@High_Kahl_Ray His hammer got a massive up in strength, his flamer has anti-vehicle +4, and he now has an aura where enemies withing 18" have hazardous on their ranged weapons
One particularly personal nitpick is cutting the Cultist Mob loadout down to only having the autopistol and sword instead of also having the cultist rifle and close combat weapon. I've been working for months on a personal project Traitor Guard army that is now incredibly off-model for WYSIWYG. Like I said, I realise this is probably just a "me" thing, but I'm salty James pissed in my cornflakes specifically after I built all these goddamn traitor guardsmen.
@@davidgantenbein9362 Oh for the actual "Traitor Guardsmen" unit absolutely, but what I meant is I was making the Cultist Mob units out of Guardsmen models too. The fluff was they were a regiment that got corrupted by ol Grandpa Nurgle. I had them kitted out with the Cultist Firearm loadout because soldiers with rifles, but apparently that doesn't exist anymore. My play group is casual enough we can just roll with it without WYSIWYG, but it's annoying on an aesthetic level after all that damn work.
@@theshamurai32I did understand you, I just hoped that there is a way to salvage your hard work … I also wonder what this may mean for DG & TS, where the load out is rifles, but the codex isn’t out yet.
@davidgantenbein9362 Ah, tracking with you now, my bad. On the brightside, at least they're still gonna look pretty cool and maybe in an edition or two they'll get their rifles back. GW can't ruin all my fun. Besides, I main Guard so I'm used to disappointment. Lol Also good point on the DG and Tsons.
I had 20 cultists with auto guns But I had plenty of bayonets from my guard army. Felt like a good mix to save a hundred dollars. I just rationalize their poor range to no training with firearms
Such a great model with great flavor and they refuse to let it be at all competitive after the sins of 9th despite the fact that it doesn't have anything like the same support!
I'm not sure which bugs me more; that Chaos does better with bikes, despite not having a dedicated detachment for them, than Astartes, who DO have said detachment, and a Chapter dedicated to that unit type, or the fact that they don't seem to have a Chaos Lord on Bike option, to lead the squad?
@@jordansedlacek5627 agree, they've teed it up and will wait until *something* before actually implementing it. Whether that something is financial, engagement/consumer morale or whatever.
Warpsmith can use a small points buff maybe but lord disco needs same love as him. Slap anti-vehicle to his melee weapons or give him +4 invul or lone operator while near to deamon engines and he is great.
I was gonna say that the Master of Possession has lost that 5+ feel no pain. I have only played 1 game with them, pre nerf, so are they still very good?
The Possessed also lost the Feel No Pain access through the MoP. 125 pts seems reasonable though. Overall the points look pretty ok, apart from on units that we never see used anyways.
Fingers crossed that the next update makes Terminators a bit more reasonably priced. I just dont see the point of them at 185/5. Chosen and Possessed make them seem like a joke. They're just way, way too expensive for models that cant effectively touch vehicles without crits. The thoughness banding changes really screwed over units that relied on melta and power fists, and GW took it a step further and removed our meltaguns.
I completely disagree as terminators with a termi sorcerer lord as I run them can deepstrike, proceed to delete an entire infantry unit hopefully elite infantry and then swing charge and swing on a vehicle with REROLLS to hit and fish for crits with deathex to make you have AP 4 power fists and chainfists. And they’re now a nuisance to deal with on the board that leaves room for the rest of your army to make its moves
@jinguini8001 i mean they're wounding vehicles on 5s and 6s natively. Some Legions can give RR wounds, some Legions can give +1 to wound, some give better pacts to bypass the low str. But even then, why buff a unit that cant do the job baseline, into something that can do it at a medocre level, instead of buffing something good to make it great? I think that even in Red Corsairs with their RR hits and wounds and bonus AP, termies end up coming short compared to Bikers for bolter fire and Chosen for melee bruising. If i'm paying 185 for a squad, it needs to be anti-everything. Trust me, i really want Abaddon, a Termi Sorc, and at least 10 termies in any given build, but the Terminators simply arent a build around unit anymore. The 5 mark abby bomb meme that made them viable as a gimick got stripped when Abby lost his god keywords. Now, I'd almost universally rather have a Rhino with 5 Chosen in it, than I would a squad of 5 Termies.
Termis in general pay way too much for a 2+ armor save that'll almost always be knocked down to a 4+ by 3 damage weapons. The problem is its way too easy to kill elite units while hordes or light infantry will almost always have a 5+ save, maybe 6+, but cost like 10% per model. There's few weapons that kill hordes of light infantry effectively for the cost. There's *plenty* of anti meq and anti termi. For every army.
Having just read my chaos codex, i have noticed that every single instance of "combi weapon" has had its ap put down from -1 to 0. This likely wont have much effect given anti infantry 4+ dev wounds, but very very odd they would even bother to make that change?
Glad you have a fun and viable army, at the expense of everyone else's fun whose armies struggle to keep up with god-awful rules that leaves CSM at an objective advantage.
This is all very reasonable. You could gripe about one or two units you wanted to use, but if you still insist on using it, you still could and not pay too big of a price. Overall very solid.
I'm thinking they have to be making a new chaos biker model or it's about to go to legends. I feel like they massively buff old/unpopular models to try and sell as much as they can first
Don't know what made anyone zero in on a Possessed and Mop nerf when they don't gain any synergies what so ever in the codex. Okay and fun models made "meh" for no reason.
If they wanted to nerf the dev wound anti psyker sniping they could just have worded the possesed abillity "the units melee weapons gains dev wounds".. But i'm sure they don't go through many steps of consideration at the rules department
For me it was obvious to play Abby and Chosen, now it is even better. However dont know in which detachment I am gonna have him get more use... Have to test them.
Gw intentionally under costing that will very clearly be removed in fhe future just to clear stock before removing is one of the many reasons i print 100% of my models.
I’ve seen many games with the new warp talon rules and it’s not as easy as it’s being made out for them to be broken every turn and can be command points heavy in certain detachments. There not as broken as made out
They are broken as hell, but they are kind of limited to 1 unit due to Rapid Ingress dependancy. 10 dudes for 220 pts is such a joke. Surely made my day!
They fucked 2 units I always play, Oblits and Possessed. I don't get it as you didn't even see them in the big competitive lists; as if that really needs to be how everything in our game is judged.
I just skimmed through the field manual; BRO the Venomcrawler at 110 pts is nuts! Possessed down to 25 points a model, Hellbrute at 130 pts. The Lord of Skulls now at 450 for CSM is also going to be crazy for the Vashtoor detachment. I am so excited to piece together a new Deamon Engine list!
I LOVE the Defiler…. But on what planet do you put it at the same price as a forgefiend and expect it to see play….. (apart from me….) TANKSHOCK *jazz hands*
@@archiecastle6076oh no, the changed some Wargear Not like Deathwing terminators lost their melee options or Companions are fucking useless despite being our bladeguard equivalent
Lament for the Lion. There's a clip online from L Dempsey showcasing the new Chaos Marines codex vs DAs. Daemon prince tanked all Lions hits and one shotted him in return in one of the worst dice betrayals I've ever seen. So much for the Monster Hunter of Caliban. 300 points or not, he can't get the job done in his current state. Anyway, glad chaos fans are having a good time
Us Custodes, whose Adrasite Spears got replaced with standard guardian spears and still haven't gotten fixed to have appropriate profiles 3 months later: First Time?
Must be nice to have a points reduction after nerfs. Wish they'd learned that before publishing the book shaped excrement that was the DA codex supplement and munitorum.
@@timhorsburgh2193 it’s crazy how some people can still have gripes about things, but because it isn’t the worst problem they aren’t allowed to have an opinion right?
@@timhorsburgh2193 As a Codex Marines player, I'd be happy with only minor nerfs to rules as well (for the most part), as opposed to the army wide neutering we got. Seriously.
@@LordKrosis To be fair, that honor belongs to Admech or Custodes. But CSM is like a rich man losing 5 dollars, whereas DA and Codex Marines are declaring bankruptcy. And Custodes are just out in a ditch somewhere.
You're telling me, Custodes are still struggling even *after* a points buff that *still* left us at pretty much the absolute bottom in terms of viability for both casual and competitive play. *We're still missing our Adrasite spears. They still have standard bolter profiles.*
If ur won't new chaos bikes us outriders plus chaos heads & us different wepons on the sqod leder and buy the horses upgraded kit two do the speshal wepons with the updates that shud be ezaly done
Whoever is writing rules at GW right now just has a massive hardon for Chaos and Xenos dominating the fields right now. Probably got their shit kicked in one time by Dark Angels or Custodes and had the temper tantrum of the millennium, bringing us to where we are today.
I'm not thrilled about an Abbadon point cut cuz I want him permanently removed from the setting. At least the codex looks like it will have some fun units at these point costs.
Traitor Guard should be 55pts, Felgore Beastmen should be 65pts, Cultist Firebrand should be like 25pts. Really painful for those who like Lost and Damned lists
This is insulting as a Custodes player. We're *still* waiting for very necessary fixes and buffs, literally missing weapons, multiple months later, and CSM gets big fixes and buffs within the month? Glad Chaos is having fun, but GW can go royally screw themselves if this is the bias they're having for 10th Ed. The current state of the hobby is worse than Warhammer Fantasy: The End Times, where you were at an overall disadvantage in every way if you weren't playing some form of Chaos affiliated faction.
So they just straight up made the Venomcrawler worse? Why? Who is going into melee with a Venomcrawler with its six attacks? It doesn't even heal wounds any more! Why are GW so insistent on making this edition so bad??
Look, I don't know about you, but the crawler at 110 points is far from bad. It's quick, still fairly durable, has excellent shooting and melee, and an ability that makes it very good. Don't you think they got rid of the whole healing thing because it was kinda broken? You throw that into a horde, and your crawler will likely never die
@@gavinziozios1431 It isn't the healing that bothers me. It was the fact that they stopped its best (only...) perk from working with shooting, the only thing it was good at.
@@DeathInTheSnow It makes complete sense why they would. It doesn't even make sense lore-wise. And it's melee and ranged profiles are almost the exact same. I think you're just looking for a reason to complain
So how many points for boarding shields or volkite chargers? Whats that? Still not actually using the tech they have access to? Of course not! That would take effort and give sales to the 30k team... cant have that! GW silo principle prevents consumer friendly practices. But hey! Lets keep pretending they are healthy!
Unless you've been living under a rock this entire time, wargear is free and GW is trying to sever 30k from 40k because it actually hurts them if they share sales. Also, believe it or not 10,000 years is a long time, and equipment can be lost in that time 🤯
@LordCrate-du8zm many of the traitors from the HH have only experienced a small period of time between the Heresy to today due to warp time being weird.
@@oliverp3545 not all the time, no. Besides, most Heresy-era equipment like Leviathan Dreadnoughts and Volkite were surprisingly rare even for their time period.
I guess there will also be a Word Bearers codex as there is no real Word Bearers detachment that works with their lore, eg Dark Apostles, cultists and Possessed.
@@NeloBladeOfRanni Word bearers have to worship all the gods and in zealots you can mark them with different gods or give them undivided. It seems to me that it represents them perfectly and if not, the one from "chaos cult" also gives the vibes of a word bearer
@@jaimevilacastro4614 In a perfect world Word Bearers would have: -Posessed have devastating wounds all the time. -Re-roll run/charge rolls -All models can only have Undivided (excluding allies). -Special items for Dark Apostles Apostles -Strategem to temporarily switch to another mark from Undivided for 1 round, which in term gives a Dark Pact bonus, build in this is the option to have multiple units do so but with increased CP cost.
CSM gets buffed in their codex, points buffs, and doesn't have crap value boxes. Tau gets rules sidegrades, points nerfs on anything that could have been decent, and worse value boxes. I think GW has a favorite.
@@NeloBladeOfRanniRight. Been playing them since 3rd edition (started collecting during 2nd) and the usual reaction has been "ok, we're Chaos. How are we getting screwed compared to loyalists this time?"
We are not even allowed our 5 minutes in the sun without somebody complaining. This is why we can't have nice things. Some armies had it too good for too many years/editions to start complaining now.
@@captaincorundum9788 always appreciate the “oh you don’t have it the worst so your criticisms aren’t valid.” Mentality. People can vent and have criticisms when something gets worse so do everyone a favor and take your own advice and shut your mouth.
@@WilhelmScreamer 8" is not really a "limitation" to it, as it still can gives fire support to infantry infrount🤦🏻♂️ And with Iron Warrior's detachment, this T13 monster is even harder to kill from range, but as a melee-buff machine, close combat is more risky to take it🤦🏻♂️
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 80 | คู่เอก "รักษ์ vs ยอดนำชัย"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ckLMRorsMeY/mqdefault.jpg)
GW clearly waiting until everyone converts all their Firstborn biker models to Chaos before punting them into legends with a chortle.
At least now, they made Vashtorr WORTH the 190 points
He honestly looks kind of okay
I feel like om missing how he's changed. How's he ok now?
@High_Kahl_Ray His hammer got a massive up in strength, his flamer has anti-vehicle +4, and he now has an aura where enemies withing 18" have hazardous on their ranged weapons
@@gavinziozios1431also tougnes 10
@@humbertoharo6840 Also toughness 10, yes
One particularly personal nitpick is cutting the Cultist Mob loadout down to only having the autopistol and sword instead of also having the cultist rifle and close combat weapon. I've been working for months on a personal project Traitor Guard army that is now incredibly off-model for WYSIWYG. Like I said, I realise this is probably just a "me" thing, but I'm salty James pissed in my cornflakes specifically after I built all these goddamn traitor guardsmen.
Can‘t you use those models as traitor guardsmen? They still have rifle plus basic melee weapon on the data sheet.
@@davidgantenbein9362 Oh for the actual "Traitor Guardsmen" unit absolutely, but what I meant is I was making the Cultist Mob units out of Guardsmen models too. The fluff was they were a regiment that got corrupted by ol Grandpa Nurgle. I had them kitted out with the Cultist Firearm loadout because soldiers with rifles, but apparently that doesn't exist anymore. My play group is casual enough we can just roll with it without WYSIWYG, but it's annoying on an aesthetic level after all that damn work.
@@theshamurai32I did understand you, I just hoped that there is a way to salvage your hard work … I also wonder what this may mean for DG & TS, where the load out is rifles, but the codex isn’t out yet.
@davidgantenbein9362 Ah, tracking with you now, my bad. On the brightside, at least they're still gonna look pretty cool and maybe in an edition or two they'll get their rifles back. GW can't ruin all my fun. Besides, I main Guard so I'm used to disappointment. Lol
Also good point on the DG and Tsons.
I had 20 cultists with auto guns
But I had plenty of bayonets from my guard army. Felt like a good mix to save a hundred dollars. I just rationalize their poor range to no training with firearms
Alpha Legion with infiltrators and cheaper bikes for an unusually speedy CSM army will be good, I'm backing them for some wins.
Im sad that lord discordants didn't got a points drop and the oblit point drop wasnt enough (I was expecting 150-160)
I don't understand what their thoughts are on the lord discordant, it's sooo goddamn bad
Such a great model with great flavor and they refuse to let it be at all competitive after the sins of 9th despite the fact that it doesn't have anything like the same support!
@@hamishwalker9637 GW has a tendency to "punish" units for being good in previous editions by making them over costed in the current one.
@@JimH.Exactly what I was about to say. It's a damn shame, love the disco lord.
Were eating good boys! Iron Within, Iron Without!!!
✊️✊️✊️
YEEESSSSSSSSSS
IRON WITHIN BROTHER ! 💀
RAAAAGH🗣️🗣️
I'm not sure which bugs me more; that Chaos does better with bikes, despite not having a dedicated detachment for them, than Astartes, who DO have said detachment, and a Chapter dedicated to that unit type, or the fact that they don't seem to have a Chaos Lord on Bike option, to lead the squad?
Red Corsairs have had a 'dudes and bikes' gameplay motif for a while now.
I'm certain there's an almost 99% chance we're getting new Chaos Bikers models with Biker Lord in 11th edition, which will be 2+ years from now.
Can't have codex marines be good
@@jordansedlacek5627 agree, they've teed it up and will wait until *something* before actually implementing it. Whether that something is financial, engagement/consumer morale or whatever.
I think its clear the Astartes need a major buff.
Warpsmith can use a small points buff maybe but lord disco needs same love as him. Slap anti-vehicle to his melee weapons or give him +4 invul or lone operator while near to deamon engines and he is great.
Heldrakes and Lord Discordants have paid for their sins long enough. It's about time they become at least usable. Also, new Defiler kit please.
I would love to see a revamped Defiler. I actually rather like the idea of it, but it's sorta...jank as it is now.
Heldrakes will never be useable gw doesn't want to see flyers.
@@getjinxed7354 I honestly think that the Heldrake can be made into a monstrous creature rules-wise and most people would be fine with it.
IRON WARRIORS SHALL REIGN SUPREME!
IRON WITHIN. IRON WITHOUT!
Iron Within Iron Without
Editions go by, but nothing still beats The Possessedbomb
Too true, had a match yesterday where they just cut straight through an entire unit of hellblasters and two characters.. It was a slaughter.
I was gonna say that the Master of Possession has lost that 5+ feel no pain. I have only played 1 game with them, pre nerf, so are they still very good?
@@rookcapcoldblood2618I think they’re best with the new slaves to darkness. 15 points for intoxicating elixir is worth it for the buffs
@@00die00991 Doesn't that enhancement only give the bearer the 5+ FNP? Or did this change from index to codex?
It's just the bearer lmao. Fnp is almost non existant in csm these days
Kinda wish the loyalist tac squad would just get a copy of the Legionaries datasheet at this point. Never realised it was so similar.
Possessed and oblit nerf hurts a lot
Agreed. They really didn’t need it. Its not like people were abusing these. You never saw them in strong tournament lists
Abaddon costs as much as a C'Tan which is horribly wrong and either one should change
RIP Obliterators. They were so fun even after many point raises. Ran 8 of them. Now they are totally unplayable.
Unforch
Why?
@@mtrunkello capped at 2 models. You can bring 6 tops atm
@@JordanR ugh thats rough. I hate when they cannot balance their game so they limit max unit size. Such a lame way
Desolators offer a seat next to them.
The Possessed also lost the Feel No Pain access through the MoP. 125 pts seems reasonable though.
Overall the points look pretty ok, apart from on units that we never see used anyways.
I’m pretty sure zealouts can get it from intoxicating elixir for 15 points
@00die00991 Last I looked that only apples to the model who equipped it.
Maulerfiends sitting at the same price as a squad of chosen is super interesting, I’d be tempted to take a few as late game skirmish tools
Probably a controversial take here, but I would prefer the Accursed Cultists regen instead of the reactive move. Tis life.
Fingers crossed that the next update makes Terminators a bit more reasonably priced. I just dont see the point of them at 185/5. Chosen and Possessed make them seem like a joke.
They're just way, way too expensive for models that cant effectively touch vehicles without crits. The thoughness banding changes really screwed over units that relied on melta and power fists, and GW took it a step further and removed our meltaguns.
I completely disagree as terminators with a termi sorcerer lord as I run them can deepstrike, proceed to delete an entire infantry unit hopefully elite infantry and then swing charge and swing on a vehicle with REROLLS to hit and fish for crits with deathex to make you have AP 4 power fists and chainfists. And they’re now a nuisance to deal with on the board that leaves room for the rest of your army to make its moves
@jinguini8001 i mean they're wounding vehicles on 5s and 6s natively. Some Legions can give RR wounds, some Legions can give +1 to wound, some give better pacts to bypass the low str. But even then, why buff a unit that cant do the job baseline, into something that can do it at a medocre level, instead of buffing something good to make it great? I think that even in Red Corsairs with their RR hits and wounds and bonus AP, termies end up coming short compared to Bikers for bolter fire and Chosen for melee bruising.
If i'm paying 185 for a squad, it needs to be anti-everything. Trust me, i really want Abaddon, a Termi Sorc, and at least 10 termies in any given build, but the Terminators simply arent a build around unit anymore. The 5 mark abby bomb meme that made them viable as a gimick got stripped when Abby lost his god keywords. Now, I'd almost universally rather have a Rhino with 5 Chosen in it, than I would a squad of 5 Termies.
Termis in general pay way too much for a 2+ armor save that'll almost always be knocked down to a 4+ by 3 damage weapons. The problem is its way too easy to kill elite units while hordes or light infantry will almost always have a 5+ save, maybe 6+, but cost like 10% per model.
There's few weapons that kill hordes of light infantry effectively for the cost. There's *plenty* of anti meq and anti termi. For every army.
I had a 2020 point list sitting waiting for the new points, this update makes it legal for 2k so im happy :D
Having just read my chaos codex, i have noticed that every single instance of "combi weapon" has had its ap put down from -1 to 0.
This likely wont have much effect given anti infantry 4+ dev wounds, but very very odd they would even bother to make that change?
Iron warriors player will eat good tonight with Forge/MaulerF(r)iends points drop
We now have a pretty fun and viable army to use, I hope meta wan kers don't ruin the fun.
They probably will they ruin everything they touch
@NeloBladeOfRanni they do
Every single time
@@NeloBladeOfRanni funny how they can ruin something youre not obliged to follow at any point
Glad you have a fun and viable army, at the expense of everyone else's fun whose armies struggle to keep up with god-awful rules that leaves CSM at an objective advantage.
@allthenamesiwantedweretaken I didn't cause the problem so why are you getting mad?
This is all very reasonable. You could gripe about one or two units you wanted to use, but if you still insist on using it, you still could and not pay too big of a price. Overall very solid.
I'm thinking they have to be making a new chaos biker model or it's about to go to legends. I feel like they massively buff old/unpopular models to try and sell as much as they can first
Time to sell old chaos biker units they always buff things to clear old stock before legends but in this case probably new models soon.
Don't know what made anyone zero in on a Possessed and Mop nerf when they don't gain any synergies what so ever in the codex. Okay and fun models made "meh" for no reason.
If they wanted to nerf the dev wound anti psyker sniping they could just have worded the possesed abillity "the units melee weapons gains dev wounds"..
But i'm sure they don't go through many steps of consideration at the rules department
Good to see accursed got a points decrease. I think this pushes them into being a valid option, especially within their new detachment.
For me it was obvious to play Abby and Chosen, now it is even better. However dont know in which detachment I am gonna have him get more use... Have to test them.
And there goes the raptor boxes online haha.
I wish they gave anything in termie armour a price cut. Right now Power armour is just too good.
As a codex space marine the statement "power armor is too good" confuses the fuck out of me lmao
I must say, as a custodes/dark angels player I’m very jealous
Man a 3 man squad of chaos bikes costs the same as 10 traitor guardsmen. Im so glad i converted horus heresy bikes into chaos jetbikes
Huh, OK this is all surprisingly good, sure some units could have used a buff, but none of them went up in points so I call this a win
Gw intentionally under costing that will very clearly be removed in fhe future just to clear stock before removing is one of the many reasons i print 100% of my models.
I’ve seen many games with the new warp talon rules and it’s not as easy as it’s being made out for them to be broken every turn and can be command points heavy in certain detachments. There not as broken as made out
They are broken as hell, but they are kind of limited to 1 unit due to Rapid Ingress dependancy. 10 dudes for 220 pts is such a joke. Surely made my day!
They fucked 2 units I always play, Oblits and Possessed. I don't get it as you didn't even see them in the big competitive lists; as if that really needs to be how everything in our game is judged.
No fun allowed.
MY TZEENTCHIAN OBLITERATORS! NO!
Team responsible for Imperial codexes should be restructured, looking hov Chaos team is writing rules
Fired. Replaced. Or at least reeducated. Good lord.
Gw making the units cost less points IG but more money IRL. Wow i wonder what their motiation was here 🤔
Happy that my boys are looking strong. Dreading the nerfs that will inevitably follow soon.
Venomcrawlers get a nerf and no point drop, but the forgefeind drops. Umm. Thanks for the easy decision i guess. Hahaha
Did Venomcrawler recieve a stealth buff to its guns?
I thought Lucius was removed from this book?
I just skimmed through the field manual; BRO the Venomcrawler at 110 pts is nuts! Possessed down to 25 points a model, Hellbrute at 130 pts.
The Lord of Skulls now at 450 for CSM is also going to be crazy for the Vashtoor detachment. I am so excited to piece together a new Deamon Engine list!
I woud like to see some stronge list for every detachment. After the point changes😃
In addition to all of these point reductions, a small note in the back of the book increases the costs of IG manticores by 15pts for... reasons.
Wat?
More points for all indirect stupidity
I LOVE the Defiler…. But on what planet do you put it at the same price as a forgefiend and expect it to see play….. (apart from me….) TANKSHOCK *jazz hands*
Forgefiend only for shooting, defiler have shot and melee+ amazing tank shock and counterattack free
*Cries in Dark Angels*
Cries in codex marines. Fuck GW.
@@Klierowski *Weeps in Deathwing Knight*
@@archiecastle6076oh no, the changed some Wargear
Not like Deathwing terminators lost their melee options or Companions are fucking useless despite being our bladeguard equivalent
Lament for the Lion. There's a clip online from L Dempsey showcasing the new Chaos Marines codex vs DAs. Daemon prince tanked all Lions hits and one shotted him in return in one of the worst dice betrayals I've ever seen. So much for the Monster Hunter of Caliban. 300 points or not, he can't get the job done in his current state. Anyway, glad chaos fans are having a good time
Us Custodes, whose Adrasite Spears got replaced with standard guardian spears and still haven't gotten fixed to have appropriate profiles 3 months later: First Time?
They're never going to make the Defiler viable. Too many people are still salty over it being able to fire indirect.
Must be nice to have a points reduction after nerfs. Wish they'd learned that before publishing the book shaped excrement that was the DA codex supplement and munitorum.
Amazingly enough, it still hasn't stopped some CSM players complaining. I would kill to have a codex that was even half as good.
@@timhorsburgh2193 it’s crazy how some people can still have gripes about things, but because it isn’t the worst problem they aren’t allowed to have an opinion right?
@@timhorsburgh2193 As a Codex Marines player, I'd be happy with only minor nerfs to rules as well (for the most part), as opposed to the army wide neutering we got. Seriously.
@@LordKrosis To be fair, that honor belongs to Admech or Custodes. But CSM is like a rich man losing 5 dollars, whereas DA and Codex Marines are declaring bankruptcy.
And Custodes are just out in a ditch somewhere.
You're telling me, Custodes are still struggling even *after* a points buff that *still* left us at pretty much the absolute bottom in terms of viability for both casual and competitive play.
*We're still missing our Adrasite spears. They still have standard bolter profiles.*
Think the accursed cultists points drop is going to be a mistake. People are going to abuse their D3 revived models with the enhancement.
The Jump Lord at 90? (Looks at my 10man Raptors I have on my shelf and the more I have coming next week) Nice.
They do online points, but cant bother with online rules... big brains play
If ur won't new chaos bikes us outriders plus chaos heads & us different wepons on the sqod leder and buy the horses upgraded kit two do the speshal wepons with the updates that shud be ezaly done
Crazy I didn't even see many big nerfs to CSM and they got points buffs anyway. Wondering why Dark Angels got the shot end of the stck again🤔🤔🤔
Hang on aren't CM already pretty good? Could push them up well to the top.
Ikr? Meanwhile SM got nerfed in their codex when they were already bad xD
Whoever is writing rules at GW right now just has a massive hardon for Chaos and Xenos dominating the fields right now.
Probably got their shit kicked in one time by Dark Angels or Custodes and had the temper tantrum of the millennium, bringing us to where we are today.
they had like 40% win rate after quadruple nerf on chosen/lord and AC/DC
Are the enhancement points out yet?
I'm not thrilled about an Abbadon point cut cuz I want him permanently removed from the setting. At least the codex looks like it will have some fun units at these point costs.
Heldraaaaaake....!😔
Oh cultis with fire arms are in the legends
Discolord and Heldrake are the two obvious datasheets to be changed (the most useless and overpriced units), but GW doesn't care. 👀
while I appreciate the update and the new units added to the app, they locked us out of seeing the content until the codex, which releases in 4 days
Dafuq they smoke again? Forge Fiend is equal to Redemptor, it should cost the same.
Traitor Guard should be 55pts, Felgore Beastmen should be 65pts, Cultist Firebrand should be like 25pts. Really painful for those who like Lost and Damned lists
This is insulting as a Custodes player. We're *still* waiting for very necessary fixes and buffs, literally missing weapons, multiple months later, and CSM gets big fixes and buffs within the month?
Glad Chaos is having fun, but GW can go royally screw themselves if this is the bias they're having for 10th Ed. The current state of the hobby is worse than Warhammer Fantasy: The End Times, where you were at an overall disadvantage in every way if you weren't playing some form of Chaos affiliated faction.
So they just straight up made the Venomcrawler worse? Why? Who is going into melee with a Venomcrawler with its six attacks? It doesn't even heal wounds any more! Why are GW so insistent on making this edition so bad??
My guess is it's fast movement.
"Ignore everything good, talk only about bad."
The warhammer community whenever GW does anything
Look, I don't know about you, but the crawler at 110 points is far from bad. It's quick, still fairly durable, has excellent shooting and melee, and an ability that makes it very good. Don't you think they got rid of the whole healing thing because it was kinda broken? You throw that into a horde, and your crawler will likely never die
@@gavinziozios1431 It isn't the healing that bothers me. It was the fact that they stopped its best (only...) perk from working with shooting, the only thing it was good at.
@@DeathInTheSnow It makes complete sense why they would. It doesn't even make sense lore-wise. And it's melee and ranged profiles are almost the exact same. I think you're just looking for a reason to complain
GW doing everything they can to make playing any Imperium faction as miserable of an experience as possible:
So how many points for boarding shields or volkite chargers? Whats that? Still not actually using the tech they have access to? Of course not! That would take effort and give sales to the 30k team... cant have that! GW silo principle prevents consumer friendly practices.
But hey! Lets keep pretending they are healthy!
Unless you've been living under a rock this entire time, wargear is free and GW is trying to sever 30k from 40k because it actually hurts them if they share sales.
Also, believe it or not 10,000 years is a long time, and equipment can be lost in that time 🤯
@LordCrate-du8zm you do realise time flows differently in the warp it very well may not have been 10000 years for the csm
@LordCrate-du8zm many of the traitors from the HH have only experienced a small period of time between the Heresy to today due to warp time being weird.
@@oliverp3545 not all the time, no. Besides, most Heresy-era equipment like Leviathan Dreadnoughts and Volkite were surprisingly rare even for their time period.
@@NeloBladeOfRanni you do realize that that’s not universally true?
I guess there will also be a Word Bearers codex as there is no real Word Bearers detachment that works with their lore, eg Dark Apostles, cultists and Possessed.
You have Two actually.
Zealots (Index rewrite)
Chaos cult (damned and heavy apostles)
@@jaimevilacastro4614 zealots goes against the WB lore tho they look down heavily upon those who devote themselves to one god
@@NeloBladeOfRanni Word bearers have to worship all the gods and in zealots you can mark them with different gods or give them undivided. It seems to me that it represents them perfectly and if not, the one from "chaos cult" also gives the vibes of a word bearer
@@jaimevilacastro4614 In a perfect world Word Bearers would have:
-Posessed have devastating wounds all the time.
-Re-roll run/charge rolls
-All models can only have Undivided (excluding allies).
-Special items for Dark Apostles Apostles
-Strategem to temporarily switch to another mark from Undivided for 1 round, which in term gives a Dark Pact bonus, build in this is the option to have multiple units do so but with increased CP cost.
GW here - Your codex is out of date, soz
CSM gets buffed in their codex, points buffs, and doesn't have crap value boxes.
Tau gets rules sidegrades, points nerfs on anything that could have been decent, and worse value boxes.
I think GW has a favorite.
SM and Knight players: "First time?"
Chaos marines are far from GWs favourite lmao
@@NeloBladeOfRanniRight. Been playing them since 3rd edition (started collecting during 2nd) and the usual reaction has been "ok, we're Chaos. How are we getting screwed compared to loyalists this time?"
@CorporalCookie same never forget our horrible 6th ed codex that arguably rivals 10th ed admech for how bad it is
We are not even allowed our 5 minutes in the sun without somebody complaining. This is why we can't have nice things. Some armies had it too good for too many years/editions to start complaining now.
Not even Horus can save the CSM now
But they got off pretty good?
CSM are strong
I don’t know how anyone can look at this and say it’s bad when the Admech and Dangels are right there. CSM players are doing fine.
Be quiet and appreciate your awesome book
@@captaincorundum9788 always appreciate the “oh you don’t have it the worst so your criticisms aren’t valid.” Mentality. People can vent and have criticisms when something gets worse so do everyone a favor and take your own advice and shut your mouth.
Well, looks like my Master of Possession will be joing my Disco Lord in the display case for the remainder of 10th 🥲
God this is creazy, CSM were strong before that, now? I CAN SEE A LOT OF GREEN colour, fuck this game - Codex space marine player.
LoS didn't change it's point🥲
OK, Ready for 3 LoS if you face CSM afterwards🥲🤦🏻♂️
Lord of Skulls?
I imagine the ability to actually move on boards is the limiting factor
@@WilhelmScreamer 8" is not really a "limitation" to it, as it still can gives fire support to infantry infrount🤦🏻♂️
And with Iron Warrior's detachment, this T13 monster is even harder to kill from range, but as a melee-buff machine, close combat is more risky to take it🤦🏻♂️
@@The_Penguin_8964 its a limitation in terms of ability to select targets at range and to leverage its extreme melee killiness
Its a big fat model