The Coraline Bug Theory
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.พ. 2021
- Get 10% off your first purchase at squarespace.com/karsten !!
Patreon: / karstenrunquist
---
Merch: teespring.com/stores/karsten-...
Instagram: / karstenrunquist
Twitter: / runquistkarsten
Discord: / discord
BUSINESS INQUIRES:
runquistkarsten@gmail.com
Thank you for watching! :) - ภาพยนตร์และแอนิเมชัน
what’s your favorite bug?
Lady
Common pest
giant beetles :•)
Squidward
‘s life
This dude's highschool english teachers prolly loved him.
i feel like they either really loved him bc he was really good or hated him bc he was always off task but still a good student
@@maryanne.898 Or they hated him because he was really good lol, and he was smarter than the teachers themselves.
@@cashwin45 he keeps calling the VW Beetle a VW Bug, so yeah, safe to say he wasn't smarter than his teachers then and still wouldn't be now either.
@@thatboymeak pedant detected
@@thatboymeak asperger moment
The praying mantis could also be about how the other mother created the other father, and eventually destroys him when he gets in her way. Female mantises bite the head off of their sexual partners once they reproduce
YES! This is exactly what I was thinking
Wow
That's creepy af
W o a h
They only do that if they're hungry, I think.
Fun fact: the book almost wasn’t published. His editor said it was going to traumatize kids , so he asked her to read it to her daughter and see if it was too scary. The girl said she was enjoying it every night , and they got through the whole book and she said it wasn’t scary so the book was published. Many years later , Neil got to talk to her about the book and she said she was absolutely terrified The whole time but wanted to know what was next , so she lied because she was worried that they’d stop reading the book if she said it was terrifying. The book got published because a kid lied about how scary it was.
I KNOW! this fact alone made me go and buy the book, and it definitely lived up to the horror hype, much scarier than the film
I watched the film when I was around 10 or so, scared the shit outta me
@@ezzalongford9097i thought i was crazy for thinking the book was scarier than the movie 💀💀 i listened to it for the first time while going to sleep, the descriptions were giving my brain a hard time LOL
😂 😂😂 lol
Kid taught a valuable lesson about pluralist ignorance, but like…in reverse.
Can we just talk about how much of a hero the other dad is? His first appearance he sings a song basically telling her to gtfo and never return. Then in the button eyes scene he tells her about how sharp the needle to try and scare her from the buttons and after Coraline rejects the buttons he has a massive grin. Even when he was horrifically mutated into a pumpkin with no free will he resists the other mothers control to give Coraline the eye all while apologizing. There are probably even more times where he was trying to help Coraline get out.
Completely agree! I did have this same thought but not with all of these examples in mind, now I want to rewatch it again to see other instances I missed
I never noticed the other father tried to help. I have to watch it again.
How does the song tell her to never return?
@@drac7478 look into the context of the lyrics, look at them deeply, and you can see the underlying warning behind them.
@@drac7478 Making up a song about Coraline
She's a peach, she's a doll, she's a pal of mine
She's as cute as a button
In the eyes of everyone who ever laid their eyes on Coraline
When she comes around exploring
Mom and I will never ever make it boring
Our eyes will be on Coraline
There's the lyrics, now you have to pick them apart. Really read between the lines. He warns her about the doll, the buttons and the fact that the Other Mother is always watching her, I'll leave you to figure out where in the song he sprinkles these warnings for yourself.
Bugs can also indicate decay, and the other mothers world is dying without a child to feed off.
oooh very good
It fits the spider symbolism of her quite well. She eats the bugs born in her decaying realm because she had no choice.
Sounds like my family.
it feels so nice to change a comment to 1k likes
@@pmatcha *gasp* bigtop burger?!
Humanity: *dreams of spiders*
Sigmund Freud: "Oh ho ho, someone has mummy issues again don't they?"
Lol I love this! Freud had some significant contributions to psychology but he also made a lot of out there assumptions and theories to explain people’s behavior.
@@atp8108 he's funny but I'm glad modern psychology studies,universities considers his psychoanalysis work non scientific
@@atp8108 a good portion of his theories were projecting his own feelings as universal mental theories, he must have had a hot mom Lmao.
@@mellowhype18 I hope he's rolling in his grave over what you've said because the bastard deserves it honestly.
Wtf Freud is a fucking pioneer and contributed more to Social Science than you try to imply here. Have some respect and go read a book or sth
2:22 The mantis wasn’t used BY the dad to attack Coraline, it was USING the dad to attack Coraline. You can see that he clearly tried to help her from saying “sorry, mother made me, I don’t wanna hurt you” to shaking his hand off of the metal and giving her the ghost eye. He’s genuinely on her side.
Also praying mantis females eat the males which perfectly describes the other mother and other father’s relationship and her control over him even through the praying mantis weapon
Yeah
'i don't play the piano, the piano plays me,'
I mean he was using it but the other mother was controlling him
@@orang1921 actually the machine itself has gloves on him controlling his arm movements, when he pulls a glove loose he is able to give Coraline the ghost eye.
3:40 the spiders representing feminine power thing is really interesting, when you consider the fact that Coraline is a movie that revolves around 3 women: the mother, the other mother, and Coraline. Throughout the story, the men are mostly just there to assist the women. The father listens to the mother and follows her lead, the other father and other Wybie are literal puppets for the other mother, and Wybie basically acts as Coraline's sidekick. It makes me wonder if it was a coincidencide or not.
Moving right past the freudian typo.
I feel it might have been more responsible to have better help sponsor this video than squarespace. This thoughtful dissection just ripped a couple of festering mental band aids off without warning. People say it hurts less if you don't anticipate it. I'm currently flailing dramatically in dispute of that being fact. Almost as ridiculously as when I unexpectedly see a spider.
Man, how could you forget the best supporting character of them all? t h e c a t
@@seeeds4702 And cats are often frequently associated with feminine power as well, particularly witchcraft.
maiden, mother and crone. Just like the triple goddess.
@Erika Wagner as a witch that’s actually completely correct, but alright
in the book, coraline has a huge fear of spiders
I can’t wait to read the book
Finally, I was looking for this comment. Should've been definitely mentioned in the video. I like to think that the Beldam doesn't have a spider true form per say, but that she just manifests as a spider in Coraline's eyes to inspire fear after Coraline refused to sew her eyes. Just how the world looked perfect in Coraline's eyes at the beginning to inspire her excitement, although in the book it didn't fool Coraline quite as well as in the movie.
This is one of those films that really improves on the book. The book is beautifully written, and I'm not here to throw shade on Neil Gaiman(I think heaps of the guy, he has some of my highest my respect), but LAIKA really transformed the story. It's...more impactful, somehow, more haunting. And knowing that the book almost wasn't published (look up the story behind that--it's pretty interesting) the fact that this movie....successfully fills out an already fantastic tale... Is huge to me. If that makes sense.
I’m surprised at how many ppl don’t know there’s a book. I think it’s so much better and scarier than the movie.
@@despondentmemories Ik right? Although I wouldn't say the book is better than the movie or viceversa, because each one it's unique on it's on way, and also the movie departed a lot from the book, mostly to make it more appealing to younger audiences. But I do agree that the book is a lot scarier and dark, that's why I enjoy it more than the movie and it's more interesting to think about theories with things from the book.
In a deleted scene, Coraline finds a spider near the sink and accidentally throws it into her mother’s coffee.
k
i did
@@thefanofthreethings6595 why did you return
@@bobfishtheblobfish3619 if someone @ I would respond too
@@alka6432 why did you come
I think coraline is treated like a pest a lot by her parents, too.
So that ties into the bugs and also the circus mice. It’s like, in the other world, the pests are pretty cool and celebrated. But then when the other mother eats the beetle in front of her, it kinda takes you out of the fantasy. The other mother is now a threat and not someone who is accepting. The bugs are her food and furniture , not something she cares about.
Oooooof this has NOTHING to do with Coraline but "bugs being celebrated/but actually are only useful and not something she cares about" reminds me of so much... this is such a good way of explaining this sort of thing. Thank you.
i never thought of this, it’s such a cool perspective!!
Yeah this is really good. When the Other Mother eats the bug, it's the first shock of her predatory nature being shown to the audience.
I think your analysis is spot on, this makes so much sense
I like this comment because you mention how pests are celebrated there. Along with your take on how Coraline is treated like a pest in the real world, and how the bedlam eats the pest shows how she pretends to like Coraline just to eat her up.
sorry this is like gibberish, it made more sense in my head
i love the fact that neil's explanation for coraline is that he wrote it to answer to his daughter where cats go when they disappear
Dad, where do cats go when they disappear?
Give me a minute, I have to think of a fancy way to traumatize you^^
AAAHSIDHDJDJSJDHFBFHDJDBthis
@Bez Podpisu She actually really likes horror, he said he wrote it because there wasn't much creepy children's content
Coraline is honestly one of the best stop motion animated films ever
It really is an incredible piece of cinema
Same
Disagree. But it is a decent film.
You're opinion is the cool opinion 😎👌
Yes!!!!
Other father actually couldn’t control the praying mantis toward the end. He never wanted to hurt coraline. He even says “I’m sorry/so sorry Mother’s making me.” He rips one of the lost children’s eyes off of the mantis contraption before meeting his demise.
It's interesting to note that male mantises are submissive until death in service of the female's predatorial behaviour. Same as some male spiders are sometimes eaten by the female spider when mating in order to better the survival chances of the female and their offspring. The choice of using a mantis there and his puppet-like persona, might very well be intentional symbolism.
@@Rodrigo_Vega Wow I never thought about that great analysis both of you!
@@Rodrigo_Vega this is so incredible!! that’s really well thought out!
Why can't we kill and eat male hoomans. (joke)
@@MissEIIie hahahahaha🥱cause that’s against the law. Somewhere along the lines of murder and disgusting... I think.
7:38 There is a subplot/backstory in the book about the rats and the crawl space behind the little door. The crawl space is definitely alive in some way, and the rats have been there a very long time: “…We were here before you rose, we will be here when you fall.”
A word the other mother uses in the movie to describe the cat in my opinion sums up the viewer’s perspective of the rats and bugs: vermin.
Or demons
It would totally be wicked if that song they sang in coraline's dream was in reference to the other mother, not Coraline. "We were here before you rose" (they were here before she became a monster and gained power) "We will be here when you fall" (they'll probably remain after she dies). Because it's mentioned in the book that the door is alive itself, it's moving and breathing and older than the other mother. It might not just be the door though, it might be the entirety of the world she uses to lure kids.
Maybe while the other mother is a spider, the door and the world as a whole is a web. It uses the other mother to capture prey and they share the essence to keep themselves alive, but considering she lost Coraline it might just feed off of her in place.
The well is probably another passageway to the other world, I think Neil Gaiman confirmed this in his Twitter. But om isn't gonna have enough time to trick and eat another kid considering she said she'll die without Coraline. So I think the om will die, but the other world will live on
another thing to point out is how bugs often live and hide in plants, the way that the other mother’s world was floral and decorated but hid her true intentions
That's really cool! I always wondered about the plants and I didn't make that connection for some reason lol
This theory is fascinating! One thing that I found interesting is the fact that the other father is forced to violence by the praying mantis controlled by the other mother similar to how the mating of praying mantises ends with the death of the father by the mother. Even decaptated the male mantis will complete the mating process, anything to obtain offspring
Oooo, I hadn’t thought of that. Good point
I think you are absolutely right.
Overall mantis' can be really brutal predators to other bugs and even big ass lizards. It's really gross watching one eat a living lizard... I'll stop
In the book the other father turns into this grotesque, mushy, bug-like creature instead of a pumpkin-y one. But I think this still works with the bug motif because it shows how the other mother discarded him and allow him to almost melt away when she had no more use for him.
I was thinking about this! I was so surprised that it wasn’t brought up. I went to the comments to see if anyone would say something about it
i love how this movie is STILL being theorized about. shows how compelling the story truly is.
@@AxxLAfriku poor caro :(
Ikr! It excites the hell out of me when I see a new theory
Neil gaiman is a master
FRRRR i love watching theories on this
Yep, that's how classics are made.
I find it a little odd that you didn’t mention the popular image of female praying mantises eating the heads off of their mates. This isn’t a truly accurate behavior, but imo it’s ubiquitous with praying mantises way more than wisdom or reliability. And it fits thematically with how the garden mantis used by other father eventually came to control HIM, physically tying him down and forcing him to chase coraline. It further highlights the control other mother has over all her pawns and the lack of care she has towards them, even towards her “husband”
I was just gonna point this out!! It makes perfect sense and goes with the devouring mother trope
Coraline is an amazing movie. The bug things aren’t part of the book at all, it was a cool addition by the talented film crew. To me it seems obvious that the other mother is being compared to a spider with Coraline as the bug. She slowly reveals her true nature over the course of the movie and at the end when all is revealed, she shows that her beautiful little world is really just a giant web to trap her prey
“They’re cocoa beatles from ZANZABAAAAAAR”
7 year old me: This woman is real crazy.
7 year old me was like: DAMN- GO OFFFFF
ZAAAANZIBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR
Ngl I really wanted to eat them when I was younger
It's weird. When I was a kid I thought coraline was crazy for not accepting other mother's offer to stay forever, even if it meant sewing buttons into her eyes. But when she brought out the box of bugs and bit one I wanted coraline to get away from her as soon as possible.
I second that.
I’m obsessed with Coraline. I’ve read the book over 8 times and watched the movie at least 12 times. And I’ve noticed something from the book - (at least the one I’ve had my hands on), when you add up all the page numbers of the mice poems, you’ll get a page number. And on that page, the mice are thanking Coraline for freeing them.
woahh
oh my
thats actually really cool!
do you have a specific copy/print? that would be a really cool read and i wanna check it out.
i haven't read the book, but i've seen the movie about 20 times. it's just-- perfection.
@@exorjack I totally agree it’s super cool. My print had a black material cover and I didn’t own it, I just brought it home and read it a lot because it was a school book. Sadly after covid hit, I hadn’t had my hands on it.
@@sophiaandstufff4730 Ah, sorry to hear. Sounds like it was a fun read!
I'm currently looking for copies of the book that I could get during Covid because im all out of books. Hope you get your hands on that copy again! :)
I think the biggest thing you missed, is that dragonflies are the most successful predators. And this shines through when coraline actually counters Other Mother’s plans by playing a game
Coraline managed to outmaneuver Other Mother at her own goals, and escaped the web alive
The metaphor for the other mother being a spider is consistent in the book: she never turns in to a spider, she’s just compared to them a lot. So her transformation is a very clever way of visually representing this metaphor
I like how the presence of the cat is so reassuring throughout the movie
Especially since it's voiced by Keith David
My cat eats bugs
I think(for some people) seeing a child in danger scares us and has the need of wanting to protect them, so having the cat walk by her side and helping her reassures us. If the cat wasn't there it would've been maybe uncomfortable to watch, just like that movie 'pihu'
@@johnmcgetrick6430 mine too,john.
Yess and in the book the character of wybie doesn’t exist so the cat plays a much bigger roll in the sense of supporting/ helping coraline to get home and basically just acting as a lifeline. He’s my favourite character :))
I hate how Netflix took off Coraline so quick lol.
Ugh I know 😒
@@kraken_the_cowboytheres no reason really.. they do that everytime
@@kraken_the_cowboy they probably lost the rights
I have it on dvd. Hehehehehe 😈😈
@peroh don't link malware please
Personally, I've always found bugs to be ethereal or otherworldy. They seem to be such a force of nature to me since you can't look at them and tell how they're feeling, unlike other animals. They always seem to just be living just because they can. They only worry about themselves, doing whatever it takes to keep going no matter what damage occurs. Its almost admirable, how they overcome the world without a second thought.
That's my take on bugs, my favorite being butterflies.
this is really interesting to me because you CAN tell how a bug is feeling by looking at them! it's just that they are small and it is hard to get a good look. they're very similar to other animals -- theyre quite intelligent, and have complex little inner lives. they're often quite expressive if you know what to look for.
it's interesting to me that it seems like most people think of bugs as little robots or mindless automata rather than just very small animals. it would be frightening to live in a world populated mostly by brainless machine creatures.
the thing that personally frightens me is how it seems like culturally we have just decided that the majority of animals in the world (bugs) aren't really animals at all. how did that decision get made? how did that belief propagate? it's so interesting and spooky to me that we can just decide something like that.
I think you would love hollow knight as much as I do at that point 😊
@SoftPiet It's hilarious that you say that because I've played Hollow Knight and it's one of my favorite games! I can't wait for Silk Song to come out!!
They're interesting for sure.
They sometimes feels so unpredictable or stupid that you can't help but think they're minions controlled by a higher power
They're a part of a _hivemind_
One of their roles is "cleaning up" the decaying matter like corpses or feces.
And no matter how well you hide a body, there will always be a bug that finds its way to the body and feasts on it.
The nature just has this nearly supernatural way of dealing with corpses and stuff.
They're tiny but so important to the environment.
And i say all that as someone who hates bugs 😅
@@birde6393
I was visiting a somewhat-distant family once. We were sitting in a patio and on a table stood a nearly empty glass bottle of beer. Inside the bottle was a wasp and a fly, both desperately trying to hold onto the glass wall and climb up on it to escape their prison, as the beverage leftover was reaching up to half of their tiny bodies.
It made me acctually feel really bad for the wasp despite my relationship with bugs... It took me some minutes but i acctually picked the bottle and spilled its contents on the grass. For once, i did something nice for the tiny creatures.
Well, the wasp propably was still going to die after this experience, but at least it died in peace instead of agony. Drowning is one of the worst ways to die, or so i've heard.
Also, coraline being shown with dragonflies and the other mother with spiders is kinda foreshadowing in itself of the other mothers downfall. Spiders are dormant predators, they wait for their prey to come into their domain and become trapped. Dragonflies on the other hand are active predators, they're quick hunters and can bite hard enough to draw blood from a human. A dragonfly trapped in a spiders web would easily be prey, but if able to come free would devour the spider
i watched coraline years ago, i literally only remember the naked grandmas swinging around
Fun Fact: Neil Gaiman (who wrote the book) intended for them to be an old lesbian couple. Which totally makes sense with how they argue with each other
@@DAEsaster aw thats amazing
@@DAEsaster They act more like sisters, at least that is how I see them.
@@Samuel-qc7kg Yeah to me they act more like sisters than a couple too. But they did say intended so I assume they are and he didn't make them a lesbian couple
@@DAEsaster Y 👏🏼 E 👏🏼 S
7:32: something to be used rather than loved.
In the book, it reads: “And, despite herself, Coraline nodded. It was true: the other mother loved her. But she loved Coraline as a miser loves money, or a dragon loves its gold. In the other mother’s button eyes, Coraline knew that she was a possession, nothing more. A tolerated pet, whose behavior was no longer amusing.”
😳😳
Reminds me of a quote from The Bluest Eye:
"Love is never any better than the lover. Wicked people love wickedly, violent people love violently, weak people love weakly, stupid people love stupidly, but the love of a free man is never safe. There is no gift for the beloved. The lover alone possesses his gift of love. The loved one is shorn, neutralized, frozen in the glare of the lover’s inward eye."
@@kkondor1081 deep
@@kkondor1081 i love that quote
@@kkondor1081 like love is in the eyes of the beholder?
It's interesting how the larger the other mothers creations are, then the more self-aware they will be. Everything is made out of a soul-sand type of material and the other mother has more control of the smaller things (usually bugs). Even Mr Bobinsky was shown to be made out of rats which were actually mice that the other mother was kidnapping from Mr Bobinsky. In the beginning Mr Bobinsky told Coraline that the mice were warning her not to go through the little door.
That explains why the dad in the end helped Coraline take the ghost eye, and Wybie helped Coraline escape the first time when the other mother trapped Coraline inside the mirror.
Quick correction: Coralines parents are trapped in the mirror
I like that they never portrayed her real mother as bad. She clearly feels remorse about her neglect, but she's so busy..
I also think the bugs communicate how Coraline feels in her home, like an unwanted pest. In the beginning of the film she keeps getting pushed away by her parents, and so much like an unwanted bug she hides away in her safe place, which just happens to be the Beldam's web. Being a pest is also interesting because mice are looked at favorably while rats are not. The same thing goes for mantises and dragonflies vs. spiders and cockroaches. I guess the bug symbolism can also be saying that "pests" can prove to be appealing and deserving of love when you take the time to appreciate them, like how the old ladies care for their dogs, Bobinski for his mice, Wybie for his cat and even Coraline's parents for her.
That's a really interesting idea, I hate that some creatures are viewed as worthless whilst others aren't.
@Gaming Miser
That's a really dumb view because the mice don't know what they're doing and any animal can spread disease if they aren't domesticated.
@Gaming Miser
Why is that stupid? If there is no fault of the animal, it's not to blame, you can accept animals being annoying without having to call them pests.
@Gaming Miser
Yeah kind of, nothing you said was technically incorrect, but the official definition has changed so much nowadays to basically just mean 'useless and pathetic'.
@Gaming Miser
Well by useless this would mean a pointless life form, not useless to a specific person. And honestly I'm pretty sure people generally use the word 'pest' to describe something as worthless or inferior, at least most of the time- sure, this could just be from my experience but I doubt it.
In Norway dragon flies are called “eye stabbers” and there are myths that they sew eyes shut, just like how the other mother sews buttons into the eyes of children..
Wow that is so interesting
Thats really interesting
that’s is really.. painful..
Mr. Creepypasta read a story about that myth of the dragonflies and in this version the dragonflies would sew your entire face shut if you were a bad child and went into the forest by yourself.
Why all the negative beliefs around dragonflies? They're beautiful compared to most other insects, and they eat mosquitos!
I like to think about the stuffing scene as a symbol of controlling abuse as well, about how Other Mother doesn’t love Coraline for her, but for herself. She puts new stuffing in a recycled doll like the cycle of abuse and hunger doesn’t stop. At least that’s how I like to think about it.
Something to point out about the use of mantises: Female praying mantises are much larger than males and often cannibalize their heads during mating. I thought this was interesting since the dad is forced to use a mantis to attack Coraline, possibly to represent the Beldam and her control over him. I also love the use of pitcher plants in the garden, a plant that uses a sweet scent to lure in bugs and drown them.
almost 10min that I am scrolling just to find someone saying this !! thank you
You missed a major one: The buttons on other mother (and the others in that world) have 4 holes; meaning that other mother has 8 holes where her eyes should be. Spiders have 8 eyes. I'm sure this was part of the inspiration behind the book.
Wow that's really cool but I think it's just a coincidence because almost all buttons have four holes.
@@wabi-sabi5621 eh I guess so but almost equally as much buttons have only two holes
Omg so true!
Oh I'm sure the other mother has plenty of holes 😏
There’s a book !,?.?
This movie is so good it's one of the rare movies considered neither a kid or adult movie. It's an amazing movie.
Glad to see you have great taste in films Landlord Almighty
Same, when I was first told about coraline, my sister told me and she described it as 'baby's first horror'!
Godbless
Yes
You mean young adult
There's a section of the book that explains the spider metaphor. At one point Coraline and the cat tries to leave the house and explore the rest of th eother world, but Coraline discovers that everything just loops back to the house. When she asks the cat why the other world only has the house in it, it answers that "a spiders web only needs to be big enough to catch a fly". The point is that the entire other world is the other mother's spider web that she crafted in order to catch flies like Coraline. By not reading up on the book, I feel that your explanation becomes lacking.
I honestly feel so bad for the pumpkin. He was trying to help Coraline the whole time. He literally said, and I quote: “Sorry, so sorry, mother make me. Don’t wanna hurt you… heeere take it!”
The mantis thing kind of made me think. I agree that mantises have that sort of a feeling to them, like they're wise, reliable and trustworthy, dependable. Those are also the kinds of qualities that a child would expect from a parent. In the other world, Coraline's other father rides a giant mantis, and this too feels like it's solidifying the fact that he and the mantis share the same virtues.
Once the garden begins to collapse, the mantis turns from trustworthy to hostile, the same way that other mother turns out to be evil and the other father fails to protect Coraline. The mantis seems to act as a reflection of Coraline's other parents.
ok, since when are mantises seen as reliable and trustworthy?? Like their defining trait is to wait on their prey luring them into a false sense of safety before ambushing them. They don't have venom which makes their bites rather harmless to beings like humans, but that's one of their freaky traits as they catch their prey and _slowly eat them alive_ since the bites won't kill. Mantises are terrifying
@@annaairahala9462 the females also kill their mates, eating them alive after decapitating them
THEY LOOK WISE OK I DIDNT ASK ABOUT THEIR SEX LIFE
This would be awesome if mantises were actually what you mentioned lol
so whens the 'the hands in coraline' video
I never even realized that the Other Mother's plate was empty throughout the movie until you said it. This theory makes a lot of sense as to why it is, and for the other details in the movie as well!
Its cuz she only eats children's souls and bugs lol
Creeped me out when I realized it.
Yeah same
Actually the other father was warning coraline about other mother, listen closely to the song he sang her when she first arrived
He also said that other mother was saving herself for the "main course "during the dinner scene, with witch she replied with the hands shutting his mouth
Coraline's hairpin looks a lot like a dragonfly. So immediately I thought "oh ok, so Coraline is the dragonfly and other mother the spider, and spiders eat dragonflies." But then found it kind of ironic with the "Devil's Darning Needle" folklore, since Coraline basically blinds the other mother at the end which ultimately saves her time to escape.
The director, Henry Selik, also made the animated film “James and the Giant Peach” where insects were used as a theme as well. They were used as friendship/escapism.
“The 2009 stop motion classic Coraline”
Wow literally 15 seconds in and I already feel old.
2009? jesus...
This movie scarred me as a child
@@justiceofbook
Who didn’t it scare 😂 I know I never watched it night, that’s for sure.
@@nervousnori ...what?
Yea
My bug theory is “bug scary”
Let me know what you guys think of my theory!
I agree
Hm you do bring up some good points
so true!!!
:0 groundbreaking
Yes! Exactly what I’m thinking!
i think it should have been interesting to also mention the fact that when coraline first beats other mother, the hand still manage it's way to return to coraline's home. and the hand walks. and this is really made to think of the hand as a spider, bc that's what it looks like, but also spiders always crawl inside, more like they sneak inside our homes, and disrupt us, and many of us have arachnophobia. so the few scenes when the hand returns, all by itself, made me think of the second spider: smaller bc the biggest part was beaten (other mother), but as it is smaller, it is also more discrete and you can't see it and that's what is the most scary, about spiders. also coraline beats the hand really the same way we, people, kill spiders: by squashing them. we can even push it deeper as she is squashing the hand with an enormous rock which really proves her fear: when we are afraid of bugs, specifically spiders, we smash them with huge objects, or at least heavy ones, bc it makes us feel more protected and also reassured that we will kill them the first time and not miss them. and in the end, this whole hand addition was to me very important to show how the presence of other mother will always be here, either by getting at least coraline traumatized for the rest of her life, just how abusive relationships traumatize and affect us in the real life, or even by always being around, and being able to return one time, which also is a big fear when it comes to adults being abused in their childhood: the fear, the paranoia will always be here, deep down. and also people always can crawl inside your life again. we are never in complete security and safety and i think this is also what the movie is about.
One of the best comments i’ve read ! This is amazing and all seems v accurate! Good job on this one !
This is so beautifully said well done!
Other mild things about the bug symbolism:
Of course regarding the Beldam spiders usually symbolize deception, see the story of The Spider and The Fly, but to further elaborate on the "feminine power" aspect, it ties seamlessly to the insect that represents Other Father. It's commonly pointed out how female mantises devour their mates after the mating process, so male mantises are often just pawns and eventual meals once their purpose has been completed. This is something that also commonly happens with spiders and various other arthropods as males are typically dwarfed by the females, and for arachnids and carnivorous insects, the size difference often pegs you as food. However, for spiders, it's a bit more infamous due to both the reputation of the black widow as well as tarantula keepers sharing information about how the breeding process works and how it's always incredibly stressful as there's a very large chance the female will just eat the male mid-courtship.
It should also be pointed out that dragonflies are known to be quick and bold hunters, which does fit Coraline's personality, but what's also interesting is that, while they are often the prey of spiders, some dragonflies are _predators_ of spiders, snatching them right from their webs due to how fast and precise they are (from what I can tell, though, this is pretty uncommon, but it does happen, some species more specialized in this form of hunting than others). They're also known for being very tactical, predicting the maneuvers of their targets while in pursuit, which also fits well with how Coraline was smart enough to immediately recoil from the Beldam's request to sew the buttons in her eyes as well as generally playing against her in a battle of wits at the end.
God damn you wrote A lot
I ain't reading allathat
I never saw a mantis as “harmless”, but rather “calculating”. They’re known to stay in one place for incredibly long times to catch their prey at the perfect moment. They’re known for their ability to play the long-con, which I think also fits into the story as well.
You're right!
The amount of code necessary to implement mantis abilities in robotics would be incredible. I came across 3 last summer and "tested" them in fascinating ways. Amazing creatures.
ive known them as being Far Too Large for my comfort
Actually there is a species of mantis which is a runner and chases their prey
They also look fucking scary. I can't look at pictures of a praying mantis. Something about them is so grotesque and creepy
Okay to set the record straight; the Australian museum states that: "Spiders usually have eight eyes but few have good eyesight.
Spiders usually have eight eyes (some have six or fewer), but few have good eyesight. They rely instead on touch, vibration and taste stimuli to navigate and find their prey. Most are able to detect little more than light-dark intensity changes which stimulate nocturnal web building, hunting or wandering activities and rapid movement to allow quick reactions against daytime predators (e.g. by dropping from webs). Some spiders have median eyes that can detect polarised light and they use this ability to navigate while hunting"
It is wrong to say that spiders can't see during the day, but it is still correct that spiders that lack an iris (the ones with completely black eyes = other mother for example) have very poor daylight vision and hence rely on other methods to catch prey. In this sense I still feel like the light to dark blindness transition makes sense in a narrative. But no, as many people have pointed out, not all spiders are blind during the day.
No that isn’t true
If so then how to whip spiders and spiders that live in caves not see as they are blind.
She was also probably blind because her eyes got gouged out by the cat
But that would explain why she couldn't just pick them up and do what that creature in pans labyrinth did
She couldn't see them
@@stever7283 There are blind spiders. They navigate using special hairs or sensors on their body.
@@makaroni1291 um yeah.. I said that
I love media with darker meanings. They have an emotional connection I can’t get anywhere else and I can truly enjoy them on a deep level. I never had a normal childhood and I relate more to Tim Burton movies than I do to Disney movies. I grew up watching Saw, Child’s play, Nightmare on Elm st., ect. because that’s what was laying around and no one cared for me so horror was basically my caregiver. I’m mentioning this here to help anyone reading this understand my deep connection to movies like this a little better.
that's sad but pretty
Also, look at how the dragonflies are pictured as “devils darning needles” & then how you use needles to sew buttons, also look at how they are a form of blindness, but in the beldams (the other mothers) world, they are able to see even with buttons for eyes. Is it a prevention of blindness from the live dragonflies, or a belief the bedlam holds?
I don’t know if it was intentional, but in Norwegian dragonfly is “øyenstikker”, which when broken down translates to “Eye Stabber”. And in Norwegian folklore it was said that they would sew shut the eyes of anyone who slept on the job, much like The Other Mother, though of course without the sleeping on the job part. It might just be me reading too much into it, but considering the movie we’re talking about it might not be such a stretch.
thats actually so interesting! i wouldn’t be suprised if that’s one of the reasons why they used the dragonflies throughout the movie!
hamster
@@FlowersOfAmity hamster
@@FlowersOfAmity hamster
@Lathan Hunter ok lathan you can go now
I will never forget the time they accidentally showed us this for movie night... in the child psychiatric ward...
Dear lord 😨, that's abit of a mess up
oh dear god
WHEEZEEE WTF 🤣 😂 😆 LMAO
Didn't happen please don't be ugly, thanks
@@basiadynos5824 we had 1 hour of free time every day in the main room. in the main room there was a TV and that TV had cable. on that TV they were showing coraline because it was october and only a few days before halloween. the cna was on his phone and didnt notice. we only got like 1/4 through the movie because there were so many ads. but it did happen
God, this movie was my absolute CHILDHOOD- I was obsessed with it ever since I was 3, and still to this day its both a comfort movie and an excitingly fun art piece to sit back and pick apart. Absolutely love the theories still being made surrounding the story
Even if they don't solve some narrative puzzle, I think the level of detail given to the bug element just heightens the viewer's unease. The inter-connected nature of the insect appearances, and the internal logic of the Beldam's spider biology gives us a sense that something larger than our own understanding is at play. It's terrifying to catch a glimpse of a mechanized system without knowing its intended use.
At the beginning of the movie,when Coraline is welcomed by other mother,she is given a cake with the inscription "Welcome home".
The "O" in home,has a double hoop,Wich symbolically, highlights a lie, something insincere.Meaning in Coraline,being Welcomed,but not being home.
I've heard this!It's amazing,the symbolism and attention to detail!
Yeah I watched it in my lit class and that was one of the things we pointed out
Not original
@@vynsimp6690 so facts aren't original? jeez
Maybe the double circles also symbolize the button eyes
"in mythology [...], Freud says..."
Subtle burn there, well done.
I don’t get it, sorry. Please explain?
@@papasscooperiaworker3649 it implies Freud’s theories are mythological, AKA bullshit
@@yanmagno3 why they hate so much Freud? Genuine question
@@ladystarfire his "theories" were incredibly sexist, inaccurate, and all-around problematic. Most have now been debunked
@@lauram7929 Those that haven’t been debunked are the backbone of modern psychology, his work is so obvious and accepted people forget how much of it was new at the time. Freud was a creep but this isn’t some fringe quack we’re talking about.
This movie... I still think it’s just so underrated, people should just acknowledge how unique it is. So cleverly thought out, such a mysterious world... brought upon are knees. Some how with Coraline, the fact that we’re not explained to pieces of this world. Just makes it all refreshing....
One more thing for the spider beldam, the Jorogumo, aka spider woman, it is a japanese urban legend. It disguises itself as a beautiful woman, which in this case Coraline’s “mother” to lure men into their traps to kill them, in this case, the Jorogumo or The Beldam disguises herself as Coraline’s “mom” to lure Coraline into her trap to take her soul. Randomly thought about this
“The spider thing has weaved through the entire story”
*is that a pun my sir?*
What do you think smart guy???
@@bungiecrimes7247 I think it's not a pun
banna bread
I do think that is a pun. Because the angle 📐 of this pun is 23:/9 so it does mean that it is a pun if you think about it so get you spirit boards to ask honest Abe about it.
@@pantzrat6273 ok
oh dam i forgot i posted this lmao
Wow this is much deeper than I thought, great analysis.
Wow, Hey.
Theory time: I’ve seen you account comment easily on hundreds of videos during a year or even more
I suspect your account is managed by a variety of people all with different tastes in entreteinment, thus commenting on a multitude of videos
Bro get out of here i cant stop seening you everywhere
Noice
FAKE ONE
"Mantids are usually looked at as harmless creatures"
I don't know where you live, but the only time anyone ever talked about mantids where I've lived, it was in references to either their thorny claws and/or the females' habit of eating the males alive. They definitely aren't seen as "harmless" where I come from.
This is insane, I've watched this film SO many times as a child and I had never, even remotely, thought about any of these, or even that the main theme of the movie could be the control and power dynamics within nature! that's so awesome! I'm just in awe
This theory makes sense. In the book coraline the “other father” slowly turns into bees at the end of the story. (It’s been a while since I’ve read it so sorry if things are off) But before he did, Coraline tells a story about how she was stung by one and how the dad helped her out. So when the other father turns into bees it shows that he wants to help out, but the situation that they were in doesn’t allow him to. Also that was probably the most terrifying part of the entire book because they were both locked in a basement with the other father having the key or something.
Edit: Thank you for all the likes holy crap!
And he lost his sight so he couldn't see her but didn't have any control over his body when the other mother didn't want him to.
Man I remember reading that scene late at night in my bed as a kid. I didn't realize I could be scared by a book up until that point.
Just like in the movie, the part with other father pumpkin in the book is the scariest part of the book. The way Neil describes the cellar....Most memorable part of the book for me
You're super close, Coraline's Real Father had a fear of getting stung by bees, and the Other Father turns into like, a giant grotesque larva or a grub when he was locked in the basement. But the bee motif actually still makes sense and is incredibly creepy because bees' offspring are larva. That actually makes the basement scene even scarier and sadder now, to think that the Other Father is transforming into something he himself (or the Real version of himself) is afraid of.
@@protonmonkey thank you I knew I was missing a part of the story!
The Coraline movie is 12 years old and every now and then, a video about the movie is made. I have no complaint, Coraline was a good movie. 😀👍
*is
I cant believe that they took it off of hulu and netflix.....
11, actchchually
@@hannahlennertkristiansen4797 did you have a stroke?
Almost 12 years
What you said about praying mantises normally considered peaceful but turned evil in the movie for the sake of horror made me think of how the other father didnt want to hurt coraline, and it was the other mother making him try to kill her. Like the other father was actually innocent like a praying mantis.
So Coraline has obvious motifs about facing your fears. I noticed 'chickens' show up fairly often (more than once lol) Do you guys think this can tie in with fear? Like, being called Chicken when youre scared to do something? Other Wybie had the chicken oven mitt over his head after the Other Mother stitched a smile on other Wybie's face.
"Cockroaches and beetles are often always around but we don't see them"
Ugh now how am I going to sleep
Read that while he said it
I live in acold as fuck place, like no bugs here just freezing
@Thegame .Dev You just made it worse
Theory: Coraline actually bullied Whybe because she's projecting her frustration with her parents onto him, but she secretly likes him. Maybe not romantically, but at least somewhat. He's weird like her, and persistently friendly and helpful in both realities.
Agreed
I take this as cannon since it’s kinda obvious if you look at the scenes carefully
this probably isnt even a theory because children and teens tend to do that a LOT especially if they dont have an emotional outlet and it seems like she did not D:
@@saturnxoxo7428 mhm
I kinda got the impression of that watching it before it's not hidden that much
ill admit ive never seen somebody point out how the father is part of the "power dynamic" before - but he really is. not to the extent that coraline is of course, but if you pay attention you can see the ways in which he is controlled by the mother. even when not in the "other world", there are subtle hints to it, like the father looking sad as the mother snatches the paper away from him. both the father and coraline are trapped in an abusive dynamic with the mother, and because of that he takes up a nurturing role towards his daughter, helping her out when the mother starts to act more "evil".
This is awesome. I grew up watching Coraline and I never really stopped to think about the bugs or deeper meanings.
“Coraline is littered with bugs”
Yeah ikr? Literally unplayable.
Ruined your 69 likes
This actually made me giggle-
Wait till you try Hollow Knight
@@YorkJonhson *a bit too late there, bud*
@@PGrayOfficial Wait till you try Silksong.
The other father scene in coroline when he was attacking her actually made a lil sad, he didn't want to hurt her. But he was forced to.
Then after he was turned into a squash. A vegetable, which has no will of its own.
Yeah that was pretty fucking scsry for me tho
Honestly both in the book and in the movie the scene in which he is forced to hurt Coraline it's more depressing than scary, as what it's depicted in detail are the unwillingness of the other father to do it and the fate he meets for disobeying the other mother, so much that in the book even Coraline pities him.
@@shinybearevidra Its makes me sad because the other mother literally created him to love her as a father
since watching this as a kid and it scaring me so much i had nightmares for weeks, ive never been able to go back and watch it. although not super creepy the whole film gives off such an eerie vibe i cant seem to stand.
This is so crazy and wild the way you perceived this concept, I mean it was beautiful the way you explained it!!!
this movie is literally 14 years old and im amazed at how gorgeous it is creepiness aside its strangely calming to watch
Love CORALINE And the Theorys
sameeee
I know right, like there are so many different parts and it’s really a beautiful movie
RIGHT THEY R SO GOOD
*Caroline
theories*
Interesting to note that each of the bugs* associated with a character, (coraline and the dragonfly, otherfather and the mantis, the beldam and spiders) are inherently predatory, each consuming other* insects…
*I understand spiders are arachnids and thus aren’t consuming “other insects”
dude the music behind this was so beautiful thank you
Another thing is that when other father is being controlled he says "Don't wanna hurt you." and he also gives coraline the boy's eye instead of keeping it. So maybe the other father didn't want to harm coraline and just wanted them to be friends.
the dad's actually being controlled by the other mother. i'm too lazy to go deep into it but there should b a few videos on youtube !!
@@cadybtterfly521 In the book, her control is much more assertive over him. In the movie, it slips, a lot. I have no doubt in my mind that the Other Father's musical number was entirely of his own will in the movie.
Yeah when he plays the piano and is riding the praying mantis he is wearing those gloves that moves his hands around for him. So his hands are being controlled by the other mother
@Thegame .Dev like the twilight zone episode where everyone has to make a little boy happy. It’s called A Good Place, I think.
Yes
I can’t believe Karsten mispronounced Caroline’s name the entire video
Really? :D In which way? I really didn't notice that :o To me it sounds correct: "Coraline"?
He pronounced it right
Y’all, I think it’s a joke
Y’all really didn’t get the joke 👁👄👁
@@kayleyisdisturbing8990 Embarrassing, truly
When the family moves in, their furniture is bug shaped. (Look closely to the furniture
the moving team is hauling in)
My strongest memory of Coraline is reading the book at 6 years old before this movie came out. I guess it was defo not for my age because it scared me so much one night before bed that I chucked it down the stairs and ran back in my room lol
I was too scared to go down the stairs the next morning, my mum had to show me that she put it in the bin outside
I forgot exactly what it was, all I remember is that the other mother was involved lol
Coralline has a special place in my heart. I can rewatch it a thousand times and not get bored. It isn’t often you find something like this
same! i know all the words to it now 😌
SAME
@@zeon3808 Same
Coraline has a special place in my childhood, occupying the intense fear and nightmare aspect, however watching this video helped me realise how interesting and actually good this film is, I now really want to rewatch it.
I've noticed that in the beginning of the movie when you see coraline moving into the pink palace, the movers walk with the bug furniture when they are in the "original world" but we only see the furniture in the "other world" which is quite interesting but I've never really seen someone talk about this? Does anyone have some theories about this?
Oh this is actually really cool! Never noticed this!
The furniture wasn’t bugs it was just furniture, that had the same shape as the bug furniture
Just like anything in the other world its same shape but different
Like for an example the chicken in the real world in bobinsky’s appartement was alive
In the other world it was a popcorn machine
I think the Other Mother just used a lot of references from Coraline's house to make everything more familiar and comfortable for Coraline
3:41 don’t forget that it says “creation” about the webs in dreams. The beldam created the other world and controls it. Plus, in the little media that I’ve consumed, the beldam is always connected to spiders and maybe tragedy
You articulated this theory so well, thank you. I’m so glad I stumbled across this video.
it's always something in plain sight, coraline needs to look for the things that are always around that we might look over too (bugs, keys, hints to finding her parents). very cool theory!
The mantis could also be a symbol of femininity and more specifically; other mother.
Since female mantis only mate to become pregnant, and will eat their mate shortly after mating, the mantis could be a symbol of other mother, as she seems to think of other father as nothing more than a pawn in her scheme, so that's why it's piloting him around in such a violent manner, using him just like she does. The mantis also watches Caroline from the bedside, just like how other mother is always watching her in the dream realm.
I think the mantis is associated with other father, since he's the one riding it. As a male mantis, he would be eaten by his mate after mating, in the same way that Other Mother uses Other Father until she no longer has use of him and discards him
The widow spider does the same. She mates with the male and then eats him after. The male spider is also significantly smaller than the female spider which can be represented by the power difference between other mother and other fahter
This was very well done. I never really looked at coraline too deeply even though I knew there was definitely a deeper message especially with how much more unsettling the book is. Good vid dude
wow, this is an incredible analysis. You've just opened up an entire new alley of appreciation and emotional attachment and relation to this movie for me. Thank you.
Every creation has a deeper meaning; whether the creator intended it or not, that meaning is always present
Actually you can’t find a “deeper” meaning in something someone created when they didn’t intend it. Thinking like this can make you entirety misinterpret a story or the true meaning of something.
@@elon1928 Read about "Death of the Author".
@@elon1928 Unconscious influences are highly prevalent in literature.
@@elon1928 actually you can because if you couldnt, you couldnt but we can so you can.
Even Michael Bay movies can sometimes let you get an understanding of the creator, you don't linger on shirtless buff sweaty men that long for nothing Michael.
Coraline is literally the fly that got tangled in the spiders web, she was tricked much like a fly and now she's going to get eaten unless she can free herself from the other mothers clutches!
I love how even after 15 years, we're still able to dissect the movie and find more detail that we haven't really paid much attention to before. Coraline was way ahead of it's time
my little brother loves coraline, he watches it every weekend. i always make an effort to watch different theory videos like these to tell him after, he adores it.
To whoever disliked this, how? You literally haven’t even finished it.
I think they just want to hate Karsten🤨
You know, a lot of people miss the like button, tons of times I’ve gone back to some of my favorite videos and found my dislike on them.
@Lil Brimbo I think some people just hate him because they bag him with the pedantic and pretentious reviewer. At least in Letterboxd, people REALLY hate him because of his popularity and his joke reviews, they think his popularity is unwarranted with his lack of "substantial content." Basically, people like to complain and that's about it.
TH-cam has bots to dislike things
Everyone is saying “they hate karsten” or something but it’s actually most likely either bots, or because a lot of people view the dislike button as a way to tell TH-cam “don’t recommend this type of content to me” which is stupid since you there is an option to do that anyway.
Edit: in my original reply it autocorrected karsten to karate lol
Hey, I found this video on my recommended. My heart skipped a beat when you mentioned my blog! I really didn't expect that! Thanks so much for the reference, it means so much! I look forward to writing more content and seeing more of your videos. 🤗
Best wishes, Lottie Maguire
Your blog was amazing! 💙
@@cajunvedafox5557 thanks so much cx
@@charlottemaguire3533
I’m really glad so see someone cover this, as the bug iconography is about the ONE thing I always remember about this movie.