Taking the opportunity of the new TMB campaign would be great to have a video for those who are new covering what are the differences between the options as entry points (core-undertow-Unbreakable- 40 days campaigns...)
Seconding this! This is a great hype video, and I'm excited to back the gamefound campaign, but would love to hear a good synopsis of all of the content there is out there!
I remember reading a comment from Adam Carlson (one of the designers) on facebook saying "if you're playing the game to always win you arent playing it right. The game itself is the fun." probably the best way to put this game. Even if you lose it was still a really cool experience.
Currently waiting for my copy to ship. Basegame, minis, hardcover book, premium health and mat. Excited to try it for sure. Won’t be till 2022 though. Ordered with the pop up book thing. 😢 +1 for a cloudspire review.
I bought the base game a month and a half ago. I recognize genius in design. After 10 plays, I was eagerly scanning the Chip Theory Games store every day to see when they would restock their inventory. So glad I picked this up.
This saved me during the pandemic. Yes, there is the learning curve. However, it was something that I could sink my mental teeth. With Undertow, playability is almost infinite.
Great review of an amazing game. One thing to add for all those struggling with the price point: Chip Theory Games, the developers of TMB, have committed to not doing Kickstarter/Gamefound exclusives. You don’t have to go all in if you are one of the collectors that wants everything you can find for a given game. You can dip your gearloc toes in little by little, and eventually you can end up with everything over time… Having friends that know you are into TMB also makes for easy for birthday and Christmas gift ideas for them. And they can rest well knowing they helped you build out your collection. I started with a second hand copy of the base game and undertow about a year ago and have since added everything except Gasket, splice & dice and the promotional content (which is also seasonally available) Amazing game with tons of replay-able scenarios. If I could only keep one game…
@@rawkyle9385 as with many things, the answer is… it depends. If you’re just starting to expand your collection after getting the base game and looking for recommendations, here are mine: If you enjoy trying to true solo (one player playing one character), I’d say go for Nugget or Ghilie first. Age of Tyranny was a good investment for me because I wanted a bit more story/flavor to my games (shout out to Quackalope). Playing through the base campaign before jumping into Undertow felt rewarding from a lore standpoint. It also slightly addressed the failing forward problem that TMB has, where things get harder if you lose an encounter. From there, the sky is the limit. I would caution to say, hold off on splice & dice until you’ve gone through a few games and either want even more variety or more of a challenge in your tyrant battles.
@@Herodragon9 Thanks for the solid advice! I added the core game to my Burncycle pledge, and then just added Gasket and Age of Tyranny to my pledge for Victorum. Now the long wait for them to arrive
Not sure if someone has already said this, but the best way to mitigate your complaint about Tyrants being too big of a ramp up if you have lost an encounter or two is to use the variant where you calculate the BQ by using your Experience points instead of the Day Number. That way you don't get the extra penalty of tougher bad guys along with not being able to gain training points.
This is a spot on review of TMB. I bought the base game recently after a discussion about good solo games that are portable for work trips. That's another plus of this game: You can throw some chips in a bag, a couple of character sheets, and a couple of dice trays, and take this game anywhere. Then bring it home and play with your game group. I am bracing my wallet to buy everything TMB during this campaign because I completely agree that if I could only have one game . . .
@@BoardGameCo One of the reasons the cost is so high is the quality of the components. They hold up really well in travel. Fair warning if you are flying commercial though: TSA has gone through my bags before because stacks of cards apparently look weird on the scanners. Have not had any issues with TMB yet.
Would also love a box with just an insert that would allow for a quick remove and restore of a campaign in progress. Living in a city apartment with limited time, space and no gaming table, not being able to ‘quicksave’ is a big barrier to getting this game to the table.
I have been avoiding TMB because of its cost, and because I thought, "It's just combat." Your review singlehandedly persuaded me to dive into TMB! I'm not pledging, however. I went out and bought the base game, 3rd edition. - toby
I played TMB for the first time on TTS recently. Got in a couple of games in a week. I read the latest rulebook and was able to learn it relatively easily. My problem was is that it is very hard to find rules mid-game. I really enjoyed this game, and could see myself enjoying it a lot... But that price... Ooof! I don't usually do this but I might just stick to playing on TTS.
The longer I'm in the hobby, the more I'd rather spend the $500-$600 for an amazing game that will hit the table and be fun every time, then have 10 $50-$60 games that never see rotation. I wish the industry would focus more on quality (in design, components) than on volume. CTG has it figured out.
October already is such an expensive month and now this.... Why does this game sound so good and you gave it such an incredible review? Thanks Alex, I the love the enthusiasm you have when you talk about games in your reviews.
Great review!! I have one question. I constantly mention the “puzzle” aspect of the game, but it seems that for some to solve the puzzle, it requires throwing the desired dice results, depending on luck. What is your thoughts on that?
One of my favorites as well and totally worth every penny. And the Trove Chest is a must-buy if you have all of the current content. It cuts down both set-up and tear-down times considerably.
Thanks for the detailed review @boardgameco . New to the hobby as a whole (@ 46, never too late). Seriously thinking of canning my Kings of Ruin pledge and digging into this. I won’t have to wait a year, and I’ll be getting in on a proven game.
I finally decided to dip my toes to TMB, but I need a little guidance. I decided to go for the original Core box, but the shipping costs 20e so I thought it would be a better value to make use of the free shipping over 200e. What would you recommend to take along the core box to get to that 200e mark? Don´t want to overshoot it too much so something around 50-60 euro of content. Premium health chips? Additional gearlocs? 40 days of Daelore? What would be the best first addition to a new player?
I also want to point out that once you get to the boss you can choose to go straight into his encounter or do another encounter before tackling the boss, which usually gives you a couple of extra training points you may need at the cost of some 1pt baddies being added to the boss encounter. Its usually worth it to do it once unless the baddie points will add a 20 pt into the encounter.
Just learned to play from the 2.1 rule book - it was the worst rule book I’ve ever read. Played a game true solo. Managed to win the first battle but got one or two shot in the next three battles which meant I wouldn’t have been able to get enough progress to face the tyrant before the time ran out. One of the worst first experiences I’ve ever had with any board game. Going to try it again later and see if I have any more joy.
This game is so good. I love it. This game two handed and Mage Knight are my go to solo experiences. Basically the only two solo games I regularly play anymore 😄
I got a second-hand deal recently, with 80-90% of the content available. I went in too deep.. but now I’m looking at each day and getting more and more happy with the purchase. This game is just on another level!
Love, Love, Love Too Many Bones. This is my Keeper game. There is so much variety, so much replay-ability, so much content. It is a lifestyle game. You cannot play this once a year. And I know the rules issues, but I have met so many wonderful people that are as passionate about the game as I am. If you ever have a question about the game, the best minds are always ready and willing to help.
Once you understand the game better, the bosses aren't such a jump in difficulty. Here's what you're missing: 1) Who the boss is, is open knowledge from the get go, and 2) The encounters you face along the way are your growth opportunities, thus can be tackled with almost any build, while the bosses have specific gimmicks. Put those 2 things together and you realize that boss is more of a progress checkpoint. We always keep the boss in mind as we go, we know what that "puzzle" will entail, so we can plan around it. Lots of armor? Get that armor pierce skill asap. Poisons you? Make sure to get that poison removal skill asap. Etc. When you play it this way, the boss feels like a smoother difficulty curve. Like, ok yup, you planned well, good job. Before we realized all this, we felt just like you, often clobbered by the boss. So just remember, the boss is open knowledge from the beginning!
One of the most well articulated reviews I’ve ever watched. I love TMB, if you put the work into learning the system and gearlocs, you will be rewarded in spades! One slight criticism I have about the game is some of the random encounters at the wrong time can be punishing especially for true solo. Subscribed!
This is also one of my favourite games I own. 3 things I dont like about the game that you didnt mention is 1) Swingy difficulty especially at the 2 player count. There is an initiative track, and if there are 4 baddies on the map, who all have higher initiative then the gearlocs, sometimes your character can be dead before you even get a turn. 2) Optimum minmaxer play vs fun. Almost all the time the using your training points on upgrading stats(attributes) is the rihgt choice (the only time it isnt is vs specific tyrants). But that isnt the most fun. The fun is unlocking all the cool skills. So usually I play non-optimally but fun. 3) You partially touched on it - Rules. Since there are SO many skills and loot that it ends up in a ton of edge cases which arent covered by the rules. This requires you to either lookup FAQs, erratas, or other posts, or just make a call on what you think makes sense.
@@rb4551 yeah I agree with that as well. I often don't go with trove loot because of the hassle. Unlocking trove chests and dangerous darts are two mechanics in the game I don't like.
Thanks for the review! I got the chance to play this at Gen Con and loved it. I've ordered the base game and have also pledged Unbreakable. I'm curious: what other games would be contenders for the only game you keep: Terraforming Mars? Blood Rage? Anything else?
Those two for sure, although these are all interested categories. There are top 10 games, top 10 desert island games, top 10 games that will never leave the collection...all 3 of those lists would have overlap, but are actually different lists due to different nuances.
I troubled about getting it for a loooong time. The Gamefound campagne with the german version starts tomorrow, so I'm back in despair. We usually prefer dry euros, so is it right for us? Love the material and it sounds tempting, but man, it's hard 😀
Thanks for the review. Saw a like new copy of the base game on the used game shelf at my FLGS yesterday for $120 sans tax or shipping. Might be my entry point into the TMB universe and glad to hear that might be enough. Trying to stay away from buying all the extras that will likely never get played.
How's the story of the game? If you lose, are there storylines that emerge to redeem oneself or whatever? Or, is a game pick a bad guy, upgrade and puzzle, face bad guy, lose or win? Is there consequence in the story?
I am glad one of the expansions of the new content is making the old bosses better. I noticed after certain amount of plays some of the original bosses from the base game are lacking. Like I fought Drellen who was a heavy poison boss, and I was playing as Tink and my friend was playing as Gasket. my bots were immune to poison and Gasket is immune to poison. Drellen couldn't do much to us.
OG better than Undertow? I really like the extra depth the river adds to the combat. REALLY looking forward to the changing battlefield in unbreakable.
Base game will keep you busy for a while. then you can branch out from there if you wish in many different ways. you can add more characters to play. (tink, nugget, ghillie etc) you can add more encounter cards. (40 days of daelore) you can add a campaign (age of tyranny) or stand alone expansions that add new bad guy types and change up the battle board. (undertow, unbreakable)
Oh man you've got me eyeing the Gamefound campaign coming up. I went in with victorum so not 100% I'll double down with TMB, but man its alluring for sure.
@@BoardGameCo for sure. I do see some overlap with victorum and tmb. The upgrade system and narrative (story cards) for tmb look superior for sure but the strategic element has some overlap as well as the deployment situation. I like the art and environment more in victorum too. The squad element in victorum is pretty sweet as well. Hmm... decisions, decisions. Thanks for the content and reply sir!
@@penoyer79 Sounds like a plan. I think Ill wait though and pick it up on my next trip to the states. That $55 shipping to asia is painful unless you're going all in.
I'll get in the upcomming gamefound capaign. They will have the german version of the base game. I somehow have the feeling that I also need all of it :x soooo it would be a bit extreme to order the trove chest aswell right?
The Trove Chest is almost a necessity once you have everything. Speeds up setup and tear down immensely, while keeping everything nice and organized....and it's pretty crammed already.
Woohoo I love this game AND I love your shirt. Man, I really like that shirt. Hilarious. Cloudspire's actually my favorite 2 player game of all time, but TMB is a close 3rd. Skytear is number 2.
Hey Alex, I was thinking of a chat you had with Quack and Shira about TMB (~9:02 into your Let's Chat video with them) and Quack said "I own everything, I still struggle with it. I think I went to deep too fast. I'm going back to the beginning to see if I can rekindle something". I have watched Quack's excitement about the game on his previous reviews so this comment from Quack is giving me a bit of a pause in clicking an All-In button. When you discussed what I can see others not liking did you happen to include whatever was bothering Quack? Was Quack merely suggesting he was bored of the game after playing it too many times? Any idea of how many games he enjoyed before hitting the wall? I wish I could hear you and Quack discuss the point he made and compare it to the thoughts you shared with us here. I'll probably listen to this review quite a few times before making a decision to back it. Pardon me for asking but I'm somewhat new to gamefound (vs Kickstarter campaigns) direct pledging experience; how does it work in terms of pledging one level but being able to upgrade it later in a pledge manager? In KS we were able to back with $1 and update it later in a pledge manager. How does gamefound work in this regard? Can we start at a lower level before ~Nov 5th but then upgrade it later as we realize we want more before the pledge manager ends? Anyway if you've done a tour of how gamefound works in practice let us know.
@@danielveda5870 If you look at the FAQ on gamefound for TMB I Think they suggest that all you have to do is "Follow" the campaign to gain access to the pledge manager. Interesting.
Just to add another point that I've not heard many reviewers highlight... This game was too fiddly for me. I don't mind games with long setups but then I expect the game to flow after that investment. In too many bones you have to setup after each scenario and it does take time; coupled with the gameplay part of each scenario only lasting 5-10 minutes at most. I sold the game afterwards due to this. As a caveat, I usually do all the setup with my gaming group so it felt more arduous, if you've got a group that all help out then it may be less of a concern.
this is a tough one for a gaming group. you're better off playing this with a single buddy or by yourself handling 1 or 2 characters. where you can take your time and go at your own place
Great game. Hate the art and the rule book. I found it to much to handle solo. But at two to three the game sings for me. Glad you gave this one some love Alex! Looking forward to the GF project.
I'm struggling with what to do with this upcoming campaign. I picked up the base game of TMB with my copy of burncycle thinking that it wouldn't matter if the delivery was delayed since I had so many other games to play in the meantime. Now, I wish I would have just ordered from their online store so that I would have a copy on hand. It's hard to know how deep to dive when I've not had the chance to play the base game yet. With that being said, FOMO is hitting me hard. I'm concerned that if I don't pick up the chest now, I'll regret it later. So I'm thinking I'll grab a couple of expansions and the chest. That way, should I want additional characters and content later on down the road, I'll have the storage solution already in place. And if, by chance it doesn't end up being for me, I can sell and get my money back.
Do they not have a Pledge Manager on their campaigns? You could maybe do a smaller pledge to delay a few months so you can try the game, then crank up to a higher level in the PM (assuming they do it that way).
I would argue the Base game is enough, I got the base game 2019 and then after I played the game once I went crazy on their store and bought everything else. I still have much of the extra content sitting on my shelf unplayed. Never even touched Undertow yet, because I am still enjoying the base game. That being said I would at least get a good chuck of character expansions. The base game only has 4 characters and honestly it wasn't enough.
One thing I hope is that we can work more with unique 16 dices for the next new gearlocs. I wanna win using those dices, not essentially with dexterity power. 🤗🤗🤗 🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲
I played this once at a gaming night I attend and was genuinely torn for several days whether to buy it or not (I didn't in the end.) I love the elegance of the 4x4 board with the setup being so simple and how you can tell health at a glance due to the chip stacks. It reminds me of ye olde 4x4 rooms in warhammer quest :) The problems that prevented me from chasing down my own copy were: a) I always play multi rather than solo so bringing others in is important and the teach is quite monumental for this because you don't just teach the game but each character to each player :P b) I hate the minigames. I just want to 'dungeon crawl' by making interesting decisions and battling... I really got turned off by time taken up rolling rounds of 'dangerous darts' and random dexterity flicking that sometimes turns up. It's yet more rules to read up too. c) I feel like lockpicking is just a needless complication that doesn't add much. We ended up with a bunch of chests stuck on high values none of us were able to ever roll d) you mentioned it in the vid, but it has a failure cascade issue. If you lose a fight then it's harder to win the next due to losing out on the upgrades which means you're more likely to lose that and so on. To be honest, I'd rather just end the campaign on a loss than have this weird, dragged-out slow death that the game seems to lead to :o Ultimately, if they released a streamlined version of this that cuts out the minigames and lockpicking... it'd be easier to teach and be much easier for me to press that 'buy' button :3
I also started with Undertow. Never really felt a need to get the OG game but i backed with Gasket and picked up Tink and Nugget. Looking at it it felt like a big investement (and tbh a downgrade from Undertow), but i have been tempted from time to time. Skipped splice and dice as well because it was not what i was looking for. But Unbreakable.... that looks incredibly promising to me and I'm hoping to pick up the 2020 promo pack (since i also got cloudspire), 40 waves in daelore and maybe some extra characters as well. Really hoping to get away with paying less than $200 (+VAT), because whev it is a lot, even for a game that i love.
You just helped me to buy unbreakable and add the base game as well, but just because it’s available in German and it will help me get trough the rules. And if I’m used to the game and I just need one, I can easily sell one of them. There is nothing here on the second hand market.
I really want to get into this game but the sheer amount of content and my inability to just stop with the core game has me worried I'll be all in and in debt in no time once I begin
The great thing about chip theory games is that there are no Kickstarter exclusives. You can pace yourself and buy new components and expansions as your budget allows. You may be subject to a small wait as their stock is constantly in flux due to high demand. But you never have to worry about FOMO. Just get what you can when you can and build out from there.
@@CheddahSlammer yeah but stopping with just gameplay items for chip theory games is like buying a house and not putting up any curtains. You're going to get the premium health chips, dice holders, chip organizers, etc at some point.
@@ReverendDrDeath LOL i hear you man. this is why im so gald i got in on this when the base game first came out. ive been able get stuff as it comes out as opposed to staring at a mountain of content i can't not get.
I need a friend to buy this game so I can play it lol. I'd love to play it but just like Terraforming Mars, I can't stand the art and therefore refuse to add it into my collection
I wish I had not seen this video. My wallet is screaming “you should have not watched that video!” I am going to have to look into this. You are right. You don’t need it all. So, a question. Is the game available retail? How hard will it be to find the various expansions? Do the crowdfunded games have deluxe versions?
Everything they make is generally available easily from the website as long as it's not in between print runs. Promos can be a bit harder, and the trove chest is not easily available
Tink/Tantrum is my favorite combo. unfair. baddie killing machines. solo - i tend to gravitate towards Nugget. She's a swiss army knife. Just does everything well. Her Longblade and Dagger are phenomenal at dealing with annoying abilities like Break and Hardy.
I misread the title as "If only I could keep it in my collection..." And got real worried. It was your videos that got me to finally try the game out and now I, too, am in the position of owning a trove chest and all the non-promo content.
Amazing game..... but imho it has a couple other problems not mentioned 1. Hardy was the worst idea ever. Make a game all about upgrading and adding more and more things..... Then give 1/2 the baddies in Undertow an inate skill that negates it all.... I hate it. 2. There's no pretending movement on a 4x4 grid is in ANY way strategic. After the first turn everything that needs to will have moved into the 4 center squares, which gives the players 0 strategic movement options since the baddies move of 2 allows them to reach any space on the board. Don't get me wrong. It's an awesome game, but a consideration for "only" game? Idk
I've only played TMB once (last night ^^), but it was on 'Undertow' and I suspect the mechs/krelln were added to address your comment right there. I found myself moving around a bit to delay needing to deal with the krelln until I wanted to - Plus as duster I wanted to get both me and my wolf adjacent to enemies for my Backup Plan which felt important. I definitely think without the mechs/krelln, it would feel less free, and potentially even worse with 4 players with the board becoming more cramped - Guess I have to find out :)
I really don't see it about this game. It looks fiddly/lucky for not enough payoff making it hard to hit the table. I'm not much of a dice chucker so that could be why (Death May Die is my only game like that). I'd love to try it still but not enough to gamble my money on it.
Yeah the game is a heavy dice chucker, however the misses (which in this game are bones) go into a track on your sheet, and power up your special abilities. So unlike a normal dice chucker your not penalized by missing.
I've played this game several times with different people and no one really liked it. Swingy game that doesn't scale well with number of players. I really don't understand all this love.
Thankyou. Finally someone else who doesn't like this game. I think it's a boring wayyyy too long game. Scenarios where you get 1 shot and sit out for the rest isn't fun
Seems like people like it because of solo from what I am read. Glad people like it. I would try it but not interested in an abstract dungeon crawl. That said I get the appeal of the puzzle but you need to know that is really the game and why people like it. Like the arkham horror games you need to like dieing and starting over lol.
@@bradleak1465 That's my guess too - I can see how it would appeal to people as a puzzle, especially solo. And as such it's perhaps one of the best - if one wants to puzzle. I prefer interactive multi-player games - which then explains why TMB is rated "meh" for me.
The new rulebook is still not good. Its wordings and terms are a little confusing. The structure of the rulebook is bad. And the tutorial is incomplete. But it is a really good game. Can't wait for TMB Unbreakable KS. 😊
![NISAMANEE - TADA (ท้าดา) [ OFFICIAL MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/hcQHEPMmJpU/mqdefault.jpg)
Taking the opportunity of the new TMB campaign would be great to have a video for those who are new covering what are the differences between the options as entry points (core-undertow-Unbreakable- 40 days campaigns...)
Good idea :)
Seconding this! This is a great hype video, and I'm excited to back the gamefound campaign, but would love to hear a good synopsis of all of the content there is out there!
I 3rd this! as I am new to TMB and want to hear what the difference is. :)
take a look at the new No Pun Included review. Also, in my eyes, a much more balanced review of the game.
This is what I’m looking for right now.. especially from Alex cannot find a “too many bones original vs unbreakable” pros /cons kinda video
I remember reading a comment from Adam Carlson (one of the designers) on facebook saying "if you're playing the game to always win you arent playing it right. The game itself is the fun." probably the best way to put this game. Even if you lose it was still a really cool experience.
Cloudspire is my number #1, (with TMB being #2).
Set the scenarios, then there's a puzzle laid out in front of you, and your job is to solve it.
Currently waiting for my copy to ship. Basegame, minis, hardcover book, premium health and mat. Excited to try it for sure. Won’t be till 2022 though. Ordered with the pop up book thing. 😢
+1 for a cloudspire review.
@@diredistortion I don't understand youtube, my reply keeps disappearing.
I bought the base game a month and a half ago. I recognize genius in design. After 10 plays, I was eagerly scanning the Chip Theory Games store every day to see when they would restock their inventory. So glad I picked this up.
This saved me during the pandemic. Yes, there is the learning curve. However, it was something that I could sink my mental teeth. With Undertow, playability is almost infinite.
Great review of an amazing game. One thing to add for all those struggling with the price point: Chip Theory Games, the developers of TMB, have committed to not doing Kickstarter/Gamefound exclusives. You don’t have to go all in if you are one of the collectors that wants everything you can find for a given game. You can dip your gearloc toes in little by little, and eventually you can end up with everything over time…
Having friends that know you are into TMB also makes for easy for birthday and Christmas gift ideas for them. And they can rest well knowing they helped you build out your collection.
I started with a second hand copy of the base game and undertow about a year ago and have since added everything except Gasket, splice & dice and the promotional content (which is also seasonally available)
Amazing game with tons of replay-able scenarios. If I could only keep one game…
What are your recommended add-on characters? Any favorites?
@@rawkyle9385 as with many things, the answer is… it depends. If you’re just starting to expand your collection after getting the base game and looking for recommendations, here are mine:
If you enjoy trying to true solo (one player playing one character), I’d say go for Nugget or Ghilie first. Age of Tyranny was a good investment for me because I wanted a bit more story/flavor to my games (shout out to Quackalope). Playing through the base campaign before jumping into Undertow felt rewarding from a lore standpoint. It also slightly addressed the failing forward problem that TMB has, where things get harder if you lose an encounter. From there, the sky is the limit.
I would caution to say, hold off on splice & dice until you’ve gone through a few games and either want even more variety or more of a challenge in your tyrant battles.
@@Herodragon9 Thanks for the solid advice! I added the core game to my Burncycle pledge, and then just added Gasket and Age of Tyranny to my pledge for Victorum. Now the long wait for them to arrive
The only dice-heavy game where I get pissed when I *don't* roll failures -- the Backup Plan is what makes this game truly special.
Not sure if someone has already said this, but the best way to mitigate your complaint about Tyrants being too big of a ramp up if you have lost an encounter or two is to use the variant where you calculate the BQ by using your Experience points instead of the Day Number. That way you don't get the extra penalty of tougher bad guys along with not being able to gain training points.
I’ve said it so many times and I’ll say it again, TMB is an absolute masterpiece! A must play and must own “Forever Game!”
This is a spot on review of TMB. I bought the base game recently after a discussion about good solo games that are portable for work trips. That's another plus of this game: You can throw some chips in a bag, a couple of character sheets, and a couple of dice trays, and take this game anywhere. Then bring it home and play with your game group. I am bracing my wallet to buy everything TMB during this campaign because I completely agree that if I could only have one game . . .
I never thought of taking it on the go like that....might be a bit scared to :)
@@BoardGameCo One of the reasons the cost is so high is the quality of the components. They hold up really well in travel. Fair warning if you are flying commercial though: TSA has gone through my bags before because stacks of cards apparently look weird on the scanners. Have not had any issues with TMB yet.
@@Nameless_Adventurer yep, the cards is a density issue. Anything too dense causes them to look through it. Chips shouldn't be a problem
Would also love a box with just an insert that would allow for a quick remove and restore of a campaign in progress. Living in a city apartment with limited time, space and no gaming table, not being able to ‘quicksave’ is a big barrier to getting this game to the table.
I have been avoiding TMB because of its cost, and because I thought, "It's just combat." Your review singlehandedly persuaded me to dive into TMB! I'm not pledging, however. I went out and bought the base game, 3rd edition. - toby
Enjoy it :)
Have you had a chance to play it? Did you enjoy it?
@@lp9092 Yes! I played it for a month, 37 hours. Delightfully challenging. I stopped playing when my copy of Euthia arrived. -toby
@@tobyr21 sweet. Euthia looks like quite the involved game, too!
One of my all time favorite games. So so good. Thanks for the content Alex!
TMB is my favorite game of all time. And I am so hyped for the grand finale. Cheers!
Solid choice for a number 1 game.
I played TMB for the first time on TTS recently. Got in a couple of games in a week. I read the latest rulebook and was able to learn it relatively easily. My problem was is that it is very hard to find rules mid-game. I really enjoyed this game, and could see myself enjoying it a lot... But that price... Ooof! I don't usually do this but I might just stick to playing on TTS.
The longer I'm in the hobby, the more I'd rather spend the $500-$600 for an amazing game that will hit the table and be fun every time, then have 10 $50-$60 games that never see rotation.
I wish the industry would focus more on quality (in design, components) than on volume. CTG has it figured out.
I 100% agree with you. I used to flinch from expensive games while buying cheap junk that I would never play.
The newest version rulebooks are much better.It really makes a difference.
Better.it lol 😂 anyway this is why there is a new version do worst than the original is almost impossible
@@patriziopastore9895 which version is it ? Because i give up last year because of this :p
@@Lynaliaplop I'm using the 2.0
October already is such an expensive month and now this.... Why does this game sound so good and you gave it such an incredible review?
Thanks Alex, I the love the enthusiasm you have when you talk about games in your reviews.
Great review!! I have one question. I constantly mention the “puzzle” aspect of the game, but it seems that for some to solve the puzzle, it requires throwing the desired dice results, depending on luck. What is your thoughts on that?
One of my favorites as well and totally worth every penny. And the Trove Chest is a must-buy if you have all of the current content. It cuts down both set-up and tear-down times considerably.
Man you are super precise... The picture from the top is almost perfect just missed a... Cup of coffee!!!
Lol, I could have put one on a coaster on the travel map...but people would have lost it :)
Thanks for the detailed review @boardgameco . New to the hobby as a whole (@ 46, never too late). Seriously thinking of canning my Kings of Ruin pledge and digging into this. I won’t have to wait a year, and I’ll be getting in on a proven game.
It´s amazing how many games is out there...first time hearing about this and I'm almost ashamed of it as this seems for something I may love.
I am intrigued but this looks way too expensive, fiddly and abstract for my tastes.
@@malcolmdouglasmichaluk8263 Played it once. Was ok. But not something I plan to play again.
I finally decided to dip my toes to TMB, but I need a little guidance. I decided to go for the original Core box, but the shipping costs 20e so I thought it would be a better value to make use of the free shipping over 200e. What would you recommend to take along the core box to get to that 200e mark? Don´t want to overshoot it too much so something around 50-60 euro of content. Premium health chips? Additional gearlocs? 40 days of Daelore? What would be the best first addition to a new player?
The lack of a comeback mechanic makes the cumulative nature of losses soul crushing.
Yes, 100%.
I also want to point out that once you get to the boss you can choose to go straight into his encounter or do another encounter before tackling the boss, which usually gives you a couple of extra training points you may need at the cost of some 1pt baddies being added to the boss encounter. Its usually worth it to do it once unless the baddie points will add a 20 pt into the encounter.
Absolutely, I think I covered that but not in a lot of detail.
Just learned to play from the 2.1 rule book - it was the worst rule book I’ve ever read. Played a game true solo. Managed to win the first battle but got one or two shot in the next three battles which meant I wouldn’t have been able to get enough progress to face the tyrant before the time ran out. One of the worst first experiences I’ve ever had with any board game. Going to try it again later and see if I have any more joy.
So what are your thoughts now? Have you gotten any more playtime?
@@beaglegod1 yeah I played some more, both solo and multiplayer. The worst game I’ve ever played. I strongly dislike it
This game is so good. I love it. This game two handed and Mage Knight are my go to solo experiences. Basically the only two solo games I regularly play anymore 😄
I want..but I saw the price and it doesn’t include the expansions it’s already at the price of mk ultimate
I got a second-hand deal recently, with 80-90% of the content available. I went in too deep.. but now I’m looking at each day and getting more and more happy with the purchase. This game is just on another level!
tmb has been number 1 on my list for 2 years running for a reason great video Alex Stay Hexy!
It's an incredible game
Love, Love, Love Too Many Bones. This is my Keeper game. There is so much variety, so much replay-ability, so much content. It is a lifestyle game. You cannot play this once a year. And I know the rules issues, but I have met so many wonderful people that are as passionate about the game as I am. If you ever have a question about the game, the best minds are always ready and willing to help.
Once you understand the game better, the bosses aren't such a jump in difficulty. Here's what you're missing: 1) Who the boss is, is open knowledge from the get go, and 2) The encounters you face along the way are your growth opportunities, thus can be tackled with almost any build, while the bosses have specific gimmicks. Put those 2 things together and you realize that boss is more of a progress checkpoint. We always keep the boss in mind as we go, we know what that "puzzle" will entail, so we can plan around it. Lots of armor? Get that armor pierce skill asap. Poisons you? Make sure to get that poison removal skill asap. Etc. When you play it this way, the boss feels like a smoother difficulty curve. Like, ok yup, you planned well, good job. Before we realized all this, we felt just like you, often clobbered by the boss. So just remember, the boss is open knowledge from the beginning!
Man, chapeau! Just objective and so well approached.
Thank you!
Love this game and need to get it to the table so much more!
Yep, every time I play it I want to play it more.
One of the most well articulated reviews I’ve ever watched. I love TMB, if you put the work into learning the system and gearlocs, you will be rewarded in spades! One slight criticism I have about the game is some of the random encounters at the wrong time can be punishing especially for true solo.
Subscribed!
This is also one of my favourite games I own. 3 things I dont like about the game that you didnt mention is
1) Swingy difficulty especially at the 2 player count. There is an initiative track, and if there are 4 baddies on the map, who all have higher initiative then the gearlocs, sometimes your character can be dead before you even get a turn.
2) Optimum minmaxer play vs fun. Almost all the time the using your training points on upgrading stats(attributes) is the rihgt choice (the only time it isnt is vs specific tyrants). But that isnt the most fun. The fun is unlocking all the cool skills. So usually I play non-optimally but fun.
3) You partially touched on it - Rules. Since there are SO many skills and loot that it ends up in a ton of edge cases which arent covered by the rules. This requires you to either lookup FAQs, erratas, or other posts, or just make a call on what you think makes sense.
@@rb4551 yeah I agree with that as well. I often don't go with trove loot because of the hassle. Unlocking trove chests and dangerous darts are two mechanics in the game I don't like.
How can you not show us the inside of the Trove Chest?
Lol, it's hard enough to manage this on the table :)
plenty of youtube videos
Thanks for the review! I got the chance to play this at Gen Con and loved it. I've ordered the base game and have also pledged Unbreakable.
I'm curious: what other games would be contenders for the only game you keep: Terraforming Mars? Blood Rage? Anything else?
Those two for sure, although these are all interested categories. There are top 10 games, top 10 desert island games, top 10 games that will never leave the collection...all 3 of those lists would have overlap, but are actually different lists due to different nuances.
How about Cloudspire? Is it similar for you (my impression is that they are similar especially in the asimmetry of the factions)? And in your rating?
I own it but haven't yet played it :(
I troubled about getting it for a loooong time. The Gamefound campagne with the german version starts tomorrow, so I'm back in despair. We usually prefer dry euros, so is it right for us? Love the material and it sounds tempting, but man, it's hard 😀
THANK YOU! I have a nice (just received) TMB Collection, and after this video, I'm not afraid to touch it any more. Here goes. Mazel Tov!
It's great :)
Great video! Now if only my copy would hurry up and get here so I could play it :D
Lol yep
Damit Alex, I don't need this right now!
:-)
Sorry man :)
Thanks for the review. Saw a like new copy of the base game on the used game shelf at my FLGS yesterday for $120 sans tax or shipping. Might be my entry point into the TMB universe and glad to hear that might be enough. Trying to stay away from buying all the extras that will likely never get played.
How's the story of the game? If you lose, are there storylines that emerge to redeem oneself or whatever? Or, is a game pick a bad guy, upgrade and puzzle, face bad guy, lose or win? Is there consequence in the story?
The latter. Story is surface level only.
I am glad one of the expansions of the new content is making the old bosses better. I noticed after certain amount of plays some of the original bosses from the base game are lacking. Like I fought Drellen who was a heavy poison boss, and I was playing as Tink and my friend was playing as Gasket. my bots were immune to poison and Gasket is immune to poison. Drellen couldn't do much to us.
once you figure out the best gearlocs to beat him with - that's when you start taking out the weaker gearlocs against him and figuring out how to win.
OG better than Undertow? I really like the extra depth the river adds to the combat. REALLY looking forward to the changing battlefield in unbreakable.
As a starting point I think so. But otherwise Undertow does have that extra aspect.
What would be the minimum essential you would recommend as a new tmb ?
The base game. That's plenty.
Base game will keep you busy for a while. then you can branch out from there if you wish in many different ways.
you can add more characters to play. (tink, nugget, ghillie etc)
you can add more encounter cards. (40 days of daelore)
you can add a campaign (age of tyranny)
or stand alone expansions that add new bad guy types and change up the battle board. (undertow, unbreakable)
Yes this is one of my evergreen games too
Awesome game. Buyer beware for new buyers. You dont need it all. It is also easy to pick up more if you want later.
This. 100% this.s
And what if you only have the core…
@@koonfasa The core is all you NEED. It will take a good while to get bored with that.
Do you play true solo or two heroes usually?
Always two, I've never played true solo.
This will be the first time I see this game. I've heard the name before, but that's it.
Can’t wait finally get a chance to get the trove chest and new content of course lol ( and I’ll support CTG because they are all awesome)
Oh man you've got me eyeing the Gamefound campaign coming up. I went in with victorum so not 100% I'll double down with TMB, but man its alluring for sure.
Sorry...it's not cheap, but you actually don't need everything.
@@BoardGameCo for sure.
I do see some overlap with victorum and tmb. The upgrade system and narrative (story cards) for tmb look superior for sure but the strategic element has some overlap as well as the deployment situation. I like the art and environment more in victorum too. The squad element in victorum is pretty sweet as well. Hmm... decisions, decisions.
Thanks for the content and reply sir!
I backed the core set as a part of Burncycle… now the long wait
Yep :)
So as a new player is the base game best to get or just jump into the the gamefound Unbreakable (standalone)?
grab the basegame with the premium health chips. (ghillie or nugget if you want to add extra characters)
that'll keep you busy for a couple months
@@penoyer79 Sounds like a plan. I think Ill wait though and pick it up on my next trip to the states. That $55 shipping to asia is painful unless you're going all in.
I'll get in the upcomming gamefound capaign. They will have the german version of the base game. I somehow have the feeling that I also need all of it :x soooo it would be a bit extreme to order the trove chest aswell right?
The Trove Chest is almost a necessity once you have everything. Speeds up setup and tear down immensely, while keeping everything nice and organized....and it's pretty crammed already.
What are your favorite add-on characters?
I've actually only played with base game and undertow characters so far.
everyone loves Ghillie. I think Nugget is essential.
And Tink is very unique and very powerful once you get the hang of how to use him. .
I have just spent an absurd amount of money on TMB. And I am way hooked.
It's very very good :)
@@BoardGameCo Right? Even though I have been getting my ass handed to me. I cant stop.
Such a great review!
TMB is on my top 3 list!
I love the game!
Woohoo I love this game AND I love your shirt. Man, I really like that shirt. Hilarious. Cloudspire's actually my favorite 2 player game of all time, but TMB is a close 3rd. Skytear is number 2.
Will you review descent? I have it and I'm absolutly loving it. That games been getting abad rep.
My all time favorite game. If I had to choose one game it would definitely be Too Many Bones
My favourite game of all time.
It's incredible.
I couldn't agree more. TMB is a real great game. One of my top three.
Hey Alex, I was thinking of a chat you had with Quack and Shira about TMB (~9:02 into your Let's Chat video with them) and Quack said "I own everything, I still struggle with it. I think I went to deep too fast. I'm going back to the beginning to see if I can rekindle something". I have watched Quack's excitement about the game on his previous reviews so this comment from Quack is giving me a bit of a pause in clicking an All-In button. When you discussed what I can see others not liking did you happen to include whatever was bothering Quack? Was Quack merely suggesting he was bored of the game after playing it too many times? Any idea of how many games he enjoyed before hitting the wall? I wish I could hear you and Quack discuss the point he made and compare it to the thoughts you shared with us here. I'll probably listen to this review quite a few times before making a decision to back it. Pardon me for asking but I'm somewhat new to gamefound (vs Kickstarter campaigns) direct pledging experience; how does it work in terms of pledging one level but being able to upgrade it later in a pledge manager? In KS we were able to back with $1 and update it later in a pledge manager. How does gamefound work in this regard? Can we start at a lower level before ~Nov 5th but then upgrade it later as we realize we want more before the pledge manager ends? Anyway if you've done a tour of how gamefound works in practice let us know.
You can pledge for 5$ in order to get access to the pledge manager. The amount (1/5) depends on the creators.
@@danielveda5870 If you look at the FAQ on gamefound for TMB I Think they suggest that all you have to do is "Follow" the campaign to gain access to the pledge manager. Interesting.
My 3 Games with a 10/10 are Too many Bones, Mage Knight and Twilight Imperium 4ed. So those 3 I keep, if I only could keep one Game in my collection…
Well 2 of those are amazing...and the 3rd I haven't played :)
Just to add another point that I've not heard many reviewers highlight...
This game was too fiddly for me. I don't mind games with long setups but then I expect the game to flow after that investment. In too many bones you have to setup after each scenario and it does take time; coupled with the gameplay part of each scenario only lasting 5-10 minutes at most. I sold the game afterwards due to this.
As a caveat, I usually do all the setup with my gaming group so it felt more arduous, if you've got a group that all help out then it may be less of a concern.
I totally hear but I can't say it's been an issue for me and I usually do find that kind of thing bothersome.
this is a tough one for a gaming group. you're better off playing this with a single buddy or by yourself handling 1 or 2 characters. where you can take your time and go at your own place
Great game. Hate the art and the rule book. I found it to much to handle solo. But at two to three the game sings for me. Glad you gave this one some love Alex! Looking forward to the GF project.
I'm struggling with what to do with this upcoming campaign. I picked up the base game of TMB with my copy of burncycle thinking that it wouldn't matter if the delivery was delayed since I had so many other games to play in the meantime. Now, I wish I would have just ordered from their online store so that I would have a copy on hand. It's hard to know how deep to dive when I've not had the chance to play the base game yet. With that being said, FOMO is hitting me hard. I'm concerned that if I don't pick up the chest now, I'll regret it later. So I'm thinking I'll grab a couple of expansions and the chest. That way, should I want additional characters and content later on down the road, I'll have the storage solution already in place. And if, by chance it doesn't end up being for me, I can sell and get my money back.
Do they not have a Pledge Manager on their campaigns?
You could maybe do a smaller pledge to delay a few months so you can try the game, then crank up to a higher level in the PM (assuming they do it that way).
I would argue the Base game is enough, I got the base game 2019 and then after I played the game once I went crazy on their store and bought everything else. I still have much of the extra content sitting on my shelf unplayed. Never even touched Undertow yet, because I am still enjoying the base game. That being said I would at least get a good chuck of character expansions. The base game only has 4 characters and honestly it wasn't enough.
This is a great game, and one that will stand the test of time.
100% yes.
I’m trying to see, but can’t tell on my phone, is Drellen sleeved?
No need to really, all of the cards are made of PVC.
I'm very interested in this game. I wanna try out undertow. Love the channel Alex!
One thing I hope is that we can work more with unique 16 dices for the next new gearlocs.
I wanna win using those dices, not essentially with dexterity power.
🤗🤗🤗
🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲🎲
I played this once at a gaming night I attend and was genuinely torn for several days whether to buy it or not (I didn't in the end.)
I love the elegance of the 4x4 board with the setup being so simple and how you can tell health at a glance due to the chip stacks. It reminds me of ye olde 4x4 rooms in warhammer quest :)
The problems that prevented me from chasing down my own copy were:
a) I always play multi rather than solo so bringing others in is important and the teach is quite monumental for this because you don't just teach the game but each character to each player :P
b) I hate the minigames. I just want to 'dungeon crawl' by making interesting decisions and battling... I really got turned off by time taken up rolling rounds of 'dangerous darts' and random dexterity flicking that sometimes turns up. It's yet more rules to read up too.
c) I feel like lockpicking is just a needless complication that doesn't add much. We ended up with a bunch of chests stuck on high values none of us were able to ever roll
d) you mentioned it in the vid, but it has a failure cascade issue. If you lose a fight then it's harder to win the next due to losing out on the upgrades which means you're more likely to lose that and so on. To be honest, I'd rather just end the campaign on a loss than have this weird, dragged-out slow death that the game seems to lead to :o
Ultimately, if they released a streamlined version of this that cuts out the minigames and lockpicking... it'd be easier to teach and be much easier for me to press that 'buy' button :3
One of my favorites for sure
Roughly how many times has TMB hit your table?
Dug through the comments and found your response to the same question. Great video.
Can I ask how many times have you played TMB? :)
No idea, I've been playing it for years, since before I started tracking plays.
are there any spiders in the game?
Is there magic in this game?
I also started with Undertow. Never really felt a need to get the OG game but i backed with Gasket and picked up Tink and Nugget. Looking at it it felt like a big investement (and tbh a downgrade from Undertow), but i have been tempted from time to time. Skipped splice and dice as well because it was not what i was looking for. But Unbreakable.... that looks incredibly promising to me and I'm hoping to pick up the 2020 promo pack (since i also got cloudspire), 40 waves in daelore and maybe some extra characters as well. Really hoping to get away with paying less than $200 (+VAT), because whev it is a lot, even for a game that i love.
You just helped me to buy unbreakable and add the base game as well, but just because it’s available in German and it will help me get trough the rules.
And if I’m used to the game and I just need one, I can easily sell one of them. There is nothing here on the second hand market.
It's such a good game :-)
I really want to get into this game but the sheer amount of content and my inability to just stop with the core game has me worried I'll be all in and in debt in no time once I begin
The great thing about chip theory games is that there are no Kickstarter exclusives. You can pace yourself and buy new components and expansions as your budget allows. You may be subject to a small wait as their stock is constantly in flux due to high demand. But you never have to worry about FOMO. Just get what you can when you can and build out from there.
900$ game play all in lol.
@@CheddahSlammer yeah but stopping with just gameplay items for chip theory games is like buying a house and not putting up any curtains. You're going to get the premium health chips, dice holders, chip organizers, etc at some point.
@@ReverendDrDeath LOL i hear you man. this is why im so gald i got in on this when the base game first came out. ive been able get stuff as it comes out as opposed to staring at a mountain of content i can't not get.
I need a friend to buy this game so I can play it lol. I'd love to play it but just like Terraforming Mars, I can't stand the art and therefore refuse to add it into my collection
Great review, but you miss it a little at the end. You should have said that the problem may be that "you do not have enough bones." Ha ha!
Lol fair enough :)
I wish I had not seen this video. My wallet is screaming “you should have not watched that video!” I am going to have to look into this. You are right. You don’t need it all. So, a question. Is the game available retail? How hard will it be to find the various expansions? Do the crowdfunded games have deluxe versions?
Everything they make is generally available easily from the website as long as it's not in between print runs. Promos can be a bit harder, and the trove chest is not easily available
2 player is really hard! Unless you have Ghillie...
Huh...maybe that's why I find the bosses challenging :) 2 gearlocs has been my primary player count.
i used Tantrum and Tink and just mow down baddies by the dozen
Thanks, Alex. This is game is a gem (beautiful, quality...and expensive). Any thoughts on ranking the characters?
Tink/Tantrum is my favorite combo. unfair. baddie killing machines.
solo - i tend to gravitate towards Nugget. She's a swiss army knife. Just does everything well. Her Longblade and Dagger are phenomenal at dealing with annoying abilities like Break and Hardy.
I misread the title as "If only I could keep it in my collection..." And got real worried. It was your videos that got me to finally try the game out and now I, too, am in the position of owning a trove chest and all the non-promo content.
It's so good :)
This game is awesome
100% it is.
Amazing game..... but imho it has a couple other problems not mentioned
1. Hardy was the worst idea ever. Make a game all about upgrading and adding more and more things..... Then give 1/2 the baddies in Undertow an inate skill that negates it all.... I hate it.
2. There's no pretending movement on a 4x4 grid is in ANY way strategic. After the first turn everything that needs to will have moved into the 4 center squares, which gives the players 0 strategic movement options since the baddies move of 2 allows them to reach any space on the board.
Don't get me wrong. It's an awesome game, but a consideration for "only" game? Idk
I've only played TMB once (last night ^^), but it was on 'Undertow' and I suspect the mechs/krelln were added to address your comment right there.
I found myself moving around a bit to delay needing to deal with the krelln until I wanted to - Plus as duster I wanted to get both me and my wolf adjacent to enemies for my Backup Plan which felt important.
I definitely think without the mechs/krelln, it would feel less free, and potentially even worse with 4 players with the board becoming more cramped - Guess I have to find out :)
Not to mention scaling problems and that sometimes it's very swingy...
Oh, and I also really don't like those chips. I prefer minis all the way.
the trick to beating Hardy is getting multiple pings on them. also using bleed effects (Duster's dagger) in combo with Fatigue damage.
Oh wow, it takes that much space?
Just saw the price of those, its about the same as mage knight ultimate..but then I saw the expansion good sweet moses
If you could only keep one game.... Sounds like a man whose never played cloudspire to me.
Correct :)
TMB is awesome! Its just too easy - thats the only Problem :/
Are you playing with 4? I've heard that 4 or even 3 can drift towards being too easy.
@@BoardGameCo no, only solo or two handed! And perhabs with a little bit of luck :) i hope the third wave makes it a bit more harder
I really don't see it about this game. It looks fiddly/lucky for not enough payoff making it hard to hit the table.
I'm not much of a dice chucker so that could be why (Death May Die is my only game like that).
I'd love to try it still but not enough to gamble my money on it.
Yeah the game is a heavy dice chucker, however the misses (which in this game are bones) go into a track on your sheet, and power up your special abilities. So unlike a normal dice chucker your not penalized by missing.
I've played this game several times with different people and no one really liked it. Swingy game that doesn't scale well with number of players. I really don't understand all this love.
Thankyou. Finally someone else who doesn't like this game. I think it's a boring wayyyy too long game. Scenarios where you get 1 shot and sit out for the rest isn't fun
You are not alone. I just played it once and never had interest to play it again. Too many other games I'd rather play instead.
Seems like people like it because of solo from what I am read. Glad people like it. I would try it but not interested in an abstract dungeon crawl. That said I get the appeal of the puzzle but you need to know that is really the game and why people like it. Like the arkham horror games you need to like dieing and starting over lol.
@@bradleak1465 That's my guess too - I can see how it would appeal to people as a puzzle, especially solo. And as such it's perhaps one of the best - if one wants to puzzle.
I prefer interactive multi-player games - which then explains why TMB is rated "meh" for me.
@@oerthling ya not sure it is for me at the price. Village attacks I enjoy solo and has minis and gives me that whew I just barely won feel.
The new rulebook is still not good. Its wordings and terms are a little confusing. The structure of the rulebook is bad. And the tutorial is incomplete.
But it is a really good game. Can't wait for TMB Unbreakable KS. 😊
Yep, sounds about right...but still amazing.
My favorite game of all time is Puerto Rico, which will get a total makeover that will most likely destroy it.
@UCkcEBOunOEneEgRD9wlJUIQ - Still our favorite game of all time.
Too Many Bones is overwrought mechanics designed to sell an overproduced and overpriced product. But dang if I didn't have a good time playing it.
But it works :) And works well :)