How much does it bend horizontally? From steady stand in zero point to full windload when comparing from ground to the nacelle? Is it more than one meter?
In the harshest Moments it may be more then 3 Meters from neutral Point. At normal Operation it has a pre-bend due to a constant Wind pressure, that may be up to 2 Meters. On top of that there are fluctuations of some cm. up to about 1m at high gusts.
@@Salvoran ich stelle die Frage etwas anders: gibt es geplante Arbeiten, bei denen der Notstop im Maschinenhaus, im Betrieb gedrückt wird? Nein. Kann das in der Praxis vorkommen? Ja. Ist mir das schon passiert? Ja, schon öfter. Soweit ich mich erinnern kann ist 2 mal jemand versehentlich an den Notaus gekommen und die anderen male hatte die Anlage einen Fehler und ist dadurch in den Notstop gegangen, während ich oben war. Angenehm ist das nicht, aber ganz Verhindern lässt sich das nicht immer.
Just do a search on youtube 'ship bending' and look at the interior shots looking down the corridors along the long axis of the ship, it becomes very obvious...
War als Kind einmal auf einer An Bonus mit 62 Meter Rotordurchmesser und durfte dort den Sofort Stop oben im Maschinenhaus bestätigen. Das hat vielleicht geschwankt, dass unterschätzt man immer.
Ja, da gibt es große Unterschiede zwischen verschiedenen Modellen. Bei einer V112 mit dem 120m Stahlturm, der besonders "weich" ist, bin ich beim Stopp im Maschinenhaus sogar mal gestürzt, weil ich die starke Bewegung nicht erwartet hätte🙈 Die 1300er AN Bonus (auf der du warst) ist auch recht beweglich im Vergleich zu anderen 😁
@@saasch_baasch Das muss aber auf 120 Meter noch extremer sein, dass du da sogar gestürzt bist. Die hatte 80 Meter Höhe und das hat sich überhaupt nicht gut angefühlt.
@@montiro8999 das hat mehr etwas mit der Steifigkeit des Turmes zu tun, nur sekundär mit der Höhe. Es gibt auch eine ältere Enercon mit ca. 80 Meter Turm, der auch extrem weich ist, da muss man schon aufpassen 😄
I won't get into too much technical Detail, but you actually can't feel the Movement, is there is any. We measured this on some modern Turbines and it was within 0.2 mm, relative to the surrounding soil. Most of the movement is absorbed by the Elongation / compression of the pre tensioned steel Bolts in the foundation.
Ok... the lifespan is calculated via fatigue curves, stress assumptions regarding to different wind conditions and some more. The calulated Lifespan of modern Turbines is between 20 and 25 Years, maybe up to 30!?. So the amount of oscillations is very high, which leads to a design with a very high fatigue strength of the Towersections. The weakest Point on these Towers are always the Bolts that hold the Towersections together, which may be changed after many years in operation. Back to your question: these high oscillating flex is only in stop situations for a few moments, I guess it's effect is minor to the Overall Stress to the Tower, as long the strain keeps under the tensile yield strength or even the breaking stress of the Tower and Bolts. Regards
@@saasch_baasch that makes sense. The stress exerted on the structure will certainly test every bit of engineering that went into it. 25 years sounds impressive when all that is taken into account. Thank you for the reply!
These Lifespan calculations based on fatigue are especially for the primary carrying parts, that means: Foundation, Tower, Main frame, Rotor bearing and socket, Hub and Blades. Other big parts like Generator and Gearbox should last also more than 20 years but do have their own calculation. The Brake especially is a normal expendable part which gets changed depending on wear. Hope that answers your question😊
@@Stefan_Dahn Isn't there a slow stop option? This is just for emergency stopping. There is also a faster emergency stop that uses a brake but is usually a 1 - 2 time use.
This is a normal stop at high Windspeed. Some of the actual Turbines don't do a "real" emergency Stop from full speed (Disk Brake and full speed pitch back) due to extremely high loads / Stress on the whole Structure. These Stops takes just a few seconds more, but to be honest I guess I doesn't matter in an emergency if the Turbine stops in 10 or 15 Seconds.
Yes, the Towers are designed for a lifertime of 20, up to 30 year's. These Vibrations occur mainly at stopping the Turbine. Due operation the Amplitude is less, but the Tower is more constantly bended due to high permanent forces.
@@Mike-kr5dn that's right. The Magnets are maybe the strongest permanent Magnets that you can find. The upright Force on massive Steel is about 600 Kg. The Ladder is attached with two of them every 2 meters. The Servicemen do have a special Tool to detach them. I have two of them at home, they may be extremely dangerous, currently one of them stucks on my refrigerator.... no Way to get them of without Tools 🙈
@@saasch_baasch What happens at the fridge stays at the fridge! 😉 I also use some of these magnets to install filters and stuff on some of my turbines. I just call it the "Vestas death magnet". 😁 It does have a little sister in size of a thumb, wich is also quite strong for it's size.
... ja, steht schon ganz oben auf meiner Liste, ich warte nur auf genügend Wind eine passende Anlage 😄 mittlerweile habe ich auch passendes Equipment um das besser zu Filmen.
Die 166m sind schon beeindruckend, aber von der Bewegung her weit weniger schlimm, aufgrund der Längs-Teilung der unteren Segmente, sodass der Durchmesser unten deutlich größer als die Standard 4 Meter ist. Das macht den Turm relativ steif für seine Höhe.
😄 So schlimm ist das in der Regel nicht. Wenn du die Möglichkeit hast, dann such dir einen Tag mit wenig Wind oder einfach eine Anlage mit Hybridturm aus, da merken das nur Menschen, die Wasseradern aufspüren und infraschall hören können 😄😉
No, there aren't any Dampers between the Steel sections. They are bolted directly to each other with many giant bolts. This is the pure Power of mother Nature 😄
This can be very dangerous in the long run. Thousands of structures have already failed due to material fatigue. And that crackling isn't a good sound either.
These structures are specially designed and calculated for this purpose. After 20 years, it can be calculated quite precisely what loads the structure has experienced and even a remaining service life. The cracking noises come from connections in the secondary structure and are unavoidable, but not too bad.
Gibt's auch bockhart😄 die Hybrid oder vollbetontürme sind viel steifer. Was man letztendlich baut ist eine Wirtschaftliche Frage und was technisch verfügbar ist.
Thank you for having good videos to show my friends what it sounds like in these things
Thank you so much, this goes down like warm honey 😌
Là je crois que j'ai trouvé une des meilleures prises de vue de tout TH-cam.
I can imagine you would see something very similar if you were to look up the shaft like that during an Earthquake.
OMG this channel is a gem!
How much does it bend horizontally? From steady stand in zero point to full windload when comparing from ground to the nacelle? Is it more than one meter?
In the harshest Moments it may be more then 3 Meters from neutral Point. At normal Operation it has a pre-bend due to a constant Wind pressure, that may be up to 2 Meters. On top of that there are fluctuations of some cm. up to about 1m at high gusts.
@@saasch_baasch that was a quick answer. Thank you!
@@saasch_baasch Darf man bei einem Notstopp in der Gondel sein?
@@Salvoran ich stelle die Frage etwas anders: gibt es geplante Arbeiten, bei denen der Notstop im Maschinenhaus, im Betrieb gedrückt wird? Nein. Kann das in der Praxis vorkommen? Ja. Ist mir das schon passiert? Ja, schon öfter. Soweit ich mich erinnern kann ist 2 mal jemand versehentlich an den Notaus gekommen und die anderen male hatte die Anlage einen Fehler und ist dadurch in den Notstop gegangen, während ich oben war. Angenehm ist das nicht, aber ganz Verhindern lässt sich das nicht immer.
Same type of oscillating bend that opened the O ring joint in the solid rocket booster on the Challenger Shuttle Disaster
You wouldn't get me up there for all of the tea in China.
Greetings youtube Algorithm People in 5 years time, please enjoy your stay
4 more years
3 in, guys its crazy out the we may not make it to 5 🙃😆
@@MrSightPlz hold the faith
His other video just algorithimed, I backed the wrong horse 😢
@@Greendot319 same here :)
Unbelievable... I have been in big ships that bent but nothig like this. Crazy..... very unnearving....
Ships bend ?
@@nvmffs Big ones in storms absolutely do....
Just do a search on youtube 'ship bending' and look at the interior shots looking down the corridors along the long axis of the ship, it becomes very obvious...
If it didn't bend, then it would break. It's the same with the masts on yachts. Thanks for the video. 🙂👍
And the most worrying sound would be a metallic “ptang tink”.
War als Kind einmal auf einer An Bonus mit 62 Meter Rotordurchmesser und durfte dort den Sofort Stop oben im Maschinenhaus bestätigen. Das hat vielleicht geschwankt, dass unterschätzt man immer.
Ja, da gibt es große Unterschiede zwischen verschiedenen Modellen. Bei einer V112 mit dem 120m Stahlturm, der besonders "weich" ist, bin ich beim Stopp im Maschinenhaus sogar mal gestürzt, weil ich die starke Bewegung nicht erwartet hätte🙈
Die 1300er AN Bonus (auf der du warst) ist auch recht beweglich im Vergleich zu anderen 😁
@@saasch_baasch Das muss aber auf 120 Meter noch extremer sein, dass du da sogar gestürzt bist. Die hatte 80 Meter Höhe und das hat sich überhaupt nicht gut angefühlt.
@@montiro8999 das hat mehr etwas mit der Steifigkeit des Turmes zu tun, nur sekundär mit der Höhe. Es gibt auch eine ältere Enercon mit ca. 80 Meter Turm, der auch extrem weich ist, da muss man schon aufpassen 😄
Do you feel the foundation shift a little when it sways that much?
I won't get into too much technical Detail, but you actually can't feel the Movement, is there is any. We measured this on some modern Turbines and it was within 0.2 mm, relative to the surrounding soil. Most of the movement is absorbed by the Elongation / compression of the pre tensioned steel Bolts in the foundation.
How much of an effect on lifespan does the flex contribute to?
Ok... the lifespan is calculated via fatigue curves, stress assumptions regarding to different wind conditions and some more.
The calulated Lifespan of modern Turbines is between 20 and 25 Years, maybe up to 30!?. So the amount of oscillations is very high, which leads to a design with a very high fatigue strength of the Towersections. The weakest Point on these Towers are always the Bolts that hold the Towersections together, which may be changed after many years in operation.
Back to your question: these high oscillating flex is only in stop situations for a few moments, I guess it's effect is minor to the Overall Stress to the Tower, as long the strain keeps under the tensile yield strength or even the breaking stress of the Tower and Bolts.
Regards
@@saasch_baasch that makes sense. The stress exerted on the structure will certainly test every bit of engineering that went into it. 25 years sounds impressive when all that is taken into account. Thank you for the reply!
These Lifespan calculations based on fatigue are especially for the primary carrying parts, that means: Foundation, Tower, Main frame, Rotor bearing and socket, Hub and Blades.
Other big parts like Generator and Gearbox should last also more than 20 years but do have their own calculation. The Brake especially is a normal expendable part which gets changed depending on wear. Hope that answers your question😊
Thats insane
Immer wieder geil sowas zu sehen. Abo von mir hast du sicher😉
Hallo Bäscher Wer hat jetzt auch an die Tauchszene in 'Das Boot' gedacht, wo die Nieten rausploppen? ;-)
whats making the CLICK CLICK CLIck...?
My guess is the ladders and fittings.
OMG. Why don't they stop gradually to avoid the oscillation?
The oscillation is only after a stop. In normal operation, it is much less bending and more "stichatic"/randomly, like grass waving in the wind.
@@Stefan_Dahn Isn't there a slow stop option? This is just for emergency stopping. There is also a faster emergency stop that uses a brake but is usually a 1 - 2 time use.
Is it going to fall over?
Is this view of looking up or looking down?
Looking up from the very Bottom of the Turbine.
@@saasch_baasch Thanks for the clarification. I was confused watching the video. Quite amazing tho 👍
@@raniramayanti312 I know, there are quite a lot of confusing views inside a Windturbine, I just remember my first one😅
Yeahhh,,, i was in the elevator going up to Nacelle and the guy didnt knew and had to press EStop,,, wiggle wiggle wiggle 😂😂
Krass wie das schwankt. Die 140m Stahlröhrentürme von den V112 sind auch wirklich sehr schlank.
Is this an emergency stop? Or just a normal one?
This is a normal stop at high Windspeed. Some of the actual Turbines don't do a "real" emergency Stop from full speed (Disk Brake and full speed pitch back) due to extremely high loads / Stress on the whole Structure. These Stops takes just a few seconds more, but to be honest I guess I doesn't matter in an emergency if the Turbine stops in 10 or 15 Seconds.
Is this safe?
Yes, the Towers are designed for a lifertime of 20, up to 30 year's. These Vibrations occur mainly at stopping the Turbine. Due operation the Amplitude is less, but the Tower is more constantly bended due to high permanent forces.
@@saasch_baasch The ladder is atached with magnets right? I suppose really strong? I tried to pull on it once and it did not even move :D
@@Mike-kr5dn that's right. The Magnets are maybe the strongest permanent Magnets that you can find. The upright Force on massive Steel is about 600 Kg. The Ladder is attached with two of them every 2 meters. The Servicemen do have a special Tool to detach them. I have two of them at home, they may be extremely dangerous, currently one of them stucks on my refrigerator.... no Way to get them of without Tools 🙈
@@saasch_baasch :DDD That thing will crush your fingers. And you got it on a fridge haha.
@@saasch_baasch What happens at the fridge stays at the fridge! 😉
I also use some of these magnets to install filters and stuff on some of my turbines. I just call it the "Vestas death magnet". 😁
It does have a little sister in size of a thumb, wich is also quite strong for it's size.
Must be like 15 + m/s wind.
0:11
Hat die Karre keine Befahranlage ?
Ja, die hat eine Befahranlage, aber an der lässt es sich besser Filmen 😉
@@saasch_baasch Dank dir für die Info
Gibt es davon auch ne aussen Ansicht?
... ja, steht schon ganz oben auf meiner Liste, ich warte nur auf genügend Wind eine passende Anlage 😄 mittlerweile habe ich auch passendes Equipment um das besser zu Filmen.
@@saasch_baasch wunderbar immer wieder geil am besten auch mal bei 166 nabenhöhe
Die 166m sind schon beeindruckend, aber von der Bewegung her weit weniger schlimm, aufgrund der Längs-Teilung der unteren Segmente, sodass der Durchmesser unten deutlich größer als die Standard 4 Meter ist. Das macht den Turm relativ steif für seine Höhe.
Gotta love aeroelasticity
Wär ja gern mal auf eine drauf gegangen, aber das Video ist wohl Grund genug warum ich das doch nie tun werde :)
😄 So schlimm ist das in der Regel nicht. Wenn du die Möglichkeit hast, dann such dir einen Tag mit wenig Wind oder einfach eine Anlage mit Hybridturm aus, da merken das nur Menschen, die Wasseradern aufspüren und infraschall hören können 😄😉
This gave me nausea and that's not even view from the top.
Some of my colleague's are taking Vomex some times, when the type of Turbine and Weather fits like in this Clip😄
Maybe some dampers?
No, there aren't any Dampers between the Steel sections. They are bolted directly to each other with many giant bolts. This is the pure Power of mother Nature 😄
That’s scary
crazy!
is this a over speed test
This can be very dangerous in the long run. Thousands of structures have already failed due to material fatigue. And that crackling isn't a good sound either.
These structures are specially designed and calculated for this purpose. After 20 years, it can be calculated quite precisely what loads the structure has experienced and even a remaining service life. The cracking noises come from connections in the secondary structure and are unavoidable, but not too bad.
@@saasch_baasch Yes, there have been thousands of them. Specially designed.
What are your sources? Certainly, there are always accidents, but these are by no means all caused by pure fatigue.
@@saasch_baasch They might be referring too the fake video of a wind turbine basically exploding that did some rounds on the internet a while back
Zum Glück sind die so Flexibel 😳
Gibt's auch bockhart😄 die Hybrid oder vollbetontürme sind viel steifer. Was man letztendlich baut ist eine Wirtschaftliche Frage und was technisch verfügbar ist.
Kinda freaky.
And this crap is supposed to replace hundreds of tons of high inertia dry saturated superheated steam turbine generators, what a joke.
Just because your small mind can not comprehend physics it doesn't make it crap or a joke.
ése sonido y también ése movimiento es bastante aterrador