@1:32 I’d like to see how that works in detail. I have a hard time imagining how the machine can continuously feed a wire around the core. Is there a really long lead up that is folded in half? The cable can’t possibly be on a feeder coil or that coil would have to be passed through the transformer that is being built. Anyone got any info on that?
I loved my 5 channel rotel amp - it was a monster.. but one night while in bed it went bang. It sounded like a hand grenade. The capacitors exploded and leaked a horrid smell. it was under warranty. Unfortunately for me, the courier ‘lost’ it on its way to the rotel repair center. I can’t blame rotel for that but it was their product failing that required the courier in the first place. I was in my 20’s and saved like crazy to get it. Bummed out for sure.
Indeed. That is some medieval testing fixture using alligator clips or pushing wire ends into brass forks and the testing supply gives +500V and 45 mA. That could easily flatline a worker.
@@wombatillo The testing power supply is not on (1000v, 50ma) until the worker holds down a momentary switch that is positioned away from the fixture, it's completely safe. Worker has been doing it for 30 years lol.
Hier sehen wir natürlich gleich mehrere Fehler - allerding ein gutes Zeichen dafür, dass nicht nur bei preiswerten Geräten Kompromisse eingegengen werden. Insgesamt sehe ich die Marke "Rotel" aber überwiegend als empfehlenswert an, die Preise schätze für den Einsteigerbereich als gut und günstig ein.
I am pretty sure the heat treat process would make all of the lamination as one big lamination reducing over all core inductance & increasing eddy currents.
@thomaslechner1622 A LPS has a much lower noise level than SMPS so is generally a better choice for electrically sensitive equipment such as high quality hifi and medical equipment. But obviously is lower efficiency, heavier etc. A SMPS may be ok for general stuff, but that doesn't make it good for everything.
Nah. Good SMPS will have much less noise as it will eliminate all of the line noise. Its much easier to filter out high frequency than very low frequencies (ie 50hz\60hz) since you can CLC and coupled inductors can be considerable smaller for high frequencies. Also much faster load regulation.
@guytech7310 That only considers electrical supply noise, the rf emissions are an issue with smps compared to linear. It's no use trying to argue black is white, facts are facts, there simply isn't ~20kHz radiation from linear, where there is from a smps. Once you have emitted electromagnetic waves it is difficult to eliminate, hence why linear supplies have their applications.
@@juliegreen7604 Put this way, My Fluke 7- digit precision multimeter has a SMPS. When I design any electronics that uses precision analog inputs, its got a SMPS. I typically use a high frequency buck converter for the analog rail voltage regulation & use a CLC with a coupled inductor to get the noise very low, then I use a ultra low noise linear regulator to remove any remaining noise. I've used this to supply for 16-bit & 20-bit ADCs. Line noise is a problem for linear PS, Every time a inductance load turns on\off it generates noise that a linear PS will not filter out.
@guytech7310 I suggest you read my previous reply as you are completely missing the concept of noise. Smps are producers of significant rfi/emc issues , these issues are all but non-existent with linears. Smps have their place, but they are not magic, there are instances where linears are more suitable. Line noise, as you said, can be reduced easily, rfi and emc issues are notoriously difficult to resolve.
@@juliegreen7604 No since SMPS can be shielded. The emi/rf problem you continue to hang on to isn't an issue in the real world. You seem to just be ignoring facts & reality. Hope that works out for you. Good day.
The humming transformer in the RB-1582mk2, your Chinese manufacture is bad, which is confirmed not only by me, but also by other users of the said power amplifier.
И сильно гудит? Торы гудят обычно. Я напечатал на 3д принтере круглые ножки, наклеил 10мм вспененную резину, усилитель NAD гудел ели слышно, на ножках вообще перестал гудеть.
The humming issue could be eliminated by running weld lines along the open sides of the core every inch. This will bond the laminations together eliminating hum. This also solved the issue with standard transformer cores. Welding the laminating layers together.
More than 85% of household appliances in the United States are made in China. In Europe - 70%. China produces more than 50% of all cameras in the world, 30% of air conditioners and 25% of washing machines.
Big heavy 50 /60 Hz transformer plus diode rectifier is 100 years old technology. Modern SMPS can deliver same power at less weight. Plus: It can have PFC, though this is often not implemented. Why would anybody still use 50 Hz transformer nowadays?
So, a video showing us how a Chinese transformer company makes the toroids that Rotel buys is meant to indicate what exactly? That there are Chinese companies who make toroids? If that's Rotel's "point of differentiation", I'd be interested to know what they save money on.
Well said! Not sure of the heritage of this particular brand, but far too many companies claim their products are unique, when in actuality they just farm everything out to the cheapest producers in the far east.
@@timothyhall7606 it's not well said. This is Rotels factory. They own it. They operate it. Just because something's made in China doesn't mean it's cheap.
@@poisonduckee Billig in den meisten Fällen schon - deshalb aber nicht unbedingt schlecht. Allerdings hat die Produktion in China schon an einigen Stellen ihre Schwächen, welche sich aber durch den Aufbau/die "Infrastruktur" der jeweiligen Betriebsführung deutlich reduzieren lassen - also un Russland oder in Afrika "hochwertig" zu Fertigen, das sollte in den meisten Fällen deutlich schwieriger sein. ;)
@@আবুবকর-ন১ধ It is by no means the same. For example, Taiwan Semiconductor is one of the most advanced chip makers in the world, and makes high end CPUs. By contrast, only low end chips are made in China. TSMC quality is second to none.
It's a shame that the music is so loud that it suppresses the manufacturing noise
that is manufacturing noise, 120db of high fidelity music 24/7, Rotel HiFi !
The toroid winding machine is very satisfying to watch in any transfomer factory ! ...... DAVE™ 🛑
@1:32 I’d like to see how that works in detail. I have a hard time imagining how the machine can continuously feed a wire around the core. Is there a really long lead up that is folded in half? The cable can’t possibly be on a feeder coil or that coil would have to be passed through the transformer that is being built. Anyone got any info on that?
The xformer's total wire need is wound onto the armature that goes through the torroid's hole, then 'unwound' onto the laminations.
ТОРЭЛ и ROTEL... беспощадный Китай
Awesome, I wasn't aware of this. I still have my old ROTEL RCD965BX CD player.......
Top kwaliteit zo te zien.
testing there at 1000 Volts and 20 milli Amperes; what was that for?
Такая крутая фирма, а судя по видео ощущение что цеха где-то в подвале...
Amazing process respect
I loved my 5 channel rotel amp - it was a monster.. but one night while in bed it went bang. It sounded like a hand grenade. The capacitors exploded and leaked a horrid smell. it was under warranty. Unfortunately for me, the courier ‘lost’ it on its way to the rotel repair center. I can’t blame rotel for that but it was their product failing that required the courier in the first place. I was in my 20’s and saved like crazy to get it. Bummed out for sure.
so you lost it entirely along with the money or someone had to pay you for losing it?
Imagine how little time and effort it would take to develop a procedure for insulation testing that didn't expose workers to deadly voltages.
Indeed. That is some medieval testing fixture using alligator clips or pushing wire ends into brass forks and the testing supply gives +500V and 45 mA. That could easily flatline a worker.
@@wombatillo The testing power supply is not on (1000v, 50ma) until the worker holds down a momentary switch that is positioned away from the fixture, it's completely safe.
Worker has been doing it for 30 years lol.
интересно почему после печи лента цвет не поменяла или это нормально ?
Отличная работа, я думал что китай делает по другому...
Да качество разное попадается.
Hier sehen wir natürlich gleich mehrere Fehler - allerding ein gutes Zeichen dafür, dass nicht nur bei preiswerten Geräten Kompromisse eingegengen werden. Insgesamt sehe ich die Marke "Rotel" aber überwiegend als empfehlenswert an, die Preise schätze für den Einsteigerbereich als gut und günstig ein.
Made In China?
Nice. I learned something new! :)
Doesn't spot welding the core so that it doesn't unravel create a shorted turn?
I am pretty sure the heat treat process would make all of the lamination as one big lamination reducing over all core inductance & increasing eddy currents.
Beautiful
It would be interesting to show the toroid winding process. 'Something quickly glossed over in the video.
@thomaslechner1622
A LPS has a much lower noise level than SMPS so is generally a better choice for electrically sensitive equipment such as high quality hifi and medical equipment.
But obviously is lower efficiency, heavier etc.
A SMPS may be ok for general stuff, but that doesn't make it good for everything.
Nah. Good SMPS will have much less noise as it will eliminate all of the line noise. Its much easier to filter out high frequency than very low frequencies (ie 50hz\60hz) since you can CLC and coupled inductors can be considerable smaller for high frequencies. Also much faster load regulation.
@guytech7310
That only considers electrical supply noise, the rf emissions are an issue with smps compared to linear.
It's no use trying to argue black is white, facts are facts, there simply isn't ~20kHz radiation from linear, where there is from a smps.
Once you have emitted electromagnetic waves it is difficult to eliminate, hence why linear supplies have their applications.
@@juliegreen7604 Put this way, My Fluke 7- digit precision multimeter has a SMPS.
When I design any electronics that uses precision analog inputs, its got a SMPS. I typically use a high frequency buck converter for the analog rail voltage regulation & use a CLC with a coupled inductor to get the noise very low, then I use a ultra low noise linear regulator to remove any remaining noise. I've used this to supply for 16-bit & 20-bit ADCs.
Line noise is a problem for linear PS, Every time a inductance load turns on\off it generates noise that a linear PS will not filter out.
@guytech7310
I suggest you read my previous reply as you are completely missing the concept of noise.
Smps are producers of significant rfi/emc issues , these issues are all but non-existent with linears.
Smps have their place, but they are not magic, there are instances where linears are more suitable.
Line noise, as you said, can be reduced easily, rfi and emc issues are notoriously difficult to resolve.
@@juliegreen7604 No since SMPS can be shielded. The emi/rf problem you continue to hang on to isn't an issue in the real world.
You seem to just be ignoring facts & reality. Hope that works out for you. Good day.
The humming transformer in the RB-1582mk2, your Chinese manufacture is bad, which is confirmed not only by me, but also by other users of the said power amplifier.
И сильно гудит? Торы гудят обычно. Я напечатал на 3д принтере круглые ножки, наклеил 10мм вспененную резину, усилитель NAD гудел ели слышно, на ножках вообще перестал гудеть.
The humming issue could be eliminated by running weld lines along the open sides of the core every inch. This will bond the laminations together eliminating hum. This also solved the issue with standard transformer cores. Welding the laminating layers together.
I bought my Rotel RB 1582 MKII in 2017 and it is absolutely SILENT. No hum whatsoever! It's an amazing power amp for the price.@@Subgunman
you payed 2000euro for an amp? ahahahahaa
@@Timsturbs I'm also happy that I paid less than 200 Euro for a new piece at auction :)
I ordered some of these for my computer but I can't figure out where they're supposed to go on the motherboard
Очень качественная работа. Респект.
Как понять очень качественная работа? Это не в гараже ни коленке....
Да "Калина" тоже не на коленке делается, но почему то предпочитают Мерседес, Фольксвапен и т.д...))
ANCIENT testing equipment with analog needle meters.
La musique est pénible. ;)
Very nice! Good job!
Perhaps it's common, but I don't like they weld on the core.
Why?
@@gibbogle
Eddy currents.
More than 85% of household appliances in the United States are made in China. In Europe - 70%. China produces more than 50% of all cameras in the world, 30% of air conditioners and 25% of washing machines.
It probably makes 50% of EVs.
Where I live, Rotel is a canned salsa base
Nice amplifiers until something goes wrong. Then the price to have it repaired nearly matches the price you paid for it.
👍❤️
Better than British company
Big heavy 50 /60 Hz transformer plus diode rectifier is 100 years old technology. Modern SMPS can deliver same power at less weight. Plus: It can have PFC, though this is often not implemented. Why would anybody still use 50 Hz transformer nowadays?
Reliability for the next 100 years?
@@fonebones88In both cases: Not even 25 years. Electrolytics get dry over time, regardless if it is an SMPS or old type PSU.
@@MYNAME_ABC I have seen some electrolytics that are still good enough even after 50 years. Of course 100 years is a bit far-fetched.
😂😂😂
@fonebones88 With contant cycling or just sitting idle in a warehouse
❤❤❤
So, a video showing us how a Chinese transformer company makes the toroids that Rotel buys is meant to indicate what exactly? That there are Chinese companies who make toroids? If that's Rotel's "point of differentiation", I'd be interested to know what they save money on.
No Rotel owns a manufacturing plant in China. I think it's funny how a lot of people just assume if something is made in China it's bad.
Well said! Not sure of the heritage of this particular brand, but far too many companies claim their products are unique, when in actuality they just farm everything out to the cheapest producers in the far east.
@@timothyhall7606 it's not well said. This is Rotels factory. They own it. They operate it. Just because something's made in China doesn't mean it's cheap.
Rotel is a family owned company based in Taiwan, the transformers featured in the video are manufactured in house by Rotel.
@@poisonduckee Billig in den meisten Fällen schon - deshalb aber nicht unbedingt schlecht. Allerdings hat die Produktion in China schon an einigen Stellen ihre Schwächen, welche sich aber durch den Aufbau/die "Infrastruktur" der jeweiligen Betriebsführung deutlich reduzieren lassen - also un Russland oder in Afrika "hochwertig" zu Fertigen, das sollte in den meisten Fällen deutlich schwieriger sein. ;)
да китайчата даже сейчас добротней делают
ммм классика...
এ গুলোর দাম কত
Harganya
97% pure copper? I thought electrical copper was 99+%.
not in cryna
steel
97% copper will have worse electrical characteristics.
Ja, 97% ist für Elektro(lyt)kupfer ein sehr guter Witz - aber wenigstens sind sie in dem Video ehrlich bezüglich ihrer "Qualität. :D
@@johnstreet797 Taiwan is not China.
工場ちうごくなのね
Cheap
the cover is manufactered by Rotel and Coil in China 🤣🤣
Taiwan is not China.
@@gibbogle ist same 🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@আবুবকর-ন১ধ It is by no means the same. For example, Taiwan Semiconductor is one of the most advanced chip makers in the world, and makes high end CPUs. By contrast, only low end chips are made in China. TSMC quality is second to none.
@@gibbogle SAME 😂😂😂
when I see it, so I'd rather have a 50 year old JVC repaired
"Over 97% pure copper" - wait, what?? I would hope it's higher than that!!
3% silver?
,👎😟 за фон
not very precisely made. windings are quite chaotic
The machinery is absolute rubbish! How old is this factory? Looks like it's from the 1940's.... BAD look Rotel.
You think there's something wrong with the transformers?
nope@@gibbogle
At least their high prices ensure the best quality tape is used to keep their testing instruments together...
RinkcäirnträFF0€?? vv
MADE IN CHINA!
another example of tofu dreg crynese manufacturing standards
Taiwan is not China, look at an atlas.
Rotel 1552мк2 + Rotel 1582мк2 + th-cam.com/video/3I-38FTL35w/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/rVwKJCm1ckQ/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/u6BAWKLAPgA/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/zro2KAl8s2s/w-d-xo.html
Rotel -Toroidal 1582мк2 присылайте трансформатор поставлю 2 шт.в отдельный ящик.