 1 our character has been through so much like gosh man it’s insane. and death to our character is a huge deal look at the guardians reaction to cayde dying we don’t take death of our close friends that well. and our ghost is like our closest friend I feel like the relationship between guardians and there ghost has been explored enough to let you know that a guardian would die for there ghost just as much as a ghost would die for there guardian. The moment where Osiris calls for sagira like that shit stung because when you think about he still hasn’t really spent enough time to process that loss. The witness is such an anomaly of power being able to off guardians with the wave of a hand. So to see our ghost possessed if it were me I wouldn’t even begin to grasp an understanding of just what the hell was going on there. So while I see your point I feel like it’s a hindsight is 20/20 type deal like yeah if you knew all the info you had now then definitively you would be able to make the call but shit when I was looking at the cutscene I was even shocked because I wouldn’t know that to do.
I find it curious that the portal is triangular, similar to how the entrance to the Infinite Forest is triangular, as well as many other passageways in the Infinite Forest are triangular. I wonder if we might revisit the infinite forest again later in the year. If we can use Mara's underworld method to get into the Pyramid a sneaky way, then maybe we can use the Infinite Forest in a sneaky way to get to wherever the Witness went.
I think the real bad guy is the vex the whole time not the witness since the black heart powered the vex and the vex only want to destroy everything in there past.i think the witness wants to seek revenge on the vex for destroying countless planets.
I guess this is the Empire Strikes Back part of the story at the end we "lost". But the fact that everyone sorta out of nowhere keeps talking about the Veil, the Mast, linking it and so on gives D1 vibes in how the story being told. All the time i was just waiting for someone to go "OK everyone stop for a second, what the hell is going on and what the fuck is the Veil" but no everyone just moves at break neck pace talking about stuff as if everyone else is in the know. I almost got whiplash when Zavala was like "Yeah so the Traveler is dead...", was that what i was supposed to read out of that cutscene?
Bungie hasn't told an interesting story since Halo: Reach lol. Even Halo 3 was pretty lame. Their graphic design and gameplay design is literally best in the world, but their stories are pretty lame. They're huge in scope and small in character.
I think the witness may have merged with the traveler. Maybe the veil is an instrument the witness created to crack its shell and enter inside the traveler during the collapse but savathun tricked the witness and hid this device on neptune. it seems pretty clear that the final shape is light and dark together but for some reason i never expected the witness to be the one to do it. I always thought they were preparing to make our guardian the final shape but maybe the plan was for the witness to become the most powerful being in the universe all along?
The final shape could be a couple of options: 1. Witness gains both, therefore achieves godhood 2. Witness wants to " free" the light from within the ball 3. Witness hates universe as it is, so maybe he wants to end it all or remake it. Therefore final shape of existing
Literally the only compelling part of the campaign. Calus had never really "recoiled" at the witness before. He was boisterous and arrogant even when in conversation with it. Then suddenly the witness appears pissed, a growing shadow takes over calus and his entire demeanor changes. What was this, why didn't they show it, why wasn't it explained. Too many what ifs, and how come with this campaign.
My opinion is that the witness is literally an egregore. A gestalt god that has taken physical form. Because calus communicates to it in a dream, he can see it’s true form.
they stripped that scene from the Movie The 5th element where the protagonist starts bleeding from the anger of the "evil" when he doesn't behave properly... Cool scene but dont already.
The fact that so many of the plot points of the campaign are left with "maybe" this or "maybe" that is why it sucks. The ambiguity of the story is stupid. You could link the intro cutscene and ending cutscene, skip the entire campaign and we'd be in the exact same place narratively.
If think the main part man people are missing is the name: the veil, which means to veil or hide something beneath. In one line the witness said, that the final shape lays beneath the veil, so many the veil's name explains itself: it protects or hides the final shape, which is also the reason why they never explained what the veil really does. It was just introduced and probably will take a bigger role in the final shape expansion. I think the witness needed the veil to unveil the final shape, but i wouldnt say too much until the raid launches, which with no dought has to do something with the travelers powers
I think / hope there will be lot of 4th wall breaking in the final shape (we can kind if see the analogy now by witness breaking the glass wall), as we, players are outside the game and witness is aware about that. It would be cool if witness is not necessarily evil, he just wants to reset the game (flower game that he played initially with his buddy traveler) because traveler broke the rules of the game and let the live/universe flourish. In the end Witness and traveler will be reunited and leaving Destiny universe to play their flower game again (I still think that we will be seeing traveler as that ethereal women). In some ending scene of light and dark saga Witness will be addressing us players directly, that we have changed the rules of the game in a way that he has unaccounted for and he will allow "the game" to continue under our own rules.... Or something along those lines... I doubt Bungie will end light and dark saga by witness just being ultimate villain that we just DPS down in campaign.
I agree with you... I believe he know he is on a Videogame, and that portal was an exit to our real world... Or maybe Destiny universe is a "pocket" universe to another one... Just like Mara's universe is a pocket universe to Destiny's universe...
I feel like while the seasonal stories have improved, we're now suffering from the seasonal campaigns answering all of the questions that the main dlc campaign creates. But also I feel the main campaign has alot of nuance, yes the characters may act like they know what the veil is but ikora asks us to keep researching it, I think the reason we don't get any answers on it is because no one really know what it actually is, they just know how to use it
I loved the campaign and the ending of it, though I'm curious about one thing. The moment we kill Calus, he says a word or name being Cemaili. Who's or what is Cemaili? First guess was one of his wives but it I thought it something different
I think this year year of lightfall will be a long burn. I hope every season this year will be focused on the war and we'll learn more as the year progresses. Fingers crossed
It would've made more sense if we lost the light at the end of the campaign or at least became ghost-less imo. Unfortunately, key points were missing and that resulted in dents in the storyline that was supposed to be unveiled in LightFall.
It’s too early for that, it would’ve made all the subclasses obsolete and forced everyone to use Stasis and Strand for a whole year… (which would piss off a lot of people lol) BUT, I could see that happening at the end of the expansion. Everyone loses their light, and in a week or so The Final Shape releases and story continues
@@Kyubii01 I feel you on that bro, I was disappointed about it. But I’m hoping by the end of the expansion it gets better. Witch Queens campaign was a lot better. The whole hive being lied to thing was a major bomb, to this day leaves me in disbelief lol. I was hoping better yet EXPECTING this light fall campaign to be even better. But unfortunately it wasn’t :/ Hopefully the raid lord will make up for it
We can't lose our Light powers and/or the ghost because it'll affect the gameplay for people who doesn't own Beyond Light and Lighfall DLC's and people that just began playing the game.
How did rohan know about guardians so quick like they weren’t even suprised its like at some point they visited earth during the dark age and saw what was going on
So … What if Savathun’s “Deception” was sending the Witness through a fake portal during the first collapse. Doing so it sent the witness along with the pyramid ships into the middle of space somewhere. Later down the line we see that cutscene where the traveler is reawakened and has the big sphere of light traveling throughout the cosmos reaching the ships thus triggering the second collapse. I think this is a good one.
"The witness Will See me" - Calus - Darkness "Traveler, do you see me now?" - Gaul - Light I'm seeing a common thread here. Gaul tried to take the Light by force, and died by our hands. Then the Traveler erased him for good. Calus submitted to the Dark, and died by our hands. Then the Witness finished him off. Too much of a good thing can be bad. I guess the Guardians are the only beings who truly understands the balance of the paracausal energies. I'm guessing this iss why we are always exposed to new supers and special abilities let alone weapons.
Plot theory: The Witness has come into our reality only to discover that he has no powers here :-) . Nezarec's sin is that he causes pain. The Witness wishes to eliminate pain but Nezarec became the god of pain, so that made him thus he became the enemy of the Whitness.
I think the witness isnt completely on this plane of existence thanks to something the traveler did during the first collapse, so the veil is the link that puts the witness on this plane so it can do something to the traveler
It’s not fully dead I think. It is a source of light but not the only one. I can’t recall the deal with the tree of silver wings from a few seasons ago. It kinda looks the the veil. The veil is similar to the traveler so it could be part of the reason we still have the light. The shard of the traveler is still off in the distance from the farm even in the current season so we would still have the light because of it too. Originally it was what gave us our powers back in the red war, who said we ever broke the link to it.
That 4:55 scene absolutely infuriated me! The SINGLE REASON the Witness was successful was because our guardian couldn’t bring themselves to shoot ghost. If I had the option to press right trigger and shoot I would’ve done so without hesitation. Sorry Ghost 😅
Lightfall's ending is basically the first step of closure of Destiny 2, this game is broken in so many ways including the lore that there is no way Bungie can go with it anywhere further.
Its most likely a singularity considering that we see the Pyramid ships LITTERALLY go through spaghettification , there's a theory going around that the veil itself is just the physical line between the light and dark and that the witness wants to merge the two. I think the main campaign drops hints of this thru mainly Osiris's talk about the light and dark's differences, The light is physical, a terraforming force that makes visible change, like observable matter and energy, The darkness is everything immaterial, Emotions and stuff we can't see, strand plays off of the idea and what we think about Dark energy and matter, that they bind everything together. As far as we know, Dark matter and energy doesn't have any observable interactions with standard matter outside of gravity. Strand is key to what is coming imo, hell mastering strand might be the key to following the witness through the portal and reaching the other side.
Did anyone notice that in cut scene before the radial mast there was pool of water where the strider and Osiris we’re meeting….the bottom of that small pool was filled with carving of hundreds of pyramid ships
See I was thinking that but then I remembered some lore in something where Rhulk had managed to get ahold of a ghost and then a voice said “this is not for you!” Then the ghost gets super bright which blinds Rhulk and then explodes. I commented this same thing but then thought of this. It’s in a byf lore video at some point.
Why if the witness speak to Nezarec and not the Traveler ? After all the image of the raid seem to take place somewhere in the Traveler maybe abord a pyramid ship? After all the Witness have a statue of Nezarec in is flagship in the first cutscene ?
Everything felt so... empty in this campaign. This was supposed to be the lead up to the climax. Where is the actual sense of this being "our end". It felt rushed and unfinished. Where are Zavala, Mara, Elsie, and Anna during this? We didn't hear them at all during the story. I think their voicelines (if any) were cut. I'm wondering why Zavala and Ikora both said that the traveler was gone although it did not leave. I defintely think there was something cut. This feels like it was put together last minute. Zavala and all of people with him just chilled there the whole time? The witness too? Just sitting there in space for the entirety of the campaign? The blast shield opened as if the blast from the pyramid ships just happened. There's also a bad cut from when the veil beam was shooting the traveler to nimbus grabbing ghost. It goes from a pre rendered cutscene to in game rendered cutscene real quick. Idk, something is off with these cutscenes and I think Bungie scrapped some stuff. Maybe the main team is hard at work on the final shape and a smaller team put this together? I sure hope so. My theory is all of the scenes from space and the witness was supposed to happen all at once and soemthing was changed and they pieced together whatever this is. Somewhere in the middle of the campaign was taken out and things were rearranged.
Dang, I could theorycraft endlessly but hoping post-raid patch will give us more info. The Veil growing roots around the arena during the Calus fight seems really specific and reminded me of the Tree of Silver Wings. As the guardian and Calus clash the Veil roots rapidly grow into a sphere around the arena. Think I recall a seed being brought up again too. The one we saw growing was being corrupted by a pyramid, but before that I'd say it appeared to be growing into something 'like the traveler'.
Just thought of a theory: Ikora said the Witness went to a place we cannot follow, but what if we actually can? The Witness had the light once and created the Darkness and he got in, but what if our guardian, who wields both Light and Darkness, can go inside the Traveller as well? The Traveller could even act as a worm hole and send us to a completely different place where we could fight the Witness one last time during Final Shape and end the Light and Dark saga once and for all. In theory, even Savathun could get in there since she has her own Ghost and also had the power of the Darkness.
Savathun doesn’t also have the darkness though. In one of the Altars of Reflection she asks the Guardian “Do you ever wonder why you can wield both dark and light, while the rest of us are constrained to one or the other?” (or something along those lines). Implying that Savathun can’t wield darkness now that she has the light
I haven't played Destiny in years and watched this video to find out what's going on. I'm glad to see the story is still - I don't have time to explain, why I don't have time to explain 😅
Is anyone sure that the traveler is dead? I feel like the Garden is inside the Traveler and the Witness just went home. Ps I think the raid for the final shape will be inside the traveler
It's not dead, it's more like captured or paralyzed by the Darkness, if it was dead, our ghost would be gone too or, at least, we would have lost our Light powers, like it happened during the Red War. Zavala and Ikora said that "it's gone" because it is in a situation where no one can rescue or help it broke free from its captivity since the Witness is INSANELY powerful
whats weird is that while they treat the traveller as dead... everyone still has access to the light as normal; makes me feel more like the traveller is still alive, but maybe in something akin to a comatose state; unable to do anything of its own but still alive (not that it ever did much in a loong while)
I think the final shape is a portal that leads Inside the Traveler's shell and to its Pale Heart. If you think about it. The Traveler's shell is massive. And for all we know, it could have an entire dimension inside of it or something. Idk, this dlc left so many questions unanswered, but it left so many possibilities open.
I think this is the best as he literally opened a portal so that mean the veil was just key which would make sense as to why they needed a piece of the light to finalize the link which ended up being out ghost. But in order to beat the traveler the darkness needs to enter it
The vale is better explained in the post campaign machine gun exotic quest. Essentially the vale was the pale heart, a light varient of the black heart but the pale heart was the original. The vex made the black heart in the image of the veil but the veil was more Powerful.
Based on his speech at the end, I'm getting some Goetia vibes from his possible end goal. For context, Goetia is one of the major enemies in another game called Fate/Grand Order, and his end goal there was to recreate the world without the concept of death to try and 'end the suffering.' I could be wrong, but it almost seems like the Witness is attempting to rewrite some fundamental aspect of reality that it considers to be wrong.
My theory is that portal was opened to our world, the real world... The witness knows he is inside a videogame, and the portal created was an exit from it. That's why all witness characteristics and powers seems like mixed pixels. It's trying to escape to our reality for a long time now. If you start thinking on that perspective, a lot of bits from the lore begin to have new angles. Maybe it isn't our world, but definitely Destiny's world is inside another world. There was a Lore book that had suggested it... I just don't remember which.. Maybe it was Savathun saying I think!
From what I understand, the veil is a third entity in and of itself, or at least the remains of one. The veil, in my theory, was sort of a mediator between the light and dark, and held the darkness at bay for most of the history of the universe. The witness wanted it because it's the only thing with a connection strong enough to the traveler to actually do harm to it.
I NEED HELP UNDERSTANDING... at the end of last season, the witness was clearly trying to destroy the travellar and the veil, but now in lightfall it needed both to fulfill its plans. Is this some writing mishap, or does it all somehow come together.
Doesn't make sense to me too. Also, why the witness can't just simply kill every guardian and everyone else (including us) like he killed the titan in the opennig scene. There would be less problems to reach the purpose the witness has. I mean he is able to do it, so why not?
That’s a good point. Because I feel like the witness definitely has the power to destroy the travel with weapons. Maybe it was apart of the plan. I feel like weapons from Rasputin wouldn’t have done anything to the traveler.
I was never under the impression that the Witness wanted to destroy the Traveler. W wanted to catch up to T and confront T, but I'm not sure I ever believed W's intent was to destroy T. The mystery for me, was what in particular W wanted T to do.. It looks like at this point, T was basically like a bathtub drain plug for the W's goals. There is no need to destroy the plug, but just unplug it from the drain so the bathtub could drain.
There's a mission after the campaign called "Bluejay" at the end there is some dialogue that references The Veil being a type of Thread Weaver that could make bigger stuff like how we use strand to create and make stuff so i'm thinking that The Witness used The Veil to make a type of key to open The Traveller and begin the Final Shape to if The Witness will return or are we gonna chase after him after we learned enough info and learn of a Weakness for The Witness
So far I'm feeling a bit eh about the story. But one thing I would've done differently is that after the witness uses our ghost to talk to callus, I would've had ghost stay with Osiris while he ran tests to figure out how and why. That I think would've led up to more of an intense scene when after callus is defeated and everyone is there, our ghost just appears as Osiris is calling over the coms to watch out. But that's just me.
One thing to mention, the symbol wall in VotD, Hive scorn love darkness worship withness Pyramid Fleet Enter Earth Stop Guardian Witness commune Traveler drink light Witness kill ... The Drinking light could refer to the viel in that cutscene as it was communing with the Traveller as the viel hit it.
My favorite theory about the witness I have heard is that instead of being a pure form of darkness he is more like someone who is balancing out light and darkness. This could be the reason why he is able to access our ghost seeing as if he is trying to balance then he should be able to use both light and darkness in an immense way.
Didn't even realize this was out already. Now I don't need to play it because nothing really got answered and very little happened. I'll play the Final Shape instead.
I believe when the witness is speaking to the perpetrator and victim suffering both fate he’s actually talking to savathun as she is physically dead but her ghost resides in the traveller. The portal the witness opens is similar to what we see in savathuns throne world
This was my first Destiny 2 Campaign and I thought it was great. I liked the enemy sets and maps better than the intro and strikes I've done from Witch Queen.
My buddy and I were theorizing that maybe our actions in Beyond Light and communing with the pyramids may have given The Witness a backdoor or something into our Ghost.
A bunch of interesting things to note overall are : 1) The dark green broken glass-like field that appeared both when the ghost projected it while being posessed, and the one Calus was trapped in when he pissed the Witness off 2) The shadow that grew over Calus in the same cutscene, making him increasingly more scared, and the fact that he wakes up afterwards as if it was a dream. It was either some form of time manipulation technique or the dialogue took place directly within Calus’ mind, or even something else 3) Calus’ mysterious unfinished line. Why was Calus dissatisfied with the Witness’ plan for the Universe as to start ranting about it? 4) The Witness refering to itself in plural, coupled with the smoke in the shape of vague faces, and the resonating voice that seems to suggest composite origin, think something like Ermac from Mortal Kombat universe. 5) In the final cutscene Withess delivered a full-on Schopenhauer style speech. The theme of pain and death and how the universe is bound to endlessly produce them seems to be central to it. But at the same time it says “we know pain”. And knowing pain is too a form of pain, perhaps in the most refined sense. According to Schopenhauer, knowledge is equal to sorrow. So, unless the Witness is an entity of special purely emotional non-physical origin and is not technically “alive”, its logic would apply to itself too. But we don’t have an explicit explaination of who exactly are these “we”, which I doubt will be revealed before end of final Lightfall season, beginning of Final Shape, or even end of Final Shape
When nimbus said that the ghost is making the link, I immediately was shouting at Nimbus to go up and get it. Really weird how we had to resort to nearly killing it. I wish us losing was more of a calculated move rather than a last minute blunder. That probably would have made the loss feel like more of a loss for us players. Additionally the loss also didn't feel like that much of a loss because it happens in a cutscene right after you BEAT the FINAL BOSS. What would have been good is a final mission where you can only lose.
I said this once and I’ll say it again, please read if you’d like to hear an interesting theory. I think the being known as the “traveller” isn’t the actual giant space ball. The being is inside what we know as the traveller, a being like the witness is a being. How the witness is supposed to be the Winnower, the traveller and the being within it being the Gardener. “Be free” the Witness has no desire to kill the traveller, the witness’ goals and morals are far above anything like that. This doesn’t answer much about what the veil is but I’m so surprised I don’t see more people thinking this. Whether the witness is the Winnower or just an agent of it, what better way to achieve complete finality than being rid of the traveller whom I’m assuming to be the Gardeners agent within the cosmos, and or they are some sort of aspect or fragment of those primordial beings. Why else would the witness need to “open” the traveller like we see at the end of the campaign, if not to find/take/destroy what is inside. Surely he would just destroy the traveller if the traveller if the traveller was the true being? The witness says the traveller is suffers both fates, being a victim and a perpetrator, my theory being the traveller and or the being with it is the Gardener or some sort of representation of the Gardener. The Gardener creates and tends to all of life and existence, so when that life dies does that not make it a victim? And when that life who he brought into being and fails to keep alive doesn’t that now also make him a perpetrator? If we go back to witch queen “the game is over, there is no where left to run” this game obviously references the game of life and death played by the Gardener and the Winnower. The Gardener also fled the Winnower emphasis on why the traveller always runs away. What I want to focus on is “pale heart” now I know everyone is assuming this to be the veil however the witness just made a portal that is seemingly entering the traveller, almost like he cut the traveller open… like a surgeon. The portal is directly in the middle of the traveller almost like where the heart would be. So what if “pale heart” was never referencing the veil but talking about the literal heart of the traveller. To expand on this theory as I said before, to achieve the final shape and to achieve perfect finality, the witness would need to be rid of the Gardener, and the best way to be rid of something like a primordial God is to kill it, what’s the best way to kill something? Rip it’s heart out. What if “pale heart” isn’t only referencing the being which is the gardener’s equivalent of the witness that is within traveller, but the literal heart of this said being itself. It’s heart, meaning it’s death, is the literal key to the final shape. Savathun said “the traveller is not the last of its kind” I am assuming this means the veil, but I’m also assuming that it means more. The portal opened using the veil obviously has to go somewhere, there has to be something on the other side. I theorised that this is the Gardener, that the traveller is not a being but more of a vehicle, or possibly even a prison. What if on the other side of that portal there are more “travellers.” What if the traveller was never the first and was never meant to be the last. What if the witness has been hunting and destroying these travellers for millennia? That would certainly explain “infinite cruelty” the cruelty of having to constantly be pursued and hunted in the name of life and light. The Witness also speaks of the universe as an entity, obviously being around as long as he has you’d come to understand how harsh it truly is. The universe gave life to the first beings the Gardener and the Winnower, could it be possible the witness/the Winnower is simply tired of playing to the universe’s whims? Don’t forget the Witness and the Traveller are two sides of the same coin, im sure the witness has no hate towards his opposite, which is why he tells it to “be free.” In his own way, which seems twisted to us but don’t forget the witness is above all our earthly morals. In his own way I believe the witness believes he is saving himself and his counterpart the traveller/Gardener. Many may see this is as far fetched but if you really think about it, I don’t believe all this lore and mystery surrounding a character can be chalked down to “he is the bad guy so he wants to kill the good guy because that’s bad guy stuff” I believe he is trying to achieve his final shape but not for the simply reason of “bad guy wants to do bad things” I believe it is a much much deeper meaning than that. A completely opposite theory is he isn’t addressing the traveller at all but his ships since they enter the portal. He is possibly freeing them from the clutches of the universe. I like this theory but it doesn’t make much sense as the Winnowers whole job is to cut down life. Unless the Witness never has and never was meant to be the Winnower. Unless the true Winnower is locked within the traveller. Back to my theory of the traveller being a vessel, what if it was never a vessel for the Gardener but a prison for the Winnower. I have so many conflicting theories my head hurts 😂 I’d love to know what other people think!
And where, might I ask, is the "EXPLAINED!" part? :D Love your unwavering optimism, Evade. Lightfall is an embarrassment on more levels than I can count. My faith in Bungie and Destiny has been profoundly shaken :( Very, very sad :( I'm still your fan, though :)
Only started playing during beyond light so take it w a grain of salt but maybe the reason the campaign left me and a lot of others with so many unanswered questions was because although the witch queen campaign was phenomenal; it doomed the rest of the expansion to fall short in terms of development (at least that’s what it seemed to feel like to me). To remedy this, this expansion they left a lot of question marks to answer in the upcoming year to keep the seasonal content interesting/relevant? If so, good move by Bungie IMO.
But we did see the Witness control a ghost earlier in the campaign...right at the start in one of the ships. When he sliced the ghost and Guardian inside into pieces. As the Witness turned his head, the ghost mimicked the movement to look at the Guardian, which is when the Witness struck.
I keep thinking about the "three in one" concept that seems to be at the very base of the game. I feel like the Traveler represents our body, the Witness is our mind, the Veil is soul? IDK. I really think it's got something to do with Sophia and the Demiurge from Gnostic faith. I also believe that we will be entering the Veil at the end. I expect us to have to kill our Ghost, and replace it w a Pouka. This would work w the way Poukas empathically bond w a subject, and also that our"Powers" Never came from the Traveler, but they are expressions of our self...l light us manipulating the energies of creation while the dark empowers our minds... perhaps by entering the Veil we learn to free ourselves from our limitations and we will awaken fully. I also feel like our last darkness power will be based upon defiance, opposition, or rage... A purple(or black) flame/shadow that will erupt out of us.
I think when Zavala and ikora say the traveller is “gone” I think they are just talking about it being gone from the last city, remember those who didn’t play season of the seraph aren’t aware of the traveller leaving so they need to include dialogue for those who don’t know, they need to make the expansion make some sense for those who may be new lights or simply don’t know what happened last season just like the expansion story doesn’t makes it seem like our player played through last season even if we did
If the witness controls the darkness and the pyramids a than there most be someone who controls the light and the traveler, and if one of savathun’s truths was that there are more of the traveler or that there was more of the traveler than that would mirror the witness with there being an entity that controls the light and the traveler’s ( if there were more of it). Also the entity that controls the traveler could be the veiled woman from the statues we find in some of the pyramids, if so than the the person the witness was talking to and telling it to be free could be the veiled woman, maybe the witness has been hunting down every traveler ( if there were more ) to find in which one the veiled woman was in to created the final shape.
I believe the witness is the travelers twin. I believe that inside the traveler is another being of the same form as the witness but opposite. I believe they are the twin children of some ultimate entity.
After completing campain i thing Traveler is like a vex( creator of vex?) And witness is a last (true)organic vex. Specialty i thing about that after hearing caiatel last word after campain that she will help us fight (mechanical) witness when he will go out, but this theory have many holes
When I think of this and hear me out, when we do that strike the person starting nightmares talks about a prison holding him and he will soon escape I feel like whoever that person is was trapped in the veil and the witness is just a servant to a true king of darkness and the veil is just the key and the traveler is the prison
Good theory crafting there. If you ever take a writing course for epics or follow authors like David Eddings, Piers Anthony, Terry Goodkind, or some other more famous authors, You will find they never let loose or let you know the Real villian until the end. You hear about it, you know it's there but you never get to "know it" mainly because they are more evil if left to your imagination.
@@wolfmcsnipes4192 and what if it is not I'd like you to come to this post when the raid is live and the final boss is shown during the raid if Nezerac is the raid boss and was there the entire time then who is in the prison?
The traveller with the pyramid round it looks like a ghost. So maybe the traveller is trying to "resurrect" something that the traveller is connected, similiar to our ghost.
Think of the campaign as a four part play. This was just act one. Act two will be in season 21, act 3 in 22, and the final act in 24 before "The Final Shape" expansion. I personally enjoyed what's been released so far and would have been dissapointed if they gave everything in one shot. Knowing there is a year between expansions (currently) it is better to release a contueation of content for the main story in each new season. There is still so much more to discover after you finish the main story. I for one am looking forward to finding all the secrets Neomuna has to offer.
If only we had some sort of power to grab ghost, maybe even a grappling hook…
Lmao... It's too logical!!!
Imagine that lol
Or Nimbus could fly up and get it..
Preferably before it creates the link
Bro… we had every opportunity to save the Speaker and we didn’t. We have an agenda too. The last boss of the next story arc, (the one we face in 2045 irl) is going to be the guardians
The Witness was not losing and he knew it that's why he was with the Traveler the whole time. He knew one way or another he was going to link the Veil to the Traveler. He sent Calus on a suicide mission to the Veil knowing if he was killed it'd be by us Guardians and then possess our ghosts to create the link. If Calus succeeded then he would use the Radial Mist. That's why he didn't kill Calus off, he needed him there knowing we would be there too. 200 IQ play, kudos
Crazy because they foreshadowed calus losing since season of opulence
Meh, could have killed Calus off. Not like there's no other disciples, nor is Bungee unknown for recycling old bosses, even dead bosses.
@@jorgeoffred He was bound to lose for sure
@@jasonrussell5265 Then that would delay his plans, he'd need a whole new disciple with a whole new army who knows what the plan is
200 IQ is not enough lol
Witness' speech while it's carving out the portal might be a red herring, as in it's not addressing the Traveler, but the being beyond the portal that it's going to free.
I was under the impression the Witness was speaking to the Pyramids, since after "be free" the Pyramids kindof escaped thru the triangle portal. It doesn't make sense to me that the Traveler is the one who can now be free, because it is still there and didn't change.
@@ablestmage True, I never thought of it like that because I always assumed the Ships were an extension of the Witness.
Well the witness isn’t talking to the tracker but what’s inside locked away, the girl is the key the trailer is the jail for… nezarac the true king of darkness
Why does he keep referring to the traveler as sol? Also has a sun/solstice shape with the pyramids around it
@@IncSpen Sol is the name of our solar system, it never referred to the Traveler as Sol.
Campaign is the biggest blue ball in gaming history
You must be COLOR BLIND ,,,,,,you mean. GOLD BALL 👍😊👍😊👍😊👍😊👍😊👍😊👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Call it zavala
When the witness stated that it knows pain, it got me thinking as to what its motivations are. The witness seems to hate watching things suffer as it said in light there is pain and suffering which it has witnessed countless times as the traveller gardens a new civilisation which it abandones. This could explain all the faces in the smoke being the souls of the past world's the witness witnessed.
I think the faces are just the entire race of beings emanating from the witness
@archimedes5158 yeah now we know
Campaign was alright, but left me a bit disapointed. It felt a bit rushed and shallow, but maybe if I catch up with all the lore it will be clearer.
Not really...it was definitely disappointing...especially for $60
We couldn't agree more.
Plus
COMN CALUS NEEDED A FREAKING DUNGEON TO BE KILLED!!!!!!!
Actually even the lore people of destiny can't answer what the veil is. Even they are confused
But that shouldn’t be the case. Lore should expand but not explain
This campaign was probably the most disappointing Destiny expansion EVER.
Bungie failed narratively here. This should have been an Infinity War. But instead we got pretty much nothing.
This is the first expansion where I wish I kept my money. I expected big things, and it should have given big things.
What we got was honestly pathetic. How on earth did Destiny go from being pretty good narratively in recent years to this?
A failure at the worst possible time. This was the big one to draw people to Destiny. And they failed hard.
At least the gameplay was good.
So we're going to act like The Witness hasn't been using our ghost since Shadow Keep.
important note: the beam from the Veil didnt hit the traveller; it hit the witness that was standing in front of it, probably empowering him to carve that portal in the traveller. You can see the beam stops some distance away from the traveller, leaving only a dot of light exactly where the witness would be if we could see him from so far away. So its not that the veil weakaned the traveller, its that it allowed the witness to open the portal using the traveller (also explains why the witness didnt destroy the traveller... he needs it to open the passage. Even with the warsats, he may have aimed to cripple the traveller more than annihilate it, the very same action rasputin did consider to force the traveller to stay)
Still doesnt tell us WHAT the veil is and what it exactly does... but hey, its clues.
Possible and i have a theory the travellers have the light mean i was thinking tgat the travellers is jas the big bang like creation and i think the witness wanted is the big bang or something like he want to create a world on his own image that tge traveller is a shell that he want to crack so tgat my theory and it just a theory
The Veil is to the Darkness as the Traveler is to the Light.
@@BungieStudios possible mabye he set it up that our guardian didn't know what id the darkness the first was to set to capture the traveller
Interesting. Savathun wanted to lock the traveler away to protect it, just like the Veil was protected and locked away...coincidence? I think not. She knew where the veil was.
100% and she tried to lock the traveler away behind many different layers aswell to keep it away from the witness. this is why i think season of the deep is going to be us REVIVING savathun, as we know eris has her body and all we need do is reveal it in the open for immaru to revive her
sex😊
I was also very much opposed to preventing Savvy from locking the traveler away. It just seemed like I was forced to follow orders and prevent her from locking it away, when I wanted to know more about why and not force her to stop. More and more, it seems like the decision to prevent her locking it away, could have been a bad one.
@@ablestmage context was needed 100%
What are the nine and where are they and do they actually exist in a physical form or do they not exist in this universe
Pale heart of the Traveler being the Veil could work potentially. As the Dark Heart in the Black Garden was to be a clone of the Veil.
@noface Some coward to confront their own end. May have taken many aeons, but now it has leaned forward. So perhaps it could be the phrase, and on the other hand may have been more literal. Maybe even both. Concepts can have several manifestations, we will have to see how it plays out.
@noface Unless you can give a better explanation of the veil you shouldn’t be talking too much
One thing I'm surprised nobody's mentioned yet is that both the veil and especially the portal look veeeeeeery similar to the strange moving "windows" inside Savathun's Throne World buildings
Maybe the Witness gave us the power to wield Darkness (Stasis) so it could directly affect our ghost.
The Witness was speaking through our Ghost since Shadowkeep. It never needed to control it before, but most likely could have at any point
Darkness itself isn't the witness apperently. Witness is just the symbol at this point somewhere in the lore it said this.
I think the witness is bigger than the destiny universe everything we’ve seen so far has shown that it’s plans are greater than we can understand
@@jorgeoffred The Witness is a former Destiny fanboy who's come to destroy Bungee, I mean Destiny... ;)
@@jasonrussell5265Destiny is dead anyways after Final Shape. One mobile spinoff for in-app purchase revenue and that’s it. Destiny 3 is just a backup in case their new f2p games flop.
lightfall and the final shape were supposed to be one expansion which is why i think there are plot holes as of right now. i feel as if the seasons will (hopefully) rectify this, if not TFS will definitely have most, if not all our answers. it also explains why there are so many TFS leaks already considering it was part of the "original" lightfall expansion
and if you guys remember during the beyond light showcase, they were labeling lightfall as the end of the saga iirc, then they revealed TFS a year later. too much ambition and not enough time were probably the reasons they completely changed what lightfall was supposed to be
I hope the seasons clear things up but a lot of the time the seasons don’t really have much to do with the overarching story. Or the seasons end up asking more questions than answering.
@@Earendil87 What do you mean? Every season leading up the Lightfall was setting up different aspects of the DLC. In Risen we ally with Caiatl, in Haunted we see Calus turn himself over to the darkness, in Plunder we bring Osiris out of his coma, and in Seraph we learn about Neomuna and see the Traveler fly up to prepare to fight the Witness
Lightfall was terribly executed, in the Witchqueen dlc, Savathun felt like more of a thread and you find out that there is a being more powerfull then everything we fought. I didnt really get the same feeling playing Lightfall. It wasnt us againsed impossible odds trying to defeand the last city, it was more like us getting a new power and destroying calus with it.
Strand tutorial. This whole DLC and its seasons are filler. I won’t be back for Final Shape and I’m not spending any more money on this game.
@@BungieStudios see you next season
@@skyyy7544😂😂
When I saw that weird harness underground when we started to go downward toward the veil in the final mission got me thinking. What if the concept of "The traveler we had was always wrong? What if this orb is almost like a ship or reality machine of some kind that belonged to the witness, and the great secret of the collapse and neomuna is that humanity actually found a way to usurp control through obtaining the veil. With the witness cut off perhaps it could not enter the realm within that was it's goal. Thus giving reason to why it could control our ghost, it wears darkness because it's light was stolen. Overall i think how little they told us was not okay for this expansion and i am let down.
well the fallen calls the traveler the "machine"
Well we do kinda get told what the veil is in the after story of the campaign
I think the traveler has a species locked away. It can grant life to anyone it chooses again. I wonder if the witness was talking to a species locked away. He wants to set them free
Was so hyped going through this campaign, amazing visuals, amazing gameplay, amazing boss fights to then be completely disappointed by an extremely confusing and lacklustre end.
Yeah, try playing the first Destiny lol
I dont get why people dont like it.. other expansions are just bland because the story is the same. New big bad guy with big bad plan. We kill bad guy foil plan save the world the. Wait for the next bad guy. At least in this expansion there is more to it. Maybe more questions are arised than answered even. But why is that bad. We completed the campaign and the story has progressed but now we actually have things to look forward to. We need to know what all this means and we will learn in the future. I think its nice having a story that spans over expansions.
I personally love the autonomy our character has in this campaign we actively make decisions and choices in the story that affect the outcome of the story and I mean personally i like that our guardian hesitates to shoot ghost I Will always remember the khovostov quest ending where ghost basically thanks us for being his guardian funny how we have khovostov in that cutscene to idk there’s a lot of subtle stuff in the campaign little dialogue bits that will go over your head if you don’t pay attention it’s really good stuff there are criticisms but man I enjoyed it heavily
I think the khovostov is only here as a placeholder as it would be difficult to animate every possible gun in the cutscene
I agree and like the autonomy but to be fair after all our gaurdian has gone through and knowing the stakes they should have taken the shot and killed our ghost, our hesitation cost us the traveller (atm anyway) and seeing other characters such as rohan sacrificing themselves for the overall cause would surely highlight how important our mission is, its a bit weird that we would throw away everything to not kill our ghost when the witness may have killed everyone and everything anyway.
It's not like we don't know the stakes and that death is more than likely so to fold at the most important moment was kinda the opposite of what really should have happened.
@@aidenmarshman3813 they did it for witch queen you could be holding a primary shotgun in the final cutscene so it was obviously purposeful
@@Kilo_23 ehhh I have to disagree this may be subjective. but as someone whose played since day 1 our character has been through so much like gosh man it’s insane. and death to our character is a huge deal look at the guardians reaction to cayde dying we don’t take death of our close friends that well. and our ghost is like our closest friend I feel like the relationship between guardians and there ghost has been explored enough to let you know that a guardian would die for there ghost just as much as a ghost would die for there guardian. The moment where Osiris calls for sagira like that shit stung because when you think about he still hasn’t really spent enough time to process that loss. The witness is such an anomaly of power being able to off guardians with the wave of a hand. So to see our ghost possessed if it were me I wouldn’t even begin to grasp an understanding of just what the hell was going on there. So while I see your point I feel like it’s a hindsight is 20/20 type deal like yeah if you knew all the info you had now then definitively you would be able to make the call but shit when I was looking at the cutscene I was even shocked because I wouldn’t know that to do.
So basically our guardian hesitated and now we are all fucked. I kinda wish it would have given us a choice to shoot our ghost or not
I find it curious that the portal is triangular, similar to how the entrance to the Infinite Forest is triangular, as well as many other passageways in the Infinite Forest are triangular. I wonder if we might revisit the infinite forest again later in the year. If we can use Mara's underworld method to get into the Pyramid a sneaky way, then maybe we can use the Infinite Forest in a sneaky way to get to wherever the Witness went.
the bottom half of the witness is a triangle too
I think the real bad guy is the vex the whole time not the witness since the black heart powered the vex and the vex only want to destroy everything in there past.i think the witness wants to seek revenge on the vex for destroying countless planets.
Many of the darkness symbologies are triangular. Even way back in the Vault of Glass, Atheon’s throne is triangular.
I love how the guardian and the cloud-striders are the only one doing a damn thing. You know for a universe ending event they just stand around.
ive been binging all ur vids recently and watched ur 4hr30min long video recapping the story, i love ur content keep it up
I guess this is the Empire Strikes Back part of the story at the end we "lost". But the fact that everyone sorta out of nowhere keeps talking about the Veil, the Mast, linking it and so on gives D1 vibes in how the story being told. All the time i was just waiting for someone to go "OK everyone stop for a second, what the hell is going on and what the fuck is the Veil" but no everyone just moves at break neck pace talking about stuff as if everyone else is in the know. I almost got whiplash when Zavala was like "Yeah so the Traveler is dead...", was that what i was supposed to read out of that cutscene?
Oh so true
Bungie hasn't told an interesting story since Halo: Reach lol. Even Halo 3 was pretty lame. Their graphic design and gameplay design is literally best in the world, but their stories are pretty lame. They're huge in scope and small in character.
I think the witness may have merged with the traveler. Maybe the veil is an instrument the witness created to crack its shell and enter inside the traveler during the collapse but savathun tricked the witness and hid this device on neptune. it seems pretty clear that the final shape is light and dark together but for some reason i never expected the witness to be the one to do it. I always thought they were preparing to make our guardian the final shape but maybe the plan was for the witness to become the most powerful being in the universe all along?
The final shape could be a couple of options:
1. Witness gains both, therefore achieves godhood
2. Witness wants to " free" the light from within the ball
3. Witness hates universe as it is, so maybe he wants to end it all or remake it. Therefore final shape of existing
The reason calus got so scared he probably seen what the witness truly is
Literally the only compelling part of the campaign. Calus had never really "recoiled" at the witness before. He was boisterous and arrogant even when in conversation with it. Then suddenly the witness appears pissed, a growing shadow takes over calus and his entire demeanor changes.
What was this, why didn't they show it, why wasn't it explained.
Too many what ifs, and how come with this campaign.
My opinion is that the witness is literally an egregore. A gestalt god that has taken physical form. Because calus communicates to it in a dream, he can see it’s true form.
they stripped that scene from the Movie The 5th element where the protagonist starts bleeding from the anger of the "evil" when he doesn't behave properly... Cool scene but dont already.
The fact that so many of the plot points of the campaign are left with "maybe" this or "maybe" that is why it sucks. The ambiguity of the story is stupid. You could link the intro cutscene and ending cutscene, skip the entire campaign and we'd be in the exact same place narratively.
Exactly what I was thinking too. It felt like everything we did on Neptune was just filler content, like an excuse to make an additional expansion.
Yup. Watched this video and now I'm not going to buy the dlc. I'll just play the Final Shape if it actually answers questions.
Maybe the traveler is a prison if some sort and the witness is trying to release whatever is locked in it.
If think the main part man people are missing is the name: the veil, which means to veil or hide something beneath. In one line the witness said, that the final shape lays beneath the veil, so many the veil's name explains itself: it protects or hides the final shape, which is also the reason why they never explained what the veil really does. It was just introduced and probably will take a bigger role in the final shape expansion. I think the witness needed the veil to unveil the final shape, but i wouldnt say too much until the raid launches, which with no dought has to do something with the travelers powers
I think / hope there will be lot of 4th wall breaking in the final shape (we can kind if see the analogy now by witness breaking the glass wall), as we, players are outside the game and witness is aware about that. It would be cool if witness is not necessarily evil, he just wants to reset the game (flower game that he played initially with his buddy traveler) because traveler broke the rules of the game and let the live/universe flourish. In the end Witness and traveler will be reunited and leaving Destiny universe to play their flower game again (I still think that we will be seeing traveler as that ethereal women). In some ending scene of light and dark saga Witness will be addressing us players directly, that we have changed the rules of the game in a way that he has unaccounted for and he will allow "the game" to continue under our own rules.... Or something along those lines... I doubt Bungie will end light and dark saga by witness just being ultimate villain that we just DPS down in campaign.
Did you just assume an ethereal being's gender??? Bigot!
I agree with you... I believe he know he is on a Videogame, and that portal was an exit to our real world...
Or maybe Destiny universe is a "pocket" universe to another one... Just like Mara's universe is a pocket universe to Destiny's universe...
I feel like while the seasonal stories have improved, we're now suffering from the seasonal campaigns answering all of the questions that the main dlc campaign creates. But also I feel the main campaign has alot of nuance, yes the characters may act like they know what the veil is but ikora asks us to keep researching it, I think the reason we don't get any answers on it is because no one really know what it actually is, they just know how to use it
I loved the campaign and the ending of it, though I'm curious about one thing. The moment we kill Calus, he says a word or name being Cemaili. Who's or what is Cemaili? First guess was one of his wives but it I thought it something different
Caiatl’s mother and Calus’ former lover whom he lost.
That’s actually kinda sad
@@Notyourstodisclose that was her real mother or stepmother? It's been a minute since I heard the name
Cemaili is Calus' consort.
@@ehrix4468 it’s very sad at first he wanted all that power but in the very end he was a soft hearted space turtle
I think this year year of lightfall will be a long burn. I hope every season this year will be focused on the war and we'll learn more as the year progresses. Fingers crossed
It would've made more sense if we lost the light at the end of the campaign or at least became ghost-less imo. Unfortunately, key points were missing and that resulted in dents in the storyline that was supposed to be unveiled in LightFall.
It’s too early for that, it would’ve made all the subclasses obsolete and forced everyone to use Stasis and Strand for a whole year… (which would piss off a lot of people lol) BUT, I could see that happening at the end of the expansion. Everyone loses their light, and in a week or so The Final Shape releases and story continues
@@Kyubii01 I feel you on that bro, I was disappointed about it. But I’m hoping by the end of the expansion it gets better. Witch Queens campaign was a lot better. The whole hive being lied to thing was a major bomb, to this day leaves me in disbelief lol. I was hoping better yet EXPECTING this light fall campaign to be even better. But unfortunately it wasn’t :/
Hopefully the raid lord will make up for it
We can't lose our Light powers and/or the ghost because it'll affect the gameplay for people who doesn't own Beyond Light and Lighfall DLC's and people that just began playing the game.
I mean that would end the game for us, next time we log in to crucible and die, we wouldn't be able to respawn. No ghost no revive.
How did rohan know about guardians so quick like they weren’t even suprised its like at some point they visited earth during the dark age and saw what was going on
Thank you for providing your own explanation… everyone else is too bummed out because how bad this all was. Props to you! Hoping this gets better!
So … What if Savathun’s “Deception” was sending the Witness through a fake portal during the first collapse. Doing so it sent the witness along with the pyramid ships into the middle of space somewhere. Later down the line we see that cutscene where the traveler is reawakened and has the big sphere of light traveling throughout the cosmos reaching the ships thus triggering the second collapse.
I think this is a good one.
"The witness Will See me" - Calus - Darkness
"Traveler, do you see me now?" - Gaul - Light
I'm seeing a common thread here.
Gaul tried to take the Light by force, and died by our hands. Then the Traveler erased him for good.
Calus submitted to the Dark, and died by our hands. Then the Witness finished him off.
Too much of a good thing can be bad.
I guess the Guardians are the only beings who truly understands the balance of the paracausal energies.
I'm guessing this iss why we are always exposed to new supers and special abilities let alone weapons.
Campaign was good. Has me wanting more. Calus and witness moments were really good imo
it was eh, the final boss was just valus ta’aurc (slowed + reverb) but the subclass and world is very cool. also loving the weapons
@@supahgaming8249 😂
that’s a hot take
@@supahgaming8249 can agree with that. A bit short and a little bit lacking but the world and subclass are cool.
@@monkyyy Not really.
Savathun was technically the misunderstood ally that we didn’t figure out until she died lol
we figured out long before killing her tho
Plot theory: The Witness has come into our reality only to discover that he has no powers here :-) . Nezarec's sin is that he causes pain. The Witness wishes to eliminate pain but Nezarec became the god of pain, so that made him thus he became the enemy of the Whitness.
I think the witness isnt completely on this plane of existence thanks to something the traveler did during the first collapse, so the veil is the link that puts the witness on this plane so it can do something to the traveler
Still weird that's the death of the traveler and we still have light
Cause the travellers lives
@@Giveitathought Or because the Traveler doesn't give the light.
@@rytr0nious Could just be a conduit for it
It’s not fully dead I think. It is a source of light but not the only one. I can’t recall the deal with the tree of silver wings from a few seasons ago. It kinda looks the the veil. The veil is similar to the traveler so it could be part of the reason we still have the light. The shard of the traveler is still off in the distance from the farm even in the current season so we would still have the light because of it too. Originally it was what gave us our powers back in the red war, who said we ever broke the link to it.
That 4:55 scene absolutely infuriated me! The SINGLE REASON the Witness was successful was because our guardian couldn’t bring themselves to shoot ghost. If I had the option to press right trigger and shoot I would’ve done so without hesitation. Sorry Ghost 😅
Lightfall's ending is basically the first step of closure of Destiny 2, this game is broken in so many ways including the lore that there is no way Bungie can go with it anywhere further.
Its most likely a singularity considering that we see the Pyramid ships LITTERALLY go through spaghettification , there's a theory going around that the veil itself is just the physical line between the light and dark and that the witness wants to merge the two.
I think the main campaign drops hints of this thru mainly Osiris's talk about the light and dark's differences, The light is physical, a terraforming force that makes visible change, like observable matter and energy, The darkness is everything immaterial, Emotions and stuff we can't see, strand plays off of the idea and what we think about Dark energy and matter, that they bind everything together. As far as we know, Dark matter and energy doesn't have any observable interactions with standard matter outside of gravity.
Strand is key to what is coming imo, hell mastering strand might be the key to following the witness through the portal and reaching the other side.
Did anyone notice that in cut scene before the radial mast there was pool of water where the strider and Osiris we’re meeting….the bottom of that small pool was filled with carving of hundreds of pyramid ships
I feel like the witness somehow might how had a hand in creating the ghost
See I was thinking that but then I remembered some lore in something where Rhulk had managed to get ahold of a ghost and then a voice said “this is not for you!” Then the ghost gets super bright which blinds Rhulk and then explodes. I commented this same thing but then thought of this. It’s in a byf lore video at some point.
Am I reaching or at exactly 6:58 you can see Ghaul bottom middle of the triangle/portal and a vex at the top middle ? Pause it and zoom in
Why if the witness speak to Nezarec and not the Traveler ? After all the image of the raid seem to take place somewhere in the Traveler maybe abord a pyramid ship?
After all the Witness have a statue of Nezarec in is flagship in the first cutscene ?
Everything felt so... empty in this campaign. This was supposed to be the lead up to the climax. Where is the actual sense of this being "our end". It felt rushed and unfinished. Where are Zavala, Mara, Elsie, and Anna during this? We didn't hear them at all during the story. I think their voicelines (if any) were cut. I'm wondering why Zavala and Ikora both said that the traveler was gone although it did not leave. I defintely think there was something cut. This feels like it was put together last minute. Zavala and all of people with him just chilled there the whole time? The witness too? Just sitting there in space for the entirety of the campaign? The blast shield opened as if the blast from the pyramid ships just happened. There's also a bad cut from when the veil beam was shooting the traveler to nimbus grabbing ghost. It goes from a pre rendered cutscene to in game rendered cutscene real quick. Idk, something is off with these cutscenes and I think Bungie scrapped some stuff. Maybe the main team is hard at work on the final shape and a smaller team put this together? I sure hope so. My theory is all of the scenes from space and the witness was supposed to happen all at once and soemthing was changed and they pieced together whatever this is. Somewhere in the middle of the campaign was taken out and things were rearranged.
No pressure, next year they will explain everything.
But I am looking forward on Raid : Osiris Nightmare dadaaa Nez is back😉
Dang, I could theorycraft endlessly but hoping post-raid patch will give us more info. The Veil growing roots around the arena during the Calus fight seems really specific and reminded me of the Tree of Silver Wings. As the guardian and Calus clash the Veil roots rapidly grow into a sphere around the arena. Think I recall a seed being brought up again too. The one we saw growing was being corrupted by a pyramid, but before that I'd say it appeared to be growing into something 'like the traveler'.
We already had hints before that the witness can control our ghost
Just thought of a theory: Ikora said the Witness went to a place we cannot follow, but what if we actually can? The Witness had the light once and created the Darkness and he got in, but what if our guardian, who wields both Light and Darkness, can go inside the Traveller as well? The Traveller could even act as a worm hole and send us to a completely different place where we could fight the Witness one last time during Final Shape and end the Light and Dark saga once and for all. In theory, even Savathun could get in there since she has her own Ghost and also had the power of the Darkness.
Savathun doesn’t also have the darkness though. In one of the Altars of Reflection she asks the Guardian “Do you ever wonder why you can wield both dark and light, while the rest of us are constrained to one or the other?” (or something along those lines). Implying that Savathun can’t wield darkness now that she has the light
I haven't played Destiny in years and watched this video to find out what's going on. I'm glad to see the story is still - I don't have time to explain, why I don't have time to explain 😅
Is anyone sure that the traveler is dead? I feel like the Garden is inside the Traveler and the Witness just went home. Ps I think the raid for the final shape will be inside the traveler
The raid is taking place on a terraformed pyramid ship
It's not dead, it's more like captured or paralyzed by the Darkness, if it was dead, our ghost would be gone too or, at least, we would have lost our Light powers, like it happened during the Red War. Zavala and Ikora said that "it's gone" because it is in a situation where no one can rescue or help it broke free from its captivity since the Witness is INSANELY powerful
@@putak2285That's for Lightfall. He wrote "The raid for the Final Shape".
Defeating Nezarec is the raid i think
@@spaceman2517the raid is taking place on both a pyramid shop and the tracker which is where nezarac is help captivite
whats weird is that while they treat the traveller as dead... everyone still has access to the light as normal; makes me feel more like the traveller is still alive, but maybe in something akin to a comatose state; unable to do anything of its own but still alive (not that it ever did much in a loong while)
I think the final shape is a portal that leads Inside the Traveler's shell and to its Pale Heart. If you think about it. The Traveler's shell is massive. And for all we know, it could have an entire dimension inside of it or something. Idk, this dlc left so many questions unanswered, but it left so many possibilities open.
I think this is the best as he literally opened a portal so that mean the veil was just key which would make sense as to why they needed a piece of the light to finalize the link which ended up being out ghost. But in order to beat the traveler the darkness needs to enter it
The vale is better explained in the post campaign machine gun exotic quest. Essentially the vale was the pale heart, a light varient of the black heart but the pale heart was the original. The vex made the black heart in the image of the veil but the veil was more Powerful.
Based on his speech at the end, I'm getting some Goetia vibes from his possible end goal. For context, Goetia is one of the major enemies in another game called Fate/Grand Order, and his end goal there was to recreate the world without the concept of death to try and 'end the suffering.'
I could be wrong, but it almost seems like the Witness is attempting to rewrite some fundamental aspect of reality that it considers to be wrong.
Maybe the final shape is the friends we made along the way?
My theory is that portal was opened to our world, the real world... The witness knows he is inside a videogame, and the portal created was an exit from it. That's why all witness characteristics and powers seems like mixed pixels. It's trying to escape to our reality for a long time now.
If you start thinking on that perspective, a lot of bits from the lore begin to have new angles.
Maybe it isn't our world, but definitely Destiny's world is inside another world. There was a Lore book that had suggested it... I just don't remember which.. Maybe it was Savathun saying I think!
I think after the raid is beaten, we'll get more details with cutscenes.
agreed, especially after all these negative comments about how ugly their baby is... ROFL
From what I understand, the veil is a third entity in and of itself, or at least the remains of one. The veil, in my theory, was sort of a mediator between the light and dark, and held the darkness at bay for most of the history of the universe. The witness wanted it because it's the only thing with a connection strong enough to the traveler to actually do harm to it.
I NEED HELP UNDERSTANDING... at the end of last season, the witness was clearly trying to destroy the travellar and the veil, but now in lightfall it needed both to fulfill its plans. Is this some writing mishap, or does it all somehow come together.
Doesn't make sense to me too. Also, why the witness can't just simply kill every guardian and everyone else (including us) like he killed the titan in the opennig scene. There would be less problems to reach the purpose the witness has. I mean he is able to do it, so why not?
That’s a good point. Because I feel like the witness definitely has the power to destroy the travel with weapons. Maybe it was apart of the plan. I feel like weapons from Rasputin wouldn’t have done anything to the traveler.
I was never under the impression that the Witness wanted to destroy the Traveler. W wanted to catch up to T and confront T, but I'm not sure I ever believed W's intent was to destroy T. The mystery for me, was what in particular W wanted T to do.. It looks like at this point, T was basically like a bathtub drain plug for the W's goals. There is no need to destroy the plug, but just unplug it from the drain so the bathtub could drain.
i feel like that moment when the witness got mad was a shout out to the fifth element
There's a mission after the campaign called "Bluejay" at the end there is some dialogue that references The Veil being a type of Thread Weaver that could make bigger stuff like how we use strand to create and make stuff so i'm thinking that The Witness used The Veil to make a type of key to open The Traveller and begin the Final Shape to if The Witness will return or are we gonna chase after him after we learned enough info and learn of a Weakness for The Witness
I don't believe that the travler is dead cus wouldn't our ghosts stop working as they are a part of him
I don’t if anyone noticed but the portal that the witness creates has been teases in the tower for years
So far I'm feeling a bit eh about the story. But one thing I would've done differently is that after the witness uses our ghost to talk to callus, I would've had ghost stay with Osiris while he ran tests to figure out how and why. That I think would've led up to more of an intense scene when after callus is defeated and everyone is there, our ghost just appears as Osiris is calling over the coms to watch out. But that's just me.
One thing to mention, the symbol wall in VotD,
Hive scorn love darkness worship withness
Pyramid Fleet Enter Earth Stop Guardian
Witness commune Traveler drink light
Witness kill ...
The Drinking light could refer to the viel in that cutscene as it was communing with the Traveller as the viel hit it.
My favorite theory about the witness I have heard is that instead of being a pure form of darkness he is more like someone who is balancing out light and darkness. This could be the reason why he is able to access our ghost seeing as if he is trying to balance then he should be able to use both light and darkness in an immense way.
so effectively trying to make Yin and Yang whole instead of one or the other bleeding out to far in one or other direction?
I'm reminded of that time long ago where Drifter told us not to trust the ghosts...
The final shape will be an Engram
Didn't even realize this was out already. Now I don't need to play it because nothing really got answered and very little happened. I'll play the Final Shape instead.
I believe when the witness is speaking to the perpetrator and victim suffering both fate he’s actually talking to savathun as she is physically dead but her ghost resides in the traveller. The portal the witness opens is similar to what we see in savathuns throne world
This was my first Destiny 2 Campaign and I thought it was great. I liked the enemy sets and maps better than the intro and strikes I've done from Witch Queen.
Maybe in the Season of The Deep we'll see Savathun or Immaru again.
My buddy and I were theorizing that maybe our actions in Beyond Light and communing with the pyramids may have given The Witness a backdoor or something into our Ghost.
Thought it was Nezerec talking through the ghost, and when the Witness said "be free" thought he was talking about Nezerec
i really like this story tbh probably one of my favorite campaigns
kind of feels like the cloud strider people things weren't 100% completed in detail
I'm glad to say I wasn't the only person who chose to ignore strand in the final fight
A bunch of interesting things to note overall are :
1) The dark green broken glass-like field that appeared both when the ghost projected it while being posessed, and the one Calus was trapped in when he pissed the Witness off
2) The shadow that grew over Calus in the same cutscene, making him increasingly more scared, and the fact that he wakes up afterwards as if it was a dream. It was either some form of time manipulation technique or the dialogue took place directly within Calus’ mind, or even something else
3) Calus’ mysterious unfinished line. Why was Calus dissatisfied with the Witness’ plan for the Universe as to start ranting about it?
4) The Witness refering to itself in plural, coupled with the smoke in the shape of vague faces, and the resonating voice that seems to suggest composite origin, think something like Ermac from Mortal Kombat universe.
5) In the final cutscene Withess delivered a full-on Schopenhauer style speech. The theme of pain and death and how the universe is bound to endlessly produce them seems to be central to it. But at the same time it says “we know pain”. And knowing pain is too a form of pain, perhaps in the most refined sense. According to Schopenhauer, knowledge is equal to sorrow. So, unless the Witness is an entity of special purely emotional non-physical origin and is not technically “alive”, its logic would apply to itself too. But we don’t have an explicit explaination of who exactly are these “we”, which I doubt will be revealed before end of final Lightfall season, beginning of Final Shape, or even end of Final Shape
maybe when the witness says we know pain he is referring to nezarec?
When nimbus said that the ghost is making the link, I immediately was shouting at Nimbus to go up and get it. Really weird how we had to resort to nearly killing it. I wish us losing was more of a calculated move rather than a last minute blunder. That probably would have made the loss feel like more of a loss for us players.
Additionally the loss also didn't feel like that much of a loss because it happens in a cutscene right after you BEAT the FINAL BOSS. What would have been good is a final mission where you can only lose.
weird we couldn't use strand to pull our ghost to us or anything...
I said this once and I’ll say it again, please read if you’d like to hear an interesting theory.
I think the being known as the “traveller” isn’t the actual giant space ball. The being is inside what we know as the traveller, a being like the witness is a being. How the witness is supposed to be the Winnower, the traveller and the being within it being the Gardener.
“Be free” the Witness has no desire to kill the traveller, the witness’ goals and morals are far above anything like that. This doesn’t answer much about what the veil is but I’m so surprised I don’t see more people thinking this. Whether the witness is the Winnower or just an agent of it, what better way to achieve complete finality than being rid of the traveller whom I’m assuming to be the Gardeners agent within the cosmos, and or they are some sort of aspect or fragment of those primordial beings. Why else would the witness need to “open” the traveller like we see at the end of the campaign, if not to find/take/destroy what is inside. Surely he would just destroy the traveller if the traveller if the traveller was the true being?
The witness says the traveller is suffers both fates, being a victim and a perpetrator, my theory being the traveller and or the being with it is the Gardener or some sort of representation of the Gardener. The Gardener creates and tends to all of life and existence, so when that life dies does that not make it a victim? And when that life who he brought into being and fails to keep alive doesn’t that now also make him a perpetrator? If we go back to witch queen “the game is over, there is no where left to run” this game obviously references the game of life and death played by the Gardener and the Winnower. The Gardener also fled the Winnower emphasis on why the traveller always runs away.
What I want to focus on is “pale heart” now I know everyone is assuming this to be the veil however the witness just made a portal that is seemingly entering the traveller, almost like he cut the traveller open… like a surgeon. The portal is directly in the middle of the traveller almost like where the heart would be. So what if “pale heart” was never referencing the veil but talking about the literal heart of the traveller. To expand on this theory as I said before, to achieve the final shape and to achieve perfect finality, the witness would need to be rid of the Gardener, and the best way to be rid of something like a primordial God is to kill it, what’s the best way to kill something? Rip it’s heart out. What if “pale heart” isn’t only referencing the being which is the gardener’s equivalent of the witness that is within traveller, but the literal heart of this said being itself. It’s heart, meaning it’s death, is the literal key to the final shape.
Savathun said “the traveller is not the last of its kind” I am assuming this means the veil, but I’m also assuming that it means more. The portal opened using the veil obviously has to go somewhere, there has to be something on the other side. I theorised that this is the Gardener, that the traveller is not a being but more of a vehicle, or possibly even a prison. What if on the other side of that portal there are more “travellers.” What if the traveller was never the first and was never meant to be the last. What if the witness has been hunting and destroying these travellers for millennia? That would certainly explain “infinite cruelty” the cruelty of having to constantly be pursued and hunted in the name of life and light.
The Witness also speaks of the universe as an entity, obviously being around as long as he has you’d come to understand how harsh it truly is. The universe gave life to the first beings the Gardener and the Winnower, could it be possible the witness/the Winnower is simply tired of playing to the universe’s whims? Don’t forget the Witness and the Traveller are two sides of the same coin, im sure the witness has no hate towards his opposite, which is why he tells it to “be free.” In his own way, which seems twisted to us but don’t forget the witness is above all our earthly morals. In his own way I believe the witness believes he is saving himself and his counterpart the traveller/Gardener.
Many may see this is as far fetched but if you really think about it, I don’t believe all this lore and mystery surrounding a character can be chalked down to “he is the bad guy so he wants to kill the good guy because that’s bad guy stuff” I believe he is trying to achieve his final shape but not for the simply reason of “bad guy wants to do bad things” I believe it is a much much deeper meaning than that.
A completely opposite theory is he isn’t addressing the traveller at all but his ships since they enter the portal. He is possibly freeing them from the clutches of the universe. I like this theory but it doesn’t make much sense as the Winnowers whole job is to cut down life. Unless the Witness never has and never was meant to be the Winnower. Unless the true Winnower is locked within the traveller. Back to my theory of the traveller being a vessel, what if it was never a vessel for the Gardener but a prison for the Winnower. I have so many conflicting theories my head hurts 😂
I’d love to know what other people think!
And where, might I ask, is the "EXPLAINED!" part? :D Love your unwavering optimism, Evade. Lightfall is an embarrassment on more levels than I can count. My faith in Bungie and Destiny has been profoundly shaken :( Very, very sad :( I'm still your fan, though :)
I’m so confused
Only started playing during beyond light so take it w a grain of salt but maybe the reason the campaign left me and a lot of others with so many unanswered questions was because although the witch queen campaign was phenomenal; it doomed the rest of the expansion to fall short in terms of development (at least that’s what it seemed to feel like to me). To remedy this, this expansion they left a lot of question marks to answer in the upcoming year to keep the seasonal content interesting/relevant? If so, good move by Bungie IMO.
But we did see the Witness control a ghost earlier in the campaign...right at the start in one of the ships. When he sliced the ghost and Guardian inside into pieces. As the Witness turned his head, the ghost mimicked the movement to look at the Guardian, which is when the Witness struck.
I keep thinking about the "three in one" concept that seems to be at the very base of the game.
I feel like the Traveler represents our body, the Witness is our mind, the Veil is soul? IDK.
I really think it's got something to do with Sophia and the Demiurge from Gnostic faith.
I also believe that we will be entering the Veil at the end. I expect us to have to kill our Ghost, and replace it w a Pouka. This would work w the way Poukas empathically bond w a subject, and also that our"Powers" Never came from the Traveler, but they are expressions of our self...l light us manipulating the energies of creation while the dark empowers our minds... perhaps by entering the Veil we learn to free ourselves from our limitations and we will awaken fully.
I also feel like our last darkness power will be based upon defiance, opposition, or rage... A purple(or black) flame/shadow that will erupt out of us.
I think when Zavala and ikora say the traveller is “gone” I think they are just talking about it being gone from the last city, remember those who didn’t play season of the seraph aren’t aware of the traveller leaving so they need to include dialogue for those who don’t know, they need to make the expansion make some sense for those who may be new lights or simply don’t know what happened last season just like the expansion story doesn’t makes it seem like our player played through last season even if we did
If the witness controls the darkness and the pyramids a than there most be someone who controls the light and the traveler, and if one of savathun’s truths was that there are more of the traveler or that there was more of the traveler than that would mirror the witness with there being an entity that controls the light and the traveler’s ( if there were more of it). Also the entity that controls the traveler could be the veiled woman from the statues we find in some of the pyramids, if so than the the person the witness was talking to and telling it to be free could be the veiled woman, maybe the witness has been hunting down every traveler ( if there were more ) to find in which one the veiled woman was in to created the final shape.
Do love the detail when you're asked to kill your ghost you pull out the Kvostov the first gun you get when your ghost revives you
I believe the witness is the travelers twin. I believe that inside the traveler is another being of the same form as the witness but opposite. I believe they are the twin children of some ultimate entity.
i want to hear your thoughts on those 3 wall images where rohan died
After completing campain i thing Traveler is like a vex( creator of vex?) And witness is a last (true)organic vex. Specialty i thing about that after hearing caiatel last word after campain that she will help us fight (mechanical) witness when he will go out, but this theory have many holes
I highly doubt the Traveler is truly dead dead. Because if it is, shouldn't we have lost our Light subclasses?
When I think of this and hear me out, when we do that strike the person starting nightmares talks about a prison holding him and he will soon escape I feel like whoever that person is was trapped in the veil and the witness is just a servant to a true king of darkness and the veil is just the key and the traveler is the prison
No it's Nezerac
Good theory crafting there. If you ever take a writing course for epics or follow authors like David Eddings, Piers Anthony, Terry Goodkind, or some other more famous authors, You will find they never let loose or let you know the Real villian until the end. You hear about it, you know it's there but you never get to "know it" mainly because they are more evil if left to your imagination.
@@wolfmcsnipes4192 and what if it is not I'd like you to come to this post when the raid is live and the final boss is shown during the raid if Nezerac is the raid boss and was there the entire time then who is in the prison?
@@MrMinster228 it's been data mined
@@wolfmcsnipes4192 see now that is just cheating
The closing discussions with zavala and ikora seemed so disconnected from the situation. "So the traveler is gone but hey its just another monday"
The traveller with the pyramid round it looks like a ghost. So maybe the traveller is trying to "resurrect" something that the traveller is connected, similiar to our ghost.
Think of the campaign as a four part play. This was just act one. Act two will be in season 21, act 3 in 22, and the final act in 24 before "The Final Shape" expansion. I personally enjoyed what's been released so far and would have been dissapointed if they gave everything in one shot. Knowing there is a year between expansions (currently) it is better to release a contueation of content for the main story in each new season. There is still so much more to discover after you finish the main story. I for one am looking forward to finding all the secrets Neomuna has to offer.