No Seriously, Classical Music Is Dying
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 พ.ค. 2024
- How did classical music fall so far? Why is it dying? And honestly, do we even care?
ARTICLES
-The Impending Finality of Classical Music 👉 www.afterglowatx.com/blog/202...
-Is Classical Music Dying? 👉 www.nytimes.com/2012/11/25/op....
-The Fatal X 👉 www.newyorker.com/culture/ale...
-All the Things that Have Been 'Killing' Classical Music Over the Centuries 👉 www.classicfm.com/discover-mu...
EXTRA VIDEOS
-The Birth of Jazz 👉 • The Birth of Jazz
-The History of Rock and Roll 👉 • History of Rock & Roll...
⏱ TIMESTAMPS
0:00 an opinion of classes
1:00 relevance, relatively speaking
2:04 or 'why classical music sounds so bad in headphones'
4:18 bought the t-shirt
5:46 cait gets on a literal soapbox
6:22 when composers were basically BTS
8:08 that ramen life
10:30 the new aristocrats
12:12 so are we saving ourselves orrrrr
15:15 in which cait gets a little whiteboard happy
STUFF USED
🎹 Piano
Hoffman, ~1930
C.Bechstein, Czech Republic
MUSIC
🎶 Epidemic Sound
🎶 IMSLP (recordings used are all in the public domain)
📝 My favorite iPad sheet music reader - ForScore -
forscore.co/
WHO AM I:
Hiya! 👋 I’m Cait, a normal person with a normal job who happened to get all her degrees in opera. Even though I don’t sing full time anymore, I’ll always love the art (of course!), so now I make videos to help make opera feel more accessible and relevant to people living in, you know, not 1800.
GET IN TOUCH:
I’d love to hear from you! I bucked socials a while ago so until I can afford a social media manager, reaching out through the contact form on my website (coming soon!) is definitely the way to go.
🌷 Cait - เพลง
I majored in composition. The HUGE problem in the academic world is the emphasis on atonal music. Audiences do not want to hear it. Composers are encouraged to emulate Schoenberg, Webern, and Berg, instead of Hayden, Mozart, and Beethoven.
Oh, this is a really good point, I totally agree! It begs the question: who is classical music for?
Atonal is absolute suicide if classical music wants to survive lol I can’t stand it. It’s so bad .. I put it next to death screamo metal on my personal list of music I really dislike lol
@@PeaceNinja007
does nikos skalkottas count as an atonal composer? i think his music is pretty good and definitely tolerable to the average person in the street
@@vaylard9474 I guess Im not the average person lol I couldn’t stand his music. He’s as atonal as it gets for me lol
It's hard to believe The Rite of Spring is over a 100 years old. 😂
People have been saying this for generations. Cheap seats to the symphony or opera cost less than the cheapest high end pop concert. And btw classical musicians do tour. Soloists do nothing but tour. Big orchestras tour as well.
Yes I couldn't figure out the tour comment either. As we all know orchestras do tour.
I think she was emphasizing, that they used to tour with their own original music. Pop artistst tour to spread their own music. Orchestras don't need to tour, as the music is avaible everywhere. You don't need the Sydney Symphony Orchestra in Berlin to perform Beethoven. But you do need "Taylor Swift" in Berlin to perform her music. Soloists tour, but the "only" thing they provide is old concertos (which I love, but let's face it, it's old!)
@@jameshaydn3341 a great orchestra/conductor provides their own unique interpretation of standard repertoire. Not to mention that they often play obscure music people hadn’t heard or even commission new music.
As a musician new music needs to make me feel like I'm not just pulling out the Abhans and drilling exercises. Recently played at an National Brass band competition and the set piece we had to play felt just like that. Even though it was a brand new composition
@@magiclover9346 I think your comment "As a musician" emphasises what this debate is really about. Musicians are dissatisfied with classical music if it doesn't give them a chance for a remunerative career with reasonable working conditions and/or a chance of self-actualisation. And to be fair it won't for most people. Cait Frizzel is making her comments following a vocal accident. An ungenerous person, like myself, might say her sentiment of "Classical Music Is Dying" is an example of sour grapes. As a consumer/listener I don't see it this way. I have more than enough classical music which I can listen to cheaply at any time and more than enough for the future if I want to expand my habits. So if you consider yourself a musician think about the art form from the point of view of the millions of little people. An art form isn't worthwhile if its not listened to and I'm not bothered if musicians feel there is nothing in it for them.
Interesting video but I think a lot of the points were iffy. The most problematic point though is the comparison of classical to bruno mars and other artists all doing the same elvis cover over and over. You stated this yourself correctly with the nutcracker example: this is not about the musicians, its about the composer or piece itself. The fact that there are multiple different performances of something just makes it more accessible rather than redundant as your point implies. Also the fact that orchestral works get replayed isnt really an issue either because since classical has existed for so long, its not really starved for content, there are so many incredible works that rarely get played, in a given year its very hard to find a single performance in the US for say Bruckner 1 for instance. Ive listened to so much classical and it would still take the rest of my life to continue to uncover still such a small part of it.
The biggest issue is that when people think about classical music they think about the most cliche and boring pieces, and when its "made modern", its just the boring stuff rehashed in a slightly more modern way, yet ultimately still cliche and overplayed. Everybody and their mothers know a grand total of 4 notes from Beethoven 5, but what about the rest? Pomp and circumstance, played at graduations, has an amazing second theme that nobody knows because the first part is played on a loop. Bach Toccatta and Fugue, same thing, the media just covers the opening 5 seconds of it.
People would like classical music if it were given the spotlight and attention on the world stage. We dont need something new, because already nobody knows Shostakovich or Bruckner or Mahler or Prokofiev (and soooo many more I could keep listing). The work these legends have produced are some of the most beautiful, epic, grandiose, powerful, and absolutely mind blowing earth shattering music to exist, but they are vastly unknown to the general public. The concert halls do their job of programming it, but people dont go because they dont give it a chance. In their minds they have already associated classical with some trivial early classical baroque style of music when really its so much more. That is the problem. Making something "new" where somebody is just rehashing Vivaldi 4 seasons (which is funnily enough the bruno mars example) is not going to fix this.
0.39 - I have never heard a single classical musician say this. Maybe the labels, but certainly not the musicians. Those few musicians that do say this don't get hired back after a little while.
2:28 - I really don't know what albums you're listening to. What albums sound muddy? Those volume changes might be the dynamic changes that are written in the music. I seriously doubt the producer is going ham at the controls and playing with the levels...
3:27 - "We want stereo sound!" Yes, as opposed to the mono sound that classical albums use....except they are also recorded in stereo sound. Mono hasn't been around for sometime now. I find it funny where she mentions the soundproof studio booth because I'm trying to imagine the logistical challenges with recording an ensemble. What do you do? Book the studio for a few years and give each musician a change to record their parts without letting them listen to their peers play with them?
3:45 - Really? Seriously? Apparently classical musicians are so stuck in the past that we haven't figured out the magic that is...anything greater than 1080p video quality.
4:40 - "It's never original music." David Bruce would like to have a word with you. While I do admit that contemporary music in the classical sphere does not get the coverage it sorely deserves, it's a bit foolish to say that "It doesn't exist."
7:05 - The practice of performing older composers works instead of primarily focusing on contemporary composers occurred earlier than that. Even when this happened though, there was still an emphasis on new music that doesn't exist today. Composers that had multiple works successfully premiere after 1900: Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Copeland, Bernstein, Ives. Contemporary music has had less focus, but it's not just because older music is performed.
7:45 - There you go again pretending contemporary classical music doesn't exist.
10:00 - Ensembles do tours. They may not be as frequent as pop artists, but they do exist. The pay scale of a musician varies greatly depending on where you look. Musicians in one of the big 5 might have a six figure salary (w/ the conductor making way too much money), but there are a variety of regional orchestras where the musicians make a fraction of that sum. Every ensemble is different and has a different financial situation. They're not one in the same here.
10:40 - This...really depends on where you're going to concerts. A ticket to the MET Opera will attract a different audience than that of your local symphony orchestra.
12:26 - Ownership model? You realize pop artists are owned by record companies with rich CEOs right? Also, a ticket to a symphony orchestra concert will often be cheaper than a ticket to any artist in the top 10 right now. I challenge you to look up your local symphony or other classical ensemble and check ticket prices. If it was truly only "For the elite", then the prices would at least match what Ariana Grande charges right?
As a side note, your sources are very odd. The first source is from 2021 and it a short blog post that is filled with conjecture. It makes the case that classical music is dying because of a few UT performances that didn't have large audiences (during a pandemic) and because of when it was written, it couldn't use any sources from a year later that show a little more positive outlook on classical music. The next two sources are a decade old and the final one is a Classic FM article that makes the case that classical music dying is hyperbole due to something new apparently killing it sprouting up every few years or so.
Don't get me wrong. I understand what this video is attempting to do. It's just makes so many wrong assumptions about classical music as it has existed, and currently exists, that the video seems completely pointless. For example, blaming the performance of dead composers music seems weird when you take into account that this has been the case since Felix Mendelssohn conducted the Gewandhaus Orchestra in the 1830s. The last time I checked, there were a lot of composers after 1830 that were successful in their careers (The big 5 in Russia, Tchaikovsky, Stravinsky, Debussy, Ravel, Copeland, Bernstein, and too many more to list here).
That's what I want to see, that's the seed for a discussion if she answers
@@radualexa1356 She won't answer.
Discussions like yours always remind me of a cartoon in the New Yorker that cracked me up: A well dressed couple is walking by a marquee announcing a Symphony program, which reads...."Now playing: Brahms Symphony Nr 1 in C minor, and Wet Tee Shirt Contest".....this is a perfect parody of what you are suggesting.......
What irritates me the most when it comes to Opera or Ballet is the modernization of librettos for them making them unenjoyable for younger and older audiences. How can I enjoy a fairy tale like The Magic Flute when everything is black and white and moody. Or putting Boris Godunov's plot in the middle of WW2 for artistic effect. It's simply annoying and very frustrating.
I think modern audiences are very tolerant of period pieces (or even passionate about them!) in other media such as TV and movies. If there were any reason to place Downton Abbey--or worse yet, the Lord of the Rings--in a setting that looks like the 21st century, then I might be more inclined to believe that there's a reason to modernize something like the Magic Flute. (As for vocal style, however, is it possible that the classical vocal style is a compromise between the need to sing beautifully and the need to make one's self heard over an orchestra without a microphone? Because that compromise may just be obsolete at this point.)
I am primarily an opera composer. I want my operas set in the periods I set them. Period.
This kind of silly crap kills the dramas. It's pretentious and plays intot he whole "elitism" argument.
"Oh we are just SO BORED with Carmen. Let's set it in outer space and have a 6'4" countertenor with a beard play her. And while we're at it let's set the whole thing in a bowling alley in the 1950s."
Barf.
The music is married to the drama in opera or ballet, just as it is in film score or even video games. It has to make sense in dramatic context. The setting is part of what makes an opera effective. Those "modernized" staging ruin the artform.
Its a common pattern, seen in Disney films too, alienate an existing audience to appeal to a different "modern" audience which may or may not exist. Unfortunately all you can do is not bother to go anymore which is sad for everybody. But hey the self-actualisation of the producers and cast is way more important than the audience.
To survive, classical music has to be advertized at least with the same intensity as the modern music is. Once you form the taste of the children they will like it. So, easy. So, schools, TV, Radio, .... all that should be full of classical music. Those are the 'taste forming institutions'. The question is: Why these institutions do not do that?
Very good question...I mean if .
modern day patrons are going to commission new works and concerts, why not promote these people and events??? It's like she said in the video, maybe they just don't want 15 year girls on Tik Tok during Rachmaninoff and so they keep it elite on purpose...we need a new system of patronage devoted to living composers and the recently deceased
Bugs Bunny cartoons really helped boomers and Gen X get exposed to classical music. Fact of the matter is that people will like classical music if it's presented in a way that's fun and engaging. I think one of the big problems is the very academic-focused and high brow culture that accompanies classical music. It's difficult for the average joe to get into and when people try, they are sneered at by the hipsters because they happen to like Canon in D or 'The Four Seasons' as opposed to Pierrot Lunaire by Shoenberg.
to survive classical music has to die
stop playing brahms and rahcmaninov over ansd over because this music is outdated and overplayed
start to play modern/contemporary regularly and see what happens
Hear me: Anime and Video game orchestras are and will thrive even more in the future. Because story is KING. And this is the relatability to the audience. Also some of the best music I have heard comes from these and the meaning*** behind it due to the story and characters. I have discovered some of my favourite composers of all time because of them. Some scores are better than the animation itself and even the story. Keep an eye out for this.
Over the years I've watched Studio Ghibli movies with my daughter. She for the animation and story, I for Joe Hisaishi's wonderful music.
Well said...and I love your optimistic outlook in this direction...if more living composers, who may not be writing for Anime or video games, could think more about STORY...they would be more successful too (new relevant operas, ballet scenes, symphonic poems, etc) today's audiences need guidance in this way, you're absolutely right!!!
You really have no clue. All of this is being done on purpose by bad actors. They want to tear down the foundations of society. It's called the fifth column.
I'm just a middle-class schlub who loves listening to Beethoven, Brahms, and Tchaikovsky symphonies and concertos over and over again, including sometimes in person. I'm okay if movie and video game music gets thrown in the mix, as long as it's not atonal. I hope "the system" doesn't ultimately take this away.
Re "I hope "the system" doesn't ultimately take this away". They are working on it. You look like a white man! This means all the hobbies, films and music you enjoy must be replaced by the message.
The symphony orchestra for the region i live in recently performed "die zauberflöte" for a family audience, which was in Danish instead of German and with an introduction to the story before. Ticket prices were an absolute steal too at, like, 13€ for adults and 6€ for children.
The hall was packed to the brim with families with children and elders alike. So I think this might be one way to go. It somewhat keeps the musical integrity in my opinion, while also being friendly towards new listeners.
That is something I see as a solution. The modernization to the max of classical music is something I don't like. Imagine going to a classical concert and seeing blinding lights and a see of fog. That is just distracting and takes away form the performance itself
Wow imagine like there was this magical thing called "music", something that has enough subtlety, nuance, complexity, that it allows for many perspectives, many interpretations, many feelings. Imagine an artistic manifestation that isn't just a disposable consumer product. What a wonderful thing that would be.
04:50
Why do you judge classical pieces by the same standards than four chords repeated over three minutes with some rhymed tropes overlayed? Why do you willfully ignore the idea of interpretation?
I love a melody, a tune. I've listened to new composers works and the ones I've listened to seem anti-melody. It's like they've been taught/instructed at their conservatoires that having a great melodic musical hook in their compositions is 'common' or low class, populist etc and should be avoided at all costs or they won't be taken seriously as a composer.
I hope the contemporary composers have other skills because their lack of listenable music output isn't going to sustain a composing career.
This is not as true as it used to be, but still...a very good point. If you think of the more recently 'popular' composers, like John Adams, Steve Reich, Philip Glass, Arvo Part and John Luther Adams, they have absolutely brilliant ideas and textures, but even they generally avoid the 'tune', and it does seem like academia still encourages originality over listenability, even if the serial methods aren't stressed as 'the way' as much as before...but I agree, melody needs to make a serious comeback in modern classical music. Composers should try to not worry so much about their peers and start writing music that they themselves would actually want to hear...then maybe we will have a new syntax
I started listening to symphonic metal bands like Epica and Haggard. I loved the voices and instruments, because of that I started listening to classical music and now im a huge fan of Opera. So in my case, it was metal music that made me love classical music
I went from rock and punk to Classical back in the early 1980s. I was seduced by the heaviest stuff, Wagner and Beethoven in particular. Later I went on to be an opera composer.
The overlap between classical and metal is pretty strong - most of my metal-loving friends also like classical music. Both genres stress instrumental elements (and virtuosity), high drama, and (at this point) are somewhat outside of the mainstream. And, classical music has been a big influence on metal since its formative years of bands like Deep Purple, Uriah Heep, and Scorpions.
I know that some time ago in Amsterdam they held piano concerts in cafe's and bars. One of the reasons why they did that was because there were plenty of people in their 20's and 30's who were into classical, however, they didn't like going to fancy places to listen to it.
I really like classical and jazz (which was even lower on that chart), but the snobby people who go to these (fancy) events really turn me off. To me, a world without these 2 genres of music being performed would be a less beautiful world, so I really hope they can reinvent themselves.
Why do you think, the recording tech in classical music sucks? I think, they are right on top of the field. Since recordings are a thing basically. I don't know, why you made this point, since you are right with most of the stuff, even though oversimplifying a bit.
You’re take on classical recordings is absurd.
I studied composition and classical guitar performance in conservatory school for a decade. Earned multiple degrees in both my undergraduate and graduate years. And honestly, I ended up quitting the entire genre. I now play more rock, metal, jazz, funk, jam, and pretty avoid classical altogether. Why?
Two main reasons:
1. The scene really is dying. There's therefore almost zero job opportunities in this field of classical music. And the two jobs I DID have as a teacher I lost, due to the fact that many of these schools unfortunately lost so much money in their programs recently, they couldn't find adjunct like myself after a year or so.
2. It's really not a stereotype that classical musicians are very elitist. I've experienced first hand the extreme levels of borderline narcissist personality disorder from many of these overly wealthy, yuppie prodigies, and snobby professors. It's pretty insufferable to be around those people, so honestly that was a major turning point in my genre switch.
Oh man, I’m sorry that was your experience. 😣 It sounds similar to mine too, it’s such a shame that such beautiful music has gotten wrapped up in so much nonsense. I was definitely one of those elitist musicians. If I hadn’t injured myself, god knows what kind of person I would have wound up becoming. I hope you feel more at home in your new genre work. 🙏
@@CaitFrizzell What kind of injury did you sustain?
@@PeaceNinja007 I hemorrhaged one of my vocal cords about 5 years into my professional career. 😕
@@CaitFrizzell Oh 🤭 Can’t even imagine how that happened .. or felt.
Hope you’re okay now
Opposite for me. Being Asian, ofc my parents forced Classical Piano down my throat. But during my teen years I rebelled, went all in on guitar playing rock, metal and jazz. Now, I'm in my 30s, going back to my classical roots, playing Classical Piano pieces. Sure, I never attended any conservatories, so I don't know how stuffy those people are; but I definitely find Classical music way more interesting than rock, metal or jazz.
Excellent Cait. Just discovered your YT site. As a product of the Royal Academy of music I’ve often asked myself why Classical musical has fallen from grace at so many levels. Whilst Rock n Roll has been my path since then I watch in awe my ‘classical’ friends continuing to pursue surely the toughest of musical careers. I find myself agreeing with your points of view wholeheartedly and commend your optimistic suggested ‘fix’. Keep up the great work !
Modern concert band composers have figured out that people want rhythm and melody and they are producing some of the finest classical music of the past century.
Frank Ticheli, Omar Thomas, John Mackey, Adam Schoenberg, and more are writing music that teenagers are falling in love with. Groups like the @DallasWinds are recording this music and making it available to everyone. If we can ride this lull out, there is hope.
Classical music is the best music we have and will never die but impossible to create something new in its garden. So, this is the reason why jazz is more actuell. Of course i love jazz as much as classical music.
Room sound: that's such a great point!! I've always loved piano solo (I play piano) but I also think I prefer listening to solo recordings like piano or cello partly because you can hear the rich little details of the instrument (e.g. hammer sounds of the piano). A full orchestra probably loses this detail because of what you pointed out.
Thank you so much for this video! I'm a young musician who is very much in love with classical tradition, but not that one of 20th century, but of those centuries before when people composed and performed, improvised their own music.
I write, improvise and perform only my music. 🥰
Still, there's something to be said about "cultural relevance". How long are current musical trends going to stay relevant, and further ahead ... what will we do when we run out of trends ?
I strongly doubt anyone will remember Taylor Swift a century or two from now.
That is, if music is still made by human beings by then
I've just recently begun composing, not academically trained and entirely self taught, and trying to get started as an original composer is daunting. I don't have the skills to play the works i write, so I'm left to ask others to do so, and most musicians know the odds of money are low. And i also compose in the "archaic" styles of classical music, not modern atonal.
I would argue to solve the death of classical music will take people seeing the composer differently. Most people don't take the word seriously anymore, or when they do, they expect this "greatness" like you're the second coming of Mozart. Musicians and composers will need to work together, it's not about "going solo" anymore. I think strong composing/performing pairs will be a way forward for the genre. Thanks for the video.
imo, classical recordings of the 90s into the 2000s were peak. the goal is to simulate the experience of sitting in a concert hall, and the reason why there is a massive industry of hi-res music and audio equipment, it compliments the genre well. i think if you want to raise your experience with listening to classical music you should probably start with your source, and then your equipment. a quality source (hi-res lossless audio, not streamed), with a quality DAC and amp paired with reference headphones (my preference; Sennheiser HD800S) helps a ton. things like dynamics, instrument separation, soundstage play a huge factor.
i've been a subscriber to my local orchestra for over 15 years now and i can attest that although it's difficult to simulate the experience of sitting at a concert hall and hearing every instrument sing harmoniously in sync, getting extremely close is a possibility. the only issue is, it's not cheap.
I completely agree, but it’s such a shame that’s the case. The cost is so prohibitive for so many people. I think I’d ultimately prefer having two experiences: the recorded and the live. That might also bring us closer to the relevance of other music genres in today’s world. Instead of catering to the 1% who have the equipment, why don’t we cater to the 99% who don’t?
Well put...it is another barrier to entry to have to get all this high end equipment to fully enjoy the classical experience-like you said, it's another elitist element to contend with, that potential new listeners will turn away from
So, what can we do about it though really??? Is it all about EQ, Compression, and Multitracking every single instrument and singer in a Mahler symphony to make it "punchy" enough for the kids to climb on board??? I'm not sure...I worked with a video/audio production company that recorded and filmed student orchestras and marching bands, etc...and I can personally attest that with a good orchestra in a GOOD room, the two condenser mics over the conductors head, really can produce a rich, powerful recording...especially for the homogeneous strings, but depending on that hall and the pieces performed, there are too many variables in that situation that make "room sound " just awful like you said...what about rearranging some of the orchestral seating to make a more balanced sound (in other words, in modern music, the bass register is always in stereo, but in the traditional orchestral set up, the bass is mainly to the right of the Sonic spectrum, making it a bit odd for modern ears-let alone the period being performed, etc) sorry this is so long, but what do you recommend about improving the recorded sound??? Love your video, editing, and delivery btw...especially kicking down the 4th wall for product placement LMAO!!!
A very interesting point you just made with the recording thing, nowadays with commercial music we get the sound "in your face" clean and punchy, but for example, last week I was watching/listening Atmospheres by Ligeti and... it was like everybody in the concert hall had tuberculosis, they totally ruined the recording :(
I think you're talking about "professional classical music" here. But most classical music, in terms of hours played, and listened, and sung, and acted, is amateur, and that's the stuff that gives people pleasure and, for kids, a great start in life. We're forming a (UK) group called "Campaign for Music", following the moves by the BBC to cut back on its professional groups (orchestras, choirs) and also the relentless education cutbacks in music education (ie instrumental and choral teaching) that's been going on for the past 20 years. I think things are different in different parts of Europe (and other parts of the world. China may be doing very well, for instance. Africa remains pretty untapped, I believe: at least, we don't see many classical musicians from that part of the world.) (Also consider the world of Theatre - we still do Old Plays, even if the proportion of New Plays is much higher than in Classical Music. But the world of theatre is much more flexible, so I think that part of your argument is spot on. BUT you still need classical musicians for your sound backing... and they have to learn somewhere. Which is what our campaign is about, its about maintaining a flow of money to ensure thaere's still a network of inspirational teachers, organisers, conductors etc. )
Finally, an approachable analysis of this issue 👏👏👏
Lovely, i think the reason audiences aren't tuning in to classical music is much more insideous ... people aren't playing music or singing themselves anymore.
In the past everyone sang at church . People would play folk instruments down the pub.
"Musicians" were those fancy orchestra people. But in reality most people made music themselves even if it was whistling.
Not sure if you have noticed but happy birthday is not sung as confidently in the past.
You can appreciate the experience of watching a sport ... yet if you have never played it yourself you don't appreciate it as much as you could. For instance watching cricket is popular here in Australia because most Australians have played backyard cricket ... yet American audiences don't get cricket because they haven't played it themselves.
I'm in my forties went to church as a kid played flute in a school band and was in the choir. - classical music is accessible to me because i played Minuet in G .
Did you know pop music is dying too? The streaming model is killing album sales.
But i think all commercial music is dying because people have lost their ability to sing and to play music.
This is a really interesting point I haven’t considered before! I think you’re absolutely right!
An important point! In the 19th and early 20th century, lots of people had pianos at home, and piano music was at its zenith because those who played the piano, if only a little, knew how to appreciate it. Later came instruments like the saxophone, and jazz became very popular. In the second half of the 20th century it was the electric guitar and rock music. Now so many youngsters don't play any musical instrument at all and therefore don't appreciate the music made with them. What consequently dominates is machine-produced pop.
I think it started with defunding music teaching in public schools and just further spiraling down cultural decay
That is unfortunately, absolutely true imho...a new initiative, like the old "Save the Music" is needed so bad, along with an updated approach to music appreciation to supplement a new curriculum
i'm 11 years old and I love classical music. Classical music must remain on. It will never be forgotten whether modern people say they hate it or not. Well, not modern people that is not what I should say, but modern music genres I don't really like modern types of music. Classical music must remain and there's nothing to do about it
There is still tons of new music being written, but 99% of it is litterally collecting dust on shelves, never having been performed.
Regarding the "new stuff" there is the basic stuff everyone knows like Canon in D, Beethovens 5th and Ravel's Bolero. But there is just so so sooo much classical music that has recordings, not to mention most are far longer than most of what is pushed out now.
Not having access to a concert hall let alone a theatre in ones local is a huge problem.
I used to live in Adelaide "the city of choirs" WITHOUT A DEDICATED CONCERT HALL!
Also the act of going to see a musical, opera, or a classical performance is expensive because one has to travel far to see a good enough rendition.
And yes, unfortunately classical music does require listening for more than 3 minutes before the track changes.
Adelaide is the 'City of Churches' from what I remember
This was a very insightful video!! I totally agree - people absolutely will always like classical music as it remains a unique way to very effectively tell story i.e. film scores plus the music is just good. It's the presentation that needs to be modernized. Easier said than done but with patience and inspiration I think it really can stay alive. Also amazing and fun editing!!
Oh my! In the first five minutes you've summed up exactly what I've been feeling deep inside for years as an performer. I wasn't even aware of it until you put it into words. Now I'll keep watching. I just had to tell you this right away.
Addendum-I am part of the generation (the dreaded B.B's) who got turned on to classical music via FM rock radio in the 70s, during the progressive rock period. There were covers and arrangements of popular classical works by those bands, and they used electronic instruments to mimic the sound or the symphony orchestra and chamber ensembles in their original compositions. And that led to fans going straight to the source and collecting recording of those popular pieces by the best known composers. It's a pity that today's popular music can't continue to be a bridge to the music in the classical world.
I"m not a classical music person. However, if I wanted to market a classical music outfit, this is what I would do:
• come up with music that engaging with Gen Z
• make the group tight (quartet or quintet), and have laptops in there.
• wear non-elitist uniforms (black tuxedos or whatever it is that they wear)
• move them from performers to media/content people
• launch TH-cam, Spotify etc channels
• do lots of videoing and have lots of engaging content that would attract the core audience
• tour: go to loads of venues and put on shows
and never compromise the quality. Just marry that with excitement, because the real competition is Netflix and video games.
Again, no idea really.
Wow! You gave me so much to think about! Thank you for another excellent video.
I feel like this video would’ve HEAVILY benefited from including examples of living composers (that aren’t film composers) who do write music audiences love, and know how to navigate the space of music in the 21st century. Max Richter, Christopher Cerrone, Mason Bates, and Takashi Yoshimatsu, just to name a few. Their music is much more digestible than what people typically think of contemporary classical music. This video left out a whole world of composers who are living today and are writing classical music. And the best part about their music? It doesn’t sound like something written 200 years ago. It still sounds new, and general audiences can enjoy and understand it (unlike the music of Boulez, Fernyhough, Stockhausen, etc.). I think having modern composers write in the style of Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, etc, is definitely not the solution. It will only sound like an imitation of older styles, and therefore still not be relevant to today. Composers need to write classical music that is still new, but that audience can enjoy. And there are composers already doing that. We just need more
You are absolutely right on this point...there IS new music being written for the old acoustic ensembles (sometimes integrated with electronics) by living composers who aren't serialists and it's fantastic, but it gets no real promotion so the general public has no idea its out there!!! Besides the ones you mentioned, also definitely check out the new works by Andrew Norman, Caroline Shaw, and Saad Haddad just to name a few more...it's not about rehashing Mozart Beethoven and Tchaikovsky, but its also not about abstract incoherence either...new composers don't have any rules to follow anymore, literally ANYTHING GOES today, so you can make a concerto or tone poem that incorporates melody *gasp*, functional harmony, but with some modern extensions, a narrative or fanciful title, a hidden tone row, a brief atonal episode for contrast, all done with impressionistic harmonies in a Minimalist type texture, and there's nothing wrong with that, or anybody stopping you!!! So as living composers we must be honest and appropriate to ourselves, know that any and everything is up for grabs, and just starting writing with genuine enthusiasm again, and NO FEAR OF MELODIES!!!
Masters in composition here as well - was a dissertation away from my DMA. Can't live on teaching wages, comissions are unicorns, and getting performances...unheard of. Let it be known, I have a decent sized catalog for the picking once I'm dead ;) [we all know how this works...]
Went to Konzerthuset Copenhagen with my 16 year old son. And guess what? He loved Ligeti and Messiaen, wasn't excited about Haydn. I think it has to do with "Hörgewohnheiten" and concert halls would be very wise to address this curiosity in more modern classical music among younger generations. And most importantly to invite people to be part of the conversation (e.g. explaining the music)
Hörgewohnheiten translates as "listening habits".
Our local symphony would not exist without patrons and corporate sponsors.
Before I respond to other points I'd just like to say that I've gone through some other videos you have and have really enjoyed your content and videos. It's always interesting to hear thoughts and view points on this subject, even if I disagree with some of it. I really appreciate the effort and thoughtfulness you've put into your videos.
What is killing the Classical Music Industry? Is the free of charge access, for the first time in history, whe need to accept that Music is free or almost free. The only way to combat piracy was let access to plataforms. That causes that the music is free for all except for institutions, musicians, etc... The platform economy is not strong enough to sustain the industry. Leting free of charge, people are not encouraged to assist to concerts, like before.
Wow what a perspective changer honestly 🍃👌🔮great video!
Hello Cait, you're the first person to explain the exact same points I've been expressing to fellow classical musicians for a long time. In a lot of ways, I believe 'mainstream' classical music (standard symphonic classical music, opera, ballet, etc....) is already on its deathbed and has been for some time. I believe that most crossover classical music doesn't generally work because a lot of the times it's far too pandering and gimmicky and non-classical audiences can see through the act. In the same way that classical music of its time was based on the folk/pop music of its time which made it relevant, we would need a new generation of bold and daring musicians in our time to reject the status quo and make new and relevant compositions that they can perform while going on tour for more people to care. I also believe that as soon as a music genre becomes institutionalized (taught for a degree at a college), it's almost always a death sentence for said genre. You can see how Jazz is slowly dying in the same way as classical music already has, and not too far behind is Rock and Roll. To really drive the point home, will be hilarious to see the day when one can get a bachelor's degree in Hip-Hop Performance some 20+ years down the road, and wonder why Rap became a dying genre in the future. Just a prediction....would like to know what you think about all this, and thank you for your video!
This is such great food for thought, I hadn’t considered how schooling might have an effect on all this too but of course you’re right! I wonder how K-pop schools teach and if there are any differences we could learn from. 🤔
No way, I had no clue there were K-Pop schools! I really wonder how much of that works out. Can you manufacture success that lasts a lifetime? When I think of great artists of our time in popular music, I think of people who carved their own path in the industry, and those who stuck true to their vision and honed it. I doubt that can be manufactured, and it is something which one must discover on their own. What things do you believe might be different k pop schools vs conservatories?
Isn't Philip Glass such a modern composer who transcripts modern music into strict compositional form? But where does that lead him? Other instrumentalists and have you not seen are on his trails and earn their name in his shadow already. And the man is still alive (or so I hope to the second and beyond as I write this comment). And yes, it does sound more like a noisy gimmick than actual music. Sadly. I would love to hear a genuine composition based off of music from my own generation. But instead we have to deal with more Stockhausens and the likes.
Glass gets a bad rap really, but I get it...when you hear every TV commercial imitating Glassworks/MAD Rush, etc, it does start to become gimmicky...but besides his early hard-core minimalism like Music in 12 Parts...check out his 2nd, 3rd, and 8th symphonies, his 4th and 5th String Quartets, his concertos (violin especially)...and you will be moved by a genuine artist/composer who just happens to retain elements of his former Minimalist approach, now turned into modern masterworks (IMHO)
@@niemand7811 I personally don't mind Glass at all and I find his music quite brilliant. I'll say, I would count him as someone who is quite belonging to the establishment at this point. I'm thinking of people who are active and although I'm being agist, under the age of 40. When I think to the time when composers in the past were the most prolific, it generally has been in their youth....our current classical establishment doesn't generally care what young composers have to say and the opportunities to have their music played at the highest level is almost non-existent....which is tragic considering how many brilliant potential artists of classical music aren't interested because there isn't interest and money to backup the dead genre. You'll find most of our musical geniuses composing movie music, or making char topping pop tunes
That is exactly what I am thinking, I am trying to explore the lesser known music of earlier centuries, and there is a lot, like really really a lot, and I compose from time to time, even though in ancient style, but I am serious about it
I know the need to revolutionize our repertoire, and maybe our performance
Came across this video and can totally get your points! Classical music really emphasizes the role of composers instead of performers while today's music does the exact opposite.
Old-school jazz emphasizes the role of performers, but it's nothing like today's popular music... This stuff emphasizes personalities and physical attributes of the performers rather than their ability to actually perform music, which is a situation that doesn't even lie on the scale you're describing.
Good point...and did you notice that poor Jazz was even lower on the overall streams list than classical???
It isn't dying, it's just a smaller and smaller portion of the overall music scene. I'd bet, by raw dollars, the same amount is spent on it now than 50 years ago.
People say the same thing about all kinds of things. In my industry, for several years people said that tablets and phones were killing the desktop. Which was kind of true, but only kind of. In reality, desktop computing is bigger than ever and still very important, it's just a much smaller part of the overall market now.
I’m not a musician nor grew up with music in my home. But along the way I developed a taste for maybe not classical music but definitely symphonic music. Used to go the Hollywood Bowl 4-5 each summer in the 70’s & 80’s. It was wonderful. Moved away then came back recently. It’s still there, but back then the Philharmonic would play 5 nights with a few nights for other “stuff”. Now it’s reversed. Maybe one night out 10 is symphonies. There’s just not enough people demanding it.
Very interesting, timely....you bring up a lot of good points and have given me a lot to think about. But...classical music doesn't sound bad in headphones....Classical music sounds bad in BAD headphones. Given a good cd transport, a high-end amplified and top-of-the-line headphones the sound can be stunning.
I agree to a point! But millennials and Gen Zers (where classical music is already dead) don't need good headphones to enjoy the music they stream all the time. And that's where classical music needs to catch up. Needing fancy (read: expensive) equipment and an education about audio to enjoy something is just one more tick in the "elitist" column. 😖
@@CaitFrizzell That's an unfixable problem to some extent though. Mostly passable audio equipment is practically free these days - my go-to earbuds are $20 (or less on sale) - but the Beatz and other poorly-designed hardware that get marketed to the masses are bad enough that they will obscure the qualities that make most classical-like music intrinsically enjoyable at all. Modernizing production and mastering and using stuff like compressors to make the music more presentable can bridge part of the gap, but hardware would need to change too.
@@Ithirahad My work earbuds are some crappy $40 ones.
Eh .. they’re not that bad. But they’re blown away by my Sony M4s, and my Audio Technica 150Xs .
I hope that’s not all you have ... if so .. let buy something i feel bad lol
@@PeaceNinja007 I'm pretty broke and my equipment is somewhat limited, but not THAT limited, haha. I do have AKG K240's or Audiotechnica M40x's for when it actually matters. My point is that DECENT (not good) audio stuff doesn't cost much, but it isn't marketed as hard as the overpriced garbage that literally sounds worse for something like classical music.
@@Ithirahad Ahh . . I sent that when I was at work .. I just realized I have the Audio Technica M50X .. not the M150x .. I don’t even think those exist 😂
Okay .. I was just feeling so bad thinking you only had some $20 earbuds lol
Love all haters in the comments, haha. Thank you for bringing up the recording issue, it's so frustrating listening to super reverby recordings that are barely audible. "Classical" music needs dynamics, I get it, but in a recorded format they really need to change it up here.
I took over our Community Symphony last season (2022-2023) We are all amateurs. (I have my Masters in Music Education, but was a pianist and classical guitarist with a bit of musicology in my background.) We have people coming from larger cities to play with our group, because we do a variety of less difficult music from Baroque standards through 10 year old movie and tonal classical music. We also play popular standards. I think, for our audience, anyway, the length of the pieces and the length of the concert make a difference. We are now doing thematic concerts of five to seven shorter pieces from different eras in 75 to 90 minute concerts (including intermission, which includes refreshments, a nice place to sit and chat with friends, and players going out to mingle with audience members.) This season we featured Vivaldi in our March concert, and Mancini in our April concert. Tonal and tuneful and really appreciated by the musicians and the audience. Next season, I'm programing Litvinovsky and Andrew Lloyd Weber in November, and trying to get us into Helvi Leiviska for the spring. I always throw a standard classical composer into every program, too.
Our musicians range in age from 15 to 75. The biggest gain in membership is the 23 to 35 year old cohort. Think about it - you can work with other people without having to be 'social' - or you can be social, if you want. You work together to reach a goal and create a thing of beauty. You are important to the final project, but if you've had a rough day, other musicians are there to support you and help you lose your problems for a couple of hours while you let your anxious brain function to make sense of a puzzle that IS solvable. You can tell your spouse, "this is my weekly scheduled time to be an adult, and it's your night to stay home with the preschooler and baby." I honestly believe the mental health benefits of recreating this complex beauty together are so relevant to society today.
I know this isn't the big 'business' side of highly trained musicians going on tours and playing impossibly technical masterpieces, but I think it's where classical music always has to have a presence if it's going to survive. And - let's face it - this music will change and disappear just as all of humanity's cultural icons do. We don't know what the music of Ancient Rome or Greece really sounded like. We have descriptions, but we have not experienced it. Some day, if humanity survives, this music will fade completely, or change and become something different. That's the way of the world.
“I don’t want to know opinions. I want to know why.” . . . Umm.
I live in Montréal QC, and I often see the Orchestre symphonique de Montréal and the Orchestre Métropolitain host free outdoor concerts in the parks and streets of the city during the summer months. Everytime I go to one of their outdoor concerts (usually Beethoven's and Mahler's symphonies and sometimes musicals), there is a huge crowd, and the police have to block vehicle traffic of a few blocks to let the audience in. From what I can see, there is not a lack of young folks in the crowd. I think this is an excellent way of promoting classical music and making it more accessible to the public.
I think you are barking up the wrong tree. Classical music lovers like music not because it is ""relevant" but because it is beautiful, because it gives pleasure, and it continues ro do so after hundreds of years. Unfortunately, I really don't know how you get people to experience this pleasure. In my own case, when I was 15 my best friend became enamored of it, so I gave it a try and was smitten. Now, 77 years later, it still gives me intense pleasure, whether trough headphones on TH-cam or in person at the concert hall; and I am still happiest seeing the Marriage of Figaro yet again in a traditional performance that does not attempt to be "relevant!"
Soundtracks are the gateway drug in my experience & so many are more open to it.
3:36 is bizarre to me. Classical sounds the best in my headphones. Granted, they're somewhat expensive headphones, but still. The sound quality on a typical modern DG, Decca, Naxos, Chandos, or Pentatone release (for instance, not to exclude other great labels) is light years better than a typical pop or rock album.
With respect to the rest of the thesis, it has given me food for thought but I don't know if I'm on board with the totality of it. I am a classical nut, and am not wealthy by any means. I also like pop, rock and jazz. But classical is an absolute tonic in my life, and a good 90% of my music purchasing in the last 5 years has been CM. My family and I get to perhaps 5 paid concerts a year with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra, and then attend a few more free concerts outdoors in Millennium Park. Between the two it seems like there is demand for the music - the venues are always packed.
If it were hard for me to find live events to attend, I might be more in line with the thesis here. I do understand the critique that the majority of money is coming from wealthy patrons and serves to reify their tastes... but I share similar tastes, and hasn't it always, to some degree? Haydn was employed by either a baron or a prince for basically 50 years.
I do however totally agree that the stuffiness and etiquette of the live CM experience should be loosened up.
I think it depends on *who* is in those audiences. If it’s the same people over and over again, that’s also worrying. And perhaps the repertoire? I can fully imagine that “An Evening at the Movies” might be an incredibly in-demand concert for the CSO, but perhaps Haydn would be less so. I definitely agree that there are loyal fans and shows aplenty, but the financial health of most organizations is frightening to consider. I never felt secure knowing my paycheck came from a house that was reliant on the generosity of its wealthiest audience members to stay in business. 😕
I agree wrt headphones, especially in today's overly noisy world. Sennheisers for me. :)
Can't think of many videos I've watched on TH-cam that are based on such feeble premises and salted with quite so much irrelevance and lack of insight.
Sharing a thought because of the headphones thing... don't ditch the music, ditch the headphones!
On a hi-fi stereo, the intimacy and high dynamic range of the recordings create a startling realness that can be "seen" just as much as heard. Placement of instruments is easily distinguished, and the glorious spaciousness of the recording venues places you right there in the middle. The most subtle nuances of sound and movement are revealed. You won't just hear the bow move, you'll hear how they're moving it. I know that sounds mystical... it's hard to fully describe. Cheers :)
All music is dying, simply because people aren’t interested in music as they were. With so many other entertainment fields open to people today, and fewer gatekeepers, culture both high and low is becoming less important in people’s lives.
But having said that, I can say that where I I’ve classical music is thriving. There are a lot of orchestras and smaller ensembles, especially in the early music field.
If classical music has "fallen", what did it fall off from? Was it ever more popular than today in absolute numbers? Sure, it does not compete with whatever musical genre is currently the hype, but it does not have to compete (and it will survive that genre).
Nice work, keep it on!
Its still every where in advertisment. Ode to Joy, Winter, Swan Lake, Well Tempered Clavier. You could probably ask almost anyone on the street and they wouldnt be able to tell you who the composers are but they'd hum the melodies.
I think film and gaming soundtracks are the key, and it definitely needs to get away from the image of pretentiousness and gatekeeping. I'll be honest, I wasn't interested in classical music when in was twenty, I was obsessed with Oasis and other Britpop bands, but soundtracks from people like Howard Shore and John Williams helped me appreciate the genre a lot more.
I think it was Mozart who said, (and I paraphrase with at least a bit of abandon--but not so much as to put something into his mouth that he wouldn't have said) music needs to be both original AND beautiful. By beautiful, of course, he meant something people want to listen to, will go out of their way to listen to, will PAY to listen to. Incidentally, Wolf was pretty good at putting his money where his mouth was at.
I'm not sure that the lack of new material is such a problem. If you go to see a "classic" pop act perform live, the most terrifying words are "I'd like to play some tracks from my new album". Not that I'm totally against new music in classical forms.
I think the key is marketing. Take for instance Alma Deutscher. She has all the attributes needed for a pop star. As a prodigy she has an interesting backstory, she is an attractive girl, and she is on the cutting edge of her chosen genre with tons of new music. Why do so few people know who she is, even people who really like classical music? She isn't promoted like a pop star, so why not? Only a limited amount of her work is available for streaming and perhaps not even the best. I'll go back to the fact that she is young and pretty, if anyone can popularize classical music it could be someone like her. Another separate point, I think there are plenty of people who appreciate traditional instruments. On TH-cam some viral channels do well playing instrumentals of modern songs on classical instruments, for instance, the Harp Twins and 2Cellos. Some people are even fanatical about some movie/TV scores. And a large number of kids grow up learning piano, band, and orchestra instruments so are to some degree preprogrammed to appreciate them.
Noticed another thing. People saying they got into classical through metal or punk. So what about highlighting movers and shakers in the classical who have this non-classical background and what they are doing. That would be cool to watch.
Something related to what you were is the lack of willingness from classical music people. I want to get into opera singing, and during research on their technmiques and stuff I alays find myself feeling that the writer is trying to look at me from over a platform or something.
Like, when I was looking info for a Do in Petto, one of the articles I read was talking about how "opera and mofdern music shouldn't mix", and that "arias shouldn't be sung with modern style singing even if it's sung properly". The writer talked about how this great modern style singer sung an aria in modern style and it was "like a screech to their ears" even though it was sung superbly. I read it and immediatly thought "yep, this is why opera is dying".
It makes me wonder if the writers of these sort of articles forget people in the opera sing that way, with over enphasis on things like squillo, chiaroscuro contrast, the glottal expansion and so on because back then there weren't microphones and they played this songs for large crowds of people to hear.
Like, I would bet anything that, had they had mics as we do today, they would have sung in what we call "modern style singing".
I think you made a good point here...while I am no real afficiando for opera, I do enjoy the music...but that HEAVY vibrato singing style, that, like you said, was a necessity back in the day, sounds absolutely ridiculous in this day and age imho. Its the sort of thing that you make fun of when youre 4...and when youre 40! With all due respect to the craft and the years of practice and refinement it takes to master this historically informed performance style, something just shuts down in my acceptance of it...even if I can enjoy the music, the story, the sets, the premise, etc, I just would rather hear the arias and recitatives performed with a more pure tone and the vibrato used more tastefully and to better effect if kept in check...imagine a voice with the purity of a Sarah McLaughlin or Sting singing these parts, and that's what I would prefer in modern opera at least anyway...otherwise, give me Glass's Einstein on the Beach or The Who's Tommy or Pink Floyd's The Wall as opera
For whatever it's worth, aside from the AC or whatever that was, your room audio actually does not suck that much. :D
But yes, establishment classical has categorically refused to change, innovate, and adapt to a modern context, and on the other side, new "art music" has seemingly tried to reject the idea that there's any such thing as context at all, modern or otherwise... leaving a big empty gulf in-between that the vast majority of people just fall through.
Ohh, I like that, yes totally! I don’t mind if a little education is needed to have full appreciation, but that shouldn’t mean that appreciation isn’t possible if you haven’t gone to conservatory. A big empty gulf indeed. 😔
This is a very underrated video. I appreciate it.
Okay, you have a point. It has become an interpreter's art (especially when it comes to recordings), and that is never going to become something that everyday people do again. I can't imagine parties full of young people arguing whether Glenn Gould's "Well Tempered Clavier" is the best, and what Back would have thought of it.
This video is so totally narrow minded about what classical music is and why people love it! This is wrong about so many things related to classical music.
Classical music has had this image ever since I can remember. It was that in the 1970s when I stared listening to music myself. And it hasn't died. Classical music has never been popular. It's in its name.
It will remain for as long as there is a class of people who wants to set itself apart from the rest. That's not going away.
At least it has remained alive more than dubstep which is in clear decline and lasted for less than 20 years 🤣. Actually, most of the music will die. How many genres have "died"? Big bands, disco, new wave, etc. The only one that has a good financial life is the pop music of today and will gradually die because in 20 years, just a few people would want to listen to today's artists.
so naive 🤣😅
@@diegohidafl I agree with you. The 100+ year old classical music that we still listen to and is performed regularly is the most successful music ever written, at least in terms of longevity.
If "classical music" is dying and needs to be saved, what exactly are we talking about? The genre? I'm not convinced it was ever more alive than today in absolute number of performances and streams etc. It may be smaller than some other musical genres, but why would that that matter? There is no need to "beat" other genres.
What would be nice is if 100 years from now classical musicians will not only perform pieces from the years 1824 and 1924 but also from 2024. I have no idea if there is any chance of that.
if classical music were to flourish, there must be new composition. There must be much emphesis on composition; composition is taught, classical composition cannot really be self-taught. e.g. When Debussy went to the French national conservatory, only the top student could earn the privilege of attending composition class, etc. There is really too little being taught in classical composition. Only then, we might see re-emergence of titans of composition, music composition genius of our age. Thank you for great video.
A very good impersonation of a British accent when speaking for "the institutions that sell classical music". This is a little odd, given that, outside London, no cities in the UK have more than a single professional symphony orchestra (with the half exception of Glasgow). To the best of my knowledge neither, Nottingham, Edinburgh, Newcastle-upon-Tyne nor Coventry has such a thing, while London has about seven. Teutonville didn't describe England as "das land ohne musik" for nothing.
Hi, Cait Frizzell, thanks for the food for thought.
The need to impose consumerism on everything is the problem - the heritage of over a millennium of music isn’t solved by pandering to consumers just as with Jingju, Gagaku, Shinto temples etc- I indeed do blame the “consumer” - not everything exists for your tittilation, however much the USA wishes otherwise. And no classical music is not an “industry”. It’s centuries of our history. And another very important point is that the view that Western classical music is dying is quite parochial as it’s growing like crazy in China, compared to which the USA is barely a blip.
Rumours of its death have been greatly exaggerated; there will always be a small audience for excellence. While lots of ink has been spilled over the past sixty years about its imminent demise, that audience still tends to be well-heeled, too. You’re highly intelligent, very engaging and concerned, for solid reasons, that classical music doesn’t fit the commercial mold. You’re right, it doesn’t. But look what it actually does. Taken on its own terms it’s no different from viticulture, or a new world’s record at the Olympics, or savouring a great meal.
You are correct on EVERY point! Excellent video.
Thought-provoking, and also not a little frustrating.
The frst and immediate problem I find is the fact that people (including you) refer to classical music as something to be consumed. Shall we begin there?
Second, I have always found suspicious, if not patently ludicrous, the argument that if the audience is dumb, an art form, or a literary form, or any other creative form need to dumb itself down. I would expect and assume that people who want to learn, to understand, to think (are these not the main sails that enable us to move through life?) would want to elevate themselves. What you are suggesting (maybe, and hopefully, half-heartedly) is not far from saying to me (I am a university lecturer) that because my students cannot sit straight and read a sentense properly to analyse and understand it I have to chew it up and present it in a short cartoon form for them to get it. I#m sorry, but is this not treating the symptom but not the disease?
P.S. When you say about this or that 'performer' doing Elvis copycat covers, you inadvertently are making an opposite point, at least to those of us who have been watching from the sidelines at how the music scene is failing and reaching newer and newer lows. What I mean is, even without making the same Elvis copycat covers, the mainstream performers are, in the overwhelming majority of cases, almost the same. The bulk of mainstream music is now composed by two or three people using two or three chords. Who makes memorable music nowadays? We are drowning in what can only be described as a sea of audio manure (to put it politely) from which you occasionally can catch glimpse of singular islets of talent, either a 'hasbeen who was actually a musician; or an Indie geek who has not been blessed by being acquired by a label. So, that Elvis analogy... we're already there.
Are we off acoustic instruments? How about, then, the fact that when an otherwise pedestrian modern tune becomes instantly more memorable when it incorporates acoustics, or even segments from classical music proper. Remember 'Amie Enemie'? The only reason this song is in any way memorable is because it incorporated the Chopin sequence. How about film and game music, which is widely popular and widely more memorable? Is it not because it uses (albeit often repetitively) acoustic instruments and classical modes of recording? And on that not? Classical music, classical pieces are... not relevant any more? What is? Rihanna? I cannot whistle one tune of her repertoire, and wouldn't be able to tell Sheeran apart from any other. They are not even on par with the 80s-90s pop and RnB, let alone rock, both classical and progressive.
So, thought-provoking video. But also, enraging!
great video!
wow what an amazing video! your editing skills and production values are insane! absolutely incredible work. Thanks very much for your hard work, it's much appreciated
Can i add that yes the acoustics of a room are cool and magical but also how f-ing cool would it be to have an amplified concert? Are you telling me that if mahler had access to subwoofers he would have passed? COME ON i want to feel those double basses in my body and not be distracted by some old geezer sneezing next to me because that is louder than the music.
I couldn't agree more! This was such a well made and fun to watch video 👏👏👏
I wouldn't really say classical music is dying, but it certainly isn't one of the most popular forms of music. I know popular music (like Rock, Country, RNB etc.) will always be the cornerstone of most people's musical tastes and classical music won't. However, there will always be new listeners coming to this music, because once someone really gets into music and becomes passionate about a wider range of genres, then classical music isn't far from their grasp.
Should have mentioned 2 cellos who seem to be doing a lot of what you suggest. Perhaps in a few years we'll have AI capable of generating endless new content in the styles of our favorite composers.
I love classical music and art of painting but have to move on to the next project so as not to weare out the former project. My next painting is always better than the last and this is where the followers always drop out. Confuses the philosopher taught me at times silence is worth more than a million opinions but not in those exact words.
Classical music has been dead for several decades. There was no succession planning. And that’s a good thing.
I have many classical recordings of symphonies, concertos and large scale works for chorus and orchestra. The great majority are very well recorded, including many from the '50s and '60s on Mercury Living Presence and RCA Living Stereo. They sound great on headphones.
A wonderful exposition! I wonder why classical literature (including Shakeare's plays, written centuries before mostclassical music) seems to be approachable by most people. I think it's because they feel there is some entry point to help them climb aboard. Challenging art 16:56 needs intrigue or initiation by a friend, or perhaps via television or even school lessons. Children are entitled to be introduced to the great artistic achievements of humans, if only to balance the tragic side.
I agree 100% with you on this...perhaps a more modern reworking of Bernstein's great Young People Concerts for the modern age would be ideal for turning the kids on to this beautiful sound world...I would say, keep Lenny's scripts and excerpts, and animate them, either using his voice (With MAESTRO...he is back in the spotlight now), or get a new classical evangelist to present Bernstein's approach (Benjamin Zander and Michael Tilson Thomas are past their prime), but someone with the energy and enthusiasm for it that is contagious is needed ASAP!!!
And finally, I agree by and large. When I saw the title of the video, I jumped to conclusions. It will exist as long as it is taught, but there is a difference between existing and surviving. And what you point to as solutions do exist and things need to go more and more in that direction. Same thing with recordings. I don't how great a new performer is-there ain't much they can do to an old piece of music interpretation wise that hasn't already been done. The one thing that distinguishes the music from other forms is the sound of its various ensembles, from soloists, to chamber ensembles, all the way to 200 piece orchestras with choir. And that needs new compositions and innovations in presentation to survive, to be sure. Have. A. Nice. Day!
It was a long time ago classical music had the same business model as popular music, and the busniess model dont need to be the same. Here the concert houses are sold out all the time so why tour, the audience is older, and not the typical internet generation avtive on X, spotify, youtube….but agree there needs to be changes, and there already is with livestreaming and presence on social media networks. We should also not forget that the asian music industry, especially in the classical field easily will outgrow and change that market, its already happening. Recording techniques change over time and it would surprise me if we didnt leave this overproduce shitcompressed era soon, its fashion. Classical music is also the basis for learning music. I see with my kids that all eras of music is present at all times. They are between 15-20 and I asked them is classicalmusic dead, they asked me if I am crazy.
I am a composer and have made my life's work on classical music (actually a wrong label for it). Classical music is not dying, but there has to be change with current times. Frist of all I do not agree with you about musical composition. There are 100s if not 1000s of new music being composed. And almost none of them are atonal. I for one is a tonal composer. As for the music of the past, there is something called keeping to the wishes of the composer. But this does not mean each performance is the same. Musicians put their own take on it, it's actually something that is heavily taught to the trained musician. If you listen to several different recordings of Beethoven's 9th, there are drastic differences. Now this is one thing. There is yet another thing, There are modern arrangements of classical music and tons of them out there. I know this because my orchestra that I founded is based on it. It's an electric orchestra that changes the sounds of classical music. This is done with plugging each instrument into a mixer with effects. Plus, I have composers who are composing in this new orchestration. That being said. Have you heard of Wendy Carlos? She did electronic arrangements of Bach, Handel, and other composers. This was back in the late 60s and up to the 90s. Let's move forward. Vanessa Mae, violinist who plays an electric violin that has done some modern arrangements of Bach. All of this is out there and on streaming platforms. Also, classical music is not snobbish. Do you even realize that classical musicians and composers are no different than other people? Some even listen to Hip Hop. We drink and party and enjoy life as normal people. We get married and raise a family like normal people. We don't turn our noses up to anyone. And neither does the audiences. As someone who has worked for orchestras, I have gotten to know the audiences. None of them were snobbish. As the librarian of one orchestra, one of our wealthy patrons turned to me and handed me a cigar and said "time to party with a drink and a smoke." Yes there are snobs in the realms of classical music, but they are in other musical genres too. Now let's get to the educational part. It's not that the new generation is stupid. That is not at all what us music educators say. it's about the politics of education system. Ask any teacher of any subject and how they cut things left and right. Music education has been cut drastically in secondary education. I am like serious cuts to the point students are not exposed to a lot of materials, including classical music. This is a huge problem. Next thing. You bought up John Williams as relevant. Do you even realize this themes and materials are directly influenced by classical music? Listen to it, you will hear it from Korngold, Holst, Tchaikovsky and Stravinsky. Now let's get to the diversity of classical music. Do you even realize that the genre includes composers from all over the world? And they music is there and performed on the concert stage as of the past ten years. I think you need to do some real analysis as to what you are saying. By the way, the new classical musicians who are being trained and are now performing in orchestras are of many diverse groups? It has actually been that way for decades. Please do yourself a favor and stop putting down an entire culture genre that has been around for centuries and has evolved. Do some research, it's very easy these days by using google. Look up Carlos Chavez, Silvestre Revueltas, Marianna Martines, Louise Farrnec, Clara Schumann, Florence Price (First African American woman composer to have her symphony performed by a major orchestra in the 1930s), and William Grant Still. These are just a few of the diverse composers who's music is performed on stage. I know this because I have programmed some of them in our concerts. And yes an Electric Orchestra.
It dies when it is no longer taught. As long as it is being taught, it will be performed. It is then up to the organization or the performer/performing group to sell it to the public. just like pop music. 100k salaries for players and 1 million dollar conductors? Maybe not-but that does not determine the death of a musical art.
Classical is NOT for massive consumerism and all that stuff. YES it needs study and much more, it is NOT a business neither Arts.
This made a lot of since, especially the live performance part..
First of all, I disagree that Classical music is "pretentious" (i.e. working under the pretense) in its requirement for an elevated taste & higher intellect, BECAUSE it clearly does. Let's not PRETEND that everyone can appreciate it. One needs a powerful CPU that can focus its attention & processing power on extremely complicated sonic architectures to be able to elucidate its design & appreciate its meaning. That's not being pretentious; it's just telling the truth.
But music of the Common Practice Era 🤪 will never die, as long as intellectuals do not get extinct via natural selection because they'd rather read Nietzsche than get on Tinder 😅. They've been saying the same thing about Jazz also but it keeps breathing & evolving. Even Rock also seemingly had a cardiac arrest when that godawful Electro-techno-kookoo Pop (probably the only genre I couldn't stand) trend popped out in which DJs suddenly became "musicians" standing alone on stage just pushing buttons. I'm so glad it's not much of a thing anymore.
But IDK if it's all just about marketing. There will always be --- like I said tongue-in-cheek up there --- an audience for the classic stuff, but it will have to evolve & incorporate the contemporary sounds, pop culture, language, issues & arts for it to truly stay relevant. And with that, we'll have to be willing to break all the true pretentious rules. I've seen a couple of the recent Met productions of brand new operas like "Champion" (by a Black composer whose name just escapes me right now) that was supposed to have Jazz elements & dealt with contemporary LGBTQ issues. It was just too damn heavy & still sounded like it conformed to the strict rules with very little Jazz music in it. The Gershwins, who were Jewish, did it so much better with "Porgy & Bess," which sounds so much more progressive & current even NOW. They should be the blueprint. But the good thing was that those newer works have supposedly increased ticket sales. But I don't think that's enough, though. I mean, you want audiences to actually get excited & flock & destroy Ticketmasters' servers a la Taylor Swift for the Met? 😝🤣 Why not incorporate Hip-hop, street dancing & current lingo into opera? Too much rule-breaking? Well, there you go with being truly pretentious now. Thank you for listening at least.
P. S. For those who haven't heard it yet, check out the album "Handel's Messiah: A Soulful Celebration" that won a Grammy in the early 90s. They re-arranged Handel's oratorio into Soul/Gospel/R&B/Hip-hop songs. Kinda like what Sister Act 2 did also with Beethoven, which I think was inspired by that album. Just to give you a better idea of what I'm talking about. It doesn't have to be that unorthodox, but I do think there's a way to make new Classical pieces sound more exciting to current audiences.
Not to argue, but I have ADHD and can't focus to save my life and I still love classical music. I usually have it on the background when I'm working, and listen to the same pieces several times for them to really register in my brain. On classical music needing big brain - that depends, I think. It's such a vast repertoire that I believe anyone would find something that they would like, given enough exposure. Some pieces are easier to listen to - eg, when I was around 5, my kindergarten teacher played us a recording of Waltz of the Flowers from Nutcracker and my whole group was so obsessed with it that we would beg the teacher to play it every day for a while. If it can grab the attention of a roomful of 5-year olds, I'm sure it can appeal to most people. On the other hand, it took me a while to get into Bach, his music really started to click with me after I learned more about what makes it great, and after many listens. And even I like a piece from the get-go, I really gain a new appreciation for it onve I've learned more about the composer and the background of said piece. While it does require some additional brain work, I really think most people have the capacity to do that once they get into the music. The main problem is the lack of exposure to classical music and the stereotype that only old and boring people can enjoy it.
You nailed it .. pretty much every complaint i had about classical music lol