As a guitarplayer for more than 40 years i came to digital domain in early 90ties. You explain the topic very well and i`m happy to connect some loose ends and missing links in my live setup. Thanks :)
I use a Mooer GE300 with a Harley Benton G212A-FR active frfr speaker, and it sounds fantastic both live with my band and in the studio. I set up the FRFR speaker behind me like a traditional guitar amp, and another output of the G300 also takes the signal direct to the mixer/PA. I've never been happier with my tone! I think a modeller with an FRFR speaker can definitely sound superb.
@@richo144 Hell yes! I play in a loud rock band with a drummer who batters the hell out of his kit, and I've never had to turn the Harley Benton G212A-FR past about half way in volume (12 o'clock position). It's loud as hell with tons of clarity and headroom. Very good sounding, good value FRFR speaker!
I learned the hard way. Live tones and album tones are often never the same. Trying to dial in tones from albums often disappointed me in a live setting. Often lack low end and like a bit more gain live. Dial tones for the area you are playing in. Delay and reverb feel so different in headphones versus an open air stage.
So for me it started when I used to use Headphones with my BOSS ME multi pedals (I went from ME-50 to the 70 to the 80 with a GT -10 in there somewhere) and it sounded so good I figured, I should plug in my Altec Lansing Computer speakers into the headphone out and it sounded exceptional. That was 13 yrs ago and now all i use is an Atomic Amplifire pedal and those same $60 today cpu speakers. I only play at home, ive got a Katana MKII but its got maybe 2 hours on it and it has an input for multi pedals on it and sound decent but I all in on just using processors for my tone as it what i always wanted it to sound like and used to think all tube amps would be the answer but would get let down when I sounded like shit. One of the biggest things is having a level good tone out of the higher strings where a lot of real amps just seem dead across all the strings.
Hey guys, bassplayer (and ex guitarist) here.. i have 3 advices about EQ as a bass-player who did some gigging: 1) put your guitar amp EQ bass and 9 o clock. It will make your guitar sit much better in band mixes. (most guitar-amps have too much low end.. ) 2) If you have a multi fx like a FM3 or Helix, and you want to know if your sound sits well in a bandmix... put a headphone in your multi-fx, put on a track via aux input ( or by putting the multi-fx through a sound-interface ) and adjust your guitar-volume (when the track is off) until its about the same as the 'general' volume of the track ... Then turn on the track and play guitar.. Cant hear yourself? Then it does not sit well in a mix.. it will also disappear when you play in a band. i did this 2nd step with my bass/bassgear too, and learnt a lot from it.. 3) if you are using a small amp (1x10 or 1x12) aim the speaker at your ears when playing in a band, then you will hear yourself much better. (and it prevents other bandmembers from having a epileptic seizure every time your struck a chord, because you tried to EQ and Volume compensate for having the sound aimed at your feet.)
due to amp design variations, the knob positions are completely arbitrary. 7 o'clock on one amp might result in as much bass, mid, treble, etc as 3 o'clock on another. Use your ears, not your eyes folks.
@@threepe0 Of course. Ive used/heard quite some amps, Most of them do well with bass at 9 or 10.. Some not. That is why i gave it as an advice, as a basic starting point: It "relatively" makes mids and more present, resulting in hearing yourself.. after cutting bass boosting volume just a little helps too. With some amps you need to cut all the lows.. It also depends on the angle of your amp. The same is true for bass amps and not hearing yourself well on stage.. (subs under/near a stage bring lows on a stage too, when an amp does the same thing the low end becomes all boomy and overpowering on stage.. )
Technically, it means that the speaker reproduces various frequencies at similar levels evenly across the spectrum. So by proxy it won’t color the input signal (much).
A "blocking" filter is the standard high of low pass filter. As apposed to a shelving, notch, or peaking filter. It's just a more specific way of describing what the filter is doing.
Both are good but it depends on your workflow and keeping track of things. I use both- I dial in tone in my studio with the Cab cuts, but setting up in a venue I'll use the Global EQs if additional cuts are needed. Generally, I'll have the Cab cuts on my Per-Preset perform page and the Global EQ low and high controls on my Global perform page so I can quickly turn off and on the eq and adjust parameters. If you are using multiple presets during a performance Global EQ is the way to go.
Hi one question. Conversely while using a traditional guitar combo or amp-cabinet with a multi fx pedal, wouldn’t switching off the amps and cabinets in the multi FX solve any potential issues. In such a situation, wouldn’t the multi fx pedal be functioning more or less like traditional analog effects.
Yes, depending on what you are going for. At the very least, you'll want to disable any cab modeling and IRs. You may still want an amp model to change the character of the amp you are plugging into or you may just want the effects. There's certainly exceptions too- I had to plug a modeler into a JC-120 on a cruise ship and found things sounded okay with my amp and cab modeling active, but its a very clean amp and I was plugged into the FX return only.
@@mathew_dale Thanks for the reply. That last point is interesting. Do send returns make it easier to use amp and cab sims into an amp. What about distortions - were you using distortions on the modeler. Or if it was a separate distortion pedal, where would you have placed it in the situation you described.
Yeah realistically “live tones” should be around 100hz-5Khz but for home use or quieter playing cutting less is okay. Mindset is also important- knowing that FRFR won’t be the same as a live cab and that’s okay is part of it as well.
@@mathew_dale I’ve had an axe fx for about 6 years and just got an fm9. I was in a rush earlier so needed to know lol very recently I’ve been going down to 6500 and I’m getting really nice results. Before I was around 7500-8000 or even 10000 for cleans
I used to do the same in my GT1000, only cutting to 10K. Then getting more and more aggressive with that cut yielded better tones. I think 6500hz is a good starting point as well!
Not always. If I feel like an amp is too bassy even with the bass knob down I may do an input eq low end cut, and I'll use the output eq on Mesa models but that's about it.
Okay folks, I need some help: I'm proud owner of an ISP theta pro DSP floor unit absolutely love the tones that are on it. I've used it through headphones (& it sounds awesome), I've used it through cheap computer powere speakers (still sounds awesome) & even through my PreSonus recording software interface (sounds awesome their as well). However... I recently purchased the headrush FRFR 108, tried my ISP unit into it and.... It sounded like tinfoil being lit on fire 😫😱🤯😥 Needless to say I was not happy with that, thus I got the turbo sound ix15 which is a 15 inch powered loudspeaker (always had an affinity for 15-in speakers) and it still sounds horrible. I'm up for any suggestions and yes if you're wondering, I do have speaker emulation on (a 4x12 greenback) via the unit. Any and all recommendations are appreciated. If I'm doing something wrong or if I'm not doing something correctly, feel free to let me know.
Did you try EQ'ng the presets like shown in the video? Do a full aggressive lowcut at 100-200hz, and highcut at 5000hz. Guitar speakers and most computer speakers have nothing below 150-200hz~ and above 5000hz, as stated in the video.. but PA speakers do and some PA speakers have the tendency to exaggerate frequencies below 200 hz and above 5000hz...
@@Graoeye Thank you for this inside, has a greatly appreciate it. Turns out that I did not have the global speaker emulation turned on. Once I made that adjustment everything coming out at FRFR speakers soon fantastic!
Most of the tone comes from the speaker, anyone else saying anything else is full of shit. All that is not from the speaker is to a variable degree between the preamp and the speaker. Yes pickups are negligeable in terms of tone but will affect the impedance of the signal, volume input and "bite"
*LONG 2 THE SHORT, everyone peep game, FRFR is simply some marketing BS garnered to make you purchases more crap. Simply select a power amp and PA speakers and rock on. **#cheers*
This took me the longest time to figure out…I would plug in my modeler,into studio monitors,and would be immediately disappointed..it’s a very different sound than a Marshall and 4x12 blasting away at your knee caps..Then I started thinking about it,every guitar tone we have ever heard,was and is filtered thru a microphone and listened to on some kind of full range speaker system,whether it’s your favorite CD,or your favorite band live…..Van Halen 1 guitar tones are NOT an amp in the room sound….it’s an amp in another room,mic’ed up and played back thru Full range speakers….When I stopped comparing the two,I was much happier….That said,sometimes I do run my AxeFXIII into a power amp and guitar cab..it’s a different experience altogether….Great video though…I already use a lot of these tips for getting the best out of my FRFR system,but I learned a few more!!..
You are so right! So many guitarists are obsessed with having that "amp in the room sound", yet fail to realize that the guitars he's hearing on recordings, or live, through a P.A., sounds quite different. The question is, can a guitar still sound great in either of those situations? Of course! That's why people buy recorded music or attend concerts and still love the sound of those guitars. My reasoning is, even if a guitarist still wants that "amp in the room" sound while playing live, that's fine. But he should remember that the audience is not going to hear what HE hears. Personally, I want to hear on stage, as closely as possible, what the audience hears. So yep, the FRFRs are going to go a long way in giving me that.
Great point! It's really about knowing the application and understanding the ways to achieve the desired results. There's certainly a time and place for FRFR as well as a power amp and 4x12!
@@mathew_dale Yeah, we guitarists all know that the sound we hear when we play affects HOW we play. The cool think about hearing what the audience hears is that the way we play will be the way we want the audience to hear it!
Who fucking cares. People that like the visceral amp in the room experience don’t want to compromise on that. Why should they have to let go of what they love?
The main thing to do is set up all your patches and scenes at gig levels. Don’t dial them in at bedroom levels. And high pass/ Low pass is your best friend. And bring an actual EQ pedal to the show to tune to the room. An EQ pedal is the most important pedal you can use in any situation. Don’t rely on the EQ in the processor you’re using. It’ll never be right in the room. And make sure your patches/scenes are at complimentary levels. Don’t go from clean neck pickup to full bore metal with bridge pickup and have the volumes not match.
Mathew, great job of explaining the mechanics behind the sounds. I have been playing through the first modeling amp ever made directly through FOH systems for years. At one time I was fortunate enough to play through some of the best tube amps ever made ('60s era Vox AC-30, Fender Bassman, 70's era Marshall, Mesa Lonestar, 60's era Twin Reverb, etc.) and I know what good tone is (yes, I'm old). These sounds are very achievable using digital technology though most purists will disagree. Funny thing is that most of those "purists" haven't played nearly as many gigs through all kinds of equipment the way that I have. Most have been sold on a lot of opinions that are not backed up by facts - just opinions. I'll go on stage up against any rig and I'm guaranteed to hang or probably sound better. A stereo chorus or roto-vibe effect through a stereo FOH system has so much more depth. All you purists can keep your overpriced, always-breaking-down, heavier-than-f_ck equipment. If you are a performing musician, you know that getting your sound out to the audience doesn't always (rarely actually) mean you'll get a great tactile response on stage. So, dragging around a heavy amplifier simply makes no sense. But it looks cool - I'll give you that.
The tube amp in an isolation room or iso box I thought was an interesting trend- especially since load boxes with D.I. as well as digital was also readily available. You quickly loose that “tube amp” feel when you are not near the amp and going “silent stage.” Making the switch to digital makes that kind of stuff much easier and better sounding in my opinion. Thanks for watching and commenting!
To just comment on part of you’re comment the purists are dumb fractals literally model the best amps in the world exactly like the real amps and even better because the ideal page
You have a great ability to convey this information without being needlessly complicated. I wish I would have found your channel a year ago when I took the plunge into modeling with the FM3. I’ve learned much of this through trial and error which is a much longer and sometimes hair pulling process.😁 Having said that I still get a lot from watching due to the aforementioned teaching skill you have. Thank You!!👍
Sounds expensive and complicated... I'll stick with tubes and instrument speakers. There's plenty of variation in traditional analog technology, and I think we need our gear to put up a little fight, some limitation to overcome. Yes, I'm a middle-aged bachelor who talks to his dog.
I believe you about the cuts, but my thing was like, I’m putting in this IR that was supposed to be a large majority of the cuts, so why am I having to do this SO much?
I believe it's from the mic'ing part of the IR. If you were to just mic a cab to FOH, those cuts, especially on the low end, would also need to be put in place.
Not exactly a practice amp. If you want your tones to relate closer to what you would hear through a PA, using a powered PA speaker like the QSC CP8 is a good choice for home use.
Dialing in your tone at intended volume use is very important. I play my Helix at home only, playing at lower volumes. My patches are dialed in for that volume level. I notice that when I play those patches loud I have to redo my settings. On my cabs I put a high cut at 6-7k and 100 at the low end. I get a great guitar tone and feel that way. A modeller isn’t going to sound quite the same as a live amp and it’s not intended to. I’m quite happy with my Helix and my frfr speakers but it took me some time to get there.
That is 100 percent correct. I live out in the country and I am able to play pretty dang loud. Im just a guitar hobbyist, so I don't play live, but I can get the Fractal to sound and feel almost identical to my real amps. I would imagine if your playing through headphones and then going to a tube amp, there would be a bigger difference.
Little late to the party but this video showed up in my feed and I couldn't agree more with most of what you're saying. I think back to when I was a young teenager listening to all of this metal in the 90s and none of that was listen to through any amplifier it was through a crappy radio in my bedroom or the car. When I started to play guitar I didn't really understand how all of this stuff worked and would try so hard to reproduce the tone that I was hearing through a stereo system from my guitar amp and could never understand why I would fail repeatedly... Fast forward 20 years ... I'm not a quick learner I was still trying to do the same thing cuz I didn't understand.... I have a evh 5150 stealth along with a Mesa Boogie triple Crown... I also have a quad cortex and an FRFR cabinet. I realize now if I want to play along with backing tracks in my basement studio then the quad cortex and the FRFR are almost a guaranteed best choice. It can reproduce the studio quality sound that is pristine and exactly what will fit into the mix perfectly. If I turn on my evh amp I can get pretty close but typically I find myself overpowering the studio monitors because the guitar amp itself is just so much more powerful. I used to switch back and forth from modeling to amps, in some sort of frustrated dance to try to get what I was after. Now I have found peace I have found my zen... I have both! It's just a matter of when to use which tool for the job you are after
You missed a very important piece of the puzzle. Expecting every user to have very high fidelity monitor speakers that also play loud is a big presumption. On the other hand, virtually everyone playing professionally has IEMs they know. That’s the perfect way to refine a reference IR as everyone has had the phones experience and they can play loud enough to be relevant.
My go -to for a while has been the QSC k10 (used here- although you are not hearing the speakers). The k10 has plenty of headroom and dispersion to be used as a stage monitor for guitar. Ideally, you'll want to use something >100W for clean headroom with a drummer. In my experience you can get good results with either an 8", 10" or 12" speaker size. Just look for enough watts of power and a good dispersion pattern (the k10 has a 90º spread as opposed to the 75º spread of the k12)
Great vid! Thank you so much! I can't help but see the writing on the wall and assume that eventually old-school tube amps will slowly disappear. I recently switched to the Boss GX100 modeler, from a heavy tube amp, and I couldn't be happier. My back is a lot happier, too. Now, when I visit my band buddy in Seattle, or we fly out to do a gig, I just pack my GX100 into carry-on and check in my guitar. That's it! 🤟 I plug my GX into the FOH and in-ears. Abodda boom, abodda bing. Ready to rock! Sounds great! I have an old-school friend. He's been playing for over 30 years. He detests modelers and says he will never give up his tube amp. He lugs that heavy ass thing around. I say "Have fun with that, buddy!".
so, i set up the ir's to have a low cut from 150Hz and high cut at 7KHz so as to get them to sound real. or a global eq with same cuts, this would apply to all Ir's if you change ir's. As far as FRFR's go, they are a pre-tuned speaker to sound as flat as possible, however, you get frequencies that stand out strong on certain every different stage/room. hence an eq still is worth considering to fix room sound.
That's kinda why I like using a PEQ after the cab- I do the heavy cuts on the lows and highs then leave the other bands to edit for the room. I'm typically a "one preset per gig" type player, but if you use multiple presets on a gig then the global makes a lot of sense.
Having just nabbed an Ampero Stomp and a Headrush FR108 for the practice room and wondering if it was meant to sound...well...meh. Now I know its just dialing in...
I don't even worry about it. I don't even use guitar amps. Namely because guitar amp speakers are frequency range limited. Notably the old marshals. We would simply disconnect the speaker and run the speaker wires to some 3 way 5x9 car speaker to get the range back. Remember, in the right hands a $50.00 Harmony Sunburst or GS1 guitar can sound like a $5000.00 guitar. If you want more confidence use the Fender SS/1000 super strat.
good info. I recently took my fm3 and Friedman frfr to a rehearsal and immediately my sound was almost lost in the mix. the little fender practice amps others had sounded better! I'm still trying to find the balance of tones to work in the studio, rehearsal with a frfr cab, and live on stage; straight into front of house mix board.
Thanks for watching! In addition to what I discussed in the video, remember that tones that sound the best when playing by yourself rarely sound good in a mix. The magic is in the midrange and scooping too much out will leave you lost (not saying you are doing this, but just as a general principle). You could also apply a global EQ with a boost around 1K for added presence in a mix throughout all your presets.
CHRIST ! F*ING EXCELLENT VIDEO ! You wouldn't imagine of how much "mind f*" you'd actually go through when you just can't afford to buy all possible equipment just to test it and have a precise idea of simply "WHAT YOU ACTUALLY WANT". Now, when you have such a nice and simply put out explanatory presentation such as this video, that greatly helps. The "reverb" thing ... you need to think of PERCEIVED SPACE in your sound. A simple example : you have just one tone, let's say a nice 70s rock tone of your liking, you play your rhythm with a little bit of reverb and at a slightly lower level (-3dB for instance) so your rhythm blends nicely with the rest of the band and brings a nice spacious ensemble sound ... then, for your solo, you go up 3dB (or even more to be right in front) and with the exact same tone, but you switch the reverb off, and maybe add some very short slapback echo in the mix just to have the sensation of "the walls getting closer to you" and "the room shrinking", and all of a sudden you're guitar is "right in the face", it gets really aggressive, no space, no perception of room, no "escape". Listen to a song like "Cold Turkey" from John Lennon, for instance, and you'll have a great example of how you can actually "perceive space" with the very contrast-full mix of that song. In that song everything contributes to that suffocating feeling (the drums tone, the slapback, the guitar without reverb, etc), and in the end it "opens up", and you have that feeling that you can finally breathe again.
I have a line 6 Powercab whenever I use it I always run 75 Hz to 5000 Hz but like you said if you don’t play loud enough it’s gonna sound boxy and dull
When I use the Axe Fx 3 to record, I always use Adams monitors. I usually added a filter block after the cab to do the same similar blocking as you did with the Parametric. Definitely going to try that. For the amp in the room, I use my EVH 5150 iii…it is a different experience for sure. I have also turned off the cab/power amp modeling & used the AxeFx through the return of the EvH, & that is pretty awesome!!! Great video
Unless you have a dedicated sub in a FRFR system - board monitors or wedge - you aren't going to get anything near 20hz. Even dedicated bass rigs won't deliver much of anything flat below 50hz
I'm 52 so I instantly cut down to 10k because anything above that I cant hear anyway. If it was spikey above that I wouldn't know but others would. Thanks Mathew great content.
Thanks for watching! Experiment with even going down further to 5 or 6K I used to cut to 10k thinking that would be plenty before hearing some harsh high end content at live volumes. 5-6K seems to be the sweet spot for me. Cheers!
I have been so dissappointed with my kemper, but just hooked up my 2 marshalls, and put a mic on it. Played it through my PA and they sound identical😂 so i will use my kemper from now on haha. I do not have frfr tho, used a yamaha dxr10. My origin50 and dsl40cr miced up sounds exactly like my kemper stage. And by that i mean it has that same buzz sort of sound thay i havent liked with the kemper.. sounds sort of digital kind of, but i realised the amps also have this when they are mic'ed up..
Great observation! A guitar speaker cab in a room and one mic'd up sound very different and this is the biggest thing to understand moving into an FRFR environment. It's less about analog and digital, and more about amp to ears and amp to mic to PA speakers to ears.
Regarding amps, lots of amp brands sound unique by default, but just because it's an amp, it is in no way automatically superior to a properly modelled amp simulation or vice versa either, some amps including some of the more expensive or boutique types don't always reproduce specific guitar tones as well as most think, most require toys attached to improve their ability, I personally think a lot of amp manufacturers are not quite always up to their marketing of their products including some who make modellers, great tone will always be great tone, but the particular guitar used obviously plays a large part in obtaining great tone for live use or recording use too.
Some of us, guitar players, are really dumb. Why would anyone with an ounce of intelligence buy a modeller and then run it via a guitar amp and a guitar cabinet. It's like buying a vintage tube amp and then use a crapload of tools to remove the deficiencies of a vintage tube amp.... OK, I'll show myself out.
You do t want amp in the room you want cd quality sit in the mix tone and the time that comes out of the frfr speaker you have will come out of the pa at the show
Yep, totally could do that as well- just showing another way. I also usually have my favorite IR's saved in the Block Library with those settings pre-dialed in for quick set-ups. So separating the aggressive stuff on a PEQ gives me more flexibility if I want to dial in something for home/ quite use or for loud/live where the PEQ gives me additional control.
I think you're right. I have manage to reduce my stuff using a Mooer ge250+ Hb gpa100 + marshall 1960 412 ( band) or peavey bandit 112 speaker (home) . I have then a cheap rig but huge possibilities of sounds and use (home/ band training/live) I have never tried FRFR exept xlr connection to monitoring table (band) sharing the singer frequencies through sprakers... So i finally prefer to have my own guitar speakers in my back 😊
Great video. I have an AXE FX III AND I also have a McCarty 594 (Two of them actually, an SC and a Hollowbody II, AND a real Fender Twin. Haha. Also I usually run thru studio monitors. I am paying attention to this, because I've got the same gear as you, and love the tone you're getting.
FRFR's also sound different depending on the speaker sizes. I've seen 110, 210, 112, and 212 versions. The tone, especially the bass response, still has to be adjusted to the room. A studio with carpeting will sound much different than a club with tile floors.
I tried some digital solutions to my guitar playing and I must admit they didn't really convince me. But I'm now realizing my approach had critical flaws, both in my expectations and in the setup I was using. This video further confirms that and points me to possible solutions. On the first, and please correct me if I'm wrong but this kind of setup will never feel like a traditional guitar amp and cabinet, it will feel as a recording of it. Which isn't bad at all, it's just a different expectation. I will still prefer the analog way, but many times that won't be practical and carrying around tons of gear for no purpose is just dumb. On the second, it was completely foolish on my part to feed the output of a modeler into a guitar amp and cabinet, or more generally trying to deal with the modeler output as if it was an analog device. I don't even know what I was thinking on those. I wasn't. 😵💫 Thank you for the great presentation, you made everything abundantly clear.
excellent vid, clear, concise, easy to understand and really well presented, subbed 👊😎. Jst getting to grips with axe fx 3 and this is a really useful find, will be watching the rest of your tutorials, thanks for sharing, peace ❤🙏
Here I have been thinking about this and coming to your channel enlightened me. An understanding of what I’m looking for. Never used a modeler nor FRFR but thinking this is the future. A bit late to the party @71….🤣
Nice and precise explanations and a very clear understanding now than before, I instantly subscribed after the first 5 minutes of watching this video. I use the Strymon Iridium but all the points about the speaker types etc. Where an eye opener. Great channel.
Great vid mate! I remember when i was educated on stage by a very versed engineer about Monitor Speakers and Guitar Speakers and how he tweaked it to have the tonal quality of a cabinet. The difference was night and day, since then my go to has always been 100/120HZ and 6khz. Great work man!
Thanks so much for watching! I been following your channel for a few years now. You've helped me with the GT1000 immensely. I enjoy your content and thank your watching one of my videos! Cheers!
This will be great content to watch! I'm a complete noob and I got a tonex, so I've been low balling a headrush 12" and I have no idea how to configure such speaker lol
Thank you, love the technical details. Just bought a used FM9, sadly my electric is getting a set up I should get it back 2maro. I’m currently playing my Taylor 810ce in a factory preset blackface “normal” clean and it sounds great. I’m using a pair of headrush frfr 108’s. Really happy so far, I’m sure that assessment will go up when I get my electric back for a real test.
I saw a similar video with a helix user. I however am using the ancient line 6 hd500x with its stock cabs. The amp eq, parametric , and room reverb tips make ALL the difference for me . Taming that low end and also using your ears instead of your eyes will put your tone in a better place for you, your band, and your sound guy. Great video.
I agree if it sounds good and close what your going for cool you know ears differently big part I have headrush gigboard and I'm going get couple headrush frfr 8ich ones I love stereo sound
Just showcasing two methods... It's also not a bad idea to do the "general cuts" in the cab block for studio and quieter playing environments, then using the PEQ for more aggressive cuts and notches for louder playing. Bypassing or engaging the PEQ block gives you an easy way to bounce between settings.
Very nice old wooden machinist toolbox behind you. I had one back in the sixties very much like that one. I'm guessing yours was your dads or more likely your grandfather's.:) Great video much needed for modeler users.
Mathew, thank - great job. I'm considering FRFR in my studio as I've sold my last heavy Mesa MK V tube amp and I'm going the modeling route (after decades of lugging heavy amps). Did I understand you correct, with FRFR monitors by placing them on the floor slight up angle (a few inches elevated), with tone dialed will provide the best "amp" recreated sound versus flat on floor? Cheers!
That's really tough to say as there are many factors. I use my FRFRs on the floor and angled up and enjoy that but to say that it is a direct 1:1 with "amp in the room" isn't the most accurate statement. If you want "amp in the room" with the convince of modeling the best thing is to have a cabinet loaded with guitar speakers powered by a neutral power amp- plug the modeler into the power amp.
I use my Helix with one single amp and one single amp (just like I would in the old days). Then I just use Helix as my pedal board (with some more flexibility).
Thanks for this video and sharing your knowledge. This made me a subscriber. Clear and concise information here. Thank you. I use modelers and it has always been trial & error. This video has helped to shake out a lot of the issues I was having and being a lot together even more for.
Very interesting stuff, thanks for doing the homework on this, a lot! Of time and effort on your part- top bloke 👍 It's cleared my head on eq a bit more, realising the definition of full range of frequencies and what I don't need when dialling in a patch for a digital modeler with use on a speaker cab- it's been the bain of my existence for a while now, but now im feeling refreshed, re educated and ready to get back to it! Keep up the good work, you're making a difference, that matters A LOT!! ❤️
But.. why doesn't the amp modeler automatically roll off the frequencies of the cabinet that it's emulating? Isn't that the FRIGGIN POINT? Not much of a cabinet simulation if it passes frequencies that the real speaker doesn't. 🤷
Remember that there is still a mic chain within the IR so the lower frequencies in some of the IRs could be a result of that. It's all about control. That's like saying why don't mixers all have a pre-set roll off at 100hz. Many input sources like mics and other instruments will need that 100k roll off but it may not be ideal for every situation. It's better to be able to control your equipment than it control you. Even if you mic up at live cab, an engineer would still be doing similar cuts at the board.
@@mathew_dale i get that but you'd think there would only be negligible amounts of those frequencies in the IR if it was an accurate representation of the speaker. At any rate, the manufacturers of modeling hardware and software should know better. If i have to apply EQ in a signal chain that I normally wouldn't have to, well, the modeler isn't doing its job.
One thing I never understood is if the guitar speaker only ranges 100-5000k, why would a mic’d up Cabinet or even an IR made with a mic produce any frequencies outside that range? The frequencies aren’t even there for a mic to pick up both in modeling and live miking.
As an older player , I’m kinda new to the world of digital guitar amplification, and I have a question. I've been experimenting with some alternatives to my traditional pedalboard into amp rig as it’s becoming more difficult for me to lug it all to gigs. I got a good deal on an Frfr speaker (Its an Alesis which is half the weight of my amp) and running a couple of my pedals into a DI with a cab sim into the Frfr. Sounds pretty good but not sure if it’ll cut it at the gig. I do have a eq pedal that I can put in the chain. Do you think this might work? I also have a Tonex One on the way to experiment with. Thanks !
Really depends on a few things. You mentioned a DI with a cab sim. Which one?what are you using for amp tones? Keep in mind that the electric guitar as an instrument is three things- guitar, amp/ speaker, and effects, and frfr is none of those. Frfr just makes things louder. Are you hoping to send your signal to both the house and your FRFR together. Ideally, you’d want the FRFR for your stage volume and monitoring and send a separate signal to the house. You should never mic an frfr like a guitar cab. Keep those things in mind and it should yield good results!
Thanks for the input and advice. Much appreciated. Just to answer a couple of the questions and give a more clear picture of my experiment, the DI is an inexpensive Mooer Micro DI that I use with my acoustic. For amp tones I was using an MXR 5150 and Wampler Plexi Drive. I’m excited to see what the Tonex does when I get it!
My question is, can I run my pedals straight into the frfr PA speakers without needing IRs, computers, etc ..., and just adjust my eq through my pedals. I have a multi effect pedals that I just want to plug into the Frfr pa speaker and adjust the EQ through the multi effect pedal. I just want quick simplicity. Is this doable or will it sound bad? It's been forever since I've been in the guitar world and am trying to catch up and do it simple as possible
Yep that’s definitely possible if your multi-effect has amp and cab modeling. The cab modeling or IRs really make the biggest difference. You can get similar amp-like tones from drive pedals, but having something for cab sounds is extremely important when going direct. What multi-effect are you using?
@@mathew_dale I'm looking at getting a zoom g1x four, Donner Arena 2000, headrush mx5, or the line 6 pod go. Have any experience with any of them? Which one would you suggest
Very informative video. I have 2 Headrush FRFR 108 connected stereo to my Quad Cortex. Its been a struggle to reduce the boominess (super heavy bass) I have used the Global EQ on QC to cut the the low end frequencies . I have also added EQ in my rigs to attenuate the 200Hz to 400Hz region. Yet, the boominess remains. My FRFRs are on the floor on 2" thick foam and one is in a corner. Any suggestions ?
@@mathew_dale Thanks for the response. I ended up buying Bass Traps from foambymail. This made a spectacular difference in my home studio. Looks like my issue was the lower frequencies bouncing all around. Cheers !!
New FM3 user here. Been browsing a ton of videos but still not getting the answer I’m looking for. May have missed it here. A power cab will deliver the more traditional feel of playing with an amp while the FRFR will deliver a better listening experience for the listener/studio/engineer right? Im trying to figure out what to get to have more fun and feel at home off phones.
So, the Powercab can actually function both ways (allegedly). You can set it to be FRFR and use IRs from a modeler, or you can set it to emulate a certain speaker- this is different from an IR as there is no mic capture- So you get a more "Amp-in-the-room' feel. If you are usually playing at home, I'd go with the Powercab.
I have 2 head rush 108 frfr. Sounds great at low volume. At high volume they fart or clip. It forces me to bring the lows down on my zoom g6, the the sound off love is gone (to much high) if I buy bigger powered speakers will that fix it?
Possibly. Allegedly, the headrush 108s are 2000W peak which should be enough headroom for pretty loud playing. A couple things to try: Run the output volume on the Zoom lower and the 108 volume higher to see if that changes anything at the same loudness level you are wanting. If not, try swapping that around- lower 108, higher Zoom. If both are pretty maxed maybe try placement- sometimes low frequencies buildup near walls and corners. It would also be good to try out as many other speakers as you can- I've been hearing very good things about the QSC cp8, I love my k10s and k12s. Or, if you can, try the headrush 112 with all the same settings and see if the bigger speaker does the trick. Hope this helps!
Could you tell me if the headrush will let my piezo from my majesty guitar actually sound like an acoustic? I got rid of my guitar amp cause I was told it’s mid range and it chokes off any high sounds made from acoustic? Thank you so much Mat
Quick question: headrush pedal board or headrush FRFR? Either way the answer is still yes (with an asterisk). A guitar amp and cab have a pretty limited frequency response (which is what we want for electric). The headrush pedalboard can process a signal from a piezo like you would an acoustic (adding eq and compression like on a mixer). The FRFR can reproduce the fuller spectrum you’d want to amplify an acoustic guitar. Bonus tone points: use an acoustic guitar IR to help the piezo on a solid body sound closer to a full bodied acoustic guitar.
Mathew I'm trying to load irs to my l6 powercab and I'm using the right requirements for the irs and all and have no prob with adding them to. Helix but when try on p/c edit the irs won't open files to load , I've tried quite a few diff ir packs and im using wave files with correct requirements, it seems my p/c doesn't recognize the files as.loadable do you have any ideas thank you
@@mathew_dale What I don't like about the digital emulation of tube sound is the latency, no matter how low it may be, it affects, which is why at a given moment I wouldn't mind using it in the studio, applying it after recording, but I don't like using it while playing. nothing, and if it is a minimally considerable latency it affects me when playing, so if I am going to use it in recordings, I record clean and apply it later. But wow, there is nothing like a real tube amp, even though it is more laborious to get a good sound and once recorded you cannot modify any of the amp's parameters, that is the magic.
I’ll never understand this confusion because the laws of physics don’t care what you’re playing through-the sound can and WILL still change depending on VOLUME, size of room, and distance between sound and ear, period! Doesn’t matter if is an FRFR speaker or a guitar cab or when monitoring a mic’d cab through a preamp, and some monitors then processed, mastered and played through a sound system; the sound cannot escape the laws of physics. It’s just a circle jerk between speaker and audio equipment manufacturers tell you that look, “this is what you need because it’s “flat” and everything can sound like anything…through THIS!” It just comes down to functionality and practicality, meaning that if you’re throwing hundreds of different sounds at a sound system it only makes sense to have a “flat” starting point. Why guitarists want to have anything to do with this is beyond my realm of understanding lol, other that the whole “it translates better and is less directional” guff.
All good points, which is why I prefer to use PA type speakers (QSC k10s and k12s) as opposed to the more common and sought after FRFRs like the Friedmans and Atomic CLRs. Those are certainly awesome, but I want to dial in tones akin to what I'll be plugging in to.
I've been playing my Kemper through some Dynaudio studio monitors for years, and just picked up the Headrush FRFR-108 and hate it. The headrush sounds so muffled. I will pick up my tele and put it on a clean channel, and it sounds like a blanket is over the speaker. I find myself having to drop the mids, blast the treble, and bass varies. Is there a solution for this? It's unreal how bad this sounds compared to the monitors I have been using.
Keep in mind that all speakers are different, or to put it another way, all speakers suck- it's just to what extent. Your monitors are going to be much nicer than the headrush, so for studio use and listening to a mix, that's one thing. If you want to use the headrush live, then making your own presets to accommodate your live speaker situation is a better way to go than dialing in on monitors and hoping for the best when using a PA speaker. Also, don't keep the 108 near a wall and tilted up on the floor- that begs for low-end build up. Could also try messing with the contour switch on the back of the 108.
*sigh* Still trying to figure out whether to purchase a modeler (Quad Cortex) with an FRFR speaker set-I know you can use the Quad Cortex as a Audio Interface-Just can't understand how I would use it (QC) in a live setting. It is my understanding I would need a set of speaker cabinets (FRFR) to produce the exact sound that the Quad Cortex is producing or plug the QC into the PA? From what I can understand from this video is that even with any modeler, you end up tweaking the frequencies coming from your modeler to whatever you use-FRFR or out to PA Help please? Thanks in advance as these questions have kept me on the fence with digital modelers.
Good questions... let's break this into 2 categories: tone shaping and room correction... While we're shaping our tones in a modeler, it's a good idea to use an FRFR or a flat(ish) PA speaker because it "levels the playing field" so to speak. In most of the gigs I play I hook up my modeler to the PA and I monitor with in-ears or a floor monitor. So in this sense, I can skip bringing the analog pedals, tube amp, and heavy 4x12 in lieu of using the system. So I want to shape my tones with this in mind- selecting a good IR, adjusting amp tones, getting my pedal sounds and other effects in check and doing other EQ tweaks for the sound I want. What I hear out of the FRFR speakers should sound like good guitar tone! And that means I should be getting good tones out of other full range systems- PAs, other FRFR speakers, Mixers, into an interface, etc. This should be a "nearly" fully processed signal that a sound tech doesn't need to adjust- just pull up the fader. So there's a lot of tweaking and dialing in on the front half. Now, when getting to the gig and you plug into the PA, there should be little to no adjusting on your guitar channel except for room correction. Since my studio is only shaped like my studio and not like any and all venues, my tones might reflect that, even with FRFR. So If I'm playing in a particularly bass heavy room, or I'm shoved in a corner for a wedding I may cut more lows out of my guitar channel. Maybe the dynamics of my preset aren't playing nice with the rest of the band- add a little light compression, and so-on. Let me know if this helps and feel free to ask more!
@@mathew_dale "This should be a "nearly" fully processed signal" Yessss-I get it now!! :)))) . Now I understand that the "tone" is coming from my Quad Cortex (soon to be purchased) I thought I needed a "regular" cabinet-NOT SO !! What I want is the sound/tone I have coming from my QC to be, for lack of a better term) True! I have the "tone" I want in the Quad Cortex-it's just a matter of presenting the "Tone" with no changes (almost) thru a FRFR speaker. I looked at the FRFR speakers at Sweetwater-not really liking what I see as far as aesthetics (most look like floor monitors-some reviews say it becomes "bassy" when on the floor) I found a company in Germany, contacted the owner and he explained FRFR as well and the difference between a regular head/cabinet setup and an FRFR speaker which in essence is a speaker made for modelers! Plus, they look like a regular cabinet +1 in the looks department! Problem solved-there goes the bank account:)) I can not even begin to thank you for explaining all this, but Thank you. Wishing you the very best!! Subscribed!!
Hello and thank you for the video. I recently bought a Headrush 108 known for having so many low frequencies. As a result, to compensate I have to make presets on my pedalboard by removing the low tones on the simulation of almost zero amps. This is not a good thing because if I then go to the PA the sounds are extremely high-pitched and unpleasant. It's like I have to think the other way around when I make my own presets. Not to mention if the sounds, as often happens, I make them in headphones and then listen to them again through Headrush 108. It's frustrating!
I've heard the Headrushes can be very bassy, especially when used in "wedge" orientation on the floor. There can be a bass coupling effect, especially when against a wall or in a corner that can amplify the bass more than it should. I believe there is a high-pass 100 hz filter on the back. Have you tried engaging that? Try pulling them away from walls if they are near that as well.
@@mathew_dale no…on the back there isn’t a bass filter! There is only the contour button that it don’t change this problem. What if I tried to put the 108 on a stand? Like a speakers …
I got a Headrush MX5. I love it. Right now I run it into a mixer with my TV and out though my home theater but I think studio monitors would be better. What do you think? Will I get a better sound? Does a home theater stereo not allow certain frequencies to come through? Keep in mind my home theater is JBL with a subwoofer but it’s from the 90s.
I don't know if "better" would be the result, but studio monitors would be a more "accurate" representation of the tones you are creating in the Headrush. Generally, home theater systems want to make everything sound the best they can so a bit of EQ and compression might be involved in the head unit- typically a bit more lows and highs for that Hi-Fi theater experience. If you are primarily a home player and it works for jamming with songs or tracks and you love the sound I'd say you're good and save your money, but if you are playing out you might find that your tones are quite a bit different going through a PA than what you dialed in at home and a lot of adjustment may be needed. Studio monitors (especially good ones) just try to give an honest representation of what being fed to them. I've heard some absolute garbage come out of my monitors because it's bad audio- but it may sound okay through a home entertainment system. Just two different purposes- sound the best or sound the most accurate. Hope this helps!
@@mathew_dale Thank you. That does help. I was suspecting a loss in certain tones when using different effects like phaser and different filter effects. I guess a good comparison would be headphones to see if I hear a difference. If not I’ll save the money. Who am I kidding. I’ll probably buy another guitar 😀
As a guitarplayer for more than 40 years i came to digital domain in early 90ties. You explain the topic very well and i`m happy to connect some loose ends and missing links in my live setup. Thanks :)
I use a Mooer GE300 with a Harley Benton G212A-FR active frfr speaker, and it sounds fantastic both live with my band and in the studio. I set up the FRFR speaker behind me like a traditional guitar amp, and another output of the G300 also takes the signal direct to the mixer/PA. I've never been happier with my tone! I think a modeller with an FRFR speaker can definitely sound superb.
Does the HB g212a-fr have enough volume keep up live with a band?
@@richo144 Hell yes! I play in a loud rock band with a drummer who batters the hell out of his kit, and I've never had to turn the Harley Benton G212A-FR past about half way in volume (12 o'clock position). It's loud as hell with tons of clarity and headroom. Very good sounding, good value FRFR speaker!
Quaint. 😂jk
I learned the hard way. Live tones and album tones are often never the same. Trying to dial in tones from albums often disappointed me in a live setting. Often lack low end and like a bit more gain live.
Dial tones for the area you are playing in. Delay and reverb feel so different in headphones versus an open air stage.
So for me it started when I used to use Headphones with my BOSS ME multi pedals (I went from ME-50 to the 70 to the 80 with a GT -10 in there somewhere) and it sounded so good I figured, I should plug in my Altec Lansing Computer speakers into the headphone out and it sounded exceptional. That was 13 yrs ago and now all i use is an Atomic Amplifire pedal and those same $60 today cpu speakers. I only play at home, ive got a Katana MKII but its got maybe 2 hours on it and it has an input for multi pedals on it and sound decent but I all in on just using processors for my tone as it what i always wanted it to sound like and used to think all tube amps would be the answer but would get let down when I sounded like shit.
One of the biggest things is having a level good tone out of the higher strings where a lot of real amps just seem dead across all the strings.
Thank You
Great vid for myself, old school loud amp guy trying to break into this ‘world’
This video is so good! Thank you!
Glad you liked it!
Hey guys, bassplayer (and ex guitarist) here.. i have 3 advices about EQ as a bass-player who did some gigging:
1) put your guitar amp EQ bass and 9 o clock. It will make your guitar sit much better in band mixes. (most guitar-amps have too much low end.. )
2) If you have a multi fx like a FM3 or Helix, and you want to know if your sound sits well in a bandmix... put a headphone in your multi-fx, put on a track via aux input ( or by putting the multi-fx through a sound-interface ) and adjust your guitar-volume (when the track is off) until its about the same as the 'general' volume of the track ... Then turn on the track and play guitar.. Cant hear yourself? Then it does not sit well in a mix.. it will also disappear when you play in a band. i did this 2nd step with my bass/bassgear too, and learnt a lot from it..
3) if you are using a small amp (1x10 or 1x12) aim the speaker at your ears when playing in a band, then you will hear yourself much better. (and it prevents other bandmembers from having a epileptic seizure every time your struck a chord, because you tried to EQ and Volume compensate for having the sound aimed at your feet.)
due to amp design variations, the knob positions are completely arbitrary. 7 o'clock on one amp might result in as much bass, mid, treble, etc as 3 o'clock on another. Use your ears, not your eyes folks.
@@threepe0 Of course. Ive used/heard quite some amps, Most of them do well with bass at 9 or 10.. Some not. That is why i gave it as an advice, as a basic starting point: It "relatively" makes mids and more present, resulting in hearing yourself.. after cutting bass boosting volume just a little helps too. With some amps you need to cut all the lows.. It also depends on the angle of your amp. The same is true for bass amps and not hearing yourself well on stage.. (subs under/near a stage bring lows on a stage too, when an amp does the same thing the low end becomes all boomy and overpowering on stage.. )
Doesnt "Flat response" mean - that it doesnt color original input sound - whether its a pro mixed tune , or your guitar's tone etc?
Technically, it means that the speaker reproduces various frequencies at similar levels evenly across the spectrum. So by proxy it won’t color the input signal (much).
Great video. Quick question, what pick in on your thumb? I am looking for this kind of solution. Thanks!
Thanks for watching! I use Fred Kelly Bumblebee Jazz picks. Here's a link...
fredkellypicks.com/product-category/bumble-bee
Interesting that Fractal call it "blocking" seems to be pretty standard high pass and lo pass filters
A "blocking" filter is the standard high of low pass filter. As apposed to a shelving, notch, or peaking filter. It's just a more specific way of describing what the filter is doing.
great stuff
Matthew- global eq vs cabinet applied cuts?? Do you recommend both? I play primarily in church direct to FOH.
Both are good but it depends on your workflow and keeping track of things. I use both- I dial in tone in my studio with the Cab cuts, but setting up in a venue I'll use the Global EQs if additional cuts are needed. Generally, I'll have the Cab cuts on my Per-Preset perform page and the Global EQ low and high controls on my Global perform page so I can quickly turn off and on the eq and adjust parameters. If you are using multiple presets during a performance Global EQ is the way to go.
@@mathew_dale - thanks that makes sense! Thanks again!
Hi one question. Conversely while using a traditional guitar combo or amp-cabinet with a multi fx pedal, wouldn’t switching off the amps and cabinets in the multi FX solve any potential issues. In such a situation, wouldn’t the multi fx pedal be functioning more or less like traditional analog effects.
Yes, depending on what you are going for. At the very least, you'll want to disable any cab modeling and IRs. You may still want an amp model to change the character of the amp you are plugging into or you may just want the effects. There's certainly exceptions too- I had to plug a modeler into a JC-120 on a cruise ship and found things sounded okay with my amp and cab modeling active, but its a very clean amp and I was plugged into the FX return only.
@@mathew_dale Thanks for the reply. That last point is interesting. Do send returns make it easier to use amp and cab sims into an amp. What about distortions - were you using distortions on the modeler. Or if it was a separate distortion pedal, where would you have placed it in the situation you described.
so the answer was high cut and low cut? about 80-100hz low and 6500-8000 high
Yeah realistically “live tones” should be around 100hz-5Khz but for home use or quieter playing cutting less is okay. Mindset is also important- knowing that FRFR won’t be the same as a live cab and that’s okay is part of it as well.
@@mathew_dale I’ve had an axe fx for about 6 years and just got an fm9. I was in a rush earlier so needed to know lol very recently I’ve been going down to 6500 and I’m getting really nice results. Before I was around 7500-8000 or even 10000 for cleans
I used to do the same in my GT1000, only cutting to 10K. Then getting more and more aggressive with that cut yielded better tones. I think 6500hz is a good starting point as well!
@@mathew_dale well I think an actual cab speaker only emits up to 5500? The rest I guess comes from the microphone voice and all the other business
Do u cut on the amp as well? I tend to match the cuts on amp an cab.
Not always. If I feel like an amp is too bassy even with the bass knob down I may do an input eq low end cut, and I'll use the output eq on Mesa models but that's about it.
Okay folks, I need some help: I'm proud owner of an ISP theta pro DSP floor unit absolutely love the tones that are on it. I've used it through headphones (& it sounds awesome), I've used it through cheap computer powere speakers (still sounds awesome) & even through my PreSonus recording software interface (sounds awesome their as well). However... I recently purchased the headrush FRFR 108, tried my ISP unit into it and.... It sounded like tinfoil being lit on fire 😫😱🤯😥 Needless to say I was not happy with that, thus I got the turbo sound ix15 which is a 15 inch powered loudspeaker (always had an affinity for 15-in speakers) and it still sounds horrible. I'm up for any suggestions and yes if you're wondering, I do have speaker emulation on (a 4x12 greenback) via the unit. Any and all recommendations are appreciated. If I'm doing something wrong or if I'm not doing something correctly, feel free to let me know.
Did you try EQ'ng the presets like shown in the video? Do a full aggressive lowcut at 100-200hz, and highcut at 5000hz. Guitar speakers and most computer speakers have nothing below 150-200hz~ and above 5000hz, as stated in the video.. but PA speakers do and some PA speakers have the tendency to exaggerate frequencies below 200 hz and above 5000hz...
@@Graoeye Thank you for this inside, has a greatly appreciate it. Turns out that I did not have the global speaker emulation turned on. Once I made that adjustment everything coming out at FRFR speakers soon fantastic!
Most of the tone comes from the speaker, anyone else saying anything else is full of shit. All that is not from the speaker is to a variable degree between the preamp and the speaker. Yes pickups are negligeable in terms of tone but will affect the impedance of the signal, volume input and "bite"
True; a Les Paul plugged into a Marshall into a 4x12 sounds exactly like a Strat plugged into a Deluxe Reverb into the same 4x12
I can hear your guitar acoustic we almost as loud as your speaker. So I am unable to get a good feel for how it sounds. Otherwise, nice presentation.
To play.
*LONG 2 THE SHORT, everyone peep game, FRFR is simply some marketing BS garnered to make you purchases more crap. Simply select a power amp and PA speakers and rock on. **#cheers*
This took me the longest time to figure out…I would plug in my modeler,into studio monitors,and would be immediately disappointed..it’s a very different sound than a Marshall and 4x12 blasting away at your knee caps..Then I started thinking about it,every guitar tone we have ever heard,was and is filtered thru a microphone and listened to on some kind of full range speaker system,whether it’s your favorite CD,or your favorite band live…..Van Halen 1 guitar tones are NOT an amp in the room sound….it’s an amp in another room,mic’ed up and played back thru Full range speakers….When I stopped comparing the two,I was much happier….That said,sometimes I do run my AxeFXIII into a power amp and guitar cab..it’s a different experience altogether….Great video though…I already use a lot of these tips for getting the best out of my FRFR system,but I learned a few more!!..
You are so right! So many guitarists are obsessed with having that "amp in the room sound", yet fail to realize that the guitars he's hearing on recordings, or live, through a P.A., sounds quite different. The question is, can a guitar still sound great in either of those situations? Of course! That's why people buy recorded music or attend concerts and still love the sound of those guitars. My reasoning is, even if a guitarist still wants that "amp in the room" sound while playing live, that's fine. But he should remember that the audience is not going to hear what HE hears. Personally, I want to hear on stage, as closely as possible, what the audience hears. So yep, the FRFRs are going to go a long way in giving me that.
Great point! It's really about knowing the application and understanding the ways to achieve the desired results. There's certainly a time and place for FRFR as well as a power amp and 4x12!
A great point as well! I also want to monitor as close to what my audience will hear.
@@mathew_dale Yeah, we guitarists all know that the sound we hear when we play affects HOW we play. The cool think about hearing what the audience hears is that the way we play will be the way we want the audience to hear it!
Who fucking cares. People that like the visceral amp in the room experience don’t want to compromise on that. Why should they have to let go of what they love?
The main thing to do is set up all your patches and scenes at gig levels. Don’t dial them in at bedroom levels. And high pass/ Low pass is your best friend. And bring an actual EQ pedal to the show to tune to the room. An EQ pedal is the most important pedal you can use in any situation. Don’t rely on the EQ in the processor you’re using. It’ll never be right in the room. And make sure your patches/scenes are at complimentary levels. Don’t go from clean neck pickup to full bore metal with bridge pickup and have the volumes not match.
Mathew, great job of explaining the mechanics behind the sounds.
I have been playing through the first modeling amp ever made directly through FOH systems for years. At one time I was fortunate enough to play through some of the best tube amps ever made ('60s era Vox AC-30, Fender Bassman, 70's era Marshall, Mesa Lonestar, 60's era Twin Reverb, etc.) and I know what good tone is (yes, I'm old). These sounds are very achievable using digital technology though most purists will disagree. Funny thing is that most of those "purists" haven't played nearly as many gigs through all kinds of equipment the way that I have. Most have been sold on a lot of opinions that are not backed up by facts - just opinions. I'll go on stage up against any rig and I'm guaranteed to hang or probably sound better. A stereo chorus or roto-vibe effect through a stereo FOH system has so much more depth. All you purists can keep your overpriced, always-breaking-down, heavier-than-f_ck equipment. If you are a performing musician, you know that getting your sound out to the audience doesn't always (rarely actually) mean you'll get a great tactile response on stage. So, dragging around a heavy amplifier simply makes no sense. But it looks cool - I'll give you that.
The tube amp in an isolation room or iso box I thought was an interesting trend- especially since load boxes with D.I. as well as digital was also readily available. You quickly loose that “tube amp” feel when you are not near the amp and going “silent stage.” Making the switch to digital makes that kind of stuff much easier and better sounding in my opinion. Thanks for watching and commenting!
Well said!! 👏 👍
To just comment on part of you’re comment the purists are dumb fractals literally model the best amps in the world exactly like the real amps and even better because the ideal page
Been using a FRFR monitor being fed from my DAw plug ins ....
Frfr seems more easy and simple instead of running amps, cabs, mics, pedals, etc just to run into frfr anyway.
You have a great ability to convey this information without being needlessly complicated. I wish I would have found your channel a year ago when I took the plunge into modeling with the FM3. I’ve learned much of this through trial and error which is a much longer and sometimes hair pulling process.😁 Having said that I still get a lot from watching due to the aforementioned teaching skill you have. Thank You!!👍
Thanks so much! I appreciate the kind words!
Sounds expensive and complicated...
I'll stick with tubes and instrument speakers. There's plenty of variation in traditional analog technology, and I think we need our gear to put up a little fight, some limitation to overcome.
Yes, I'm a middle-aged bachelor who talks to his dog.
You sure do play pretty!
Hello!I bought a Headrush frfr and is really good!I play with a Mooer radar and my Pod Hd bean desktop…much better!Thank you!👍🙏
Prs🎸💯👍🤗☀️ pozdrawiam serdecznie z Polski
One of the best videos I have seen on configuring settings for FRFR. Many thanks for publishing.
Thanks so much! Glad you enjoyed!
Agreed you managed to appeal to me and I struggle to listen to many of the modeler dudes out there today 😄
I believe you about the cuts, but my thing was like, I’m putting in this IR that was supposed to be a large majority of the cuts, so why am I having to do this SO much?
I believe it's from the mic'ing part of the IR. If you were to just mic a cab to FOH, those cuts, especially on the low end, would also need to be put in place.
So do you still need a practice amp if your not gigging and if so which one works best with the Helix ????
Not exactly a practice amp. If you want your tones to relate closer to what you would hear through a PA, using a powered PA speaker like the QSC CP8 is a good choice for home use.
Dialing in your tone at intended volume use is very important. I play my Helix at home only, playing at lower volumes. My patches are dialed in for that volume level. I notice that when I play those patches loud I have to redo my settings. On my cabs I put a high cut at 6-7k and 100 at the low end. I get a great guitar tone and feel that way. A modeller isn’t going to sound quite the same as a live amp and it’s not intended to. I’m quite happy with my Helix and my frfr speakers but it took me some time to get there.
That is 100 percent correct. I live out in the country and I am able to play pretty dang loud. Im just a guitar hobbyist, so I don't play live, but I can get the Fractal to sound and feel almost identical to my real amps. I would imagine if your playing through headphones and then going to a tube amp, there would be a bigger difference.
Little late to the party but this video showed up in my feed and I couldn't agree more with most of what you're saying. I think back to when I was a young teenager listening to all of this metal in the 90s and none of that was listen to through any amplifier it was through a crappy radio in my bedroom or the car. When I started to play guitar I didn't really understand how all of this stuff worked and would try so hard to reproduce the tone that I was hearing through a stereo system from my guitar amp and could never understand why I would fail repeatedly... Fast forward 20 years
... I'm not a quick learner I was still trying to do the same thing cuz I didn't understand.... I have a evh 5150 stealth along with a Mesa Boogie triple Crown... I also have a quad cortex and an FRFR cabinet. I realize now if I want to play along with backing tracks in my basement studio then the quad cortex and the FRFR are almost a guaranteed best choice. It can reproduce the studio quality sound that is pristine and exactly what will fit into the mix perfectly. If I turn on my evh amp I can get pretty close but typically I find myself overpowering the studio monitors because the guitar amp itself is just so much more powerful. I used to switch back and forth from modeling to amps, in some sort of frustrated dance to try to get what I was after. Now I have found peace I have found my zen... I have both! It's just a matter of when to use which tool for the job you are after
You missed a very important piece of the puzzle. Expecting every user to have very high fidelity monitor speakers that also play loud is a big presumption. On the other hand, virtually everyone playing professionally has IEMs they know. That’s the perfect way to refine a reference IR as everyone has had the phones experience and they can play loud enough to be relevant.
I learned to love even my $200 set of Guitar Center Sterling 8”ers and I was fully convinced for nearly 2 years that I could not do frfr
so what frfr speaker would you use for a rock band live gig ? what is used in this episode?
My go -to for a while has been the QSC k10 (used here- although you are not hearing the speakers). The k10 has plenty of headroom and dispersion to be used as a stage monitor for guitar. Ideally, you'll want to use something >100W for clean headroom with a drummer. In my experience you can get good results with either an 8", 10" or 12" speaker size. Just look for enough watts of power and a good dispersion pattern (the k10 has a 90º spread as opposed to the 75º spread of the k12)
@@mathew_dale thanks man this helps a ton
Great vid! Thank you so much!
I can't help but see the writing on the wall and assume that eventually old-school tube amps will slowly disappear.
I recently switched to the Boss GX100 modeler, from a heavy tube amp, and I couldn't be happier.
My back is a lot happier, too.
Now, when I visit my band buddy in Seattle, or we fly out to do a gig, I just pack my GX100 into carry-on and check in my guitar.
That's it! 🤟
I plug my GX into the FOH and in-ears. Abodda boom, abodda bing. Ready to rock! Sounds great!
I have an old-school friend. He's been playing for over 30 years. He detests modelers and says he will never give up his tube amp. He lugs that heavy ass thing around.
I say "Have fun with that, buddy!".
Thanks for watching! The convenience factor is huge for modelers!
so, i set up the ir's to have a low cut from 150Hz and high cut at 7KHz so as to get them to sound real. or a global eq with same cuts, this would apply to all Ir's if you change ir's. As far as FRFR's go, they are a pre-tuned speaker to sound as flat as possible, however, you get frequencies that stand out strong on certain every different stage/room. hence an eq still is worth considering to fix room sound.
That's kinda why I like using a PEQ after the cab- I do the heavy cuts on the lows and highs then leave the other bands to edit for the room. I'm typically a "one preset per gig" type player, but if you use multiple presets on a gig then the global makes a lot of sense.
@@mathew_dale me too.
Having just nabbed an Ampero Stomp and a Headrush FR108 for the practice room and wondering if it was meant to sound...well...meh. Now I know its just dialing in...
I don't even worry about it. I don't even use guitar amps.
Namely because guitar amp speakers are frequency range limited.
Notably the old marshals. We would simply disconnect the speaker and run the speaker wires to some 3 way 5x9 car speaker to get the range back.
Remember, in the right hands a $50.00 Harmony Sunburst or GS1 guitar can sound like a $5000.00 guitar. If you want more confidence use the Fender SS/1000 super strat.
good info. I recently took my fm3 and Friedman frfr to a rehearsal and immediately my sound was almost lost in the mix. the little fender practice amps others had sounded better! I'm still trying to find the balance of tones to work in the studio, rehearsal with a frfr cab, and live on stage; straight into front of house mix board.
Thanks for watching! In addition to what I discussed in the video, remember that tones that sound the best when playing by yourself rarely sound good in a mix. The magic is in the midrange and scooping too much out will leave you lost (not saying you are doing this, but just as a general principle). You could also apply a global EQ with a boost around 1K for added presence in a mix throughout all your presets.
CHRIST ! F*ING EXCELLENT VIDEO !
You wouldn't imagine of how much "mind f*" you'd actually go through when you just can't afford to buy all possible equipment just to test it and have a precise idea of simply "WHAT YOU ACTUALLY WANT".
Now, when you have such a nice and simply put out explanatory presentation such as this video, that greatly helps.
The "reverb" thing ... you need to think of PERCEIVED SPACE in your sound. A simple example : you have just one tone, let's say a nice 70s rock tone of your liking, you play your rhythm with a little bit of reverb and at a slightly lower level (-3dB for instance) so your rhythm blends nicely with the rest of the band and brings a nice spacious ensemble sound ... then, for your solo, you go up 3dB (or even more to be right in front) and with the exact same tone, but you switch the reverb off, and maybe add some very short slapback echo in the mix just to have the sensation of "the walls getting closer to you" and "the room shrinking", and all of a sudden you're guitar is "right in the face", it gets really aggressive, no space, no perception of room, no "escape".
Listen to a song like "Cold Turkey" from John Lennon, for instance, and you'll have a great example of how you can actually "perceive space" with the very contrast-full mix of that song. In that song everything contributes to that suffocating feeling (the drums tone, the slapback, the guitar without reverb, etc), and in the end it "opens up", and you have that feeling that you can finally breathe again.
You explained this extremely well man! Thank you! 10/10 recommend
I have a line 6 Powercab whenever I use it I always run 75 Hz to 5000 Hz but like you said if you don’t play loud enough it’s gonna sound boxy and dull
The Fractal sounds better than actual amps to me
The Tone master FRFR 12 is pretty good....The Headrush FRFR is the worst sheet I ve ever listened too.
When I use the Axe Fx 3 to record, I always use Adams monitors. I usually added a filter block after the cab to do the same similar blocking as you did with the Parametric. Definitely going to try that. For the amp in the room, I use my EVH 5150 iii…it is a different experience for sure. I have also turned off the cab/power amp modeling & used the AxeFx through the return of the EvH, & that is pretty awesome!!! Great video
Unless you have a dedicated sub in a FRFR system - board monitors or wedge - you aren't going to get anything near 20hz. Even dedicated bass rigs won't deliver much of anything flat below 50hz
I'm 52 so I instantly cut down to 10k because anything above that I cant hear anyway. If it was spikey above that I wouldn't know but others would. Thanks Mathew great content.
Thanks for watching! Experiment with even going down further to 5 or 6K I used to cut to 10k thinking that would be plenty before hearing some harsh high end content at live volumes. 5-6K seems to be the sweet spot for me. Cheers!
I have been so dissappointed with my kemper, but just hooked up my 2 marshalls, and put a mic on it. Played it through my PA and they sound identical😂 so i will use my kemper from now on haha. I do not have frfr tho, used a yamaha dxr10. My origin50 and dsl40cr miced up sounds exactly like my kemper stage. And by that i mean it has that same buzz sort of sound thay i havent liked with the kemper.. sounds sort of digital kind of, but i realised the amps also have this when they are mic'ed up..
Great observation! A guitar speaker cab in a room and one mic'd up sound very different and this is the biggest thing to understand moving into an FRFR environment. It's less about analog and digital, and more about amp to ears and amp to mic to PA speakers to ears.
Regarding amps, lots of amp brands sound unique by default, but just because it's an amp, it is in no way automatically superior to a properly modelled amp simulation or vice versa either, some amps including some of the more expensive or boutique types don't always reproduce specific guitar tones as well as most think, most require toys attached to improve their ability, I personally think a lot of amp manufacturers are not quite always up to their marketing of their products including some who make modellers, great tone will always be great tone, but the particular guitar used obviously plays a large part in obtaining great tone for live use or recording use too.
Some of us, guitar players, are really dumb. Why would anyone with an ounce of intelligence buy a modeller and then run it via a guitar amp and a guitar cabinet. It's like buying a vintage tube amp and then use a crapload of tools to remove the deficiencies of a vintage tube amp.... OK, I'll show myself out.
Basically, FRFR cab is just your re-badged PA speaker, with higher price tag, same quality/design/construction.
Lol, yup- Kinda why I prefer my QSC k series
@@mathew_dale I'm getting a used QSC CP8. Is it any good for modellers? I'll be using my Headrush Prime with it.
So do these fractal IR tones work with other modelers like Valeton GP 200
J’ai arrêter à 10 mns blabla et rien ! Merci va boire un verre d’eau tu m’as donner soif man 😅
Martinez Helen Moore Matthew Thompson Patricia
You do t want amp in the room you want cd quality sit in the mix tone and the time that comes out of the frfr speaker you have will come out of the pa at the show
Why not just do the aggressive cuts in the Cab block itself?
Yes!
Yep, totally could do that as well- just showing another way. I also usually have my favorite IR's saved in the Block Library with those settings pre-dialed in for quick set-ups. So separating the aggressive stuff on a PEQ gives me more flexibility if I want to dial in something for home/ quite use or for loud/live where the PEQ gives me additional control.
@@mathew_dale Thanks.
Convenience nothing, I want the same sound live that I get from my studio. FRFR can give me that
I think you're right.
I have manage to reduce my stuff using a Mooer ge250+ Hb gpa100 + marshall 1960 412 ( band) or peavey bandit 112 speaker (home) . I have then a cheap rig but huge possibilities of sounds and use (home/ band training/live)
I have never tried FRFR exept xlr connection to monitoring table (band) sharing the singer frequencies through sprakers... So i finally prefer to have my own guitar speakers in my back 😊
Great video. I have an AXE FX III AND I also have a McCarty 594 (Two of them actually, an SC and a Hollowbody II, AND a real Fender Twin. Haha. Also I usually run thru studio monitors. I am paying attention to this, because I've got the same gear as you, and love the tone you're getting.
Thanks for watching! We sound like kindred spirits!
FRFR's also sound different depending on the speaker sizes. I've seen 110, 210, 112, and 212 versions. The tone, especially the bass response, still has to be adjusted to the room. A studio with carpeting will sound much different than a club with tile floors.
Absolutely! No getting around room variance.
I tried some digital solutions to my guitar playing and I must admit they didn't really convince me. But I'm now realizing my approach had critical flaws, both in my expectations and in the setup I was using. This video further confirms that and points me to possible solutions.
On the first, and please correct me if I'm wrong but this kind of setup will never feel like a traditional guitar amp and cabinet, it will feel as a recording of it. Which isn't bad at all, it's just a different expectation. I will still prefer the analog way, but many times that won't be practical and carrying around tons of gear for no purpose is just dumb.
On the second, it was completely foolish on my part to feed the output of a modeler into a guitar amp and cabinet, or more generally trying to deal with the modeler output as if it was an analog device. I don't even know what I was thinking on those. I wasn't. 😵💫
Thank you for the great presentation, you made everything abundantly clear.
I love frfr. My guitar sounds the same wherever I stand in the room
excellent vid, clear, concise, easy to understand and really well presented, subbed 👊😎. Jst getting to grips with axe fx 3 and this is a really useful find, will be watching the rest of your tutorials, thanks for sharing, peace ❤🙏
Thanks for watching and the sub! Glad to have you along for the journey!
Here I have been thinking about this and coming to your channel enlightened me. An understanding of what I’m looking for. Never used a modeler nor FRFR but thinking this is the future. A bit late to the party @71….🤣
Nice and precise explanations and a very clear understanding now than before, I instantly subscribed after the first 5 minutes of watching this video. I use the Strymon Iridium but all the points about the speaker types etc. Where an eye opener. Great channel.
Thanks for watching and I'm glad you enjoyed and got something out of it!
Great vid mate! I remember when i was educated on stage by a very versed engineer about Monitor Speakers and Guitar Speakers and how he tweaked it to have the tonal quality of a cabinet. The difference was night and day, since then my go to has always been 100/120HZ and 6khz. Great work man!
Thanks so much for watching! I been following your channel for a few years now. You've helped me with the GT1000 immensely. I enjoy your content and thank your watching one of my videos! Cheers!
This will be great content to watch! I'm a complete noob and I got a tonex, so I've been low balling a headrush 12" and I have no idea how to configure such speaker lol
Thank you, love the technical details. Just bought a used FM9, sadly my electric is getting a set up I should get it back 2maro. I’m currently playing my Taylor 810ce in a factory preset blackface “normal” clean and it sounds great. I’m using a pair of headrush frfr 108’s. Really happy so far, I’m sure that assessment will go up when I get my electric back for a real test.
Sorry, I’m on preset #4 “normal”
The headrush 108 need their frequency curve being flatened, they (and other speakers too) are far from flat.
❤ thx so much Exploit wise information
I saw a similar video with a helix user. I however am using the ancient line 6 hd500x with its stock cabs. The amp eq, parametric , and room reverb tips make ALL the difference for me . Taming that low end and also using your ears instead of your eyes will put your tone in a better place for you, your band, and your sound guy. Great video.
Thanks for watching! Those older line 6 units still sound great!
I agree if it sounds good and close what your going for cool you know ears differently big part I have headrush gigboard and I'm going get couple headrush frfr 8ich ones I love stereo sound
Why double EQ? Doesn’t the shelving filter in Cab Block do the same thing as PEQ in the way you have it set?
Just showcasing two methods... It's also not a bad idea to do the "general cuts" in the cab block for studio and quieter playing environments, then using the PEQ for more aggressive cuts and notches for louder playing. Bypassing or engaging the PEQ block gives you an easy way to bounce between settings.
Very nice old wooden machinist toolbox behind you. I had one back in the sixties very much like that one. I'm guessing yours was your dads or more likely your grandfather's.:) Great video much needed for modeler users.
Antique shop actually, but I love it. Great for pedals, cables, guitar parts, strings and other random guitar stuff! Thanks for watching.
Mathew, thank - great job. I'm considering FRFR in my studio as I've sold my last heavy Mesa MK V tube amp and I'm going the modeling route (after decades of lugging heavy amps). Did I understand you correct, with FRFR monitors by placing them on the floor slight up angle (a few inches elevated), with tone dialed will provide the best "amp" recreated sound versus flat on floor? Cheers!
That's really tough to say as there are many factors. I use my FRFRs on the floor and angled up and enjoy that but to say that it is a direct 1:1 with "amp in the room" isn't the most accurate statement. If you want "amp in the room" with the convince of modeling the best thing is to have a cabinet loaded with guitar speakers powered by a neutral power amp- plug the modeler into the power amp.
I use my Helix with one single amp and one single amp (just like I would in the old days). Then I just use Helix as my pedal board (with some more flexibility).
Thanks for this video and sharing your knowledge. This made me a subscriber. Clear and concise information here. Thank you. I use modelers and it has always been trial & error. This video has helped to shake out a lot of the issues I was having and being a lot together even more for.
Glad this helped! Thanks!
Very interesting stuff, thanks for doing the homework on this, a lot! Of time and effort on your part- top bloke 👍
It's cleared my head on eq a bit more, realising the definition of full range of frequencies and what I don't need when dialling in a patch for a digital modeler with use on a speaker cab- it's been the bain of my existence for a while now, but now im feeling refreshed, re educated and ready to get back to it! Keep up the good work, you're making a difference, that matters A LOT!! ❤️
Thanks so much!
You need to cut the low and high freq so it sits in mix better
Best FRFR are the Red sound, did you ever tried?
But.. why doesn't the amp modeler automatically roll off the frequencies of the cabinet that it's emulating? Isn't that the FRIGGIN POINT? Not much of a cabinet simulation if it passes frequencies that the real speaker doesn't. 🤷
Remember that there is still a mic chain within the IR so the lower frequencies in some of the IRs could be a result of that. It's all about control. That's like saying why don't mixers all have a pre-set roll off at 100hz. Many input sources like mics and other instruments will need that 100k roll off but it may not be ideal for every situation. It's better to be able to control your equipment than it control you. Even if you mic up at live cab, an engineer would still be doing similar cuts at the board.
@@mathew_dale i get that but you'd think there would only be negligible amounts of those frequencies in the IR if it was an accurate representation of the speaker. At any rate, the manufacturers of modeling hardware and software should know better. If i have to apply EQ in a signal chain that I normally wouldn't have to, well, the modeler isn't doing its job.
One thing I never understood is if the guitar speaker only ranges 100-5000k, why would a mic’d up
Cabinet or even an IR made with a mic produce any frequencies outside that range? The frequencies aren’t even there for a mic to pick up both in modeling and live miking.
I’ve wondered that as well and I’m not sure why either. Just something that happens when going full range I guess…
This has been really helpful bro, many thanks for your efforts!
Glad it helped!
As an older player , I’m kinda new to the world of digital guitar amplification, and I have a question. I've been experimenting with some alternatives to my traditional pedalboard into amp rig as it’s becoming more difficult for me to lug it all to gigs. I got a good deal on an Frfr speaker (Its an Alesis which is half the weight of my amp) and running a couple of my pedals into a DI with a cab sim into the Frfr. Sounds pretty good but not sure if it’ll cut it at the gig. I do have a eq pedal that I can put in the chain. Do you think this might work? I also have a Tonex One on the way to experiment with.
Thanks !
Really depends on a few things. You mentioned a DI with a cab sim. Which one?what are you using for amp tones? Keep in mind that the electric guitar as an instrument is three things- guitar, amp/ speaker, and effects, and frfr is none of those. Frfr just makes things louder. Are you hoping to send your signal to both the house and your FRFR together. Ideally, you’d want the FRFR for your stage volume and monitoring and send a separate signal to the house. You should never mic an frfr like a guitar cab. Keep those things in mind and it should yield good results!
Thanks for the input and advice. Much appreciated. Just to answer a couple of the questions and give a more clear picture of my experiment, the DI is an inexpensive Mooer Micro DI that I use with my acoustic. For amp tones I was using an MXR 5150 and Wampler Plexi Drive. I’m excited to see what the Tonex does when I get it!
Allen Matthew Walker Sarah White William
My question is, can I run my pedals straight into the frfr PA speakers without needing IRs, computers, etc ..., and just adjust my eq through my pedals. I have a multi effect pedals that I just want to plug into the Frfr pa speaker and adjust the EQ through the multi effect pedal. I just want quick simplicity. Is this doable or will it sound bad? It's been forever since I've been in the guitar world and am trying to catch up and do it simple as possible
Yep that’s definitely possible if your multi-effect has amp and cab modeling. The cab modeling or IRs really make the biggest difference. You can get similar amp-like tones from drive pedals, but having something for cab sounds is extremely important when going direct. What multi-effect are you using?
@@mathew_dale I'm looking at getting a zoom g1x four, Donner Arena 2000, headrush mx5, or the line 6 pod go. Have any experience with any of them? Which one would you suggest
Very informative video. I have 2 Headrush FRFR 108 connected stereo to my Quad Cortex. Its been a struggle to reduce the boominess (super heavy bass) I have used the Global EQ on QC to cut the the low end frequencies . I have also added EQ in my rigs to attenuate the 200Hz to 400Hz region. Yet, the boominess remains. My FRFRs are on the floor on 2" thick foam and one is in a corner. Any suggestions ?
Try moving it away from the corner. Bass frequencies build up there.
@@mathew_dale Thanks for the response. I ended up buying Bass Traps from foambymail. This made a spectacular difference in my home studio. Looks like my issue was the lower frequencies bouncing all around. Cheers !!
New FM3 user here. Been browsing a ton of videos but still not getting the answer I’m looking for. May have missed it here.
A power cab will deliver the more traditional feel of playing with an amp while the FRFR will deliver a better listening experience for the listener/studio/engineer right? Im trying to figure out what to get to have more fun and feel at home off phones.
So, the Powercab can actually function both ways (allegedly). You can set it to be FRFR and use IRs from a modeler, or you can set it to emulate a certain speaker- this is different from an IR as there is no mic capture- So you get a more "Amp-in-the-room' feel. If you are usually playing at home, I'd go with the Powercab.
I have 2 head rush 108 frfr. Sounds great at low volume. At high volume they fart or clip. It forces me to bring the lows down on my zoom g6, the the sound off love is gone (to much high) if I buy bigger powered speakers will that fix it?
Possibly. Allegedly, the headrush 108s are 2000W peak which should be enough headroom for pretty loud playing. A couple things to try: Run the output volume on the Zoom lower and the 108 volume higher to see if that changes anything at the same loudness level you are wanting. If not, try swapping that around- lower 108, higher Zoom. If both are pretty maxed maybe try placement- sometimes low frequencies buildup near walls and corners. It would also be good to try out as many other speakers as you can- I've been hearing very good things about the QSC cp8, I love my k10s and k12s. Or, if you can, try the headrush 112 with all the same settings and see if the bigger speaker does the trick. Hope this helps!
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Could you tell me if the headrush will let my piezo from my majesty guitar actually sound like an acoustic? I got rid of my guitar amp cause I was told it’s mid range and it chokes off any high sounds made from acoustic? Thank you so much Mat
Quick question: headrush pedal board or headrush FRFR? Either way the answer is still yes (with an asterisk). A guitar amp and cab have a pretty limited frequency response (which is what we want for electric). The headrush pedalboard can process a signal from a piezo like you would an acoustic (adding eq and compression like on a mixer). The FRFR can reproduce the fuller spectrum you’d want to amplify an acoustic guitar. Bonus tone points: use an acoustic guitar IR to help the piezo on a solid body sound closer to a full bodied acoustic guitar.
Mathew I'm trying to load irs to my l6 powercab and I'm using the right requirements for the irs and all and have no prob with adding them to. Helix but when try on p/c edit the irs won't open files to load , I've tried quite a few diff ir packs and im using wave files with correct requirements, it seems my p/c doesn't recognize the files as.loadable do you have any ideas thank you
Interesting. I don't have much experience with the PowerCab. Wish I could be of more help. Best of luck!
Dude, is that a Cold shirt?
Buying an FRFR amp to play using digital emulation of a tube amp? What´s next? Buying an electric car?
Lol. I guess using a modeler with a tube amp would be like a hybrid then...
@@mathew_dale What I don't like about the digital emulation of tube sound is the latency, no matter how low it may be, it affects, which is why at a given moment I wouldn't mind using it in the studio, applying it after recording, but I don't like using it while playing. nothing, and if it is a minimally considerable latency it affects me when playing, so if I am going to use it in recordings, I record clean and apply it later. But wow, there is nothing like a real tube amp, even though it is more laborious to get a good sound and once recorded you cannot modify any of the amp's parameters, that is the magic.
I’ll never understand this confusion because the laws of physics don’t care what you’re playing through-the sound can and WILL still change depending on VOLUME, size of room, and distance between sound and ear, period! Doesn’t matter if is an FRFR speaker or a guitar cab or when monitoring a mic’d cab through a preamp, and some monitors then processed, mastered and played through a sound system; the sound cannot escape the laws of physics. It’s just a circle jerk between speaker and audio equipment manufacturers tell you that look, “this is what you need because it’s “flat” and everything can sound like anything…through THIS!”
It just comes down to functionality and practicality, meaning that if you’re throwing hundreds of different sounds at a sound system it only makes sense to have a “flat” starting point. Why guitarists want to have anything to do with this is beyond my realm of understanding lol, other that the whole “it translates better and is less directional” guff.
All good points, which is why I prefer to use PA type speakers (QSC k10s and k12s) as opposed to the more common and sought after FRFRs like the Friedmans and Atomic CLRs. Those are certainly awesome, but I want to dial in tones akin to what I'll be plugging in to.
I've been playing my Kemper through some Dynaudio studio monitors for years, and just picked up the Headrush FRFR-108 and hate it. The headrush sounds so muffled. I will pick up my tele and put it on a clean channel, and it sounds like a blanket is over the speaker. I find myself having to drop the mids, blast the treble, and bass varies. Is there a solution for this? It's unreal how bad this sounds compared to the monitors I have been using.
Keep in mind that all speakers are different, or to put it another way, all speakers suck- it's just to what extent. Your monitors are going to be much nicer than the headrush, so for studio use and listening to a mix, that's one thing. If you want to use the headrush live, then making your own presets to accommodate your live speaker situation is a better way to go than dialing in on monitors and hoping for the best when using a PA speaker. Also, don't keep the 108 near a wall and tilted up on the floor- that begs for low-end build up. Could also try messing with the contour switch on the back of the 108.
Mine won't crank. Fractal ax8 and 2 headrush speakers at 2000 watts. And it doesn't get real loud. Kinda sucks.
*sigh* Still trying to figure out whether to purchase a modeler (Quad Cortex) with an FRFR speaker set-I know you can use the Quad Cortex as a Audio Interface-Just can't understand how I would use it (QC) in a live setting.
It is my understanding I would need a set of speaker cabinets (FRFR) to produce the exact sound that the Quad Cortex is producing or plug the QC into the PA?
From what I can understand from this video is that even with any modeler, you end up tweaking the frequencies coming from your modeler to whatever you use-FRFR or out to PA
Help please? Thanks in advance as these questions have kept me on the fence with digital modelers.
Good questions... let's break this into 2 categories: tone shaping and room correction...
While we're shaping our tones in a modeler, it's a good idea to use an FRFR or a flat(ish) PA speaker because it "levels the playing field" so to speak. In most of the gigs I play I hook up my modeler to the PA and I monitor with in-ears or a floor monitor. So in this sense, I can skip bringing the analog pedals, tube amp, and heavy 4x12 in lieu of using the system. So I want to shape my tones with this in mind- selecting a good IR, adjusting amp tones, getting my pedal sounds and other effects in check and doing other EQ tweaks for the sound I want. What I hear out of the FRFR speakers should sound like good guitar tone! And that means I should be getting good tones out of other full range systems- PAs, other FRFR speakers, Mixers, into an interface, etc. This should be a "nearly" fully processed signal that a sound tech doesn't need to adjust- just pull up the fader. So there's a lot of tweaking and dialing in on the front half.
Now, when getting to the gig and you plug into the PA, there should be little to no adjusting on your guitar channel except for room correction. Since my studio is only shaped like my studio and not like any and all venues, my tones might reflect that, even with FRFR. So If I'm playing in a particularly bass heavy room, or I'm shoved in a corner for a wedding I may cut more lows out of my guitar channel. Maybe the dynamics of my preset aren't playing nice with the rest of the band- add a little light compression, and so-on.
Let me know if this helps and feel free to ask more!
@@mathew_dale "This should be a "nearly" fully processed signal" Yessss-I get it now!! :))))
. Now I understand that the "tone" is coming from my Quad Cortex (soon to be purchased)
I thought I needed a "regular" cabinet-NOT SO !! What I want is the sound/tone I have coming from my QC to be, for lack of a better term) True!
I have the "tone" I want in the Quad Cortex-it's just a matter of presenting the "Tone" with no changes (almost) thru a FRFR speaker. I looked at the FRFR speakers at Sweetwater-not really liking what I see as far as aesthetics (most look like floor monitors-some reviews say it becomes "bassy" when on the floor)
I found a company in Germany, contacted the owner and he explained FRFR as well and the difference between a regular head/cabinet setup and an FRFR speaker which in essence is a speaker made for modelers! Plus, they look like a regular cabinet +1 in the looks department!
Problem solved-there goes the bank account:))
I can not even begin to thank you for explaining all this, but Thank you. Wishing you the very best!! Subscribed!!
Hello and thank you for the video. I recently bought a Headrush 108 known for having so many low frequencies. As a result, to compensate I have to make presets on my pedalboard by removing the low tones on the simulation of almost zero amps.
This is not a good thing because if I then go to the PA the sounds are extremely high-pitched and unpleasant. It's like I have to think the other way around when I make my own presets. Not to mention if the sounds, as often happens, I make them in headphones and then listen to them again through Headrush 108. It's frustrating!
I've heard the Headrushes can be very bassy, especially when used in "wedge" orientation on the floor. There can be a bass coupling effect, especially when against a wall or in a corner that can amplify the bass more than it should. I believe there is a high-pass 100 hz filter on the back. Have you tried engaging that? Try pulling them away from walls if they are near that as well.
@@mathew_dale no…on the back there isn’t a bass filter! There is only the contour button that it don’t change this problem.
What if I tried to put the 108 on a stand? Like a speakers …
Worth a shot
I got a Headrush MX5. I love it. Right now I run it into a mixer with my TV and out though my home theater but I think studio monitors would be better. What do you think? Will I get a better sound? Does a home theater stereo not allow certain frequencies to come through? Keep in mind my home theater is JBL with a subwoofer but it’s from the 90s.
I don't know if "better" would be the result, but studio monitors would be a more "accurate" representation of the tones you are creating in the Headrush. Generally, home theater systems want to make everything sound the best they can so a bit of EQ and compression might be involved in the head unit- typically a bit more lows and highs for that Hi-Fi theater experience. If you are primarily a home player and it works for jamming with songs or tracks and you love the sound I'd say you're good and save your money, but if you are playing out you might find that your tones are quite a bit different going through a PA than what you dialed in at home and a lot of adjustment may be needed. Studio monitors (especially good ones) just try to give an honest representation of what being fed to them. I've heard some absolute garbage come out of my monitors because it's bad audio- but it may sound okay through a home entertainment system. Just two different purposes- sound the best or sound the most accurate. Hope this helps!
@@mathew_dale Thank you. That does help. I was suspecting a loss in certain tones when using different effects like phaser and different filter effects. I guess a good comparison would be headphones to see if I hear a difference. If not I’ll save the money. Who am I kidding. I’ll probably buy another guitar 😀
Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge!
Thanks for watching!
Fricken AWESOME Video!!!! Thanks sooo much!!
Glad you liked it!