I'm so happy for you with the print sales. I remember maybe a year ago, or a little more you said you didn't even like showing your photos in your videos. You restricted those visuals to other photographers. Gradually we got to see more and more of your work and we were finally able to see the world through your eyes. I really love the body of work you have put together and think it's amazing how you can be so consistent with how you read these mundane scenes. You make people take notice!
Hi Greg, Thanks so much for that comment. I was quite nervous TBH about showing my own photography on such a public platform, but over time, as you noticed, I injected my own images in there. I'm pleased you like them :D
I met Peter Lik once - he does so much different, the shots are the shots...but when you see them huge format...on a timber packing...in great lighting in a viewing space....put a high tag on it...sell a narrative....and he has nailed it with well shot and wdited screen savers! Genius and a gent.
Your enthusiasm for your images can clearly be seen in this video which I applaud. Your ability to create art out of the everyday and mundane is a rare gift so few have. I hope your print launch gives you the success you so richly deserve. I take huge amounts of inspiration from you in my own photography so thank you for that. 🙂
Such a brillliant and important message. One of many reasons why I love photography is that, a photograph is a still image that tells more than a single image. Because a photograph isn't moving, it's stuck in time and space, and always makes us think and imagine. I've got no doubt that story telling is very important in photography even in videography. But I think it's relatively easier in videography because the images can move. But when the right story is told very well in photography, the impact is much more powerful in my opinion. I am surprisingly terrible at story telling 😄(I'm not trying to be humble at all) but this video makes me think about storytelling more and deeper. I believe that is a sign that my story telling skills are very slowly but gradually improving. Thank you so much Alex! :D
Every time I am in Key West I visit the Peter Lik gallery. His staff presents the photos in viewing room where the lighting is controlled and the prints are truly impressive. They also run a video where he talks about the stories behind his prints. A very worthwhile experience.
It was fun watching your face and listening to your voice as you relived your experience as you took your photos. I appreciate you sharing your passion for photography.
I never thought about this much. One reason is that the people I share my photos with seem not to be interested in any story about the image. I got it into my head that it was a universal thing. That is, that people don't care about that and would prefer I not bore them with it. I figure it would be a different matter when among other photographers, though. Thank you for showing that many people do care about the story and that it adds to their enjoyment of the image.
Alex, this is one of the best videos you’ve made, quite introspective and a perfect follow up to your Saturday Selections newsletter last weekend in which you discussed this subject. Since reading it, I’ve been thinking about this question myself in order to find a deeper understanding of my photography.
Thank you very much! Your channel is very unique among all TH-cam channels about photography. Please continue what you are doing! It gives me great inspiration and lot education in photography and arts as well...
Alex your videos are fantastic. This one in particular is so telling. I can see you doing dozens of videos dedicated to the subject you covered today. It is so deep and ripe for further exploration.
Alex, your presentations like this one are the reason that I subscribe and look forward to your videos. You are among the very few who discuss the "why" rather than the "how". Your thoughtful discussions are the best. Thank you!!
A good story about how a wee bit of a backstory can add so much more to a photo image. Thank you! Airports are fascinating places and I fell in love with Eero Saarinen’s soaring Jet Age terminal at JFK Airport that has been restored to its 1962 glory. It was designed to have a minim of signage, letting all the curves and glass simply and quietly guide passengers and visitors to their destination. Cheers!
Thanks for making me think about why I like certain images I take and giving me the cue to add descriptions about the story on photos I submit to various sites. Thank you for sharing thought provoking information throughout all your videos they're a great learning tool.
The problem with Facebook photography groups is that there are a lot with a rule that you must post camera, lens and settings or risk being banned. I have a writers degree and would love to see more photos with a story attached
Really? The TPE FB group doesn't require this. Seems a pretty pointless and pedantic thing to require. Thanks for watching - if you like images with stories attached, check out Obie Oberholzer (he's also on Facebook)
I give all my photos titles for this very reason. It doesn't have to be profound but it gives me a chance in just a few words to give the image a bit of context. Be it through references, word association or juxtaposition. If it holds people's attention for a few seconds longer or from a different perspective, it's achieved it's goal. Great video (as always) Alex 👍
@@ThePhotographicEye As of today I will also be giving a short paragraph with my photos. I don't care about likes, but I feel its a nice reminder why we post what we post 👍
Great insight into building a coherent story about an image, doesn't hurt to make a bit of a show about the motivation and often unique moment which was captured
@@ThePhotographicEye From what I've seen thus far, the photos are undoubtedly very pretty, highly stylised and heavily 'Photoshopped', but they lack emotional value to myself. To me, photos require 3 basic elements, i.e. composition, lighting and 'story telling'. It is the last element that I am referring to, but that is highly subjective and individualistic.
One of the most important videos you have made for a artist (photographer). To tell an interesting story about the work to create interest. An artist statement. Then I saw how you were inspired by the principle to apply it to you work. I will take your advice.
Always enjoy your thoughtful insight. Speaking about your photography is certainly an art. On the opposite side of the equation, there have been a handful of well known photographer's who have actually ruined some aspect of their work for me BY talking about it. There are some circumstances where a bit of mystery behind a photograph (and the photographer!) works better.
I love your videos...the more I watch them the more I appreciate your insight and perspective. This video was excellent as you explore the impact/value of having a story to go with the photograph. There is a belief out there (and I'm not saying it's wrong) that the photograph, a good photograph, tells a story, in and of itself without someone standing there telling you what you're looking at and without a special musical backtrack trying to add to the mood of the viewer. Your example of reading Peter Lik's story/caption for the Antelope Canyon shot was compelling in demonstrating the point. That said I also wanted to comment on some of YOUR photos that you've included as part of this video. I'll start by saying I liked every single one of them. I find the geometric shapes interesting and how you've taken the ordinary and made it extraordinary demonstrates your seriously good photography chops. There is something that caught my eye in a somewhat distracting way...and I should say that I allowed myself to be distracted because of the emphasis I have when doing architectural photography, particular for clients. And that's ensuring that the vertical lines of walls and windows are actually vertical. And before anyone takes issue with that I'll quickly add that I know they don't have to me, and often times they are not either for creative reasons or for practical reasons. However, if your verticals are not vertical, I think that should look more intentional in your images, and by that I mean when they look close, but aren't quite, then either straighten them up, or skew them at bit more (in post if necessary) to show that it's intentional and not an accidental oversight. Last point--please accept my comments in the constructive way I'm intending them. Your images show an intuition and skill that I wish I had.
I wondered if you’d consider a talk on approaches to editioning prints. Limited editions are common, and I’ve reluctantly taken that approach so far - in spite of preferring open editions - because it’s often preferred by galleries.
I imagine the impact of the photographer's ability to write and compose their thoughts and emotions to capture their story would really have a large impact on their photography success. I can think of two photographers that are actually great at writing and suspect this helped with creating and placing images to convey their story. I'm thinking of Lewis Carroll and Sally Mann.
I own two Peter Lik prints, both large and so expensive. Why Peter Lik and not some other photographer? Mostly because of his gallery. My wife and I had been looking for a work of art to go in a specific spot for years. We walked into a Lik gallery and saw an image we liked that would fit. The sales people went on and on about art and investment. None of that mattered. We didn’t think it was great art but we liked it and(lucky us) could afford it. We found another we also liked so bought two. And they delivered. Painless. We bought from Lik not because he is a superior artist but because of superior customer service. I’m sure there are other photographers whose work we would have been equally satisfied with but we didn’t know about them or how to get their works in our house.
First the bad news, I was completely put off by Lik's use of someone throwing dust into the air, which turned this picture into a plastic, phony Hollywoodesque production. It feels dirty and untoward. Now the good news, great video, loaded with things to ponder. I wish you massive success tomorrow when you kick off your print sales. I'm fresh out of million dollar bills, but I will definitely come looking.
2:55 _"timing is everything"_ You know, i'm not about reading what others did or watching big photographers to be like them or who knows what. Like all the things i do in my life. By no mean, I don't deny them. But i'm me. I love abstract, action, sport photography. And some street photography from time to time. At least when i was healthier. Now, i can't do ****. But, i did a lot, more than 10 years. And, coming back to what that photographer said, yes that's it. How mostly all things in life are. TIMING! And being in the right moment at the right time... I watched henry Cartier Bresson documentary and i loved the way it is written and put into light. He also said in his journey that many of his photos are pure luck. Just being at the right moment in time. He also gave the example for the _Muhammad Ali vs. Sonny Liston_ photo taken by _Neil Leifer_. If i remember right this is the case, when Bresson said that there were 2 photographers. But only one had the chance to immortalize that photo... And that's how your luck in life comes in place. JUST for being at the right moment and at the right time... Eh... I love this kind of stories and i also was surprising me being this way. And i just took that shot no matter what others around me thought i do or how i look... With my phone, camera or who knows what other concoction ;-) Cheers!
Hi Alex, some really good advice that will help us stand out from other photographers. You can have a photo taken by a professional, and the same photo from an enthusiast but it's the photo that has the great story to it will sell the most. And it might just be the enthusiast who will have the best story line. Airports are great places to take photos. There are compositions just waiting to be snapped. Thanks for your great advice and good luck for the launch of your prints. 😊
The true story about the picture Phantom is actually really fishy, in fact a known friend of Peter Lik bought it from him, which makes you think if the photo is really that special, without the high price tag.
To me Lik's description borders on the bee ess if not diving headlong into it. I see this sort of stuff in the oil painting magazines, it's like if some pseudo-intellectual nonsense is not included to describe it the expectation is that it will not sell. Maybe that is the lesson of experience, they want to sell artwork so they come up with some overly verbose stuff to grease the skids. It's all of a form, and one artist in particular went into this lengthy description. I don't remember exactly, but it was something along the lines of I explore the juxtaposition of the public and private and where they interface. It just went on and on in that vein. Translation: Her paintings were of people sitting on window sills as seen from the outside of buildings. So, for what it is worth, my opinion is that if one's images don't speak for themselves they are not quality images. If one needs to write a paragraph to explain it it is not a sign of a successful image. If writing is one's joy in life write novels and poetry instead. The point of an image is to "speak" in a way words cannot.
But I'll add that Cascone really seems to have a case of sour grapes, and no small amount of snobbery. Honestly, what's it to her that inexperienced collectors like his work (or Kinkaid's)? Maybe those who like Taylor Swift or Lady Gaga aren't experienced listeners of music like someone who likes Beethoven and the like. If if brings joy to people's lives so what? I was in Florida and did stumble across one of the Kincaid galleries. It is remarkable how he did achieve a palpable feeling of light no matter how much his naysayers say it's cheesy. Art, by nature, is subjective anyway. I like that line from the Rataouille cartoon uttered by the character Anton Ego toward the end, something like the average piece of garbage has more value than the critic declaring it so because someone DID try to create something which the critics don't do. The theater crowd often says of critics that they are the ones who couldn't make it as actors, and thus have an axe of bitterness to grind.
There always seems to a level of snobbery when it comes to any art form. Jack Vetriano springs to mind aswell. I can't but help feel that, and whilst I don't really care for Peters images, a lot of the arrows pointed at him and others like him are simply from a POV of critics et al thinking that people like this are debasing 'art'.
Thanks for this episode on communicating the stories of our images. It has given me something to think very seriously about. You may be sorry about the monster that you have released when you see the upcoming results on the Facebook page. I, for one, can tend toward the verbose. 😊
It's note the story in the image, but the story behind the image that often separates the image from the rest of the images. There are many technically 'perfect' images, many very thoughtful images taken every minute but too often none of these images have a the 'backstory' told about them.
Thank you for the thoughtful topic. There's something a bit sleazy about Lik's operation. I'd rather have a picture with a story behind it, or at least a message, by Edward Burtynsky. For pure emotional enjoyment I'd like a monochrome portrait by Yousuf Karsh, perhaps Hemmingway, Ingrid Berman or better, a young Audrey Hepburn.
I think images should stand in their own right, without all the verbal garbage that fools the credulous. If people want to pay silly money for smoke to be blown up their nether parts that's up to them, but the real greats of photography gave their images the simplest names imaginable. It should be the image that tells the story, not the blurb.
I love writing a little story or adding a quote to explain what I was thinking doing the image. But I've seen so many professional photographers saying don't? People should be aloud to make their own thoughts about a piece of work. There's so many contradictions in photography. There's a wonder any images get done. It's a good thing most go there're own way.
I'm of the camp that begrudges even giving my photos a title. If a photo needs a title, perhaps its a photo that falls short of conveying the intent of taking it, or giving it a title limits the imagination of the viewer to make their own interpretation. I have to wonder how much embellishment goes into Peter Lik's descriptions at times, it comes across as pure marketing to me, like a realtor's flowery description of a property for sale. Like you say he knows his market, and for the person looking for a quality print that goes with the curtains and comes with a little story to tell their admiring house guests, his galleries are a one stop shop.
TBH I never really title my images, and I appreciate where you're coming from. However there is a business to selling images so in this regard, certainly for me, if I can present the print in a way that increases the possibility of sale, then I'm happy to experiment with it
Ugh, Peter Lik is the absolute worst example you could have used. His sales tactics have gotten him in trouble with the art world and at times with the authorities. You say he is “popular with collectors” but remember there is NO secondary market for his work to speak of, so his actual popularity with collectors is very much a matter of speculation. By all descriptions his buyers are unsophisticated and are not collectors at all, or if they are collectors they frequent the galleries of Las Vegas and Park City. (Galleries that cater to buyers with far more money than sense) Lik is probably very rich and has achieved a certain kind of success but he's not someone we should hope to emulate at all. Anyway, your point here is very simple, it’s about what art theorists and critic Hal Foster calls “finishing the work.” Turns out there are a lot of ways to do it. Someone like Sally Mann has done a good job over the years creating a mythology around herself talking about things like her “second sight.” Sculptor Richard Serra did exactly what you say we shouldn’t do, he talked extensively about the methods of production of his work. Painter Mark Bradford ties his biography to the meaning and form of his works very well. Richard Moss is also very good at creating a narrative around his works that reinforces the idea that it’s important for its ability to reveal hidden aspects of human crisis. Other artists are silent about their work and it creates a sense of mystery. there is no right or wrong way to finish the work, but we should probably get some help figuring out which method to use and why.
I agree. I think of him more as Peter 'Ilk.' He is probably a better discussion point around the business of art, rather than any meaningful journey into artistic expression. He has been able to create his own market value through a syndicated sales process that goads people into a sale for fear of missing out. The NYT had a pretty good write up on his his questionable business practices.
Fantastic photos but shrouded in a little controversy (see Fstoppers and Artnet). It raises the issue of how much a photograph can be edited or manipulated and still be called a photograph. I think the images are fantastic and the stories associated point to a master of marketing as much as a master of photography.
Many, if not a majority, of Lik's photos, including a number in the video, are assembled digitally from a variety of separate images. The argument that they are distinguished by have been exposed at the right time and right place is pure misinformation. Others are nice photos, like the opening B&W taken near the entrance of Upper Antelope Canyon outside Page, Arizona, (the light ray beaming down), repeated in color at 3:08, are common as dirt. (Pun intended) I have a dozen similar photos from my past trips there. Moreover, those light rays are artificial, being obtained by throwing dirt into the air where the light is shining down. If you don't throw the dirt, you don't get the shot. On the other hand, everyone has seen this image from dozens of "Not Peter Lik" sources, so all the tourists want to see it. So the guides line them all up in rows and then throw the dirt for them. I'm not saying that this is an uninteresting photo, but it's so common that no "collector" worth the name would spend more than $50 for a nice print, assuming that he can't just go and take it for himself. Lik's gallery employees may be able to may be able to tease tens of thousands of dollars out of some self-styled collector, but Lik's stuff is likely to sell for big bucks only at the point of origin.
And that is the point exactly. People talk about 'ghost' (and other Lik images) because of the story he builds around them, and himself. On a personal level I'm not a fan of his stuff, but I appreciate the lessons one can learn about making images stand out in a crowd
I don't care for it. I wouldn't hang it on my wall, but the story is interesting. I don't believe in right place right time. I believe photography is about seeing and making creative decisions about the shot
Photography is extremely subjective,Like wallpaper . The Phantom photo is a calendar pic and has nothing about it for me to look at it again. Now I’m beginning to understand why a lot of professional photographers like Polaroid pics because it has content like that video you did with the lads getting splashed by the car in the rain taken in the seventies. I can look at the photo for ages❤
Analysis of data from the early years of eBay (before it was dominated by commercial sellers and Chinese junk exports) showed that a trivial item sold with a story that catches the public imagination, fetches 10s to 1000s of % more than a similar trivial item alone. Whereas art prices used to be controlled by competence plus who the artist knew and reputation, now art prices are controlled by notoriety and who the artist knows; competence rarely enters into the equation. This isn't to imply that Lik is incompetent, so much as that his competence is not entirely relevant.
I have always been thinking…. How difficult would it be for Peter Lik to fake that sale? Truth is, it is easy.. I read in the comments that one of his friends bought the photo.. I don’t know, but for him to fake that sale would have been very benefitial and too easy. He is known to fake his photos to the absurd.. why not fake a sale?
@@ThePhotographicEye So a professional liar confirmed the sale😂. I have no doubt that there was a sale, but the marketing value of that sale exceeds the price for the photo.. I think that if it had been sold through a gallery, auction of something like that, then maybe.. it is too easy to fake a sale like that.
Did he? Peter Lik is a mixed bag. I think he is brilliant at marketing, I'll give him that. But there are rumbles it was a gimmick with that "Ghost" sale. But hey, don't hate the player...hate the game.
Don't hate the player, hate the game...that's brilliant...I've never heard that but I'm going to use it, a lot! The sentiment behind it is what I see when people criticize a rich person or company that doesn't pay their "fair share" of taxes... what they don't understand or are unwilling to accept is that these people/companies are exploiting the laws and accounting rules that exist--i.e., the "game". And in that vane, it's the tax laws that should be, and are fair game for being criticized, not necessarily "the player". Don't hate the player, hate the game...just brilliant!!
We all would love to sell our work. Even make a living out of it. But with anything I suppose. If these collectors buy up "so-called master pieces" what's the point if nobody gets to see these master pieces? I would love my work to be seen by everyone. If it was a master piece....
3.30 you said it, My Navaho Indian guide' plugging a mystic sense to it all, he admits has been there before! because he knew the timing and taken an image, and with his story it changed, he has created what some want to see and hear, the spiritual side of an image. Its ok but I would not want it on my wall. bit like the tennis/bottom girl of the 70's not the nest but sold a million. personally, I like your images, I can related to them.
Hmm, I understand where you are going and I follow a pretty distance, but this Peter Lik character is too much imho. This is the thousands words saved, used to sell the picture, it is the emperors new cloths. But someone is willing to pay 6,5 million for this blabla. Tempting.....😂
".....and as is often attributed to P.T. Barnum, There's a sucker born every minute." Like when I found out the true story of "Migrant Woman", how many "just right" moments were there to get this shot? Or how many images were blended in the lightroom. It's not the same with view cameras and "Moonrise". The only prints I have purchased were ones where I have known the photographer and to a degree could know just how much BS I was wading through. "Migrant Woman" went from a compelling photograph to mere propaganda for a political purpose.
You need to take Peter Lik’s claims with a large piece of salt. As for Phantom No evidence exists to support the existence of this sale. Lik’s claim that he sold an image is not evidence. The anonymous bidder has never been identified. The picture has never been seen since the claimed sale. The original colour picture ‘Ghost’ from which ‘Phantom’ was made sold for $15,860 The second hand value of his prints is very low and not the investment he claims to gullible buyers. He is just a marketing trickster IMO
That's interesting. Reading his bio on his web site, he does seem rather full of himself, and then on his WIkiPedia entry it references the fact that his sales claims are a matter of some dispute. Indeed, the headline from a story about him is "Rekordfoto oder Rekordschwindel?" which you don't need to speak German to suss out. Regardless, his photography is undoubtedly brilliant.
Peter Lik is a great marketer and his multimillion dollar sales are nothing but marketing stunts. His galleries are made for unsophisticated buyers who are sold the idea of investing in the art... Nobody would pay more than $10k for a large good print.
As an owner of two Lik prints, I'm not unsophisticated. I knew full well that these prints were not and are not an investment. Yes, the sales people went on and on about that but I knew better. I bought them because I liked the images and had places in my home where I could put them. Nothing more. Investment? No. Art? Not great art for sure. Pleasing to have and fill up a blank wall. Definitely. Lots of other photographers have made photos that would have worked equally well, But how many of them have a gallery where I can see their works, can print 1m x 1.5m, and deliver.
TBF, just because someone uses digital gymnastics to create a photo doesn't IMHO make those images questionable - they just are what they are. A cursoiry glance at some of them and it;s quite clear there are composites. Then you end up down the rabbit hole of what is photography and where does it end?
@@ThePhotographicEye composites, that’s what I was trying to say. Photoshop in and of itself isn’t a bad thing in moderation. It’s when a “photographer” takes elements from different times/places and combines them that I’m not a fan of. If you can’t capture the shot you envision in one take then you might as well call yourself a “digital artist” rather than a photographer... An analogy would be the difference between analog music and taking that same music back into the studio and mixing it to make it “perfect”. Sure the end result is pleasing, but the artist never played it like that.
I do not like Lik’s images. I do not believe them. I would rather have yours Alex. I know that is what a car park looks like, with or without ‘dust’. ❤️😍😘🤐🤐🤐🤐
Lik is so overrated--much more gimmick/hype than true art. Not that he doesn't know what he's doing, but his work is much more of a gallery/collector-oriented commodity than museum/discussion-worthy material. Visually impressive, but it just doesn't "resonate" with me (like over-produced pop music--more style than substance). Your point is spot-on regarding technical aspects of photos--nobody other than other aspiring photographers care about hardware/settings (and they shouldn't either). Punctum matters more than studium. If what you see inspires you to make an image, then it's logical to conclude that others will be similarly moved if you effectively communicate your vision (and timing is a result of experience and luck, not divine intervention).
Unlike all the drooling masses, I find your photos uninteresting. All of them to me seem devoid of the human element. Busy places with no soul. To me it seems odd and out of place. I get that is what you are going for but I don’t know that I will ever get the why. Why capture what is ignored and for the most part with good reason? But that is art,right? It is subjective. What one finds great value in, another may only see trash. Before some jerk comes in here to comment on my words, understand this. I am ENTITLED to my opinion. You are entitled to yours. But the minute you throw yours under my comment, you trying to push mine away. Go post your comment in your own your own area and leave my area alone. With that being said, I will conclude. Most certainly if you can make decent images, most certainly there is someone out there who might like them. However, few will invest just because they like something. It will take meeting the right person who will shout your name to the sky to get you noticed by the buyers, no matter how great your photos and story is. It is sad but often the truth is.
Thank for you sharing you opinon about my images, and yes, of course you're entitled to it. The world would be a very dull place if we all liked the same thing. You're also not the first person to say that they (the images) leave them cold. I do think it's a bit harsh to open with 'drooling masses' though. I'm reading quite a bit of aggressiveness in your comment which I feel sets people off on the wrong foot. By all means share your opnion, just don't present it as the opening salvo in an argument. I appreciate you've taken the time to watch the video and comment on the photos.
@@ThePhotographicEye well, I could have used the word that kids use these days. What is it? Oh yeah…simp. America has a lot of problems with sheeple. You just get sick of it. Too many people afraid to speak their minds. I do apologize, but I did not point to anyone specific either. Take care!
Visit alexkilbee.com to see the print collections on offer
I'm so happy for you with the print sales. I remember maybe a year ago, or a little more you said you didn't even like showing your photos in your videos. You restricted those visuals to other photographers. Gradually we got to see more and more of your work and we were finally able to see the world through your eyes. I really love the body of work you have put together and think it's amazing how you can be so consistent with how you read these mundane scenes. You make people take notice!
Hi Greg,
Thanks so much for that comment.
I was quite nervous TBH about showing my own photography on such a public platform, but over time, as you noticed, I injected my own images in there. I'm pleased you like them :D
I met Peter Lik once - he does so much different, the shots are the shots...but when you see them huge format...on a timber packing...in great lighting in a viewing space....put a high tag on it...sell a narrative....and he has nailed it with well shot and wdited screen savers! Genius and a gent.
Your enthusiasm for your images can clearly be seen in this video which I applaud. Your ability to create art out of the everyday and mundane is a rare gift so few have. I hope your print launch gives you the success you so richly deserve. I take huge amounts of inspiration from you in my own photography so thank you for that. 🙂
Thanks Tony. I really appreciate it.
Also standing up in the kitchen is helping :D
Such a brillliant and important message. One of many reasons why I love photography is that, a photograph is a still image that tells more than a single image. Because a photograph isn't moving, it's stuck in time and space, and always makes us think and imagine.
I've got no doubt that story telling is very important in photography even in videography. But I think it's relatively easier in videography because the images can move. But when the right story is told very well in photography, the impact is much more powerful in my opinion.
I am surprisingly terrible at story telling 😄(I'm not trying to be humble at all) but this video makes me think about storytelling more and deeper. I believe that is a sign that my story telling skills are very slowly but gradually improving.
Thank you so much Alex! :D
Thanks for watching
Every time I am in Key West I visit the Peter Lik gallery. His staff presents the photos in viewing room where the lighting is controlled and the prints are truly impressive. They also run a video where he talks about the stories behind his prints. A very worthwhile experience.
You’re SOOOO very motivating. Thank you. I needed that! And that’s why I listen to you Alex!
You are so welcome!
It was fun watching your face and listening to your voice as you relived your experience as you took your photos. I appreciate you sharing your passion for photography.
Thank you so much!
I love your enthusiasm, Alex. It makes me think about my own photography more. 👍
Great to hear!
You hit my soft spot in my work...simplicity, wonder, story, detail. Thank you
Glad you enjoyed it!
I never thought about this much. One reason is that the people I share my photos with seem not to be interested in any story about the image. I got it into my head that it was a universal thing. That is, that people don't care about that and would prefer I not bore them with it. I figure it would be a different matter when among other photographers, though. Thank you for showing that many people do care about the story and that it adds to their enjoyment of the image.
You find the quiet in busy places. From a introvert: I love that.
Alex, this is one of the best videos you’ve made, quite introspective and a perfect follow up to your Saturday Selections newsletter last weekend in which you discussed this subject. Since reading it, I’ve been thinking about this question myself in order to find a deeper understanding of my photography.
Glad you enjoyed it.
I've been giving the matter some thought recently and felt it would be helpful to document them
Thank you very much! Your channel is very unique among all TH-cam channels about photography. Please continue what you are doing! It gives me great inspiration and lot education in photography and arts as well...
Thank you for watching
This was great. Thank you for sharing the Why behind your photography, Alex. Gives me much to think about
My pleasure!
Alex your videos are fantastic. This one in particular is so telling. I can see you doing dozens of videos dedicated to the subject you covered today. It is so deep and ripe for further exploration.
Thank you so much. I'm glad you're enjoying them
Alex, your presentations like this one are the reason that I subscribe and look forward to your videos. You are among the very few who discuss the "why" rather than the "how". Your thoughtful discussions are the best. Thank you!!
Glad you like them! Thanks for watching and commenting. Appreciate it
A good story about how a wee bit of a backstory can add so much more to a photo image. Thank you! Airports are fascinating places and I fell in love with Eero Saarinen’s soaring Jet Age terminal at JFK Airport that has been restored to its 1962 glory. It was designed to have a minim of signage, letting all the curves and glass simply and quietly guide passengers and visitors to their destination. Cheers!
Our pleasure!
This was great! It's something I have been thinking about for a while and I loved your take:)
Thanks for watching
Thanks for making me think about why I like certain images I take and giving me the cue to add descriptions about the story on photos I submit to various sites. Thank you for sharing thought provoking information throughout all your videos they're a great learning tool.
My pleasure
The problem with Facebook photography groups is that there are a lot with a rule that you must post camera, lens and settings or risk being banned. I have a writers degree and would love to see more photos with a story attached
Really? The TPE FB group doesn't require this.
Seems a pretty pointless and pedantic thing to require.
Thanks for watching - if you like images with stories attached, check out Obie Oberholzer (he's also on Facebook)
Thank you. This video finally summed up what I was noticing for several weeks in my photography.
What was it you were noticing?
@@ThePhotographicEye that the story gets more attention/engagement. Story can be one or two words
I give all my photos titles for this very reason. It doesn't have to be profound but it gives me a chance in just a few words to give the image a bit of context. Be it through references, word association or juxtaposition. If it holds people's attention for a few seconds longer or from a different perspective, it's achieved it's goal. Great video (as always) Alex 👍
Thank you for watching
@@ThePhotographicEye As of today I will also be giving a short paragraph with my photos. I don't care about likes, but I feel its a nice reminder why we post what we post 👍
Your videos are all absolutely stunning
Thank you so much!
Wonderful content, I love your true enthusiasm. Love this ‘story’ idea. Awesome. This is great value. Thank you.
Thanks so much!
Great insight into building a coherent story about an image, doesn't hurt to make a bit of a show about the motivation and often unique moment which was captured
I've never heard of Peter Lik, until I watched this!
He is what he is - some people like him, others aren't so keen.
What do you think?
@@ThePhotographicEye From what I've seen thus far, the photos are undoubtedly very pretty, highly stylised and heavily 'Photoshopped', but they lack emotional value to myself. To me, photos require 3 basic elements, i.e. composition, lighting and 'story telling'. It is the last element that I am referring to, but that is highly subjective and individualistic.
One of the most important videos you have made for a artist (photographer). To tell an interesting story about the work to create interest. An artist statement. Then I saw how you were inspired by the principle to apply it to you work. I will take your advice.
Wow, thank you!
Totally with you when you say "total simplicity of lines..."
Totally! Thanks for watching :D
Connections. It's all about who you know.
Always enjoy your thoughtful insight. Speaking about your photography is certainly an art. On the opposite side of the equation, there have been a handful of well known photographer's who have actually ruined some aspect of their work for me BY talking about it. There are some circumstances where a bit of mystery behind a photograph (and the photographer!) works better.
I love your videos...the more I watch them the more I appreciate your insight and perspective. This video was excellent as you explore the impact/value of having a story to go with the photograph. There is a belief out there (and I'm not saying it's wrong) that the photograph, a good photograph, tells a story, in and of itself without someone standing there telling you what you're looking at and without a special musical backtrack trying to add to the mood of the viewer. Your example of reading Peter Lik's story/caption for the Antelope Canyon shot was compelling in demonstrating the point.
That said I also wanted to comment on some of YOUR photos that you've included as part of this video. I'll start by saying I liked every single one of them. I find the geometric shapes interesting and how you've taken the ordinary and made it extraordinary demonstrates your seriously good photography chops. There is something that caught my eye in a somewhat distracting way...and I should say that I allowed myself to be distracted because of the emphasis I have when doing architectural photography, particular for clients. And that's ensuring that the vertical lines of walls and windows are actually vertical. And before anyone takes issue with that I'll quickly add that I know they don't have to me, and often times they are not either for creative reasons or for practical reasons. However, if your verticals are not vertical, I think that should look more intentional in your images, and by that I mean when they look close, but aren't quite, then either straighten them up, or skew them at bit more (in post if necessary) to show that it's intentional and not an accidental oversight. Last point--please accept my comments in the constructive way I'm intending them. Your images show an intuition and skill that I wish I had.
Thank you for your comments and watching the channel.
I wondered if you’d consider a talk on approaches to editioning prints.
Limited editions are common, and I’ve reluctantly taken that approach so far - in spite of preferring open editions - because it’s often preferred by galleries.
I imagine the impact of the photographer's ability to write and compose their thoughts and emotions to capture their story would really have a large impact on their photography success. I can think of two photographers that are actually great at writing and suspect this helped with creating and placing images to convey their story. I'm thinking of Lewis Carroll and Sally Mann.
Thanks for sharing.
Our pleasure!
I own two Peter Lik prints, both large and so expensive. Why Peter Lik and not some other photographer? Mostly because of his gallery. My wife and I had been looking for a work of art to go in a specific spot for years. We walked into a Lik gallery and saw an image we liked that would fit. The sales people went on and on about art and investment. None of that mattered. We didn’t think it was great art but we liked it and(lucky us) could afford it. We found another we also liked so bought two. And they delivered. Painless. We bought from Lik not because he is a superior artist but because of superior customer service. I’m sure there are other photographers whose work we would have been equally satisfied with but we didn’t know about them or how to get their works in our house.
You made all excellent points.
Thank you for this video. Ive been to his exhibition twice in Miami. Cheers from Poland :)
Thanks for watching
Fascinating 👍
Thank you for watching
First the bad news, I was completely put off by Lik's use of someone throwing dust into the air, which turned this picture into a plastic, phony Hollywoodesque production. It feels dirty and untoward. Now the good news, great video, loaded with things to ponder. I wish you massive success tomorrow when you kick off your print sales. I'm fresh out of million dollar bills, but I will definitely come looking.
Thanks for watching
2:55 _"timing is everything"_
You know, i'm not about reading what others did or watching big photographers to be like them or who knows what. Like all the things i do in my life.
By no mean, I don't deny them.
But i'm me. I love abstract, action, sport photography. And some street photography from time to time. At least when i was healthier. Now, i can't do ****. But, i did a lot, more than 10 years.
And, coming back to what that photographer said, yes that's it. How mostly all things in life are.
TIMING! And being in the right moment at the right time...
I watched henry Cartier Bresson documentary and i loved the way it is written and put into light. He also said in his journey that many of his photos are pure luck. Just being at the right moment in time.
He also gave the example for the _Muhammad Ali vs. Sonny Liston_ photo taken by _Neil Leifer_. If i remember right this is the case, when Bresson said that there were 2 photographers. But only one had the chance to immortalize that photo... And that's how your luck in life comes in place. JUST for being at the right moment and at the right time...
Eh... I love this kind of stories and i also was surprising me being this way. And i just took that shot no matter what others around me thought i do or how i look... With my phone, camera or who knows what other concoction ;-)
Cheers!
When you put your images up for sale perhaps you should put an audio track under each image. Telling the story.. Or maybe even a short video clip.
Hi Alex, some really good advice that will help us stand out from other photographers. You can have a photo taken by a professional, and the same photo from an enthusiast but it's the photo that has the great story to it will sell the most. And it might just be the enthusiast who will have the best story line. Airports are great places to take photos. There are compositions just waiting to be snapped. Thanks for your great advice and good luck for the launch of your prints. 😊
Thank you
@@ThePhotographicEye Your very welcome Alex 😊
The true story about the picture Phantom is actually really fishy, in fact a known friend of Peter Lik bought it from him, which makes you think if the photo is really that special, without the high price tag.
Sales of any type of art are rarely tied to anything resembling intrinsic value.
Looked up Perter Lik and which camera system he uses. Linhof Technorama 617s III panoramic film camera. Out of my league.
To me Lik's description borders on the bee ess if not diving headlong into it. I see this sort of stuff in the oil painting magazines, it's like if some pseudo-intellectual nonsense is not included to describe it the expectation is that it will not sell. Maybe that is the lesson of experience, they want to sell artwork so they come up with some overly verbose stuff to grease the skids. It's all of a form, and one artist in particular went into this lengthy description. I don't remember exactly, but it was something along the lines of I explore the juxtaposition of the public and private and where they interface. It just went on and on in that vein. Translation: Her paintings were of people sitting on window sills as seen from the outside of buildings.
So, for what it is worth, my opinion is that if one's images don't speak for themselves they are not quality images. If one needs to write a paragraph to explain it it is not a sign of a successful image. If writing is one's joy in life write novels and poetry instead. The point of an image is to "speak" in a way words cannot.
But I'll add that Cascone really seems to have a case of sour grapes, and no small amount of snobbery. Honestly, what's it to her that inexperienced collectors like his work (or Kinkaid's)? Maybe those who like Taylor Swift or Lady Gaga aren't experienced listeners of music like someone who likes Beethoven and the like. If if brings joy to people's lives so what?
I was in Florida and did stumble across one of the Kincaid galleries. It is remarkable how he did achieve a palpable feeling of light no matter how much his naysayers say it's cheesy.
Art, by nature, is subjective anyway.
I like that line from the Rataouille cartoon uttered by the character Anton Ego toward the end, something like the average piece of garbage has more value than the critic declaring it so because someone DID try to create something which the critics don't do. The theater crowd often says of critics that they are the ones who couldn't make it as actors, and thus have an axe of bitterness to grind.
There always seems to a level of snobbery when it comes to any art form.
Jack Vetriano springs to mind aswell.
I can't but help feel that, and whilst I don't really care for Peters images, a lot of the arrows pointed at him and others like him are simply from a POV of critics et al thinking that people like this are debasing 'art'.
Thanks for this episode on communicating the stories of our images. It has given me something to think very seriously about. You may be sorry about the monster that you have released when you see the upcoming results on the Facebook page. I, for one, can tend toward the verbose. 😊
Haha - not to worry. one of my favourite photographers (Obie Oberholzer) writes lengthy stories to go with his photos
It's note the story in the image, but the story behind the image that often separates the image from the rest of the images. There are many technically 'perfect' images, many very thoughtful images taken every minute but too often none of these images have a the 'backstory' told about them.
Alex,
I love your images. Your comments on Peter Lik are right on. His marketing is fantastic, probably better than his images.
Thanks - gald you enjoyed it
10:49 That’s what my wife says about my work: that I capture things people pass by and don’t see.
I always talk about my photos, when I put them online.
Thank you for the thoughtful topic. There's something a bit sleazy about Lik's operation. I'd rather have a picture with a story behind it, or at least a message, by Edward Burtynsky. For pure emotional enjoyment I'd like a monochrome portrait by Yousuf Karsh, perhaps Hemmingway, Ingrid Berman or better, a young Audrey Hepburn.
BTW, congratulations!
Thanks!
I think images should stand in their own right, without all the verbal garbage that fools the credulous. If people want to pay silly money for smoke to be blown up their nether parts that's up to them, but the real greats of photography gave their images the simplest names imaginable. It should be the image that tells the story, not the blurb.
I love writing a little story or adding a quote to explain what I was thinking doing the image. But I've seen so many professional photographers saying don't? People should be aloud to make their own thoughts about a piece of work. There's so many contradictions in photography. There's a wonder any images get done. It's a good thing most go there're own way.
I'm of the camp that begrudges even giving my photos a title.
If a photo needs a title, perhaps its a photo that falls short of conveying the intent of taking it, or giving it a title limits the imagination of the viewer to make their own interpretation.
I have to wonder how much embellishment goes into Peter Lik's descriptions at times, it comes across as pure marketing to me, like a realtor's flowery description of a property for sale.
Like you say he knows his market, and for the person looking for a quality print that goes with the curtains and comes with a little story to tell their admiring house guests, his galleries are a one stop shop.
TBH I never really title my images, and I appreciate where you're coming from. However there is a business to selling images so in this regard, certainly for me, if I can present the print in a way that increases the possibility of sale, then I'm happy to experiment with it
I can appreciate a story behind a photo if it’s journalistic / documentary in nature, but in general I prefer photos doing most of the talking.
Alex introspective? I'm shocked, I tell you. Shocked!
I know. I was shocked too!
Ugh, Peter Lik is the absolute worst example you could have used. His sales tactics have gotten him in trouble with the art world and at times with the authorities. You say he is “popular with collectors” but remember there is NO secondary market for his work to speak of, so his actual popularity with collectors is very much a matter of speculation. By all descriptions his buyers are unsophisticated and are not collectors at all, or if they are collectors they frequent the galleries of Las Vegas and Park City. (Galleries that cater to buyers with far more money than sense) Lik is probably very rich and has achieved a certain kind of success but he's not someone we should hope to emulate at all.
Anyway, your point here is very simple, it’s about what art theorists and critic Hal Foster calls “finishing the work.” Turns out there are a lot of ways to do it. Someone like Sally Mann has done a good job over the years creating a mythology around herself talking about things like her “second sight.” Sculptor Richard Serra did exactly what you say we shouldn’t do, he talked extensively about the methods of production of his work. Painter Mark Bradford ties his biography to the meaning and form of his works very well. Richard Moss is also very good at creating a narrative around his works that reinforces the idea that it’s important for its ability to reveal hidden aspects of human crisis. Other artists are silent about their work and it creates a sense of mystery. there is no right or wrong way to finish the work, but we should probably get some help figuring out which method to use and why.
I agree. I think of him more as Peter 'Ilk.' He is probably a better discussion point around the business of art, rather than any meaningful journey into artistic expression. He has been able to create his own market value through a syndicated sales process that goads people into a sale for fear of missing out. The NYT had a pretty good write up on his his questionable business practices.
Fantastic photos but shrouded in a little controversy (see Fstoppers and Artnet). It raises the issue of how much a photograph can be edited or manipulated and still be called a photograph. I think the images are fantastic and the stories associated point to a master of marketing as much as a master of photography.
The debate about digital manipulation is one I think I'll poke with a stick at some point soon :D
Selling sizzle instead of steak. Been going on for centuries.
He's packaging the commercial crap into his photography
Many, if not a majority, of Lik's photos, including a number in the video, are assembled digitally from a variety of separate images. The argument that they are distinguished by have been exposed at the right time and right place is pure misinformation. Others are nice photos, like the opening B&W taken near the entrance of Upper Antelope Canyon outside Page, Arizona, (the light ray beaming down), repeated in color at 3:08, are common as dirt. (Pun intended) I have a dozen similar photos from my past trips there. Moreover, those light rays are artificial, being obtained by throwing dirt into the air where the light is shining down. If you don't throw the dirt, you don't get the shot. On the other hand, everyone has seen this image from dozens of "Not Peter Lik" sources, so all the tourists want to see it. So the guides line them all up in rows and then throw the dirt for them. I'm not saying that this is an uninteresting photo, but it's so common that no "collector" worth the name would spend more than $50 for a nice print, assuming that he can't just go and take it for himself. Lik's gallery employees may be able to may be able to tease tens of thousands of dollars out of some self-styled collector, but Lik's stuff is likely to sell for big bucks only at the point of origin.
And that is the point exactly. People talk about 'ghost' (and other Lik images) because of the story he builds around them, and himself.
On a personal level I'm not a fan of his stuff, but I appreciate the lessons one can learn about making images stand out in a crowd
Flip that airport picture at 8:45 upside down and have a look at it
Table leg?
I don't care for it. I wouldn't hang it on my wall, but the story is interesting. I don't believe in right place right time. I believe photography is about seeing and making creative decisions about the shot
Photography is extremely subjective,Like wallpaper . The Phantom photo is a calendar pic and has nothing about it for me to look at it again. Now I’m beginning to understand why a lot of professional photographers like Polaroid pics because it has content like that video you did with the lads getting splashed by the car in the rain taken in the seventies. I can look at the photo for ages❤
You deleted my comment?
Analysis of data from the early years of eBay (before it was dominated by commercial sellers and Chinese junk exports) showed that a trivial item sold with a story that catches the public imagination, fetches 10s to 1000s of % more than a similar trivial item alone. Whereas art prices used to be controlled by competence plus who the artist knew and reputation, now art prices are controlled by notoriety and who the artist knows; competence rarely enters into the equation. This isn't to imply that Lik is incompetent, so much as that his competence is not entirely relevant.
I have always been thinking…. How difficult would it be for Peter Lik to fake that sale? Truth is, it is easy.. I read in the comments that one of his friends bought the photo.. I don’t know, but for him to fake that sale would have been very benefitial and too easy. He is known to fake his photos to the absurd.. why not fake a sale?
I believe that there was confirmation from a lawyer regarding the sale, but hey ho, one never knows.
@@ThePhotographicEye So a professional liar confirmed the sale😂. I have no doubt that there was a sale, but the marketing value of that sale exceeds the price for the photo.. I think that if it had been sold through a gallery, auction of something like that, then maybe.. it is too easy to fake a sale like that.
Did he? Peter Lik is a mixed bag. I think he is brilliant at marketing, I'll give him that. But there are rumbles it was a gimmick with that "Ghost" sale. But hey, don't hate the player...hate the game.
Don't hate the player, hate the game...that's brilliant...I've never heard that but I'm going to use it, a lot! The sentiment behind it is what I see when people criticize a rich person or company that doesn't pay their "fair share" of taxes... what they don't understand or are unwilling to accept is that these people/companies are exploiting the laws and accounting rules that exist--i.e., the "game". And in that vane, it's the tax laws that should be, and are fair game for being criticized, not necessarily "the player". Don't hate the player, hate the game...just brilliant!!
We all would love to sell our work. Even make a living out of it. But with anything I suppose. If these collectors buy up "so-called master pieces" what's the point if nobody gets to see these master pieces? I would love my work to be seen by everyone. If it was a master piece....
3.30 you said it, My Navaho Indian guide' plugging a mystic sense to it all, he admits has been there before! because he knew the timing and taken an image, and with his story it changed, he has created what some want to see and hear, the spiritual side of an image. Its ok but I would not want it on my wall. bit like the tennis/bottom girl of the 70's not the nest but sold a million. personally, I like your images, I can related to them.
Hmm, I understand where you are going and I follow a pretty distance, but this Peter Lik character is too much imho. This is the thousands words saved, used to sell the picture, it is the emperors new cloths.
But someone is willing to pay 6,5 million for this blabla. Tempting.....😂
".....and as is often attributed to P.T. Barnum, There's a sucker born every minute." Like when I found out the true story of "Migrant Woman", how many "just right" moments were there to get this shot? Or how many images were blended in the lightroom. It's not the same with view cameras and "Moonrise". The only prints I have purchased were ones where I have known the photographer and to a degree could know just how much BS I was wading through. "Migrant Woman" went from a compelling photograph to mere propaganda for a political purpose.
According to Peter Lik, digital manipulation is everything!
You need to take Peter Lik’s claims with a large piece of salt. As for Phantom No evidence exists to support the existence of this sale. Lik’s claim that he sold an image is not evidence.
The anonymous bidder has never been identified. The picture has never been seen since the claimed sale.
The original colour picture ‘Ghost’ from which ‘Phantom’ was made sold for $15,860
The second hand value of his prints is very low and not the investment he claims to gullible buyers. He is just a marketing trickster IMO
That's interesting. Reading his bio on his web site, he does seem rather full of himself, and then on his WIkiPedia entry it references the fact that his sales claims are a matter of some dispute. Indeed, the headline from a story about him is "Rekordfoto oder Rekordschwindel?" which you don't need to speak German to suss out. Regardless, his photography is undoubtedly brilliant.
Peter Lik is a great marketer and his multimillion dollar sales are nothing but marketing stunts.
His galleries are made for unsophisticated buyers who are sold the idea of investing in the art... Nobody would pay more than $10k for a large good print.
As an owner of two Lik prints, I'm not unsophisticated. I knew full well that these prints were not and are not an investment. Yes, the sales people went on and on about that but I knew better. I bought them because I liked the images and had places in my home where I could put them. Nothing more. Investment? No. Art? Not great art for sure. Pleasing to have and fill up a blank wall. Definitely. Lots of other photographers have made photos that would have worked equally well, But how many of them have a gallery where I can see their works, can print 1m x 1.5m, and deliver.
I’ve heard that Peter Lik uses a lot of Photoshop to “get” his photos, thus they’re all questionable images…
Personally I don’t care for his work.
TBF, just because someone uses digital gymnastics to create a photo doesn't IMHO make those images questionable - they just are what they are.
A cursoiry glance at some of them and it;s quite clear there are composites.
Then you end up down the rabbit hole of what is photography and where does it end?
@@ThePhotographicEye composites, that’s what I was trying to say. Photoshop in and of itself isn’t a bad thing in moderation. It’s when a “photographer” takes elements from different times/places and combines them that I’m not a fan of. If you can’t capture the shot you envision in one take then you might as well call yourself a “digital artist” rather than a photographer...
An analogy would be the difference between analog music and taking that same music back into the studio and mixing it to make it “perfect”. Sure the end result is pleasing, but the artist never played it like that.
I do not like Lik’s images. I do not believe them. I would rather have yours Alex. I know that is what a car park looks like, with or without ‘dust’. ❤️😍😘🤐🤐🤐🤐
Thank you ☺️
Lik is so overrated--much more gimmick/hype than true art. Not that he doesn't know what he's doing, but his work is much more of a gallery/collector-oriented commodity than museum/discussion-worthy material. Visually impressive, but it just doesn't "resonate" with me (like over-produced pop music--more style than substance). Your point is spot-on regarding technical aspects of photos--nobody other than other aspiring photographers care about hardware/settings (and they shouldn't either). Punctum matters more than studium. If what you see inspires you to make an image, then it's logical to conclude that others will be similarly moved if you effectively communicate your vision (and timing is a result of experience and luck, not divine intervention).
Unlike all the drooling masses, I find your photos uninteresting. All of them to me seem devoid of the human element. Busy places with no soul. To me it seems odd and out of place. I get that is what you are going for but I don’t know that I will ever get the why. Why capture what is ignored and for the most part with good reason? But that is art,right? It is subjective. What one finds great value in, another may only see trash.
Before some jerk comes in here to comment on my words, understand this. I am ENTITLED to my opinion. You are entitled to yours. But the minute you throw yours under my comment, you trying to push mine away. Go post your comment in your own your own area and leave my area alone.
With that being said, I will conclude. Most certainly if you can make decent images, most certainly there is someone out there who might like them. However, few will invest just because they like something. It will take meeting the right person who will shout your name to the sky to get you noticed by the buyers, no matter how great your photos and story is. It is sad but often the truth is.
Thank for you sharing you opinon about my images, and yes, of course you're entitled to it. The world would be a very dull place if we all liked the same thing. You're also not the first person to say that they (the images) leave them cold.
I do think it's a bit harsh to open with 'drooling masses' though. I'm reading quite a bit of aggressiveness in your comment which I feel sets people off on the wrong foot. By all means share your opnion, just don't present it as the opening salvo in an argument.
I appreciate you've taken the time to watch the video and comment on the photos.
@@ThePhotographicEye well, I could have used the word that kids use these days. What is it? Oh yeah…simp. America has a lot of problems with sheeple. You just get sick of it. Too many people afraid to speak their minds. I do apologize, but I did not point to anyone specific either. Take care!