10:41 Exactly! This has been my realisation a few years back now. Bodybuilding belongs to naturals et we should just call it like that. And we should separate it from enhanced bodybuilding. Because right now, PEDs users are so all over the place on the internet, that we say "bodybuilding" for the drugs up freaks and "natural bodybuilding" for the rest of us (which is at least 95% of the fitness industry tbf). It should be the other way around: Bodybuilding (ie: natties) and enhanced bodybuilding. By normalazing the term for us naturals, it'll greatly help!
This speaks to me. I was following layne, Jeff and other guys who push power building. I was strong for my size but not impressive compare to power lifter. I have a decent physique but wouldn’t place in a competition. I’ve moved away from it since I got rotator cuff injury and multiple back injuries and i stopped doing low rep. My physique is at it best right now since I focus more on bodybuilding style rep ranges and mind muscles connection. Thanks for your message because I’ve learned a lot since I followed you this year.
Earlier this week, I convinced one of my fellow lifters to use measurements as a quantifiable way of determining progress. He was very used to knowing all of his numbers on barbell compounds, but was struggling with arms and not making progress (on appearance I surmised). I told him to consider logging his lifts and check his arm size occasionally. I think he had an epiphany at that moment, where he could see the parallels to the other parts of training that were working. Just going through the motions at the gym isn't going to get you anywhere. Where I think it matters is not letting yourself drift into mediocrity. Taking an easy solution is...well... easy. Pursuing a goal, and truly pushing toward achieving it is where you truly learn about yourself and really start to benefit from that journey. I appreciate your video about strength standards a couple of weeks ago. It got me thinking about goals. It's a subtle mindset shift and puts a little more intention into the process. I'm finding that intent in my workouts is providing overall focus. While I usually shy away from external competition due to time constraints and it not really being aligned with my overall goals, I can still use internal competition (with myself) to drive myself to new levels.
Yeah it really does, doesn't it. I didn't want to touch on the whole 'what is a woman' angle again as that may just have made some heads explode lol but you're right.
What you say is true. Personally, I always considered it a tongue in check term. People that like the big lifts, don't plan on competing and wanna get jacked. I never took the term seriously since it isn't competitive.
I would urge people to watch the full video. You've replied here only a few minutes after this 30 minute video was premiered. Your points are covered in full.
Similar experience at 44 years old. 20+ years of bodybuilding with mediocre results. IMO strength > aesthetics in terms of value as long as not neglecting work capacity or GPP type activities.
Powerbuilding could be done like those old school bronze and silver era hercules shows, where bodybuilders would also do feats of strength alongside showing off their physique. If done with the big 3, it could be a "powerbuilding" show, and if done with a variety of lifts it could be "strong-body-building" (a conjunction of strongman and bb, where the goal is to build a strong and impressive physique). The line between this and cross-fit would slowly start to blur however. If they kept the event times to under 90 seconds it might start to differentiate it.
Tbh, you are the only person I know talking about powerbuilding. Did someone hurt you? I know a lot of people who like to look good but also like to have high numbers on the barbell lifts. I'd say it's completely fine, not everyone only cares about competition like you. A lot of people also like to have fun doing what they are doing
I think it's a natural disdain from trainers who have achieved an excellent physique. They see newbies hitting better near maximal lifts without great physiques. They get triggered. How about videos on how to improve powerbuilding routines or potential pitfalls??
I thoroughly enjoyed this conversation. A lot of the points were transferable to other aspects of life as well. "It's never a good idea to live a lie. You're not going to grow if you continuously embrace this lie. We only grow by putting ourselves in difficult positions." Also "man boobs and jiggly bits" cracks me up every time lol.
Rip powerbuilding 2015 ~ 2023 They has the best of both excuses. Fun fact: BBing translates to Health and Aesthetics in Chinese (健美） PLing translates to Health and Strength. (健力）No translation for PBing.
Life long early intermediate Started Stronglifts in 2009 First powerlifting comp in 2015! Enjoying grappling since 2019 Fazs channel intrigued me in 2022 and he somehow persuaded me to consider 'natural bodybuilding', hate the term but joints and cns feel better, started direct arm work, isolations, machine compounds, programming by body part not dead/squat and press. I now feel a bit like Chad Waterbury the anti bodybuilding hypertrophy guy...
Well done video Faz. About 3-4 months ago I took "powerbuilding" out of my IG bio. It was due to a lot of the reasons you stated here. There really is no set definition which is it's downfall, If someone looks at your bio and it says the word "powerbuilder", most general population lifters won't know wtf it even means. I think the best way to describe myself now would be a bodybuilder & general strength enjoyer.
Thank you for watching it through. Yeah we used to just call ourselves 'lifters' that was what I called myself before I competed. I think strength enjoyer, bodybuilder all work too.
@@Fazlifts I think part of it is marketing too. A lot of coaches are taught to have a "unique opportunity". A lot of coaches resort to that being powerbuilding.
I definitely think strength progression is very important but lately I've been doing more volume than normal and I think I'm noticing some positive changes to my physique. I've always been a believer in strength progression as being the most important thing to focus on but I've gone through periods of training (especially the last couple of years) where my lifts were consistently going up for months and months with no real changes to my physique. Since adding the extra volume and noticing a change, I'm started to second guess if strength is as important as an advanced lifter. Obviously for beginners and intermediates the strength progression is king but I've been lifting for over 15 years and maybe it's time to consider the possibility I would benefit from more volume and less of an emphasis on getting stronger every workout. Curious to hear your thoughts on this.
Awesome to hear. Yeah I mean I’ve always been a lower to moderate volume guy with the mindset of “strength equals size”. I really do love training by ramping to an all out set of a top weight and moving onto the next exercise but I think I’ll experiment with the volume for a bit. Maybe the benefits are just exaggerated in my head and I don’t look any different lol who knows. At one point many years ago I was doing a ton of sets for the big muscle groups and I did have a certain “look” that I don’t now despite being bigger now. Stay tuned for more lol.
Yeah I think your experience is very valid. I've certainly seen my own response to certain training parameters change over the years. I feel for me this is why it's so important to remain open minded and adapt as our bodies change.
Reg Park at his peak could bench 500, squat 600, behind-the-neck press 300. Brutally strong and ,crucially, still a bodybuilder - no idea why there's even a need to invent a new term like 'powerbuilding' for a jacked and strong guy, good video.
This video in particular has had a huge impact on my philosophy and training ideals over the last few months. Your absolutely right; powerbuilding really has no goal. I've been pondering the idea of looking at competing in my first powerlifting competition in the next year or so and I was wondering if you had advice for a first timer? What are some things someone should look out for going into their first competition? Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Probably worth a video on this, however in brief worry LESS about how much you're gonna lift on the day or whether you'll be first or not and worry MORE about actually going 9/9 and following the rules of the day and having fun: 1) Practice the commands at home. This is vital. 2) Ensure form is acceptable according to the rules, including bench pauses. 3) Your opener should be a 3-5RM, ensure you know roughly what that is. 4) Get your singlet. 5) If your schedule allows do some training sessions in the morning, as your Meet is likely to start early 6) Enjoy the process and have fun, and seriously I mean that. This is a fun hobby, don't woork yourself up into a nervous mess you paid your money to be there so enjoy it. 7) Learn what foods you can eat which won't upset your tummy. Fruit juice and too much caffeine is a bad idea. Remember it's a LONG day. 8) Read point 6 again.
Yeah thanks man, well that was the goal of the video. It is a very technical video, with a great deal of good practical advice and I think most people appreciated that but of course a few people had some very emotional reactions because they knew I was right.
For me i'm just a big 3 enjoyer and love doing accessory movements to build up weak points. "Powerbuilding" programs have always been a fun way for me to train. Jeff Nippard has good templates I have made good progress off and i'? currently running Juggernaut AI Powerbuilding. In reality it is pretty much a Powerlifting program with some extra work. I may compete in Powerlifting some day, definitely not interested in competive bodybuilding. Am interested in being more jacked though. I think I don't need a title, i am just a lifter right now until I decide to compete. 😅
Yeah I like CWS I ran his Juggernaut 2.0 method way back in 2015 for a few months and it was pretty cool. It was like a more effective 531. Not used his new AI stuff but I bet it's good. Chad is a good dude.
the way i understood it is a subset of bodybuilding. it's people who are still primary after aesthetics, but who believe that the best way to reach good aesthetics is to get strong at compound movements. e.g. it's the belief that you can't look good without being strong. i don't necessarily think it's a true belief, though. like you just have to look at geoffrey verity schofield's weak bench (he'd get last place for his weight class in any powerlifting competition), and look how good he looks despite being so weak at the bench, to know that you can look good without being strong. and then you see people who are the opposite, like ivan djuric of 'squat every day' who many have said he barely looks like he lifts yet he's stronger than the majority of fitness youtubers. so i think the origin of powerlifting is just that type of mistaken belief, that size equals strength, when it's more accurate to say that size equals strength potential.
Individual lifters like Geoffrey, will forever be different in their relative strengths and preferences for certain lifts as they train for hypertrophy. That doesn't mean we need to create these made up arbitrary terms to classify everything every little difference.
I get that you are absolutely not going to get the best of both worlds with "powerbuilding". You are making sacrifices. The issue I and others have had is they have defined goals and are willing to hold themselves accountable but what they precisely want doesn't fall exactly into natural bodybuilding (on stage competition) or competitive powerlifting. Your definitions have helped somewhat. I value the front squat and the ohp as much as the squat, bench press and deadlift. There is no such competition for this and I am aware that my bp and squat will suffer in comparision to another version of myself that went all out in powerlifting specifically. Successful natural bodybuilders are usually quite strong in whatever lifts they have chosen to get their desired physique especially when you look at the form they are using. Powerlifters have hijacked strength to only ever mean 1rm squat, bench press and deadlift it seems.
Thank you for one of the calmer replies :) "The issue I and others have had is they have defined goals and are willing to hold themselves accountable but what they precisely want doesn't fall exactly into natural bodybuilding (on stage competition) or competitive powerlifting. Your definitions have helped somewhat" This is where the misunderstanding lies. Two things to point out here: 1) There is this misconception that bodybuilding is all fluff and tone and bodybuilders are uninterested in poundage targets. However that's a strawman, I've been around MANY bodybuilders over the last 25 years, I've competed in BBing and I can tell you confidently that every single bodybuilder has poundage targets for the major lifts. Every single BB I know, knows precisely what he wants to hit in the Squat for a set of 10 or the OHP for a set of 6 etc etc~ So we need to stop listening to people (usually non bodybuilders) who propagate this myth that bodybuilders aren't interested in poundage targets. That's complete and total BS. So when that strawman is used to push the powerbuilding agenda I feel it is my duty to point out that people are being misled. 2) The second misconception is that powerbuilding is for non-competitors and bb/pl is for competitors, this is again another diversion from the truth the powerbuilding agenda uses. This is simply another lie, another strawman which they argue against. Bodybuilding is the holistic endeavour of physical improvement, be that in aesthetics OR in strength (and mindset arguably). That is INCLUSIVE of strength targets. powerbuilders snuck in and took credit for everything bodybuilders has been doing this entire time, but were subverted by drug using bodybuilders. Bodybuilding IS the pursuit of strength and aesthetics because the two are intertwined. I also find it ironic that most powerbuilders will insist strength & muscle are linked, but then point out bodybuilders aren't interested in strength... make that make sense, but then it's powerbuilding logic I suppose and it doesn't have to make sense. The bottom line is, i do not want you being mislead. You can do better.
@@Fazlifts The title was spicy but I decided to watch it anyway lol. I consider myself to be a bodybuilder then. Thanks for the clarification. It really helps. When I was on the old stronglifts forums the idea of bodybuilders just being into fluff and pump was quite prevalent. Now with enough natural bodybuilding channels that idea can and should be thrown away.
Do you have any suggestions for hip hinges? I'm just wondering how to approach day 2 of barbarian v2, stage 1 routine. Just worried about lower back problems and I was wondering if there's exercise alternatives instead of the good mornings.
Hmmm well I generally categorise hip hinges into 3 main categories Deadlifts Good Mornings Hyperextensions/GHR And of course within those you have your variations. I would probably look to some kind of Hyperextension if you have access. Otherwise just heavily reduce the volume on the hip hinges.
@@Fazlifts thanks! I hope you make some beanies once you get back into your sports wear stuff. Always enjoy the content! I learn something new all the time!
I was once very overweight. Almost 400 lbs. at 6'4". I'm now 232 lbs and have been as low as 200 lbs. I have jiggly bits that are never going away. I'm at 18% body fat based on a recent DEXA. I honestly hate my body, but following an hypertrophy focused upper lower for the past year instead of the 531 variants I did most often in the past has really started to shift my upper body noticeably. Anyway I'd be happy with jacked bear mode forever. I'm not there, but would be awesome to get there before I die.
So I’m someone who still doesn’t call themselves anything, as I’ve basically been doing bodybuilding from the start BUT I don’t compete nor intend to + I DO care about my strength on big compounds even beyond just what they’ll do for musculature. So powerbuilding sounds like the closest thing if it were defined as bodybuilding with an emphasis on the big lifts, but I understand the pushback against that, particularly for those such as yourself who have and love to actually compete.
I think it's fine to call yourself a bodybuilder Bill. You don't have to compete. I think we could argue Bodybuilder is a nice catch all term for anyone who's trains to be big and strong. Whereas amateur or professional bodybuilder may indicate those who compete.
I always thought that Powerbuilding are mainly for novices. With a well designed program, they will gain both size and strength at the same time. Once they graduated from novice, they should specify according to their goal. It can be Bodybuilding, Powerlifting, or others. It's like elementary school, middle school and high school students don't choose their study subjects. Once they enter college, they will choose a specific study subject. Btw, I'm currently running a "powerbuilding-like" program, GZCLP. Ironically, the creator of the program, Cody Lefever, is a Powerlifter.
I thought power-building was just for people who can't decide between power-lifting and body-building. The one group Faz mentioned is people who want to look jacked, but also want to get strong at the big 3. I think it's for people who do body-building but because it's a slow process that's hard to measure in the short term so they do the big lifts so they will at least have something to measure week to week, month to month.
What you're describing here is bodybuilding. I don't personally feel people need a special little made up title to make them feel unique about doing the same thing as the rest of us. As I explained in this video, it holds them back which is what I don't like to see.
Damn Faz! I feel as if you've roasted me and you've hit the nail on the head to a degree that it's not even funny 😂 Allow me to share my story. I used to be a fat boy with a pretty sturdy build and decent athletic abilities (martial arts, swimming..). I always deeply enjoyed being strong. Some years back when I was about 25 (now I am 29) I got into fitness and, searching for "the best beginner lifting program", I came across Starting Strength and Stronglifts. Having that in mind, people on TH-cam and mostly Rippetoe got into my head that "real men are really strong at the big basics". So I started as quite the minimalist. What I actually cared about was to be as big and muscular as I can naturally manage, not caring much for abs and leanness. Maybe the reason is that I never really believed that I can get to a really lean state and sustain it (anything under 15% seems really lean to me), so I decided I would be happy with 15-20%. I thought that Powerbuilding meant "I wanna be huge and strong, but I don't sweat proportions or leanness", so that's what I thought I was doing. It took me years to slowly get more and more out of that mindset and more into the mindset that "If your goal is ultimately hypertrophy without being a fat-ass, it's Bodybuilding". And the basics are great, but there is no lift that you absolutely need and cannot substitute. Same goes for splits, rep ranges... You've played quite the role in this mind-shift. Thanks for that! So yeah. You were spot on (in regards to me, at least). Right now I think I am around 25% (178 cm, 95-96 kg), I have decided to not try to bulk again (at least not until I am under 20%). I am currently trying to recomp at 25% and, hopefully, hit that sub 20% in a sensible timeframe. That's the story. If you've read so far, thank you for all your influence on my journey. I deeply appreciate you and I hope that we'll have you here for a long long time! Cheers 😉
Thank you for sharing! I think at the heart of this discussion is the very real fact that none of us are the finished product or even very good immediately. It takes time and we earn our plaudits. You've come so far and you should be proud of your story. Over time you'll continue to make improvements. Labelling oneself as a powerbuilder is creating plaudits when nothing has been achieved. Which only reduces desire for further improvements. That is my disagreement. Keep going my man. You are doing great 🍻
In my Country for the normal folks i call myself a "Powerbuilder" for one simple reason : people here in Egypt associate Bodybuilding not only with Pro Bodybuilding (Specially since Big Ramy is Egyptian) , but they consider if your goal is Bodybuilding u must want to compete on stage and they start to point out that u need to get peeled to a 3% BF or something ridiculous and starts to talk about "water cutting" , and i am just standing there like aaaah No thanks , i am a Powerbuilder haha !! but with people who i feel they know what they talking about i tell them ye i am Hypertrophy & Muscle building focused yes a Natural bodybuilding .
@@Fazlifts Ofc i am , it just a headache to explain to brain washed people (by Pro BB) that this is actually what Natural Bodybuilding training should look like its not about the 20° elbow angle and squeezing at the end to feel the muscle with 20s tempo and 30 rep sets and u actually need to get strong on the basics with a hypertrophy focused form , so i just go ye ye i am a PowerBuilder ... 🤦🤷
Scorched earth policy on powerbuilding. Ive always thought this, the vast majority of people who use the term powerbuilding just do bodybuilding but they do the big 3 in their program, often with form to optimize numbers as opposed to hypertrophy, and they think that getting the raw numbers will grant the physique. In effect, theyre quite literally getting the worst of both worlds. This is the stuff basement bodybuilding is always talking about. Im very happy to have discovered a niche community in the world of fitness that allows for this level of nuance, otherwise I would have been lost in the sauce...
@@Fazlifts Completely agreed. The "fear of failure" part really resonated with me as well. I intend on competing in bodybuilding in the next few years after I've gained more muscle. Listening to you talk about that experience is a big part of that decision
Your video is very insightful and has very valid points. Just on the point about Russwole I do believe he used to refer to himself as a PowerBuilder. Unsure whether it was for marketing/views or how he "identified" then.
That's interesting. Based on what you said I actually went and looked his powerbuilding pdf up and you're right it is labelled as such - what I find interesting about it though, is that it's littered with pictures of him in a powerlifting singlet on a powerlifting platform, with powerlifting trophies maxing on the powerlifts!
Interesting video as when I think about it I have never heard guys that I know that do compete in both bodybuilding and powerlifting call themselves power builders and they usually just label themselves by what they consider their primary sport out of the two. So they are either competitive bodybuilders who do some powerlifting competitions or competitive powerlifters who do some bodybuilding competitions.
The fact that talking about something gives you almost as much pleasure as doing the damn thing is kinda crazy, not to fault people but rather our brains. Which is why I've mostly done things silently, regarding the diet at least lol.
the man single handedly destroyed the whole "gender identification" crap with a single sentence : "u cant slap a label on yourself and call yourself an apply , it doesn't work that way" -Faz2023 ..
Tbh I'm a fat, ageing powerbuilder. Though I'm an ageing fat powerbuilder with a young, hot girlfriend who probably wouldn't want me to drop down to 15% for very long. Here's the other thing: I like food. A lot. So to an extent, training is *yes* a coping mechanism to avoid being an absolute tub of lard (bc there are levels to that) I dieted down to circa 20% (I was 19% if I struck it lucky on the Gym Group machine that day lol), but a few years ago then covid blablabla. Realistically I know for health reasons I have to get below 23% again, but 15% is an 'achievement unlocked' that frankly doesn't interest me *at all*. Comptition powerlifting doesn't really interest me that much either - I'd consider it under certain circumstances but it all looks a bit stressful & not particularly worthwhile for me personally. Basically I just want to be a guy who looks like he lifts (if I simultaneously look like I eat cake on the daily, that doesn't bother me even if some ppl think it should), can lift more than most in my gym, owns the weights with no foolishness, & get to advanced levels of symmetrical strength for my age. By your definitions I'm a recreational bodybuilder I suppose but the point is that I don't think the 'I'm a powerbuilder' is a cope (obv we're all coping in some way), in many cases it's just a divergence of interests. And of course, ppl can have an opinion about why they're so superior or something because they're 'in the arena' - but at the end of the day very few of these people will ever actually compete in an actual arena.
Again no addressing of my actual points, just a bunch of rambling deflections. I'm assuming you follow me on IG and are here due to a recent story. Have the decency to timestamp specifically what you're debating, and debate the points I've made. Don't just present a wall of rambling deflections. If your answer is just 'this is how I like to train, this is how I like to diet', great! Go do it, but that has absolutely NOTHING to do with what I'm presenting here.
@@Fazlifts Erm no. I barely go on IG and have consumed a lot of your content on youtube recently. Most of which I really like. I am actually currently doing 3x8 on OHP, SLDL & Hack Squat with the intention of going to 5s on the latter and 3s on the other 2 which I got indirectly from Stand Strngth. Honestly I don't think the bar you are setting to 'decent' engagement is a reasonable one. My comment was not an attack, it was not trying to start a debate; it was just offering a slightly different perspective. This is eerily similar to the 'muh community is under attack' stuff Landon was doing recently. It's *really aggy*; weirdly so. My initial reaction is to be amused, but then that feels mean in all honesty; it was never my intention to goad a reaction. So I will try to positively engage. Basically your video said iirc; if you're in the gym lifting, you're either a bodybuilder or powerlifter (I will infer option c, you compete in another sport) - if the former, go get to 15% bf. If the latter, go and do a competition prep, with the implication that you are somehow inferior if you actually genuinely don't want to do either of those things. Now I'm not trying to say anybody should model what I do, nor do I seek permission or forgveness. I am simply suggesting that a lot of 30-40% bf 'powerbuilders' (I myself wouldn't use that label, I'd just call myself a recreational lifter) really have no latent interest in competing in bodybuilding or powerlifting, or in having visible abs and I inferred from your video that you think they do and just use the term 'powerbuilder' as cope If you think my inferences are wrong, then I apologise. But my basic point is that I don't think many of these people are interested in competition even if you think they should be (because it drives motivation to improve, potentially), and arguments from the perspective of health, longevity (& work capacity!) are more likely to be persuasive. My secondary point was that powerbuilding standards do exist to some extent; they're on websites like symmetrical strength and one could argue infact they're better as they allow people who specialise in different lifts and across different rep ranges to compare themselves (in theory at any rate). Obviously some ppl's idea of a good bench press (for example) will differ, but I would say the same about big-arch benching and powerlfting judging is hardly consistent at local level (& obv the same applies to bodybuilding). Honestly, I wish you a pleasant rest of the day!
I ask people to timestamp things so that when they attempt to debate, we can stick to what I've actually said. Since you haven't bothered to timestamp anything and you have also created a number of strawman points which do not reflect what I actually said, this is yet another example of a powerbuilder who isn't interesting in addressing the points I have made. I'm not going to tear apart your comment, because you haven't even bothered to address my content. I recorded a 30 minute video, timestamped point by point so people who wanted to debate it could do so. No one has done so yet, it's all just been deflections and fabricated strawman arguments and it's been 4 months. It does appear there are no powerbuilder enthusiasts who have the ability to actually address the points I've made. I do appreciate your comments because any comment boosts the algorithm. Thank you and have a good day.
@@Fazlifts And I am *very happy* to boost the algorithm on your behalf! Genuinely. I often write comments on videos with this intention. I definitely didn't mean to strawman your arguments, tbh I don't think I really did so. I am a philosophy grad so I am quite familiar with this logical fallacy (and fwiw the rhetorical effectiveness of accusing 'opponents' of it). But to go through it at this point in the detail you seek would effectively mean I would have to rereview the material & then a) write an essay, or b) record a video. Not really a fruitful use of my time right now. Maybe one day!
Then he gets to call himself a Powerlifter too. That doesn't diminish my argument at all and doesn't really add anything to the debate. It also doesn't mean we need to invent a made up word to describe him or anyone else.
And for clarification, we also have to take into account those guys who have lost 100, 150, 200lbs. and are now "20%" but have so much lose skin, they will always have "jiggly bites" and man boobs. Have one patient who lost 170lbs., He is now down to 190 lbs at 6'3", jacked, but will never be seen till he gets skin surgery. The whole idea of real men doing a fashion show in their shorts just never made sense. Obviously to each their own. Powerlifting, strongman, CrossFit, sprinters, very cool because of the specific measurements of performance. In general, let's hope, all people, each individual finds his or her own space even if it is chess, ping pong or badminton. Understand how you feel, felt the same way about anyone that never joined the military and never had to shoot another human or drop a bomb on a village of men, women, children, babies... however found not everyone should face challenges. Not everyone is cut from the same cloth. Live and let live. If they are happy being a powerbodybuilder, fine. The world needs more happy people. Too much death and destruction.
A guy who's lost 200lbs is his own hero of course, but that's not really who I'm talking to here in this video. I do make that very clear in the video, so hopefully you've watched it all. My question to you regarding what you said here: "Understand how you feel, felt the same way about anyone that never joined the military and never had to shoot another human or drop a bomb on a village of men, women, children, babies" Would you be as forgiving if someone who hadn't done that, went around trying to 'steal valor' and claim experiences and victories without actually doing them? I would guess not. That is a better representation of the debate. I have zero problem with people having different goals, but this made up safety blanket needs to go and if you watch the video all the way through that is my point.
@@Fazlifts Yes, always watch the whole video. Very Good point. Never seen anyone who wanted to fake killing other people. Yes sometimes their are guys that try to fake military service (desk job bitches). Not sure why they would. Have to live the rest of my life knowing what I have done, regardless of the reason or which government said it was "ok" or "justified". No matter how many lives I help or save, will forever focus on those I have taken. Honestly don't know anyone who would fake that but guess anything is possible and yes see your point. Thanks 🙏💪👍 Guess that also touches on the point, if "powerbodybuilding" is for fakes but they are happy, let's let them live in their own fantasy world and be happy as they would never make it in a real sport. Just like the fake soldiers would never make it as a real soldiers. You have a good point and maybe this is why people care about watching Natty or Not videos. Have often wondered why? And who actually cares? Maybe you have a point, "Live and let live" might not be a good policy and we need to kick them in the butt to move them off center? Interesting thought. Let's find those who are happy in their own fantasy world and pull them into the real world. Like the TikTok people claiming obese is healthy and sexy, drives me insane.
Thank you Dr AJ. I've always enjoyed your reasoned input. My hope is that people see past their emotional reaction to the topic and see this for what it is, that is me believing that no matter where you currently are, you can do better. I think we can both agree, that's a good thing ;)
Seems like a fair amount of people who call themselves powerbuilders likely do so due to their perceived identity. Even if they are technically doing bodybuilding training, they don’t view it as that because they either don’t ‘feel’ or look like an archetypical bodybuilder (huge, lean, likely enhanced, eating in a particular way, etc). Similarly, if their training is focused more on the powerlifting movements, maybe thy don’t ‘feel’ like a power lifter because the don’t compete or haven’t hit the ‘right’ numbers yet. Tbh, more people are probably doing bodybuilding training than realise it, and that’s likely because when people think bodybuilding they think of pro enhanced BB, which is so far removed from reality no wonder people get lost with these definitions and make up their own coping category. Got to love 30mins of Faz just methodically going to town on this topic though 😂
Haha right! Yes, I agree with all that. Ironically I actually disagree with people classifying themselves at all, unless they have actually competed. Back in my day, we just called ourselves lifters.
I always saw powerbuilding as a loose philosophy of bodybuilding that uses powerlifting methods. Never saw it as something to be diferentiated or legitimized, kind of like HIIT, or Mike Mentzer 1 set to failure, or nucleus overload nonsense. Just different methods to get the same result, especially since as you mentioned, you're gonna get stronger if you get big anyway, so what's the difference, why rename it? 😅 Always just seemed like a silly distinction.
OOF! I think you're just right on this one. This whole need to "identify" as something is kind of cringe. Until you compete, or do something to earn a title a title you simply are. I think we can sum up this issue as "Until proven otherwise, you're a lifter"
Yeah I think it's cringe for sure. I think it's okay to be a lifter. The comments have been overwhelmingly positive but it's been interesting to see the few negative comments were VERY aggressive and personal. Clearly from people who have this strong emotional reaction to their safety blanket being taken away.
I wonder if "Hybrid Athletes" are the new Powerbuilders 👀 With that being said, I would say I fall into this category of trying to push lifting and endurance haha
I think Hybrid makes sense as it's an appropriately descriptive term. Powerbuilders don't even seem to understand the difference between strength and power...
@@Fazlifts Fair. Was talking with a friend as well and although there are a ton of interpretations, pretty much everyone labelling themselves a hybrid athlete is competing in the second (non-strength) discipline - be it fighting, marathons, other endurance sports
Get the aloe vera ready. Bodyfat related... I have small love handles but visible abs when I flex. I have a belly that extends, but I also have a very rounded spine. I have vascular limbs, but my pecs look bigger than they really are. A bodyfat conundrum indeed. I'm gonna annoy Faz and say I'm 21-22%. My max goal was 20%, but I screwed up after my last mini cut and regained too much weight and gave myself no runway for growing. I'll fix it.
It doesn't annoy me at all :) I had hoped people would see this as more of a 'tough love' and positive message. But with regards to your point, we're all different too. I gave those as fairly rough generalities from what I've seen. However there are some people who are more peripherally lean. It's unusual but far from impossible. Good luck, and thank you for the comment!
@@Fazlifts Tough love was the message I received. It was much needed. Not a self-proclaimed powerbuilder at all; more just someone who has poor self-control when it comes to my love for good food. xD Thanks Faz!
Interesting video thanks Faz. Russwole of course is tryna be claimed by PowerBuilders - oop theres an aesthetic power lifter we'll take him. 😂 I didn't know power building actually a brand people identify with, I'm out of the loop lol but you have a point. Also I love Mike Ohearn literally sells Duck Eggs it feels like someone selling literal oil from a snake. I hope he at least injects Anavar into them so his customers get some benefits 😂😂 jk jk
I had you wrong from one of your short videos so I reckon I owe you sort of an apology. I can't remember which vid but I took it that you are just badgering lifters who carry higher body fat percentages. Saying they should just get lean and stop being fat shits. I myself and others I know are happy being larger and stronger (although we don't compete in anything), and happy pushing strength and not aesthetics. Do we categorise ourselves in any discipline, no not at all it's just about having fun, but I listened to you clearly here getting your points and can see where people get confused. An example is where someone has approached me before asking what I do, body building, powerlifting etc, me, I just lift weights mate, call it what you will. Good video I understand you more now and I'm not a power builder or anything else. Just a lifter. 😉
From one lifter to another, thank you. I very rarely just berate people or ideas without reason, I'm not a drama channel. I did this video because I truly believe it's important.
@@Fazlifts I can see your intentions are good, kind and just wanting to help people. It says more about me jumping to assumptions from watching a short video. You're welcome, glad I stumbled across that short because it led me to your page. Best wishes.
Coaching spots available: docs.google.com/forms/d/15_F8NS9vWIZUGlPXv-jGeFO9vVCyEKUFTmwuJo3RHlA/viewform?edit_requested=true
Jeff Nippard has been real quiet since Faz started his anti powerbuilder campaign 🤫
Haha! Jeff has good material by and large.
@@Fazlifts I agree!
I think he is focusing on his relationship and other things. Still a big fan of him even though I don’t follow is programming.
Great Video Faz!
10:41 Exactly! This has been my realisation a few years back now. Bodybuilding belongs to naturals et we should just call it like that. And we should separate it from enhanced bodybuilding. Because right now, PEDs users are so all over the place on the internet, that we say "bodybuilding" for the drugs up freaks and "natural bodybuilding" for the rest of us (which is at least 95% of the fitness industry tbf). It should be the other way around: Bodybuilding (ie: natties) and enhanced bodybuilding. By normalazing the term for us naturals, it'll greatly help!
You clearly had beef with someone, I'm not a powerbuilder, so relax.
Just saying this is starting to become ridiculous
This speaks to me. I was following layne, Jeff and other guys who push power building. I was strong for my size but not impressive compare to power lifter. I have a decent physique but wouldn’t place in a competition. I’ve moved away from it since I got rotator cuff injury and multiple back injuries and i stopped doing low rep. My physique is at it best right now since I focus more on bodybuilding style rep ranges and mind muscles connection. Thanks for your message because I’ve learned a lot since I followed you this year.
That's awesome man. Thanks for sharing and that's a wonderful example.
What type of rep ranges do you work in now?
Earlier this week, I convinced one of my fellow lifters to use measurements as a quantifiable way of determining progress. He was very used to knowing all of his numbers on barbell compounds, but was struggling with arms and not making progress (on appearance I surmised). I told him to consider logging his lifts and check his arm size occasionally. I think he had an epiphany at that moment, where he could see the parallels to the other parts of training that were working. Just going through the motions at the gym isn't going to get you anywhere.
Where I think it matters is not letting yourself drift into mediocrity. Taking an easy solution is...well... easy. Pursuing a goal, and truly pushing toward achieving it is where you truly learn about yourself and really start to benefit from that journey. I appreciate your video about strength standards a couple of weeks ago. It got me thinking about goals. It's a subtle mindset shift and puts a little more intention into the process. I'm finding that intent in my workouts is providing overall focus. While I usually shy away from external competition due to time constraints and it not really being aligned with my overall goals, I can still use internal competition (with myself) to drive myself to new levels.
I love this.
Your comments always have so much wisdom 🙏
it's so over for powerbuildingcels
Loving this discussion! Also, people making up terms for what they want to be, even if not grounded in reality, seems to be the zeitgeist
Yeah it really does, doesn't it. I didn't want to touch on the whole 'what is a woman' angle again as that may just have made some heads explode lol but you're right.
What you say is true. Personally, I always considered it a tongue in check term. People that like the big lifts, don't plan on competing and wanna get jacked. I never took the term seriously since it isn't competitive.
I would urge people to watch the full video. You've replied here only a few minutes after this 30 minute video was premiered. Your points are covered in full.
Excellent video Faz. You definitely covered what my initial thought was. Thanks.
Ive Been powerbuildingi My first year in The gym and have gotten almost 20kg bigger and up to a 110kg bench, 155 squat and a 200 deadlift
Similar experience at 44 years old. 20+ years of bodybuilding with mediocre results. IMO strength > aesthetics in terms of value as long as not neglecting work capacity or GPP type activities.
I always get into my car after work and spend ages trying to figure out what I’ll be listening to on the way home. That won’t be happening tonight!
Enjoy!
Powerbuilding could be done like those old school bronze and silver era hercules shows, where bodybuilders would also do feats of strength alongside showing off their physique. If done with the big 3, it could be a "powerbuilding" show, and if done with a variety of lifts it could be "strong-body-building" (a conjunction of strongman and bb, where the goal is to build a strong and impressive physique). The line between this and cross-fit would slowly start to blur however. If they kept the event times to under 90 seconds it might start to differentiate it.
That would certainly be a step in the right direction!
Tbh, you are the only person I know talking about powerbuilding. Did someone hurt you?
I know a lot of people who like to look good but also like to have high numbers on the barbell lifts. I'd say it's completely fine, not everyone only cares about competition like you. A lot of people also like to have fun doing what they are doing
I think it's a natural disdain from trainers who have achieved an excellent physique. They see newbies hitting better near maximal lifts without great physiques. They get triggered.
How about videos on how to improve powerbuilding routines or potential pitfalls??
I thoroughly enjoyed this conversation. A lot of the points were transferable to other aspects of life as well. "It's never a good idea to live a lie. You're not going to grow if you continuously embrace this lie. We only grow by putting ourselves in difficult positions."
Also "man boobs and jiggly bits" cracks me up every time lol.
Absolutely 💯 and I think this is why the lie is so pervasive. It's not a lifting problem, it's a people problem.
Rip powerbuilding 2015 ~ 2023
They has the best of both excuses.
Fun fact: BBing translates to Health and Aesthetics in Chinese (健美） PLing translates to Health and Strength. (健力）No translation for PBing.
Haha! I wonder why 😂
powerbuilding meet where they compete in curls, lat pulldowns and deadlifts
I think that might be a step up 😂
I'd watch that.
Life long early intermediate
Started Stronglifts in 2009
First powerlifting comp in 2015!
Enjoying grappling since 2019
Fazs channel intrigued me in 2022 and he somehow persuaded me to consider 'natural bodybuilding', hate the term but joints and cns feel better, started direct arm work, isolations, machine compounds, programming by body part not dead/squat and press.
I now feel a bit like Chad Waterbury the anti bodybuilding hypertrophy guy...
Good! I'm glad I was of help!
As a Profesional Strong-Power-Cali-Cross-Chess-Builder, i feel very offended
🤣
Well done video Faz. About 3-4 months ago I took "powerbuilding" out of my IG bio. It was due to a lot of the reasons you stated here. There really is no set definition which is it's downfall, If someone looks at your bio and it says the word "powerbuilder", most general population lifters won't know wtf it even means. I think the best way to describe myself now would be a bodybuilder & general strength enjoyer.
Thank you for watching it through.
Yeah we used to just call ourselves 'lifters' that was what I called myself before I competed. I think strength enjoyer, bodybuilder all work too.
@@Fazlifts I think part of it is marketing too. A lot of coaches are taught to have a "unique opportunity". A lot of coaches resort to that being powerbuilding.
How about just 'lifter'? It's a semi derogatory term used by the cardio crew.
That's what we used to call ourselves back in my day, 'lifters'.
Brilliant talk, absolutely loved it! Especially the part about limiting believes and failure.
Glad you enjoyed it!
I definitely think strength progression is very important but lately I've been doing more volume than normal and I think I'm noticing some positive changes to my physique. I've always been a believer in strength progression as being the most important thing to focus on but I've gone through periods of training (especially the last couple of years) where my lifts were consistently going up for months and months with no real changes to my physique. Since adding the extra volume and noticing a change, I'm started to second guess if strength is as important as an advanced lifter.
Obviously for beginners and intermediates the strength progression is king but I've been lifting for over 15 years and maybe it's time to consider the possibility I would benefit from more volume and less of an emphasis on getting stronger every workout. Curious to hear your thoughts on this.
I'm the same. I can reduce sets and even reps and quickly see my strength rise but hard volume is what makes me grow.
Awesome to hear. Yeah I mean I’ve always been a lower to moderate volume guy with the mindset of “strength equals size”. I really do love training by ramping to an all out set of a top weight and moving onto the next exercise but I think I’ll experiment with the volume for a bit.
Maybe the benefits are just exaggerated in my head and I don’t look any different lol who knows. At one point many years ago I was doing a ton of sets for the big muscle groups and I did have a certain “look” that I don’t now despite being bigger now. Stay tuned for more lol.
Yeah I think your experience is very valid.
I've certainly seen my own response to certain training parameters change over the years. I feel for me this is why it's so important to remain open minded and adapt as our bodies change.
Reg Park at his peak could bench 500, squat 600, behind-the-neck press 300. Brutally strong and ,crucially, still a bodybuilder - no idea why there's even a need to invent a new term like 'powerbuilding' for a jacked and strong guy, good video.
So what is a power ranger?
Well they at least have a uniform 😂
This video in particular has had a huge impact on my philosophy and training ideals over the last few months. Your absolutely right; powerbuilding really has no goal. I've been pondering the idea of looking at competing in my first powerlifting competition in the next year or so and I was wondering if you had advice for a first timer? What are some things someone should look out for going into their first competition?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Probably worth a video on this, however in brief worry LESS about how much you're gonna lift on the day or whether you'll be first or not and worry MORE about actually going 9/9 and following the rules of the day and having fun:
1) Practice the commands at home. This is vital.
2) Ensure form is acceptable according to the rules, including bench pauses.
3) Your opener should be a 3-5RM, ensure you know roughly what that is.
4) Get your singlet.
5) If your schedule allows do some training sessions in the morning, as your Meet is likely to start early
6) Enjoy the process and have fun, and seriously I mean that. This is a fun hobby, don't woork yourself up into a nervous mess you paid your money to be there so enjoy it.
7) Learn what foods you can eat which won't upset your tummy. Fruit juice and too much caffeine is a bad idea. Remember it's a LONG day.
8) Read point 6 again.
Lots of good general advice here, Faz! Awesome video.
Yeah thanks man, well that was the goal of the video. It is a very technical video, with a great deal of good practical advice and I think most people appreciated that but of course a few people had some very emotional reactions because they knew I was right.
For me i'm just a big 3 enjoyer and love doing accessory movements to build up weak points. "Powerbuilding" programs have always been a fun way for me to train. Jeff Nippard has good templates I have made good progress off and i'? currently running Juggernaut AI Powerbuilding. In reality it is pretty much a Powerlifting program with some extra work. I may compete in Powerlifting some day, definitely not interested in competive bodybuilding. Am interested in being more jacked though. I think I don't need a title, i am just a lifter right now until I decide to compete. 😅
I agree about the Juggernaut ai it’s a great program for Powerlifting and powerbuilding
Yeah I like CWS I ran his Juggernaut 2.0 method way back in 2015 for a few months and it was pretty cool. It was like a more effective 531. Not used his new AI stuff but I bet it's good. Chad is a good dude.
the way i understood it is a subset of bodybuilding. it's people who are still primary after aesthetics, but who believe that the best way to reach good aesthetics is to get strong at compound movements. e.g. it's the belief that you can't look good without being strong. i don't necessarily think it's a true belief, though. like you just have to look at geoffrey verity schofield's weak bench (he'd get last place for his weight class in any powerlifting competition), and look how good he looks despite being so weak at the bench, to know that you can look good without being strong. and then you see people who are the opposite, like ivan djuric of 'squat every day' who many have said he barely looks like he lifts yet he's stronger than the majority of fitness youtubers. so i think the origin of powerlifting is just that type of mistaken belief, that size equals strength, when it's more accurate to say that size equals strength potential.
Individual lifters like Geoffrey, will forever be different in their relative strengths and preferences for certain lifts as they train for hypertrophy.
That doesn't mean we need to create these made up arbitrary terms to classify everything every little difference.
I get that you are absolutely not going to get the best of both worlds with "powerbuilding". You are making sacrifices. The issue I and others have had is they have defined goals and are willing to hold themselves accountable but what they precisely want doesn't fall exactly into natural bodybuilding (on stage competition) or competitive powerlifting. Your definitions have helped somewhat.
I value the front squat and the ohp as much as the squat, bench press and deadlift. There is no such competition for this and I am aware that my bp and squat will suffer in comparision to another version of myself that went all out in powerlifting specifically.
Successful natural bodybuilders are usually quite strong in whatever lifts they have chosen to get their desired physique especially when you look at the form they are using. Powerlifters have hijacked strength to only ever mean 1rm squat, bench press and deadlift it seems.
Thank you for one of the calmer replies :)
"The issue I and others have had is they have defined goals and are willing to hold themselves accountable but what they precisely want doesn't fall exactly into natural bodybuilding (on stage competition) or competitive powerlifting. Your definitions have helped somewhat"
This is where the misunderstanding lies. Two things to point out here:
1) There is this misconception that bodybuilding is all fluff and tone and bodybuilders are uninterested in poundage targets. However that's a strawman, I've been around MANY bodybuilders over the last 25 years, I've competed in BBing and I can tell you confidently that every single bodybuilder has poundage targets for the major lifts. Every single BB I know, knows precisely what he wants to hit in the Squat for a set of 10 or the OHP for a set of 6 etc etc~
So we need to stop listening to people (usually non bodybuilders) who propagate this myth that bodybuilders aren't interested in poundage targets. That's complete and total BS.
So when that strawman is used to push the powerbuilding agenda I feel it is my duty to point out that people are being misled.
2) The second misconception is that powerbuilding is for non-competitors and bb/pl is for competitors, this is again another diversion from the truth the powerbuilding agenda uses. This is simply another lie, another strawman which they argue against.
Bodybuilding is the holistic endeavour of physical improvement, be that in aesthetics OR in strength (and mindset arguably). That is INCLUSIVE of strength targets. powerbuilders snuck in and took credit for everything bodybuilders has been doing this entire time, but were subverted by drug using bodybuilders.
Bodybuilding IS the pursuit of strength and aesthetics because the two are intertwined. I also find it ironic that most powerbuilders will insist strength & muscle are linked, but then point out bodybuilders aren't interested in strength... make that make sense, but then it's powerbuilding logic I suppose and it doesn't have to make sense.
The bottom line is, i do not want you being mislead. You can do better.
@@Fazlifts The title was spicy but I decided to watch it anyway lol. I consider myself to be a bodybuilder then. Thanks for the clarification. It really helps. When I was on the old stronglifts forums the idea of bodybuilders just being into fluff and pump was quite prevalent. Now with enough natural bodybuilding channels that idea can and should be thrown away.
Do you have any suggestions for hip hinges? I'm just wondering how to approach day 2 of barbarian v2, stage 1 routine. Just worried about lower back problems and I was wondering if there's exercise alternatives instead of the good mornings.
Hmmm well I generally categorise hip hinges into 3 main categories
Deadlifts
Good Mornings
Hyperextensions/GHR
And of course within those you have your variations. I would probably look to some kind of Hyperextension if you have access. Otherwise just heavily reduce the volume on the hip hinges.
@@Fazlifts thanks! I hope you make some beanies once you get back into your sports wear stuff. Always enjoy the content! I learn something new all the time!
I was once very overweight. Almost 400 lbs. at 6'4". I'm now 232 lbs and have been as low as 200 lbs. I have jiggly bits that are never going away. I'm at 18% body fat based on a recent DEXA. I honestly hate my body, but following an hypertrophy focused upper lower for the past year instead of the 531 variants I did most often in the past has really started to shift my upper body noticeably. Anyway I'd be happy with jacked bear mode forever. I'm not there, but would be awesome to get there before I die.
Incredible 👏 Brother you're doing great
Keep going. "The long term benefits are immense," say I at 65.
So I’m someone who still doesn’t call themselves anything, as I’ve basically been doing bodybuilding from the start BUT I don’t compete nor intend to + I DO care about my strength on big compounds even beyond just what they’ll do for musculature. So powerbuilding sounds like the closest thing if it were defined as bodybuilding with an emphasis on the big lifts, but I understand the pushback against that, particularly for those such as yourself who have and love to actually compete.
I think it's fine to call yourself a bodybuilder Bill. You don't have to compete.
I think we could argue Bodybuilder is a nice catch all term for anyone who's trains to be big and strong. Whereas amateur or professional bodybuilder may indicate those who compete.
I always thought that Powerbuilding are mainly for novices. With a well designed program, they will gain both size and strength at the same time. Once they graduated from novice, they should specify according to their goal. It can be Bodybuilding, Powerlifting, or others.
It's like elementary school, middle school and high school students don't choose their study subjects. Once they enter college, they will choose a specific study subject.
Btw, I'm currently running a "powerbuilding-like" program, GZCLP. Ironically, the creator of the program, Cody Lefever, is a Powerlifter.
You're incorrect. Powerbuilding isn't what you think it is.
I thought power-building was just for people who can't decide between power-lifting and body-building. The one group Faz mentioned is people who want to look jacked, but also want to get strong at the big 3. I think it's for people who do body-building but because it's a slow process that's hard to measure in the short term so they do the big lifts so they will at least have something to measure week to week, month to month.
What you're describing here is bodybuilding.
I don't personally feel people need a special little made up title to make them feel unique about doing the same thing as the rest of us. As I explained in this video, it holds them back which is what I don't like to see.
Damn Faz! I feel as if you've roasted me and you've hit the nail on the head to a degree that it's not even funny 😂
Allow me to share my story. I used to be a fat boy with a pretty sturdy build and decent athletic abilities (martial arts, swimming..). I always deeply enjoyed being strong.
Some years back when I was about 25 (now I am 29) I got into fitness and, searching for "the best beginner lifting program", I came across Starting Strength and Stronglifts.
Having that in mind, people on TH-cam and mostly Rippetoe got into my head that "real men are really strong at the big basics". So I started as quite the minimalist.
What I actually cared about was to be as big and muscular as I can naturally manage, not caring much for abs and leanness.
Maybe the reason is that I never really believed that I can get to a really lean state and sustain it (anything under 15% seems really lean to me), so I decided I would be happy with 15-20%.
I thought that Powerbuilding meant "I wanna be huge and strong, but I don't sweat proportions or leanness", so that's what I thought I was doing.
It took me years to slowly get more and more out of that mindset and more into the mindset that "If your goal is ultimately hypertrophy without being a fat-ass, it's Bodybuilding".
And the basics are great, but there is no lift that you absolutely need and cannot substitute. Same goes for splits, rep ranges... You've played quite the role in this mind-shift. Thanks for that!
So yeah. You were spot on (in regards to me, at least).
Right now I think I am around 25% (178 cm, 95-96 kg), I have decided to not try to bulk again (at least not until I am under 20%).
I am currently trying to recomp at 25% and, hopefully, hit that sub 20% in a sensible timeframe.
That's the story. If you've read so far, thank you for all your influence on my journey. I deeply appreciate you and I hope that we'll have you here for a long long time!
Cheers 😉
Thank you for sharing!
I think at the heart of this discussion is the very real fact that none of us are the finished product or even very good immediately. It takes time and we earn our plaudits. You've come so far and you should be proud of your story.
Over time you'll continue to make improvements.
Labelling oneself as a powerbuilder is creating plaudits when nothing has been achieved. Which only reduces desire for further improvements. That is my disagreement.
Keep going my man. You are doing great 🍻
In my Country for the normal folks i call myself a "Powerbuilder" for one simple reason :
people here in Egypt associate Bodybuilding not only with Pro Bodybuilding (Specially since Big Ramy is Egyptian) , but they consider if your goal is Bodybuilding u must want to compete on stage and they start to point out that u need to get peeled to a 3% BF or something ridiculous and starts to talk about "water cutting" , and i am just standing there like aaaah No thanks , i am a Powerbuilder haha !!
but with people who i feel they know what they talking about i tell them ye i am Hypertrophy & Muscle building focused yes a Natural bodybuilding .
Stand loud and proud, you're a bodybuilder!
@@Fazlifts Ofc i am , it just a headache to explain to brain washed people (by Pro BB) that this is actually what Natural Bodybuilding training should look like its not about the 20° elbow angle and squeezing at the end to feel the muscle with 20s tempo and 30 rep sets and u actually need to get strong on the basics with a hypertrophy focused form , so i just go ye ye i am a PowerBuilder ... 🤦🤷
Where does dad bod and dad strong fit in?
Hey c'mon now, we've already discussed this :) You are doing just fine. You're progressing in your own way and that's a-okay :)
@@Fazlifts you are outstanding sir I always enjoy your content
Scorched earth policy on powerbuilding. Ive always thought this, the vast majority of people who use the term powerbuilding just do bodybuilding but they do the big 3 in their program, often with form to optimize numbers as opposed to hypertrophy, and they think that getting the raw numbers will grant the physique. In effect, theyre quite literally getting the worst of both worlds. This is the stuff basement bodybuilding is always talking about. Im very happy to have discovered a niche community in the world of fitness that allows for this level of nuance, otherwise I would have been lost in the sauce...
Yes 🍻👌 let's just get better. We don't need these imaginary divisions.
@@Fazlifts Completely agreed. The "fear of failure" part really resonated with me as well. I intend on competing in bodybuilding in the next few years after I've gained more muscle. Listening to you talk about that experience is a big part of that decision
🍻💪
Your video is very insightful and has very valid points. Just on the point about Russwole I do believe he used to refer to himself as a PowerBuilder. Unsure whether it was for marketing/views or how he "identified" then.
That's interesting. Based on what you said I actually went and looked his powerbuilding pdf up and you're right it is labelled as such - what I find interesting about it though, is that it's littered with pictures of him in a powerlifting singlet on a powerlifting platform, with powerlifting trophies maxing on the powerlifts!
Interesting video as when I think about it I have never heard guys that I know that do compete in both bodybuilding and powerlifting call themselves power builders and they usually just label themselves by what they consider their primary sport out of the two. So they are either competitive bodybuilders who do some powerlifting competitions or competitive powerlifters who do some bodybuilding competitions.
Yep, it's a marketing term and people fell for it.
The fact that talking about something gives you almost as much pleasure as doing the damn thing is kinda crazy, not to fault people but rather our brains. Which is why I've mostly done things silently, regarding the diet at least lol.
Yeah it's crazy right. At least you're aware of it though, so that's good!
Very interesting
Richard Gozdecki - does not identify as a powerlifter, this gentleman wiped the floor at a BDFPA meet!
He looks strong! However if he competed in powerlifting he could definitely call himself a Powerlifter. Makes sense right?
How do I look good without being weak as shit
100%. I wasted so many years of training doing "powerbuilding" and I just got fat and never really strong. Worst of both worlds.
On the right track now 🍻💪
the man single handedly destroyed the whole "gender identification" crap with a single sentence :
"u cant slap a label on yourself and call yourself an apply , it doesn't work that way" -Faz2023 ..
Agreed. Refreshing to hear this point of view instead of the garbage that's constantly getting shoved down our throats.
i guess it's like Dan John said: "you can't ride two horses with one ass"
Tbh I'm a fat, ageing powerbuilder. Though I'm an ageing fat powerbuilder with a young, hot girlfriend who probably wouldn't want me to drop down to 15% for very long.
Here's the other thing: I like food. A lot. So to an extent, training is *yes* a coping mechanism to avoid being an absolute tub of lard (bc there are levels to that)
I dieted down to circa 20% (I was 19% if I struck it lucky on the Gym Group machine that day lol), but a few years ago then covid blablabla.
Realistically I know for health reasons I have to get below 23% again, but 15% is an 'achievement unlocked' that frankly doesn't interest me *at all*. Comptition powerlifting doesn't really interest me that much either - I'd consider it under certain circumstances but it all looks a bit stressful & not particularly worthwhile for me personally. Basically I just want to be a guy who looks like he lifts (if I simultaneously look like I eat cake on the daily, that doesn't bother me even if some ppl think it should), can lift more than most in my gym, owns the weights with no foolishness, & get to advanced levels of symmetrical strength for my age. By your definitions I'm a recreational bodybuilder I suppose but the point is that I don't think the 'I'm a powerbuilder' is a cope (obv we're all coping in some way), in many cases it's just a divergence of interests. And of course, ppl can have an opinion about why they're so superior or something because they're 'in the arena' - but at the end of the day very few of these people will ever actually compete in an actual arena.
Again no addressing of my actual points, just a bunch of rambling deflections. I'm assuming you follow me on IG and are here due to a recent story.
Have the decency to timestamp specifically what you're debating, and debate the points I've made. Don't just present a wall of rambling deflections.
If your answer is just 'this is how I like to train, this is how I like to diet', great! Go do it, but that has absolutely NOTHING to do with what I'm presenting here.
@@Fazlifts
Erm no. I barely go on IG and have consumed a lot of your content on youtube recently. Most of which I really like. I am actually currently doing 3x8 on OHP, SLDL & Hack Squat with the intention of going to 5s on the latter and 3s on the other 2 which I got indirectly from Stand Strngth.
Honestly I don't think the bar you are setting to 'decent' engagement is a reasonable one. My comment was not an attack, it was not trying to start a debate; it was just offering a slightly different perspective. This is eerily similar to the 'muh community is under attack' stuff Landon was doing recently.
It's *really aggy*; weirdly so. My initial reaction is to be amused, but then that feels mean in all honesty; it was never my intention to goad a reaction.
So I will try to positively engage. Basically your video said iirc; if you're in the gym lifting, you're either a bodybuilder or powerlifter (I will infer option c, you compete in another sport) - if the former, go get to 15% bf. If the latter, go and do a competition prep, with the implication that you are somehow inferior if you actually genuinely don't want to do either of those things.
Now I'm not trying to say anybody should model what I do, nor do I seek permission or forgveness. I am simply suggesting that a lot of 30-40% bf 'powerbuilders' (I myself wouldn't use that label, I'd just call myself a recreational lifter) really have no latent interest in competing in bodybuilding or powerlifting, or in having visible abs and I inferred from your video that you think they do and just use the term 'powerbuilder' as cope If you think my inferences are wrong, then I apologise.
But my basic point is that I don't think many of these people are interested in competition even if you think they should be (because it drives motivation to improve, potentially), and arguments from the perspective of health, longevity (& work capacity!) are more likely to be persuasive.
My secondary point was that powerbuilding standards do exist to some extent; they're on websites like symmetrical strength and one could argue infact they're better as they allow people who specialise in different lifts and across different rep ranges to compare themselves (in theory at any rate). Obviously some ppl's idea of a good bench press (for example) will differ, but I would say the same about big-arch benching and powerlfting judging is hardly consistent at local level (& obv the same applies to bodybuilding).
Honestly, I wish you a pleasant rest of the day!
I ask people to timestamp things so that when they attempt to debate, we can stick to what I've actually said.
Since you haven't bothered to timestamp anything and you have also created a number of strawman points which do not reflect what I actually said, this is yet another example of a powerbuilder who isn't interesting in addressing the points I have made.
I'm not going to tear apart your comment, because you haven't even bothered to address my content. I recorded a 30 minute video, timestamped point by point so people who wanted to debate it could do so. No one has done so yet, it's all just been deflections and fabricated strawman arguments and it's been 4 months. It does appear there are no powerbuilder enthusiasts who have the ability to actually address the points I've made.
I do appreciate your comments because any comment boosts the algorithm. Thank you and have a good day.
@@Fazlifts And I am *very happy* to boost the algorithm on your behalf! Genuinely. I often write comments on videos with this intention.
I definitely didn't mean to strawman your arguments, tbh I don't think I really did so. I am a philosophy grad so I am quite familiar with this logical fallacy (and fwiw the rhetorical effectiveness of accusing 'opponents' of it). But to go through it at this point in the detail you seek would effectively mean I would have to rereview the material & then a) write an essay, or b) record a video. Not really a fruitful use of my time right now. Maybe one day!
Does Faz know that there is such a thing as equipped, multi-ply, but drug tested powerlifting?
I mean, what's the point? Talk about spoiling the fun.
I competed in single ply once, it's wild. Never again.
in the world where i can be anything I want to be. Why can’t I be a skinny fat power builder with jiggly bits?
Excellent stuff as usual. I agree 100% about powerbuilding being the worst of both worlds.
Just to be devil's advocate here and let people know, Mike O'Hearn has competed in powerlifting in the past and has put up some good numbers.
Then he gets to call himself a Powerlifter too. That doesn't diminish my argument at all and doesn't really add anything to the debate.
It also doesn't mean we need to invent a made up word to describe him or anyone else.
Ahead of the curve lol
😉
This should be interesting
I think you'll appreciate this one, especially the powerbuilders encroaching on what bodybuilding is angle. Be good to hear what you think!
I don't think most powerbuilders think they are getting the best of both worlds. Anyone with half a brain knows there is a tradeoff
Unfortunately most of them lack even half a brain
And for clarification, we also have to take into account those guys who have lost 100, 150, 200lbs. and are now "20%" but have so much lose skin, they will always have "jiggly bites" and man boobs. Have one patient who lost 170lbs., He is now down to 190 lbs at 6'3", jacked, but will never be seen till he gets skin surgery. The whole idea of real men doing a fashion show in their shorts just never made sense. Obviously to each their own. Powerlifting, strongman, CrossFit, sprinters, very cool because of the specific measurements of performance. In general, let's hope, all people, each individual finds his or her own space even if it is chess, ping pong or badminton. Understand how you feel, felt the same way about anyone that never joined the military and never had to shoot another human or drop a bomb on a village of men, women, children, babies... however found not everyone should face challenges. Not everyone is cut from the same cloth. Live and let live. If they are happy being a powerbodybuilder, fine. The world needs more happy people. Too much death and destruction.
A guy who's lost 200lbs is his own hero of course, but that's not really who I'm talking to here in this video. I do make that very clear in the video, so hopefully you've watched it all.
My question to you regarding what you said here:
"Understand how you feel, felt the same way about anyone that never joined the military and never had to shoot another human or drop a bomb on a village of men, women, children, babies"
Would you be as forgiving if someone who hadn't done that, went around trying to 'steal valor' and claim experiences and victories without actually doing them? I would guess not.
That is a better representation of the debate. I have zero problem with people having different goals, but this made up safety blanket needs to go and if you watch the video all the way through that is my point.
@@Fazlifts Yes, always watch the whole video. Very Good point. Never seen anyone who wanted to fake killing other people. Yes sometimes their are guys that try to fake military service (desk job bitches). Not sure why they would. Have to live the rest of my life knowing what I have done, regardless of the reason or which government said it was "ok" or "justified". No matter how many lives I help or save, will forever focus on those I have taken. Honestly don't know anyone who would fake that but guess anything is possible and yes see your point. Thanks 🙏💪👍 Guess that also touches on the point, if "powerbodybuilding" is for fakes but they are happy, let's let them live in their own fantasy world and be happy as they would never make it in a real sport. Just like the fake soldiers would never make it as a real soldiers. You have a good point and maybe this is why people care about watching Natty or Not videos. Have often wondered why? And who actually cares? Maybe you have a point, "Live and let live" might not be a good policy and we need to kick them in the butt to move them off center? Interesting thought. Let's find those who are happy in their own fantasy world and pull them into the real world. Like the TikTok people claiming obese is healthy and sexy, drives me insane.
Thank you Dr AJ. I've always enjoyed your reasoned input.
My hope is that people see past their emotional reaction to the topic and see this for what it is, that is me believing that no matter where you currently are, you can do better.
I think we can both agree, that's a good thing ;)
Seems like a fair amount of people who call themselves powerbuilders likely do so due to their perceived identity.
Even if they are technically doing bodybuilding training, they don’t view it as that because they either don’t ‘feel’ or look like an archetypical bodybuilder (huge, lean, likely enhanced, eating in a particular way, etc).
Similarly, if their training is focused more on the powerlifting movements, maybe thy don’t ‘feel’ like a power lifter because the don’t compete or haven’t hit the ‘right’ numbers yet.
Tbh, more people are probably doing bodybuilding training than realise it, and that’s likely because when people think bodybuilding they think of pro enhanced BB, which is so far removed from reality no wonder people get lost with these definitions and make up their own coping category.
Got to love 30mins of Faz just methodically going to town on this topic though 😂
Haha right!
Yes, I agree with all that. Ironically I actually disagree with people classifying themselves at all, unless they have actually competed. Back in my day, we just called ourselves lifters.
I always saw powerbuilding as a loose philosophy of bodybuilding that uses powerlifting methods. Never saw it as something to be diferentiated or legitimized, kind of like HIIT, or Mike Mentzer 1 set to failure, or nucleus overload nonsense. Just different methods to get the same result, especially since as you mentioned, you're gonna get stronger if you get big anyway, so what's the difference, why rename it? 😅 Always just seemed like a silly distinction.
Exactly. We're all brothers in strength and hypertrophy. We don't need made up divisions.
Can we start calling them "half cross-fitters" instead of Powerbuilders?
OOF! I think you're just right on this one. This whole need to "identify" as something is kind of cringe.
Until you compete, or do something to earn a title a title you simply are. I think we can sum up this issue as "Until proven otherwise, you're a lifter"
Yeah I think it's cringe for sure. I think it's okay to be a lifter.
The comments have been overwhelmingly positive but it's been interesting to see the few negative comments were VERY aggressive and personal. Clearly from people who have this strong emotional reaction to their safety blanket being taken away.
I'm an iron enjoyer
I can get behind that 💪
I wonder if "Hybrid Athletes" are the new Powerbuilders 👀 With that being said, I would say I fall into this category of trying to push lifting and endurance haha
I think Hybrid makes sense as it's an appropriately descriptive term.
Powerbuilders don't even seem to understand the difference between strength and power...
@@Fazlifts Fair. Was talking with a friend as well and although there are a ton of interpretations, pretty much everyone labelling themselves a hybrid athlete is competing in the second (non-strength) discipline - be it fighting, marathons, other endurance sports
Get the aloe vera ready.
Bodyfat related...
I have small love handles but visible abs when I flex.
I have a belly that extends, but I also have a very rounded spine.
I have vascular limbs, but my pecs look bigger than they really are.
A bodyfat conundrum indeed.
I'm gonna annoy Faz and say I'm 21-22%. My max goal was 20%, but I screwed up after my last mini cut and regained too much weight and gave myself no runway for growing. I'll fix it.
It doesn't annoy me at all :) I had hoped people would see this as more of a 'tough love' and positive message.
But with regards to your point, we're all different too. I gave those as fairly rough generalities from what I've seen. However there are some people who are more peripherally lean. It's unusual but far from impossible.
Good luck, and thank you for the comment!
@@Fazlifts Tough love was the message I received. It was much needed. Not a self-proclaimed powerbuilder at all; more just someone who has poor self-control when it comes to my love for good food. xD Thanks Faz!
Oh perfect, then I am a powerbuilder. Neither aesthetic nor very strong😅
Nice to know why I train. Not that I ever went sleepless over it though.
Err yeah that's not really what I'm saying Tony😅but thanks for the comment!
Interesting video thanks Faz. Russwole of course is tryna be claimed by PowerBuilders - oop theres an aesthetic power lifter we'll take him. 😂 I didn't know power building actually a brand people identify with, I'm out of the loop lol but you have a point. Also I love Mike Ohearn literally sells Duck Eggs it feels like someone selling literal oil from a snake. I hope he at least injects Anavar into them so his customers get some benefits 😂😂 jk jk
The Ohearn duck egg thing is unironically one of the funniest bodybuilding grifts of all time 🤣
🪦
I had you wrong from one of your short videos so I reckon I owe you sort of an apology. I can't remember which vid but I took it that you are just badgering lifters who carry higher body fat percentages. Saying they should just get lean and stop being fat shits. I myself and others I know are happy being larger and stronger (although we don't compete in anything), and happy pushing strength and not aesthetics. Do we categorise ourselves in any discipline, no not at all it's just about having fun, but I listened to you clearly here getting your points and can see where people get confused. An example is where someone has approached me before asking what I do, body building, powerlifting etc, me, I just lift weights mate, call it what you will. Good video I understand you more now and I'm not a power builder or anything else. Just a lifter. 😉
From one lifter to another, thank you.
I very rarely just berate people or ideas without reason, I'm not a drama channel. I did this video because I truly believe it's important.
@@Fazlifts I can see your intentions are good, kind and just wanting to help people. It says more about me jumping to assumptions from watching a short video. You're welcome, glad I stumbled across that short because it led me to your page. Best wishes.
Faz is by far one of the best coaches in the market right now💪 His teaching can be applied to every aspect of life. Thank You Faz!🙌
I appreciate that! Thanks!
💪💪
basado
🍻👌
Closetted bodybuilder responses incoming 😂😂
For better or worse it seems to have generated commentary 😃
Ah yes but Faz , you are well aware these days people can identify as any gender or label and the government will say its true 😉
🤣🤣🤣 the similarities are uncanny
Yawn
I’m ready to get roasted
I am surprisingly encouraging considering the title!