Solarpunk: Succeeding Where Cyberpunk Failed
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 พ.ค. 2024
- The stories we tell impact our lives in many unexpected ways. In this video we will talk about the most important story yet to be told.
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HUGE thanks to @that5thpuddle and Sam @Afterthoughts for helping out with the video!
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Timestamps:
Intro - 00:00
Brief History of Cyberpunk - 1:55
Aesthetic Commodified - 4:33
So... Why is Solarpunk - Punk? - 8:44
Solarpunk Manifesto - 11:10
Epilogue - 18:02
Sources and Further Readings:
Union Membership and Wealth Inequality - jacobin.com/2021/09/labor-day...
"Techno-Orientalism" and Hollywood's Fear of Asia by @MaiaCVideos - • "Techno-Orientalism" a...
Who Shot Guybrush Threepwood? | Genre and the Adventure Game by @InnuendoStudios - • Who Shot Guybrush Thre...
"Capitalist Realism: Is There No Alternative?" by Mark Fisher (Published by Zero Books)
What Kind Of Game Did Cyberpunk 2077 Turn Out To Be, Anyway? by @broadcaststsatic - • What Kind Of Game Did ...
How Capitalism Destroys Radical Movements by @SecondThought - • How Capitalism Destroy...
Tomorrow's Leaves Short Film - • Tomorrow's Leaves | Ol...
Olivia Louise's Tumblr Post - missolivialouise.tumblr.com/p...
'Dear Alice' Decommodified Edition by @waffletotheleft3443 - • 'Dear Alice' Decommodi...
Solarpunk Manifesto - www.re-des.org/es/a-solarpunk...
COLZA Short Film - • COLZA - Animated Short...
A Psalm For the Wild-Built by Becky Chambers (Published by Tor.com)
The Dark Cost of Electric Cars by @OurChangingClimate - • The Dark Cost of Elect...
15 Minute Cities by @radicalplanning - • 15-Minute Cities for L...
We Need A Library Economy by @Andrewism - • We Need A Library Economy
Why We Need Degrowth by @OurChangingClimate - • Why We Need Degrowth
Imagining a Solarpunk Education by @HumanRestorationProject - • Imagining a Solarpunk ...
Why We Need To Abolish Borders by @Andrewism - • Why We Need To Abolish...
The Myth of the Barter Economy - www.theatlantic.com/business/...
How The Barter Myth Harms Us by @Andrewism - • How The Barter Myth Ha...
Neoliberalism: From Ronald Reagan to the Gig Economy by @Tom_Nicholas - • Neoliberalism: From Ro...
Why It's So Hard To Imagine Life After Capitalism by @SecondThought - • Why It's So Hard To Im...
How To Build A Solarpunk City by @Andrewism - • How To Build A Solarpu...
Planned Obsolescence Will Kill Us All by @unlearningeconomics9021 - • Planned Obsolescence W...
Making Sense of Capitalism by @unlearningeconomics9021 - • Value
The Cyclical Failures of Bethesda's Terrible Writing by @JessieGender1 - • The Cyclical Failures ...
Why We Need Utopias by @OurChangingClimate - • Why We Need More Than ...
Very cool Solarpunk artist - dustinjacobus.com/
Ursula Le Guin's Full Speech - • Ursula Le Guin
Visuals: Terra Nil, Factorio, Cyberpunk 2077, Blade Runner 2049, Ghost in the Shell, Blade Runner, Altered Carbon, Johnny Mnemonic, Tomorrow's Leaves, Dear Alice, COLZA, Love, Death + Robots, Strange World.
Stock Images and Footage provided by Pixabay
Footage Credits:
Factorio Footage by @Nathans-Sandbox
1980's Wall Street Footage by @DavidHoffmanFilmmaker
1980's New York Footage by @VintageLynx
Mortgage Rates News Story by @TheEconomicsArchives
Cyberpunk 2077 Free Roam Footage by @DayDreamGamingTV
Cyberpunk 2077 Kerry Eurodine Questline Footage by @GamesfromMarsYT
Misc Cyberpunk 2077 Footage by @ChristopherOdd
The Beauty of Cyberpunk 2077 by @defendthehouse
Disco Elysium Footage by @myparanoidass2464
Music: First Light (Terra Nil), Blossom (Terra Nil), Title Reveal (Terra Nil), Mud Pits (Rain World), Icarus (Deus Ex: Human Revolution), Sewer Stress (Deus Ex: Human Revolution), 14FC (Cloudpunk), Oxygen (Terra Nil), The Omega Institute (Deus Ex: Human Revolution), Urban Downunder (Cyberpunk 2077), Surface of Gorgon (The Outer Worlds), Groundbreaker (The Outer Worlds), Hearing the Forest (Terra Nil), Clear Water (Terra Nil), Rules of Nature (Metal Gear Rising: Revengance), You Are Not Welcome Here (Pathologic 2), One Night in New Orleans (Norco), CGI Snake (Chris Zabriskie), Ignus Nilsen Waltz (Disco Elysium), Mae (GRIS), Gris Pt.1 (Gris).
#videoessay #solarpunk #cyberpunk #terranil - ภาพยนตร์และแอนิเมชัน
Thank you for watching! If you like what I'm doing consider supporting this channel on Patreon for more essays on storytelling, art, video games and more: www.patreon.com/TheBookofIve
I've been thinking about that...like no wonder we are headed towards a dystopian type future, it's because that's all we can visualise (that's in our collective consciousness). If people can't visualise a different way, we will never get there.
Read capitalist realism
I feel like this phrase would work well in so many circumstances right now 😄
Capitalist Realism by Mark Fisher? @@0skim0 this correct?
Yup, that's the one
@@thebookofive I'll check it out, thank you!
First one and a half of a minute into the video and as soon as the words "what's so punk about trees?" were spoken I already loved it. A very much needed genre covered by a very much needed type of video essay, thank you for this, this is great work!
Thank you for watching!
To anyone interested in solarpunk I'd recommend reading Murray Bookchin, as many of the views espoused by the genre feel like they're drawn directly from his ecology-centric libertarian socialism.
I'd also add Michael Löwy's book Ecosocialism as well
How socialism and libertarianism even go together?
Can you elaborate it?
@nivaldoschmiedel8245 in the most basic terms it rejects both capitalism and private property as well as state ownership by emphasizing mutual aid, common ownership and self-organisation.
Andrewism's video on the Commons illustrates some parts of that: th-cam.com/video/HG4Y8bgUwQ0/w-d-xo.htmlsi=GUrAfVcytaQr88wn
I'm deeply impressed by this video. The amount of work you've put into it is clearly visible and the further reading section only encourages to explore the topic further. You've made wonderful job with this one, I think it's gotta be one of my fave essays (and I watch plenty of those)
I really hope the algorithm will pick it up, this video needs to be watched by much more people
Thank you!
Hollllyyy shit, that ending speech gave me goosebumps
Yes, yes yes! This is one of the best summaries of Solarpunk I have some across in years. It is a movement of sorts that is still finding its footing but everyday it slowly gets a little more stable and capable. It has been said that the reason why capitalism has lasted so long is because many simply do not have a vision or imagination of any other way. For a total lack of this, we just keep doing the same thing everyday because "there is no other way". Solarpunk is an attempt to provide that vision, a future people would actually want rather than fear.
That you mentioned the limited scope of this messaging in mass media is to be expected a little. George Lucas once said that in the 70's he spoke to many film directors in the USSR and found that apart from a few subjects they couldn't touch (critical of the standing government), they were much more free than directors in the US. They didn't have to worry about the entire structure of commercial viability/marketing etc that hollywood has as its backbone. In USSR, they couldn't challenge the political powers. In modern media, you cannot challenge the economic system, for it is the great god of progress and it is looking a little well... fragile...
In the face of political tension, ecological blow back, resource depletion - solarpunk is a vision of another way. A word that we shrink into rather than trying to speed out of. To be the essence of Epicurus - 'If thou wilt make a man happy, add not unto his riches but take away from his desires.'
Holy s%it.
Just. Damn. I've long been a fan of Solarpunk (Ever since I first encountered the concept on that very tumblr post you discussed!) but I couldn't put my fingers on why it resonated so hard. I couldn't put to words why it felt so much more revolutionary and important than other 'punk aesthetics' like steampunk or cyberpunk.
Your editing, your analysis, your details and suggestions for further reading and just -- I can't say I can remember a time a video left me in tears because of *hope* before. Because hope, hope for a better world, a better future, a better alternative ... that's what the difference is. That's what's been missing.
And you nailed it, without even ever once having to utter that word. That word that we so often get chided as being 'foolish' or 'childish' for when we point to fiction as something to aspire for -- hope.
This is only the second video I've seen of yours, the first being "The Other Kind Of Horror" that got randomly recced to me... But I'm absolutely subscribing, already. Just, phenomenal.
My world changed when I realized the dystopian direction of our society. I just couldn't stop seeing the cracks and stupidity in everything within our system.
First came the rage, then the anxiety and I had to sought help to navigate this ocean of feelings. I grew exhausted of the pessimism and then found a new emotion in me: Raw passion.
This is it. I realized we could build wonders. Change. fucking. everything. We can build Solarpunk.
I had quitted my job a year ago in favor of something climate, and began working on electric batteries (I know, huge issues there). I need the financial stability for a while so decided to take a first step literally a month ago. One experiment. A whatsapp community where every Sunday I curate and share uplifting and Solarpunk stuff, in hopes of switching the pessimism paradigm to something bright.
Super small thing, but I'll give it my best as my first forage into something different. I also know that my career will probably take a huge turn towards regeneration and positive impact.
This Video is not only good in it's making, it is touching as well... and the beginning of a rabbit hole or even better, a starting point and resource for the unknowing and untouched. As an artist, I salute you. Thank you.
Thank you for watching!
I've referred this documentary to our book club for background viewing, for when we take up The House of Tomorrow, a novel (and later movie) likewise investigating punk rebelliousness vs technologically developed utopianism.
Solarpunk starts with people gradually practicing it, experimenting what works and what doesn't work.
Start living the way you intent on the practices that work and gradually you can structure a system around the practices so the transition becomes smooth and and acceptable instead of enforcing change and see if people like it or not.
Solarpunk will remain a fiction as long as 1% of the population control 90% of the world's wealth. Governments now need corporate wealth to function too which is why COP24 had world leaders consulting with investors and corporate executives. You could get 99% of the worlds population going green and it wouldn't change a thing because they are a minor part of the world's ecological problems.
I think this video has awaken something in me. Amazing work. You really deserve more views and subcribers, but hey...at least you got one more with me 😊
Thank you!
A very touching video.
Thank you 👍👍👍
Your editing style is soooo satisfying
Thank you!
Very good video, thank you!
Thank you for your video. I hope algorithm picks up your work, and spreads the good word around.
Success.
Thank you for watching!
Second video I watch from your channel and I really love your stuff.
Marvelous work, thank you
Humans can make anything they can dream of. That means both hell and heaven theoretically can exist. We just need to pick a dream and go to work. I love the video btw. :)
Amazing video!
Your accent gives the essay a lot of personality. I love it.
i love this video essay
So much food for thought, thank you for putting together such a comprehensive and uplifting video essay! Loved the editing as well, looking forward to future content :D
Thank you for watching!
good video, commenting for algorithm!
new sub
I was into looking into some Solarpunk stories and seeing how it can be expressed only to find thousands of explanations and solutions with no plots and only exploring old worlds.
I was sad to find that only Strange World was the only story with a plot that's not seeing some old building or society.
As I said in the video, the genre is comparatively young, but you can check out The Monk & The Robot books if you feel like it. These are fully realised stories with a ton of character and great writing
nice
❤❤❤
All valid, but you got to start somewhere. So start there, try your best and share with everyone you know! Comment for the algo! 🌍❤🌱
Is adventure time solar punk
CyberPunk is a knock off of SteamPunk while SolarPunk IS SteamPunk only better and greener
I'm tired of the doomerisms too.
And yeah- most reactions lately are trying to "adress the symptom not the cause".
Yeah, can't have the all good without the bad- as there is no light without a shadow, but we can mitigate and make the shadow natural instead of the bleak something that "has to be there because we don't know what we would do without it"
It's interesting that the idea "you can't have the good without the bad" is something we essentially have come up with to explain our current system, but it's not a universal truth. Like, having everyone fed doesn't need to be balanced out by some other negative consequences. I think Ursula Le Guin talked about that particular fallacy
@@thebookofive I agree on that.
But my point was about the fact that we can make things better, but there still will be some dissatisfied, but it still will be a better option than what we have now- where minimal part is satisfied in expense of everyone else living in shit.
(I mainly think of the 1% when I speak of the some dissatisfied- they always will be dissatisfied when others are happy, because it cuts their power)
I think that I've always perceived the saying from a more objective, or at least more broad, point of view.
For instance, everyone can be fed, yes.
But in order for everyone to be fed, at least some people will have to do the work to either gather/forage, cultivate & harvest, or hunt & then prepare that food... & no matter how one slices it, life forms will have to die for that sustenance.
So, perhaps we ought to reframe our perceptions from seeing it as the good & the "bad" to the good & the necessary?
And we can also remember that some people enjoy the foraging, cultivating, & hunting.
What it all boils down to after that is ethics; to experience & express deep gratitude for those who lose their lives (including plant life) because it is necessary for us to take it if we wish to continue living our own.
Because all life & experience has meaning & importance, & we should not take it for granted by behaving as though the lives & deaths of the life forms that become our food are just some small, menial thing.
This is why I think that ethical, sustainable/regenerative, & high-quality animal husbandry, foraging, hunting/ fishing/etc., & agriculture/gardening, & food production practices should be of much higher importance to all.
@@masterzoroark6664
This may be true, but do you think that would be lessened if things like parenting, developement, life skills, pedagogy, mental health, self-care, communication/interaction, community, & understanding others became reframed with a goal to strive towards the healthy, positive, evidence & knowledge based best practices for each of those categories?
@@RuinedTemple yeah, that's the way- changing the goals of life from just "money and clout" into the ones about what you said- carring about people with whoom you interact, how you and them can do things together not how one can explot the other for the longest without the other calling them out.
I phrased that "light and dark" bit wrong- yes, you can't please everybody, there will always be someone who's annoyed, but it's better that the annoyed one is someone who's major gripe is that they can't abuse others for self gain rather than the person who's unhappy being the person abused for someone elses gain.
Ask some, "If old tea is used tea, what is old ink?" When they say " used ink," it sounds like "You stink." You got yourself!
why THE FUCK was this ridiculously loud music at minute 14 for? awful choice
Build new alternate good strong smart renewable ageless beautiful eco friendly green sustainable solarpunk immortal utopian resilient peaceful safer healthier anachronistic future ❤
Make humans animals parents grandparents siblings and entire earth young new and immortal permanently
0:57 It _is_ originated from Cyber- _and_ Steampunk, but [word]punk just became a general description of an alternate universe based on [word].
Wolfenstein and FF7 are Dieselpunk
Mad Max is Oilpunk/Steelpunk
Fallout and Atomic Heart are Atompunk
Starfield is meant to be, but fails at being, Nasapunk
Bioshock is Decopunk with a touch of Dieselpunk
Wrought Flesh is Biopunk in as literal a sense as possible
The Hearts of Iron 4 mod, Kaiserreich, is Kaiserpunk
etc.
I could even say that games like Dead Island II, GTA6 and other similar wacky but realistic worlds are Floridapunk, or something
It really doesn't require punk-ness
I am aware of that, but I think this is a very surface-level understanding of the word, similarly to how the word "-core" is slapped onto everything nowadays.
I mean, half of those supposed punk-genres make zero sense outside of "sounding cool"
The irony is that Cyberpunk lost it's edge as it became closer to reality. Entertainment is largely about escapism but immersing yourself in a world of economic disparity, social collapse, corporate and government corruption where technology is deeply ingrained into cultural norms to the point of dependancy is no different to what you see all around you today - minus the cybernetics.
Solarpunk is certainly undefined in every regard except in it's rebellion against the modern world. But people asking for art nouveau are missing the point. The goal is to represent the exact opposite of the world around us not just embracing an aesthetic which came about in rebellion of the industrial revolution. We live in cities of metal and stone so just because you reshape that into a old asthetic is as hypocritical as singing about corporate corruption while under their control.
In my opinion, Solarpunk needs to be organic. Through and through. Stone replaced by Ebony. Metal replaced by Ivory. Sharp angles giving way to curves. Poverty replaced with abundence. Cities reduced to towns and countries devolved into states. High life, low tech. Maybe even no tech, but rather readily avaiilable biotech but essentially a place were capitalism is impossible because the infrastructires it depends upon are gone.
I wouldn't go too harsh on the art nouveau bit, since it was one of the first public mentions of solarpunk, so of course having almost a decade of discussions in hindsight we can see the faults in that argument, but I do believe that it was made with sincerity.
Personally, I would say that 'no tech' is a bit extreme, but we definitely need to rethink the way it is being built and utilised (which again ties to the larger socio-economic problem), but as a whole I do agree with you.
@@thebookofive Keep in mind that art nouveau came about for capitalist and commercial reasons. There was a general attitude among consumers that manufacturered items were of less value and the industrial technology of the time was not capable of asymetric, organic forms therefore craftsman deliberately adopted this style to increase the perceived value of their products. That is why adopting this aesthetic for Solarpunk is hypocritical. If they wanted to look back for inspiration then the Romanticism movement of tte early 1800s shares similar ideology as Solarpunk but in all honesty why is a forward looking ideology trying go draw inspiration from ways of thinking that got us into this mess to begin with? Especially drawing upon attitudes and ideas cultivated during the rise of industry?
As for "no tech" keep in mind that I'm talking electronics and other technology that is made of or uses non-biodegradable or finite materials. The Iron Age was actually quite recent and humanity thrived on Stone Age technology but I'm suggesting that advanced bio-technology is the solution here not a reversion to neolithic ways of life. A no-tech society would basically be free of electronics and fossil fuels resulting in the end of factories and mass production, the end to billions of acres of land covered in asphalt and concrete , the decentralisation of government, the return of land to people so they can provide for their needs without national or global financial systems and the inevitable collapse of capitalism and corporate power.
Good luck living in the cave and depending on weather
@@user-qh2ir7nb4o Humans have been living in man-made caves for thousands of years and have always been at the mercy of their climate. The problem these days is thatm unlike our ancestors, most don't have the luxery of just up and relocating if the local circumstances turn into a living nightmare.
Cyberpunk isn't just about the dystopia. It's about those who rebel against it. The protagonists of cyberpunk stories are invariably in opposition to the hyper-capitalist, inequality-plagued, corporate-focused system. They aren't always motivated by idealism, they might be entirely self-interested, but they'll always be fighting 'The Man' in some manner. The escapism element is "This sucks, but no matter how bad it may be there are still people who will fight against it."
Solarpunk, in its core concept is still a dystopian future, far darker than cyberpunk.
>large-scale deindustrialization and degrowth across the former First World to meet "climate goals"
>permitted industries in undisclosed locations focus on maintaining state control (weapons, surveillance, law enforcement, etc)
>"green energy" proves greatly inferior in power input compared to now-banned fossil fuels, necessitating an overall drop-off in living standards
>said "green energy" also requires access to scarce resources in the Third World, leaving room for kino proxy wars
>vast tracts of farmland and suburbs emptied out for "rewilding", resulting in food shortages and exodus to already-crowded "walkable cities"
>available food are almost entirely either plant-based or ze bugs grown in a few hydroponics facilities
>the average citizen lives in a rented pod in a mixed-use urban area overgrown with weeds like in some abandoned Rust Belt town
>most income sources are either Grubhub-style gig work in the service sector, hyperinflated digital UBI, or the black market (typically in red meat or gasoline)
>decades-old technology are constantly (and often illegally) refurbished for their superior performance and lack of state-mandated backdoors
>depopulation and sterilization to "stop climate change" strongly promoted via state policy and mass media
>mass media also distracts the masses through pornography and ADHD-inducing "sludge" content, as do decriminalized drugs
>a small circle of Wall Street and City of London "philanthropists" puppet-strings not only all corporations and state lobbies, but also academia, NGOs, and social institutions
>every formal organization, for-profit or non-profit, advances the "Great Reset" launched by monopoly capital
>the original "utopian" solarpunk is in fact in-universe propaganda to promote the "New Normal" ideology
Where exactly are you getting these points? I feel like you kinda misunderstood what the whole genre is about.
No he knows what solar punk really is
Just accept that comunism will never work because it has no possibility in reality
@thebookofive no I understand, but what solarpunk dosen't understand is the nature of humanity
@@thebookofiveno he does understand what solar punk really is
Just accept that comunism will never work
@@thebookofive One thing that's always been curious to me about typical portrayals of solarpunk is the absence of any kind of mass industrial technology and infrastructure. Sure, there are the community gardens, artisanal workshops, etc. all sprinkled with elements of high-tech and green-tech. But - as I am sure I don't need to explain - this by itself could never be a sustainable material basis. Civilized life as we know it, no matter the mode of production and distribution, cannot go without a great deal of economy of scale and division of labour. Not that these could not be made much more ecologically sustainable than they currently are, or that some - like animal agriculture - might be better upended or replaced all together.
But I do have to wonder why I never see solarpunk visions for things like mass waste disposal, mineral extraction, chemical and electronics production and recycling, etc. Only ever the domestic, residential or municipal sphere are being portrayed as though they could be omnipresent, or magically suffuse mass industry and infrastructure.
Especially the "solar" in solarpunk is sorta ironic given how notoriously hard it is to recycle solar panels and electronics in general. Not to argue against solar panels ofc; it's just kinda funny in light of the perfect tonal levity of solarpunk with all its electronic gadgeteering.
Given the primary urgency of climate change - which is almost entirely a challenge of political economy rather than technology - it is almost like many have forgotten that some of the less urgent ecological crises (like metal mining and e-waste for example) are in fact very much technological challenges still, which - in lieu of a scientific miracle - will likely stay with us, maybe forever. And so I get the impression that many forsee some sudden, idyllic harmony with nature if only fossil capitalism will finally be overcome.
I certainly cannot and frankly do not want to imagine a future which sacrifices mass electronics and all the digital amenities that come with it, and neither seem those giddy about solarpunk. Yet they don't seem to contend with the ecological comprise implied by that tho.
And fine, I feel like that should not be the responsibility of something that merely understands itself as an aesthetic. But it seems like many on the online Left want to make it out as more than that. And not to get on a high horse, but I get the vibe that those most excited about solarpunk tend to be the more bohemian, less-STEM-brained types. And bless their soul, we need those types, just maybe not as civil engineers and the like.
The failure of solar punk is it illiteracy about infrastructures, with a straw capitalism as a target. We need a slight revision of solarpunk to combat current dystopia.
What do you suggest should be revised exactly?
@@thebookofive **infrastructure**, stuff like hard number about human waste management, recycling cycle, production chain, all the stuff we take for granted but are abstracted by capitalism. All these solar punk dream start were those thing are taken cared off magically, especially at scale.
The fact you ask despite me clearly pointing to the term: 'infrastructure', is the problem, you aren't able to see the elephant in the room, which enabled by another invisible elephant, industrialism. How else you would get those fancy high tech renewable contraception, with the local craftsmen? If so, how are you going to do it without taxing local resources if available, that's a big if, resources tend to be very localized, good luck finding the lithium to power these clean electric machine. Resources availability is an artifact of current capitalist structure, because the main power of this system is abstraction of sources and scaling efficiency.
Solar punk is not a goal, it's an aesthetic, not a practice, that's the problem. Most experiment that look good are really just green washing the future, because those who works only do do because parasite the current system, for example there would be nothing to recycle if the current system didn't produce them, so basing a whole experiment on the fact you can go back to the closest city for basic services, like they often do.
Ironically, the most practical solar punk system are being by rich tech bro who want to go to Mars, which is sterile in every way, as it mean building practice of completely self sustained system you must be able to create from scratch, without any industry. Which highlights another elephant in the room, labor. The reason that solar punk animation was made by a big company is that they could leverage the resources they have to coordinate a vision, then affect the resources to create that vision and ultimately use that vision to funnel more resources to them, IE an ads to sell products, the power is that's a 'virtuous' cycle of gaining resources as a practice, solar punk not being a practice doesn't have any virtuous cycle that's actionable, it focus more on the dream than the reality. We need an appetite for practice and evolving them, not an escapism full of rules of cool, because that's only serving capitalism.
I do agree that we need more practical answers, though I'd ask you to not assume what I can or cannot see.
Here's the thing though, solarpunk is a genre of fiction, and as such it's main goal is to provide critique, explore ideas and the possibility space (which is the foundational premise of this entire video), same as any other fiction. I don't think anyone would've asked sci-fi writers of the 20th century for the actual working blueprint of an FTL drive. Do I agree that we need to have actionable ideas? Hell yes. And maybe there are answers for some of those questions already. The goal of fiction isn't to give you the answers straight up, the goal of fiction, any fiction is to make you care enough, that you will find the answers yourself.
Also, solar punk as any genre isn't set in stone, so if some parts of it aren't covered in the current works of fiction, doesn't mean they won't be at all.
@@thebookofive fair, but the argument is that fiction is how capitalism self sustain itself. It's a distraction into escapism to make the capitalist reality easier to cope with. Because capitalism is a structure of resources access, trying to enact solar punk fiction is just furthering capitalism.
Still the bottleneck is chipsmithing, if we get to bake sufficiently good micro chip in a kitchen, that future will happen organically in some way.
We don't need solar panel, we can use solar heat with low tech such as steam or Stirling engine. Which mean energy need are covered at individual scale.
Human waste are compostable. Which mean food can be a virtuous cycle with good hygiene practices. Especially with vertical farming type of ideas. It abstract local pressure on nature, because any farming mean displacing whatever human find nuisance. And it allows to occupy place that would be more sterile.
3d printing and alike bring industry into the home and or the community.
So really the missing link is abstraction of knowledge and labor, that's AI. IE we need to be able to make chip at home, this will lead to abstraction of labor at the personal level. IE remove dependence on capitalism as access to good and services.
Ai disrupting the job market is a good thing in the long term, as jobs are the main engine of capitalism. Without job, there is no money, without money there is no capitalism. Ai is a productive technology, that is, it replace the function of capitalism. Money is access to good and services, if ai can produce by operating farm and personal factory like a 3d printer, there is no need to have money to access good and services.
I'd disagree that AI is a good thing, and I'd argue that seeing it as such also plays in favour of the capitalist model. Silicon Valley tech bros and VCs generally don't care about the consequences of their actions and by the time the consequences become apparent they either reinvent the wheel or run to their mars colonies or underground bunkers. You can see it already in the recent Sam Altman's statement that "owning a piece of their "AI" will be more important than money" (whatever that means). Capitalism isn't an issue of technology, it's an issue of perspective. And I don't think it's worth it to wait for some technological silver bullet to kill it, especially when waiting means thousands if not millions of people losing their livelihoods.
Not to mention the fact that capitalism is perfectly happy absorbing everything into itself. You mentioned 3D printing, and while I'm not part of that community I've seen people in it express frustration to how commercialised the space has become in recent years.
On the topic of fiction, yes it can be a tool for escapism, but it's not its sole purpose. It can be a way to get people interested in alternative perspectives, find community or explore ideas in a safe environment.
I've yet to see a good plan for how the solarpunk future would decide who gets to live on small-family paradise farms and who has to live within one-room apartments within the urban cities.
half the point of this type of thing is that hyper-dense cities no longer exist. An important part of the development of modern cities is capitalism itself. As privatization and enclosure of the land and its resources advanced, people lost access to their means of subsistance and began migrating towards the cities in search of alternatives. That meant that the cities filled up with laborers with no means for labor, ripe for exploitation. High unemployment allowed industrial capitalists to lower wages, which allowed them to increase profits and expand very fast. The development and growth of industrial capital exacerbated the "appeal" of cities in relation to the decaying countryside, which further incentivized migration, creating a reinforcing feedback loop.
In short: people move towards resources; resources take the form of capital; capital tends to accumulate and concentrate; people accumulate and concentrate. If resources are allowed to be administered in other ways, then there's no reason to push the densities of cities beyond what's practical or healthy.
@@SMorales851 Cities already are beyond that density. Who decides which city dwellers are allowed to leave to go to less-urban areas and which ones have to stay to provide the necessary labor for making cities work?
I think the point of Solarpunk (or ecosocialism for that matter) is that no one dictates you what to do. From my perspective the decision will be made based on the needs of the community and what any particular person wants/can do.
I mean, the cities do need to change because as you noted in their current form most of them are not sustainable.
P.S. Also, I don't think that the solarpunk city living will be limited to one room apartments :)
People really need to remove collectivist political and economic philosophy from these movements l, it's the cancer that kills the dream.
On the contrary, it's the foundational element of the movements, "the cancer that kills the dream" is the capitalist pursuit of profit and infinite growth and expansion.
Capitalism is a realistic approach to human nature. It takes those of us prone to passion and drive, and takes what should be a negative aspect: "greed", and converts the results of that passion into betterment for others. In a capitalist system, the customer has choice. They can choose to go with what gives them what they want, what is best for them. The highest rewards for the greedy are ensured by giving the people what they want.
But this needs protection, and requires an industry that allows easy competition (entry to compete must be minimal and open) and an informed customer base (they have the ability to see who provides them the best for them).
Lies, monopolies, high entry cost. These are not environments where capitalism works well, or at all. A cyberpunk future is not capitalistic. There is nothing free in the market, as corporate entities have ensured an oligarchy. That isn't capitalism, or a free market. That's one entity getting power and becoming a tyrannical force.
For example, I personally don't feel that health care is ready for a totally free market to function. Too high of entry cost, and the customer cannot be fully informed in their decisions. Some massive technological advancement would be required before this industry could function fully in a free market.
How I'd see a Solarpunk future working would be where the greediest of human nature was incentivized to produce what the average person desired the most.
Technology advanced enough that entry into competing on any stage, for any industry, is simple.. all it takes is passion and drive. Then when one starts to cut corners or produce something undesired, a new competitor can easily come into play to provide the alternative.
Then as long as what people want includes a reality that doesn't have a bleak future, perhaps a people that derives fulfillment beyond the immediate dopamine hit, like those with children or a sense of social belonging for which they'd like to see a good future beyond just themselves... then we could see a future where the world becomes much more livable.
Most collectivist and similar political or sociological stances (the ones that permeate these movements so much) are great for the aesthetics and dreaming, but fall quite short for realistic application or implementation. It is fun to dream and watch and play in these kinds of ideas, but beyond mental masturbation, I don't see it coming to fruition. Especially since it gets so emotional when someone tries to figure out how this would really work, and it feels like the dream.. _my dream_ is being attacked. Tribal feelings means you end up with people having their labels, talking past each other, and nothing getting done.
Ignore the human nature that drives passion, and you will either fail to start... or become yet another tyrannical force trying to just "do what's right for you, can't you just understand?".
@@kaisokusekkendou1498
>They can choose to go with what gives them what they want
So... Homeless people just like hanging around in the tents? You're trying to tie an idea of free choice to the inherently hierarchical system that dictates the possibility space depending on how much money you have, which 99% of the time is a variable outside of your control.
>Lies, monopolies, high entry cost
Monopolies are exactly an end-goal of capitalism, within a system that prioritises endless expansion and profit at a certain point everything converges into a monopoly, because that's the only way to expand. Amazon didn't strangle the competition in the online retail space because it was somehow anti-capitalist, it was doing exactly what the system said it should do.
With regards to your first point, there's nothing inherent in human behaviour and as a matter of fact it is changeable over time, plus throughout history there were societies that didn't rely on greed. Also, I 100% disagree with your take on passion. If you're really as passionate and driven as you say you are, not having a system built with a hierarchy of haves and have-nots and not having a mandate to orient your actions around what is profitable doesn't affect your drive in passion in any way, as a matter of fact it allows you to take it even further. Passion and drive is "I want to make this great thing", greed is "I want to maintain the hierarchy where I have more resources and control over those beneath me". If you have a former, capitalism is more of an obstacle for you than anything else, if you're in a latter group, I don't really think we have anything to discuss.
I am not going to belabour point-by-point arguments in a comment space.
I feel like I may have touched a nerve and 'attacked your dream', so I won't make it worse. Arguing online typically doesn't change minds anyways.
For what it's worth, I feel we want the same goals overall, and I'll leave it at that.
Have a good one. 🙂
bruh. "solarpunk" is the most unrealistic and blank genre. its almost like an AI generated. no realism at all, a lack of style. im not even diving into the fact that its most-used visual representation is freaking YOGURT AD. i think that solarpunk even less realistic than steampunk. like imagine just adding several solar panels and maybe a wind turbine to a factory or any building that consumes electricity. the authors of this "punk" just don't know how the real world works (what are you going to do when there's night and no wind?)
>Imagine just adding several solar panels and maybe a wind turbine
I mean, I specifically talk about that in the video, it's not just about "adding solar panels", I'd go so far as to say that it's not about solar panels at all.
>What are you going to do when there's night and no wind?
I assume people that use solar panels to supply their homes with electricity found a way to deal with this particular problem, but that's beside the point. I'm not an engineer but if you are really curious about it, I'd it's a good thing to look into. Also, it's not like new technology cannot be invented, especially once you remove the factor of profitability from the equation.
@@thebookofive yeah. but every "punk" needs a distinct style and features. i imagine solar panels and wind turbines are features of solarpunk. and about post-scarcity society. i genuinely don't know how to achieve it. capitalism is pretty bad but... at least its working. there was attempts to create new society in ussr, china, germany and italy. and they failed badly
@@thebookofive the main problem with solarpunk is... solar panels. as far as i know there's only 2 solutions - bild giant batteries which involves a lot of chemicals thus making solarpunk not so friendly. or move solar panels into space, which requires a lot of rockets. the main point im trying to tell is that almost every other punk genre is somewhat plausible. its designed to look like future from the perspective of the past. i think that something like reinvented atompunk or thermonuclear punk would look much more realistic
The genre is relatively young and there are still very few actual works that explore it (which is why I had to resort to reusing the same clips in the second half of the video). I agree that every genre has a distinct style, but I'd disagree that wind turbines and solar panels are the core stylistical signifiers of solar punk.
Regarding your second point, I wouldn't say that it's working. Or that it is actually working, but that's not good news for us. Armed conflicts, climate catastrophes, housing crisis, exploitation, imperialism and massive wealth inequality are all the inherent parts of it (and those are not the whole list really). I'm not saying that you specifically should know the answer to what exactly needs to be changed, but I think it's high time to be critical of it.
As for the third point, I definitely don't want to recreate what Germany or Italy tried to do (I don't think anyone in their right mind wants that), as far as the USSR and China are concerned I think they are very vital case studies on how a good and progressive cause can be corrupted and used for evil (for lack of a better world). Despite the fact that the USSR tried to present itself as communist or socialist, in my opinion, it was basically an authoritarian governmental capitalism where the old hierarchy of aristocracy and peasants was simply replaced by the new hierarchy of party officials and everyone else. Partially they failed badly because no one really attempted to build a just system without hierarchy, on the other hand if you look at "smaller" countries that tried to do that (say Chile prior to the Pinochet's rule) were very quickly and violently suppressed (there are lots of great documentaries on CIA backed coups on TH-cam, you can check them out), so I wouldn't say that it's the sign that alternative systems cannot work.
Also, you can check out the videos by other creators on the topic that I put in the description, might give you some food for thought
I'd still think that it is plausible, and in some ways it is based on the perspective of the past (granted you have to look way deeper into the past, but still). I mean, yeah, building cyberpunk is much easier, I'd say we are living in it already, but that's not something anyone wants.
I think the problem is that we look at the solarpunk from two different perspectives. I'm more concerned with systems and socio-economic concepts and you look at it from the perspective of a specific piece of tech that we have right now. Both of those perspectives are valid but I just want to say that I don't think that we should disregard Solarpunk altogether just because from our current vantage point it may seem impossible. Lots of eco-friendly developments get shut down because they aren't deemed profitable. And I mean, there were times when the internet, electricity, steam engines or non-monarchical societies were seen as impossible as well.
There's an anecdote which isn't really about Solarpunk but I think it illustrates the extreme myopia of capitalism, that in the 70s the US government approached AT&T (the biggest telecom company in the country) and offered them to buy ARPANet (basically, the precursor of the modern internet) and AT&T refused because they thought it wouldn't be profitable. I mean, I'm happy that the deal didn't go through, but it just goes to show how things that are enormously beneficial for society might not have existed because they hadn't been considered a great ROI.
Also, I just want to add my intention with this video was to start a conversation and get people to think about that stuff, I'm aware of my limitations and I understand that I can't just solve all the world's problems with one TH-cam video essay. So if you disagree with some of my points - that's totally fine, all I ask is to not shut them down immediately. If you have some questions that weren't answered in this video (which is expected, since it's not a complete guide) you can always do your own research and follow your curiosity. Anyway, thank you for watching!
Im glad Solar Punk will never take off. This shit seems lame as hell.