I can only speak for myself, but when I started reading comics I accepted that I'd be missing out on a lot of key information but I knew that I would stumble upon the answers eventually no matter how long it took which was always really rewarding.
Honestly, All New Wolverine deserves more credit than most people give it. I am for sire bias because laura kinney has been a favorite since her appearance in evolution. NYX a good not Laura Kinney story but they kinda did her dirty for a first comic appearance. But yeah glad to see it made the list because it was a blast to read from start to finish, same with the first spider gwen omnibus it was such a good read I couldn't stop reading them.
Another epic video! Great topic and great panelists! This list was damn good and I want to go back and read all of them. Thanks to everyone for putting in the time to entertain all of us by torturing Omar until the very end. The chat saved Omar from going completely insane. Good job everyone!
If Marvel did evergreen any of these they should probably just give the volumes a name, like an epic. That may overcome the focus on needing to get volume 1, especially if they can be read on their own; this stream like the Marvel one and Kurtis's suggestion of a later FF, seems to point to perhaps removing that barrier.
1:12:25 I don't think changing the rules is off the table when attacking other people's picks. I think low blows are allowed too. Isn't it supposed to be a fight to the death?
I'm someone who, personally, likes the Laura>"Logan" Wolverine omnibus more as far as reads I enjoyed more (at least volume 1, I have 2-4 for Jimmy but not gotten around to reading those yet). Gabby, I'm sure, gets some of that credit. Still glad Wolverine vol 1 made the list, though. I'm in the " _Gimme a Generation X omni, dammit!_ " camp, too. I'm also a person who bought the Phoenix omnibus volumes 1&2 after that Marvel evergreen list stream, though... lol.
The main issue that I have with the Phoenix Omnibus is that for all intents in purposes it doesn't collect some very key pieces of set up for Dark Phoenix, like it doesn't collect issue 114 which is kind of the catalyst for Jason Wyngarde showing up not to mention, we don't get Jason Wyngarde meeting Jean for the first time either which is in issue 122, like that's some important set up that the folks at Marvel missed there. Like if I was a first time collector and someone told me to go Phoenix omnibus route, but then I happen to fall in love with John Byrne's art along the way and want all of it oversized, I would have to buy two more books in addition to that and insult to injury there would be that I would be massively double dipping. I cannot justify recommending the Phoenix Omnibus unless they remap it to include all of the setup. If I had it my way UXM 1-3 would be evergreen, 4&5 are good but they are just less iconic than the first 3. In Vols. 1-3 you get second genesis, then phoenix, then global adventure which rolls into Proteus, then Dark Phoenix, then Days of Future Past, I, Magneto, Brood, From the Ashes, God Loves Man Kills. It's just an unbelievable line up back to back to back.
I’m so bummed I missed this one! This has to be the hardest list; nitpicking differences for all of these. Here’s my opinion on New vs. Astonishing. I prefer New X-Men to Astonishing, but both assassinated two of my favorite characters. Magneto lost all of his nuance and became the mustache twirling villain from the 60’s. And Emma was so slut-shamed by Whedon throughout Astonishing. Read Ann Nocenti’s Classic X-Men story where she explains to a new Hellfire Club employee what she’s all about. She doesn’t “put out”; you can look, but know that you will never have her. Magneto and Emma are two of the most nuanced characters in X-Men, and they were portrayed as caricatures of themselves.
I couldn’t agree more with Ødfel’s take on New vs Astonishing. Thought it was just me. And no-one mentioned some of the astonishingly ugly art in there too. Acknowledge the legacy just dont want to read it again. Like Omar, Astonishing got me back into comics after 16 years out - it’s beautiful and really well written. And of course Uncanny 2 is a no brainer. Byrne/Austin on that run, never bettered
If Claremont/Lee x men 1 is the best selling x men omnibus, how well did vol 2 sell? Because if people bought volume 1 and didnt follow it up with a high rate of retention for volume 2, then 1 isnt worthy of evergreen.
5here are different types of collectors. Some are completists/semi completists who will buy uncanny by claremont omnibus. Other people just want key stories and will buy phoenix/dark phoenix omnibus. That's how we got a phoenix volume 2 because phoenix volume 1 sold so well.
I don't like reading the Dark Phoenix as a stand-alone. It should be read as part of the whole Uncanny X-Men saga. It's a far better option to vote for Uncanny X-Men vol. 2 because it also includes Days of Future Past and the portion of the Dark Phoenix saga that is actually about Dark Phoenix.
Laura Kinney is one of my favorite characters, and while All-New Wolverine is great as a standalone read, there is a lot of stuff that might not be great for new fans, including the young time-displaced X-Men hanging around in the present day.
Loved the show but you can't not have Uncanny 1 on the list or Dark Phoenix and have All New Wolverine. And I don't understand how no one commented on AOA being terrible for new readers, as fun as it is for the rest.
I was just thinking we need to get Joe back for another panel! I'll have to share what we're cooking up and see if he's interested in anything upcoming.
Curious which retcon you're referring to when you say attack on weapon crap? I've read the wolverine and the x men omni and can't recall any crazy weapon x retcon.
Oh Omar hates the idea of Weapon X meaning Weapon 10. He's talked about it on his Saturday streams in the past. To us that grew up with BWS' Weapon X, any retconning they do the classics, its just a sin.
@@mattthompson3371 oh. Thought he was referencing something from wolverine and the x-men. I wasn't fond of the whole weapon 10 thing in new x-men either.
I liked half the Top 10. My Top 10 Omnibus are: 1 Uncanny X-men Vol.1 2 " " Vol. 2 3 " " Vol. 3 4 X-Men Fall of the Mutants 5 X-Men Inferno 6 X-Men Claremont/Lee Vol. 2 7 Wolverine Vol. 1 8 X-men Age of Apocalypse 9 Astonishing X-Men 10 Uncanny X-Force
I think it would've been interesting to have each of us bring a full Top 10 list to this show. I suspect we would've seen even more overlap, but also a few lesser-loved books like Excalibur that would've universally been in the lower spots.
I would love it if this list somehow led to a reprint of the House/Powers of X hardcover. I missed out on it because I had the series digitally but it has become a glaring omission from my shelves.
I'm totally with you on this. I think it's cool that it got an evergreen trade paperback, but I also think it's a major prestige release that deserves to remain in OHC format (or even larger!)
Hopefully they do produce new OHC or stick it in some new omnibus. The original OHC was unfortunately glued binding (not sewn) and it’s awful. Don’t feel bad about missing out on it.
I feel like Uncanny 1 and 2, and Claremont/Lee 1 and 2 are all basically evergreen by default, aren't they? They should be. Those have to be the highest selling X-Men omnis. I'd be very surprised if they weren't. Wolverine 1 is probably up there as well.
IF they would have kept Grand Design on the list, X-Men #1, Giant Size #1, and Uncanny #268 would have still been in there...just saying. Also, the original Wolverine mini is included in Uncanny Omnibus 3, and Magik is doubled with New Mutants and Uncanny vol 3.
If you are doing an evergreen line, then i feel that having a more or less uninterrupted run is just as important as diversity of options. X-statix isn't really an X-men title, sorry. If people just want Dark Phoenix, the trade should be evergreen. For me, it should be Uncanny vol. 1-4, Mutant Massacre, Fall of the Mutants, Claremont & Lee vol. 1-2, New X-men, Astonishing X-men, Wolverine vol. 1, New Mutants vol. 1, Excalibur vol. 1, Hox/Pox. So 14. Everything else should be reprinted every 3 years as needed.
You are amazing experts of everything related to the X-Men comics, but the way how you handle the process is painful to watch. 😅 In your system, it is entirely possible that there is a book that is in everyone's list but it still doesn't end up to the top 10. There were eight or so books that appeared in more than one list. Put all of them in your top 10. After that go through all the rest, discuss, and vote for the remaining two places. That's it.
We need to find a smoother way to handle voting now that these streams have gotten bigger. I think you raise an interesting point about how much it matters that a book appears on multiple lists versus it being universally liked. Clearly a number of us are big fans of Uncanny X-Force and so we put it on our lists, but some of us equally dislike it very much. It missed the cut and had to be saved by the chat, while All-New Wolverine - a book on only one list BUT that none of us strongly object to - easily made the cut. Maybe we need to change the voting from "Yes/No" with negative votes knocking books out of contention to purely a "I LOVE THIS" positive-only vote. But... would that take away our fun in raising Omar's blood pressure?
No, I don't think they went hard enough on his art and storytelling style. It's not good at all. While I understand art is all subjective; that's one creator I don't like.
@@StegoKing Good for him. People also like Fast and The Furious movies and I don't. I did say it's all subjective. I hope he doesn't loose any sleep on what I think of his art and story telling abilities.
@@StegoKing Not sure where the name calling came from, but I can always tell the Kayfabe fanboys by the way they handle a conversation. I'm glad you enjoy his work.
New X-men is awful. The characters sound nothing like themselves. They are at a mass extinction and they are making jokes and playing with the bones of dead people. This run is overrated and Morrison is an overrated writer. Hate that book so much
I find it funny cause I’d say except for Age of Apocalypse I’d literally would pass on every other book on here I don’t think X-men honestly have made a omnibus worth reading not to say all is bad but Marvel has yet to make a actual Omni I find interesting within the X-men cause I hate the classic stuff and I find modern to be just boring with Krakoa arc so yeah
I can only speak for myself, but when I started reading comics I accepted that I'd be missing out on a lot of key information but I knew that I would stumble upon the answers eventually no matter how long it took which was always really rewarding.
Thank you all for letting me survive the experience. Have a wonderful day wherever you all are!
Honestly, All New Wolverine deserves more credit than most people give it.
I am for sire bias because laura kinney has been a favorite since her appearance in evolution. NYX a good not Laura Kinney story but they kinda did her dirty for a first comic appearance. But yeah glad to see it made the list because it was a blast to read from start to finish, same with the first spider gwen omnibus it was such a good read I couldn't stop reading them.
Missed the live stream. Catching up. Glad to see All New Wolverine made the list, as it should!
I want to thank the chat for righting the wrongs of leaving out Uncanny X-Men Volume 1 and Uncanny X-Force! All is right in the world!
I'm here, once again, for Peter. ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Another epic video! Great topic and great panelists! This list was damn good and I want to go back and read all of them. Thanks to everyone for putting in the time to entertain all of us by torturing Omar until the very end. The chat saved Omar from going completely insane. Good job everyone!
Krisis is gold. Grand Design: LOL
What an awesome, entertaining stream!
If Marvel did evergreen any of these they should probably just give the volumes a name, like an epic. That may overcome the focus on needing to get volume 1, especially if they can be read on their own; this stream like the Marvel one and Kurtis's suggestion of a later FF, seems to point to perhaps removing that barrier.
DOM's list is perfect.
I dig his taste too and his logic.
1:12:25 I don't think changing the rules is off the table when attacking other people's picks. I think low blows are allowed too. Isn't it supposed to be a fight to the death?
I was so happy to hear both Peter and odfel not liking Morrison's X-Men run. I always thought I was the only one that didn't care for it.
I hate it
Oh thank god for other people giving your taste value!
I love these evergreen shows they are so entertaining and this xembled (assembled) cast is full of fantastic people
I'm someone who, personally, likes the Laura>"Logan" Wolverine omnibus more as far as reads I enjoyed more (at least volume 1, I have 2-4 for Jimmy but not gotten around to reading those yet). Gabby, I'm sure, gets some of that credit. Still glad Wolverine vol 1 made the list, though.
I'm in the " _Gimme a Generation X omni, dammit!_ " camp, too.
I'm also a person who bought the Phoenix omnibus volumes 1&2 after that Marvel evergreen list stream, though... lol.
The main issue that I have with the Phoenix Omnibus is that for all intents in purposes it doesn't collect some very key pieces of set up for Dark Phoenix, like it doesn't collect issue 114 which is kind of the catalyst for Jason Wyngarde showing up not to mention, we don't get Jason Wyngarde meeting Jean for the first time either which is in issue 122, like that's some important set up that the folks at Marvel missed there. Like if I was a first time collector and someone told me to go Phoenix omnibus route, but then I happen to fall in love with John Byrne's art along the way and want all of it oversized, I would have to buy two more books in addition to that and insult to injury there would be that I would be massively double dipping. I cannot justify recommending the Phoenix Omnibus unless they remap it to include all of the setup. If I had it my way UXM 1-3 would be evergreen, 4&5 are good but they are just less iconic than the first 3. In Vols. 1-3 you get second genesis, then phoenix, then global adventure which rolls into Proteus, then Dark Phoenix, then Days of Future Past, I, Magneto, Brood, From the Ashes, God Loves Man Kills. It's just an unbelievable line up back to back to back.
I’m so bummed I missed this one! This has to be the hardest list; nitpicking differences for all of these. Here’s my opinion on New vs. Astonishing. I prefer New X-Men to Astonishing, but both assassinated two of my favorite characters. Magneto lost all of his nuance and became the mustache twirling villain from the 60’s. And Emma was so slut-shamed by Whedon throughout Astonishing. Read Ann Nocenti’s Classic X-Men story where she explains to a new Hellfire Club employee what she’s all about. She doesn’t “put out”; you can look, but know that you will never have her. Magneto and Emma are two of the most nuanced characters in X-Men, and they were portrayed as caricatures of themselves.
Who does Emma slut around with written by Whedon?
What would be the Marvel Event Omnibus Evergreen List?
oo, that would be fun because there's a finite number of events to choose from.
I couldn’t agree more with Ødfel’s take on New vs Astonishing. Thought it was just me. And no-one mentioned some of the astonishingly ugly art in there too. Acknowledge the legacy just dont want to read it again. Like Omar, Astonishing got me back into comics after 16 years out - it’s beautiful and really well written. And of course Uncanny 2 is a no brainer. Byrne/Austin on that run, never bettered
Right after the Marvel Reprint Poll, I started preparing for the new Marvel omni poll. Going to have to add Generation X to my list :)
If Claremont/Lee x men 1 is the best selling x men omnibus, how well did vol 2 sell? Because if people bought volume 1 and didnt follow it up with a high rate of retention for volume 2, then 1 isnt worthy of evergreen.
1:30:18 YES this is what I was waiting for! The beggining of a meltdown!! X-Men Evergreen List: Ultimatum Saga
Listening to this and thinking of the potential discussion for a Batman or Spider-Man omnibus evergreens🤔
13:40 Can't argue with facts and data
5here are different types of collectors. Some are completists/semi completists who will buy uncanny by claremont omnibus.
Other people just want key stories and will buy phoenix/dark phoenix omnibus. That's how we got a phoenix volume 2 because phoenix volume 1 sold so well.
I don't like reading the Dark Phoenix as a stand-alone. It should be read as part of the whole Uncanny X-Men saga. It's a far better option to vote for Uncanny X-Men vol. 2 because it also includes Days of Future Past and the portion of the Dark Phoenix saga that is actually about Dark Phoenix.
This is my view. And Omar's 😂
Laura Kinney is one of my favorite characters, and while All-New Wolverine is great as a standalone read, there is a lot of stuff that might not be great for new fans, including the young time-displaced X-Men hanging around in the present day.
27:20 What a surprising and efficient sales pitch!!!!
So wait, Phoenix 1 made your list of 10 Marvel evergreens but couldn’t make the list of 12 X Evergreens? Huh?
I own 8 of these 10 lol
Loved the show but you can't not have Uncanny 1 on the list or Dark Phoenix and have All New Wolverine. And I don't understand how no one commented on AOA being terrible for new readers, as fun as it is for the rest.
Please bring Joe Glass more!
I was just thinking we need to get Joe back for another panel! I'll have to share what we're cooking up and see if he's interested in anything upcoming.
Curious which retcon you're referring to when you say attack on weapon crap? I've read the wolverine and the x men omni and can't recall any crazy weapon x retcon.
Oh Omar hates the idea of Weapon X meaning Weapon 10. He's talked about it on his Saturday streams in the past. To us that grew up with BWS' Weapon X, any retconning they do the classics, its just a sin.
@@mattthompson3371 oh. Thought he was referencing something from wolverine and the x-men. I wasn't fond of the whole weapon 10 thing in new x-men either.
13:30 This is the moment where the show could have ended. Go, krisis!
I liked half the Top 10.
My Top 10 Omnibus are:
1 Uncanny X-men Vol.1
2 " " Vol. 2
3 " " Vol. 3
4 X-Men Fall of the Mutants
5 X-Men Inferno
6 X-Men Claremont/Lee Vol. 2
7 Wolverine Vol. 1
8 X-men Age of Apocalypse
9 Astonishing X-Men
10 Uncanny X-Force
I think it would've been interesting to have each of us bring a full Top 10 list to this show. I suspect we would've seen even more overlap, but also a few lesser-loved books like Excalibur that would've universally been in the lower spots.
@@CrushingKrisis My 11th & 12th would be New Mutants Vol. 3 and Excalibur Vol. 2
I would love it if this list somehow led to a reprint of the House/Powers of X hardcover. I missed out on it because I had the series digitally but it has become a glaring omission from my shelves.
I'm totally with you on this. I think it's cool that it got an evergreen trade paperback, but I also think it's a major prestige release that deserves to remain in OHC format (or even larger!)
Hopefully they do produce new OHC or stick it in some new omnibus. The original OHC was unfortunately glued binding (not sewn) and it’s awful. Don’t feel bad about missing out on it.
It's such a major era it has to hit omni format at some point.
@cruelangel8689 That's true, but how long that'll take is why I'm impatient for at least this one.
This is a great list! I wish we have a Messiah Trilogy Omnibus that's my top x-book on my wishlist right now.
If there were more 2008-2012 omnibuses I think Ødfel and I would've both picked entirely from that period, tbh.
I feel like Uncanny 1 and 2, and Claremont/Lee 1 and 2 are all basically evergreen by default, aren't they? They should be. Those have to be the highest selling X-Men omnis. I'd be very surprised if they weren't.
Wolverine 1 is probably up there as well.
This was such a fun watch lol
IF they would have kept Grand Design on the list, X-Men #1, Giant Size #1, and Uncanny #268 would have still been in there...just saying. Also, the original Wolverine mini is included in Uncanny Omnibus 3, and Magik is doubled with New Mutants and Uncanny vol 3.
If you are doing an evergreen line, then i feel that having a more or less uninterrupted run is just as important as diversity of options.
X-statix isn't really an X-men title, sorry.
If people just want Dark Phoenix, the trade should be evergreen.
For me, it should be Uncanny vol. 1-4, Mutant Massacre, Fall of the Mutants, Claremont & Lee vol. 1-2, New X-men, Astonishing X-men, Wolverine vol. 1, New Mutants vol. 1, Excalibur vol. 1, Hox/Pox. So 14.
Everything else should be reprinted every 3 years as needed.
You are amazing experts of everything related to the X-Men comics, but the way how you handle the process is painful to watch. 😅 In your system, it is entirely possible that there is a book that is in everyone's list but it still doesn't end up to the top 10.
There were eight or so books that appeared in more than one list. Put all of them in your top 10. After that go through all the rest, discuss, and vote for the remaining two places. That's it.
We need to find a smoother way to handle voting now that these streams have gotten bigger.
I think you raise an interesting point about how much it matters that a book appears on multiple lists versus it being universally liked. Clearly a number of us are big fans of Uncanny X-Force and so we put it on our lists, but some of us equally dislike it very much. It missed the cut and had to be saved by the chat, while All-New Wolverine - a book on only one list BUT that none of us strongly object to - easily made the cut.
Maybe we need to change the voting from "Yes/No" with negative votes knocking books out of contention to purely a "I LOVE THIS" positive-only vote. But... would that take away our fun in raising Omar's blood pressure?
42:00 I agree
#CyclopsWasRightMuchLater
2:33:36 Omar why do you complain about living on an alternate Age of Apocalypse reality and vote Maybe for AVX!?!?
AVX takes place in the 616 universe where the characters are familiar. Far from a good story, but those names sell books.
I love X-Men Grand Design. Y'all are rough on Ed... I wanna see that same energy with Peach Momoko.
No, I don't think they went hard enough on his art and storytelling style. It's not good at all. While I understand art is all subjective; that's one creator I don't like.
@@trishb.6398 I'm sure he's broken up about that at his art show opening this weekend in Pittsburgh.
@@StegoKing Good for him. People also like Fast and The Furious movies and I don't. I did say it's all subjective. I hope he doesn't loose any sleep on what I think of his art and story telling abilities.
@@trishb.6398 Are you always a giant asshole?
@@StegoKing Not sure where the name calling came from, but I can always tell the Kayfabe fanboys by the way they handle a conversation. I'm glad you enjoy his work.
If sales are A factor, they are THE ONLY factor.
In that case, just ask Marvel fir the best selling.
Done
New X-men is awful. The characters sound nothing like themselves. They are at a mass extinction and they are making jokes and playing with the bones of dead people. This run is overrated and Morrison is an overrated writer. Hate that book so much
Let the insanity begin.
I find it funny cause I’d say except for Age of Apocalypse I’d literally would pass on every other book on here I don’t think X-men honestly have made a omnibus worth reading not to say all is bad but Marvel has yet to make a actual Omni I find interesting within the X-men cause I hate the classic stuff and I find modern to be just boring with Krakoa arc so yeah