Ari should be one of the biggest stars in rnb. Music wise she's a star imo but not getting social media advertising is clear mismanagement in 2024. Dreamville has a few of those artists where the music has star potential but they seem to be managed like their indie artists.
No she shouldn’t, I love her music but she literally doesn’t want to be that. Shes a walking contradiction, she can’t handle being percieved in a way that she doesn’t perceive herself. WHICH IS GOING TO HAPPEN IN FAME AND MAJOR LABELS. She’s not a star because her personality type can’t handle that. Most people can’t so that’s not a knock on her, but that’s reality. Shes not a star and that’s okay but her music is great and she needs to make peace with that
Im going to have to agree with Ari on the marketing thing. To be fair, I think the label is a reflection of J. Cole and how he moves. I think he doesn't understand that everyone isn't him. He probably only spends a little on marketing himself. This means the idea of spending on marketing doesn't cross his mind regarding others.
True. I also think he maybe expected everyone on the label to basically move as if they are their own boss. He may have missed the point that some people just absolutely need that guidance & leadership. Everyone isn’t a boss or built to build their own platform. Seems like they are allowed too much autonomy at Dreamville and overlook actually taking care of the artist. Idk, this is just a small observation based on how they never promote the art until it drops and on what Ari was saying. And it also seems like J Cole was in some tension with Interscope, the parent company. I still wonder why he said “I’m finally free” on Port Antonio. Ari’s music is dope though, she’s insanely beautiful and talented. She just might need to get away from the industry and just make music for the love of it because she actually has a solid fanbase. It’s just hard to compete with all the female industry plants that are marketed heavily in the mainstream.
What do you all think marketing is? Like what do you expect to see in terms of promotion? In this information age, it's easier than ever to know when someone releases music.
He prioritizes live shows and tbh she's never with the other Dreamville artist when on tour... But you are right if their views and direction don't intersect its time for her to go her own way
@@RonDonProductions that may be true , but dont forget its also way easier to miss when someone releases music , due to the sheer ammount of content coming out daily from these well marketed artists. Especially finding good new music is now harder then ever before , unless you have 5h a day to search for those songs
Dreamville artist do seem pretty quiet. I honestly never know when they drop unless I go looking for them. I only found out Earthgang dropped because of the “On the Radar” channel and that was because I was on their page. Dreamville can definitely do better with promoting their artist.
Nope. If it was on dreamville this would be okay because that would make her an independent artist. Dreamville isn't a major label. They don't have millions to put into artist. That would come from Interscope. But the music industry is bleeding right now and they may not have the budget for Ari. Atlantic just dropped like 50 artist from their roster. What she is going thru, 95% of artist are going thru. It's not some isolated dreamville problem
Rap Radar is fkn huge lmfao. I think you understate how hard and costly it is getting on these types of things. People say “i only found out because rap radar” first of all THAT MEANS THEYRE BEING PROMOTED GREAT! Second, that’s not their fault THATS THE ALGORITHMS FAULT. The algorithm is surpressinf everybody on socials and people are mostly shown random pages based on your personal algorithm. Meaning not even the people you follow. So that’s not the labels fault, they’re doing great getting them on a platform like that. Only so much we all can do including the artists
@ks_wallace2324 according to the data Labels profit Billions a quarter, off of Master recordings alone. Labels have the money. They just don't want to spend it on her. This entire narrative of Labels being broke is not true. They spend the money who they think will make money, and don't care about the art. Labels are ran by rich WHT men who are not musically talented at all, but want to make money. So artist like Sabrina Carpenter or The Weeknd (who cater to bigger audiences antherefore make them more money) will get more of the promotion dollars. Ari is a niche artist and needs to just be Independent because R&B soul in America, is no longer profitable how they want it to be
@@notreallyafamousartist695 it was the actually “On the Radar” channel regardless, Dreamville artist have been quiet for years. There’s more that one way to promote artist seems like they’re doing the minimum. Just seems like Dreamville, Interscope whoever can do a better job promoting all of their artist
Another thing I can heavily agree with Ari is the social media aspect. It’s like you can’t make it far in the music industry unless you do it through these applications.
@@houseofmatrix6174the Weeknd is an anomaly. He blew up when 2dopeboyz and other blogspots were popular. You didn't necessarily need social media as much 15 years ago. Artist nowadays kinda have to be on multiple socials until they establish a solid and large fan base. All the superstar artist don't use socials anymore because they don't have to.
I love earth gang … but I had no idea that earth gang had a new album coming, which I feel is a testament to Ari’s resentment towards dreamville’s practices
@@RobMarkman I mean that’s fair and I’ll be honest I don’t be on socials like crazy, but I be on Apple Music and Spotify coming soon albums and I couldn’t find it, and I even be checkin on websites about upcoming projects and nothing
Why? Because she’s a phenomenal singer? Not enough. Nobody is going to put money into someone who will BURN IT because they didn’t like how they are being perceived. Imagine they put 20k into a music video and ads for her, and 2 days later she decides “I don’t like how this makes the public perceive me, take it down” wtf, no she doesn’t deserve better promotion until she fixes her issues because it will burn the labels money. You wouldn’t put your hard earned money on someone who will waste it. Imagine buying your friend some food that they asked for and they throw it in the trash in front of your face because they changed their mind. YOU WOULD NEVER BUY THEM FOOD AGAIN. You people think with your emotions because you like the artist, I like her music too but be truthful with yourself
@@notreallyafamousartist695I’ve noticed for years, ari just got a few problems lol, she always in the news bout some crazy shit lol. I love her music too and follow her, but ppl got to keep it 100 with themselves lol. Someone said she said one time that no other label would put up with her ways, lol, at least she self aware 😂😂 One thing I would say tho, I think cole could use his influence on social media more to promote his artists , just cause he don’t want to put his life on social media don’t mean his artists got to suffer for that, post their drops and shit, I don’t think that would make them blow up , but it would at least show he putting in a lil effort
She doesn't like it though did people forget about that incident she had with a interviewer who asked about her sex life since thinking it was OK since she is so open and explitive about it in her lyrics and she had a social media breakdown? How Dreamville put her on major artist tour so she can expand her audience but she did was complain that the fans are toxic cause they don't li like her music. Ari is great but compared to the rest of the field like Sza, HER and Summer Walker she is not as marketable especially since she won't do what's necessary to put herself out there, every single time she cries and complains to her fans on social media that the label ain't shit, then what are you doing to help the label Ari?
It’s good self awareness on Earthgang’s part to repackage the old records on to this new album. They’re going against the algorithm, but also catering to the fact that the majority of music listeners in this current streaming climate are casual. These are things that I’m picking up more as an artist. Keep it true to your core with the music, but know how to maximize this casual system and algorithm to your advantage.
@@notreallyafamousartist695 just because both of your comments are digital gold , i felt i needed to leave more then a like in each , so ill leave this comment here to double down on how gratefull i am for both your insights
Whoever is managing summer is who needs to manage Ari. I say this because. Summers new song popped up a good 10 times without me asking. Now I’m playing the mess out the song over me actually going to find Ari’s two times and now being stuck. Ari’s song is just as good as summers.
Summer is on LVRN, I really dope RnB label from Atlanta. They also manage 6lack (who was their first signee), Davido, and Dvsn, and sad boi plus more dope artists.
Earthgang's Album is crazy they have been better and better every time out and their music is timeless and a whole vibe. They are 100% themselves from vocals to beat selections.
Beat selection nice.. they just don’t rap about nothing but pussy 😂😂 the music good tho, just not something I’ll listen to a lot., they damn near r&b now. Last earthgang releases I fucked with was them 3 eps they put out years ago., robots, royalty and something else i think
I didn’t even know EarthGang released. This streaming era just pushes out tons of releases every Friday and everything just gets washed away and pushed to the side
Let’s talk about it : I agree with Rob . The streaming services are built for the casual audience to have access to whatever they want whenever they want . That doesn’t necessarily show you the actual supporter that goes beyond to assure the artist is supported . With the industry shake up that’s been happening , it’s getting harder to show artist love unless it’s physical material ( merch , iTunes purchases , paywalls for music , tours , Pop-Ups ) . What makes it worse is social media is the ultimate tool for marketing . A lot of artist aren’t active on social platforms but their presence or content promotes naturally from the platforms . It could be repost , content creators making content with the product or project & many other things . Ari’s talent is God given , but she can’t blame anyone for her marketing strategy but herself . You have to do it yourself so others can get behind it and start believing . But it is frustrating where you sign with a MAJOR label and they aren’t providing you a service that you essentially paying them for . But imagine how KRIT felt with Def Jam and he was one of the most talented artist they’ve ever signed . But he started to create his own world and had a core base that supported him through his deal and now that he’s independent the support is directly to him from his core audience . Ari is completely valid in what she feels . But the reality is when you sign to a major label you aren’t a priority unless you’re hot as fish grease . They’ll do what they want when they want even if it’s not what you agree with .
Yeah the majors just gonna go wherever the heat is and it feels like more and more artists are expected to create their own heat… and with so many recent layoffs you can see how artists are falling thru the cracks.
I agree with what you’re saying but the whole point of going to a major is the marketing and access to resources. If they can’t provide that then why are artists there? Even before the layoffs they weren’t putting up the money for R&B. Most of us found out about Ari through word of mouth not targeted ads. In fairness to her when ppl complained about how she was marketed she spoke up for Dreamville and tried to tell fans to relax on the criticism. KRIT is a great example because he had the same problems but he made his mark 10 years earlier and put most of his frustration in the music.
I agree . Unfortunately , the music industry is following trends vs. what’s long standing . major labels care for quantity not quality . And it shows based on longevity with the artist they sign . The fact that R&B isn’t supported properly but it’s 1 of the most popular at festivals and consistently has been 1 of the best streaming music lets me know majors are lost . They’re out of touch with reality and what the consumer wants .
Also gotta keep in mind that streaming was the music industry's solution to the massive popularity of music piracy via p2p apps such as Napster, Morpheus, Kazaa, Limewire, etc. I stopped pirating music because it became way more convenient to just use a streaming service like Spotify, and it was the same for millions of others. So, the industry succeeded in it's goal, and now piracy is no longer a major topic of discussion within the music industry. However, with one problem solved, new issues have surfaced and we're seeing that the current streaming model is far from perfect. That said, I think streaming is here to say but perhaps it's time for the industry to address some of streaming's biggest flaws and evolve the model. Issues like low payouts to artists, lack of transparency in royalty distribution, and the prioritization of quantity over quality.
I dont understand why she doesnt just hire somebody to run her social media if she feels its such a burden, she can save heeself the mental anguish etc
Because she pays her management, that is Dreamvill by the way, to do that. And they aren’t doing their job, but also keeping her from doing it herself. Plus, as an artist, she should not have the time to do her own advertising. She literally explained this.
@5106ammieDam hire a third party, social media does not need to ruin your day lol none of the other artists use social media for promotion like that I don't think they said she wasn't allowed to do so
@@chinortega3I think the issue is that the label is supposed to do that for you. Independent artists hire a third party to do that for them. She’s signed to a major label, she should not have to pay for her own promotion.
@@chinortega3 The label gets a cut of her profits, and in turn they are expected to help do things like advertise her projects. Labels normally do things like pay for advertising, studio time, and video production in return for a percentage of your earning. If they aren't going to help cover the things that you would expect a label to pay for, then she should get let out her contract so she can pay for it herself without them getting their cut. There is no point of being on a label and them taking you money if you aren't getting the benefits of being sign to them.
@@AShiftingofFate I'm not saying she shouldn't do that,I mean the way she goes about social media regardless of the outcome you'd think that would be her best solution for her mental health and success
If y'all saw or heard the EARTHGANG interview on The Breakfast Club they toured with TDE. That's how they met Jcole. I never wanted a Dreamville TDE beef but I have felt like Dreamville took their spot. I'm happy that Ab has been releasing music more consistently and Q dropped a dope project recently. Dreamville is everywhere now. Obviously not so much for Ari, Coz, Bas or Lute but they have to do the legwork that JID and EARTHGANG are doing. I'm from Houston and Rapalot was always bad at promoting their Artists.
Ari Dope. Seen her twice last year...still checkin' for her projects. The industry aint got no funds...better bring back CD's...😂 Earth, puts on a great live show...I hope J.I.D works on his stage presence...
Shiii rapping that fast is probably hard to have a great stage presence with 😭. Have you seen Eminem perform, he’s mostly just rapping and walking because what else can you do when you’re rapping 90MPH
I can see Ari going completely independent if she does end up leaving Dreamville, I can understand her frustration as someone signed to a label. She deserve a bit better than how she’s currently being treated.
@@RobMarkman if you were Ari’s situation, how would you go about it? Are you signing a different deal or are you going independent? What would be your alternative?
I’m sorry for Ari. I don’t know what she wants but it’s not going to be any better anywhere else. She’s going to have to go being somewhere near independence at this point. If y’all have another panel (appreciate them btw), can y’all talk about the death of the middle class artist? FD touched on it this week but hearing Ari (and similar artists like Teyana Taylor) and an article in the New Yorker talking about the erosion of a session player, feels like there’s something bigger going on that’s going to be detrimental to the creativity of music being able to rise out of their bubbles.
When your an artist signed to an artist it never works out long term. Sadly. Ari should be bigger. Even BAS should have reached higher heights by now. J Cole is not a great Label CEO.
I don’t believe that it never works out. 50 signed to Em. In more recent times you have Keem signed to Dot. Tommy Richman signed to Brent Fiyaz. Don Toliver signed to Travis. It has worked. But yeah doesn’t seem to be working in this case.
@ point taken for real. But 50 had his own imprint G-Unit Records and he released Get Rich or Die Tryin Under his Label. Now D12 is another story. 😂. The rest are the rarities but in all fairness when you signed to someone that’s still on there career grind you put yourself first. It’s instinct.
@@TheRealNativeSun I think it would be great if it's only one or two artists signed to the big artist.. 50 cent is huge but there's probably a bunch of people Eminem signed that haven't reached great heights. Cole signed too many people
What she doesn't seem to realize is... ARI LENNOX IS THE STORY... not her wanting to leave the label etc... She needs to create the story for people to talk about and it seems to me that her frustration isn't what the label hasn't done for her or what they may or may not believe in... It's her inability to figure out how to make herself a focal point rather than being just another opinion in the form of content that's floating around in the world of social media... That idea/concept of "being relevant" isn't what people think it is... But I can't give away all the game I have... She honestly has to figure it out on her own...
I'm not sure if you watched the video, but what you just named is literally Ari's problem. She wants to make herself the focal point instead of being framed as some mental health crisis artist. She told her label she'd like their help by using social media to highlight herself and the music along with making sure none of her interviews focus on mental health questions. The frustration comes when the label says the don't believe in social media strategies and don't control the media narratives. What would you do if you're Ari and you see all these R&B people having massive success but your label refuses to adopt any of those strategies? You can't use a male rapper rollout strategy for a female R&B act.
@@mbealhighjumpI don't follow her, but what is she posting on her own social media? Is she posting things that would create a different discussion? Is she posting herself singing? Showing up and taking over karaoke? Both things can be true. The label is failing her and she could also be doing different things.
I've been seeing a lot of uninformed opinions from casual Ari supporters. I'm not knowledgeable about what's currently going on behind the scenes with the music industry because I keep seeing people say that a lot of r&b acts are going through the same struggles that Ari is going through from a budgeting/marketing standpoint. Then you have music labels laying off a lot of people. Rob can you provide insight on this? I'll say as an Ari fan, not casual supporter, I've seen her get booked for major festivals (like Coachella and Wireless), late night show performances (Fallon), award show performances, and interviews on major platforms such as Hot 97 and The Breakfast Club. I've seen Cole bring her on tour with him. I've seen Cole pop out as a surprise guest on her tour. He's featured her on his album and has featured on her's. I don't think a lot of people realize just how much she has been marketed because they don't follow her intensely but aside from maybe internet ads she hasn't been slighted none promo wise imo.
You’re absolutely right. Those saying she should be on TDE, all missed her saying on one of her infamous ig lives that not many labels would put up with her BS. Her words, not mine.
Finally someone said it! She has definitely been promoted/marketed, she just isn't a top priority artist for INTERSCOPE. Notice I said Interscope instead of dreamville because if her music was solely thru dreamville she would be considered independent. It's not coles fault that Interscope has a small budget for her. Ppl saying she would go to tde and become sza are dead wrong. Sza had label issues and it took a while before ppl made her a priority. Not everyone becomes high demand and a star.
My ears perked up when I heard that Pulitzer line, it’s tough cuz that word is synonymous with Kendrick but at the same time Kendrick don’t own the word, an interesting time for wordsmiths for sure. Especially the dreamville camp, they all under a microscope rn.
I love some of her music and I’ll keep listening to it, if she ever does decide to re-record her stuff later on I will support that too, whatever she does I’m here for it
Would love to see you expound on that conversation @ 10:23 and how marketing to the casual listeners has effected the industry. I think it has changed so much with how we consume music and the success of the artist
I can understand Ari's frustration. The music industry isn't putting any real money behind marketing. They rely on an artist's social media that typically ran by them to promote music/art. That's why music sales are low.
I just looked Terrell took the interview down. I'm mad I missed it they interact well with each other and he seems to make his guest feel very safe like he always looks like he's bff's with his guests it's cool. So I imagine she got real and talked to him as if the cameras weren't there and asked him to take it down once she saw all of what was going to be aired
The physical product needs to come back. This Internet era is horrible. Artists spend so much money and time making albums only for people to buy ONE song? No wonder why one HIT wonders are the goal...
When I saw EarthGang on the tidal front page, I said she threw a tantrum to step on their release and it's not cool. When she says she wants off the label and doesn't want to be independent, does that mean she's retiring or wants a different deal? And this was after planning to leave social media on a specific date. If she's serious she should just get a new lawyer and build a team that understands her vision and can make her deal work for her.
@@RobMarkman Has Ari shown that her music is really good enough though for her to warrant how big she wants to be? Her music is nowhere enough as catchy or engaging as someone like SZA or Summer Walker. Those two artists have a much better grasp of melodies and how to make hit records. Ari also complains too much on social media. She’s like the R&B version of Wale, stuff like that usually puts people off the music
@@kevink01639people like her music, no need to shit on her for her frustration. She's got a right to be upset, her gripe isn't squarely about "not being as big as she wants to be" it's more about the fact that the label isn't doing the things it promised to while still taking cuts of her earnings as though they did. This is her life and career so yeah naturally she's gonna want to take it far. And she's only "complaining" on socials because her label refuses to listen to her
what artists should do is promote following their spotify accounts. that way, fans'll get notifications/can go to "what's new" and it'll stay updated on their releases. and pushing to pre-saving albums. the streaming service has a lot of issues that leaves it up to the artist to have to do more work. also, ari made a great point that i don't think she or other artists realize (or maybe they do), they are so worried about what fansand the label want that they no longer are doing it for themselves and are losing motivation on top of having labels that do half the work they're meant to do. i feel bad for artists and writers
7:45 with all due respect, you can’t cry about label troubles and not wanna be independent cause even with small labels like Stones Throw, the same thing happens.
Going independent would mean having to do everything yourself anyway, which was part of the issue. Why go with a record label and they don’t handle promotion for a product they profit off of? A smaller label will still at least handle some of the tasks like distribution etc. Some people just want to make music and share their art not be marketing experts or social media personalities.
I had no idea about that Earthgang album! I follow them on social media, watch tons of hip-hop music channels on TH-cam, and stay listening to Apple Music, but heard no peeps about it. I won’t blame Dreamville though. I think our entire music community is missing some way of connecting, sharing, and advertising new and big music when it’s dropping like we used to have with mainstream outlets. As much as I hated it back in the day, we’re definitely not doing better in our own separate bubbles.
1: The “Cultured United” podcasts have been some of the BEST think tank pieces I’ve seen in a long time. All of yall are incredible individually, but a force to be reckoned with as a group. 2. It’s sad that Arri is as talented as she is, to not have total support from Dreamville squad and the label. I hope she gets out of her deal
Now see, I LOVE Ari Lennox’s work. I never call myself a fan but I am indeed a fan of her artistry. And have been since she first came out. People have ragged on her and it’s been painful to see because she’s been reduced to just “another black woman complaining” instead of the gravity of her concerns being heard and validated. She’s come to social media because she said otherwise her concerns aren’t being validated. That’s awful considering how great of an artist she is. It seems the artists that promote trash and dysfunction have the push of the machine while artists like Ari gets pushed to the side. I’m so happy she’s speaking up for herself because I was able to discover the other great artists on the same label. Just listened to EarthGang and their album is superb!!! I am so impressed! People are missing out on some amazing art due to poor management and agendas. It’s pitiful.
I’m not trying to be negative or rude but! That Ari Lennox joint smoke to me is not it ! Maybe the label didn’t push it because they didn’t believe in it 🤷🏽♂️ and I’m a fan of her music….
@@Demsky83the problem is she’s going to do the exact opposite of what anyone tells her to do☠️ she’s a contrarian which is gong to kill her career, but that’s her she’s not going to change
@@Demsky83think the subject matter of the song is dope and different for an r&b singer, that beat just not gon catch ppl lol.. she need some trap like production of something.. or some soul trap type shit.. wish I could manage some of these artists, cause I feel like I got a good ear and eye for certain shit, I see how the game is played, but some just don’t be seeing it lol
I feel her on wanting to walk away from social media but also realizing she needs it but she shouldn’t have to run her own social media accounts. She should be able to have someone that can run her accounts to make sure her stuff gets promoted, even influencers have that. But the old way of Google ads and Instagram ads is not the best way to promote an artist these days. The best way to get your music noticed is to go viral on TikTok. Ari has a huge funny personality. If she found a way to use that on TikTok and make TikTok trends or apply TikTok trends to her music then she would find more success than way instead of ads.
11:10 I agree and disagree. I believe it was changed to combat piracy. Casual fans/consumers just benefit from it more than the artists. A fraction of a penny per stream beats 0¢ from a bootleg 🤷🏽♂️
How much online advertising do labels really do ? Playlists yes that makes sense but google ads ? I don’t think I’ve ever seen a google ad for an artist.
This is also a larger discussion surrounding public and private and as an artist, why should the public get full access to your life? It seems to be a needed discussion around the renegotiation around private and public- as well as responsibility and care for the artists as opposed to pimping artists to pay the executives. TDE seems to make it work- they select artists that have long term talent and they invest in them long term. Slow and steady with phenomenal artists that produce works of art. Chef’s kiss.
I agree. Artists can absolutely and should absolutely draw the line between their public and private lines and what they choose to share. But honestly the only things i really know about Ari is what she shares with us
Nobody would even know Ari if it wasn’t for J Cole. She literally said that and it’s clear she featured on coles 4 your eyez only album which was great promotion for her because she is the only female vocalist on that album and the only other voice other than Cole on the record. Cole gave you a great feature. I think her problems should be handled by her manager. If the manager isn’t handling these simple things then maybe she need a new one. Dreamville Artist are underground. It’s always been that way. A lot of people would kill to be in her position.
I stopped at 17:56 and went to listen to the song... To me... It sounds like a song where they are sparring as if to say the Dreamville vs TDE battle would have been WW3 for real ... JID started tying bars together intentionally sending subliminal shots and near the end he brought closure basically saying "don't sleep we woulda caught you slipping cuz you were looking the wrong way" and Soul was like yeah whatever n***a think what you want but also said JID name near the end to let people know it wasn't serious... Just a sparring match 🤷🏾♂️
I was hoping you'd speak on this regarding Ari! I think 2 things can def be true. She does complain on/about social media so people may not take in what she's saying, however, I think some of her complaints are fair. Dreamville allegedly telling her they don't believe in digital marketing/ads, "just post on IG" (free media) is insane. You're more likely to see an influencer(s) and people you don't know before an artist or someone you actually even know on IG nowadays because the algorithm is so fucked up. People esp younger audiences like relatability, so I'm surprised/not so surprised she's not on TikTok, or doing micro shows, interviews/lyrical breakdowns since she doesn’t like spotlight but she'd be able to curate herself better that way. I absolutely agree w/ you, I think she needs to go independent or walk away from the industry. She doesn't seem happy.
Thank you for sharing ya thoughts Rob yo I heard you mention little dragon doing a song with earthgang, love little dragon man, you know yo shit 😎🎶 blessings to you and yours from the D 🙏🏿 keep pushin bruh keeping it 💯 - kaazmik
People are too into yoga these days because thinking that Pulitzer line is a dis is a bit of a stretch. Ab is no dummy either he would have caught on right away and checked JID. Otherwise he would have run it by Kendrick before releasing. There's way too much respect between Ab-Soul and Kendrick for him to let any sort of shots towards Dot slide on one of his tracks. To me it's just dope wordplay by JID, and that's it.
I saw people also saying JID was dissing Drake in those lines 🤦🏾♀️ people don't know what they're talking about...I agree I don't hear any diss at all...plus Soul is an elite lyricist...if there was a diss there he could pick it up better than anybody and he's loyal to his team, he wouldn't allow a diss toward Kendrick on that song...again ppl just thirst for the drama instead of just enjoying the music...as far as Ari goes, I think the industry is just not for her...she doesn't seem built for it in my opinion
Don’t wanna assume all of Dreamvilles inner workings are all on Cole, but they clearly don’t know how to bridge their artists into the mainstream. I can’t help but feel like a ton of Cole’s anti media/hermit mentality is hurting his artists growth and visibility. Cole has incredible artists in his stable, but they’re trapped in his closet collecting dust when they aren’t dropping.
Yea, I agreee, cause I feel he can at least post their drops on his IG, he stopped doing that lol, just cause you don’t utilize social media don’t mean your artists got to suffer cause of your ways lol.. I feel like cole even acknowledged that in an interview one time.. so he self aware of what you saying..
Imho JID verse sounded like a friendly jam with no negative connotations. Is it something that will inhibit a response from kdot? Idk, but it I'm here for friendly competitive wordplay
I remember when she was getting some motion a few years back and they released this photo shoot on IG with her and then like an hour later they took it down bc she was getting clowned in the comments bc the make-up department and photographer did her dirty. I saw the pics and was "yeah they should not have released this"
🤷🏾♂️ The issue I find is I don’t know who these are artists are anymore. There is no branding, development and showcasing. Everyone can’t be the “ mysterious I just drop music” artist
She said It was the Terrell interview in the comments of her post. I watched that interview and it was no different than she is everytime she's in an interview so I didn't really get it.
I believe she didn't like how he was speaking to her at the end of the video where he was telling her that the internet is an illusion and not to let it affect her and that's why she said people are always talking to her like they feel sorry for her.
I didn't get it either. I am an avid watcher of Terrell's youtube and he POURS into the artists and gives them their flowers. The ENTIRE interview was her comprised of her saying "I'm sorry" and "Thank You". After many songs she apologized for not knowing the lyrics and being on the wrong note and then Terrell once again poured into her and reaffirmed that her voice is perfection. She has a level of insecurity and imposture syndrome that we ALL have but hers is on full display.
@CD-xq1lc I met her shortly after Cole signed her back in like 2016 and she was the exact same way lol. She had just dropped her ep "Pho" which I had in heavy rotation at the time. I thanked her for her project and she was like "Huh? What project?" and when I said "Pho" it was like a genuine "Oh shit" moment like she forgot that she was signed. She's a pretty awkward person😂
It’s very interesting Ari’s situation. Is her beef more with Interscope or Dreamville? It might be naivety but everything we know from Cole and how he was handled by Rocnation early on in his career, I’m sure him and IB would give all of their artists full control over their music and creative direction, and would never stop them from dropping or being marketed however they want to.
@@kevink01639 EXACTLY!!! Earthgang and others on the label have said this exact same thing. If Ari ain’t making it at Dreamville, she definitely aint gonna make it as an independent artist. Sounds like she needs more “structure”.
People looking for disses in any song coming out now. I heard the same thing about that verse from a couple of places. They tried to tie "the bullet for ya boy" line for a Drake diss.
I love Ari and been championing her since PHO. She’s the big 3 of this era along with sza and summer but she been wanting off the label for years. Smoke is good but it’s the weakest lead single she’s done. She doesn’t want to be the face of mental health but if you watch the smoke video it was giving that type of energy
My last comment was too lengthy so I had to break my thoughts up. My last points. Some accountability needs to be taken by the artists and supporters. I seem to only see a lot of online support for Ari from "music listeners" whenever she airs out her grievances but are they actually streaming her songs? Everyone loves Ari but do they buy her music? Do they clip her videos and post them on X the same way they would a controversial clip that will go viral? As for Ari, she told Angela Yee that she decided to tour with Rod Wave. Dreamville had no involvement with that. She said Rod reached out, she took up his offer because it was an opportunity to tour arenas and gain more exposure. That crashed and burn and as a result she basically took the last year and some change off. No music, little social media interraction. You can't afford to do that unless you have a large dedicated fanbase. Now she's back with a new lead single that's just okay imo. The label can only do so much when the return on investment isn't there. Sometimes artists have to put their heads down and get to work. I look at her counterparts (Earthgang) and they are always touring and releasing music somehow without having the biggest following.
@@r.johnson1170 JID has been putting in work as well. Seems like they all appreciate the creative control they have over their music and other artists they want to work with. Dreamville has let them fly. It doesn’t seem like Ari has taken advantage of the opportunities she has been given and Ib needs to hand her termination papers IMO. I wish her the best in her future endeavors
@kimzziereenee1638 I agree as a fan of Ari. If she's not happy with the situation she's in she either needs to pay her way out or pray that she didn't offend Interscope and Dreamville to the point of them being petty and keeping her hostage. If I'm Dreamville though, I'm not risking the chance of her ruining the brand's rep again.
There are lots of artists who I don’t even know they were gonna drop because I don’t see shit about them advertised but I check them out constantly because I fuck with them so hard. She’s just not one of them imho. I don’t be seeing that Summer Walker is gonna drop but I damn sure I go to her Apple Music page to see if she dropped or will drop soon. I do the same thing with Cleo Sol’s music. There’s also a way to favorite an artists so you see that they dropped something whenever you open the app; apparently ppl don’t do that for her because they don’t care that much to listen to her. No need to blame the industry when ppl just ain’t checking for her
As far as JID, Ab Soul could be letting the slick disses fly because they letting their foes make mistakes and they taking notes…then when it’s time to eat that up, that’s what it’s gonna be! TDE is a camp full of lyricist, they know what’s up! The years of sneaking’ is what got the last superstar knocked off, all the while they sitting back for 10 years and taking notes. Rap is a minefield!
She needs a sugar label, like a Harvey Weinstein type situation, because that’s the only way someone is going to throw money at someone who will waste it actively and then trash you publicly for it😭
It isn't a DISS! I hope these lyricists are proud and reaching for a Pultizer prize and look into the history of that recognition and HipHop is an art that continues to evolve and stamp into American History
Just watched Ari’s smoke video after watching your commentary. I think it’s a nice old school song but not a song that will be a hit. I think the label did a solid video for her and I’m sure there was a budget but is the label supposed to push the song even when they don’t feel like it will be a hit ? Just my thoughts
I’m really not making it anything. I don’t believe it’s for kdot but we can acknowledge that when you say “Pulitzer” people gonna take it that way. If i really wanted to make it a thing i would’ve put it in the headline
I feel you. I’ll give credit to the listeners that they understand that too. But you know the world we live in where a mountain is made out of a molehill in a quick second. You made the best point that if it was anything Ab wouldn’t have approved it. But we seen that happen in the past “ie Style P’s verse on Jay-Z’s ‘Reservoir Dogs’ where he was dissin Jay. But we didn’t hear about that until over 20 years afterwards so we’ll see 😂🤣🤣. Both JID and AB’s verses were crazy
Ari should be one of the biggest stars in rnb. Music wise she's a star imo but not getting social media advertising is clear mismanagement in 2024. Dreamville has a few of those artists where the music has star potential but they seem to be managed like their indie artists.
Watered down badu?
@BluEx22329 nah, her vocal range is better than Badu, but that a weird comparison
Shii even indie artists are louder than Dreamville artists.
No she shouldn’t, I love her music but she literally doesn’t want to be that. Shes a walking contradiction, she can’t handle being percieved in a way that she doesn’t perceive herself. WHICH IS GOING TO HAPPEN IN FAME AND MAJOR LABELS. She’s not a star because her personality type can’t handle that. Most people can’t so that’s not a knock on her, but that’s reality. Shes not a star and that’s okay but her music is great and she needs to make peace with that
Rnb doesnt make superstars anymore
Im going to have to agree with Ari on the marketing thing. To be fair, I think the label is a reflection of J. Cole and how he moves. I think he doesn't understand that everyone isn't him. He probably only spends a little on marketing himself. This means the idea of spending on marketing doesn't cross his mind regarding others.
True. I also think he maybe expected everyone on the label to basically move as if they are their own boss. He may have missed the point that some people just absolutely need that guidance & leadership. Everyone isn’t a boss or built to build their own platform. Seems like they are allowed too much autonomy at Dreamville and overlook actually taking care of the artist. Idk, this is just a small observation based on how they never promote the art until it drops and on what Ari was saying. And it also seems like J Cole was in some tension with Interscope, the parent company. I still wonder why he said “I’m finally free” on Port Antonio. Ari’s music is dope though, she’s insanely beautiful and talented. She just might need to get away from the industry and just make music for the love of it because she actually has a solid fanbase. It’s just hard to compete with all the female industry plants that are marketed heavily in the mainstream.
What do you all think marketing is? Like what do you expect to see in terms of promotion? In this information age, it's easier than ever to know when someone releases music.
He prioritizes live shows and tbh she's never with the other Dreamville artist when on tour... But you are right if their views and direction don't intersect its time for her to go her own way
@@RonDonProductions that may be true , but dont forget its also way easier to miss when someone releases music , due to the sheer ammount of content coming out daily from these well marketed artists. Especially finding good new music is now harder then ever before , unless you have 5h a day to search for those songs
Yall just Truly ignorant of selling your soul for fame.
She realized she got got 😂😂 satan doesnt care about us😂
Dreamville artist do seem pretty quiet. I honestly never know when they drop unless I go looking for them. I only found out Earthgang dropped because of the “On the Radar” channel and that was because I was on their page. Dreamville can definitely do better with promoting their artist.
Nope. If it was on dreamville this would be okay because that would make her an independent artist. Dreamville isn't a major label. They don't have millions to put into artist. That would come from Interscope. But the music industry is bleeding right now and they may not have the budget for Ari. Atlantic just dropped like 50 artist from their roster. What she is going thru, 95% of artist are going thru. It's not some isolated dreamville problem
Rap Radar is fkn huge lmfao. I think you understate how hard and costly it is getting on these types of things. People say “i only found out because rap radar” first of all THAT MEANS THEYRE BEING PROMOTED GREAT! Second, that’s not their fault THATS THE ALGORITHMS FAULT. The algorithm is surpressinf everybody on socials and people are mostly shown random pages based on your personal algorithm. Meaning not even the people you follow. So that’s not the labels fault, they’re doing great getting them on a platform like that. Only so much we all can do including the artists
@ks_wallace2324 according to the data Labels profit Billions a quarter, off of Master recordings alone. Labels have the money. They just don't want to spend it on her. This entire narrative of Labels being broke is not true. They spend the money who they think will make money, and don't care about the art. Labels are ran by rich WHT men who are not musically talented at all, but want to make money. So artist like Sabrina Carpenter or The Weeknd (who cater to bigger audiences antherefore make them more money) will get more of the promotion dollars. Ari is a niche artist and needs to just be Independent because R&B soul in America, is no longer profitable how they want it to be
@@notreallyafamousartist695 it was the actually “On the Radar” channel regardless, Dreamville artist have been quiet for years. There’s more that one way to promote artist seems like they’re doing the minimum. Just seems like Dreamville, Interscope whoever can do a better job promoting all of their artist
I didn't know until watching this video today
Another thing I can heavily agree with Ari is the social media aspect. It’s like you can’t make it far in the music industry unless you do it through these applications.
It’s very difficult without social
Shxt 🗑️
The weekend doesn’t use social media much
@@houseofmatrix6174the Weeknd is an anomaly. He blew up when 2dopeboyz and other blogspots were popular. You didn't necessarily need social media as much 15 years ago. Artist nowadays kinda have to be on multiple socials until they establish a solid and large fan base. All the superstar artist don't use socials anymore because they don't have to.
@@houseofmatrix6174kendrick even less usually lol
I love earth gang … but I had no idea that earth gang had a new album coming, which I feel is a testament to Ari’s resentment towards dreamville’s practices
I dunno. They’ve been talking about it for a minute.
@@RobMarkman I mean that’s fair and I’ll be honest I don’t be on socials like crazy, but I be on Apple Music and Spotify coming soon albums and I couldn’t find it, and I even be checkin on websites about upcoming projects and nothing
Again it’s probably a me thing
@@RobMarkman they the group or they the label?
I think Ari Lennox is a phenomenal singer. She should have better promotion from her label for sure. 🎯💯
Why? Because she’s a phenomenal singer? Not enough. Nobody is going to put money into someone who will BURN IT because they didn’t like how they are being perceived. Imagine they put 20k into a music video and ads for her, and 2 days later she decides “I don’t like how this makes the public perceive me, take it down” wtf, no she doesn’t deserve better promotion until she fixes her issues because it will burn the labels money. You wouldn’t put your hard earned money on someone who will waste it. Imagine buying your friend some food that they asked for and they throw it in the trash in front of your face because they changed their mind. YOU WOULD NEVER BUY THEM FOOD AGAIN. You people think with your emotions because you like the artist, I like her music too but be truthful with yourself
@@notreallyafamousartist695I’ve noticed for years, ari just got a few problems lol, she always in the news bout some crazy shit lol. I love her music too and follow her, but ppl got to keep it 100 with themselves lol. Someone said she said one time that no other label would put up with her ways, lol, at least she self aware 😂😂
One thing I would say tho, I think cole could use his influence on social media more to promote his artists , just cause he don’t want to put his life on social media don’t mean his artists got to suffer for that, post their drops and shit, I don’t think that would make them blow up , but it would at least show he putting in a lil effort
Do you purchase her art?
She doesn't like it though did people forget about that incident she had with a interviewer who asked about her sex life since thinking it was OK since she is so open and explitive about it in her lyrics and she had a social media breakdown?
How Dreamville put her on major artist tour so she can expand her audience but she did was complain that the fans are toxic cause they don't li
like her music.
Ari is great but compared to the rest of the field like Sza, HER and Summer Walker she is not as marketable especially since she won't do what's necessary to put herself out there, every single time she cries and complains to her fans on social media that the label ain't shit, then what are you doing to help the label Ari?
Sorry Cole, gotta agree with Ari on this. She should be way bigger than she currently is.
It’s good self awareness on Earthgang’s part to repackage the old records on to this new album. They’re going against the algorithm, but also catering to the fact that the majority of music listeners in this current streaming climate are casual.
These are things that I’m picking up more as an artist. Keep it true to your core with the music, but know how to maximize this casual system and algorithm to your advantage.
Talk to em JP, this is a pro take. Most of the non music industry viewers won’t understand the importance of your statement
@@notreallyafamousartist695 just because both of your comments are digital gold , i felt i needed to leave more then a like in each , so ill leave this comment here to double down on how gratefull i am for both your insights
Wayne did exactly this in the mixtape era… drop songs and let the core listeners decide the hits, repackage in an album to sell for numbers.
Whoever is managing summer is who needs to manage Ari. I say this because. Summers new song popped up a good 10 times without me asking. Now I’m playing the mess out the song over me actually going to find Ari’s two times and now being stuck. Ari’s song is just as good as summers.
That's what fans do, find the music they like...
Summer is on LVRN, I really dope RnB label from Atlanta. They also manage 6lack (who was their first signee), Davido, and Dvsn, and sad boi plus more dope artists.
Earthgang's Album is crazy they have been better and better every time out and their music is timeless and a whole vibe. They are 100% themselves from vocals to beat selections.
Beat selection nice.. they just don’t rap about nothing but pussy 😂😂 the music good tho, just not something I’ll listen to a lot., they damn near r&b now. Last earthgang releases I fucked with was them 3 eps they put out years ago., robots, royalty and something else i think
And their live shows are always lit
The dropped with snakehips and that’s how I found out they had another project
I didn’t even know EarthGang released. This streaming era just pushes out tons of releases every Friday and everything just gets washed away and pushed to the side
Morning coffee and listening to Rob Markman. A great way to start the workday!
Ayeeeeeeee
Since Earthgang has came on the scene, there hasn’t been a better group than them in their era. Flow, singing, subject matter. They got it all!
Coast?
I was just about to say it@@kelvinkaranja1799
Let’s talk about it :
I agree with Rob . The streaming services are built for the casual audience to have access to whatever they want whenever they want . That doesn’t necessarily show you the actual supporter that goes beyond to assure the artist is supported . With the industry shake up that’s been happening , it’s getting harder to show artist love unless it’s physical material ( merch , iTunes purchases , paywalls for music , tours , Pop-Ups ) . What makes it worse is social media is the ultimate tool for marketing . A lot of artist aren’t active on social platforms but their presence or content promotes naturally from the platforms . It could be repost , content creators making content with the product or project & many other things . Ari’s talent is God given , but she can’t blame anyone for her marketing strategy but herself . You have to do it yourself so others can get behind it and start believing . But it is frustrating where you sign with a MAJOR label and they aren’t providing you a service that you essentially paying them for .
But imagine how KRIT felt with Def Jam and he was one of the most talented artist they’ve ever signed . But he started to create his own world and had a core base that supported him through his deal and now that he’s independent the support is directly to him from his core audience .
Ari is completely valid in what she feels . But the reality is when you sign to a major label you aren’t a priority unless you’re hot as fish grease . They’ll do what they want when they want even if it’s not what you agree with .
Yeah the majors just gonna go wherever the heat is and it feels like more and more artists are expected to create their own heat… and with so many recent layoffs you can see how artists are falling thru the cracks.
I agree with what you’re saying but the whole point of going to a major is the marketing and access to resources. If they can’t provide that then why are artists there?
Even before the layoffs they weren’t putting up the money for R&B. Most of us found out about Ari through word of mouth not targeted ads. In fairness to her when ppl complained about how she was marketed she spoke up for Dreamville and tried to tell fans to relax on the criticism.
KRIT is a great example because he had the same problems but he made his mark 10 years earlier and put most of his frustration in the music.
I agree . Unfortunately , the music industry is following trends vs. what’s long standing . major labels care for quantity not quality . And it shows based on longevity with the artist they sign . The fact that R&B isn’t supported properly but it’s 1 of the most popular at festivals and consistently has been 1 of the best streaming music lets me know majors are lost . They’re out of touch with reality and what the consumer wants .
Also gotta keep in mind that streaming was the music industry's solution to the massive popularity of music piracy via p2p apps such as Napster, Morpheus, Kazaa, Limewire, etc. I stopped pirating music because it became way more convenient to just use a streaming service like Spotify, and it was the same for millions of others. So, the industry succeeded in it's goal, and now piracy is no longer a major topic of discussion within the music industry. However, with one problem solved, new issues have surfaced and we're seeing that the current streaming model is far from perfect. That said, I think streaming is here to say but perhaps it's time for the industry to address some of streaming's biggest flaws and evolve the model. Issues like low payouts to artists, lack of transparency in royalty distribution, and the prioritization of quantity over quality.
I dont understand why she doesnt just hire somebody to run her social media if she feels its such a burden, she can save heeself the mental anguish etc
Because she pays her management, that is Dreamvill by the way, to do that. And they aren’t doing their job, but also keeping her from doing it herself. Plus, as an artist, she should not have the time to do her own advertising. She literally explained this.
@5106ammieDam hire a third party, social media does not need to ruin your day lol none of the other artists use social media for promotion like that I don't think they said she wasn't allowed to do so
@@chinortega3I think the issue is that the label is supposed to do that for you. Independent artists hire a third party to do that for them. She’s signed to a major label, she should not have to pay for her own promotion.
@@chinortega3 The label gets a cut of her profits, and in turn they are expected to help do things like advertise her projects. Labels normally do things like pay for advertising, studio time, and video production in return for a percentage of your earning. If they aren't going to help cover the things that you would expect a label to pay for, then she should get let out her contract so she can pay for it herself without them getting their cut. There is no point of being on a label and them taking you money if you aren't getting the benefits of being sign to them.
@@AShiftingofFate I'm not saying she shouldn't do that,I mean the way she goes about social media regardless of the outcome you'd think that would be her best solution for her mental health and success
0:21 that livestream was great! Y’all had a lot of important things to say - it was a privilege to see
Ari is amazing 🙏🏽 I pray she gets through that situation…
Ppl want to JID and Kdot to beef so bad...he wouldn't diss Dot let alone on a Ab-Soul song...
Yeah. I just don’t see the angle here. Agreed
Niggas just be looking for anything to create a diss these days,. That drake Kendrick shit fucked these dudes heads up 😂
If y'all saw or heard the EARTHGANG interview on The Breakfast Club they toured with TDE. That's how they met Jcole. I never wanted a Dreamville TDE beef but I have felt like Dreamville took their spot. I'm happy that Ab has been releasing music more consistently and Q dropped a dope project recently. Dreamville is everywhere now. Obviously not so much for Ari, Coz, Bas or Lute but they have to do the legwork that JID and EARTHGANG are doing. I'm from Houston and Rapalot was always bad at promoting their Artists.
Ari Dope. Seen her twice last year...still checkin' for her projects. The industry aint got no funds...better bring back CD's...😂
Earth, puts on a great live show...I hope J.I.D works on his stage presence...
Earthgang are hands down the best live performers on that label.
Shiii rapping that fast is probably hard to have a great stage presence with 😭. Have you seen Eminem perform, he’s mostly just rapping and walking because what else can you do when you’re rapping 90MPH
@notreallyafamousartist695 Two words...Breath Control...
@@notreallyafamousartist695Kendrick is a GREAT LIVE PERFORMER and has unmatched breath control with no backing track. These guys have no excuse
I can see Ari going completely independent if she does end up leaving Dreamville, I can understand her frustration as someone signed to a label. She deserve a bit better than how she’s currently being treated.
She says she doesn’t want to be indie tho. I don’t know what the alternative is then.
@@RobMarkmanlike you said, she can sign and take a deal with Empire and do a distribution or marketing deal to where she can gain that satisfaction.
@ yeah. It’s still technically indie tho. We’ll see
@@RobMarkman if you were Ari’s situation, how would you go about it? Are you signing a different deal or are you going independent? What would be your alternative?
I’m sorry for Ari. I don’t know what she wants but it’s not going to be any better anywhere else. She’s going to have to go being somewhere near independence at this point.
If y’all have another panel (appreciate them btw), can y’all talk about the death of the middle class artist? FD touched on it this week but hearing Ari (and similar artists like Teyana Taylor) and an article in the New Yorker talking about the erosion of a session player, feels like there’s something bigger going on that’s going to be detrimental to the creativity of music being able to rise out of their bubbles.
When your an artist signed to an artist it never works out long term. Sadly. Ari should be bigger. Even BAS should have reached higher heights by now. J Cole is not a great Label CEO.
I don’t believe that it never works out. 50 signed to Em. In more recent times you have Keem signed to Dot.
Tommy Richman signed to Brent Fiyaz. Don Toliver signed to Travis. It has worked.
But yeah doesn’t seem to be working in this case.
@ point taken for real. But 50 had his own imprint G-Unit Records and he released Get Rich or Die Tryin Under his Label. Now D12 is another story. 😂. The rest are the rarities but in all fairness when you signed to someone that’s still on there career grind you put yourself first. It’s instinct.
@@TheRealNativeSun I think it would be great if it's only one or two artists signed to the big artist.. 50 cent is huge but there's probably a bunch of people Eminem signed that haven't reached great heights. Cole signed too many people
This how I start my morning really, The Company Man and Big Rob!!
What she doesn't seem to realize is... ARI LENNOX IS THE STORY... not her wanting to leave the label etc... She needs to create the story for people to talk about and it seems to me that her frustration isn't what the label hasn't done for her or what they may or may not believe in... It's her inability to figure out how to make herself a focal point rather than being just another opinion in the form of content that's floating around in the world of social media... That idea/concept of "being relevant" isn't what people think it is... But I can't give away all the game I have... She honestly has to figure it out on her own...
I agree
I'm not sure if you watched the video, but what you just named is literally Ari's problem. She wants to make herself the focal point instead of being framed as some mental health crisis artist. She told her label she'd like their help by using social media to highlight herself and the music along with making sure none of her interviews focus on mental health questions. The frustration comes when the label says the don't believe in social media strategies and don't control the media narratives. What would you do if you're Ari and you see all these R&B people having massive success but your label refuses to adopt any of those strategies? You can't use a male rapper rollout strategy for a female R&B act.
@@mbealhighjump the first artist I ever saw use this EP to LP rollout strategy was Miguel.
@@mbealhighjumpI don't follow her, but what is she posting on her own social media? Is she posting things that would create a different discussion? Is she posting herself singing? Showing up and taking over karaoke? Both things can be true. The label is failing her and she could also be doing different things.
This is spot on
Rob I love your work. You’re doing great and a big inspo for doing it solo. Mad respect!
I've been seeing a lot of uninformed opinions from casual Ari supporters. I'm not knowledgeable about what's currently going on behind the scenes with the music industry because I keep seeing people say that a lot of r&b acts are going through the same struggles that Ari is going through from a budgeting/marketing standpoint. Then you have music labels laying off a lot of people. Rob can you provide insight on this?
I'll say as an Ari fan, not casual supporter, I've seen her get booked for major festivals (like Coachella and Wireless), late night show performances (Fallon), award show performances, and interviews on major platforms such as Hot 97 and The Breakfast Club. I've seen Cole bring her on tour with him. I've seen Cole pop out as a surprise guest on her tour. He's featured her on his album and has featured on her's. I don't think a lot of people realize just how much she has been marketed because they don't follow her intensely but aside from maybe internet ads she hasn't been slighted none promo wise imo.
Exactly!
Because this is marketing just another reason to have us talking about her
You’re absolutely right. Those saying she should be on TDE, all missed her saying on one of her infamous ig lives that not many labels would put up with her BS. Her words, not mine.
Finally someone said it! She has definitely been promoted/marketed, she just isn't a top priority artist for INTERSCOPE. Notice I said Interscope instead of dreamville because if her music was solely thru dreamville she would be considered independent. It's not coles fault that Interscope has a small budget for her.
Ppl saying she would go to tde and become sza are dead wrong. Sza had label issues and it took a while before ppl made her a priority. Not everyone becomes high demand and a star.
Thank you. They don’t want to hear this.
Dreamville should have just swapped Ari for Reason with TDE
Hilarious!!!
Wasn’t Reason going to Dreamville too? 😂
Fuck noooo
That’s A terrible trade
Reason ain’t signed to TDE no more
Earthgang’s album is so fire!!! Just a viiiiiibbbeee ❤ feel good records.
Also Deep Blue was my fave soon as I heard it!!! ❤
@@Dalia_dk but I already loved godly 😅
For sure. They've been my favorite duo since 2020. They make the kind of high frequency music that transcends genre labels.
Ari can SANGGGG, he should have been promiting her. I pray that she gets the recognition she deserves
THIS! For all the artists in here, be on the look out for what might replace streaming or could also you to make more money off your music
My ears perked up when I heard that Pulitzer line, it’s tough cuz that word is synonymous with Kendrick but at the same time Kendrick don’t own the word, an interesting time for wordsmiths for sure. Especially the dreamville camp, they all under a microscope rn.
Yeah. Thats fair, it’s not a word rappers rhyme all the time and now we associate it with Dot.
I agree with your assessment of the JID verse. It's not a diss.
Those jid bars sounds like he talking about dot killin the boy and reepin the rewards for Keepin it 💯. Not a dis if anything a shout out. You tell me.
excellent insight man. imma be checking out this Earthgang album
Thank you. Hope you enjoy
S/o to the Earthgang track ft. T-Pain too from their album! They have great chemistry together
Yeah. Thats a fun record
Which one? Tequila? Or it’s on the new album?
I love some of her music and I’ll keep listening to it, if she ever does decide to re-record her stuff later on I will support that too, whatever she does I’m here for it
You ain’t lying. Deep Blue was crazy. Shoutout Little Dragon
Would love to see you expound on that conversation @ 10:23 and how marketing to the casual listeners has effected the industry. I think it has changed so much with how we consume music and the success of the artist
ROB! Big love, keep the content coming. Love the culture united stuff.
Much love
Great conversation about streaming and how the business works now-days. Again thank you so much!
I can understand Ari's frustration. The music industry isn't putting any real money behind marketing. They rely on an artist's social media that typically ran by them to promote music/art. That's why music sales are low.
Had to pause the video to listen to my dudes! I difnt know they were dropping... its a dope project fs
I like your commentary on the ceiling of streaming. Thank you for the insights! Regarding Earthgang, Ari ain’t stopping me from checking it.
Great commentary on all the subjects. I went and streamed the earth gang album. It’s dope.
EG album really musical
Ari Girl....u better let them feel that PRESSURE cos why wouldn't they give her the promotion she deserves? I love Ari songs...💕
We all do
I just looked Terrell took the interview down. I'm mad I missed it they interact well with each other and he seems to make his guest feel very safe like he always looks like he's bff's with his guests it's cool. So I imagine she got real and talked to him as if the cameras weren't there and asked him to take it down once she saw all of what was going to be aired
I don’t watch a ton of his stuff but he always struck me as someone positive and who creates a cool atmosphere for his guests
The “Electric” record on the EarthGang album is super dope. That can go if it goes further
Shoutout to you King. You been killing it. 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Much love. Thank you
The physical product needs to come back. This Internet era is horrible. Artists spend so much money and time making albums only for people to buy ONE song? No wonder why one HIT wonders are the goal...
That “casual fan” synopsis earned u a sub. U hit that sh!t right on the 💵
Rob Markman. You continue to build the respect I have for you. Nice work.
Thank you
When I saw EarthGang on the tidal front page, I said she threw a tantrum to step on their release and it's not cool. When she says she wants off the label and doesn't want to be independent, does that mean she's retiring or wants a different deal? And this was after planning to leave social media on a specific date. If she's serious she should just get a new lawyer and build a team that understands her vision and can make her deal work for her.
Yeah she needs to build a team around here I think
@@RobMarkman Has Ari shown that her music is really good enough though for her to warrant how big she wants to be? Her music is nowhere enough as catchy or engaging as someone like SZA or Summer Walker. Those two artists have a much better grasp of melodies and how to make hit records. Ari also complains too much on social media. She’s like the R&B version of Wale, stuff like that usually puts people off the music
@@kevink01639people like her music, no need to shit on her for her frustration. She's got a right to be upset, her gripe isn't squarely about "not being as big as she wants to be" it's more about the fact that the label isn't doing the things it promised to while still taking cuts of her earnings as though they did. This is her life and career so yeah naturally she's gonna want to take it far. And she's only "complaining" on socials because her label refuses to listen to her
Am I the only one who has a desire to purchase music? Why can't every stream service give you the option to buy?
I still purchase music
@RobMarkman They took the option away a few years ago on TH-cam music. Still buy vinyls when available
You CAN purchase music and if you consider yourself a "fan", it's the main way to actually support an artist.
@@RonDonProductions Never said you couldn't. I just wish it was easier and built into every streaming service.
@@midnitepostman it's easier than it's ever been in history to purchase music nowadays...
One of the channels I love listening to
Thank uou
what artists should do is promote following their spotify accounts. that way, fans'll get notifications/can go to "what's new" and it'll stay updated on their releases. and pushing to pre-saving albums. the streaming service has a lot of issues that leaves it up to the artist to have to do more work. also, ari made a great point that i don't think she or other artists realize (or maybe they do), they are so worried about what fansand the label want that they no longer are doing it for themselves and are losing motivation on top of having labels that do half the work they're meant to do. i feel bad for artists and writers
the industry is changing, independent artists are going to be the mainstream pretty soon
7:45 with all due respect, you can’t cry about label troubles and not wanna be independent cause even with small labels like Stones Throw, the same thing happens.
Going independent would mean having to do everything yourself anyway, which was part of the issue. Why go with a record label and they don’t handle promotion for a product they profit off of? A smaller label will still at least handle some of the tasks like distribution etc. Some people just want to make music and share their art not be marketing experts or social media personalities.
I had no idea about that Earthgang album! I follow them on social media, watch tons of hip-hop music channels on TH-cam, and stay listening to Apple Music, but heard no peeps about it.
I won’t blame Dreamville though. I think our entire music community is missing some way of connecting, sharing, and advertising new and big music when it’s dropping like we used to have with mainstream outlets.
As much as I hated it back in the day, we’re definitely not doing better in our own separate bubbles.
1: The “Cultured United” podcasts have been some of the BEST think tank pieces I’ve seen in a long time. All of yall are incredible individually, but a force to be reckoned with as a group.
2. It’s sad that Arri is as talented as she is, to not have total support from Dreamville squad and the label. I hope she gets out of her deal
Thank you. For real.
And as far as Ari, she just don’t seem happy in that situation. I wonder if there is a situation out there that can serve her
Now see, I LOVE Ari Lennox’s work. I never call myself a fan but I am indeed a fan of her artistry. And have been since she first came out. People have ragged on her and it’s been painful to see because she’s been reduced to just “another black woman complaining” instead of the gravity of her concerns being heard and validated. She’s come to social media because she said otherwise her concerns aren’t being validated. That’s awful considering how great of an artist she is. It seems the artists that promote trash and dysfunction have the push of the machine while artists like Ari gets pushed to the side. I’m so happy she’s speaking up for herself because I was able to discover the other great artists on the same label. Just listened to EarthGang and their album is superb!!! I am so impressed! People are missing out on some amazing art due to poor management and agendas. It’s pitiful.
🎶hey now hey nooow. Don’t dreammmmmm itssss overrrrrrrr🎶
I’m not trying to be negative or rude but! That Ari Lennox joint smoke to me is not it ! Maybe the label didn’t push it because they didn’t believe in it 🤷🏽♂️ and I’m a fan of her music….
She needs to go strictly R&B I can see a “Heard it all before” in her. Ari needs a new fresh sound.
@@danielleweaver3052and stay away from feminism. Sing about love and loss, heartbreak and joy. Cry. Anything besides what she is currently doing.
@@Demsky83the problem is she’s going to do the exact opposite of what anyone tells her to do☠️ she’s a contrarian which is gong to kill her career, but that’s her she’s not going to change
@@Demsky83think the subject matter of the song is dope and different for an r&b singer, that beat just not gon catch ppl lol.. she need some trap like production of something.. or some soul trap type shit.. wish I could manage some of these artists, cause I feel like I got a good ear and eye for certain shit, I see how the game is played, but some just don’t be seeing it lol
I feel her on wanting to walk away from social media but also realizing she needs it but she shouldn’t have to run her own social media accounts. She should be able to have someone that can run her accounts to make sure her stuff gets promoted, even influencers have that. But the old way of Google ads and Instagram ads is not the best way to promote an artist these days. The best way to get your music noticed is to go viral on TikTok. Ari has a huge funny personality. If she found a way to use that on TikTok and make TikTok trends or apply TikTok trends to her music then she would find more success than way instead of ads.
11:10 I agree and disagree. I believe it was changed to combat piracy. Casual fans/consumers just benefit from it more than the artists. A fraction of a penny per stream beats 0¢ from a bootleg 🤷🏽♂️
Dope vid Rob
How much online advertising do labels really do ? Playlists yes that makes sense but google ads ? I don’t think I’ve ever seen a google ad for an artist.
Yeah. Labels do a lot. Google owns TH-cam. And a lot of money is spent for Google ads to promote music vids
This is also a larger discussion surrounding public and private and as an artist, why should the public get full access to your life? It seems to be a needed discussion around the renegotiation around private and public- as well as responsibility and care for the artists as opposed to pimping artists to pay the executives.
TDE seems to make it work- they select artists that have long term talent and they invest in them long term. Slow and steady with phenomenal artists that produce works of art. Chef’s kiss.
I agree. Artists can absolutely and should absolutely draw the line between their public and private lines and what they choose to share. But honestly the only things i really know about Ari is what she shares with us
@ I think your channel is dope- thoughtful, introspective, intelligent- your energy and content is a vibe 🫡🖤✊🏽🔥‼️
Great point about the casual fans
Nobody would even know Ari if it wasn’t for J Cole. She literally said that and it’s clear she featured on coles 4 your eyez only album which was great promotion for her because she is the only female vocalist on that album and the only other voice other than Cole on the record. Cole gave you a great feature. I think her problems should be handled by her manager. If the manager isn’t handling these simple things then maybe she need a new one. Dreamville Artist are underground. It’s always been that way. A lot of people would kill to be in her position.
Is earthgang even dreamville any more? They have been saying how this is their first “independent album” so like?
Yeah they’re on Dreamville but not thru Interscope but rather United Masters
Earthgang is still Dreamville, just not Interscope
Yeah looks like the new album is under United Masters
Die today from earthgang is my jam from the new album (bobby boucher an obvious one)
I like the tangent about the industry!
Lute album where is it?😮
He just had one in 22
I stopped at 17:56 and went to listen to the song... To me... It sounds like a song where they are sparring as if to say the Dreamville vs TDE battle would have been WW3 for real ... JID started tying bars together intentionally sending subliminal shots and near the end he brought closure basically saying "don't sleep we woulda caught you slipping cuz you were looking the wrong way" and Soul was like yeah whatever n***a think what you want but also said JID name near the end to let people know it wasn't serious... Just a sparring match 🤷🏾♂️
17:23 yes you can. I want that Cole/dot tape! lol
I was hoping you'd speak on this regarding Ari! I think 2 things can def be true. She does complain on/about social media so people may not take in what she's saying, however, I think some of her complaints are fair. Dreamville allegedly telling her they don't believe in digital marketing/ads, "just post on IG" (free media) is insane. You're more likely to see an influencer(s) and people you don't know before an artist or someone you actually even know on IG nowadays because the algorithm is so fucked up. People esp younger audiences like relatability, so I'm surprised/not so surprised she's not on TikTok, or doing micro shows, interviews/lyrical breakdowns since she doesn’t like spotlight but she'd be able to curate herself better that way.
I absolutely agree w/ you, I think she needs to go independent or walk away from the industry. She doesn't seem happy.
Thank you for sharing ya thoughts Rob yo I heard you mention little dragon doing a song with earthgang, love little dragon man, you know yo shit 😎🎶 blessings to you and yours from the D 🙏🏿 keep pushin bruh keeping it 💯
- kaazmik
Much love
People are too into yoga these days because thinking that Pulitzer line is a dis is a bit of a stretch. Ab is no dummy either he would have caught on right away and checked JID. Otherwise he would have run it by Kendrick before releasing. There's way too much respect between Ab-Soul and Kendrick for him to let any sort of shots towards Dot slide on one of his tracks. To me it's just dope wordplay by JID, and that's it.
Agreed
I saw people also saying JID was dissing Drake in those lines 🤦🏾♀️ people don't know what they're talking about...I agree I don't hear any diss at all...plus Soul is an elite lyricist...if there was a diss there he could pick it up better than anybody and he's loyal to his team, he wouldn't allow a diss toward Kendrick on that song...again ppl just thirst for the drama instead of just enjoying the music...as far as Ari goes, I think the industry is just not for her...she doesn't seem built for it in my opinion
Agreed
Don’t wanna assume all of Dreamvilles inner workings are all on Cole, but they clearly don’t know how to bridge their artists into the mainstream. I can’t help but feel like a ton of Cole’s anti media/hermit mentality is hurting his artists growth and visibility. Cole has incredible artists in his stable, but they’re trapped in his closet collecting dust when they aren’t dropping.
Yea, I agreee, cause I feel he can at least post their drops on his IG, he stopped doing that lol, just cause you don’t utilize social media don’t mean your artists got to suffer cause of your ways lol.. I feel like cole even acknowledged that in an interview one time.. so he self aware of what you saying..
Make music that more (a wider range) people like..... Easy solution. Everybody knows her already. Tour and do the work.
Imho JID verse sounded like a friendly jam with no negative connotations. Is it something that will inhibit a response from kdot? Idk, but it I'm here for friendly competitive wordplay
🤔
I LOVE Ari!
Me too!!!
I remember when she was getting some motion a few years back and they released this photo shoot on IG with her and then like an hour later they took it down bc she was getting clowned in the comments bc the make-up department and photographer did her dirty. I saw the pics and was "yeah they should not have released this"
The streaming tangent was very relevant to the Ari situation but there is deftly something coming because all the hedge funds are buying catalogs
🤷🏾♂️ The issue I find is I don’t know who these are artists are anymore. There is no branding, development and showcasing. Everyone can’t be the “ mysterious I just drop music” artist
Rob we support you let's go best journalist in hh
She said It was the Terrell interview in the comments of her post. I watched that interview and it was no different than she is everytime she's in an interview so I didn't really get it.
I believe she didn't like how he was speaking to her at the end of the video where he was telling her that the internet is an illusion and not to let it affect her and that's why she said people are always talking to her like they feel sorry for her.
@@serenitysounds8824guess they just be going by the what she present on social media, can’t get mad when ppl bring it up lol
I didn't get it either. I am an avid watcher of Terrell's youtube and he POURS into the artists and gives them their flowers. The ENTIRE interview was her comprised of her saying "I'm sorry" and "Thank You". After many songs she apologized for not knowing the lyrics and being on the wrong note and then Terrell once again poured into her and reaffirmed that her voice is perfection. She has a level of insecurity and imposture syndrome that we ALL have but hers is on full display.
@CD-xq1lc I met her shortly after Cole signed her back in like 2016 and she was the exact same way lol. She had just dropped her ep "Pho" which I had in heavy rotation at the time. I thanked her for her project and she was like "Huh? What project?" and when I said "Pho" it was like a genuine "Oh shit" moment like she forgot that she was signed. She's a pretty awkward person😂
It’s very interesting Ari’s situation. Is her beef more with Interscope or Dreamville? It might be naivety but everything we know from Cole and how he was handled by Rocnation early on in his career, I’m sure him and IB would give all of their artists full control over their music and creative direction, and would never stop them from dropping or being marketed however they want to.
@@kevink01639 EXACTLY!!! Earthgang and others on the label have said this exact same thing. If Ari ain’t making it at Dreamville, she definitely aint gonna make it as an independent artist. Sounds like she needs more “structure”.
People looking for disses in any song coming out now. I heard the same thing about that verse from a couple of places. They tried to tie "the bullet for ya boy" line for a Drake diss.
18:16 JID sliding for Cole 😭🙏🏽
I love Ari and been championing her since PHO. She’s the big 3 of this era along with sza and summer but she been wanting off the label for years. Smoke is good but it’s the weakest lead single she’s done. She doesn’t want to be the face of mental health but if you watch the smoke video it was giving that type of energy
My last comment was too lengthy so I had to break my thoughts up. My last points. Some accountability needs to be taken by the artists and supporters. I seem to only see a lot of online support for Ari from "music listeners" whenever she airs out her grievances but are they actually streaming her songs? Everyone loves Ari but do they buy her music? Do they clip her videos and post them on X the same way they would a controversial clip that will go viral?
As for Ari, she told Angela Yee that she decided to tour with Rod Wave. Dreamville had no involvement with that. She said Rod reached out, she took up his offer because it was an opportunity to tour arenas and gain more exposure. That crashed and burn and as a result she basically took the last year and some change off. No music, little social media interraction. You can't afford to do that unless you have a large dedicated fanbase. Now she's back with a new lead single that's just okay imo. The label can only do so much when the return on investment isn't there. Sometimes artists have to put their heads down and get to work. I look at her counterparts (Earthgang) and they are always touring and releasing music somehow without having the biggest following.
@@r.johnson1170 JID has been putting in work as well. Seems like they all appreciate the creative control they have over their music and other artists they want to work with. Dreamville has let them fly. It doesn’t seem like Ari has taken advantage of the opportunities she has been given and Ib needs to hand her termination papers IMO. I wish her the best in her future endeavors
@kimzziereenee1638 I agree as a fan of Ari. If she's not happy with the situation she's in she either needs to pay her way out or pray that she didn't offend Interscope and Dreamville to the point of them being petty and keeping her hostage. If I'm Dreamville though, I'm not risking the chance of her ruining the brand's rep again.
There are lots of artists who I don’t even know they were gonna drop because I don’t see shit about them advertised but I check them out constantly because I fuck with them so hard. She’s just not one of them imho. I don’t be seeing that Summer Walker is gonna drop but I damn sure I go to her Apple Music page to see if she dropped or will drop soon. I do the same thing with Cleo Sol’s music. There’s also a way to favorite an artists so you see that they dropped something whenever you open the app; apparently ppl don’t do that for her because they don’t care that much to listen to her. No need to blame the industry when ppl just ain’t checking for her
As far as JID, Ab Soul could be letting the slick disses fly because they letting their foes make mistakes and they taking notes…then when it’s time to eat that up, that’s what it’s gonna be! TDE is a camp full of lyricist, they know what’s up! The years of sneaking’ is what got the last superstar knocked off, all the while they sitting back for 10 years and taking notes. Rap is a minefield!
BIG shout out to Little Dragon they are an amazing Band with a very unique energy, little dragons are silent hitters fr.
We don’t know all the details, but she has placed herself in a toxic light multiple times. She doesn’t seem built for this.
Yeah. Unless she finds some type of magical, perfect situation, i think it’s gonna be hard for her to
She needs a sugar label, like a Harvey Weinstein type situation, because that’s the only way someone is going to throw money at someone who will waste it actively and then trash you publicly for it😭
It isn't a DISS! I hope these lyricists are proud and reaching for a Pultizer prize and look into the history of that recognition and HipHop is an art that continues to evolve and stamp into American History
You added nothing to the conversation
Ari deserves peace, I’m so sorry she had to be pushed to this
Just watched Ari’s smoke video after watching your commentary. I think it’s a nice old school song but not a song that will be a hit. I think the label did a solid video for her and I’m sure there was a budget but is the label supposed to push the song even when they don’t feel like it will be a hit ? Just my thoughts
You’re not making the JID verse a thing against Kdot. You keep adding…..”BUT…” let’s not make it something it’s not
I’m really not making it anything. I don’t believe it’s for kdot but we can acknowledge that when you say “Pulitzer” people gonna take it that way.
If i really wanted to make it a thing i would’ve put it in the headline
I feel you. I’ll give credit to the listeners that they understand that too. But you know the world we live in where a mountain is made out of a molehill in a quick second. You made the best point that if it was anything Ab wouldn’t have approved it. But we seen that happen in the past “ie Style P’s verse on Jay-Z’s ‘Reservoir Dogs’ where he was dissin Jay. But we didn’t hear about that until over 20 years afterwards so we’ll see 😂🤣🤣. Both JID and AB’s verses were crazy