The amount of slander I see towards Aang and the kataang relationship had me shocked and for a while, I actually felt bad for loving them and their relationship. So thank you, these points actually make a lot more sense than what the toxic zutara shippers say.
@@madydood Exactly, they pretty much miss out on other great details of the series, and just watch it for Zuko, but even then they pretty much know nothing about him and treat him like a God despite being constantly claimed that he isn't perfect in the series
yes that is exactly what i felt and i am happy that there are these kataang defenders out there that make these points clear and show that it was not a one sided relationship
I wonder, that shows hw toxic people are, am not saying shipping Katara and zuko is wrong, I shipped them then but was glad she ended up with aang, the problem is people who argue that kataang relationship wasn't healthy like what the f, their relationship was so unique
JUSTICE FOR KATAANG! I AGREE #kataang Also i did noticed some parallels when Aang wakes up in book 1 ep 1 we see him and Katara, then at the last ep we see Aang and Katara hugging together, and it goes on to Book 2-3 All similar. And not only that at Book 1 The episode with The fortune teller, When Katara asked the lady who she’ll be with in the future, she said is he gonna be tall, and handsome, but the lady only said He’s gonna be a very powerful bender, and thats already a hint that its Aang, also if you payed close attention to the older gaang you can see Aang is literally taller than the entire gaang and bery handsome as well, so technically the writers were pushing their relationship THEY ARE NOT DUMB EXACTLY ITS REALLY THEM ZUTARA FANS CANT U SEE IT???!!😭 Also if netflix disobeys this relationship between Aang and Katara I aint watching it at all, im just gonna be so disappointed again just like that movie which doesnt exist, cuz that would be a huge impact for the series the plot will change fr bruh, just like Zach Eisen/ voice of Aang, he literally said how did the show ended anyways? The show wouldnt work if Kataang didnt work at all. Based on what i observed on their relationship they have a very healthy and strong relationship ngl, they indeed help each other, learn together, and grow together.
Hey don't worry live action show runner actually talked about developing aang and Katara relationship in season 2 and 3. They didn't add it in season 1 because the actor who plays aang looked so young.
Thank you so much. At long last somebody made an analysis of Kataang to show why they are the couple that makes sense. Really nice analysis by the way. I just finished watching your other analysis on The Case Against Zutara, and you did a fantastic job.
@@patricio8569 This was two years ago, but I think it referrs to Katara's expression and the fact that their face are extremely close. Like yes, I can correct a friend's posture but I wouldn't typically stand so close and have a smirk on my face.
Good lord, it feels like if someone looked into my brain, took out everything I’ve always thought of and explained it in a reasonable and understandable manner. Thank you! Keep up the good work and god bless!
The creators aren't dumb - but part of the audience sure tries really hard to make the same dumb points over and over again... Your analysis was much needed ❤ Kataang is beautiful and brilliant. I'm so glad I stumbled upon this video.
This a analysis is so well done. I loved how you explained in full detail about Katara and Aang's relationship. Yep the creators knew what they were doing.
Oh my god, thank you for looking at kataang with actual functioning brain cells. I totally agree with you on every level of this video. Zutara makes zero sense, and zutarians arguments against kataang aren’t even true 95% of the time. They constantly misinterpret zuko and katara friendship scenes for romance when it’s actually just friendship and comradeship. Every time I see something Zutara related it puts me one minute closer to death. Kataang is two best friends who fought side by side and supported and loved and cared for each other for months and have been through hell together. And then when they’ve finally accomplished their mission, they end up falling in love. And people still say it’s forced. Zutara is two people who were enemies from birth and literally wanted to kill each other for ten months and then zuko betrays katara after she trusted him. Which makes katara hate zuko even more. Keep in mind Zuko already has a girlfriend that he cares for. Then katara swears that if he hurts her best friend she will kill him. And then they finally become friends at the very fricking end of the show. And people say a romantic relationship between them is somehow not forced or unnatural? Honestly Zutara is forced and unnatural as frick while kataang is healthy, well developed, and natural. The Zutara fandom is full of twisted logic and backwards thinking thought up by people who are extremely out of touch with the reality of the show.
MDD: Yeah, Aang-Katara, that romance. Some stuff developed along the way, and we're glad some fans are more receptive to that element of the show, but it was in the DNA of the thing from the start. When Mike say Aang-Katara, that romance. What exactly means?
Hi I’m a zutara shipper (not a super extreme one) but I think there are many good arguments that can be made for zutara, and you don’t necessarily have to agree with it or support it, but don’t try to frame it as a toxic ship because that would dismiss the development of katara and zuko’s relationship throughout the series and how comfortable they became with each other by the end of season 3. If you don’t like them as lovers, at least admit that they are close friends at the end, which would debunk the idea that they would be toxic and fighting all the time because they have developed and grown past that. Either way, if you’re willing to watch a zutara video openly, I suggest watching the video sneezy reviews has on zutara (the two hour long one and u don’t have to watch the whole thing but it might help) because she makes some really great points about how zutara could contribute to the overall message and theme of the show.
If that happened, Aang would've eventually had to find someone else like one of his air acolyte fangirls who admire him greatly or On Ji (the girl who was implied to have a crush on him in "The Headband" episode or someone else. My point is, If Zutara happened, he'd eventually fall in love with someone else and start a family because he _has to_ restore the air nation. love both Kataang and Zutara.
@@paprika1725but would Katara be happy with Zuko been boss around keeping secret from as we seen him do. Zutara is not for Katara character as she is not one that will be happy to sit back be popped and wave that’s not Katara. To me I feel like those Zutara shippers only ship their ship cos if feels right for Zuko but not Katara.
@@MaxzySunny ? I think Katara would be happy being a diplomatic bridge between the Water Tribes and Fire Nation, proactively working to rebuild the world and mend the scars of war.
@@blubblubblup 😂😅🤣 And isn’t Katara a diplomatic with Aang? Didn’t you read the comic The Promise or what? Katara is a diplomatic she doesn’t need Zuko for that.
Why does Katara have to be responsible for doing something like that ? And a bridge between the two nations could also be built through a simple friendship. So youre gonna sit here and act like she should be forced into a relationship with Zuko because you THINK thats something she would want to do?😭
It's about time someone made a video like this. Kataang gets so much undeserved hate, especially from Zutara fans. Speaking of... do you think you could make a video on why Zutara is not canon? It pretty much all boils down to one cold, hard fact that most Zutara fans won't even acknowledge; the fact that *Katara and Zuko did NOT want to be together.* Zutarians often call Kataang "one-sided" but the same logic, applied to Zutara, makes Zutara "zero-sided".
First I believe she liked Aang as soon as they met and went penguin sledding but as soon as Aang announced he was the avatar she felt like he needed to be protected so he can save the world. And he was never going to like her back because he's the avatar. Until the fortune teller's episode opened her eyes to the fact that there is a chance. Also The reason she didn't want to get together at the play was the same reason aang said during the invasion, because She didnt know if they or Aang would come back alive she's already almost lost him once when azula Shot him. What if second time he doesn't come back ? Hence why she wanted to wait until after the war was over. Yea they could've gone without the messup by Aang at the play but he's human we've all done something embarrassing or we wish we could take back or done differently. Plus Katara understood Aang she knows he didnt mean anything bad by it and wouldn't hurt her(intentionally). Also lots of people forget what the argument they had twards the end was About, how to defeat Ozai so im pretty sure katara didnt really care about that argument as long as Aang came back safe plus I'm pretty sure Aang apologized for leaving the way he did. But I think they only had a certain amount of time to work with And the thing is Zutara fans dont understand Zutara did technically happen. It was just they became friends "from enemies to friends" not relationship. They both had someone special in there lives already and even if they didn't they shouldn't have tried to date because it's too much negative baggage between them(Katara&Zuko). Would adding in a reunion between her and Aang help ? Yes. But 'keep in mind' we dont see everything plus Aang was waiting for her to come to him with her decision. Which is why she chose to walk out behind him and Katara kissed him first in the very end. Also I'm pretty sure she wouldn't want to kiss in front of everyone she'd be shy and wanted that moment all to them both Her & Aang which is why she waited until they got alone.
@@fendrel5382 Damn, the desperation is still there. Context shows AGAIN that they weren't talking about Kataang specifically but more so that they disliked how it ended with everyone coupled up, which felt like a cliche.
I feel that many (though im sure not all) zutara shippers are those who have not closely rewatched the show. I remember my first time watching ATLA, in the end Zutara had a lot more plausible chemistry, though I still favored Kataang. After a second and third watching, nearly all of that chemistry disappears. There isn't a lick of any implied romance or chemistry between Zuko and Katara, whereas I saw so, so much more subtle and not so subtle feelings between Aang and Katara being shown to us, for both characters. That kiss at the end of the show wasn't just a "happy ending for the heros" decision; it was built up to and foretold throughout all three seasons, and was completely deserved.
Yep i I feel like Katara liked Aang as soon as they met and went penguin sledding because he made her happy and brought fun and joy back into her life. But once she found out he was the Avatar in episode 2 she felt like there was no chance, which Is why she tried to date jet (also because she thought he was cute 😂). Until the fortune teller episode when sokka mentioned Aang was a powerful bender then she realized maybe They do have a chance. Plus Sokka Approves at the end of this episode he's looking at Katara and Aang blushing and starts smiling.
@Cjb242-ms8vw Yea I feel like people just see zuko and Katara and they see there both attractive. But They forget that Katara hates firenation and That Zuko has threatened to burn her most prized possession and called her a slur Multiple times, Tried to blackmail her and everything. Plus I dont get what some people find so attractive about someone calling you out of your name and threatening to kill you like Katara Did. I mean they clearly like the character Zuko and are trying to live through Katara or they like Katara and are trying to live through Zuko. Plus last time she did trust him he Helped kill the person she actually had a crush on. I cant imagine how much katara was blaming herself and was stressing while she was trying to heal Aang and he's being unresponsive they show a little bit of it in the comics. When they where taking over the Firenation ship. And they see her with her head down and Sokka say Katara we need you, katara says : I shouldn't be here should be with Aang. Then Sokka says to her : the faster we get can capture this boat it means we can get Aang on this boat and he'll be safe from the firenation then she said ok but she was doubting herself saying "if I'm such a good healer why can't I heal him" Because it seemed like it wasn't working at that time .
I feel the exact opposite. Kataang was obviously the canon ship the show tried to push, while Zutara was the ship for people who more closely rewatched and analyzed Katara and Zuko because it wasn't canon. To me Kataang felt like it barely progressed throughout the entire series - a constant will they / won't they tease - not to mention their last conversation before the end is an argument. I didn't feel the kiss was deserved because it felt like Katara just spontaneously decided to give into Aang's impatient advances before they ever had a chance to talk things through and make up for the arguments they've had in The Southern Raiders, The Ember Island Players, and Sozin's Comet: Part 1.
@@Oraanu Funny I actually feel like Katang has more moments and Zutara has none like when I rewatched my 2nd and 3rd time because all Katara did was be nice to zuko and people swear there was a relationship between them I understand the appeal of Zutara( Bad boy turns good and gets the good girl trope) and the (Good girl likes bad boys trope which yes katara did like jet but once she had a taste of that kinda relationship she didn't want it anymore) but it just was never there in my eyes to me she was just the first person we see being nice to Zuko besides that earth kingdom girl. Sad but that actually happens in real life sometimes when a woman is just being nice and it's taken as they like someone
Just look at Zutarians logic here: For them Zuko urging Katara to take revenge is SO OPPOSITES DIMINISHING EATCH OTHER'S FAULTS, than Aang being the Only one person able to stand up to Katara in letting Jet, Zuko in the team and in forgiving her mom's killer is SO FUXIN "Oppressive" & "Controlling"! Making someone good at Forgiving rather than Killing is Better for Both parties! Zuko's "Encouragement" would ONLY Worsen Katara's Mental Health imo coz u never really find peace with bloodshed! just wow!
@@AlashiaTuol u can't understand the fact that Zutara will all it's "Beauty" and "Sophistication" on paper is actually a cliche love between two VERY Similar, Impulsive and emotionally driven personalities? u wanna call ot a strawman? u must not know what it means then bud!
@@mahidinho5461 Who cares about beauty and sophistication? And sophistication by whose standards? Their cultures define those words very differently. I care that Zuko and Katara are each the only person the other's really opened up to on a personal level about their deepest pains. Their canon love interests - Aang and Mai - don't really respect or understand their concerns when they try to do so with them. Katara spends the entirety of her most emotional episode telling Aang that she knew he wouldn't understand her and then running of with/confiding in Zuko, then ends that conflict scowling at Aang, correcting his assumptions about how she feels, then smiling at and hugging Zuko. This lack of understanding is never resolved. Aang is never shown to understand Katara better than this episode in which he couldn't provide her what she emotionally needed and Zuko could. Mai frequently tells Zuko she doesn't care about his feelings and dismisses and disrespects his attempts to make her happy. She literally interrogates him because she can't understand his motivations; still thinks of his actions as treason to his country rather than serving it with his moral principles. Principles she can't understand, that she never understands. You want to talk superficial pairings, let's talk Maiko and Kataang - because Aang and Mai are never shown to understand and respect the feelings and opinions of Zuko and Katara the way the latter do each other. I know how Zuko and Katara can handle emotional hardships and even disagreements together - they became stronger after conflict; eventually they opened up more and respected each other's reasons. I also know how Mai and Zuko and Katara and Aang deal with hardships and disagreements. One person's value system is privileged over the other, and the other can do nothing but give. Aang is never there for Katara the way she is for him. Mai is never there for Zuko the way he tries to be for her. We're never given evidence that these dynamics change for any of them. That's not what I consider good enough for any of the characters involved. But Katara and Zuko are there for each other. There's my arguments. Face my real ones rather than making up what you think I'll say so you can dismiss me easier. That's strawman.
@@mahidinho5461 Who gives a shit about forgiveness? No one should be made to forgive someone who hurt them. That's not how you help a victim heal. That's how you privilege the needs of the criminal over their victim. The important thing is to help a victim regain a sense of powered and control regarding how they move forward, a sense usually stripped from them, or at the very least shaken, by the perpetrator of the crime. Thanks to Zuko, Katara got to face her demons on her terms and make the decision of what happened for herself, for the sake of closure, for the sake of no longer feeling like "the helpless little girl [she] was when they came" who couldn't do anything to protect the people she cared about. To be honest, Sokka implies that he and Aang are part of the problem: Katara is their mother-figure. Katara has never been able to grieve as she needed because she had to always work hard to take care of them - Sokka and her dad, then Aang. She had to do her mother's work from the moment her mother died, while Sokka still got to be a child for the most part. It's not their fault, but they really don't understand this part of Katara, as evident from their shock and rejection of Katara's needs rather than helping her work through them in a productive manner. Zuko didn't judge. He didn't tell her what to do or how to feel. He helped her lance the infection that had been eating her alive for years. He didn't tell her how to feel, demand she just let go and forgive the most traumatic experience of her life, one that shaped her in particular and who she had to be since the moment it happened. Here's the thing: Aang is wrong. The show pretends he isn't by shifting the argument: Zuko never explicitly says Katara should be violent, or get revenge. He says she should be able to get _closure_ and _justice._ He makes it her choice, waits for her all night for the time when she's ready. It is Aang who insists they mean violence, it is Katara who says she _doesn't know_ but if she does, what of it, Aang? The argument is over Aang's assumptions and Aang demanding how Katara should heal. Not violence. Violence may not the answer, but neither is demanding forgiveness. Aang had no right to do so. Zuko didn't kill Ozai, even though he could have. Would you also demand Zuko forgive Ozai? I doubt it. Then why do you defend Aang moralizing whether Katara forgives Yon Rha? Edit: Mmm, yes, deleting your side of the argument and altering the contents of your original post after the fact, classy.
@@AlashiaTuol On one hand you're saying that Sokka and Aang express how Katara taking care of them has had a toll on her and thus tries to give her proper mature advice while letting her make her own decision and on the other hand you say Zuko was the better guy for recognising katara's concerns?! How long have you been on weed for?! Demanding forgiveness IS the answer in when it comes to PSTDs and mental Health dumbass! Take some damn Mental Health classes for affirmation!
Thank you so f!cking much, COULDNT have said it any better myself, I respect the idea of zutara…but the constant mischaracterization and false claims need to stop
This isn't so much a response to the video as it is a response to the comment section: I've noticed that both Kataang shippers and Zutara shippers call each other toxic. Zutara shippers even often complain about being harrassed. Maybe instead of fighting about pairings y'all can't change, you should voice your opinion sensibly and then check yourself before you wreck yourself, because it's clear each side sees the other as antagonistic towards them and a lot of y'all don't seem to understand the messages of the show.
I totally agree with everything you said in the video, so thanks so much for putting it out there! I'm soooo glad that you're not defending the theory of Katara already being in love with Aang during the EIP episode but hiding it from him because she was too scared to lose him by distracting him or anything. Ugh. Like, that's totally not what the show was trying to say if you ask me haha However, there's one thing I view a little differently. I do indeed believe that at that point Katara was still confused about her feelings for Aang. Yes, as you said, she certainly must have already at least CONSIDERED Aang in a romantic way, given her jealousy in The Headband and their DoBS kiss. However, I think that she simply wasn't sure what exactly she was feeling at that point and whether her up until then rather subtle feelings would evolve into something stronger in the future. I mean, the creators even put in the whole "Aang's just like a little brother to her" thing, which they push to the extreme in this episode, and I don't think that that only reflects Aang's greatest fear - being nothing but someone platonic to Katara -, it also hints at Katara's viewpoint. Up until season 3, she has pretty much always seen him as something like a little brother (e.g. The Fortuneteller), so Aang kissing her on the day of the invasion has totally shed a new light on her relationship with him. Only thing is, they're getting ready to fight the Firelord so they truly do "have other things to worry about" (so yes, in that sense, her statement about bad timing is also true in a way). I've always tended to translate her "This isn't the right time" into a "I'm unsure about my feelings atm and I need more time to figure things out" (which Aang didn't give her, that little dork lol). Her using the war as an explanation to refer to might have been true to some regard but to me it's also kind of felt like an excuse for not yet being able to tell Aang what she felt.
I agree (and a lot of other Kataang shippers do too) that Katara was genuinely confused there. Her rejecting Aang in EIP allowed me personally to believe that she wasn't going to be persuaded by force into returning feelings that were or were not there, I wish we'd gotten more insight into Katara's romantic feelings for Aang but I think that final balcony scene made a powerful statement nonetheless.
@@drfifteenmd7561 Yes, that's true. It probably was a good thing that Aang sort of gave her space in the aftermath and didn't push the matter any further, although I really would've liked to see him apologize for pressuring her the way he did in EIP.
@@DivineDil Yeah, the thing is the pressuring could be seen as purely negative or as Aang just wanting clarity and peace of mind through asking Katara about it himself, instead of just assuming things or bottling it up. Someone can argue that he should've been more calm about it and secure with himself, but I can argue that there was pressure on him as well prior to and he really felt it. Anyways, I agree that Aang should've apologized on screen. I also don't think the kiss was justified, no matter the intention and why it happened (which is because of The Invasion incident that he initiated and faced no immediate repercussions over like he did there). I like that he didn't bother her over it and also that Katara was the one who started everything in the finale scene instead, it could've been more effective (like telling us why she was confused and give more insight on how her feelings for him developed).
My only argument is that for angg to enter the avatar state he needed to let go of katara and in many cases he needs to let go of katara to fulfill his avatar duties but well said
Honestly, being in a relationship with the Avatar is very compromising. Kyoshi and Rangshi, Roku and Ta Min, Aang and Katara, and Korra and Asami all showcase the obstacles they face by being the Avatar and the Avatar's partner. Valid argument, but in a relationship that you want to work, you have to come to compromise sometimes unless you aren't satisfied with the end result.
The hatred towards kataang is beyond insufferable I admit Aang made some mistakes during book 1 but Aang and Katara's relationship had respect and besides during Book 1 and 2 Zuko did a lot of things that hurt katara hell I myself sometimes find katara a bit annoying but I get where she's coming from
Ok, I’m a zutara shipper just trying to test out the waters and see what points there are for kataang. Tbh this was a refreshing video to watch because there were many good moments between Katara and Aang, but I think my problem with them ending up together at the end of season 3 lies with how their relationship developed in season 3. Season three caused the ship to become even messier than it needed to be and constantly left katara and aang on bad terms, not to mention that the last time they talk before the ending kiss is a fight. I ship zutara, but don’t get me wrong, I don’t think they should have gotten together by the end of the show bc that wouldn’t make sense either and it would have been rushed. I much prefer their enemies to friends to lovers trope that could have been explored, but the lovers should have only come after the show ended and expanded in the comics or lok. Anyway, back to my point, I really think that kataang could have worked and I really would have loved it if their dynamic shifted in season 3, but I think that I was ultimately left feeling uncomfortable about it because of season 3 mostly. I think that sneezy reviews does a good job of dissecting how kataang could have worked better and improved the characters, and, if any Kataang shippers are curious and willing to listen to the other side of the shipping war lol, she also explains why Zutara would overall work better themeatically. Either way, I’m trying to keep an open mind and I would like to admit that this video has helped me see kataang in a new light and better understand the kataang shippers even if I don’t ship it.
@@damask8964 honestly, yeah, I see that. I think they had potential to be something more later on, but definitely not during the time period of the show. I guess it just didn’t feel right for the show to end with kataang either. It wasn’t developed as well as it could’ve been and it was too rushed at the end. In my opinion, Katara shouldn’t have ended up with anyone at the end of the show, but maybe she would later on with one of them (obviously ik she ends up with Aang, but I’m just talking hypothetically if I could tweak it). It just felt like more of a win for Aang at the end rather than a natural conclusion to the their “will-they-won’t-they” relationship. Not to bash Aang tho, but I just don’t think we needed a definitive answer to their relationship by the end of the series, like it could have just been left open ended idk
All their issues were resolved. I think season 3 actually made them sbit more interesting. Aang grew alot in season 3 and katara saw that But yeah, all their arguments were resolved.
If you’re genuinely curious and willing to check it out, sneezy reviews has a great video on shipping zutara, and it doesn’t have to change your opinion but it might help you understand better 😊
i do think Katara and Aang should have been together eventually, but they were too young for a 2 year age difference. Also, aang gave her a little bit of emotional support but not that much, not nearly as much as she gave him. that always bothered me about their relationship. i would also like to make it clear that i don’t ship Zutara. i don’t ship either ship. i think katara and aang would have worked well once they were older, but it’s also likely that in real life that wouldn’t have worked when they were older because they would have grown apart. Relationships from when you’re 12 or 14 don’t usually last
@@antoverlord I know there toxic but I taught the writers rushed there relationship and instead should have let the characters develop and then at the end korra and mako get together
Great video but I personally think zaatar could’ve worked if they were simply enough time, but if they were in a relationship, I don’t think it would be an endgame type of thing I think it would be like a summer fling
"Aang couldn't have won Katara because she cannot be won." ...normally I'd agree. The problem is that Katara is barely characterized when it comes to her feelings for Aang in the third season. She reacts negatively to every romantic overture except the last and they have several open conflicts that are never resolved. Their last verbal interaction is a fight that ends with both still at odds. Yet they still kiss at the end, seemingly all of Katara's disagreements and differences with him forgotten off screen. This is... really disrespectful to Katara, because it blatantly dismisses both her agency and her feelings. When Zutara fans point this out I tend to agree with them - it's not _them_ dismissing or mischaracterizing, it's the actual writing of the show. Katara suddenly reciprocates Aang's romantic overtures after he defeats the Firelord despite all of their most recent actions being discordant. Katara isn't a trophy, but the writing of the show treats her like one by not even caring to show how, when, or why her feelings for Aang changed or when they resolved their conflicts and agreed to be together. Every scene between them from the Day of Black Sun onwards ends with them in conflict except the scene at the very end, in which Katara doesn't even speak. What the heck happened? I don't really... Ship. Not really. I support well-written relationships for narrative purposes, but I have no interest in romance otherwise, fictional or in real life. I'm not trying to judge those who like Kataang, only call attention to the fact that their relationship arc was handled poorly. Especially since they put all these unresolved tensions with Kataang in place over the course of the very episodes where Zuko and Katara have all their trust and emotional openness develop. The relationship writing is all over the place. Edit: Gotta say, I've never heard someone use the legend of Oma and Shu to justify Kataang, given the crystal cave stuff, red and blue color coding, and the fact that the lovers are usually interpreted to be on opposing sides. That's new.
I disagree. Up to EIP, most romantic interactions were initiated by her. This includes all her kisses, hugs and such. She kissed him back at the subs in the invasion which basically confirmed that she felt the same way towards aang. Then what happened you may ask? My interpretations for what went on was that Katara was afraid of loosing Aang and didn’t want to initiate any relationship with him during the war (as she expressed in EIP). She kissed him at the read hip because the war was finally over and they could finally initiate a relationship that was clear both of them wanted without the pressure of the war and such. That’s my interpretation of it at least. I don’t think the show treated Katara as a trophy or something to be won and that the relationship was perfectly built up. What do you think?
@@thecollector4332 I... don't think she kissed him back? I just watched that again. He interrupts her with a kiss and she closes her eyes and afterwards she looks off to the side looking... ambiguous, but definitely not happy. We see in the show what it looks like when people kiss back. Sokka kisses Suki back. There're physical gestures they make when they kiss back. Katara doesn't do that. She literally side-eyes away from him afterwards. And then the Ember Island Players kiss... She sets down boundaries in season 3 that Aang doesn't respect, and he acts pretty entitled to her affection and her response. She says no, she says she's confused, and he kisses her angry and she gets upset. I get sympathy anxiety just watching. They never resolve this, ever, and they just keep having disagreements throughout the season that they never resolve. Their last interaction before the kiss in the finale was an argument. So no, I don't think they treated Katara fairly. She support him emotionally but he never returns that; she helps him work through his emotions and he tells her how to feel. They didn't even dignify her conflicts with Aang with actual resolution. It honestly makes me so uncomfortable and upsets me so much. Especially since we know from Korra that their relationship continued to have these problems and doesn't seem to have been a happy one at all. It's just a really upsetting end for her in my opinion; Aang adores her but doesn't respect her as a person with equally valid feelings, and by not resolving their disagreements and validating Katara's asserted boundaries on-screen but having them get together at the end anyways, the writing does the exact same thing.
@@thecollector4332 That's why I sympathize with Zutara shippers even though I don't really ship. During the same episodes where Aang doesn't treat Katara's feelings with much respect, Zuko is supportive, despite some of those feelings being hostility directed towards him in particular. When Katara unloads her most negative emotions, it's with Zuko, who accepts, respects, and empathizes. She brushes Aang and Sokka off with the angry statement that Sokka didn't feel like she did and that she _knew_ Aang would never understand. The accusation that Aang _does not understand her_ and that she _expected_ this is one hell of a statement to make about her _future boyfriend,_ especially since we never see Aang come to understand Katara better. The subtext of "The Southern Raiders" is that Katara hasn't had the chance to really work through her more painful emotional wounds before because she's always had to be the strong, supportive maternal figure for her family and friends; she can't prioritize her own emotional wounds around Sokka or Aang or work through her festering emotions around them because she has to be strong and hold them together. She can't be fully herself around them because she always has to hold a rather large part of herself back for their sakes. And when she gets the opportunity to finally lance the infected wound and confront the emotions head-on in her own way, they get judgemental, rather than supportive. They don't understand that, partially, they're the reason she hasn't been properly able to grieve - she's always had to hold it together for Sokka, for her father, for her tribe, for Aang. That's why it's so important that Zuko is the one to go with her. That's why Zuko insists this isn't for revenge, it's _for closure._ Because Katara taking care of everyone else first and not herself denied her the ability to fully go through the natural grieving process. She _needed_ this, and Aang and Sokka are both equally framed as the loving family that can't fully understand. Sokka openly says Katara, his _younger_ sibling, took on his mother's role after she died to the point where she basically has taken her place of his maternal figure. And what does Katara say in the second episode? I have to _look out_ for Aang; Aang is my _responsibility._ Never heard a boyfriend or girlfriend refer to their significant other as their _responsibility._ Not in a health relationship, anyways - more in the really unhealthy dysfunctional sitcom ones where the husband is portrayed as super childish and his poor begrudging wife, who's stuck with him, bears all the responsibility for taking care of her husband and maintaining the stability of their lives while he takes on little if any of the responsibility for their family. That's _not good._ Made worse by the fact that that "lack of support" and "little to no responsibility for their family" aspects appear to have actually manifested in the time between ATLA and LoK. That dynamic of maternal figure and ward doesn't change at the end, which doesn't speak well for their relationship. Katara deserved so much better. Zuko is a lot of things and very flawed, but he at least offered Katara _better_ than that: a _genuinely_ supportive partnership, the freedom to work out her emotions for herself without judgement, a genuinely communicative and mutually respectful partnership. The willingness to grow and change, and accept responsibility for his flaws, to rise to become better than that, especially where Katara is concerned because she was the first member of team Avatar that was mutually open with him and the one he betrayed most. They're both very flawed people, but they're _both_ willing to make the effort and they eventually get to a place where they can both trust that the other _will_ make that effort, which is a hell of a lot healthier than Kataang, because Aang's biggest reoccuring flaw is that he's _flighty and hard to rely on,_ which he clearly continued to struggle with after the show given what we see and hear about in the comics and LoK, and is made even worse when one considers that Katara _canonically has abandonment issues as part of her childhood trauma._ Just... No. No. Kataang doesn't work as a healthy and respectful relationship without assuming a whole lot of character development occured where the audience couldn't see it. Aang doesn't need coddling, he needs to grow up and accept responsibility and stop leaving his loved ones in the lurch without the certainty of whether he'd come back. Katara doesn't need a boyfriend she feels she has to mother, she needs acceptance and support to work through her trauma and flaws without being judged a bad person for them. She is motherly and that isn't bad, but she shouldn't always _have_ to be, especially not with her significant other. They don't provide what the other fundamentally needs. Aang sees Katara as his "forever girl." But the text as a whole implies and never contradicts the idea that Katara mainly sees taking care of Aang as her _duty._ Aang only showed up a year ago but his relationship with her is partially a continuation of circumstances that have clearly been straining and hurting Katara for years, in which Katara gives all her support and strength to those around her and gets little in return. That does not a healthy relationship make.
@@thecollector4332 Sorry for the essay; I know that can annoy people. I just have a lot of negative feelings towards Kataang and the treatment of Katara in regards to the writing of that relationship. I sympathize with Zutara more because despite their intial antagonistic relationship, the two grow to genuinely and mutually understand, accept, and support each other, which are fundamentally important in any close relationship and are wholly missing from Kataang. It's that absence that hurts, because Katara deserves better, and by the end of the show, the harsh truth is that Aang was outclassed by Zuko in understanding, supporting, and empathizing with Katara. It's no wonder more people ship Zutara, given that.
@@AlashiaTuol She definitely kissed him back. I don’t know how you can interpret her reaction as anything but returning the kiss. The reason why she doesn’t smile after the kiss is because she’s scared. Aang just gave her the prospect of him not returning and dying. That’s the reason she doesn’t want to be in a relationship with him until after the war is over and the show makes it pretty clear in my opinion. The only time aang crosses boundaries is when he kisses Katara at the EIP. And after that we clearly see that he understands that what he did was not ok. I would’ve liked them to talk about it and resolve their issues but the show was ending and it was understandable that they devoted time to other things. And at the end they have the silent agreement that it’s finally “the right time”. It’s not bad writing.
I hate to say it but Katara kind of is a trophy. Think about it, Aang sees Katara as this perfect and angelic girl who always seems so close but just barely out of reach. There is nothing wrong with that, that's how most relationships start out. To prove my point compare this to Spider-man. Once Peter defeats the main villain he gets with MJ. The same thing with Aang, he defeats the fire lord and gets with Katara. It's the same ole superhero trope where the hero defeats the villain and wins the girl. I hope that made since I'm writing this on my phone (edit) I'm talking about the Toby Maguire spider-man, not the Tom Holland one
I don’t think Aang romanticizes Katara; He notices her flaws and knows her to a T. We see this when Toph joined the group and they kept on arguing or when Katara wanted to beat that nga who killed her mother. He tells her when she wrong and supports her fully-heartedly when she’s right. Katara would never allow herself to be a “trophy,” to anyone. Katara and Aang both felt so close but barely out of reach to each other due to the separation caused by the war
Aang and katara and compatible with each other and I see a long-lasting relationship between the two of them likely; Aang is calm, free-spirited, empathetic, and goofy. Katara is short-tempered, motherly, caring, and quite serious. When Aang and Katara met, he was the wildcard for her and immediately peaked her interest; His eagerness to have fun lights up a room. This is seen when he takes Katara penguin-sledding. Katara says, “I haven’t did this since I was a kid,” Aang confusingly responds, “but you’re still a kid.” Another example is in “The HeadBand;” Katara sat quietly in the corner until Aang requested that they’d dance. Katara was admittedly nervous but was quickly reassured by Aang, saying “it’s just you and me.” Katara balances things out and grounds him; Her willingness to listen and comfort him is remarkable and speaks volumes towards her character. When Aang witnessed the decaying corpse of his mentor, Katara was the first to comfort him out the avatar-state. Laying him gently into her lap and arms, she tells him and Sokka and her are his family now and he’s not alone. She also does this when Aang feels he’s failed the world. She contently listens to Aang as he tells how he was put in the iceberg and left the Southern Air temple. Aang’s deepened regret for the war and Katara’s mother’s death plagued them for years and shaped them as characters. There’s examples of them comforting each other for these, as well. Aang and Katara, as I said earlier, balance one another. Even as young people, Katara’s will to protect Aang from Zuko in the western temple is ever prevalent. Aang’s love for Katara and turmoil caused when she is pushed under the ground by the Earth kingdom general displays immense care. Sorry if this was long or the present grammatical issues, Ima ride for Aang and katara
A trophy isn't just a romantic interest someone gets to be with after defeating a villian. A trophy is specifically someone who's SOLE PURPOSE is to exist as a plot device to reward the main character. Katara does not fit that description at all. Katara is a co-main character with her own entire storyline we get to see unfold. Not some two dimensional trophy. She literally can NOT be a trophy for Aang in any sense because she's too well developed and their romance is too well developed.
@@jaleria489 But was Katara really wrong for wanting revenge? Her mother, the one person that she had the closest relationship with since she was a child was abruptly and tromaticly taken from her. Might I add, that the fact her mother was killed, is the reason she tends to act motherly? Her whole life turned upside down for the worst, to the point that her own brother can't even remember his own mother's face and when he even tries to remember, he pitchers his sister’s face instead of his mother's. Sokka didn't have the trauma of losing a mother because Katara stepped up to the plate and (like most kids her age at the time) had to grow up way faster than she had to, just to take care of her brother and father. So tell me are you saying that Katara was wrong for feeling the urge to avenge her mother, avenge her father, her brother? And don’t even get me started on Aang’s (and Sokka's) behavior. Aang wasn't pointing out a flaw in Katara's personality, he was just trying to calm her and force(not really force, just being dramatic for the sake of getting my point across) his monk ideals of forgiveness and not taking revenge. Instead of trying to see the story from Katara’s POV, he tries to convince her to forgive the man who, quite literally, ruined her life and broke her family. Does that sound like love to you? I don't purposefully try to offend anyone by saying that Katara is kinda a trophy girl. I hate to say it as much as you hate to read/hear it from me. But I have to put it out there because I'm tired of people defending this ship and I'm not saying this is a bad ship, it's just the bad outweighs the good. Sorry, I kind of, go on a rant when it comes to Katara. She's kinda the person I Identify with the most other than Zuko.
@@C.V.Q I'm sorry, but when did being a trophy mean that you are immediately a two-dimensional character? Maybe "trophy" was not the right way to get my point across. Let me remind you that no writer is always going to make their viewers happy or satisfied, but they can at least try. I know I am not entitled to have the ending I want. But the writers of ATLA could have put more love and attention into the romance of this show, or if not, don't even bother adding it if you weren't planning to fix the wholes you left behind, and just expecting us to jump over them. I can't jump over those holes or pretend there is a bridge that's preventing me from falling into a rabbit hole of question after question, with no answer in sight. (sorry, I got lost in that metaphor) What I'm trying to say is that there is no answer to the questions I have, nor is there any way for me to know if they fixed the problems they had before they got together. The way they ended up together, felt forced, to me (not developed). It's just unbelievable to me that they managed to stay together for what, 40, 50 years and even get married, with three children. But I don't know, maybe I'm too focused on the future of this relationship, maybe I'm reflecting on my own family issues.
The relationship in is good I gonna tell you is healthy but I am not biggest fan of this relationship 😞 I feel they are romance is cringe boring I am just for sake of plot feel really forcing really I am not a ship er the story is pretty good but their relationship is the weakest part of it is there a little bit more developed to the relationship it will be good if I open anybody I am sorry but that what I feel I just wish there was more development
To be fair, most of the siblings in my immediate family have a two-year age gap. I am two years younger than the sibling born immediately before me. I am like roughly four, or almost four, years older than the sibling born immediately after me, at that is only because my mother miscarried a baby in between us..otherwise...I would have only been two years older than my eldest younger sibling too. Only being two years apart in age says nothing, really, about whether or not they are more or less like siblings than romantic love interests. I also saw all of my younger siblings almost like they were more akin to my children than my siblings oftentimes, despite the fact that they were too old to have ever actually been my actual children. Because, as their older sibling, I often filled a borderline parental role with them. Because my older siblings were being teenagers holing up in their rooms doing their own things shirking/avoiding responsibility just wanting to be kids and not be in charge of looking after pesky/needy kid siblings or going out to hang with friends and/or getting jobs to spread their independence and become adults or whatever, and because my mother had to go back to work after splitting with our father and was often not home so SOMEONE had to look after the children and childcare is too expensive and it is legal to leave older siblings in charge of younger siblings if the older siblings are a certain age or old considered capable of being responsible enough to not burn down the house or whatever, that meant that I was pushed into the role of being in charge by default when we were left home 'alone'(with each other) and/or when we all went out as a family but our mother was busy doing shopping or what-such or was catching up with family and family friends or whatever and needed help wrangling everyone together to keep things moving smoothly OR while us kids entertained ourselves playing together or whatnot literally just by being the oldest person actually paying attention to the younger siblings and not just f-ing off and doing my own thing except when I was not in charge of looking after younger siblings and was actually on my own. Because I was the child who actually had the personality type to do that, just because it needed to get done, rather than complaining about it or just doing whatever I could to get out of it. Whether or not someone sees someone almost like a child to them has to do with maturity and independence vs dependence or such. And just like you've said yourself, actual maturity is about more than just literal physical age. It's really not that weird or farfetched or impossible as it apparently seems to you that Katara could potentially see Aang as more of a sibling or even almost like a child to her like you think. 😅😅 But maybe that's just me. I don't disagree that the tv show very obviously made Kataang a canon ship. I just personally disagree that they should have, and never personally felt like they ever made it seem like a convincingly positive or desirable romantic ship. I think it could and should have been an amazing, powerful, beautiful, wonderful platonic friendship-and that would have be fantastically great! 🙂 (Lol) I just don't personally see or understand why it needed to be made romantic, at all, and I just did not personally like the ways how the show went about transforming/developing it into more romantic directions exactly either-I don't feel that it did progress in a way that felt super natural or organic to me, nor did I think it was developed in the most healthiest ways it could have been either. 🙃🙃 😅 (I really really hate it when stories use one character seeing the other character finally kinda sorta maybe possibly actually considering pursuing a potential romantic interest in/with/ someone else to finally motivate the character to quick suddenly want to be with the other character and snatch the other character up not because they just genuinely realized they might have been mistaken about their feelings previously or genuinely felt more comfy or ready and wanting to go in that particular direction with their relationship after all than they previous were but instead basically because they basically just didn't want to lose the option altogether. You shouldn't be with someone just because you don't like the idea of seeing them be with someone else. You should only be with someone if you actually legitimately want to be with them yourself. Because there are actually tons of other reason that you might not like the idea of seeing someone be with somebody else other than wanting to be with them like that yourself.) But, again, maybe that's just me. Also...physical contact and physical affection and bare skin, like hugs or kissing cheeks or holding hands or helping someone physically adjust their stance for technique or whatever in martial arts or whatever other physical sport/activity//performance or just general shirtlessness or even outright pecking on the lips, is not always automatically inherently nonplatonic[ for every person in the whole entire world]. 👀 And any argument made using the basis of because YOU yourself personally do or don't-do that particular thing so somehow that must apparently suggest that 'obviously' no one else must be capable of ever doing or not-doing that thing either is automatically founded upon a logical fallacy.🙃😅😅 Different person absolutely can do the same actions with completely different motivations behind why or how they did it. And different people can have drastically different comfort levels or internal associations or lack-of-associations behind it when it comes to touching other people, whether just friends or family or anything else. And some people are even more likely to do certain types of things with friends totally platonically that they wouldn't find appropriate or comfortable to do with family. Everybody differs. Lol And someone could be touched to tears by something sweet or moving even if they don't personally reciprocate it in that same exact particular way, in fact....some people may be even more likely to be brought to tears by knowing that the other person feels that way about them even when they don't feel the same exact way back themself. They could also mention a specific friend rather than just broadly saying "my friends" in general because they know it isn't just their friends in general who are at risk of being hurt but that one specific friends even moreso than any of their other friends, context matters sometimes.🤭🤭😂 😁 I feel like there are some people who say Zutara are the more "mature" characters, not to say that they are the most psychologically grown-up -ish, but just because they are literally older and more physically grown up. I think that's kinda valid, too. Not everybody has to like the idea of 12 yr olds in love, not even if it is purely innocent lovey-dovey feelings and nothing more; it's just as valid I think to believe that romance should maybe wait a couple years as it is to believe as long as it's kept age appropriate it's totally fine, or whatever. I don't really have a problem with people liking Kataang-I just don't like it when I feel like people are trying not just to explain why they personally do(like Kataang) themself, but also somehow try to convince me that I should also like it too myself [ rather than just respecting that we're all allowed to like or dislike different things for our own reasons]. 😊💖💖
@Cjb242-ms8vw It really wasn't a rant. I just made my own points. And I did so in a pretty much neutral, matter-of-fact, and not remotely impassioned way. Just because someone uses a lot of words doesn't mean they're being overly emotional or furiously typing while breathing heavily or whatever. I'm not trying to convince anyone that they shouldn't like Kataang either, and I never actually said that she in this video specifically was trying to convince me to like Kataang(I was just speaking in general about how the only situation in which I ever have a problem myself with anyone supporting the Kataang ship themself even though it's not one that I'm personally fond of is if or when they do try and convince other people to see all the reason they think everyone should like and support Kataang just as much as they do too; in other words, I was specifically acknowledging that I appreciated and had zero beef with how she was talking about it in this video nor with anyone else, just so long as those particular lines aren't being crossed, I'm perfectly okay with different people have different reasons for not all liking or disliking all of the same exact things in the same exact ways all of the time). However, her points involved talking about sibling dynamics, and I happen to have siblings and have a lot of extended family members as well as friends who also have siblings too and thus I personally know a thing or two about actual sibling dynamics and her points weren't very valid or universally applicable with regards to what is or isn't unusual sibling behavior. Even a younger sibling could view their older sibling more like that sibling was basically their child, all depending on personality types and/or levels of maturity/responsibility/etcetera, nevermind an older sibling-even if they are only two years apart in age. Just because you personally think I made my comment for no reason doesn't actually make it true that there was no reason for it. And even if I did, it's still my prerogative what I decide to comment or not and why, not yours. The comment sections literally exists specifically so that anyone who watches the video can discuss what's in the video and share their own thoughts on it or related to it or whatever else, regardless of whether they might actually align with or against what's in the video. You could easily have just clicked or scrolled away if you really thought it was so pointless, too. 🙂
@Cjb242-ms8vw My point was that the fact Aang isn't all that many years younger than Katara(or the fact that they're relatively close in age) itself specifically has nothing to do with how likely it was or wasn't that she might or could have seen him like almost more of a younger sibling or even a child to her than anything else. Claiming that the fact he wasn't that much younger than her makes it any more unlikely that she would or could have seen him as more like a younger sibling or almost even like a child to her IS flawed and incorrect-and my personal experience being put in a position in real life where I personally ended up seeing people who weren't that much younger than me as basically more like they were my children than like actual close-in-age peers myself DOES prove that, just like the fact that Katara is practically like a mother even to her own actual and older sibling does. There are entirely platonic reasons that someone could get jealous of someone spending less time with them / more time with someone else, not only romantic reasons. Some people's cheeks turn red and/or they get flustered specifically because they are uncomfy and DON'T like something, not always because they're excited about it. But I also fully acknowledged that the animated series clearly intended for Kataang to be romantic and not just platonic. I was never debating whether or not Kataang actually was or wasn't a romantic couple in the animated series. I was only saying that I personally disagree that it should have been made romantic or nonplatonic relationship, and disagree that it actually was built up in a specifically romantic way that was supported outside of those clearly meant to be interpreted romantic moments that seemed almost out of character to me in some ways, and I can also see why some people might sometimes interpret certain reactions in the animated series in a different light than it was probably meant to be interpreted or than some other people might. And just because you are disgusted by the very thought of kissing lips with your siblings doesn't mean that literally everyone who isn't disgusted by it gets specifically romantically or such excited by it either-just because I can acknowledge that some people can and do kiss on the lips entirely platonically though doesn't mean that I personally do that with my siblings nor that I was trying to say this is what Kataang specifically were doing in the animated series either. This will probably be the last time I reply to you, though, since I'm not hear to just argue or repeat the same things over and over-so I'll bid you adieu, and I do hope you have a great upcoming week. 🙂💜
@Cjb242-ms8vw No, the video creator's comment in the video about Aang not being that much younger than Katara was brought up specifically in relation to some people's beliefs that Katara seemed to see Aang like much more of a younger sibling or even child to Katara while Aang kept just throwing himself at her again and again without respecting her boundaries right up until Aang went in a date or whatever with some other girl, and then suddenly she finally seemed to consider him as more than just friends in a way which came off to some people much more like she was kind of pressured into it from fear of upsetting him or losing his friendship or just because he and other people kept bringing it up and suggesting it or trying to push her toward considering it rather than because she actually liked him in that same way back for herself even before then. And the video's creator listed Aang not being that much younger than Katara specifically as one of the reasons why she personally didn't agree with people who believed that way / listed it specifically as one of the reasons why the video's creator personally thought it was not so likely or believable that Katara would possibly see Aang that way(as being almost like a child to her) at all and why she didn't agree with other fans who do see Aang's character more like Katara's little brother or maybe even a child in their eyes rather than like an actual or appropriate romantic interest for her. But, yeah, there are many people who find the idea of Kataang ickie specifically because when they were 14 year olds they were babysitting 12 year olds and younger and couldn't possibly imagine ever dating someone that young enough that they would have been made responsible for looking after them rather than just allowed to play together more like same-age or close-in-age peers while someone else/older looked out for them all together. That is still a valid reason for some people to dislike the ship or to see Aang like more of a younger sibling or child to her than like a love-interest and to find the idea of them being together romantically kind of squicky or unpleasant, even if he isn't THAT many years younger-it's not like they're both already fully grown adults so it's less likely that one of them would have to be responsible for the other rather than each being responsible for their own self completely independently. That's primarily all I was trying to point out.
@Cjb242-ms8vw Did you miss the part where I said that was the way that it seemed to some people? I never said that was actually how it was, nor did I ever say that literally everybody has to see it that same way as well. But it's kinda like how one person can hear someone say the words "I'm fine" and think it meant "I'm not doing well at all" while another person could hear the words "I'm fine" and think it meant "I'm doing perfectly well"-I'm saying that I can see/respect why different people can or do sometimes see things in completely different ways than other people might/do, regardless of who I or anybody else agrees with or sees it the same exact way as or not. You might not personally believe that Katara could get jealous of Aang spending time with someone else unless she was romantically interested in Aang herself, but that doesn't mean that it's actually totally and completely impossible or never ever happens that someone might get jealous for completely non-romantic reasons so some/other people may still believe that she might well could do so regardless of whether you believe they are right to think so or not and even regardless of whether that was how the creators of the animated series intended it to be understood by viewers or not, because audiences are allowed to feel their own ways about things for their own reasons sometimes even in spite of whatever the creator's intentions actually were or weren't. Even though the fortune teller didn't tell her it was Aang directly, some people still didn't like that it was the fact she thought the description of who the fortune teller said she would end up with sounded like Aang that made her suddenly seem to consider him an option rather than just the fact that all on her own she'd just gradually started to like him and consider ending up with him more and more not because she thought he might be who somebody else had told her that she would end up with but just because she had spontaneously grew to like him more and more-and even though he didn't initially tell her his feelings and she often initiated platonic hugs and such with him, it was made far more obvious to the audience that Aang liked her as more than just friends than it was ever made to the audience that Katara liked him as more than just friends and she still knew about his feelings first [in some people's opinions ]before she ever truly/seriously seemed to even consider showing or expressing any kind of obviously not-platonic interest in him; some people just prefer it when two characters come to like each other all on their own without knowing the other person's feelings first and without being told some idea of who they will end up with and then trying to just find whoever they think might best match that suggestion of who they'll supposedly end up with, some people would have liked to have more obviously seen that she had more than just platonic feelings for him a little more[ even if she hadn't consciously realized it yet herself it still could have been shown/suggested to the audience in how she talked about him or behaved around him or such more] even before she just suddenly got jealous after having initially turned him down. And I just personally think that is every bit as fair as some people genuinely liking the way Kataang actually played out just exactly how it was. Obviously, the creators of the show wanted people to believe that Katara was bothered by Aang spending time with the other girl because Katara had romantic feelings for him, since Kataang do end up together romantically in the end-but that doesn't change the fact that not everyone believed that she was shown to actually have had anything like romantic feelings for him before that particular moment and thus did not believe that she would or should have been bothered by seeing him with someone else at all or believed that she might have just been afraid that if Aang fell for someone else he might treat her differently or might stop having as much time to spend with the others doing their team avatar adventures just the way they had been before that, people can have weird and nonsensical fears and even though that didn't ever actually happen that still doesn't mean that she couldn't have still been worried that it might have and could have not wanted anything to change and could have been bothered for that reason instead not necessarily because she was romantically interested him just because she wanted things to stay the same and not change and some viewers might have believed that was why she was bothered rather than believing it was because secretly she really did have romantic feelings for him but hadn't admitted it yet. Even if Aang and the fortune teller did not deliberately push her toward liking him, it was still those things (knowing Aang liked her more than friends and being told by the fortune teller that she would end up with someone who she thought sounded like Aang) which did push her toward liking him in the animated series rather than it seeming as if she just came to like him a little more organically all on her own.
@Cjb242-ms8vw Because it might have been there, but it was[ for some people] subtle enough and/or sparsely scattered enough that it could easily be missed or often enough could have happened for other non-romantic reasons except for the most overt and obvious moments(like when they actually finally kiss). But nobody's denying that they did eventually end up clearly together in the very end, regardless of whether everybody agrees that they should have or agrees that it was built up well enough for everyone's liking or not. I think maybe it's not so much that people are insisting stuff wasn't there that actually was, it's just the fact that what is there wasn't built up in ways that everybody saw it coming or liked seeing it happen, so some people were initially thinking or hoping that maybe it was actually something else that was happening instead until it became more obvious that it wasn't something else at all but then they just didn't personally like what it really was better than they liked what it could have been yet wasn't(like if they personally see Katara as acting more like a mother or big-sister toward team avatar, of course they're going to find it weird to see her get romantically involved with someone but especially with basically the youngest and most kid-like member of the group who they may just have trouble imagining in romantic situations at all or may just not particularly enjoy seeing in a romantic light at all, even if that's not how everyone saw the way she acted toward absolutely everyone on the team). It's all in people's own perspectives, I s'pose. Lol
Thank you all so much. 🥰
np
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You did so well!
Amanda Castrillo diste un gran ejemplo y un gran concepto en la relación de Aang y Katara 👍👍👍
Doont you ever take down this video
The amount of slander I see towards Aang and the kataang relationship had me shocked and for a while, I actually felt bad for loving them and their relationship. So thank you, these points actually make a lot more sense than what the toxic zutara shippers say.
don't be ashamed hun. i know we get bashed for shipping kataang but don't listen to them! they're probably not even real fans bby
@@madydood Exactly, they pretty much miss out on other great details of the series, and just watch it for Zuko, but even then they pretty much know nothing about him and treat him like a God despite being constantly claimed that he isn't perfect in the series
yes that is exactly what i felt and i am happy that there are these kataang defenders out there that make these points clear and show that it was not a one sided relationship
I wonder, that shows hw toxic people are, am not saying shipping Katara and zuko is wrong, I shipped them then but was glad she ended up with aang, the problem is people who argue that kataang relationship wasn't healthy like what the f, their relationship was so unique
"Are we watching the same SHOW??!!" 😂😂😂👏👏👏 AMAZING.
“Not the cave of two friends being pals” 😭😭😭😭😭😭❤️
You saying “the creators aren’t dumb” was my favorite part 🤣 but this video was *chef’s kiss* and I do love analyses as much as you probably do
Can you imagine that aang had to wait a 100 years to find the true love of his live and even after that, it wasn't smooth sailing.
Y’all cannot lie the music at the end plus this kiss is a perfect way to end a 3 year long series
JUSTICE FOR KATAANG! I AGREE #kataang
Also i did noticed some parallels when Aang wakes up in book 1 ep 1 we see him and Katara, then at the last ep we see Aang and Katara hugging together, and it goes on to Book 2-3 All similar.
And not only that at Book 1 The episode with The fortune teller, When Katara asked the lady who she’ll be with in the future, she said is he gonna be tall, and handsome, but the lady only said He’s gonna be a very powerful bender, and thats already a hint that its Aang, also if you payed close attention to the older gaang you can see Aang is literally taller than the entire gaang and bery handsome as well, so technically the writers were pushing their relationship THEY ARE NOT DUMB EXACTLY ITS REALLY THEM ZUTARA FANS CANT U SEE IT???!!😭
Also if netflix disobeys this relationship between Aang and Katara I aint watching it at all, im just gonna be so disappointed again just like that movie which doesnt exist, cuz that would be a huge impact for the series the plot will change fr bruh, just like Zach Eisen/ voice of Aang, he literally said how did the show ended anyways? The show wouldnt work if Kataang didnt work at all.
Based on what i observed on their relationship they have a very healthy and strong relationship ngl, they indeed help each other, learn together, and grow together.
Hey don't worry live action show runner actually talked about developing aang and Katara relationship in season 2 and 3. They didn't add it in season 1 because the actor who plays aang looked so young.
i love kattaang so muuucchhh😭😭
Who does not? (Except people who ship Zutara)
I love more then anything
Thank you so much. At long last somebody made an analysis of Kataang to show why they are the couple that makes sense. Really nice analysis by the way. I just finished watching your other analysis on The Case Against Zutara, and you did a fantastic job.
Thank you!
@@patricio8569 This was two years ago, but I think it referrs to Katara's expression and the fact that their face are extremely close. Like yes, I can correct a friend's posture but I wouldn't typically stand so close and have a smirk on my face.
Good lord, it feels like if someone looked into my brain, took out everything I’ve always thought of and explained it in a reasonable and understandable manner. Thank you! Keep up the good work and god bless!
Zutara shippers: KATARA IS LIKE A MOTHER TO HIM!!! And then they totally ignore the sibling dynamic between Zuko and Katara
Finally! A Zuko fan that doesn't ship Zutara!
th-cam.com/video/eRxtWMODfAc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=qDwBBvXd7POEcbDo
The creators aren't dumb - but part of the audience sure tries really hard to make the same dumb points over and over again...
Your analysis was much needed ❤ Kataang is beautiful and brilliant. I'm so glad I stumbled upon this video.
I ship it
This a analysis is so well done. I loved how you explained in full detail about Katara and Aang's relationship. Yep the creators knew what they were doing.
Oh my god, thank you for looking at kataang with actual functioning brain cells. I totally agree with you on every level of this video. Zutara makes zero sense, and zutarians arguments against kataang aren’t even true 95% of the time. They constantly misinterpret zuko and katara friendship scenes for romance when it’s actually just friendship and comradeship. Every time I see something Zutara related it puts me one minute closer to death.
Kataang is two best friends who fought side by side and supported and loved and cared for each other for months and have been through hell together. And then when they’ve finally accomplished their mission, they end up falling in love. And people still say it’s forced.
Zutara is two people who were enemies from birth and literally wanted to kill each other for ten months and then zuko betrays katara after she trusted him. Which makes katara hate zuko even more. Keep in mind Zuko already has a girlfriend that he cares for. Then katara swears that if he hurts her best friend she will kill him. And then they finally become friends at the very fricking end of the show. And people say a romantic relationship between them is somehow not forced or unnatural? Honestly Zutara is forced and unnatural as frick while kataang is healthy, well developed, and natural.
The Zutara fandom is full of twisted logic and backwards thinking thought up by people who are extremely out of touch with the reality of the show.
Omg... you dropped this 👑
MDD: Yeah, Aang-Katara, that romance. Some stuff developed along the way, and we're glad some fans are more receptive to that element of the show, but it was in the DNA of the thing from the start.
When Mike say Aang-Katara, that romance. What exactly means?
I think you already know the answer to that question my man. 😏
@@Oreo_166 What you mean?
Hi I’m a zutara shipper (not a super extreme one) but I think there are many good arguments that can be made for zutara, and you don’t necessarily have to agree with it or support it, but don’t try to frame it as a toxic ship because that would dismiss the development of katara and zuko’s relationship throughout the series and how comfortable they became with each other by the end of season 3. If you don’t like them as lovers, at least admit that they are close friends at the end, which would debunk the idea that they would be toxic and fighting all the time because they have developed and grown past that. Either way, if you’re willing to watch a zutara video openly, I suggest watching the video sneezy reviews has on zutara (the two hour long one and u don’t have to watch the whole thing but it might help) because she makes some really great points about how zutara could contribute to the overall message and theme of the show.
FINNALLY SOMEONE UNDERSTANDS
Thank you for making this.
Ngl, you made me cry at how beautifully you said this.
This...this is beautiful. Thank you for creating this.
Thank you for watching
wonderful analysis!
Thank you!
also kataang beacuse they need new airbenders if katara went with zuko then there would be no one who would recoverd the air nation
If that happened, Aang would've eventually had to find someone else like one of his air acolyte fangirls who admire him greatly or On Ji (the girl who was implied to have a crush on him in "The Headband" episode or someone else. My point is, If Zutara happened, he'd eventually fall in love with someone else and start a family because he _has to_ restore the air nation. love both Kataang and Zutara.
@@paprika1725but would Katara be happy with Zuko been boss around keeping secret from as we seen him do.
Zutara is not for Katara character as she is not one that will be happy to sit back be popped and wave that’s not Katara.
To me I feel like those Zutara shippers only ship their ship cos if feels right for Zuko but not Katara.
@@MaxzySunny ?
I think Katara would be happy being a diplomatic bridge between the Water Tribes and Fire Nation, proactively working to rebuild the world and mend the scars of war.
@@blubblubblup 😂😅🤣
And isn’t Katara a diplomatic with Aang?
Didn’t you read the comic The Promise or what?
Katara is a diplomatic she doesn’t need Zuko for that.
Why does Katara have to be responsible for doing something like that ? And a bridge between the two nations could also be built through a simple friendship. So youre gonna sit here and act like she should be forced into a relationship with Zuko because you THINK thats something she would want to do?😭
It's about time someone made a video like this. Kataang gets so much undeserved hate, especially from Zutara fans.
Speaking of... do you think you could make a video on why Zutara is not canon? It pretty much all boils down to one cold, hard fact that most Zutara fans won't even acknowledge; the fact that *Katara and Zuko did NOT want to be together.* Zutarians often call Kataang "one-sided" but the same logic, applied to Zutara, makes Zutara "zero-sided".
Slayyyyyyy
You deserve more subs and followers
Thank you :)
the music makes my heart beat so much I just re-finished the show and I'm soo invested in this group...
First I believe she liked Aang as soon as they met and went penguin sledding but as soon as Aang announced he was the avatar she felt like he needed to be protected so he can save the world. And he was never going to like her back because he's the avatar. Until the fortune teller's episode opened her eyes to the fact that there is a chance. Also The reason she didn't want to get together at the play was the same reason aang said during the invasion, because She didnt know if they or Aang would come back alive she's already almost lost him once when azula Shot him. What if second time he doesn't come back ? Hence why she wanted to wait until after the war was over.
Yea they could've gone without the messup by Aang at the play but he's human we've all done something embarrassing or we wish we could take back or done differently. Plus Katara understood Aang she knows he didnt mean anything bad by it and wouldn't hurt her(intentionally). Also lots of people forget what the argument they had twards the end was About, how to defeat Ozai so im pretty sure katara didnt really care about that argument as long as Aang came back safe plus I'm pretty sure Aang apologized for leaving the way he did. But I think they only had a certain amount of time to work with And the thing is Zutara fans dont understand Zutara did technically happen. It was just they became friends "from enemies to friends" not relationship. They both had someone special in there lives already and even if they didn't they shouldn't have tried to date because it's too much negative baggage between them(Katara&Zuko). Would adding in a reunion between her and Aang help ? Yes. But 'keep in mind' we dont see everything plus Aang was waiting for her to come to him with her decision. Which is why she chose to walk out behind him and Katara kissed him first in the very end. Also I'm pretty sure she wouldn't want to kiss in front of everyone she'd be shy and wanted that moment all to them both Her & Aang which is why she waited until they got alone.
ong bruh
Whoa, I did not even realize that the creators uses Aunt wu as a messenger.
I just want say something
I LOVE KATAANG💖💖💖💖💖💓💓💓💓💓😎😎😎😎💪💪💪💪
Same!
Amanda Castrillo Thank you
Same ♡♡
@@fendrel5382 What are you try to prove?
@@fendrel5382 Damn, the desperation is still there. Context shows AGAIN that they weren't talking about Kataang specifically but more so that they disliked how it ended with everyone coupled up, which felt like a cliche.
I really feel like this shit shouldn’t have to be explained it’s so obvious
Oh my god this video made me cry 😢 It was so good
I came from TikTok to watch all the videos and like them because I am a big fan but I don’t have a TikTok account I just watch TikToks
Thank you!
Amanda Castrillo omg no proplem 😃
This is going to make me cry
I love them and their love so much😭❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
I feel that many (though im sure not all) zutara shippers are those who have not closely rewatched the show. I remember my first time watching ATLA, in the end Zutara had a lot more plausible chemistry, though I still favored Kataang. After a second and third watching, nearly all of that chemistry disappears. There isn't a lick of any implied romance or chemistry between Zuko and Katara, whereas I saw so, so much more subtle and not so subtle feelings between Aang and Katara being shown to us, for both characters. That kiss at the end of the show wasn't just a "happy ending for the heros" decision; it was built up to and foretold throughout all three seasons, and was completely deserved.
Yep i I feel like Katara liked Aang as soon as they met and went penguin sledding because he made her happy and brought fun and joy back into her life. But once she found out he was the Avatar in episode 2 she felt like there was no chance, which Is why she tried to date jet (also because she thought he was cute 😂). Until the fortune teller episode when sokka mentioned Aang was a powerful bender then she realized maybe They do have a chance. Plus Sokka Approves at the end of this episode he's looking at Katara and Aang blushing and starts smiling.
@Cjb242-ms8vw Yea I feel like people just see zuko and Katara and they see there both attractive. But They forget that Katara hates firenation and That Zuko has threatened to burn her most prized possession and called her a slur Multiple times, Tried to blackmail her and everything. Plus I dont get what some people find so attractive about someone calling you out of your name and threatening to kill you like Katara Did. I mean they clearly like the character Zuko and are trying to live through Katara or they like Katara and are trying to live through Zuko. Plus last time she did trust him he Helped kill the person she actually had a crush on. I cant imagine how much katara was blaming herself and was stressing while she was trying to heal Aang and he's being unresponsive they show a little bit of it in the comics. When they where taking over the Firenation ship. And they see her with her head down and Sokka say Katara we need you, katara says : I shouldn't be here should be with Aang. Then Sokka says to her : the faster we get can capture this boat it means we can get Aang on this boat and he'll be safe from the firenation then she said ok but she was doubting herself saying "if I'm such a good healer why can't I heal him" Because it seemed like it wasn't working at that time .
@@kingjames6948 Did you not watch season 3? Katara forgives Zuko, she even risks her life to save his, they're friends now!
I feel the exact opposite. Kataang was obviously the canon ship the show tried to push, while Zutara was the ship for people who more closely rewatched and analyzed Katara and Zuko because it wasn't canon. To me Kataang felt like it barely progressed throughout the entire series - a constant will they / won't they tease - not to mention their last conversation before the end is an argument. I didn't feel the kiss was deserved because it felt like Katara just spontaneously decided to give into Aang's impatient advances before they ever had a chance to talk things through and make up for the arguments they've had in The Southern Raiders, The Ember Island Players, and Sozin's Comet: Part 1.
@@Oraanu Funny I actually feel like Katang has more moments and Zutara has none like when I rewatched my 2nd and 3rd time because all Katara did was be nice to zuko and people swear there was a relationship between them I understand the appeal of Zutara( Bad boy turns good and gets the good girl trope) and the (Good girl likes bad boys trope which yes katara did like jet but once she had a taste of that kinda relationship she didn't want it anymore) but it just was never there in my eyes to me she was just the first person we see being nice to Zuko besides that earth kingdom girl. Sad but that actually happens in real life sometimes when a woman is just being nice and it's taken as they like someone
so happy you're on youtube too
Omg I love you!!! I didn’t know you had a TH-cam channel every time I saw these on tik tok I always thought queen 👑
Aw thank you!
Just look at Zutarians logic here:
For them Zuko urging Katara to take revenge is SO OPPOSITES DIMINISHING EATCH OTHER'S FAULTS,
than Aang being the Only one person able to stand up to Katara in letting Jet, Zuko in the team and in forgiving her mom's killer is SO FUXIN "Oppressive" & "Controlling"!
Making someone good at Forgiving rather than Killing is Better for Both parties! Zuko's "Encouragement" would ONLY Worsen Katara's Mental Health imo coz u never really find peace with bloodshed!
just wow!
I support Zutara narratively more than Kataang and I do not even understand what you've written, so I'm smelling a whiff of straw man, to be honest.
@@AlashiaTuol u can't understand the fact that Zutara will all it's "Beauty" and "Sophistication" on paper is actually a cliche love between two VERY Similar, Impulsive and emotionally driven personalities?
u wanna call ot a strawman? u must not know what it means then bud!
@@mahidinho5461 Who cares about beauty and sophistication? And sophistication by whose standards? Their cultures define those words very differently.
I care that Zuko and Katara are each the only person the other's really opened up to on a personal level about their deepest pains. Their canon love interests - Aang and Mai - don't really respect or understand their concerns when they try to do so with them. Katara spends the entirety of her most emotional episode telling Aang that she knew he wouldn't understand her and then running of with/confiding in Zuko, then ends that conflict scowling at Aang, correcting his assumptions about how she feels, then smiling at and hugging Zuko. This lack of understanding is never resolved. Aang is never shown to understand Katara better than this episode in which he couldn't provide her what she emotionally needed and Zuko could. Mai frequently tells Zuko she doesn't care about his feelings and dismisses and disrespects his attempts to make her happy. She literally interrogates him because she can't understand his motivations; still thinks of his actions as treason to his country rather than serving it with his moral principles. Principles she can't understand, that she never understands. You want to talk superficial pairings, let's talk Maiko and Kataang - because Aang and Mai are never shown to understand and respect the feelings and opinions of Zuko and Katara the way the latter do each other.
I know how Zuko and Katara can handle emotional hardships and even disagreements together - they became stronger after conflict; eventually they opened up more and respected each other's reasons. I also know how Mai and Zuko and Katara and Aang deal with hardships and disagreements. One person's value system is privileged over the other, and the other can do nothing but give. Aang is never there for Katara the way she is for him. Mai is never there for Zuko the way he tries to be for her. We're never given evidence that these dynamics change for any of them. That's not what I consider good enough for any of the characters involved.
But Katara and Zuko are there for each other.
There's my arguments. Face my real ones rather than making up what you think I'll say so you can dismiss me easier. That's strawman.
@@mahidinho5461 Who gives a shit about forgiveness? No one should be made to forgive someone who hurt them. That's not how you help a victim heal. That's how you privilege the needs of the criminal over their victim. The important thing is to help a victim regain a sense of powered and control regarding how they move forward, a sense usually stripped from them, or at the very least shaken, by the perpetrator of the crime. Thanks to Zuko, Katara got to face her demons on her terms and make the decision of what happened for herself, for the sake of closure, for the sake of no longer feeling like "the helpless little girl [she] was when they came" who couldn't do anything to protect the people she cared about.
To be honest, Sokka implies that he and Aang are part of the problem: Katara is their mother-figure. Katara has never been able to grieve as she needed because she had to always work hard to take care of them - Sokka and her dad, then Aang. She had to do her mother's work from the moment her mother died, while Sokka still got to be a child for the most part. It's not their fault, but they really don't understand this part of Katara, as evident from their shock and rejection of Katara's needs rather than helping her work through them in a productive manner.
Zuko didn't judge. He didn't tell her what to do or how to feel. He helped her lance the infection that had been eating her alive for years. He didn't tell her how to feel, demand she just let go and forgive the most traumatic experience of her life, one that shaped her in particular and who she had to be since the moment it happened.
Here's the thing: Aang is wrong. The show pretends he isn't by shifting the argument: Zuko never explicitly says Katara should be violent, or get revenge. He says she should be able to get _closure_ and _justice._ He makes it her choice, waits for her all night for the time when she's ready. It is Aang who insists they mean violence, it is Katara who says she _doesn't know_ but if she does, what of it, Aang? The argument is over Aang's assumptions and Aang demanding how Katara should heal. Not violence.
Violence may not the answer, but neither is demanding forgiveness. Aang had no right to do so.
Zuko didn't kill Ozai, even though he could have. Would you also demand Zuko forgive Ozai? I doubt it. Then why do you defend Aang moralizing whether Katara forgives Yon Rha?
Edit: Mmm, yes, deleting your side of the argument and altering the contents of your original post after the fact, classy.
@@AlashiaTuol On one hand you're saying that Sokka and Aang express how Katara taking care of them has had a toll on her and thus tries to give her proper mature advice while letting her make her own decision and on the other hand you say Zuko was the better guy for recognising katara's concerns?!
How long have you been on weed for?!
Demanding forgiveness IS the answer in when it comes to PSTDs and mental Health dumbass! Take some damn Mental Health classes for affirmation!
Thank you so f!cking much, COULDNT have said it any better myself, I respect the idea of zutara…but the constant mischaracterization and false claims need to stop
very cool! i love it!
This isn't so much a response to the video as it is a response to the comment section: I've noticed that both Kataang shippers and Zutara shippers call each other toxic. Zutara shippers even often complain about being harrassed.
Maybe instead of fighting about pairings y'all can't change, you should voice your opinion sensibly and then check yourself before you wreck yourself, because it's clear each side sees the other as antagonistic towards them and a lot of y'all don't seem to understand the messages of the show.
I love your video, good one, aang and katara are like ying and yang....
@EjikeJanefrances My thoughts exactly!
im 13 and this is deep
So
Hi
UwU
This
UwU
Please
@@Sikekataangforlife damn i really made that comment 2 years ago
Thank you! This was an amazing video. ^w^
Thank you for watching!!!
I totally agree with everything you said in the video, so thanks so much for putting it out there! I'm soooo glad that you're not defending the theory of Katara already being in love with Aang during the EIP episode but hiding it from him because she was too scared to lose him by distracting him or anything. Ugh. Like, that's totally not what the show was trying to say if you ask me haha
However, there's one thing I view a little differently. I do indeed believe that at that point Katara was still confused about her feelings for Aang. Yes, as you said, she certainly must have already at least CONSIDERED Aang in a romantic way, given her jealousy in The Headband and their DoBS kiss. However, I think that she simply wasn't sure what exactly she was feeling at that point and whether her up until then rather subtle feelings would evolve into something stronger in the future. I mean, the creators even put in the whole "Aang's just like a little brother to her" thing, which they push to the extreme in this episode, and I don't think that that only reflects Aang's greatest fear - being nothing but someone platonic to Katara -, it also hints at Katara's viewpoint. Up until season 3, she has pretty much always seen him as something like a little brother (e.g. The Fortuneteller), so Aang kissing her on the day of the invasion has totally shed a new light on her relationship with him. Only thing is, they're getting ready to fight the Firelord so they truly do "have other things to worry about" (so yes, in that sense, her statement about bad timing is also true in a way). I've always tended to translate her "This isn't the right time" into a "I'm unsure about my feelings atm and I need more time to figure things out" (which Aang didn't give her, that little dork lol). Her using the war as an explanation to refer to might have been true to some regard but to me it's also kind of felt like an excuse for not yet being able to tell Aang what she felt.
I agree (and a lot of other Kataang shippers do too) that Katara was genuinely confused there. Her rejecting Aang in EIP allowed me personally to believe that she wasn't going to be persuaded by force into returning feelings that were or were not there, I wish we'd gotten more insight into Katara's romantic feelings for Aang but I think that final balcony scene made a powerful statement nonetheless.
@@drfifteenmd7561 Yes, that's true. It probably was a good thing that Aang sort of gave her space in the aftermath and didn't push the matter any further, although I really would've liked to see him apologize for pressuring her the way he did in EIP.
@@DivineDil Yeah, the thing is the pressuring could be seen as purely negative or as Aang just wanting clarity and peace of mind through asking Katara about it himself, instead of just assuming things or bottling it up. Someone can argue that he should've been more calm about it and secure with himself, but I can argue that there was pressure on him as well prior to and he really felt it. Anyways, I agree that Aang should've apologized on screen. I also don't think the kiss was justified, no matter the intention and why it happened (which is because of The Invasion incident that he initiated and faced no immediate repercussions over like he did there). I like that he didn't bother her over it and also that Katara was the one who started everything in the finale scene instead, it could've been more effective (like telling us why she was confused and give more insight on how her feelings for him developed).
Great Video Analysis On Kataang
My only argument is that for angg to enter the avatar state he needed to let go of katara and in many cases he needs to let go of katara to fulfill his avatar duties but well said
Honestly, being in a relationship with the Avatar is very compromising. Kyoshi and Rangshi, Roku and Ta Min, Aang and Katara, and Korra and Asami all showcase the obstacles they face by being the Avatar and the Avatar's partner. Valid argument, but in a relationship that you want to work, you have to come to compromise sometimes unless you aren't satisfied with the end result.
@@drfifteenmd7561 Love is Love is always that is not the people is the love
Thanks, u make me wanna watch avatar for like the 9th or 10th time, honestly I've lost count😀😀😀 grate vid btw, got ur self a new subscriber!!
Kataang forever 💞
The hatred towards kataang is beyond insufferable I admit Aang made some mistakes during book 1 but Aang and Katara's relationship had respect and besides during Book 1 and 2 Zuko did a lot of things that hurt katara hell I myself sometimes find katara a bit annoying but I get where she's coming from
Now Katara being jealous means that she knows she likes aang
Facts
Great video. I wish these Zutara shippers would just face reality.
hey if zutara can make argument without hating kataang should too
She just did!
Ooooooooooh the cave of two lovers not the the cave of two friends being pals burn yo face like zuko now 😃
Ø
That ending was 😫💕❤️
Ok, I’m a zutara shipper just trying to test out the waters and see what points there are for kataang. Tbh this was a refreshing video to watch because there were many good moments between Katara and Aang, but I think my problem with them ending up together at the end of season 3 lies with how their relationship developed in season 3. Season three caused the ship to become even messier than it needed to be and constantly left katara and aang on bad terms, not to mention that the last time they talk before the ending kiss is a fight. I ship zutara, but don’t get me wrong, I don’t think they should have gotten together by the end of the show bc that wouldn’t make sense either and it would have been rushed. I much prefer their enemies to friends to lovers trope that could have been explored, but the lovers should have only come after the show ended and expanded in the comics or lok. Anyway, back to my point, I really think that kataang could have worked and I really would have loved it if their dynamic shifted in season 3, but I think that I was ultimately left feeling uncomfortable about it because of season 3 mostly. I think that sneezy reviews does a good job of dissecting how kataang could have worked better and improved the characters, and, if any Kataang shippers are curious and willing to listen to the other side of the shipping war lol, she also explains why Zutara would overall work better themeatically. Either way, I’m trying to keep an open mind and I would like to admit that this video has helped me see kataang in a new light and better understand the kataang shippers even if I don’t ship it.
Everyone can believe what they want even when it's not true., but zuko and katara were never more than a friendship. Even the creators said so.
@@damask8964 honestly, yeah, I see that. I think they had potential to be something more later on, but definitely not during the time period of the show. I guess it just didn’t feel right for the show to end with kataang either. It wasn’t developed as well as it could’ve been and it was too rushed at the end. In my opinion, Katara shouldn’t have ended up with anyone at the end of the show, but maybe she would later on with one of them (obviously ik she ends up with Aang, but I’m just talking hypothetically if I could tweak it). It just felt like more of a win for Aang at the end rather than a natural conclusion to the their “will-they-won’t-they” relationship. Not to bash Aang tho, but I just don’t think we needed a definitive answer to their relationship by the end of the series, like it could have just been left open ended idk
All their issues were resolved. I think season 3 actually made them sbit more interesting. Aang grew alot in season 3 and katara saw that
But yeah, all their arguments were resolved.
Why is zutara a thing
Honey we will never know
@@ashcat1815 no we won’t
If you’re genuinely curious and willing to check it out, sneezy reviews has a great video on shipping zutara, and it doesn’t have to change your opinion but it might help you understand better 😊
YAAAAAAAAAYYY
Yaaaaaaay
I’m fiiiirts I think
I don’t think the creators are dumb guys
Why they should've been together:
Lion turtles
How You Gonna Diss Classic Bruno Mars?
good video i agree with you
Hello
i do think Katara and Aang should have been together eventually, but they were too young for a 2 year age difference. Also, aang gave her a little bit of emotional support but not that much, not nearly as much as she gave him. that always bothered me about their relationship. i would also like to make it clear that i don’t ship Zutara. i don’t ship either ship. i think katara and aang would have worked well once they were older, but it’s also likely that in real life that wouldn’t have worked when they were older because they would have grown apart. Relationships from when you’re 12 or 14 don’t usually last
Are u makorra fan or korrasami fan
Korrasami ❤️
@@amandacastrillo aw imo makorra is better
@@reecemonaghan6040 no offense dude but in what way? They are toxic
@@antoverlord I know there toxic but I taught the writers rushed there relationship and instead should have let the characters develop and then at the end korra and mako get together
@@reecemonaghan6040 i understand your point but for me I feel like korrasami is just 👌
Oh my god hi please notice me
Great video but I personally think zaatar could’ve worked if they were simply enough time, but if they were in a relationship, I don’t think it would be an endgame type of thing I think it would be like a summer fling
I don’t even ship Zutara but why are you so aggressive??? Like why is the tone so hostile
"The creators aren't dumb!!!"
"Aang couldn't have won Katara because she cannot be won."
...normally I'd agree. The problem is that Katara is barely characterized when it comes to her feelings for Aang in the third season. She reacts negatively to every romantic overture except the last and they have several open conflicts that are never resolved. Their last verbal interaction is a fight that ends with both still at odds. Yet they still kiss at the end, seemingly all of Katara's disagreements and differences with him forgotten off screen.
This is... really disrespectful to Katara, because it blatantly dismisses both her agency and her feelings. When Zutara fans point this out I tend to agree with them - it's not _them_ dismissing or mischaracterizing, it's the actual writing of the show. Katara suddenly reciprocates Aang's romantic overtures after he defeats the Firelord despite all of their most recent actions being discordant. Katara isn't a trophy, but the writing of the show treats her like one by not even caring to show how, when, or why her feelings for Aang changed or when they resolved their conflicts and agreed to be together. Every scene between them from the Day of Black Sun onwards ends with them in conflict except the scene at the very end, in which Katara doesn't even speak. What the heck happened?
I don't really... Ship. Not really. I support well-written relationships for narrative purposes, but I have no interest in romance otherwise, fictional or in real life. I'm not trying to judge those who like Kataang, only call attention to the fact that their relationship arc was handled poorly.
Especially since they put all these unresolved tensions with Kataang in place over the course of the very episodes where Zuko and Katara have all their trust and emotional openness develop. The relationship writing is all over the place.
Edit: Gotta say, I've never heard someone use the legend of Oma and Shu to justify Kataang, given the crystal cave stuff, red and blue color coding, and the fact that the lovers are usually interpreted to be on opposing sides. That's new.
I disagree. Up to EIP, most romantic interactions were initiated by her. This includes all her kisses, hugs and such. She kissed him back at the subs in the invasion which basically confirmed that she felt the same way towards aang. Then what happened you may ask? My interpretations for what went on was that Katara was afraid of loosing Aang and didn’t want to initiate any relationship with him during the war (as she expressed in EIP). She kissed him at the read hip because the war was finally over and they could finally initiate a relationship that was clear both of them wanted without the pressure of the war and such. That’s my interpretation of it at least. I don’t think the show treated Katara as a trophy or something to be won and that the relationship was perfectly built up. What do you think?
@@thecollector4332 I... don't think she kissed him back? I just watched that again. He interrupts her with a kiss and she closes her eyes and afterwards she looks off to the side looking... ambiguous, but definitely not happy. We see in the show what it looks like when people kiss back. Sokka kisses Suki back. There're physical gestures they make when they kiss back. Katara doesn't do that. She literally side-eyes away from him afterwards.
And then the Ember Island Players kiss...
She sets down boundaries in season 3 that Aang doesn't respect, and he acts pretty entitled to her affection and her response. She says no, she says she's confused, and he kisses her angry and she gets upset. I get sympathy anxiety just watching. They never resolve this, ever, and they just keep having disagreements throughout the season that they never resolve. Their last interaction before the kiss in the finale was an argument.
So no, I don't think they treated Katara fairly. She support him emotionally but he never returns that; she helps him work through his emotions and he tells her how to feel. They didn't even dignify her conflicts with Aang with actual resolution. It honestly makes me so uncomfortable and upsets me so much. Especially since we know from Korra that their relationship continued to have these problems and doesn't seem to have been a happy one at all. It's just a really upsetting end for her in my opinion; Aang adores her but doesn't respect her as a person with equally valid feelings, and by not resolving their disagreements and validating Katara's asserted boundaries on-screen but having them get together at the end anyways, the writing does the exact same thing.
@@thecollector4332 That's why I sympathize with Zutara shippers even though I don't really ship. During the same episodes where Aang doesn't treat Katara's feelings with much respect, Zuko is supportive, despite some of those feelings being hostility directed towards him in particular. When Katara unloads her most negative emotions, it's with Zuko, who accepts, respects, and empathizes. She brushes Aang and Sokka off with the angry statement that Sokka didn't feel like she did and that she _knew_ Aang would never understand. The accusation that Aang _does not understand her_ and that she _expected_ this is one hell of a statement to make about her _future boyfriend,_ especially since we never see Aang come to understand Katara better.
The subtext of "The Southern Raiders" is that Katara hasn't had the chance to really work through her more painful emotional wounds before because she's always had to be the strong, supportive maternal figure for her family and friends; she can't prioritize her own emotional wounds around Sokka or Aang or work through her festering emotions around them because she has to be strong and hold them together. She can't be fully herself around them because she always has to hold a rather large part of herself back for their sakes. And when she gets the opportunity to finally lance the infected wound and confront the emotions head-on in her own way, they get judgemental, rather than supportive. They don't understand that, partially, they're the reason she hasn't been properly able to grieve - she's always had to hold it together for Sokka, for her father, for her tribe, for Aang. That's why it's so important that Zuko is the one to go with her. That's why Zuko insists this isn't for revenge, it's _for closure._ Because Katara taking care of everyone else first and not herself denied her the ability to fully go through the natural grieving process. She _needed_ this, and Aang and Sokka are both equally framed as the loving family that can't fully understand. Sokka openly says Katara, his _younger_ sibling, took on his mother's role after she died to the point where she basically has taken her place of his maternal figure. And what does Katara say in the second episode? I have to _look out_ for Aang; Aang is my _responsibility._
Never heard a boyfriend or girlfriend refer to their significant other as their _responsibility._ Not in a health relationship, anyways - more in the really unhealthy dysfunctional sitcom ones where the husband is portrayed as super childish and his poor begrudging wife, who's stuck with him, bears all the responsibility for taking care of her husband and maintaining the stability of their lives while he takes on little if any of the responsibility for their family.
That's _not good._ Made worse by the fact that that "lack of support" and "little to no responsibility for their family" aspects appear to have actually manifested in the time between ATLA and LoK.
That dynamic of maternal figure and ward doesn't change at the end, which doesn't speak well for their relationship. Katara deserved so much better.
Zuko is a lot of things and very flawed, but he at least offered Katara _better_ than that: a _genuinely_ supportive partnership, the freedom to work out her emotions for herself without judgement, a genuinely communicative and mutually respectful partnership. The willingness to grow and change, and accept responsibility for his flaws, to rise to become better than that, especially where Katara is concerned because she was the first member of team Avatar that was mutually open with him and the one he betrayed most. They're both very flawed people, but they're _both_ willing to make the effort and they eventually get to a place where they can both trust that the other _will_ make that effort, which is a hell of a lot healthier than Kataang, because Aang's biggest reoccuring flaw is that he's _flighty and hard to rely on,_ which he clearly continued to struggle with after the show given what we see and hear about in the comics and LoK, and is made even worse when one considers that Katara _canonically has abandonment issues as part of her childhood trauma._
Just... No. No. Kataang doesn't work as a healthy and respectful relationship without assuming a whole lot of character development occured where the audience couldn't see it.
Aang doesn't need coddling, he needs to grow up and accept responsibility and stop leaving his loved ones in the lurch without the certainty of whether he'd come back. Katara doesn't need a boyfriend she feels she has to mother, she needs acceptance and support to work through her trauma and flaws without being judged a bad person for them. She is motherly and that isn't bad, but she shouldn't always _have_ to be, especially not with her significant other. They don't provide what the other fundamentally needs.
Aang sees Katara as his "forever girl." But the text as a whole implies and never contradicts the idea that Katara mainly sees taking care of Aang as her _duty._ Aang only showed up a year ago but his relationship with her is partially a continuation of circumstances that have clearly been straining and hurting Katara for years, in which Katara gives all her support and strength to those around her and gets little in return. That does not a healthy relationship make.
@@thecollector4332 Sorry for the essay; I know that can annoy people. I just have a lot of negative feelings towards Kataang and the treatment of Katara in regards to the writing of that relationship. I sympathize with Zutara more because despite their intial antagonistic relationship, the two grow to genuinely and mutually understand, accept, and support each other, which are fundamentally important in any close relationship and are wholly missing from Kataang. It's that absence that hurts, because Katara deserves better, and by the end of the show, the harsh truth is that Aang was outclassed by Zuko in understanding, supporting, and empathizing with Katara. It's no wonder more people ship Zutara, given that.
@@AlashiaTuol
She definitely kissed him back. I don’t know how you can interpret her reaction as anything but returning the kiss. The reason why she doesn’t smile after the kiss is because she’s scared. Aang just gave her the prospect of him not returning and dying. That’s the reason she doesn’t want to be in a relationship with him until after the war is over and the show makes it pretty clear in my opinion.
The only time aang crosses boundaries is when he kisses Katara at the EIP. And after that we clearly see that he understands that what he did was not ok. I would’ve liked them to talk about it and resolve their issues but the show was ending and it was understandable that they devoted time to other things. And at the end they have the silent agreement that it’s finally “the right time”. It’s not bad writing.
I hate to say it but Katara kind of is a trophy. Think about it, Aang sees Katara as this perfect and angelic girl who always seems so close but just barely out of reach. There is nothing wrong with that, that's how most relationships start out.
To prove my point compare this to Spider-man. Once Peter defeats the main villain he gets with MJ. The same thing with Aang, he defeats the fire lord and gets with Katara. It's the same ole superhero trope where the hero defeats the villain and wins the girl.
I hope that made since I'm writing this on my phone
(edit) I'm talking about the Toby Maguire spider-man, not the Tom Holland one
I don’t think Aang romanticizes Katara;
He notices her flaws and knows her to a T. We see this when Toph joined the group and they kept on arguing or when Katara wanted to beat that nga who killed her mother. He tells her when she wrong and supports her fully-heartedly when she’s right. Katara would never allow herself to be a “trophy,” to anyone.
Katara and Aang both felt so close but barely out of reach to each other due to the separation caused by the war
Aang and katara and compatible with each other and I see a long-lasting relationship between the two of them likely;
Aang is calm, free-spirited, empathetic, and goofy.
Katara is short-tempered, motherly, caring, and quite serious.
When Aang and Katara met, he was the wildcard for her and immediately peaked her interest; His eagerness to have fun lights up a room.
This is seen when he takes Katara penguin-sledding.
Katara says, “I haven’t did this since I was a kid,”
Aang confusingly responds, “but you’re still a kid.”
Another example is in “The HeadBand;”
Katara sat quietly in the corner until Aang requested that they’d dance.
Katara was admittedly nervous but was quickly reassured by Aang, saying “it’s just you and me.”
Katara balances things out and grounds him;
Her willingness to listen and comfort him is remarkable and speaks volumes towards her character.
When Aang witnessed the decaying corpse of his mentor,
Katara was the first to comfort him out the avatar-state.
Laying him gently into her lap and arms, she tells him and Sokka and her are his family now and he’s not alone.
She also does this when Aang feels he’s failed the world.
She contently listens to Aang as he tells how he was put in the iceberg and left the Southern Air temple.
Aang’s deepened regret for the war and Katara’s mother’s death plagued them for years and shaped them as characters.
There’s examples of them comforting each other for these, as well.
Aang and Katara, as I said earlier, balance one another. Even as young people, Katara’s will to protect Aang from Zuko in the western temple is ever prevalent. Aang’s love for Katara and turmoil caused when she is pushed under the ground by the Earth kingdom general displays immense care.
Sorry if this was long or the present grammatical issues, Ima ride for Aang and katara
A trophy isn't just a romantic interest someone gets to be with after defeating a villian. A trophy is specifically someone who's SOLE PURPOSE is to exist as a plot device to reward the main character. Katara does not fit that description at all. Katara is a co-main character with her own entire storyline we get to see unfold. Not some two dimensional trophy. She literally can NOT be a trophy for Aang in any sense because she's too well developed and their romance is too well developed.
@@jaleria489 But was Katara really wrong for wanting revenge?
Her mother, the one person that she had the closest relationship with since she was a child was abruptly and tromaticly taken from her. Might I add, that the fact her mother was killed, is the reason she tends to act motherly? Her whole life turned upside down for the worst, to the point that her own brother can't even remember his own mother's face and when he even tries to remember, he pitchers his sister’s face instead of his mother's.
Sokka didn't have the trauma of losing a mother because Katara stepped up to the plate and (like most kids her age at the time) had to grow up way faster than she had to, just to take care of her brother and father. So tell me are you saying that Katara was wrong for feeling the urge to avenge her mother, avenge her father, her brother?
And don’t even get me started on Aang’s (and Sokka's) behavior. Aang wasn't pointing out a flaw in Katara's personality, he was just trying to calm her and force(not really force, just being dramatic for the sake of getting my point across) his monk ideals of forgiveness and not taking revenge. Instead of trying to see the story from Katara’s POV, he tries to convince her to forgive the man who, quite literally, ruined her life and broke her family. Does that sound like love to you?
I don't purposefully try to offend anyone by saying that Katara is kinda a trophy girl. I hate to say it as much as you hate to read/hear it from me. But I have to put it out there because I'm tired of people defending this ship and I'm not saying this is a bad ship, it's just the bad outweighs the good.
Sorry, I kind of, go on a rant when it comes to Katara. She's kinda the person I Identify with the most other than Zuko.
@@C.V.Q I'm sorry, but when did being a trophy mean that you are immediately a two-dimensional character?
Maybe "trophy" was not the right way to get my point across.
Let me remind you that no writer is always going to make their viewers happy or satisfied, but they can at least try.
I know I am not entitled to have the ending I want. But the writers of ATLA could have put more love and attention into the romance of this show, or if not, don't even bother adding it if you weren't planning to fix the wholes you left behind, and just expecting us to jump over them. I can't jump over those holes or pretend there is a bridge that's preventing me from falling into a rabbit hole of question after question, with no answer in sight.
(sorry, I got lost in that metaphor)
What I'm trying to say is that there is no answer to the questions I have, nor is there any way for me to know if they fixed the problems they had before they got together. The way they ended up together, felt forced, to me (not developed). It's just unbelievable to me that they managed to stay together for what, 40, 50 years and even get married, with three children.
But I don't know, maybe I'm too focused on the future of this relationship, maybe I'm reflecting on my own family issues.
The relationship in is good I gonna tell you is healthy but I am not biggest fan of this relationship 😞 I feel they are romance is cringe boring I am just for sake of plot feel really forcing really I am not a ship er the story is pretty good but their relationship is the weakest part of it is there a little bit more developed to the relationship it will be good if I open anybody I am sorry but that what I feel I just wish there was more development
To be fair, most of the siblings in my immediate family have a two-year age gap. I am two years younger than the sibling born immediately before me. I am like roughly four, or almost four, years older than the sibling born immediately after me, at that is only because my mother miscarried a baby in between us..otherwise...I would have only been two years older than my eldest younger sibling too.
Only being two years apart in age says nothing, really, about whether or not they are more or less like siblings than romantic love interests.
I also saw all of my younger siblings almost like they were more akin to my children than my siblings oftentimes, despite the fact that they were too old to have ever actually been my actual children. Because, as their older sibling, I often filled a borderline parental role with them. Because my older siblings were being teenagers holing up in their rooms doing their own things shirking/avoiding responsibility just wanting to be kids and not be in charge of looking after pesky/needy kid siblings or going out to hang with friends and/or getting jobs to spread their independence and become adults or whatever, and because my mother had to go back to work after splitting with our father and was often not home so SOMEONE had to look after the children and childcare is too expensive and it is legal to leave older siblings in charge of younger siblings if the older siblings are a certain age or old considered capable of being responsible enough to not burn down the house or whatever, that meant that I was pushed into the role of being in charge by default when we were left home 'alone'(with each other) and/or when we all went out as a family but our mother was busy doing shopping or what-such or was catching up with family and family friends or whatever and needed help wrangling everyone together to keep things moving smoothly OR while us kids entertained ourselves playing together or whatnot literally just by being the oldest person actually paying attention to the younger siblings and not just f-ing off and doing my own thing except when I was not in charge of looking after younger siblings and was actually on my own. Because I was the child who actually had the personality type to do that, just because it needed to get done, rather than complaining about it or just doing whatever I could to get out of it. Whether or not someone sees someone almost like a child to them has to do with maturity and independence vs dependence or such. And just like you've said yourself, actual maturity is about more than just literal physical age.
It's really not that weird or farfetched or impossible as it apparently seems to you that Katara could potentially see Aang as more of a sibling or even almost like a child to her like you think. 😅😅
But maybe that's just me.
I don't disagree that the tv show very obviously made Kataang a canon ship.
I just personally disagree that they should have, and never personally felt like they ever made it seem like a convincingly positive or desirable romantic ship. I think it could and should have been an amazing, powerful, beautiful, wonderful platonic friendship-and that would have be fantastically great! 🙂 (Lol) I just don't personally see or understand why it needed to be made romantic, at all, and I just did not personally like the ways how the show went about transforming/developing it into more romantic directions exactly either-I don't feel that it did progress in a way that felt super natural or organic to me, nor did I think it was developed in the most healthiest ways it could have been either. 🙃🙃 😅
(I really really hate it when stories use one character seeing the other character finally kinda sorta maybe possibly actually considering pursuing a potential romantic interest in/with/ someone else to finally motivate the character to quick suddenly want to be with the other character and snatch the other character up not because they just genuinely realized they might have been mistaken about their feelings previously or genuinely felt more comfy or ready and wanting to go in that particular direction with their relationship after all than they previous were but instead basically because they basically just didn't want to lose the option altogether. You shouldn't be with someone just because you don't like the idea of seeing them be with someone else. You should only be with someone if you actually legitimately want to be with them yourself. Because there are actually tons of other reason that you might not like the idea of seeing someone be with somebody else other than wanting to be with them like that yourself.)
But, again, maybe that's just me.
Also...physical contact and physical affection and bare skin, like hugs or kissing cheeks or holding hands or helping someone physically adjust their stance for technique or whatever in martial arts or whatever other physical sport/activity//performance or just general shirtlessness or even outright pecking on the lips, is not always automatically inherently nonplatonic[ for every person in the whole entire world]. 👀 And any argument made using the basis of because YOU yourself personally do or don't-do that particular thing so somehow that must apparently suggest that 'obviously' no one else must be capable of ever doing or not-doing that thing either is automatically founded upon a logical fallacy.🙃😅😅 Different person absolutely can do the same actions with completely different motivations behind why or how they did it. And different people can have drastically different comfort levels or internal associations or lack-of-associations behind it when it comes to touching other people, whether just friends or family or anything else. And some people are even more likely to do certain types of things with friends totally platonically that they wouldn't find appropriate or comfortable to do with family. Everybody differs. Lol
And someone could be touched to tears by something sweet or moving even if they don't personally reciprocate it in that same exact particular way, in fact....some people may be even more likely to be brought to tears by knowing that the other person feels that way about them even when they don't feel the same exact way back themself. They could also mention a specific friend rather than just broadly saying "my friends" in general because they know it isn't just their friends in general who are at risk of being hurt but that one specific friends even moreso than any of their other friends, context matters sometimes.🤭🤭😂 😁
I feel like there are some people who say Zutara are the more "mature" characters, not to say that they are the most psychologically grown-up -ish, but just because they are literally older and more physically grown up. I think that's kinda valid, too. Not everybody has to like the idea of 12 yr olds in love, not even if it is purely innocent lovey-dovey feelings and nothing more; it's just as valid I think to believe that romance should maybe wait a couple years as it is to believe as long as it's kept age appropriate it's totally fine, or whatever.
I don't really have a problem with people liking Kataang-I just don't like it when I feel like people are trying not just to explain why they personally do(like Kataang) themself, but also somehow try to convince me that I should also like it too myself [ rather than just respecting that we're all allowed to like or dislike different things for our own reasons]. 😊💖💖
@Cjb242-ms8vw It really wasn't a rant. I just made my own points. And I did so in a pretty much neutral, matter-of-fact, and not remotely impassioned way.
Just because someone uses a lot of words doesn't mean they're being overly emotional or furiously typing while breathing heavily or whatever.
I'm not trying to convince anyone that they shouldn't like Kataang either, and I never actually said that she in this video specifically was trying to convince me to like Kataang(I was just speaking in general about how the only situation in which I ever have a problem myself with anyone supporting the Kataang ship themself even though it's not one that I'm personally fond of is if or when they do try and convince other people to see all the reason they think everyone should like and support Kataang just as much as they do too; in other words, I was specifically acknowledging that I appreciated and had zero beef with how she was talking about it in this video nor with anyone else, just so long as those particular lines aren't being crossed, I'm perfectly okay with different people have different reasons for not all liking or disliking all of the same exact things in the same exact ways all of the time).
However, her points involved talking about sibling dynamics, and I happen to have siblings and have a lot of extended family members as well as friends who also have siblings too and thus I personally know a thing or two about actual sibling dynamics and her points weren't very valid or universally applicable with regards to what is or isn't unusual sibling behavior. Even a younger sibling could view their older sibling more like that sibling was basically their child, all depending on personality types and/or levels of maturity/responsibility/etcetera, nevermind an older sibling-even if they are only two years apart in age.
Just because you personally think I made my comment for no reason doesn't actually make it true that there was no reason for it. And even if I did, it's still my prerogative what I decide to comment or not and why, not yours.
The comment sections literally exists specifically so that anyone who watches the video can discuss what's in the video and share their own thoughts on it or related to it or whatever else, regardless of whether they might actually align with or against what's in the video.
You could easily have just clicked or scrolled away if you really thought it was so pointless, too. 🙂
@Cjb242-ms8vw My point was that the fact Aang isn't all that many years younger than Katara(or the fact that they're relatively close in age) itself specifically has nothing to do with how likely it was or wasn't that she might or could have seen him like almost more of a younger sibling or even a child to her than anything else. Claiming that the fact he wasn't that much younger than her makes it any more unlikely that she would or could have seen him as more like a younger sibling or almost even like a child to her IS flawed and incorrect-and my personal experience being put in a position in real life where I personally ended up seeing people who weren't that much younger than me as basically more like they were my children than like actual close-in-age peers myself DOES prove that, just like the fact that Katara is practically like a mother even to her own actual and older sibling does. There are entirely platonic reasons that someone could get jealous of someone spending less time with them / more time with someone else, not only romantic reasons. Some people's cheeks turn red and/or they get flustered specifically because they are uncomfy and DON'T like something, not always because they're excited about it. But I also fully acknowledged that the animated series clearly intended for Kataang to be romantic and not just platonic. I was never debating whether or not Kataang actually was or wasn't a romantic couple in the animated series. I was only saying that I personally disagree that it should have been made romantic or nonplatonic relationship, and disagree that it actually was built up in a specifically romantic way that was supported outside of those clearly meant to be interpreted romantic moments that seemed almost out of character to me in some ways, and I can also see why some people might sometimes interpret certain reactions in the animated series in a different light than it was probably meant to be interpreted or than some other people might. And just because you are disgusted by the very thought of kissing lips with your siblings doesn't mean that literally everyone who isn't disgusted by it gets specifically romantically or such excited by it either-just because I can acknowledge that some people can and do kiss on the lips entirely platonically though doesn't mean that I personally do that with my siblings nor that I was trying to say this is what Kataang specifically were doing in the animated series either. This will probably be the last time I reply to you, though, since I'm not hear to just argue or repeat the same things over and over-so I'll bid you adieu, and I do hope you have a great upcoming week. 🙂💜
@Cjb242-ms8vw No, the video creator's comment in the video about Aang not being that much younger than Katara was brought up specifically in relation to some people's beliefs that Katara seemed to see Aang like much more of a younger sibling or even child to Katara while Aang kept just throwing himself at her again and again without respecting her boundaries right up until Aang went in a date or whatever with some other girl, and then suddenly she finally seemed to consider him as more than just friends in a way which came off to some people much more like she was kind of pressured into it from fear of upsetting him or losing his friendship or just because he and other people kept bringing it up and suggesting it or trying to push her toward considering it rather than because she actually liked him in that same way back for herself even before then. And the video's creator listed Aang not being that much younger than Katara specifically as one of the reasons why she personally didn't agree with people who believed that way / listed it specifically as one of the reasons why the video's creator personally thought it was not so likely or believable that Katara would possibly see Aang that way(as being almost like a child to her) at all and why she didn't agree with other fans who do see Aang's character more like Katara's little brother or maybe even a child in their eyes rather than like an actual or appropriate romantic interest for her. But, yeah, there are many people who find the idea of Kataang ickie specifically because when they were 14 year olds they were babysitting 12 year olds and younger and couldn't possibly imagine ever dating someone that young enough that they would have been made responsible for looking after them rather than just allowed to play together more like same-age or close-in-age peers while someone else/older looked out for them all together. That is still a valid reason for some people to dislike the ship or to see Aang like more of a younger sibling or child to her than like a love-interest and to find the idea of them being together romantically kind of squicky or unpleasant, even if he isn't THAT many years younger-it's not like they're both already fully grown adults so it's less likely that one of them would have to be responsible for the other rather than each being responsible for their own self completely independently. That's primarily all I was trying to point out.
@Cjb242-ms8vw Did you miss the part where I said that was the way that it seemed to some people? I never said that was actually how it was, nor did I ever say that literally everybody has to see it that same way as well. But it's kinda like how one person can hear someone say the words "I'm fine" and think it meant "I'm not doing well at all" while another person could hear the words "I'm fine" and think it meant "I'm doing perfectly well"-I'm saying that I can see/respect why different people can or do sometimes see things in completely different ways than other people might/do, regardless of who I or anybody else agrees with or sees it the same exact way as or not. You might not personally believe that Katara could get jealous of Aang spending time with someone else unless she was romantically interested in Aang herself, but that doesn't mean that it's actually totally and completely impossible or never ever happens that someone might get jealous for completely non-romantic reasons so some/other people may still believe that she might well could do so regardless of whether you believe they are right to think so or not and even regardless of whether that was how the creators of the animated series intended it to be understood by viewers or not, because audiences are allowed to feel their own ways about things for their own reasons sometimes even in spite of whatever the creator's intentions actually were or weren't. Even though the fortune teller didn't tell her it was Aang directly, some people still didn't like that it was the fact she thought the description of who the fortune teller said she would end up with sounded like Aang that made her suddenly seem to consider him an option rather than just the fact that all on her own she'd just gradually started to like him and consider ending up with him more and more not because she thought he might be who somebody else had told her that she would end up with but just because she had spontaneously grew to like him more and more-and even though he didn't initially tell her his feelings and she often initiated platonic hugs and such with him, it was made far more obvious to the audience that Aang liked her as more than just friends than it was ever made to the audience that Katara liked him as more than just friends and she still knew about his feelings first [in some people's opinions ]before she ever truly/seriously seemed to even consider showing or expressing any kind of obviously not-platonic interest in him; some people just prefer it when two characters come to like each other all on their own without knowing the other person's feelings first and without being told some idea of who they will end up with and then trying to just find whoever they think might best match that suggestion of who they'll supposedly end up with, some people would have liked to have more obviously seen that she had more than just platonic feelings for him a little more[ even if she hadn't consciously realized it yet herself it still could have been shown/suggested to the audience in how she talked about him or behaved around him or such more] even before she just suddenly got jealous after having initially turned him down. And I just personally think that is every bit as fair as some people genuinely liking the way Kataang actually played out just exactly how it was. Obviously, the creators of the show wanted people to believe that Katara was bothered by Aang spending time with the other girl because Katara had romantic feelings for him, since Kataang do end up together romantically in the end-but that doesn't change the fact that not everyone believed that she was shown to actually have had anything like romantic feelings for him before that particular moment and thus did not believe that she would or should have been bothered by seeing him with someone else at all or believed that she might have just been afraid that if Aang fell for someone else he might treat her differently or might stop having as much time to spend with the others doing their team avatar adventures just the way they had been before that, people can have weird and nonsensical fears and even though that didn't ever actually happen that still doesn't mean that she couldn't have still been worried that it might have and could have not wanted anything to change and could have been bothered for that reason instead not necessarily because she was romantically interested him just because she wanted things to stay the same and not change and some viewers might have believed that was why she was bothered rather than believing it was because secretly she really did have romantic feelings for him but hadn't admitted it yet. Even if Aang and the fortune teller did not deliberately push her toward liking him, it was still those things (knowing Aang liked her more than friends and being told by the fortune teller that she would end up with someone who she thought sounded like Aang) which did push her toward liking him in the animated series rather than it seeming as if she just came to like him a little more organically all on her own.
@Cjb242-ms8vw Because it might have been there, but it was[ for some people] subtle enough and/or sparsely scattered enough that it could easily be missed or often enough could have happened for other non-romantic reasons except for the most overt and obvious moments(like when they actually finally kiss). But nobody's denying that they did eventually end up clearly together in the very end, regardless of whether everybody agrees that they should have or agrees that it was built up well enough for everyone's liking or not. I think maybe it's not so much that people are insisting stuff wasn't there that actually was, it's just the fact that what is there wasn't built up in ways that everybody saw it coming or liked seeing it happen, so some people were initially thinking or hoping that maybe it was actually something else that was happening instead until it became more obvious that it wasn't something else at all but then they just didn't personally like what it really was better than they liked what it could have been yet wasn't(like if they personally see Katara as acting more like a mother or big-sister toward team avatar, of course they're going to find it weird to see her get romantically involved with someone but especially with basically the youngest and most kid-like member of the group who they may just have trouble imagining in romantic situations at all or may just not particularly enjoy seeing in a romantic light at all, even if that's not how everyone saw the way she acted toward absolutely everyone on the team). It's all in people's own perspectives, I s'pose. Lol
Can you hear the silence can you see the dark can you fix the broken can you feel my hea-a-a-a-art