Would have been cool to see something like the Aeon Closed X in place of the Sundara! It's a lot more comfortable, and it at least does a lot better in sound vs the sundara, not sure about your full thoughts on it these days though. Or even an option like the DT770/700, bathys, etc.
@@clickbaitpro Yeah I personally own all of them (sundara, aeon noire, 700 pro x, and meze 99), aeon is providing the best overall experience when it comes to ON THE GO. beyer comes in super handy when I'm recording guitar but is just lacking in comfort. The cup size is too small. Sundara closed doesn't sound that nice to me, and meze is no good for carrying outside, too huge. Aeon sounds nice, looks nice, and is foldable. Absolute killer when paired with ifi gryphon
@@DuranInternational im so scared to send money on something that's apparently pretty bad build quality and focal havea a bad reputation for it despite the sound
If you're going to discard the $600 option immediately then find another alternative. Comparing a $1,000 vs $100 makes genuinely zero sense. You may as well throw in a $7,000 option to skewer it even more. You even have the Apple AirPods Max that you've reviewed that makes sense for the middle purchase, even if it doesn't directly compete with the Celeste and AKG.
Joshua has a history of compiling things that he recently reviewed into one comparison-style video. So just see it as that, rather than a complete look into the closed-back headphone market. Poke 2 and Sundara closed wouldn't have made it into the video if it weren't like this
I have been owning the Celestee for a while now. I mainly use them at home, since my wife and I mostly chill in the same room and I do not want her noises to interrupt me or me to disturb her. I use that with an AUNE X1s GT and I love it. This headphone gives me everything I need for modern music. I still have the 660s to fall back to for more analytical listening, but I love the engaging sound of the Celestee ❤️
Another Focal closed headphone is the Focal Radiance. I auditioned both Celestee and Radiance and I can simply say that the Radiance is much "airier" with a bigger soundstage, maybe like the closed back sibling of the Focal Clear MG, but with slight bass emphasis. However, that's a higher price point than the Celestee!
I love my Radiance powered off of a Burson Conductor 3XP. Couldn't believe how much better it sounds with the Burson than it did with my Topping E50/L50.
The ifi Hip DAC 2 is a good option too if you don’t want the battery drain. It has a built in battery and sounds great. It is a lot bigger than the Moonriver 2 though.
I think there's a pretty big gap in the market for $200-500 solid closed back headphones. Open backs seem to be so dominant for that price range and I'm not sure why.
Open backs are better headphones in terms of sound, they always will be at any price point it's just physics. But as for why there is a huge gap in closed backs in that price bracket, I have no idea.
Would be cool to do a higher-end closed system build designed around office space use. (for example: a desktop amplifier like the fiio k9 pro paired with a LCD-XC, or a T60 Argon with a topping stack) I feel like some of your choices in this video for headphones was limited to what can be powered by a portable.
Looking at it as a "headphone system", mine is worth $300; Meze 99 Noir ($180, frequently on sale through Drop) and BTR5 2019 version (prior to BTR5 2020 release). It might not impress Josh at all but to my non-audiophile ears it sounds great and I am happy with this setup. 😁
Am I missing something? Considering when you dropped this video, but what about SEVERAL game changer product available now. 1) Focal Bathys. I am using it, and it is replacing the dongle headphone solution. The Bathys is in Celestee territory. 2) Apple AirPods Pro 2 is now approaching or in audiophile territory. I use that at work when a large headphone is too intrusive. And even more recent, the B&W Px 8, which I hear is cheaper and maybe comparable to Bathys, just different. Audiophile ANC Bluetooth is here! Let’s see a review? The Bathys is roughly 1/2 the cost of the Celestee set!
An M1060C with Fiio BTR7 ( 200$ for M1060C and 200$ for the BTR7) would a be a very good combo/build. Plus the M1060C comms with the carrying case too and you'll still have the option to make it an open back headphone to have a different sound signature, its headband is not the the best but it very nice with regards to its price. Very disappointed from the build option, we either buy some low-end headphone for 100$ or we jump straight to a 600$ build that doesn't offer even half of the option you get with the 400$ build I suggested... Maybe because you need to push your referral links...
I loved my AKG's but they broke REALLY fast :( In about 6 months a plastic part between the headband and the speaker broke and I can't replace it because it's all glued on and is a one piece Sucks because I loved them, great sounds and fit
With the Sundara closed I would assume you need an actual amp that can can drive the 20 ohm load to its full potential. have you tried the sundara closed with a more powerful amp like 2 watts or more?. because you are not driving the headphones well enough with the moonriver2 as it seems.
Cool mobile systems, Josh! Just a thought - I would love to see another 3 closed back systems, but intended for home use so that the world of DACs/amps opens up. A think a lot of people run both opens and closed, usually closed for when there are people (like a partner) who need to sleep but you want to listen to music. This is my case - my daily drivers is the Senn HD598 (soon to be DT1990s... or sundaras... haven't decided yet, I can get the 1990 for $400 or sundara for $300) but I recently got the DT770 Pro 250ohm ($99 direct from BD!) paired with a DX3 Pro+ for night time listening and I absolutely love this system. I'd love to try a tube amp with my 770s, but I've never owned or tried a tube amp. It'd be great to see what combos you can think of for this use case.
AKG 371s all day every day but make sure to swap out the pads and get a headband cushion. Don't get the Brainwavez pads though, they were pretty bad imo - go for Shure instead.
No one ever talks about focal having a wear point breaking issue that’s known on their headbands. It’s not covered in the warranty either. Buyer beware
I was thinking this too? I didn't think many people liked the sundara closed, including josh himself in his own review of them haha. The aeon closed x is similar in price, and have been reviewed much more favorably for both sound and comfort.
I've been using the DT177X GO for a couple of years now (paired with ifi xDSD Gryphon and an M-Audio bass traveller). I really would like to upgrade headphones but I'm really not sure where to go, plus every other manufacturer seems to have dual entry which is a right pain especially for travelling.
Josh it would be cool if you can review the closed-back Focal Stellia headphones. Yes I know $3,000.00 is expensive but it would be interesting what your take on it is compared to the Celestee.
i have the celestee i use them gaming on laptop,laptop with dragon fly red for music while traveling and on a naim amp at my place tryed them on the apple adapter on iphone 13 pro i was supriced that my other headphones for 500 bucks sounded much better and louder on the iphone with adapter so to trips i don,t need my laptop i take the others pair next time.
So I can't get AKG where I live but I don't want to spend 400-500 on a headphone. I have some good IEM's and my HD58X open backs but I want a really nice closed back headphone. Something with a removable cable, so no 770. I would like it to be warm neutral if anyone knows of any recommendations? Having a hell of a time finding any outside of the expensive ones like the new DT 700 Pro X, Meze 99 Nior and Aeon.
Can you help me? I just bought DT 1990 pro. They are run through a Scarlett 2i2 gen 1. I am underwhelmed whit the base and overall volume I guess. Before I jump to a closed back is there anything you recommend I do to get the most of them? Perhaps an amp to run thru the Scarlett or a better interface? I use the interface for a mic, guitar and turntable
Would the eq on the poke 2 work well with a audeze lcd xc closed on the go Knowing how well audeze headphones do with eq. Or perhaps a better option for on the go eq?
Music samples so damn sick so often >_< How you can get this excellent audio through TH-cam's compression, I dont know what demon you summoned to gift you with such sorcery.
MoonRiver could be better for the price, and there is better for less. Also, I have the 361 and 361bt, and the existence of the 361bt makes the 361 obsolete. Wired, it is identical, and you get bt for when you want it.
Maybe it was a different approach, rather than recommend one headphone or one DAC he probably wanted to suggest a system; which most people will use anyway. Given we are already in November-December (aka. 'let's buy things on sale' season) he was probably recommending an ideal setup for portable and stationary use; for those who don't already have a setup. But that's just my guess.🤷♂
I know it''s been a while since he's done one, but Josh has done several of these "system build" videos. So this wasn't out of left field. I've got nothing for you're other question. I'm asking why he didn't go with a DAP for the Celestee.
Probably because he doesn't have a referral link for it ... a Fiio btr7 (200$) would be better than any of these dac/amps offered here I think with regard to the value you get for the money. Same goes for the M1060C, great value for the money (200$ and you get a carrying case too)
Same here, I have the 2019 version and I think it works fine with both my over-ears (Meze 99 Noir) and my in-ears (Moondrop Blessing 2 Dusk). I like the small form factor and you can also use it for blutooth. It does it all.
@@alejandroelcid i have the one with mqa bullshit but I use local files anyway and I have some at20 over ears i also use it for my home amp which is all vintage stuffs
Who recommends Closed Sundara?! I thought you were joking at first! There are far better choices. Focal Elegia (350$), Aeon Closed X (400$), EMU-Teak (450$).
Why do you recommend Apple dongle? One from Samsung is far superior - it has a lot more power and better sounds quality. A actually sended back Apple dongle after testing it - it's not worth the money.
Don't buy Apple dongle, if you own android device - sound is really quiet, significantly more quiet than my phone is able to output without it. Workaround I know is to install custom volume increase tool on rooted device.
you just made a video talking about how disappointing the closed sundara was, the only reason you've put it in this video is because it's new. are your recent videos all part of some joke or something?? 💀💀
Would have been cool to see something like the Aeon Closed X in place of the Sundara! It's a lot more comfortable, and it at least does a lot better in sound vs the sundara, not sure about your full thoughts on it these days though. Or even an option like the DT770/700, bathys, etc.
Yes and even 700 Pro X and Meze 99
@@clickbaitpro Yeah I personally own all of them (sundara, aeon noire, 700 pro x, and meze 99), aeon is providing the best overall experience when it comes to ON THE GO. beyer comes in super handy when I'm recording guitar but is just lacking in comfort. The cup size is too small. Sundara closed doesn't sound that nice to me, and meze is no good for carrying outside, too huge. Aeon sounds nice, looks nice, and is foldable. Absolute killer when paired with ifi gryphon
Focal Bathys reading that title like 👀
The focal bathys is great, especially when you put it in dac mode!
@@DuranInternational im so scared to send money on something that's apparently pretty bad build quality and focal havea a bad reputation for it despite the sound
I have Elex and they have been fine. But I mean, they’re expensive, so I’m kind to them
If you're going to discard the $600 option immediately then find another alternative.
Comparing a $1,000 vs $100 makes genuinely zero sense. You may as well throw in a $7,000 option to skewer it even more.
You even have the Apple AirPods Max that you've reviewed that makes sense for the middle purchase, even if it doesn't directly compete with the Celeste and AKG.
Aeon Closed X should be an option instead of Sundara. Airpods max isn't a competitor but still better tuned than Sundara
Joshua has a history of compiling things that he recently reviewed into one comparison-style video. So just see it as that, rather than a complete look into the closed-back headphone market. Poke 2 and Sundara closed wouldn't have made it into the video if it weren't like this
I have been owning the Celestee for a while now. I mainly use them at home, since my wife and I mostly chill in the same room and I do not want her noises to interrupt me or me to disturb her. I use that with an AUNE X1s GT and I love it. This headphone gives me everything I need for modern music. I still have the 660s to fall back to for more analytical listening, but I love the engaging sound of the Celestee ❤️
Another Focal closed headphone is the Focal Radiance. I auditioned both Celestee and Radiance and I can simply say that the Radiance is much "airier" with a bigger soundstage, maybe like the closed back sibling of the Focal Clear MG, but with slight bass emphasis. However, that's a higher price point than the Celestee!
I love my Radiance powered off of a Burson Conductor 3XP. Couldn't believe how much better it sounds with the Burson than it did with my Topping E50/L50.
The ifi Hip DAC 2 is a good option too if you don’t want the battery drain. It has a built in battery and sounds great. It is a lot bigger than the Moonriver 2 though.
I think there's a pretty big gap in the market for $200-500 solid closed back headphones. Open backs seem to be so dominant for that price range and I'm not sure why.
Open backs are better headphones in terms of sound, they always will be at any price point it's just physics. But as for why there is a huge gap in closed backs in that price bracket, I have no idea.
it's really hard to make excellent closed back headphones, especially on a budget.
@@killerra I mean, there's a lot of good $100-200 closed backs, but not much in the price range that the OP mentioned.
For travel and portability, IEMs are much better option. Great SQ with very less power requirements
IEMs sub $300 are no joke in 2022.
At the price of the sundara I would 100% recommend the Focal Elegia's they require hardly any power and resolve much better imo.
@@mellochord oh yeah the cable is horrible lol, luckily 3.5 to 3.5's is super common
The Elegia's are way too bass light unless you put leather pads on them.
Elegia's with Dekoni Sheepskin Pads for me! A little bit of EQ with Qudelix 5k: excellent. Elegia can be found used for under $300.
Will you do a review on the Focal Bathys?
Would be cool to do a higher-end closed system build designed around office space use. (for example: a desktop amplifier like the fiio k9 pro paired with a LCD-XC, or a T60 Argon with a topping stack) I feel like some of your choices in this video for headphones was limited to what can be powered by a portable.
Looking at it as a "headphone system", mine is worth $300; Meze 99 Noir ($180, frequently on sale through Drop) and BTR5 2019 version (prior to BTR5 2020 release). It might not impress Josh at all but to my non-audiophile ears it sounds great and I am happy with this setup. 😁
Yeah. I'm not sure why he didn't consider the Fiio BTR5. It's a great little device.
Am I missing something? Considering when you dropped this video, but what about SEVERAL game changer product available now. 1) Focal Bathys. I am using it, and it is replacing the dongle headphone solution. The Bathys is in Celestee territory. 2) Apple AirPods Pro 2 is now approaching or in audiophile territory. I use that at work when a large headphone is too intrusive. And even more recent, the B&W Px 8, which I hear is cheaper and maybe comparable to Bathys, just different. Audiophile ANC Bluetooth is here! Let’s see a review? The Bathys is roughly 1/2 the cost of the Celestee set!
An M1060C with Fiio BTR7 ( 200$ for M1060C and 200$ for the BTR7) would a be a very good combo/build. Plus the M1060C comms with the carrying case too and you'll still have the option to make it an open back headphone to have a different sound signature, its headband is not the the best but it very nice with regards to its price. Very disappointed from the build option, we either buy some low-end headphone for 100$ or we jump straight to a 600$ build that doesn't offer even half of the option you get with the 400$ build I suggested... Maybe because you need to push your referral links...
Have you ever tried the DCA Aeons, are a direct competitor to the focals
I would swap out the Sundara for the 177X Go (especially if you can get them used) and maybe the Earmen Eagle.
Focal Elegia balanced cable and fiio Btr5k has been my thing for a year now🤤
I loved my AKG's but they broke REALLY fast :(
In about 6 months a plastic part between the headband and the speaker broke and I can't replace it because it's all glued on and is a one piece
Sucks because I loved them, great sounds and fit
Same, they are a cheap build…
I hear this all the time. Why does my k361 doesn't break even though I wore them to sleep every night after one year, honestly.
@@gavinxq1224 won't last decades, that's what I mean
Using a Qudelix 5k with a DT770 is working pretty awesome form me.
For me the Massdrop x Beyerdynamic DT 177X GO + Apple dongle is really good bang for the buck
With the Sundara closed I would assume you need an actual amp that can can drive the 20 ohm load to its full potential.
have you tried the sundara closed with a more powerful amp like 2 watts or more?. because you are not driving the headphones well enough with the moonriver2 as it seems.
Should look for “Ve Megatron”. Incredible for what it does. Drive “hard to drive”(150-600) headphones without any problems for only $50
Sorry Joshua, may I ask which hoodie you are wearing? It's pretty cool
Can you do a review on the Sennheiser monument 4? Apparently it’s a nice upgrade from the existing monument line Thanks great video josh
I'm waiting for Focal Bathys review Joshua and how it compares to Celeste. thanks
Cool mobile systems, Josh! Just a thought - I would love to see another 3 closed back systems, but intended for home use so that the world of DACs/amps opens up. A think a lot of people run both opens and closed, usually closed for when there are people (like a partner) who need to sleep but you want to listen to music. This is my case - my daily drivers is the Senn HD598 (soon to be DT1990s... or sundaras... haven't decided yet, I can get the 1990 for $400 or sundara for $300) but I recently got the DT770 Pro 250ohm ($99 direct from BD!) paired with a DX3 Pro+ for night time listening and I absolutely love this system. I'd love to try a tube amp with my 770s, but I've never owned or tried a tube amp. It'd be great to see what combos you can think of for this use case.
AKG 371s all day every day but make sure to swap out the pads and get a headband cushion. Don't get the Brainwavez pads though, they were pretty bad imo - go for Shure instead.
Can you update this type of video with higer end setup pleaseee
No one ever talks about focal having a wear point breaking issue that’s known on their headbands. It’s not covered in the warranty either. Buyer beware
Would you recommend the aeon flow closed over the sundara closed ?
Regarding the sound ofcourse
I was thinking this too? I didn't think many people liked the sundara closed, including josh himself in his own review of them haha. The aeon closed x is similar in price, and have been reviewed much more favorably for both sound and comfort.
@@SpookySkeletonGang
I think that too.
Overall for 500 usd aeon flow closed x is unbeatable
I've been using the DT177X GO for a couple of years now (paired with ifi xDSD Gryphon and an M-Audio bass traveller).
I really would like to upgrade headphones but I'm really not sure where to go, plus every other manufacturer seems to have dual entry which is a right pain especially for travelling.
Josh it would be cool if you can review the closed-back Focal Stellia headphones. Yes I know $3,000.00 is expensive but it would be interesting what your take on it is compared to the Celestee.
how’s the build quality of akg371 now? i want to buy a pair but lots of problems about it years back
Will you be reviewing the Focal Bathys?
i have the celestee i use them gaming on laptop,laptop with dragon fly red for music while traveling and on a naim amp at my place tryed them on the apple adapter on iphone 13 pro i was supriced that my other headphones for 500 bucks sounded much better and louder on the iphone with adapter so to trips i don,t need my laptop i take the others pair next time.
Was really hoping the next video was gonna be a review of the Topping G5
I would say the moon river could be nicely replaced with a Fiio BTR 5
I haven’t even heard it all but two thumbs up 👍 👍 for the concept of what you may (or may not) get when you spend more.
Why Moonriver ?? Why not Fiio BTR7 ??
Planning on buying a good portable DAC/AMP. Pls tell
Most important question, what brand is that hoodie?
Focal headphones feel super premium and Luxurious
So I can't get AKG where I live but I don't want to spend 400-500 on a headphone.
I have some good IEM's and my HD58X open backs but I want a really nice closed back headphone. Something with a removable cable, so no 770. I would like it to be warm neutral if anyone knows of any recommendations? Having a hell of a time finding any outside of the expensive ones like the new DT 700 Pro X, Meze 99 Nior and Aeon.
Can you help me? I just bought DT 1990 pro. They are run through a Scarlett 2i2 gen 1.
I am underwhelmed whit the base and overall volume I guess. Before I jump to a closed back is there anything you recommend I do to get the most of them? Perhaps an amp to run thru the Scarlett or a better interface?
I use the interface for a mic, guitar and turntable
focal's greatest weakness is how terrible their stock cables are. If you buy a pair just get a custom cable immediately IMO
Would the eq on the poke 2 work well with a audeze lcd xc closed on the go Knowing how well audeze headphones do with eq. Or perhaps a better option for on the go eq?
Music samples so damn sick so often >_<
How you can get this excellent audio through TH-cam's compression, I dont know what demon you summoned to gift you with such sorcery.
I just got my Bathys, for 800 you get the best of all of the above
What is the "best" headphone that you can run well with just the Apple Dongle?
I like the Sivga SV021 a lot overall, especially for the price. It's very easy to drive too
Probably AKG K371 because it just cant power DT990 Pro properly, shrunken soundstage and less dynamics
K371 is the easiest to drive.
Just don't use Apple dongle. With Samsung dongle I can use 300 ohm vintage Sennheiser HD 535
@@stanisawszczypua9076 that doesn't work on iPhone yet, thanks though.
MoonRiver could be better for the price, and there is better for less. Also, I have the 361 and 361bt, and the existence of the 361bt makes the 361 obsolete. Wired, it is identical, and you get bt for when you want it.
Thinking outside the box!
Great video!! Hope you get the chance of reviewing the new PX8 and compare them to the top BT headphones on the market. Keep up the great work! 🙌
IEMs are the best closed backs. Just get an IE600 and call it a day.
You can get a pair of Z1Rs for 1400 if you look hard enough
Any suggestion for decent closed back? Anyone try those wonky looking Hifiman dynamic closed?
Great video. Thanks! Is there a relationship between price and clamp force?
I'm sorry but what is the point of this video? Did I miss something? Why chuck one out in the middle of the video? I have so many questions!
Maybe it was a different approach, rather than recommend one headphone or one DAC he probably wanted to suggest a system; which most people will use anyway. Given we are already in November-December (aka. 'let's buy things on sale' season) he was probably recommending an ideal setup for portable and stationary use; for those who don't already have a setup.
But that's just my guess.🤷♂
I know it''s been a while since he's done one, but Josh has done several of these "system build" videos. So this wasn't out of left field.
I've got nothing for you're other question. I'm asking why he didn't go with a DAP for the Celestee.
Can you review the new ananda SE ?
The link in the description to the diana tc's gives a 404 now for some reason.
Denon ah9200 very rarely mentioned.. best I've heard anyway
What are some pairing alternatives for stellia?
can the AKG produce good subbass for electronic music with heavy basslines?
K371 because K361 is not bass heavy
K371 has better subbass.
anything else besides the k371 in that price range I should look at for deep subbass?
aeon close x is pretty solid
I am surprised not to see a fiio btr5 I have a fiio btr5 with balanced cables going to my fiio fa1 items
Probably because he doesn't have a referral link for it ... a Fiio btr7 (200$) would be better than any of these dac/amps offered here I think with regard to the value you get for the money. Same goes for the M1060C, great value for the money (200$ and you get a carrying case too)
Same here, I have the 2019 version and I think it works fine with both my over-ears (Meze 99 Noir) and my in-ears (Moondrop Blessing 2 Dusk). I like the small form factor and you can also use it for blutooth. It does it all.
@@alejandroelcid i have the one with mqa bullshit but I use local files anyway and I have some at20 over ears i also use it for my home amp which is all vintage stuffs
What about AIAIAI TMA-2 headphones?
Why not Meze Liric???????
Is focal bathys ok?
Joshua Valour Thanks Much !
Can someone please recommend me a DAC and/or AMP for HE400i (old version), ideally less than
Who recommends Closed Sundara?! I thought you were joking at first! There are far better choices. Focal Elegia (350$), Aeon Closed X (400$), EMU-Teak (450$).
AirPods Max, the best portable closed-back headphones.
Focal bathys vs celestee pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee....
Why do you recommend Apple dongle? One from Samsung is far superior - it has a lot more power and better sounds quality. A actually sended back Apple dongle after testing it - it's not worth the money.
Does the Apple dongle work with Android?
yes. make sure to pick the usb-c version.
@@Bushviking lies
@@Chris-gm4hk 🙄 works for me. if you don't want to know, don't ask.
Opening song?!?
include cb sundara just to shit on them....bro , its your second time youve done this 😂
Don't buy Apple dongle, if you own android device - sound is really quiet, significantly more quiet than my phone is able to output without it. Workaround I know is to install custom volume increase tool on rooted device.
Yeah, I was a little surprised at Josh's suggestion. It's not $10 but Moondrop's Dawn is a good option and you can get it in either 3.5mm or 4.4mm.
Travel around with a $1000 headphone is a little pretentious yet there are people walking around on the street wearing a $3000 or even $7xxx iem lol.
you just made a video talking about how disappointing the closed sundara was, the only reason you've put it in this video is because it's new. are your recent videos all part of some joke or something?? 💀💀
177x master race
Lets gooooooooooooo >:3
pog
Stupid apple dongle
why the poke over the xd05 plus
My respect when you included the apple dongle 📉📉📉