Did you know Persona 5 is based on Jungian psychology? Learn about the symbolism behinds the masks and major arcana! PLUS: Don't miss the limited edition Gamevolution shirt from this episode! Only available until July 13: store.dftba.com/products/limited-edition-gamevolution-shirt
id say all or atlest most of them do take quite alot of jungian psychology to heart, the 4th game delves alot more into the shadow then enything els, what i like about persona 5 is that its asentely forced theripy for all the targets :) id love to se what jordan b peterson wod say about it after playing it. ed: 2:07 lost opertunety to mention kanji :)
It is wrong to say that only Persona 5 is based on it as actually the entire series is. Persona 3 was about facing death in one way or another and Persona 4 about the Persona you present outwards and the extension of how others see it, but overall Jungian psychology is always a mayor theme.
A minor correction and addendum to the Tarot bit: You don't need to have a matching Persona equipped, you just need to have it with you. While this is a small difference I think it opens up a different interpretation than the one you proposed: The Protagonist doesn't need to change himself to match the Confidant he's interacting with, but carrying with him a Persona matching the person he's talking to grants him a better understanding of them, making it easier to help the Confidant work through their issues and reach their goals, the entire point of the Confidant storylines.
The two don't have to be mutually exclusive though. I noticed that the protagonist in 3,4 and 5 tend to condition their responses differently depending on the person they're talking to (like the kind of approach that works on Majima wouldn't work on Ann for example). The better understanding you have of someone, the more accurately you can fashion a 'right' response.
Small Leviathan. Dont agree because in previous games you had to equip it, but it was annoying, you dont having to equip it is just a gameplay changed to make the game less anoyinh
I'm pretty late here... But I figured the removal of the mask was actually symbolic. Imagine the example with the main character summoning his persona Arsene for the first time. He's essentially convicted for a crime he didn't commit by "shitty adults" and sent to Tokyo to basically start anew for the year. He's treated like trash by the people around him, until he finally runs into someone who'll actually give him the time of day... Ryuji. Of course, they end up in Kamoshida's castle where they're captured and sentenced to death. It's here that Arsene speaks to him, asking him if his attempt at saving that woman back at his hometown was really a waste and if he is truly sick of what he's seeing before him and desires to fight back. He's given a choice, watch Ryuji die or fight back. When the mask appears, he's not ripping off the mask to summon Arsene... He's forcefully removing his complacent persona to reveal the rage and rebellion he feels in his heart. The blood that we see is also symbolic, showing that this kind of change so suddenly is painful... But his smile shows that being true to yourself is worth it.
The Kentucky Gamer That's a beautiful answer! Especially with the smirk he gives off even with blood all around his face, I knew that symbolized satisfaction.
I think that the mask being ripped off represents the separation of the true person and their persona. In the gameplay, if you rip off your mask, the persona and the person becomes different entities.
Exactly, the Jungian Persona is the mask we wear to 'fit in' with society. When we rebel, when we fight back, we rip off the mask of 'complacent member of society' and reveal our TRUE face, that of the Trickster, the One Who Breaks Society's Rules.
I knew about Jungian psychology before this game, and I always thought the characters rip off their Personas to show that they can be their true selves without the mask.
Further, I think it has to do with realizing that they ARE wearing a mask, and that the power of persona has to do with wielding that balance of private self and public appearance rather than allowing oneself to believe that the public appearance IS the private self. Likewise, unless I'm missing something, the mask removal only occurs the first time they summon their persona- when they awaken to the awareness of the mask and step outside of its limitations for the first time.
Dharengo yea I was kinda surprised he missed that with how in depth the rest of the video was, also not noting that the velvet room is also a form of the consciousness literally the place you draw out the symbols and myths of society
Did you know, in-game, why most Shadow's taking the form of Mythological Creatures is because Shadow's in nature, are manufactured by humans and the easiest way they can manifest themselves is in the form of what humans subconsciously know of folklore.
It is the explanation they give in the game. It is explicitly stated in Persona 5 that Shadows take on the visages of mythological figures/creatures because that's how the human mind perceives their concept.
Pretty sure that's just an excuse for them to write the demon negotiation back into Persona. It's definitely the reason that the personas in all the previous games were mythological figures, but the shadows didn't used to be.
It's merely mentioned though by Justine and Caroline and the line does require you to 'search' for it. Most players never use the toilet in the Velvet Room Cell.
I actually skipped Personas 3 and 4 (Ok, I know, I should totally play them), so I dont really know what you mean by Shadows in past games... but I always understood that's what the demons always were in the PS1 games. I actually thought they took form of those figures and creatures because everything in those games were created by people's subconscious.
The characters in P5 don't have the spirit of rebellion, they are the spirit of rebellion. Tearing off their nice to the public mask to reveal their inner rebel.
Mr. Edogawa explained it in Persona 3 as well when our characters went to summer school. I was really interested in that particular lecture so it sticks with me even now.
I believe that they chose to make your Persona summoning ripping off a mask due to the whole theme of the game. Since it's all about rebellion and fighting against society, it makes sense for them to summon their Persona the opposite way you would think, like the rebels they are.
The ripping off the mask actually makes a great deal of sense. The persona for the main characters is their true feelings they bury , the actualization of their true self. By ripping off the mask, they accept their true unconscious self and it manifests as a persona. This is why Persona users can't have shadows, as Morgana stated. It also really plays on the word Persona/Mask and it was a great design choice.
They rip off their masks because the persona themselves (The creatures) are the masks, which then take their true forms. It's not rocket science, c'mon.
@@DakarTwelve But the physical act is also a symbolic one, much the same way that holding your hands together is symbolic of prayer. In fact, the areas that the characters can summon their Persona are symbolism made physical.
Sato it's from polygon's "Monster Factory" videos, where Griffin and Justin McElroy play games that have character customization and just try to make, well, monstrous people with it lol. The Final Pam is from their Fallout 4 series
The Final Pam is the metric by which the world is judged and the judge. The Final Pam is the Pam which death forgot. She's the main character of Polygon's monster factory Fallout 4 videos.
being a long time persona fan it inspired me to literally dive into psychology, tarotology, and cognitive science, so i'm actually really happy everyone else is now finally getting on board the jung train. i will say though that playing persona 4 felt like it handled the idea of the shadow and anima/animus really well and better than persona 5
Slightly annoyed that they didn't even mention the past Persona games even in passing. They're all dealt with Jungian psychology from the start and I'd argue that P4 does a slightly better job of expressing its ideas. P4 even has a segment where one character sits the group down and explains to them what Jungian psychology, explicitly name dropping it, is all about and how it relates to what they're going through.
One of the exra channel things in P4 Golden, with the classroom and teacher from P3, has a lot of lectures about Jungian psychology, which was a great move I thought.
All games deal with jungian philosophy and psychology differently and address them in their own terms. Persona 5 seems more interested in perception while P4 focuses on the self discovery and therapeutic ideas of it and P3 dives into the effect facing death and instrospectionnhas in people's character. Each of those are valid ways to appriach Jung, and yeah, it is kinda sad EC isolated their commentary in the latest and hottest issue of the franchise
Extra Credits isn't supposed to be hour-long explorations of the themes of video games, though. They're designed to be short videos on game design, which in this case specifically is the intersection of psychology and games. The most retrospective of the series they'd have done is a throw away line about how all the Persona games include references to Jung.
Petition to have them reupload the video with the only change being having a picture of "The World" from Jojo's at 5:09 instead of a drawing of the actual world
The ripping off the mask to summon your Persona makes complete sense with the ideas set by Jungian psychology. Because the monster that is your Persona in the game literally is the mask on your face as shown by when you get new ones. So when you rip off the mask you are hiding behind you let it form it's true shape and if you notice they always cover their face when they summon in order to still hide their face while their mask is out fighting for them.
Yes. I think it has to do with being aware of it being a mask what unleashes the Persona. You are still using it, not showing your raw self,but you are recognizing and stating that this mask isn't you
When each of the main characters first gains their persona by removing their mask, I also saw it as symbolism for them abandoning the role society had given them and rebelling by choosing their own path in life.
I like to think that Joker having the "Wild Card" power, which allows him to use multiple different personas, is also a reference to the fact that his character is that of a blank canvas, taking on the personality, or persona, that the player exhibits while playing the game
I think the ripping off the mask to summon their persona is symbolic of how painful and difficult it can be for someone to discover/embrace/reveal who they really are. Even blood is shown when each character first takes off their mask.
I had to correct the use of the Collective Unconscious. In the Persona series, the collective unconscious is represented by the velvet room, hence why it's there you could summon demons, angels and gods from various mythologies and religions. It is the literal embodiment of the collective unconscious, the sum total of all symbolism in order to understand the natural world and phenomena around us. Also, it's quite explicitly stated when you summon some Personas, they mention something along the lines of "I come for the sea of thy heart", a metaphor for the collective unconscious. So yeah, I don't think mementos was a appropriate example in this case.
hibye201 Morgana when talking about Mementos: "Think of it as the collective unconscious". Not saying what you said is wrong, just that Morgana literally calls it the collective unconscious.
hibye201 Well, I think both the Velvet Room and Mementos could be considered representations of the collective unconscious. I'm fairly certain that they say in the game that Mementos symbolizes the collecrive unconscious.
COME ON DOWN TO SPOILER TOWN . . . . . . Aaaaand that's why the Velvet Room is INSIDE Mementos, locked away. Because they're both representations of the Collective Unconscious. It's just that the Big Bad has more control over one than the other. The Velvet Room represents the bedrock aspects, the universal immutable symbols at the deepest part of the psyche, while Mementos starts off much more surface-level and thus is susceptible to change. And, this is why you need to become more well-known as the game goes on to access deeper and deeper aspects of Mementos; because you need to *become* a universal symbol recognized by the world, for good or for ill, to be a part of those immutable universal symbols at the bottom.
I think Persona devs think of it as a realm of shadows inaccessible by humans that represents the collective will of society, and that it takes shape an keeps resurfacing in many forms.
as Persona 5 often says: it's all in the cognition (of the beholder) as, for people who played Persona before watching Jojo, JJBA is a Persona reference. (except for Parts 1/2, as those had no Standsonas)
JoJo Part 3 came out in the 80’s, Persona has always taken heavy influence from JoJo as a whole, that's never been a secret, well maybe outside of Japan it was since nobody ever read JoJo until the Anime came out. I’m actually pretty sure the first JoJo video game on the PS1 is older than the first Persona game!
In regards to personas and masks, I always interpreted it as the characters persona being their true self, and by ripping off the masks they wear to fit in with society, they're drawing strength from that true self rather than society's perception of them.
That plus the Palaces are the 7 deadly sins: 1. Lust 2. Envy (or vanity) 3. Gluttony 4. Wrath 5. Greed 6. Vanity (or envy) 7. Pride 8. Sloth Correct me if I am wrong
5:48 In addition, if you pick the answers that best fit what they want to hear, they will like you more. For the elementary school gamer, telling him he's right even if you think he's being bratty. For the ex-yakuza, hearing that you have ulterior motives aloud immediately relieves him of the tension he's used to feeling. Plus, what they want to hear changes over the course of your link. The star shogi player initially enjoys you as a flirt, but prefers you start helping her advance her career midway through.
Parallels also exist between the Major Arcana and storytelling. You start your journey as The Fool, and you progress towards The World where a resolution to the main arc is made apparent. It is even covered by Campbell, who saw the Major Arcana as representing the stages of life as the individual learned more about themselves and were affected by life's challenges.
I think the reason behind tearing their masks off so violently can describe the effect of different hardships in life affecting who you are. So much to the fact that when everything changes dramatically you must find yourself going through mask to mask to be able to overcome what comes at you.
Actually, the Tarot connections and inspirations run much deeper than that. Every Confidant starts with their life being in the upside down position of their arcana; But as you progress through the stories you help them change for the better and get their life in the upright position. Like for example Ryuji's Arcana, The Chariot, in it's upside down position means Aggression and being lost in life. Or Ann's, The Lover, Means not knowing what to do and chasing after the wrong things.
"The difference between a smart and wise person is this: a smart person knows a tomato is a fruit, however the wise does not put it in their fruit salad." - a sorta edited quote some from probably famous dude
The best I heard it put was this: A smart person knows Galaxy Quest is not a Star Trek movie. A wise person knows Galaxy Quest is /the best/ Star Trek movie.
I've seen it expounded entirely with D&D stats. Strength - Crushing a tomato Dexterity - Dodging a thrown tomato Constitution - Eating a bad tomato and not getting sick Intelligence - Knowing a tomato is a fruit Wisdom - Knowing not to put tomato in a fruit salad Charisma - The ability to sell someone a tomato-based fruit salad. I also saw a Tumblr post where someone followed that up with "But isn't a tomato-based fruit salad just a salsa?"
Is a salsa (or pico de gallo) a fruit salad? Also, for legal and taxation purposes in the USA, tomatoes are vegetables. There literally were court cases about it, because some guy importing tomatoes tried to classify them as fruit to get better tax rates and avoid regulations.
It's funny, but growing up with Aspberger's, I didn't really understand the idea of a persona until it was explicitly spelled out for me, well into high school. In other words, I literally acted like the same person, regardless of context or setting, no mask. I still don't really have that firm a grasp on the concept, and have to make a conscious effort to "put on a mask" and it's usually only marginally effective. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I wonder how Jung would have reacted to Asperger's. Because for the most part, there's some validity in a lot of his stuff, not entirely, but somebody with Asperger's is almost completely outside that realm, it's like... You've effectively kind of bypassed Personas as a whole, because you're you and why would you ever want to be anything but you, you like you just fine. Archetypes, sure, you probably fall into one, sort of. One could argue, using his own terminology, than somebody with Asperger's is more-or-less disconnected from the collective unconsciousness, or rather... Has their own, which renders interaction with others feeling... Alien.
charcharmunr Yeah, archetypes I'm pretty sure are still valid. I think I've always felt like "the fool" (65% Shakespeare's version and 35% the Tarot version) or somewhere in that ballpark- not really cognizant of a lot of obvious things but despite and/or because of that, that still able to more easily see things from an uncommon but useful perspective. Also somewhat prone to accidentally ending up in unfavorable situations (from my perspective at least) due to said lack of cognizance yet generally avoiding the consequences I think are coming and avoiding becoming jaded as a result (from my perspective at least). And even as a kid I feel like I would have understood archetypes, at least as much as any other kid. Sorry for the long, self-indulgent reply. I just appreciated the feedback and I don't think thumbs up show the people who do them anymore.
spindash64 I have Aspergers and I can confirm that the shadow is still there, it just makes it harder to create a persona. (I had to manually learn through intensive therapy and phychiactric help.)
I didn't see this coming, but it's nice to see you do some Persona 5 videos. Also, the arcana of the P5 protagonist (or Ren, his canon name) is Fool, not Trickster. Also, Loki is a Persona in the series, as are Thor & Odin.
His arcana is the fool. However in game, everyone calls him the Trickster. play the game and you will see. When it comes to fate, Akira is called "the fool" but when it comes to him specifically, he is referred to as "the Trickster"
Actually, Akira can be both Trickster and Fool because Tarot. The fool represents the beginning of a journey which will change the very nature of the fool embarking upon it. He was the fool when he got sent to Tokyo on parole, forced on a journey which will inevitably change him. without his consent. This injustice sets him on the path of the trickster as well, as he will rebel against corruption with incredibly questionable methods. And the big thing that allows him to be represented by two tarrots is the fact that the fool and the trickster share the position as the first card in different iterations of the tarot deck. The French deck, used in P5, has the Pierrot, or the jester arcana instead of the fool, which represents both the Fool and the Trickster. Without spoiling anything, Atlus actually used both the Fool and the Jester as seperate Arcana and Social Links in P4 Golden, with the Jester representing the Trickster, so there is precedent for my assumption of P5's use of the French deck. Also, sorry for the info dump, or if I came off as a pretentious ass, I just really like this series.
IS THAT A MOTHERFUCKING JOJO REFERENCE LOLLLLLOL MUDAMUDAMUDA WRYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
Wonderful analysis as usual. I thought Get Even similarly and deftly portrayed the human condition, albeit in a way that completely turns story roles and exploration scenarios on their heads with its theme of identity and looping narrative. It's one thing to contextualize the environment and in-game action, it's another to do the same thing for the actual systems and mechanics governing the virtual space and gameplay rules.
I love the video's you do on psychology/philosophy although being an avid tolken fan I have to point out using odin and Gandolf as separate examples is redundant because the character of Gandolf is heavily influenced by Odin to the point of arguably being based off him. A small nitpick I know so keep making awesome videos!
One little tiny, tiny nitpick I have:If they have a palace, you are not wrong about their wrongdoings, Because the palace is their wrongdoings and distorted desires in a physical manifestation.
Yes! I just finished the video and was looking for someone to comment that. That's the first thing my mind went to when I heard those words. What's your opinion on S3 coming out?
basically, a place where humanity shares their ideas. The main reason why some ancient gods are quite similar, as well as some folklore, like monsters, stories, etc.
I kinda feel the need to question why this topic isn't discussed back when P3 or P4 came out. Is it simply because P5 is that much more hyped thanks to the popularity built up by P3 and P4 themselves?
Pretty much. Persona 5 is the most accessible of the installments, so a lot of people who have never played Persona just got into it with 5. So expect to see a lot of vids jumping on the hype train now, than when Persona was more niche.
I just want to say, I drifted off at around 3:30 when you were talking about the old man and all of a sudden started thinking about the hermit from tarot and how it might be cool to bring in aspects from tarot to help tell a story, maybe by capitalizing on certain character traits to help further the hero's journey . . . and then you started talking about it. I don't know why, but it always excites me when I come up with independent thoughts and then see those thoughts reflected back at me by someone else. Which in writing this I realize, maybe that's what the developer was getting at in that character link system from "Persona 5" that you talked about later in the video (I couldn't say because I haven't played "Persona 5", but it makes me really want to play it now). I don't know why, but this video made me really happy, so thanks.
5:40 This is actually a key technique in building an instant rapport with someone, if you wish to get closer to them. Matching someones general personality, from your tone of voice to your facial expressions, and even to your posture, will cause them to be naturally drawn to you. The mind will see it as familiar, therefore safe.
Not sure if it's been stated, but the reason why the cast in P5 rip off masks to call forth their Personas is because (obviously) the mask is the Persona. By removing the mask, they are releasing the Persona. That's why when they do so, they cover their face. Their face is their true self, which is also why it's dark and hard to see the features.
Oh dear. I can't help laughing. 1:04 I don't think you guys really thought through a guy putting on a white head cover so that he could hang out with a black guy.
Nah, look at the original North American release of Persona 2 (only the second half,) which inexplicably turned a Japanese teenager into a stereotypical African-American because... Well, look at Atlus' localization reputation. They've been getting flak for P5, it's 2017 and they've got no more excuses because they used them all up on putting a Japanese kid in blackface in the 90s.
I learned about Jung through Jordan Peterson's podcast/videos, and I think this video did a great job of unpacking the super super dense info surrounding Jung's mind theory. Prof. Peterson is absolutely brilliant but I, as a layman, have a lot of trouble following exactly what he means a lot of the time. So thanks EC!
Here's an easy symbolic way to view summoning personas by removing masks. The mask resembles the persona you are wearing, by removing it from yourself and casting it aside you summon the persona's form outside of your body.
"Clean your room." *Cleans room* "Fix the situation with your family." *Maxes confidant with Sojiro and Futaba* "Do good in the broader community." *Forms genuine relationships with influential people through Shujin and Shibuya* "There 'ya go, bucko! Now, go on and slay the dragon of chaos."
I'm pretty sure That all persona games are based on that because in every persona game they say that the persona is a mask you use to protect yourself from hardships but this game really touches on that with the actual mask
I will never stop praising the amount of polish and finely tuned and thought out symbolism this game presented. Oh my fucking god. 100 hours. It made me start researching about life again. What a game.
The "Mr. Edogawa's TV Classroom" in the TV Listings menu of Persona 4: Golden also talks about Jungian psychology too if anyone has that and wants to know more. They slowly unlock as your play through it so they won't all be there in the beginning but P4G's a really good game too so it kinda like a bonus for players that're interested in the subject. There 10 in all so there's quite a bit there. If you're a Persona 3 fan you also get to see Mr. Edogawa being Mr. Edogawa, which is always... fun? I think?
Hmm, could you guys maybe do once a episode about how to properly do subtle hints? Like how to push an idea on the player, without them knowing, and getting them theorizing. Like, how to properly have a character with a split personality, but then how to properly push the player a bit in the right direction of theorizing, and trying to find deeper lore?
You misconstrued a very important part early on. Persona is not defines by the monsters you summoned. Rather, the true power of the main characters is their removal of their personas. The power of these main characters' persona are those that are made manifest by *removing* their personas, which is why the removal of the mask is not odd, but perfect. The monsters that you summon elsewise are manifestations of other aspects of human consciousness. It is explained the reason why they take the form of gods and mythological creatures is because they are physical manifestations of traits to which humans would ascribe them. You, as the main character, are the only one who can access this human collective consciousness usually by some godlike intervention. Which you would have known had you really played the games...
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 76 | คู่เอก "ผึ้งหลวง vs สมิงดำ"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/9SBshmGQOIM/mqdefault.jpg)
Did you know Persona 5 is based on Jungian psychology? Learn about the symbolism behinds the masks and major arcana!
PLUS: Don't miss the limited edition Gamevolution shirt from this episode! Only available until July 13: store.dftba.com/products/limited-edition-gamevolution-shirt
I feel so much Junger now! it's amazing!
id say all or atlest most of them do take quite alot of jungian psychology to heart, the 4th game delves alot more into the shadow then enything els, what i like about persona 5 is that its asentely forced theripy for all the targets :) id love to se what jordan b peterson wod say about it after playing it.
ed: 2:07 lost opertunety to mention kanji :)
0utta S1TE but I had so much pun saying it.
It is wrong to say that only Persona 5 is based on it as actually the entire series is.
Persona 3 was about facing death in one way or another and Persona 4 about the Persona you present outwards and the extension of how others see it, but overall Jungian psychology is always a mayor theme.
Extra Credits I WANT MORE PERSONA 5
A minor correction and addendum to the Tarot bit: You don't need to have a matching Persona equipped, you just need to have it with you. While this is a small difference I think it opens up a different interpretation than the one you proposed: The Protagonist doesn't need to change himself to match the Confidant he's interacting with, but carrying with him a Persona matching the person he's talking to grants him a better understanding of them, making it easier to help the Confidant work through their issues and reach their goals, the entire point of the Confidant storylines.
Your comment should be more upvoted because that was exactly what I felt while playing.
Small Leviathan I somewhat agree but the lyrics of the song Beneath the Mask in Persona 5 seems to fit EC's interpretation.
The two don't have to be mutually exclusive though. I noticed that the protagonist in 3,4 and 5 tend to condition their responses differently depending on the person they're talking to (like the kind of approach that works on Majima wouldn't work on Ann for example). The better understanding you have of someone, the more accurately you can fashion a 'right' response.
Small Leviathan. Dont agree because in previous games you had to equip it, but it was annoying, you dont having to equip it is just a gameplay changed to make the game less anoyinh
Nope, I clearly remember only having the personae in 3/4 to get the boosts active.
I'm pretty late here... But I figured the removal of the mask was actually symbolic. Imagine the example with the main character summoning his persona Arsene for the first time. He's essentially convicted for a crime he didn't commit by "shitty adults" and sent to Tokyo to basically start anew for the year. He's treated like trash by the people around him, until he finally runs into someone who'll actually give him the time of day... Ryuji. Of course, they end up in Kamoshida's castle where they're captured and sentenced to death. It's here that Arsene speaks to him, asking him if his attempt at saving that woman back at his hometown was really a waste and if he is truly sick of what he's seeing before him and desires to fight back. He's given a choice, watch Ryuji die or fight back. When the mask appears, he's not ripping off the mask to summon Arsene... He's forcefully removing his complacent persona to reveal the rage and rebellion he feels in his heart. The blood that we see is also symbolic, showing that this kind of change so suddenly is painful... But his smile shows that being true to yourself is worth it.
The Kentucky Gamer That's a beautiful answer! Especially with the smirk he gives off even with blood all around his face, I knew that symbolized satisfaction.
I think that the mask being ripped off represents the separation of the true person and their persona. In the gameplay, if you rip off your mask, the persona and the person becomes different entities.
Wow, that's DEEP.
Like, Mariana Trench deep.
Exactly, the Jungian Persona is the mask we wear to 'fit in' with society. When we rebel, when we fight back, we rip off the mask of 'complacent member of society' and reveal our TRUE face, that of the Trickster, the One Who Breaks Society's Rules.
I knew about Jungian psychology before this game, and I always thought the characters rip off their Personas to show that they can be their true selves without the mask.
Further, I think it has to do with realizing that they ARE wearing a mask, and that the power of persona has to do with wielding that balance of private self and public appearance rather than allowing oneself to believe that the public appearance IS the private self. Likewise, unless I'm missing something, the mask removal only occurs the first time they summon their persona- when they awaken to the awareness of the mask and step outside of its limitations for the first time.
If you look carefully during battles, I think they do take their mask off?
Dharengo yea I was kinda surprised he missed that with how in depth the rest of the video was, also not noting that the velvet room is also a form of the consciousness literally the place you draw out the symbols and myths of society
Those references in the Tarot section though
Somebody hates a certain Mega Man mini-boss.
They all reference JoJo...
NANI???
Death was uncle death from let it die
Nah The Magician was from Yu-Gi-Oh
(dark magician girl)
Did you know, in-game, why most Shadow's taking the form of Mythological Creatures is because Shadow's in nature, are manufactured by humans and the easiest way they can manifest themselves is in the form of what humans subconsciously know of folklore.
I'm not sure if that is the explanation they give, I mean, in P3 and P4 they are not demons. but that actually makes sense anyway
It is the explanation they give in the game. It is explicitly stated in Persona 5 that Shadows take on the visages of mythological figures/creatures because that's how the human mind perceives their concept.
Pretty sure that's just an excuse for them to write the demon negotiation back into Persona. It's definitely the reason that the personas in all the previous games were mythological figures, but the shadows didn't used to be.
It's merely mentioned though by Justine and Caroline and the line does require you to 'search' for it. Most players never use the toilet in the Velvet Room Cell.
I actually skipped Personas 3 and 4 (Ok, I know, I should totally play them), so I dont really know what you mean by Shadows in past games... but I always understood that's what the demons always were in the PS1 games.
I actually thought they took form of those figures and creatures because everything in those games were created by people's subconscious.
The characters in P5 don't have the spirit of rebellion, they are the spirit of rebellion. Tearing off their nice to the public mask to reveal their inner rebel.
NecrophiliaPro
What could possibly be more rebellious to society than removing the masks that we all make ourselves wear? I love it
this episode is brought to you by Edogawa Sensei from Persona 3, i'm not kidding he covers pretty much all of this and a bit more
Oh yeah, the P4 Golden extras.
except that P2 did first *cough*
And persona 4 golden
Basics of magic and spirituality like its a history class. I actually loved his lessons
I love how in P4:G the P3 teacher explains jungian psychology.
Mr. Edogawa explained it in Persona 3 as well when our characters went to summer school. I was really interested in that particular lecture so it sticks with me even now.
Man persona teach me more than school
how about persona 2?
"Jung II, this time it's persona"
Is phenomenal.
Man i want an extra credits themed tarot deck
yeah, would fit perfectly next to my Welcome to nightvale themed tarot deck^^
Fortune: James having free time
I have a silicon valley tarot deck, it's pretty great.
Only if they replace The World with the flat plane of a Minecraft world.
IREALLY WANT THIS TOO
I believe that they chose to make your Persona summoning ripping off a mask due to the whole theme of the game. Since it's all about rebellion and fighting against society, it makes sense for them to summon their Persona the opposite way you would think, like the rebels they are.
The ripping off the mask actually makes a great deal of sense. The persona for the main characters is their true feelings they bury , the actualization of their true self. By ripping off the mask, they accept their true unconscious self and it manifests as a persona. This is why Persona users can't have shadows, as Morgana stated. It also really plays on the word Persona/Mask and it was a great design choice.
I FACE OUT
I HOLD OUT
I REACH OUT TO THE TRUTH
BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,BABY,
Yyyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeaaaaaahhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Anima and Animus fighting each other is accepting a shadow
🎺
This makes more sense after P4G is now on Steam for the PC
They rip off their masks because the persona themselves (The creatures) are the masks, which then take their true forms. It's not rocket science, c'mon.
THIS!!!
If you see this comment with no context, it becomes so much more funny.
That's the physical interpretation, sure. This looks into the symbolic references, which are arguably more interesting.
@@DakarTwelve But the physical act is also a symbolic one, much the same way that holding your hands together is symbolic of prayer. In fact, the areas that the characters can summon their Persona are symbolism made physical.
@@Uldihaa this does nothing to disprove my point, and only enhances it.
Seems no one is mentioning The Final Pam as The Judgement. Nice addition!
Nearly spit out my coffee when I saw it lol
what is "the final pam"?
Sato it's from polygon's "Monster Factory" videos, where Griffin and Justin McElroy play games that have character customization and just try to make, well, monstrous people with it lol. The Final Pam is from their Fallout 4 series
I paused the video at that exact moment to see who else in the comments caught that.
The Final Pam is the metric by which the world is judged and the judge. The Final Pam is the Pam which death forgot.
She's the main character of Polygon's monster factory Fallout 4 videos.
My god EC just used an animation in their video instead of still frames 5:44
You'll never see it coming
I thought he was done in.
He will be. And by the time it hits him, it'll be his last surprise.
LOOKING COOL JOKER
All this clowning around is fun and all, BUT ALL OF YOU NEED TO GO TO BED
Oh hi Yusukes Dad
End credits :
"YOU SEE THAT MY MIND IS , TOO FAST FOR EYES "
now i have to listen that music again hahahah
being a long time persona fan it inspired me to literally dive into psychology, tarotology, and cognitive science, so i'm actually really happy everyone else is now finally getting on board the jung train. i will say though that playing persona 4 felt like it handled the idea of the shadow and anima/animus really well and better than persona 5
Slightly annoyed that they didn't even mention the past Persona games even in passing. They're all dealt with Jungian psychology from the start and I'd argue that P4 does a slightly better job of expressing its ideas. P4 even has a segment where one character sits the group down and explains to them what Jungian psychology, explicitly name dropping it, is all about and how it relates to what they're going through.
One of the exra channel things in P4 Golden, with the classroom and teacher from P3, has a lot of lectures about Jungian psychology, which was a great move I thought.
Anima and Animus is also explored through Kanji in a far more in-depth way than Persona 5 explores it.
Persona 4 was not as well-known in the mainstream, using Persona 5 makes more sense because more of the audience is familiar with it - that's all.
All games deal with jungian philosophy and psychology differently and address them in their own terms. Persona 5 seems more interested in perception while P4 focuses on the self discovery and therapeutic ideas of it and P3 dives into the effect facing death and instrospectionnhas in people's character. Each of those are valid ways to appriach Jung, and yeah, it is kinda sad EC isolated their commentary in the latest and hottest issue of the franchise
Extra Credits isn't supposed to be hour-long explorations of the themes of video games, though. They're designed to be short videos on game design, which in this case specifically is the intersection of psychology and games. The most retrospective of the series they'd have done is a throw away line about how all the Persona games include references to Jung.
Petition to have them reupload the video with the only change being having a picture of "The World" from Jojo's at 5:09 instead of a drawing of the actual world
KreativAce YES
ZA WARUUUUDO!
*muda intensifies
Hey this applies to Persona 4 as well! Kanji's Anima and Naoto's Animus!
and the whole Shadow thing is even more well done there, because most of the palace rulers in 5 don't actually face themselves like in 4
The ripping off the mask to summon your Persona makes complete sense with the ideas set by Jungian psychology. Because the monster that is your Persona in the game literally is the mask on your face as shown by when you get new ones. So when you rip off the mask you are hiding behind you let it form it's true shape and if you notice they always cover their face when they summon in order to still hide their face while their mask is out fighting for them.
Yes. I think it has to do with being aware of it being a mask what unleashes the Persona. You are still using it, not showing your raw self,but you are recognizing and stating that this mask isn't you
When each of the main characters first gains their persona by removing their mask, I also saw it as symbolism for them abandoning the role society had given them and rebelling by choosing their own path in life.
I like to think that Joker having the "Wild Card" power, which allows him to use multiple different personas, is also a reference to the fact that his character is that of a blank canvas, taking on the personality, or persona, that the player exhibits while playing the game
Remis Chun I agree. Which is an aspect of the Fool or the Trickster - there’s shape shifting abilities.
FINAL PAM!!! 5:07
THIS IS THE FINAL PAM'S POWER
And Roachie! Reunited again!
VishusCycle CANNOT CONTAIN
the final Pam shall never be contained
she has been freed from the hell dimension
5:03 Uncle Death! Just started playing Let it Die the other day so it was nice to see that reference.
I should check that out sometime
not just Persona 5... there's a 1, and 2 and 3 and 4 and they're all good games
I think the ripping off the mask to summon their persona is symbolic of how painful and difficult it can be for someone to discover/embrace/reveal who they really are. Even blood is shown when each character first takes off their mask.
I had to correct the use of the Collective Unconscious. In the Persona series, the collective unconscious is represented by the velvet room, hence why it's there you could summon demons, angels and gods from various mythologies and religions. It is the literal embodiment of the collective unconscious, the sum total of all symbolism in order to understand the natural world and phenomena around us. Also, it's quite explicitly stated when you summon some Personas, they mention something along the lines of "I come for the sea of thy heart", a metaphor for the collective unconscious. So yeah, I don't think mementos was a appropriate example in this case.
hibye201 Morgana when talking about Mementos: "Think of it as the collective unconscious".
Not saying what you said is wrong, just that Morgana literally calls it the collective unconscious.
hibye201 Well, I think both the Velvet Room and Mementos could be considered representations of the collective unconscious. I'm fairly certain that they say in the game that Mementos symbolizes the collecrive unconscious.
COME ON DOWN TO SPOILER TOWN
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Aaaaand that's why the Velvet Room is INSIDE Mementos, locked away. Because they're both representations of the Collective Unconscious. It's just that the Big Bad has more control over one than the other. The Velvet Room represents the bedrock aspects, the universal immutable symbols at the deepest part of the psyche, while Mementos starts off much more surface-level and thus is susceptible to change. And, this is why you need to become more well-known as the game goes on to access deeper and deeper aspects of Mementos; because you need to *become* a universal symbol recognized by the world, for good or for ill, to be a part of those immutable universal symbols at the bottom.
JacksonJin What he said. Didn't want to spoil but this is essentially it.
I think Persona devs think of it as a realm of shadows inaccessible by humans that represents the collective will of society, and that it takes shape an keeps resurfacing in many forms.
OMG can I have a extra credits tarot deck! Those were hillarious.
*Dan starts naming tarot card*
My brain: "is that a JoJo reference?"
Miguel Contreras persona is a JoJo reference
as Persona 5 often says: it's all in the cognition (of the beholder) as, for people who played Persona before watching Jojo, JJBA is a Persona reference. (except for Parts 1/2, as those had no Standsonas)
Sonny FIRESTORM persona 2 is basically JoJo part 2
Sonny FIRESTORM I think persona influenced Jojo part 3 since it came out before stands
JoJo Part 3 came out in the 80’s, Persona has always taken heavy influence from JoJo as a whole, that's never been a secret, well maybe outside of Japan it was since nobody ever read JoJo until the Anime came out. I’m actually pretty sure the first JoJo video game on the PS1 is older than the first Persona game!
(snorts at the references used for the Tarot card)
In regards to personas and masks, I always interpreted it as the characters persona being their true self, and by ripping off the masks they wear to fit in with society, they're drawing strength from that true self rather than society's perception of them.
Whoa a whole extra credits devoted to Persona 5 psychology??? Was not expecting this.
In fact..::SHADES:: I never saw it coming.
I see that Gaben placed right in the middle of the steam sale.
"I am a Shadow, the true self!"
- The moment I realised that Persona 4 was about to be something special.
That plus the Palaces are the 7 deadly sins:
1. Lust
2. Envy (or vanity)
3. Gluttony
4. Wrath
5. Greed
6. Vanity (or envy)
7. Pride
8. Sloth
Correct me if I am wrong
I don't know about this guy, maybe he was before my time and I'm too Jung
Leave.
lol
5:48 In addition, if you pick the answers that best fit what they want to hear, they will like you more. For the elementary school gamer, telling him he's right even if you think he's being bratty. For the ex-yakuza, hearing that you have ulterior motives aloud immediately relieves him of the tension he's used to feeling. Plus, what they want to hear changes over the course of your link. The star shogi player initially enjoys you as a flirt, but prefers you start helping her advance her career midway through.
Parallels also exist between the Major Arcana and storytelling. You start your journey as The Fool, and you progress towards The World where a resolution to the main arc is made apparent.
It is even covered by Campbell, who saw the Major Arcana as representing the stages of life as the individual learned more about themselves and were affected by life's challenges.
Loki to Loki?
Come on, man. Coyote, Brer Rabbit, Anansi, Sinbad... even Bugs Bunny or the Animaniacs!
Beyond that, excellent video as always :D
Didn't see this coming
And knowing this channel, it won't be the last surprise
They tend to reach out for the truth a lot.
YOU'LL NEVER SEEN IT COMING!!
I think the reason behind tearing their masks off so violently can describe the effect of different hardships in life affecting who you are. So much to the fact that when everything changes dramatically you must find yourself going through mask to mask to be able to overcome what comes at you.
I'm not sure how much I was properly able to learn because Scott was having too much fun drawing this episode.
*(Insert jojo's reference)*
(Insert Duwang Quote)
Sealand Ball I THAT A OTHERFUNGIN JONO'S REVERENCE?
Sealand Ball 5:09 *Distant Wry*
( Insert WRYYYYYYYY)
You thought it was a Jojo Reference.
BUT IT WAS I, DIO!
You can tell someone had a lot of fun drawing those tarot images! Gabe as the Hierophant cracked me up!
Actually, the Tarot connections and inspirations run much deeper than that. Every Confidant starts with their life being in the upside down position of their arcana; But as you progress through the stories you help them change for the better and get their life in the upright position.
Like for example Ryuji's Arcana, The Chariot, in it's upside down position means Aggression and being lost in life. Or Ann's, The Lover, Means not knowing what to do and chasing after the wrong things.
"The difference between a smart and wise person is this: a smart person knows a tomato is a fruit, however the wise does not put it in their fruit salad." - a sorta edited quote some from probably famous dude
The best I heard it put was this: A smart person knows Galaxy Quest is not a Star Trek movie. A wise person knows Galaxy Quest is /the best/ Star Trek movie.
jeesus its been 27 minutes and ive already got 4 likes and two replies... lmao
I've seen it expounded entirely with D&D stats.
Strength - Crushing a tomato
Dexterity - Dodging a thrown tomato
Constitution - Eating a bad tomato and not getting sick
Intelligence - Knowing a tomato is a fruit
Wisdom - Knowing not to put tomato in a fruit salad
Charisma - The ability to sell someone a tomato-based fruit salad.
I also saw a Tumblr post where someone followed that up with "But isn't a tomato-based fruit salad just a salsa?"
Is a salsa (or pico de gallo) a fruit salad?
Also, for legal and taxation purposes in the USA, tomatoes are vegetables. There literally were court cases about it, because some guy importing tomatoes tried to classify them as fruit to get better tax rates and avoid regulations.
Kyman102 i remember that post and i discussed with the family we decided that salsa is a fruit salad and that peppers are also fruit
It's funny, but growing up with Aspberger's, I didn't really understand the idea of a persona until it was explicitly spelled out for me, well into high school. In other words, I literally acted like the same person, regardless of context or setting, no mask.
I still don't really have that firm a grasp on the concept, and have to make a conscious effort to "put on a mask" and it's usually only marginally effective. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I wonder how Jung would have reacted to Asperger's. Because for the most part, there's some validity in a lot of his stuff, not entirely, but somebody with Asperger's is almost completely outside that realm, it's like... You've effectively kind of bypassed Personas as a whole, because you're you and why would you ever want to be anything but you, you like you just fine. Archetypes, sure, you probably fall into one, sort of. One could argue, using his own terminology, than somebody with Asperger's is more-or-less disconnected from the collective unconsciousness, or rather... Has their own, which renders interaction with others feeling... Alien.
charcharmunr
Would that also mean that there's no shadow, or at least much less shadow? Also, this is making me wonder how that would work IN Persona.
Well, there've been some characters in Persona who seem relatively disconnected. Sho in Persona 4 Arena Ultimax, for example.
charcharmunr
Yeah, archetypes I'm pretty sure are still valid.
I think I've always felt like "the fool" (65% Shakespeare's version and 35% the Tarot version) or somewhere in that ballpark- not really cognizant of a lot of obvious things but despite and/or because of that, that still able to more easily see things from an uncommon but useful perspective. Also somewhat prone to accidentally ending up in unfavorable situations (from my perspective at least) due to said lack of cognizance yet generally avoiding the consequences I think are coming and avoiding becoming jaded as a result (from my perspective at least).
And even as a kid I feel like I would have understood archetypes, at least as much as any other kid.
Sorry for the long, self-indulgent reply.
I just appreciated the feedback and I don't think thumbs up show the people who do them anymore.
spindash64 I have Aspergers and I can confirm that the shadow is still there, it just makes it harder to create a persona. (I had to manually learn through intensive therapy and phychiactric help.)
I didn't see this coming, but it's nice to see you do some Persona 5 videos.
Also, the arcana of the P5 protagonist (or Ren, his canon name) is Fool, not Trickster. Also, Loki is a Persona in the series, as are Thor & Odin.
His arcana is the fool. However in game, everyone calls him the Trickster. play the game and you will see. When it comes to fate, Akira is called "the fool" but when it comes to him specifically, he is referred to as "the Trickster"
wtf everyone calls him 'Joker' in my game no one has called him 'Trickster' yet.
Archetype =/= arcana
He meant, I'd guess, that the fool in the major arcana corresponds to the age-old archetype of the trickster.
Nipah Auauau The trickster is actually for all of the party members, IIRC
Actually, Akira can be both Trickster and Fool because Tarot. The fool represents the beginning of a journey which will change the very nature of the fool embarking upon it. He was the fool when he got sent to Tokyo on parole, forced on a journey which will inevitably change him. without his consent. This injustice sets him on the path of the trickster as well, as he will rebel against corruption with incredibly questionable methods. And the big thing that allows him to be represented by two tarrots is the fact that the fool and the trickster share the position as the first card in different iterations of the tarot deck. The French deck, used in P5, has the Pierrot, or the jester arcana instead of the fool, which represents both the Fool and the Trickster. Without spoiling anything, Atlus actually used both the Fool and the Jester as seperate Arcana and Social Links in P4 Golden, with the Jester representing the Trickster, so there is precedent for my assumption of P5's use of the French deck.
Also, sorry for the info dump, or if I came off as a pretentious ass, I just really like this series.
They missed the opportunity to put some stands in the video when listing the Tarot cards
+King_Isard_of_Io - Stand-ins? There was Lord Gaben, if you didn't realize?
+Downstream01 Stands, from JJBA
IS THAT A MOTHERFUCKING JOJO REFERENCE LOLLLLLOL MUDAMUDAMUDA WRYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
*Standos
+Arausito Dude...chill.
Wonderful analysis as usual. I thought Get Even similarly and deftly portrayed the human condition, albeit in a way that completely turns story roles and exploration scenarios on their heads with its theme of identity and looping narrative. It's one thing to contextualize the environment and in-game action, it's another to do the same thing for the actual systems and mechanics governing the virtual space and gameplay rules.
I love the video's you do on psychology/philosophy although being an avid tolken fan I have to point out using odin and Gandolf as separate examples is redundant because the character of Gandolf is heavily influenced by Odin to the point of arguably being based off him. A small nitpick I know so keep making awesome videos!
All I heard was Jung and I immediately thought of Jordan Peterson, that guy is always talking about Jung. You think he'd enjoy this game?
Since I am platinuming this game come July, it is nice to know how this version of Persona is different from the other versions. :)
"The World"
>Not having DIO pop up for a split second
SummonerCypress
WRRRYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
I did *NOT* expect Final Pam XD
That was your last mistake
This is literally the kind of game I have been looking for, and I didn't even know it!, thanks Dan and the Extra Credits crew!
Always pleasant to see video games bring to science discussions.
Was THAT the FINAL PAM!?
1:04 - hahaha, I don't think that black postman would wave and smile at a white dude in a white hood walking towards him.
Stephen McVicker Oh... Uh... Yeah, good catch.....
I was literally begging you for a Persona 5 episode !! Thanks !
One little tiny, tiny nitpick I have:If they have a palace, you are not wrong about their wrongdoings, Because the palace is their wrongdoings and distorted desires in a physical manifestation.
Wait that's what the collective unconscious is? I thought it was the god from Code Geass...
Yes! I just finished the video and was looking for someone to comment that. That's the first thing my mind went to when I heard those words. What's your opinion on S3 coming out?
basically, a place where humanity shares their ideas. The main reason why some ancient gods are quite similar, as well as some folklore, like monsters, stories, etc.
Wut
I thought about Plato's Theory of Forms
You pronounced "Za Warudo" wrong :D
Yeah, it's: 'AKANA FOSU NIIJUUICHI ZA WARUDO!!!"
@@SakuraAvalon he means JOJO
It's not za warudo it's ZAAA WAAARRRRUUUDOOOO
Juragan Traktor I know.
Your restraint in not going for the jojo gag for the visual of 'The World' is admirable. I do not believe I could have done the same.
I nearly lost it when I saw Roach from The Witcher standing on a roof as the Chariot. XD
I kinda feel the need to question why this topic isn't discussed back when P3 or P4 came out. Is it simply because P5 is that much more hyped thanks to the popularity built up by P3 and P4 themselves?
Pretty much. Persona 5 is the most accessible of the installments, so a lot of people who have never played Persona just got into it with 5. So expect to see a lot of vids jumping on the hype train now, than when Persona was more niche.
Ive never heard of persona until persona 5 came out. its no denying P5 is popularizing the series
85 Hours of gameplay explained in 8 minutes. 10 outa 10
more like 120 hours
I am really happy that I got most of the references during the Major Arcana breakdown.
I just want to say, I drifted off at around 3:30 when you were talking about the old man and all of a sudden started thinking about the hermit from tarot and how it might be cool to bring in aspects from tarot to help tell a story, maybe by capitalizing on certain character traits to help further the hero's journey . . . and then you started talking about it. I don't know why, but it always excites me when I come up with independent thoughts and then see those thoughts reflected back at me by someone else. Which in writing this I realize, maybe that's what the developer was getting at in that character link system from "Persona 5" that you talked about later in the video (I couldn't say because I haven't played "Persona 5", but it makes me really want to play it now). I don't know why, but this video made me really happy, so thanks.
Did some one say TAROT? STAAAR PLATINUM! SILVA CHARIOT! HIEROPHANTO GUREEN! HERMITO PAHPUL! MAGICIANS RED!
And of course... ZA WARUDO
There's a guy who can stop time in persona lol he looks like a fusion of magicians red and star platinum+ a little bit of the hand
he starts naming tarpt cards and all im thinking is the binding of issac
5:40 This is actually a key technique in building an instant rapport with someone, if you wish to get closer to them. Matching someones general personality, from your tone of voice to your facial expressions, and even to your posture, will cause them to be naturally drawn to you. The mind will see it as familiar, therefore safe.
Not sure if it's been stated, but the reason why the cast in P5 rip off masks to call forth their Personas is because (obviously) the mask is the Persona. By removing the mask, they are releasing the Persona. That's why when they do so, they cover their face. Their face is their true self, which is also why it's dark and hard to see the features.
Oh dear. I can't help laughing. 1:04 I don't think you guys really thought through a guy putting on a white head cover so that he could hang out with a black guy.
Top kek.
Nah, look at the original North American release of Persona 2 (only the second half,) which inexplicably turned a Japanese teenager into a stereotypical African-American because... Well, look at Atlus' localization reputation. They've been getting flak for P5, it's 2017 and they've got no more excuses because they used them all up on putting a Japanese kid in blackface in the 90s.
5:08 Oh my god... she's found persona 5. She will consume it
I learned about Jung through Jordan Peterson's podcast/videos, and I think this video did a great job of unpacking the super super dense info surrounding Jung's mind theory. Prof. Peterson is absolutely brilliant but I, as a layman, have a lot of trouble following exactly what he means a lot of the time. So thanks EC!
Here's an easy symbolic way to view summoning personas by removing masks. The mask resembles the persona you are wearing, by removing it from yourself and casting it aside you summon the persona's form outside of your body.
What is going on with that gun at 0:24? Is the second trigger just for punctuation?
In order to play this game you need to sort yourself out go tidy your room..... roughly speaking
And that's no joke!
2/10, dead father wasn't revivified
but ya,know what about the hierarchy? (of dominance)
"Clean your room."
*Cleans room*
"Fix the situation with your family."
*Maxes confidant with Sojiro and Futaba*
"Do good in the broader community."
*Forms genuine relationships with influential people through Shujin and Shibuya*
"There 'ya go, bucko! Now, go on and slay the dragon of chaos."
I'm pretty sure That all persona games are based on that because in every persona game they say that the persona is a mask you use to protect yourself from hardships but this game really touches on that with the actual mask
5:44 every time they switch from 1 frame per 2 seconds to 60 frames per second will never not mess me up
I find your lack of JoJo reference for 'The world', disappointing.
I was hoping a za warudo or dio illustration at the tarots cards.....
i just realized the catbus thing was a reference. that scene makes SO MUCH more sense now
That The Final Pam reference made me double take and then laugh super hard!
Great episode!
5:05 The stARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR PLATINUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUM
What a beautiful Duwang
I will never stop praising the amount of polish and finely tuned and thought out symbolism this game presented. Oh my fucking god. 100 hours. It made me start researching about life again. What a game.
you figuratively Madoka Magicka'd my brain with that last bit of commentary
5:09 ZA WARUDO
HELLO METAL HUSBAND and Trash Hogan
THREE EYED METAL HUSBAND
The "Mr. Edogawa's TV Classroom" in the TV Listings menu of Persona 4: Golden also talks about Jungian psychology too if anyone has that and wants to know more. They slowly unlock as your play through it so they won't all be there in the beginning but P4G's a really good game too so it kinda like a bonus for players that're interested in the subject. There 10 in all so there's quite a bit there. If you're a Persona 3 fan you also get to see Mr. Edogawa being Mr. Edogawa, which is always... fun? I think?
Hmm, could you guys maybe do once a episode about how to properly do subtle hints? Like how to push an idea on the player, without them knowing, and getting them theorizing. Like, how to properly have a character with a split personality, but then how to properly push the player a bit in the right direction of theorizing, and trying to find deeper lore?
no jojo reference makes me sad
Just mentioning Persona is a Jojo reference
you dont even pronounce his name correctly lol. yoong. not young.
You misconstrued a very important part early on. Persona is not defines by the monsters you summoned. Rather, the true power of the main characters is their removal of their personas. The power of these main characters' persona are those that are made manifest by *removing* their personas, which is why the removal of the mask is not odd, but perfect. The monsters that you summon elsewise are manifestations of other aspects of human consciousness. It is explained the reason why they take the form of gods and mythological creatures is because they are physical manifestations of traits to which humans would ascribe them. You, as the main character, are the only one who can access this human collective consciousness usually by some godlike intervention. Which you would have known had you really played the games...
The cool thing about Persona 4 Golden is you get a crash course on Jungian Pschology bundled in! I learned a lot from that, too.