Palpatine did consider the Vong to be a threat but not for the reasons you mentioned. Palpatine considered them to be threat because he wanted absolute power without anyone challenging him and the Vong could possibly be in his way. Palpatine didn't make the Empire for the greater good and the Vong simply was in his way.
Your right about obi and Anakin but I did love how palaptines pet project (Anakin) he was soooo worried about. He personally got him out of there. Watch your career with great interest indeed.
Great review Meg! This is one of the few Zahn stories I still need to read, and it sounds like a treat. I think you're on the right track in regards to the Ethical Ramifications point, but (and I say this having not read the NJO itself - only Wookieepedia and preceding novels) my conclusion has always been that clearly the Empire wouldn't have been effective against the Vong anyway since the Rebels managed to overcome Paplatine's machinations and free the galaxy. Good was proved stronger, and that's what faced the Vong =) Thrawn definitely held the opinion that the Empire was the better defence against this future threat, but that was only his perspective. To be fair, an Empire under Thrawn might've been more effective in some ways than the New Republic; but I don't think this implication changes anything about Paplatine's Empire (you can imagine him sacrificing dozens of worlds, or people throughout the Empire destroying themselves with petty squabbles like always). So while the villains of Star Wars would agree that, yes, the Rebels messed everything up, I think the bigger picture means that the right people were in the right places when the time came. That's long been my take on it, anyway!
I looked up thrass fanfics and saw them associated with Vanto from the newcanon so I looked up Newcanon Thrass wondering if he at least got a happy ending there. Nope, died basically the same way eith an unnamed Jinzler analog.
Along with Timothy Zahn, 2 of my favorite writers of star wars novels are Drew Karpyshyn & Karen Traviss. Have you read and enjoyed any books by these two?
I very much like the idea that Palpatine would use outside threats as a way to get those who would otherwise doubt him on his side. And it's not like he was ever going to *share* the galaxy with thr Vong
Oh cool I read this one not long ago and I also recently read Plaguieus for the first time. I enjoyed outbound but I do see what you mean about Ben and Anakin. I always feel bad for Lorana too. I can't say I enjoyed the next book. Pretty much hated everyone in it but then again I was supposed to I think.
I think it's very interesting how much of thrawns backstory here seems to be copied and expanded in the new ascendancy trilogy. After finishing all 6 disney thrawn books I'm working through all of his original EU appearances, so I'll have to add this one to my list!
And it's absolutely great to me that through the Batman era silly after silly super weapon gets beat by our HEROES. THEY unknowingly didn't cause the Vong war but made it significantly harder
I really enjoyed this book and your review Meg. I also think this is my favourite Zahn book in terms of his writing style. The Cocked eyebrows and twitching lips that he often puts in are definitely toned down in this book. It's great you're reading Darth Plauges Meg but if you wanted you could've just watched Robot Chickens Palpatine narrated backstory episode, tells his story right there 😉 As for Thrawn being Zahn favourite character, is it Thrawn or Mara ?. In Choices of One Luke literally stops and stares at Mara's awesomeness at one point, it's giggle worthy Also Meg you don't need to put on a gigantic Black Hood and Cape when reviewing DP, if only because I'm not sure anyone will be able to see you 😉
“You could always join Maris and me for the language lessons. Commander Thrawn really is decent company.” “No thanks. You two want to aid and abet a potential enemy, be my guests. Not me.” “These people are not potential enemies, as you’d realize if you’d made any effort to get to know them. They’re very polite and extremely civilized.” “Yeah, well, the Hutts have a civilization, too, or so they say. Sorry, but it’ll take more than good manners to convince me the Chiss are harmless.” -Jorj Car’das, Dubrak Qennto & Maris Ferasi, on the Chiss
Sorta! The third novel of Ascendency says that basically Lorena and Thrass have an extremely similar adventure. When I saw him a few weeks ago at a con, Zahn said that the Obi Wan and Anakin stuff didn't happen, though.
Thrawn making Doriana an idiot who worked closely with Palpatine and Sidious withiut realizing they were thr same person seemed like thr funniest way to walk back how much of a Gary Stu he was described as by Fel in the Hand Duology. "Vader AND Mara/other hands, and Thrawn AND Sate Pestage all rolled into one" was ridiculous, so he swung to the other end and made him a bit of a dummy.
I finally read this one, and I liked the Thrawn stuff a lot. However, as to your issues with Palpatine and Thrawn knowing about the "far outsiders": if Thrawn is so reasonable and he knew they were going to invade, why did he not propose an empire/new republic alliance once he was in charge during the Thrawn trilogy? Obviously it's just because the yuuzhan vong weren't conceived back then, but this one detail seems to create that inconsistency.
Later stuff has shown that Thrawn's Empire was far from united. The ruling council had grudgingly accepted him, the Ciutric Hegemony and Pentastat alignment had even more grudgingly half-accepted him, only providing bare minimums/noninterference. And almost every major world kept huge portions of the navy playing defensive, leaving Thrawn like 6-24 ISDs plus support ships before he found the Katana Fleet. There is absolutely no way they would accept dome jumped up Alien coming in and demanding they make peace with the Rebels. Pellaeon took ages to convince a far smaller, far weaker empire in Hand of Thrawn Duology to throw in the towel. Thrawn proposing the same when they were "Almost evenly gunned" according to Han would have just had him killed or driven out.
Cbaoth is the best example of the arrogance that can befall the Jedi. The Force and the role as "Guardians" of the Republic made Cbaoth be the arrogant man he was. He knows better than you. He will save you from yourself for your own good. You are not important, the Force chose me, how dare the peasants question me! It reminds me of a Kyp had he not been stopped by Han and Luke. The arrogant self righteousness to stop the Empire and Vong by himself.
The Vong hypothesis for Palpatine doing what he did was always garbage. People who love it cling to it hard though. The entire reason why it makes things weird and murky etc. is because it's junk in itself.
Palpatine did not make the Empire as a plan to contest the Vong, he made plans to contest the Vong to ensure he could make and keep his Empire.
Palpatine did consider the Vong to be a threat but not for the reasons you mentioned. Palpatine considered them to be threat because he wanted absolute power without anyone challenging him and the Vong could possibly be in his way. Palpatine didn't make the Empire for the greater good and the Vong simply was in his way.
That make up is dedication! I love it!
Good review as always Meg!
Palpatine was a small factor about the Vong. But his main thing is power. I see nothing wrong with a small part of it being the Vong is fine
My take on the Sidious/Vong issue is that it wasn't a major motivation for him, but it was probably how he motivated Doriana to work for him.
Your right about obi and Anakin but I did love how palaptines pet project (Anakin) he was soooo worried about. He personally got him out of there. Watch your career with great interest indeed.
Great review Meg! This is one of the few Zahn stories I still need to read, and it sounds like a treat. I think you're on the right track in regards to the Ethical Ramifications point, but (and I say this having not read the NJO itself - only Wookieepedia and preceding novels) my conclusion has always been that clearly the Empire wouldn't have been effective against the Vong anyway since the Rebels managed to overcome Paplatine's machinations and free the galaxy. Good was proved stronger, and that's what faced the Vong =)
Thrawn definitely held the opinion that the Empire was the better defence against this future threat, but that was only his perspective. To be fair, an Empire under Thrawn might've been more effective in some ways than the New Republic; but I don't think this implication changes anything about Paplatine's Empire (you can imagine him sacrificing dozens of worlds, or people throughout the Empire destroying themselves with petty squabbles like always). So while the villains of Star Wars would agree that, yes, the Rebels messed everything up, I think the bigger picture means that the right people were in the right places when the time came.
That's long been my take on it, anyway!
I will be super interested in your thoughts on Darth Plaguieus. I don't like it very much myself, but it is very interesting for sure!
I am disappoint. Someone asked me if I was dumb, and I was excited to answer "no!"
I love your channel. I don't have many people i can talk about star wars novels with
I looked up thrass fanfics and saw them associated with Vanto from the newcanon so I looked up Newcanon Thrass wondering if he at least got a happy ending there. Nope, died basically the same way eith an unnamed Jinzler analog.
Zahn is cruel like that
woah, when you sat down, I was NOT ready for that Chiss cosplay. :)
Kinman was in the Zahn shoet stoey about the Spaarti cyliners
Along with Timothy Zahn, 2 of my favorite writers of star wars novels are Drew Karpyshyn & Karen Traviss. Have you read and enjoyed any books by these two?
I very much like the idea that Palpatine would use outside threats as a way to get those who would otherwise doubt him on his side. And it's not like he was ever going to *share* the galaxy with thr Vong
Great review!
I absolutely loved "Outbound Flight" even though we all knew how it was going to end.
Oh cool I read this one not long ago and I also recently read Plaguieus for the first time. I enjoyed outbound but I do see what you mean about Ben and Anakin. I always feel bad for Lorana too. I can't say I enjoyed the next book. Pretty much hated everyone in it but then again I was supposed to I think.
I think it's very interesting how much of thrawns backstory here seems to be copied and expanded in the new ascendancy trilogy. After finishing all 6 disney thrawn books I'm working through all of his original EU appearances, so I'll have to add this one to my list!
And it's absolutely great to me that through the Batman era silly after silly super weapon gets beat by our HEROES. THEY unknowingly didn't cause the Vong war but made it significantly harder
I really enjoyed this book and your review Meg. I also think this is my favourite Zahn book in terms of his writing style. The Cocked eyebrows and twitching lips that he often puts in are definitely toned down in this book.
It's great you're reading Darth Plauges Meg but if you wanted you could've just watched Robot Chickens Palpatine narrated backstory episode, tells his story right there 😉
As for Thrawn being Zahn favourite character, is it Thrawn or Mara ?. In Choices of One Luke literally stops and stares at Mara's awesomeness at one point, it's giggle worthy
Also Meg you don't need to put on a gigantic Black Hood and Cape when reviewing DP, if only because I'm not sure anyone will be able to see you 😉
“You could always join Maris and me for the language lessons. Commander Thrawn really is decent company.”
“No thanks. You two want to aid and abet a potential enemy, be my guests. Not me.”
“These people are not potential enemies, as you’d realize if you’d made any effort to get to know them. They’re very polite and extremely civilized.”
“Yeah, well, the Hutts have a civilization, too, or so they say. Sorry, but it’ll take more than good manners to convince me the Chiss are harmless.”
-Jorj Car’das, Dubrak Qennto & Maris Ferasi, on the Chiss
Blue dabu dee dabu da
I haven't read Ascendency, but I have heard it's great. Does Outbound Flight happen in Disney Canon?
No.
Sorta! The third novel of Ascendency says that basically Lorena and Thrass have an extremely similar adventure. When I saw him a few weeks ago at a con, Zahn said that the Obi Wan and Anakin stuff didn't happen, though.
Oooooooooh boy. Back for Zahn
Thrawn making Doriana an idiot who worked closely with Palpatine and Sidious withiut realizing they were thr same person seemed like thr funniest way to walk back how much of a Gary Stu he was described as by Fel in the Hand Duology. "Vader AND Mara/other hands, and Thrawn AND Sate Pestage all rolled into one" was ridiculous, so he swung to the other end and made him a bit of a dummy.
One of my favourites, credit to that outfit 👌
I finally read this one, and I liked the Thrawn stuff a lot. However, as to your issues with Palpatine and Thrawn knowing about the "far outsiders": if Thrawn is so reasonable and he knew they were going to invade, why did he not propose an empire/new republic alliance once he was in charge during the Thrawn trilogy?
Obviously it's just because the yuuzhan vong weren't conceived back then, but this one detail seems to create that inconsistency.
Later stuff has shown that Thrawn's Empire was far from united. The ruling council had grudgingly accepted him, the Ciutric Hegemony and Pentastat alignment had even more grudgingly half-accepted him, only providing bare minimums/noninterference. And almost every major world kept huge portions of the navy playing defensive, leaving Thrawn like 6-24 ISDs plus support ships before he found the Katana Fleet. There is absolutely no way they would accept dome jumped up Alien coming in and demanding they make peace with the Rebels. Pellaeon took ages to convince a far smaller, far weaker empire in Hand of Thrawn Duology to throw in the towel. Thrawn proposing the same when they were "Almost evenly gunned" according to Han would have just had him killed or driven out.
I think Sate Pestage knew.
I liked this book but it felt too long as I read it along side the shorter prequel books
Good on ya for covering thrawn, expanded universe and not the Disney fuster-cluck that they call Star Wars. Rip Mara
22:16 the empire did nothing wrong lol
Cbaoth is the best example of the arrogance that can befall the Jedi. The Force and the role as "Guardians" of the Republic made Cbaoth be the arrogant man he was. He knows better than you. He will save you from yourself for your own good. You are not important, the Force chose me, how dare the peasants question me!
It reminds me of a Kyp had he not been stopped by Han and Luke. The arrogant self righteousness to stop the Empire and Vong by himself.
You look beautiful in blue.
The Vong hypothesis for Palpatine doing what he did was always garbage. People who love it cling to it hard though. The entire reason why it makes things weird and murky etc. is because it's junk in itself.