Well Pump was Stuck on the Bottom in this Nasty Mess! That's Terrible Looking
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ต.ค. 2024
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I got called out to this job after another plumbing company said they couldn't get the pump stuck & the well must have caved in. The Homeowner was freaking out until I arrived 2 days later to remedy the issue. It's a shame how quickly other give up. 1 man (The H2oMechanic) was able to fix this in roughly 2 hours. A simple Submersible pump replacement. But the Iron & Manganese minerals in this Well were an absolute nightmare!
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For those new to the whole well thing: Good pump guys are BUSY. If you move into a house with a well for the first time, find a good pump guy BEFORE you have issues--pay them to do an evaluation and make a record of what's there so they know what to bring if an emergency comes up and what was done weird or badly originally, and keep their contact number handy. When something eventually goes haywire, you will be miles ahead in getting it resolved. Similar with septic pumping guys for the other end of the water system BTW.
i have on hand a new replacement gauge, wire, switch, pipe, clamps, fittings, pump, and tank. the big box store is 1/2 hr. away
I just realized how close he is to me! I've got 3 wells, very possible they drilled them!
Would u consider hiring a hard working new yorker??
@@MichaelPelestano-it4ym Now. Everybody knows that 'New Yorker' and 'hard worker' create an oxymoron! (I am kidding you in a big way!)
thats all i do at work wells water systems and the treatment systems its amazing some of the shit these poor people paid other guys to do for so much money and then we come out to fix it
The craftfolk that choose to show their work are the ones I want to hire.
Something special about watching someone work who knows exactly what they’re doing.
I've watched a number of videos of this gentleman. He is knowledgeable, experienced, and generally first class. His community is lucky to have him.
Good job. My pump guy left me without water 7 years ago, other pump companies wouldn't come out for 3 months. You can be our pump guy. 😅😂😅😂
You still don't have water after 7 years? DDDDDDDAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNGGGGGGGGGG you are a trooper.
The cost of not helping yourself.....
The Folks around here have been raised on well water, I've helped about 6 people pull out their pump some just a dry well one didn't have the spacers on the pipe and wires so it was swinging in the breeze and wore the insulation off 2 of the wires and shorted it out, an old wheel on an a frame and a quad just need enough room to drive the quad far enough to get the pump to the top
Two years for me. Ihs just put it in for free! Ill have water again in a couple days!!! Woohoo@@E85BETTY
Sheesh. Never had a well company fail to come within a few hours when I was without water.
"Oil that is, black gold, Texas tea..."
I was humming about Jed the millionaire when I read your post
*Let's move to Beverly 😂* *yeehawww 😂😂😂*
@@user-rz5di8fv9xMore banjo required in that segment of the video.
Californy is the place they outta be
Jethro is happy about having the cee-ment pond full of clean water again.
I had a problem with my well. I had two different plumbers come out to fix it. The first guy insisted my well pump was bad and that I needed a new one (a few thousand dollars).
The 2nd guy actually pulled the pump up, found the wiring problem and told me my old pump was a quality product and that it would be silly to replace it.
At the time, we had owned the house at last 10 years. I have no idea how old the pump is. Still working like a champ four or five years after the plumber came out.
You ROCK! Great job! If I was that customer, having that beautiful red truck + trailer + excavator roll up must be an amazing site for someone that has NO WATER. And all that work from one guy, in 2 hours and 15 minutes with 95 degrees and humidity? Crazy.
How ironic! I have a condition called Meniere's disease (an inner ear condition causing tinnitus, vertigo, discomfort) I had to take manganese suppliments to help with the symptoms. I moved to a community where they're wellhead produced manganese and had to do yearly water main flushing. The 14 years I lived there, I didn't need the suppliments. I now live in an old house in Northern Ontario (Canada) that has a shallow, dug well with a jet pump setup. Nicest water ever! But, I now have to take the manganese suppliments again! You do great work....Keep on keepin on!
Is your real name Niel Young?
I worked with a lady that had Menieres years ago, and that was interesting stuff to learn about, and what debilitating symptoms it can come with. How fascinating about the difference in water making such a difference for you. Just goes to show sometimes we make it more complicated than it needs to be
Do you mean magnesium?
Wear ear plug when showering !
The customer dumping chlorine in the well is making things worse. Chlorine causes the manganese to drop out of solution. You can use chlorine for iron and manganese treatment but only in small controlled doses. Best thing for him to do is get a filter that contains Katalox which will take out manganese and iron.
Even ordinary Birm will do the job. I used Birm for years at my place and got about eight years out of it.
Many years ago my pump went bad when I was down with the flu. Even with a friend coming over to help, it was a huge struggle to do what needed to be done, and my well is only 80 feet. A couple of years ago I had a nasty bout of COVID. That was immeasurably worse than the flu that I was suffering when I pulled the well, and the brain fog is very real. I suffered from it for well over a month. The fact that you were out pulling and fixing a well by yourself only a couple of weeks after testing positive speaks volumes to your work ethic and dedication. You are to be commended. Well done. Thank you for sharing this.
Covid ain't no joke for the folks it killed and for the folks it affects.
problems like that always strikes when ur the most busy or sick.
Vitamin D.
One guy uses a lawn tractor to pull the whole pipe and pump out. He says that if something gets stuck it's easy for you to keep pulling and bust stuff especially using an excavator. Just saying because it seems an awful big deal to bring an excavator to somebody's property.
It must be going around again I had it over the weekend
Greetings from Sweden.
My pump blew fuses and I it was stuck. I only got the wire, hose and cable out. Pump is still down there. A new pump was put a little above the old pump. It was 165 feet deep. Pump, hose and cable cost about $2000 for just the material. It was a good pump though (Grundfos). I changed from a three phase to a 1 phase pump so the new diameter of the pump is just about three inches. Fits better in the hole.
Hope you feel better soon. Rest as much as you can and drink tons of water. Pulling for you!!
First time I’ve ever seen a well fixed. We have a well it’s good to know a little more about it. Good job guy 👍
Next thing you know, old Jed's a millionaire. Californy is the place he oughta be...
😂 Exactly what I was thinking.
I heard the Klampits moved out of Californy because it's too f'ing crazy. They moved back to Tennessee. 😂
Not nowadays 😂😂 run from California.
Did he load up his truck and move to Beverly? Hills, that is? If he has any sense he'll stay the hell outta there now!
@@StickySyrupEverywhereexcuse my ignorance as not from that area - but why is that ? Besides water contamination what are the other risks ?
It’s been some years since I pulled poly well pumps, I used a 3 wheel pump puller for Galvanized pipe once, pretty rare they were.
I always used place circular wire guides and a Torque Arrestor to reduce the spinning of submersible pumps. And I like how you despite not feeling your best, throughly diagnosed the problem and keeping the pump off the bottom by 15 feet.
Great job 👍
Great work . First the diagnosis, then the lift with multiple 20 yard laps back and forth , change out , pressure sw replacement , all on the heels of a covid bout , in that heat !
Hats off to you man .
Cool to see a neighborhood company on TH-cam, doing a stand up job💯
Dude, you rocked it by yourself. Thanks.😊
Sorry about the covid. I've had it 3 separate times. The last one took my taste and smell away for a year and replaced it with only being able to smell sulfur compounds. About 95% normal again. Those little bugs kill you energy level. Makes you feel like a zombie. Loved the video. Real people like you make the world livable for all of us.
Same here, it's a real bite. Gave me the worst chills and fever I ever had and continued issues with my health. I feel lucky to have survived though as some didn't make it. I had the sulpher taste thing for months where everything I ate tasted like rotten eggs. Gruesome.
if you wear a mask you wont get covid, you dont need to risk not being able to smell or taste food. not getting covid is totally preventable and easy. kn-95s/n-95s does a great job and i have never got covid ever, everyone that i know has gotten it at some point because they are stupid. i remember one thanksgiving family came over and one was "positive" lol everyone tested positive the two days later after that except me because i understood the protocols and was able to apply them in a effective way. there are people with long covid four years on and the symptoms never went away lol google it. "properly follow proper protocols" lol but it works
Yep, I had the same covid taste for about a year and a half. It sucked bad, couldn't eat much of anything.
I had Covid 3 times, too, but without any long lasting effects. I'm in my late 60s.
FLCCC ivermectin protocol also help long covid
This guy is a good craftsman, worth his weight in gold!
Worth his weight in WATER!
I have been doing wells for 50 years and here in PA, we put a torque arrester every 10 ft and a check valve next to the pump in case a pebel or something else gets stuck in the built-in check valve.
I'll never need a well, but couldnt turn this video off. I like watching people work, in a knowledgeable manner, sorting through issues and getting a positive result. Plus you do a great job presenting things on video. Well done.
Always kind of wondered how those wells worked. Now I'm a professional Thanks to youtube 😆
Glad you’re recovering. The Covid brain fog is very real and unexpected. Covid had me in bed for about 5 days. Took about two more weeks before I felt like a functional human being again. Take care of yourself and don’t push too hard!
@@matth5309 It affected me almost identical to this!
Year and a half still getting brain fog for days and bowel issues to boot. Comes and goes without forewarning. Very disconcerting.
Did u take the shot?
@@BoStaggs-cr5lc nope. Never will either. Both my parents did, both had complications to some extent
@@aday1637vaxxed sheep
Good Job, nicely explained. I used to have a well pump. I now have city water. Thank goodness.
You are a true craftsman, we had a new pump put in but our well is only 40 feet deep here in Florida. The two guys did a great job but I can appreciate your work by yourself. Don’t forget your seatbelt.
Hans Premium water filtration systems get out all of that manganese and other crap no problem. I love my RO system. You do very good work❤
Interesting video especially for someone like myself who's never seen anything about well systems. I definitely appreciate your diagnostic skills and decisions to replace the pump and pressure switch. 👍👍
I don't know anything about well pump systems - this vid was fascinating and I'm going to watch more
Very impressive. Great job. We lived with a well in 1955. I believe it was about 250' deep
I'm 65 and never had COVID. My wife and kids had it twice each. I hope I never get it. Great job Phillip!😄
Don't bet on it. It was documented that a LOT... I mean 90%+... of people who got SARS2 (the actual name of the virus) had no symptoms whatsoever even with the relatively strong strain in Spring/Summer 2020.
You most likely have had SARS2, just without severe symptoms.
almost 66 no covid either..
Lucky duck.😊
66 here and never had it and I've been tested multiple times before I has medical procedures. Really surprised the results all came back negative. I remember in Nov of '19 before 'Rona went global I was the sickest I've ever been in my life for two weeks. I honestly thought I was checking out in the beginning of it. I've asked to be tested for antibodies since then and none of the doctors I've had to see for other stuff, or my primary doc would order it. I suspect I had CV19 but I may never know.
I came here to say exactly what you said!!!@@christopherkidwell9817
Man, this is my first time seeing your channel and videos, and the moment I saw your face, I knew that no, you are *NOT* over covid yet. You look exhausted, and not just from the heat. Cut your workload in half, and move slower for another two weeks, then start ramping back up. And yes, the Brain Fog is real. That's going to be with you for a while, but fortunately, you do a lot of physical work, which is one of the treatments. If the brain fog doesn't improve over the next month, ask your PCP about off-label treatments using N-acetylcysteine (NAC) and guanfacine. Those are showing very good results for neurological impairment from covid.
Don’t push too hard Philip. Get over the covid without hurting yourself. 👍🏻
Thank you for the education. 2 hours by yourself strikes me as Pretty dam fast. That’s experience skill and knowledge. Good Job!!
This guy is good seems very authentic! Interesting and informative! Thank you ‼️
Job well done. You know your stuff !
Best Well Man on the internet.
Your knowledge is spot on. I'm glad I tuned in to your channel to learn something about something I don't know about just in case I am ever ending up with a well on my property I'm learning a whole lot, you're number is in my book
I love hard work so much I spend most of my day watching it on here
It's a treat to watch a man who knows his business. 👍🏻
i pulled many water well pumps,drilled many wells,worked on wind mills.you are in my wheel house.
excelent video sir.i did this in north dakota
I had to have my stand pipes replaced up here in Minnesota this spring. We had a dry winter. Very little snow, so it was easy to get to the Red Head. There are two brothers who went their separate ways a few years ago. This is the third time in 40 years that I needed to do this. One brother still uses galvanized pipe. I went with the other brother who uses 20 foot sections of Schedule 80 PVC and stainless steel couplers. I also had the 40 year old pump replaced along with all the wire. This area has a high iron content. When we turned on the pump it looked like oil coming out also. One thing that amazed me was that the water quality improved immensely. The iron has almost disappeared. I redid the pressure tank and the flow is excellent. I like watching how the wells are done down south.
Great vid, Philip. There's no substitute for experience.
I had covid in May for the first time. There was a few days that I was on the verge of being hospitalized because I couldn't figure out how to do the most normal, everyday things. I'm an electrician in my regular life. When I went back to work after 8 days, I realized I was only functioning at 40-50%. Had to have someone check all my work. Mistakes aren't an option with electricity. It took a month or more to feel normal.
I had a similar experience last year when I got it myself. I ended up taking some time to do some other work the boss had for me, he was very understanding and put me to work doing simpler tasks while I recovered. I felt so dumb doing that kind of work but hey, do what you gotta I guess. It took me a little over 2 weeks to get back to something closer to 'normal'
I feel for you, that fog truing to keep your head wrapped around what's going on... troubleshooting felt impossibly frustrating for a while.
@@goosenotmaverick1156 My first few days back to work I couldn't even push a broom properly 😆
@VTKingdomsawing oh man you had it rougher than me! I was able to do minor stuff. But anything more physically taxing than a brisk walk had me out of breath.
The fog was what really got me. Physically It seems I got quite lucky.
You Good .
Man Charlie Brown , you treat your customers righf.
A testament to your skill! I can listen to your audio and know what you are saying is a complete instruction, and never watch the video.
"up through the ground came a-bubblin' crude.
Oil that is, black gold, Texas tea."
Great job, totally agree on changing the old pump, etc. Hope you get to feeling a lot better soon, some people that get Covid say they still feel weak, etc. for about 6 months. Get well and Take Care ! 👍
Very Commendable you doin a 1 Man + 2 helper job alone in very Hot humid energy Draining weather + still Covid effects Recovering !! .....Rambunctious energetic Youth but You gotta take care yourself from these complex Virus diseases that Need lots rest & Down time for best possible recovery.....
Far out. I care about him too, from that short video.
took me a week to recover from COVID. I had nightmares during covid and couldn't eat for a week I lost about 40 50 lb only had hot soup I was able to put down my throat lots of ginger ale/water
@FordExplorer420 I've been drinking green tea for about 3 weeks, it seems to help me. That & Advil for the headaches
First time seeing you but I got to tell you I love it. You got a new fan. Definitely learned something here today. I love this kind of stuff
You're right about that, when I had my trouble with COVID the coughing and trouble breathing kept me awake and the no energy meant I was struggling with a lot of basic stuff. It sure isn't fun. Glad you're feelin better though.
The hyperventilation I experienced for 2 weeks after I came down with covid kept me unable to sleep. I'd drift off due to exhaustion then jerk awake gasping for air. A trip to the emergency room did not good. Doctors didn't know about the hyper. at the time and thought I needed a CPAP. Pure awful, crazy illness & still on/off ailing.
@@aday1637 Yeah, my lungs have never been quite right since. It's a really dismal thing and I feel for anyone who catches it.
Great job. Thanks for showing the entire job.
Great job cobbie and heat 🥵 good man. Knows what hard work is ....we all need to do our part ...keep love alive
Hi, Australia here: I'm amazed at how many people have wells, but don't catch the rainwater from their roof. I grew up on "tank water", and I have that again now. In the 15 years I've lived in this house I've never run out of water - and we only get about 12 inches (300mm) of rain a year. Why don't Americans have rainwater tanks?
AND, rainwater doesn't have all those minerals in it, just a little dirt. Sure, you need to keep your gutters clean, especially in fire season, but that's a pretty simple job.
Dust and bird shit. Roofs are not clean. Where i live, rain water tanks are common but exclusively used for watering the backyard or for cleaning outdoor things.
The dust is easy to filter, but bacterial contamination from bird shit not so much.
Chlorine eats rubber, that's why bladder tank broke. One or two small capfuls of chlorine is all that is needed once or twice a year.
Regards from South
Usually chlorine is only put in the well if it is disturbed. Never heard of adding it every year.
thanks for you teaching. you are very knowledgeable in what you doing.
I would have liked to see the pump change out. Very impressive work. Learned a lot from the video. Thank you.
Great videos, Very easy to understand what the "F" is going on. Thanks for taking the time to explain.
As a kid my dad absolutely refused to pay for municipal water. Hey, he was old school, and a practical man. He was also correct, with this ridiculous consumer society we've all helped create. My point is that I gained a lot of water well experience all those years ago, and still maintain one of the old wells we used back then. Dang that was fifty years ago! Very nice to have a well for gardening and car washing and such things.
Anyhow, my point really was YOU DID A MAN'S WORK! Excellent! The old well I'm using doesn't need anything right now, but you've got me ready to pull the pump and check everything just for the sake of knowing! Now that's how you sell a product! Dad also taught me maybe the most important thing I ever learned in this life though too. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" I love an opportunity to pass that little piece of wisdom on, but of course, that same practical man who I lucked out and had as a father also taught me the value of maintenance.
I would hire you, based on this video alone young man.
sorry about recovering from Covid in the heat.....hanging in there is impressive
Nice work Phil. That well could stand to be fracked just to clean it out.
Great job you care that your job was done right. Very professional
Sorry to hear about your getting COVID and that your recovery has been such a struggle. Thank you for the videos as I've learned so much from many of them.
The black manganese looked really nasty. Sometimes I wonder about the water quality from some of the wells such as this one and I trust there is some type of filtering in the system.
Excellent job young man, but make sure you keep an eye on those covid symptoms because I know several people who thought they had gotten over covid only to find out they still had covid.
Excellent work done by a knowledgeable craftsman. Well done.
I love how bro is like "....Well, I guess we're" several times while working on a well.
Moved into my place November 22, it had set empty 10 years, and the pressure switch was stolen off the system.
Went to the local Ace hardware and asked the very helpful lady who owned the store to recommend a pump service. The best thing i ever did was replace the switch tank and pump motor along with a new water softener system since North Florida has notoriously hard water. Money well spent, and i have a relationship with a reputable pump service.
Never under estimate word of mouth advertising, i want to use the guy everybody recommends, not some blank slick advertisement.
Very informative video. I have City water at my house, but I have lots of friends with wells. It’s always been a mystery to me how these things work.
Around my area, we have natural gas in our wells. It makes like a slime that can actually plug in the pump and line so tight it takes a minimum of 3 to 4 strong farmers to pull one up to replace the pump every 6 to 10 years. I think I would rather have your manganese problems 😂😂. Great job actually diagnosing and fixing the problem for your customers.
As a contractor, aren't you concerned about the nasty state of the well? I was thinking about air lifting that shit out of there, or circulating it out with a mud pump.
@@traviseuler9082 it definitely could use some for of cleaning out for sure! I expressed that concern with the customer. He'll have to get funds available before that can be done.
Outstanding. Educational and very satisfying. You kick ass young man. I blame your Dad. 💪🏼
for you when you have a one man crew on the job, they make a battery operated back up with the RV's. You can put the camera on the wall head and hold the other pipe inside the excavator so you could monitor the hole as back up we need portable so you can see back up your camper. Give you a chance to monitor the top of the wall
Good job. Hope you're feeling better by now. Heats a killer especially when you been sick and just recovering. You're keeping your customers well satisfied and that will keep you all busy. God Bless you all for the great help you give your customers.
Get well and stay strong ! Thanks for sharing !!
Holy shit, buddy. Respect for dealing with that mess. My area rarely see wells deeper then 100 feet with the norm being 25-40 for those that just want water for irrigation and don't care about the staining as it's very heavy in iron. Running the deeper wells does help clean it up but it's still pretty iron rich.
I hate pulling wells of any sort with the shallow sand points being my most hated. it's sometimes much easier to just pop in a new one... post hole auger style... lots of fun, lol. I remember trying to pull sand point with chains, black pipe, 2 15 tonne house jacks and 6 foot snipes... we had a piece of 1 inch black pipe inside an 1.5 inch pipe and it bowed them both which made us realize that if that energy went kinetic it could be very very bad. We just moved ten feet to the side the augured a new well.
Every video you do I watch you make connections at the well head free air. Having done dozens of repairs and feeds this drives me crazy as an electrician. Run pipe for the wire and bring it up into a PVC Jbox. Install a strain relief connector appropriate to the cable. Inspectors fail well heads frequently for such issues here in New York. Further, not installing a simple black button connector on the input and output side of the pressure switch is another fail. They only cost $0.10 each and can be installed without even removing the UF. Other than those gripes I learned allot from
Is he even qualified to do electric connections? Agree that open air connection being dangerous. Who's responsible in case of third party electric shock?
You done a nice clean job ! Looks great.
Great job! Thanks for sharing! 👌👍
Well, it looks like a good way to harvest manganese.
I hope you get well soon. No pun intended. Lol. You definitely know what your doing. God Bless
Awesome job that you have done we will be praying for you that you have a speedy recovery from covid that can be a nasty virus hope you get to feeling better soon God bless my friend stay safe out there in this heat drink plenty of fluids
Woozy from Covid, smoothing the gravel in the driveway from the excavator, that, sir, is dedication to the customer!
Great job man!
As a younger electrician back in the early 80's I worked for a company doing all their pump servicing and it was a great job! Difference was though all the installs in the area we worked in where steel pipe drops on pitiless adapters. Some of the wells we serviced where around a 1000' so pulling those setups required a Derrick truck, we rarely saw plastic drops, 20' lengths of pipe made for some long days. The area we worked in was pretty remote and many of the jobs where several hours driving time. Winters were especially challenging as when temps got down into the -30 range everything freezes up pretty quickly.
Great memories and a great job at the time - still Thank Larry Churchill at Northern Pump Supply for the learning opportunity that he gave me!
Cheers
Mike 🇨🇦
My well was done in 86 and has never needed any maintenance other than cleaning the filter in the house water shot seventy feet in the air when the water was drilled out and the drilling rig shook and bounced until the guy jumped off of the truck ! 1650 deep and was a spring for five minutes after the bit was removed from the casing seventy five feet of solid granite was the last material that came out with the drill it was a perfect aquifer hit the operator said !
A shinning knoght in a red truck 🚒! Great work!
Glad to see u back to wrk. How do u treat the manganese of the pipe, pressure wash? Its good to take a look at the whole pipe, i never like splicing..always a wk point..take care of yourself..
When I got Covid it only bothered me for about 3 days but it did wipe me out.
Excellent Video@ love this channel , the best! Great content! You are a wonderful instructor
Awesome video. I hope you feel better soon. At 18:30 I noticed some of the elusive Electchicken droppings in the mud.
I know nothing about wells and pumps, but you're great at explaining your thought process. I do have a question: When you see a silted in pump and all that black mayonnaise, is there the option of using some kind of super-pump to rinse and flush that stuff up and out of the well? Or will it just accumulate again?
That's great work, boss, and on your own? - good job!👏👏👏We have loads of iron in our local water, so yellow, brown crap all over the pipes. Loved the wheel pulley assist you have, and the precast concrete circular cover is the best and most simple system I have seen. Time for a few upgrades here (central Portugal!). It won't even damage the social aspect, when an neighbour's pump goes bad, everyone piles in and we heave it up by hand with the aid of a case of cold beer, bad language and good humour. Be the heck of a lot easier with one of those wheel things though. Thanks, good luck and God bless 🤗🤗
Interesting to watch. Also educational.
Hello Hello , haven't been on site since.
A phrase I coined many years ago was.
When I need help , I can not get it.
When I don't need it , I can't get rid of it.
The well on the farm had a lot of that manganese.
Did well work for years and seen quite a bit of stuff. Never seen one where pump was on bottom. Common sense not used. Better to install a storage tank and pump slower into it if well not productive enough than to lower the pump. I found 2 wells on my own property (which has city water). Both were marginally productive but was able to slow pump into a 2500 gal tank for storage and use in garden when needed. Normal pumping would run pump dry with manual reset so I had to valve the output down to a trickle. Takes 3 days to fill the 2500 gal tank at trickle but 2500 gal is a months worth of water so I took a marginal well and made it quite usable. In fact, if needed, it could be used for whole house use instead of city water. There are many solutions but putting pump on bottom is not one of them.
@@aday1637 pumps at the top of the well can be used for shallow wells only. Submerged pumps are the only option for deep wells. Deep wells are expensive, but if that is where the water is, you are stuck with a deep well.
Thanks!
VERY, VERY, VERY GOOD JOB.
My mom's tank rusted through right at the full water level. It would leak for about 30 seconds every cycle, until the bladder came down and covered the pinhole. Took us a while to catch on to that one.
It is great to see a Mechanoc that knows his Craft,, >Joe Morris , Dundalk MD.
I learned a LOT! I also have a manganese problem.