Is CdTe something you’d want on your house or project? Order yourself a LARQ Bottle PureVis 2 to go plastic free and enjoy ice cold water throughout the entire day. bylarq.com/undecidedpv2 If you liked this, check out How Compressed Air Batteries are FINALLY Here th-cam.com/video/VS05y9mQgbw/w-d-xo.html
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5607867/ nope, this is terrible idea, far from value of ''green energy''... elimination pathway of Cd involves brain, not to mentioned how it affects carcinogenesis, mutagenesis and destruction of the metabolic pathways associated with energy production in the human body.
Don't like plastic waste associated with drinking water? Buy this radio, battery, plastic, and disposable, proprietary filters only meant for a single person! Sorry, just pointing out the irony there.
Please stop pronouncing NREL as en-are-ee-el. Everybody at NREL, including its director Martin Keller who I just met on Sept 27 at the Colorado School of Mines, pronounce it en-rel. Your excellent podcasts are influential, and I'd appreciate if you could get the small things correct, too. Thank you!
The cool thing about CdTe that you mentioned. They are waste products of 2 VERY widely used metals AND they both don't really have any other uses. So CdTe panels will always have a supply of raw material for not too much money.
I'm a big fan from Lebanon, I love your videos Matt! Solar saved our lives! We have 1 to 2h a day maximum of grid coverage so we just installed a 4kw solar setup and just cancelled the government grid. We're saving a ton on bills, spending it elsewhere and living fully on green power :) The setup is small, so we manually regulate things like on hours for fridge, etc..
Stay safe. Can you tell us more about your experience with using solar power in Lebanon? Many people here wonder if solar can be used as a prepper solution. Thanks.
@@mickmccarthy8925 there is no urban area or country side, the nation is very small but very mountaineous. I live on 420m elevation with a lot of humidity and clouds. The only intense power sucker is the fridge, which we turn on at varying times. During summer, clouds are minimal and the 4 520W panels are working a lot of the day, so we keep it on from 6 am to 7 pm. In autumn its more cloudy and less sun so the fridge goes on from 7 am to 6 pm. I winter its very dependent on the weather, but at worst we turn it off an hour or so during its on hours. For heating water to bath and shower, we have a gas setup, its cheaper then electricity around here. We're also very careful with the batteries (2x250A) and the load. Aside from the fridge we really don't have anything that sucks power with high amperage. My gaming pc is on the lower end, I can keep it running pretty much always. Lastly, the trick to solar, I found, is to minimize consumption when the sun is setting, where the panels are barely charging and turning on anything besides lights and wifi make it stop charging the batteries. This is about a 1h period here so we just let it charge. Perhaps it is illogical, but that's just how I handle all my electronics: don't overstress them and keep them happy. I have an old laptop with an i3 2nd gen, 4gm ram, and an hdd, its terrible and should have died years ago but its still kixking even after 11 years. Same with solar, its a game of load balancing
@@ktefccre sure. My house is full of LED lamps, barely use 20W at most. 2 250A batteries and 4 520W panels have been doing a great job. Although it gets frustrating during some winter days with full on cloud and no heat from the sun, we never pass a day without lights and a working fridge. Heating for the shower is gas-powered, so the only power suckers in the house that impose a heavy load are the fridge and the iron (for clothes). Fridge runs an average of 8h, 12 during the summer, 6 at worst during winter. I live in a very humid area with a lot of clouds too. If I lived in a country side with minimal Cloud, solar would be a blast! Though it would be more terrible in the freezing winters Id assume too. So yeah, the biggest power consumers in the house are iron, fridge, washing machine (forgot to mention it in the other comment), and then my pc at 100W at most. 1V in the Inverter's battery charge panel is equivalent to 500 Watts, since we have 2 250A batteries (1v x 500A = 500 Watts) That means the Pc at very high load might take a singular watt in 5 hours. On a regular day with 8 hours of sun light, you can say we have about 3 volts or 1,500W to work with. You might think its nothing because of the fridge, washing machine, etc, but these don't use much power in practice because we run them during sunlight hours, so the pressure is offloaded from the batteries. Idk if my explanations make sense but its a humble setup with minimal consumption. The most important factor is to keeo watch on things and take care of your appliances
The difference between CdTe and table salt is, we don't have to ship truckloads of nasty Na and tankers full of cleansing Cl across the country to make our nice benign compound. Any site where Cadmium emerges as a (by)product is a potential problem.
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Can't believe I got here with the video uploaded 32 seconds ago. What a treat to get my coffee break at the same time as some of my favourite media. I love just have a think and undecided I actually rewatch some of the videos especially the one on Hydrothermal carbonization and would love an update and expansion on that project and similar projects. Thank you undecided
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Initial thoughts after the intro: Cadmium is a real nasty substance and also rare, so we shouldn't really be using it in tech and mining and disposal chains that risk environmental contamination. Maybe if recycling chains were mandated by law to be maintained y the companies fabricating tech, and if severe (jail, hundreds of millions or billions in fines) penalties for improper disposal, and cleanup crews (storm or disaster damaged arrays) help as well, then maybe ... but I still think we should focus on tech that won't poison us so readily.
After video: Nice to see the recycling loop is mostly closed. The bigger concern remains the lower efficiency. There might be niche applications for mobile home or trailer installs where the benefits of lower weight saves fuel that would equal of exceed the amount of additional fuel needed to move more efficient but heavier silicon panels, as well as extra fuel burnt in CdTe systems to run a generator to make up the difference. This would be use-case dependent, where the difference between panel weights is significant compared to vehicle weight, as well as the frequency of moving the vehicle.
@@Warp9pnt9CIGS panels are also light, tough and truly flexible (never flex the "flexible" silicon panels!), though less efficient. Also they're expensive but I have it on hearsay that they could be cheaper, if they had higher production runs. Only one company really sells them; BougeRV. They also seemingly got off to a rocky start with some other company that sold them first getting a bad batch, witj crappy glue, that delaminated. This had nothing to do with the CIGS technology itself but cemented "CIGS = Scam" in a lot of people's minds (probably the same sort who constantly obsess over ROI and still use lead-acid. Just enjoy your free electricity bro)
Seeing as we've already been using it to power camcorders back in the day up to today's cordless screwdrivers, drills, and anything else that can be made for a price from china it literally can't be that rare can it ? 🤔
@@ltandrepants Cheaper Energy is really the last thing on the list of reasons to go Solar. And now that the Value of your Solar System is starting to be recovered by the increase in Value of your Home, the initial cost is largely irrelevant too. It will be the single greatest upgrade to your home soon. Currently, a Bathroom or Kitchen Remodel have the greatest returns.
How easily can cadmium telluride break down back into it's toxic elements? When I hear people say they're afraid of panels breaking and leaking toxic material I thought they were crazy, but then we have panels like these, and you have to wonder if this is what they latched onto to drive those concerns. I'm more for silicon with perovskite layer to boost efficiency.
A UK manufacturer is already making a pervoskite/silicone solar panel with 24% efffiency in the real world. 28% in the lab. "Just have a think" just released a video on it. Even touching on the Chinese. Pervoskites are here, and better. Screw this toxic crap. Even I know Cadmium is not to be trifled with. Imagine having million of houses having these in say... Florida. Getting wiped out by a hurricane spreading broken pieces and leaching into the ground. No thanks.
Their roof is not massive at the scale required to generate solar power in bulk. The same panels can be installed elsewhere to generate just as much power. Why complicate the building envelope of a complex manufacturing facility with another thing that gets in the way if you have to repair, remediate, or renovate? You use suspicion because it is cognitively cheap. Why think when you can merely suspect?
Why? Lots of companies including the one I work for find more financial value in selling their product than in using it. It could just be that that their electricity costs locally are low enough that it makes more sense to sell the panels than to install them. Or maybe they can't get a 1:1 NEM agreement and that kills the incentive.
Having worked in the utility silicon solar industry for many years, I can assure everyone, CdTe won’t catch silicon as it’s efficiency will always remain much lower and cost, much higher, and silicon modules are starting to overlay transparent thin film over silicon modules now, called HJT cells, to offer: 32-40% efficiencies. It’s all about price in utility modules and silicon is almost 1/2 the price of CdTe. Cadmium modules have been saying for many years that they’ll increase efficiency, and it doesn’t happen.
Yeah that is the missing important information that I was waiting for. Just looked it up. They cost a little less but are less efficient and need more space so that their output per $ is smaller . ChatGot got found the numbers CdTe , 0,07 USD per kWh silicon, 0,06 USD per kWh
I am curious as to what work is being done on placing PV Panels on the roof of trailers of EV Trucks? If one looks at the roof of a trailer the area is considerable and could house a number of PV panels supply a percentage of charge to the battery. What is the drawbacks of such an arrangement and what if anything can be done to make this economical or even feasible?
Well, then it's a question of when silicon doesn't have any gains left to make, isn't it? It was suggested in the video that the theoretical max is higher for cdte than silicon.
Making two toxic materials inert is win in itself. Price is more important than efficiency if space is available. Recycling is essential because of the materials. Interesting technology, though perovskite might win in the end anyway.
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Why not talk about the large volume solar panels and why everyone buys those instead? These cadium panels are nothing to get excited about. And theres a reason why solar farms and residential systems use silicon. I just dont get it. I dont see any real benefit here
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Regarding the Larq promo: real UV sterilizers for water keep the fluid in very close proximity to the bulb (a few mm is typical for aquarium or domestic water units) because sterilization efficiency drops off very quickly due to the water absorbing the UV. It strikes me as highly implausible that the LED in this thing is going to be sanitizing or sterilizing anything in any meaningful way. Perhaps a completely empty container, maybe. But a 6 inch tall column of water? Doubtful.
Would love to know the weight ratio/difference between the two. It seems that thinner and lighter may have some commercial scale use cases, with engineering requirements for roofs or other structures that bear the load.
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You end asking if CdTe panels are something I'd use, and the answer is 'eventually'. I'd be using them for a home PV setup, and I have limited roof space. Once CdTe matches or exceeds Silicon in efficiency, then it becomes a strong contender. After that, we need to compare price over the life of the system.
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7:27 This gave me flashbacks. I've made 4 of these. It looks the same so I assume it's the same. It's a standard for testing glass and I despise it for how it can deform so easily. Anyways, it's quite literally a punching bag filled will 100lbs of lead shot. The kicker is that the back is full at around 80lbs and it takes a long time to pack more in to get it to near 100lbs. The bag is then taped with glass tape, and then you stop once it reaches 100lbs. ugh.... I honestly didn't know about CdTe and love the way you explained it Matt!
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Can CdTe panels be used in tandem with Perovskite Panels the same manner that Si PV Panels are? Would this improve their efficiency? Have CdTe panels been used as an onboard charging system in vehicles? If they are "thin" then the weight should be less than Si PV Panels making them better suited for onboard charging of batteries in EV Vehicles. This could have applications in Electric Trucks with the roof of a truck trailer covered with panels and that could contribute to the recharging of the onboard battery.
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CdTe might be stable, but you need a second junction and that's typically CdS. That's the same CdS in photoresistors that got them banned in all of the EU, because CdS is not stable. Deploying CdTe/CdS panels throughout residential areas is just asking to create massive superfund sites.
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eV stands for "electron Volt" not electric volt. Silicon is not being reclaimed and therefore that is a strike against it. Eventually, CdTe will be the better choice.
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I would expect CdTe to be more popular for homes. 30 years retaining 89% of its effectiveness is nothing to sneeze at. That means it's a once per lifetime purchase. If they designed the panels around it, you could replace your whole roof in panels with fakes where gaps are required. Efficiency isn't that important as seen by Tesla's solar roof tile program. Longevity is. Cost is also important. The panels better be cost competitive with silicon otherwise the lower efficiency leading to more panels will become a factor in the initial investment.
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I already have silicon panels thanks to the really unfair NEM agreement structure in my state. I expect the NEM rules to change at the end of this year so the incentive to go solar will largely disappear. Maybe if I were to move, I'd consider alternatives to silicon.
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I'd definitely look into these for my roof. The recyclable/longevity angle is huge and really should be a bigger selling factor. Ideally Gov't would step in and make regulations where these companies need to hit 90% recyclability of their products in pretty much all categories.
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Do they have to be on glass? Thin film construction suggests that flexible substrates could be workable. That could improve installation costs, allow alternative nonplanar substructure, and reduce weight and waste.
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Sodium is toxic? Weird, since it's once of the most used ions in the human body. And both the sodium and chlorine in solution are continually being pulled apart and back together. They are free whether in the glass or in the body. That's what makes something dissolved in a solution.
are there any companies experimenting with combining CdTe, perovskite, and silicon based panels? seems to me that if someone could find a way to combine these materials in the right way, they could create a much better panel than each of these materials alone.
First Solar and it's recently acquired research teams to go along with it's current R&D teams in OH and Silicon Valley, comprising the largest solar research expenditures in the industry.
This may be a silly question, but what does the open circuit voltage of each cell mean in terms of efficiency per watt-square-meter for a panel overall? Is there a series loss that has to be figured into the equasion, or can we just stack however many we need to get a reasonable voltage then parallel to get the current? Also, what does the thermal performance look like?
I really like seeing some diverse technologies and this seems like a really relevant one, to develop further. The thing that struck me was that the thin film aspect seems under utilized. If the efficiency needs it to have 31% larger areas, we should use it in areas where it can shine lige solar shingles or other applications, where lightweightness an thinnes are a real factor (maybe solar roofs in cars etc.)
We own a flat roof building in Chicago. We have considered solar panels, but we do not know if the roof can support the weight. What is the average weight savings of CDTE over silicon per 100 sq ft?
I live in Lake Township Ohio and was shocked to hear about this since I haven't heard about it before, then I remembered about the other lake townships in ohio. I'm guessing you mean the one that is closest to Cleveland.
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Honestly, I think the answer is to get the price as low as possible and worry about efficiency later. This is a classic mistake the green people make. Stop worrying about trying to get everyone off fossil fuels. That should have never been a goal and ironically, it is the very reason why transitioning away from fossil fuels has taken so long. Instead, focus on economic benefit. If you try to build a highly efficient off grid system, the payback period will be several years. However, if you build a small cheap system that is only designed to offset the need for power during the hours of the day that energy prices are most expensive, the payoff period might be as little as 1 year. Make alternative energy so cheap that the average homeowner can't afford not to do it. Don't regulate, don't subsidize it, don't give tax breaks. Just use good old fashion engineering to bring the cost down and worry about the last 5% of performance later.
I live in somerset, England uk, cadmium,is found in certain parts of the nearby Mendip hills,various mining activities! Including,coal and lead,were historically ,carried ,out,today mainly limestone is mined.could this become a new industry for somerset..
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Sorry but this time I cannot agree to your opinion on cadmium telluride solar panels. It's a little bit too positive. We have massiv global production capacities for silicon based solar panels and because of this they are very cheap. Additionally, the efficiency is today also at around 25 percent. All in all, silicon is easier, more common and better for recycling.
had the same thought. why use something edgy when silicon is around for 30 years and works perfect. i know so many people which have silicon on the roof, since 20 years. it still works as is intended to do. of course, lose of some efficiency, but still works.
Dave Borlace of the TH-cam channel Just Have A Think had a video last weekend about Perovskite solar panels are now for the first time produced and sold commercially, with efficiencies of over 30%! A company in the UK seems to have found a solution for the longevity of Perovskite and started commercial production, selling them in the USA. Worth to check out I think. If I want to swap my current panels for new ones they must be more efficient so I can poroduce more energy with the same roof area. So I do not think CDTe will finds its way to my roof.. Perovskite in the future for sure!
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Got to admit, I'd never heard of CdTe panels before. The only application I'd ever seen for Cadmium, over Silicon, was in the light meter of my old Pentax ME Super film camera. And guess what, it was a superior meter too. I guess the point is, Silicon is so damn plentiful, and latest Perovskite added in tandem development models are pushing well past the Shockley-Queisser limit, as far as 43% in the lab. Yes, Perovskite is that super material that let's itself down by quickly degrading in sunlight, of all things, but that is quietly, if slowly, being solved. I guess CdTe will find its place in the mix. It looks like a great alternative and there is certainly a vast market to fill. Incidentally, when you say 2nd most common panels, I'd love to see a bar chart of the percentages.
First Solar is the largest solar panel producer in the western hemisphere and has been for some time. The other western players are now defunct or close to it. All the rest is Chinese with their "go large" mandate from Xi and a lot of subsidies and coal power and forced labor in the case of silicon ingot.
Well I'm honestly tired of the old tech, big heavy large solar panels, that companies keep trying to ram down our throats, because they don't want to spend the money to make something better. So this is exciting, I believe that solar is one of those things, that seems "good enough", so no one is investing in making them better, or bringing something new to market and it feels stagnant. So I think this is a good thing.
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I would have loved some kind of cost comparison between these technologies, since that is a key factor in adoption. I understand that price comparisons are difficult and that they should be taken with a grain of salt but it’s an important metric in the viability of a technology.
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Seems very promising and very close to being widely ready to sell well. Can I request you look into RV solor. What's out there and some innovations coming. thanks
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When I look at residential installations then space is not an issue. There's always plenty of roof space left after setting up PV. It's more of an issue for large scale power plants, though...as there cost of land does make up a significant part of the capital expenditure.
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Just FYI @Matt Ferrell. Recent study came out last week warning against using black plastics in food products because of dangerous chemicals found in that color. You should consider your association...
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I'm okay with cadmium, mercury, uranium or whatever, toxic or non-toxic. As long as longevity is close to market and as long as there is a very high sustainablity and renewablility at scale. If efficiency, location buildout, cost per watt output, etc. is higher, I'm okay with that metric long term.
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Your puns are definitely getting worse, well done 😋. Well researched as usual, and very interesting - it indicates that you really have to stay on top of market developments if you plan an installation because the overall picture still keeps changing.
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I have seen thin solar panels glued directly to adventure van hoods. I wonder if this is the type of solar technology being used on those recreational vehicles? One of the problems RV owners have had is the need to mound rigid panels on platforms that allow air to circulate underneath. The market for solar or other technologies that facilitate mobile living off grid with energy independence will only increase. Especially when states like California are banning inexpensive, reliable fuels like propane.
That graph at 0:25 is genuine rage bait - a pie chart coloured with barely different shades of blue is bad enough, but to really add to the rage, there are 4 visible segments in the chart but 5 different materials on the chart legend 😆.
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Cadmium is a toxic and carcinogenic heavy metal, and Tellurium is also toxic, so I"m happy their use is rare. Don't forget the hard work that went into phasing out NiCd (Nickel-Cadmium) rechargeable batteries. Also, Tellurium is about as rare as Platinum.
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What's the cost difference? For many middle & low income communities, cost may play a significant role in choice of panel - although it's the inverter & batteries than are the most expensive component of a solar system?
Me barely scraping by renting in CA, with energy bills too high, bad credit, wishing solar was affordable enough to to stick in the backyard and save on my bills a little -.- The upfront cost of solar, especially as a 'paycheck to paycheck' renter, is still far too astronomical. I love seeing all this new tech coming about, but i hate that i won't get to leverage any of it in my life for 50 years.
Had it 10 years ago and Im happy I sold it to my friend, kaneka 145wp panels, it was big and power nothing, since I switched to monocrystal Im very happy with power, similar size is 600W and not 145W, so no hell I never want to see it around my house
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Watching this makes me wonder if hybrid panels would be a viable path to consider. You mentioned optimizing for different variables so I'm wondering if its possible to combine different types of cells that have been fine tuned in different ways. I'm just not sure if that would be a net gain or if they would all just average out to be the same in the end.
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I wonder if graphene would have any benefits instead of using copper. I have no idea the logistics of such a thing, or the actual usefulness(if any) of graphene vs copper in such an application.
Yeah, but my bet's on Multi Junction Manufacturing Technologies advancing to an economically viable state before anything replaces silicon. Between that and quantum filters, we can theoretically achieve up to 80% efficiency... The technologies already exist, the manufacturing simply needs to be refined & scaled up.
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Nitpick: electroN-volt, not electro-volt. It's the amount of energy imparted to a single electron when accelerated through a 1 volt potential difference.
7:44 if this company is devoted to proving the efficiency of their panels, then why isn't their massive research center covered in rooftop solar panels?
How about laying a thin film over standard silicon photo electric panels and take advantage of both materials. I am assuming they absorb different wavelengths.
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I've been on the edge regarding getting solar panels. The main reason I might get them is there's a chance Trump will end the tax credits. I don't think he will and he may not have the power to do so. On the other hand, the costs keep going down. My electrical bills aren't that bad. Around $200/mo on average. Is it worth spending $20k to save $100/mo? It's a 6% ROI, assuming everything works fine. I can get 5% putting the money in a CD.
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How did cdte survived Chinese subsidies to go large like many other mfg sectors and powered by a vast array of coal power plants? It was lowest cost per watt. And the Chinese onslaught served to lower First Solar profit margins during that time, even with the lowest cost from a single American inventor and company.
Is CdTe something you’d want on your house or project? Order yourself a LARQ Bottle PureVis 2 to go plastic free and enjoy ice cold water throughout the entire day. bylarq.com/undecidedpv2
If you liked this, check out How Compressed Air Batteries are FINALLY Here th-cam.com/video/VS05y9mQgbw/w-d-xo.html
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5607867/
nope, this is terrible idea, far from value of ''green energy''... elimination pathway of Cd involves brain, not to mentioned how it affects carcinogenesis, mutagenesis and destruction of the metabolic pathways associated with energy production in the human body.
The app is actually useful, especially for people like me who tunnel vision while working and keeo forgetting to stay hydrated.
Don't like plastic waste associated with drinking water? Buy this radio, battery, plastic, and disposable, proprietary filters only meant for a single person! Sorry, just pointing out the irony there.
Please stop pronouncing NREL as en-are-ee-el. Everybody at NREL, including its director Martin Keller who I just met on Sept 27 at the Colorado School of Mines, pronounce it en-rel. Your excellent podcasts are influential, and I'd appreciate if you could get the small things correct, too. Thank you!
The cool thing about CdTe that you mentioned. They are waste products of 2 VERY widely used metals AND they both don't really have any other uses. So CdTe panels will always have a supply of raw material for not too much money.
Cd is a widely used metal, but it's not as ubiquitous as sand.
@@runcycleskixc Cadmium is used as a hardener and anti-rust cladding on nuts and bolts. It's everywhere.
@@CorwinPatrick Cd content in Earth crust: ~0.1-0.5 ppm. Si content in Earth crust: ~25%.
@@runcycleskixc mine some asteroids
CDTe is less affected by heat, so it works well in a hot desert.
I'm a big fan from Lebanon, I love your videos Matt!
Solar saved our lives! We have 1 to 2h a day maximum of grid coverage so we just installed a 4kw solar setup and just cancelled the government grid.
We're saving a ton on bills, spending it elsewhere and living fully on green power :)
The setup is small, so we manually regulate things like on hours for fridge, etc..
Stay safe.
Can you tell us more about your experience with using solar power in Lebanon?
Many people here wonder if solar can be used as a prepper solution.
Thanks.
@@fuzzy-02 are you in an urban area or the country side?
Stay safe - I hope your people come through the current troubles without issue.
@@mickmccarthy8925 there is no urban area or country side, the nation is very small but very mountaineous.
I live on 420m elevation with a lot of humidity and clouds.
The only intense power sucker is the fridge, which we turn on at varying times.
During summer, clouds are minimal and the 4 520W panels are working a lot of the day, so we keep it on from 6 am to 7 pm.
In autumn its more cloudy and less sun so the fridge goes on from 7 am to 6 pm.
I winter its very dependent on the weather, but at worst we turn it off an hour or so during its on hours.
For heating water to bath and shower, we have a gas setup, its cheaper then electricity around here.
We're also very careful with the batteries (2x250A) and the load.
Aside from the fridge we really don't have anything that sucks power with high amperage.
My gaming pc is on the lower end, I can keep it running pretty much always.
Lastly, the trick to solar, I found, is to minimize consumption when the sun is setting, where the panels are barely charging and turning on anything besides lights and wifi make it stop charging the batteries. This is about a 1h period here so we just let it charge.
Perhaps it is illogical, but that's just how I handle all my electronics: don't overstress them and keep them happy.
I have an old laptop with an i3 2nd gen, 4gm ram, and an hdd, its terrible and should have died years ago but its still kixking even after 11 years.
Same with solar, its a game of load balancing
@@ktefccre sure.
My house is full of LED lamps, barely use 20W at most.
2 250A batteries and 4 520W panels have been doing a great job. Although it gets frustrating during some winter days with full on cloud and no heat from the sun, we never pass a day without lights and a working fridge.
Heating for the shower is gas-powered, so the only power suckers in the house that impose a heavy load are the fridge and the iron (for clothes).
Fridge runs an average of 8h, 12 during the summer, 6 at worst during winter.
I live in a very humid area with a lot of clouds too.
If I lived in a country side with minimal Cloud, solar would be a blast! Though it would be more terrible in the freezing winters Id assume too.
So yeah, the biggest power consumers in the house are iron, fridge, washing machine (forgot to mention it in the other comment), and then my pc at 100W at most.
1V in the Inverter's battery charge panel is equivalent to 500 Watts, since we have 2 250A batteries (1v x 500A = 500 Watts)
That means the Pc at very high load might take a singular watt in 5 hours.
On a regular day with 8 hours of sun light, you can say we have about 3 volts or 1,500W to work with.
You might think its nothing because of the fridge, washing machine, etc, but these don't use much power in practice because we run them during sunlight hours, so the pressure is offloaded from the batteries.
Idk if my explanations make sense but its a humble setup with minimal consumption.
The most important factor is to keeo watch on things and take care of your appliances
The difference between CdTe and table salt is, we don't have to ship truckloads of nasty Na and tankers full of cleansing Cl across the country to make our nice benign compound. Any site where Cadmium emerges as a (by)product is a potential problem.
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Can't believe I got here with the video uploaded 32 seconds ago. What a treat to get my coffee break at the same time as some of my favourite media. I love just have a think and undecided I actually rewatch some of the videos especially the one on Hydrothermal carbonization and would love an update and expansion on that project and similar projects. Thank you undecided
"Just have a think" channel just posted a video stating that Perovskite cells have begun shipping to customers as of Sep 2024.
I thought the problem with perovskite cells was short lifespan?
@@wva5089 they've managed to improve it, apparently, though It'll probably be still lower than traditional panels
@@wva5089 apparently they resolved it well enough to go to market.
Right, CdTe is clearly something to avoid....
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Initial thoughts after the intro: Cadmium is a real nasty substance and also rare, so we shouldn't really be using it in tech and mining and disposal chains that risk environmental contamination. Maybe if recycling chains were mandated by law to be maintained y the companies fabricating tech, and if severe (jail, hundreds of millions or billions in fines) penalties for improper disposal, and cleanup crews (storm or disaster damaged arrays) help as well, then maybe ... but I still think we should focus on tech that won't poison us so readily.
After video: Nice to see the recycling loop is mostly closed. The bigger concern remains the lower efficiency. There might be niche applications for mobile home or trailer installs where the benefits of lower weight saves fuel that would equal of exceed the amount of additional fuel needed to move more efficient but heavier silicon panels, as well as extra fuel burnt in CdTe systems to run a generator to make up the difference. This would be use-case dependent, where the difference between panel weights is significant compared to vehicle weight, as well as the frequency of moving the vehicle.
@@Warp9pnt9CIGS panels are also light, tough and truly flexible (never flex the "flexible" silicon panels!), though less efficient. Also they're expensive but I have it on hearsay that they could be cheaper, if they had higher production runs. Only one company really sells them; BougeRV. They also seemingly got off to a rocky start with some other company that sold them first getting a bad batch, witj crappy glue, that delaminated. This had nothing to do with the CIGS technology itself but cemented "CIGS = Scam" in a lot of people's minds (probably the same sort who constantly obsess over ROI and still use lead-acid. Just enjoy your free electricity bro)
Well thought.
Seeing as we've already been using it to power camcorders back in the day up to today's cordless screwdrivers, drills, and anything else that can be made for a price from china it literally can't be that rare can it ? 🤔
So you missed the part of it not being toxic when mixed ?
Cut plastics from your life by ordering plastic bottle with one time use filters encapsulated in plastic you will have to replace
this world is weird sometimes! like spending so much money for a solar system when the objective is cheaper energy!
@@ltandrepants Cheaper Energy is really the last thing on the list of reasons to go Solar. And now that the Value of your Solar System is starting to be recovered by the increase in Value of your Home, the initial cost is largely irrelevant too. It will be the single greatest upgrade to your home soon. Currently, a Bathroom or Kitchen Remodel have the greatest returns.
How easily can cadmium telluride break down back into it's toxic elements? When I hear people say they're afraid of panels breaking and leaking toxic material I thought they were crazy, but then we have panels like these, and you have to wonder if this is what they latched onto to drive those concerns. I'm more for silicon with perovskite layer to boost efficiency.
A UK manufacturer is already making a pervoskite/silicone solar panel with 24% efffiency in the real world. 28% in the lab.
"Just have a think" just released a video on it. Even touching on the Chinese.
Pervoskites are here, and better. Screw this toxic crap. Even I know Cadmium is not to be trifled with.
Imagine having million of houses having these in say... Florida. Getting wiped out by a hurricane spreading broken pieces and leaching into the ground.
No thanks.
I'm extremely suspicious of any solar company with not a single panel on their massive roof.
@@ajwright5512 they just added their panels to their warehouses and headquarters
Their roof is not massive at the scale required to generate solar power in bulk. The same panels can be installed elsewhere to generate just as much power. Why complicate the building envelope of a complex manufacturing facility with another thing that gets in the way if you have to repair, remediate, or renovate?
You use suspicion because it is cognitively cheap. Why think when you can merely suspect?
@@afterthesmash occams razor.
Why? Lots of companies including the one I work for find more financial value in selling their product than in using it. It could just be that that their electricity costs locally are low enough that it makes more sense to sell the panels than to install them. Or maybe they can't get a 1:1 NEM agreement and that kills the incentive.
Having worked in the utility silicon solar industry for many years, I can assure everyone, CdTe won’t catch silicon as it’s efficiency will always remain much lower and cost, much higher, and silicon modules are starting to overlay transparent thin film over silicon modules now, called HJT cells, to offer: 32-40% efficiencies. It’s all about price in utility modules and silicon is almost 1/2 the price of CdTe. Cadmium modules have been saying for many years that they’ll increase efficiency, and it doesn’t happen.
Yeah that is the missing important information that I was waiting for.
Just looked it up.
They cost a little less but are less efficient and need more space so that their output per $ is smaller .
ChatGot got found the numbers
CdTe , 0,07 USD per kWh
silicon, 0,06 USD per kWh
I am curious as to what work is being done on placing PV Panels on the roof of trailers of EV Trucks? If one looks at the roof of a trailer the area is considerable and could house a number of PV panels supply a percentage of charge to the battery. What is the drawbacks of such an arrangement and what if anything can be done to make this economical or even feasible?
Well, then it's a question of when silicon doesn't have any gains left to make, isn't it? It was suggested in the video that the theoretical max is higher for cdte than silicon.
thx for info about price
@@blablup1214 This info ought to have been in the video. Thank you for providing it.
Making two toxic materials inert is win in itself. Price is more important than efficiency if space is available. Recycling is essential because of the materials. Interesting technology, though perovskite might win in the end anyway.
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Why not talk about the large volume solar panels and why everyone buys those instead? These cadium panels are nothing to get excited about. And theres a reason why solar farms and residential systems use silicon. I just dont get it. I dont see any real benefit here
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So these panels are less efficient, cost more (only one company makes them?), and are based on Cd. I wonder why they are not very popular.
exactly! why even make a video on it?
Even better: 9:42 "replaces [Copper] with Arsenic"
Yeah that sounds like a great idea, worked so well putting asbestos everywhere.
Regarding the Larq promo: real UV sterilizers for water keep the fluid in very close proximity to the bulb (a few mm is typical for aquarium or domestic water units) because sterilization efficiency drops off very quickly due to the water absorbing the UV. It strikes me as highly implausible that the LED in this thing is going to be sanitizing or sterilizing anything in any meaningful way. Perhaps a completely empty container, maybe. But a 6 inch tall column of water? Doubtful.
Would love to know the weight ratio/difference between the two. It seems that thinner and lighter may have some commercial scale use cases, with engineering requirements for roofs or other structures that bear the load.
Efficiency matters to me. If I was in a southern state, and not Michigan, I would have considered CdTe.
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It always shocks me to see a solar panel manufacturer that doesn't have their solar panels all over the roofs of their buildings.
Right??
First Solar did just install them on their hq in Tempe and their factories in Alabama and Pennsylvania.
They have no facilities in PA. Maybe you mean OH? @@MustachioFurioso9134
You end asking if CdTe panels are something I'd use, and the answer is 'eventually'. I'd be using them for a home PV setup, and I have limited roof space. Once CdTe matches or exceeds Silicon in efficiency, then it becomes a strong contender. After that, we need to compare price over the life of the system.
I like that it diversifies the supply chain for solar panels so that if there is disruption in silicon production we have mature alternatives.
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7:27 This gave me flashbacks. I've made 4 of these. It looks the same so I assume it's the same. It's a standard for testing glass and I despise it for how it can deform so easily. Anyways, it's quite literally a punching bag filled will 100lbs of lead shot. The kicker is that the back is full at around 80lbs and it takes a long time to pack more in to get it to near 100lbs. The bag is then taped with glass tape, and then you stop once it reaches 100lbs. ugh.... I honestly didn't know about CdTe and love the way you explained it Matt!
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Can CdTe panels be used in tandem with Perovskite Panels the same manner that Si PV Panels are? Would this improve their efficiency?
Have CdTe panels been used as an onboard charging system in vehicles?
If they are "thin" then the weight should be less than Si PV Panels making them better suited for onboard charging of batteries in EV Vehicles. This could have applications in Electric Trucks with the roof of a truck trailer covered with panels and that could contribute to the recharging of the onboard battery.
One would guess the weight of CdTe is more because of the atomic weight or less because it is thinner?
The intro joke got me 😂
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What I got out of this is to find a weight-critical application or an application that can't tolerate the thickness of silicon panels.
CdTe might be stable, but you need a second junction and that's typically CdS. That's the same CdS in photoresistors that got them banned in all of the EU, because CdS is not stable.
Deploying CdTe/CdS panels throughout residential areas is just asking to create massive superfund sites.
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First Solar shareholder here!
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electron volt is the unit Good video
So lose 4 percent efficiency to gain thinness , but if it’s going on my roof I’d rather have the higher efficiency rate
Well, he said that “thin means cheap”, so unless I have a small roof, cheap is good.
eV stands for "electron Volt" not electric volt. Silicon is not being reclaimed and therefore that is a strike against it. Eventually, CdTe will be the better choice.
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I would expect CdTe to be more popular for homes. 30 years retaining 89% of its effectiveness is nothing to sneeze at. That means it's a once per lifetime purchase. If they designed the panels around it, you could replace your whole roof in panels with fakes where gaps are required. Efficiency isn't that important as seen by Tesla's solar roof tile program. Longevity is.
Cost is also important. The panels better be cost competitive with silicon otherwise the lower efficiency leading to more panels will become a factor in the initial investment.
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I already have silicon panels thanks to the really unfair NEM agreement structure in my state. I expect the NEM rules to change at the end of this year so the incentive to go solar will largely disappear. Maybe if I were to move, I'd consider alternatives to silicon.
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I'd definitely look into these for my roof. The recyclable/longevity angle is huge and really should be a bigger selling factor. Ideally Gov't would step in and make regulations where these companies need to hit 90% recyclability of their products in pretty much all categories.
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Did you not mean Electron Volt rather than Electro Volt? Interesting video, Thanks.
You didn’t mention how it handles heat. How is its efficiency in high heat environments.
I really dig the new intro! Nice, clean, and uncluttered from Tesla logos!
The first solar cells I ever played with, back in the mid 1970s, were Selenium based. I don't know if Cd was also involved....
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Do they have to be on glass? Thin film construction suggests that flexible substrates could be workable. That could improve installation costs, allow alternative nonplanar substructure, and reduce weight and waste.
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Sodium is toxic? Weird, since it's once of the most used ions in the human body. And both the sodium and chlorine in solution are continually being pulled apart and back together. They are free whether in the glass or in the body. That's what makes something dissolved in a solution.
are there any companies experimenting with combining CdTe, perovskite, and silicon based panels? seems to me that if someone could find a way to combine these materials in the right way, they could create a much better panel than each of these materials alone.
First Solar and it's recently acquired research teams to go along with it's current R&D teams in OH and Silicon Valley, comprising the largest solar research expenditures in the industry.
This may be a silly question, but what does the open circuit voltage of each cell mean in terms of efficiency per watt-square-meter for a panel overall? Is there a series loss that has to be figured into the equasion, or can we just stack however many we need to get a reasonable voltage then parallel to get the current? Also, what does the thermal performance look like?
I really like seeing some diverse technologies and this seems like a really relevant one, to develop further. The thing that struck me was that the thin film aspect seems under utilized. If the efficiency needs it to have 31% larger areas, we should use it in areas where it can shine lige solar shingles or other applications, where lightweightness an thinnes are a real factor (maybe solar roofs in cars etc.)
We own a flat roof building in Chicago. We have considered solar panels, but we do not know if the roof can support the weight. What is the average weight savings of CDTE over silicon per 100 sq ft?
Is there any chance to have tandem Perovskite and CdTe tandem solar panel. It will be so thin and lightweight.
I live in Lake Township Ohio and was shocked to hear about this since I haven't heard about it before, then I remembered about the other lake townships in ohio. I'm guessing you mean the one that is closest to Cleveland.
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Honestly, I think the answer is to get the price as low as possible and worry about efficiency later. This is a classic mistake the green people make. Stop worrying about trying to get everyone off fossil fuels. That should have never been a goal and ironically, it is the very reason why transitioning away from fossil fuels has taken so long. Instead, focus on economic benefit. If you try to build a highly efficient off grid system, the payback period will be several years. However, if you build a small cheap system that is only designed to offset the need for power during the hours of the day that energy prices are most expensive, the payoff period might be as little as 1 year. Make alternative energy so cheap that the average homeowner can't afford not to do it. Don't regulate, don't subsidize it, don't give tax breaks. Just use good old fashion engineering to bring the cost down and worry about the last 5% of performance later.
eV. Is that electron-volt as in the very tiny unit of energy? 1eV = 6.24e18 Joules. You said electro-volt. I am not familiar with that term.
I live in somerset, England uk, cadmium,is found in certain parts of the nearby Mendip hills,various mining activities! Including,coal and lead,were historically ,carried ,out,today mainly limestone is mined.could this become a new industry for somerset..
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Oxford PV say they are building a production line for 24.5% efficient tandem panels, & expect to start shipping this year
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A huge advancement for solar panels would be their ability to survive any hail storm.
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Sorry but this time I cannot agree to your opinion on cadmium telluride solar panels.
It's a little bit too positive.
We have massiv global production capacities for silicon based solar panels and because of this they are very cheap. Additionally, the efficiency is today also at around 25 percent.
All in all, silicon is easier, more common and better for recycling.
This video is literally an ad.
First mover advantage.
Right, CdTe is clearly something to avoid....
The benefits just don't justify the downsides.
had the same thought. why use something edgy when silicon is around for 30 years and works perfect. i know so many people which have silicon on the roof, since 20 years. it still works as is intended to do. of course, lose of some efficiency, but still works.
@@DerSchrottBastler exactly, all the risks, etc for 2 or 3% more efficiency? No thanks
You have a lot to learn about this tech, it's enviro certifications, and the expanding company.
bot comment
Dave Borlace of the TH-cam channel Just Have A Think had a video last weekend about Perovskite solar panels are now for the first time produced and sold commercially, with efficiencies of over 30%! A company in the UK seems to have found a solution for the longevity of Perovskite and started commercial production, selling them in the USA.
Worth to check out I think.
If I want to swap my current panels for new ones they must be more efficient so I can poroduce more energy with the same roof area. So I do not think CDTe will finds its way to my roof.. Perovskite in the future for sure!
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Got to admit, I'd never heard of CdTe panels before. The only application I'd ever seen for Cadmium, over Silicon, was in the light meter of my old Pentax ME Super film camera. And guess what, it was a superior meter too. I guess the point is, Silicon is so damn plentiful, and latest Perovskite added in tandem development models are pushing well past the Shockley-Queisser limit, as far as 43% in the lab. Yes, Perovskite is that super material that let's itself down by quickly degrading in sunlight, of all things, but that is quietly, if slowly, being solved. I guess CdTe will find its place in the mix. It looks like a great alternative and there is certainly a vast market to fill. Incidentally, when you say 2nd most common panels, I'd love to see a bar chart of the percentages.
First Solar is the largest solar panel producer in the western hemisphere and has been for some time. The other western players are now defunct or close to it. All the rest is Chinese with their "go large" mandate from Xi and a lot of subsidies and coal power and forced labor in the case of silicon ingot.
Well I'm honestly tired of the old tech, big heavy large solar panels, that companies keep trying to ram down our throats, because they don't want to spend the money to make something better. So this is exciting, I believe that solar is one of those things, that seems "good enough", so no one is investing in making them better, or bringing something new to market and it feels stagnant. So I think this is a good thing.
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I would have loved some kind of cost comparison between these technologies, since that is a key factor in adoption.
I understand that price comparisons are difficult and that they should be taken with a grain of salt but it’s an important metric in the viability of a technology.
Hmmmmm sounds cool. Always good to have more choices.
90% recyclable?
I'm on board!
The lack of effeciency sucks, but the point is greener tech right? That recycle rate hits that hard.
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Seems very promising and very close to being widely ready to sell well.
Can I request you look into RV solor. What's out there and some innovations coming. thanks
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Thanks Matt.
When I look at residential installations then space is not an issue. There's always plenty of roof space left after setting up PV.
It's more of an issue for large scale power plants, though...as there cost of land does make up a significant part of the capital expenditure.
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Maybe look up LCOE like the industry and Wall Street uses.
Just FYI @Matt Ferrell. Recent study came out last week warning against using black plastics in food products because of dangerous chemicals found in that color. You should consider your association...
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Thank you and good morning.
I'm okay with cadmium, mercury, uranium or whatever, toxic or non-toxic. As long as longevity is close to market and as long as there is a very high sustainablity and renewablility at scale.
If efficiency, location buildout, cost per watt output, etc. is higher, I'm okay with that metric long term.
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The recent flooding of the silicate mines in spruce grove is going to dramatically change this balance.
III-V quantum dots still have substantial advantages over CdTe for PV in almost every aspect except maturity of the tech.
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I'm sceptic about anything with cadmium.
Your puns are definitely getting worse, well done 😋. Well researched as usual, and very interesting - it indicates that you really have to stay on top of market developments if you plan an installation because the overall picture still keeps changing.
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I have seen thin solar panels glued directly to adventure van hoods. I wonder if this is the type of solar technology being used on those recreational vehicles? One of the problems RV owners have had is the need to mound rigid panels on platforms that allow air to circulate underneath. The market for solar or other technologies that facilitate mobile living off grid with energy independence will only increase. Especially when states like California are banning inexpensive, reliable fuels like propane.
That graph at 0:25 is genuine rage bait - a pie chart coloured with barely different shades of blue is bad enough, but to really add to the rage, there are 4 visible segments in the chart but 5 different materials on the chart legend 😆.
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@@peglor who's idea was that lol
Amino silane passification is being researched as an excellent way to boost perovskite's stability in solar cells
I would like to know when Stanford Universities Agile solar project is going to become available for all.
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it is restricted under RoHS, as always arguing for exemption, similar to material sensitive to SWIR, unless there's a magic composition that comply to
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Cadmium is a toxic and carcinogenic heavy metal, and Tellurium is also toxic, so I"m happy their use is rare. Don't forget the hard work that went into phasing out NiCd (Nickel-Cadmium) rechargeable batteries. Also, Tellurium is about as rare as Platinum.
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What's the cost difference? For many middle & low income communities, cost may play a significant role in choice of panel - although it's the inverter & batteries than are the most expensive component of a solar system?
Me barely scraping by renting in CA, with energy bills too high, bad credit, wishing solar was affordable enough to to stick in the backyard and save on my bills a little -.-
The upfront cost of solar, especially as a 'paycheck to paycheck' renter, is still far too astronomical.
I love seeing all this new tech coming about, but i hate that i won't get to leverage any of it in my life for 50 years.
Cadmium Telluride definitely doesn't make the grass greener.
Had it 10 years ago and Im happy I sold it to my friend, kaneka 145wp panels, it was big and power nothing, since I switched to monocrystal Im very happy with power, similar size is 600W and not 145W, so no hell I never want to see it around my house
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price price price bring the price down and yes i would use it!
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Watching this makes me wonder if hybrid panels would be a viable path to consider. You mentioned optimizing for different variables so I'm wondering if its possible to combine different types of cells that have been fine tuned in different ways. I'm just not sure if that would be a net gain or if they would all just average out to be the same in the end.
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I wonder if graphene would have any benefits instead of using copper. I have no idea the logistics of such a thing, or the actual usefulness(if any) of graphene vs copper in such an application.
Hey, what about using some sort of quantum structures, dots, etc, with an element.
Yeah, but my bet's on Multi Junction Manufacturing Technologies advancing to an economically viable state before anything replaces silicon. Between that and quantum filters, we can theoretically achieve up to 80% efficiency...
The technologies already exist, the manufacturing simply needs to be refined & scaled up.
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NREL => "inrail"
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Nitpick: electroN-volt, not electro-volt. It's the amount of energy imparted to a single electron when accelerated through a 1 volt potential difference.
7:44 if this company is devoted to proving the efficiency of their panels, then why isn't their massive research center covered in rooftop solar panels?
Is there a slice missing?
Is it available and affordable for residential installation?
Cool concept… however, if CDTE panels are a little thinner and a little more efficient, but cost 5x then it’s dead on arrival.
How about laying a thin film over standard silicon photo electric panels and take advantage of both materials. I am assuming they absorb different wavelengths.
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You again the $2000 window AC, do you think this new stuff going to make your window AC cheaper?
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What the heck are ELECTRO volts? Did you mean ELECTRON volts, which is abbreviated ev?
Would it be useful in tandem solar cells or is the bandgap too similar to silicon cells?
😊the issue that it will be made in China 🇨🇳 like silicon panels now 600w panels sold for 120$ worldwide but in the US it's sold for 300$ 😂.
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I've been on the edge regarding getting solar panels. The main reason I might get them is there's a chance Trump will end the tax credits. I don't think he will and he may not have the power to do so. On the other hand, the costs keep going down. My electrical bills aren't that bad. Around $200/mo on average. Is it worth spending $20k to save $100/mo? It's a 6% ROI, assuming everything works fine. I can get 5% putting the money in a CD.
The "Plasma" TV of Solar Panels. Cool, but otherwise, will pave the way for what is truly next.
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This vid is an ad for First Solar
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Interesting info… can[t help but feel that this sounds a bit like a press release
How did cdte survived Chinese subsidies to go large like many other mfg sectors and powered by a vast array of coal power plants? It was lowest cost per watt. And the Chinese onslaught served to lower First Solar profit margins during that time, even with the lowest cost from a single American inventor and company.
Good video