My Grid Tie Batteryless Solar Panel Setup
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ก.ย. 2019
- Showing everyone my whole grid tie batteryless solar panel system. It is dead simple and wiring plugs into my wall. It's mostly a test bed for me to tinker with for fun. It has the advantage of providing a small amount of electricity during peak hours.
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DISCLAIMER: Before purchasing any products, know that in order to feed power to the grid, it is required to have a contract in place with your utility company. Since solar products generate live electricity, these things require proper installation for safe usage. Improper usage and even not installing a breaker at the power output of this system could cause fire and/or death in rare cases. Please use these products at your own risk. Just because it is sold on the market does not mean using them guarantees safety.
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Grid Tie Inverter: amzn.to/41mDFAI
Short Pig tails to connect to connectors: amzn.to/2MP6DGd
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You explained it perfectly! This is what I've been trying to explain to people! I love the schematic and how you talked about the to wires in parallel
Just what I had laying around. To think someone disagreed with doubling them up.
I'm laughing at all of these comments.
Thanks ... this is GREAT. I always wanted to play around with solar but never wanted to invest. This seems to be a great starting point. Thank you .
Watch out for the safety concerns. This one does have anti-islanding feature but you also have to take care to add a fuse to the system. If something shorts, it will trip.
Make more videos likes this please! I Love the technical side of beat the bush !
=D
Here is the original video that caused people to ask about how everything is connected: th-cam.com/video/UWIccIrZMWI/w-d-xo.html
Helpful, thanks for taking the time to inform us.
Excellent explanation. Cheers from Michael. Australia.
thank you very much this is one of the best videos i have seen on the subject.
A very clear and clean xplanation i did subcribe i am a filipino living here in carson ca. Thanks for the info
Nice job
Excellent video. Makes sense, thanks for posting, thumbs up for the video.
Thanks!
Very nicely spocken.
"Should I touch it 😀 📻👈👈" "Haha, not dead"
😂😂😂😂
..good job!
its about time i find someone that explains how it works. you dont know how many videos i have watched until i found you. now i know i need a grid tie inverter. i'm not looking to get my bill to zero but this 2 to $300 a month light bill is killing me. we lost our dryer a couple months ago and now its cool enough we dont need a a/c on most days and still had a $250 light bill. and just got my bill a few days ago and with no dryer running no A/C and now my oven went out so no oven and i still have a $200 light bill. and in the middle of building a new house so not wanting to waste any money on anything i have been looking at on grid solar. but i do know that entergy WILL NOT pay you any money if you put power back on the grid if you get enough they will just Zero your bill. and if you put some back in you just lost it. but that would be ok with me. and maybe when batteries start dropping in price i will add some later
Very nice and informative. I was scared you couln''t use 2x 36 cell 18v with grid tie but you explain it's not problem. This solar panels are cheaper and more compact for on my balcony!
Great Video. Lots of good information!!
Thanks!
This is something that I should consider doing
=D
Super helpful thanks
11:08 This "feature" is called anti-islanding. Sometimes referred to anti-islanding mode, or protection. I think all grid tie inverters have this safety feature, even if it's not advertised. Of course, it would be nice to test it out (like the host did) just to make sure.
Yup! I guess I didn't have the word for it when I made this video. Many people freak out saying it will shock electrical workers in the event of power outage.
Great video
Veryyyyy good review!
I like that you tested that. But I really do think a true test that would be needed is to cut the power to the house from the electric panel. Reason is that when you pulled the plug on the power strip it would not test if the device was just testing for an available ground. Since a home has its own grounding rod, that is something that would not be disconnected by the power company. But some houses have the grounding wire done after the master cut-off (inside home wiring) at the master circuit breaking point. So you may want to test that side of things. Either way, very intriguing system and I'm tempted to try this myself!
I knew someone will say something but I will wait until next time to prove this. This second video addressed the grid-tie actually having an anti-islanding feature. Next one, I'll add that one.
Thank you for this video. I am facing a situation in uk where feed in tariff is no longer available. I want to grid-tie but I’m worried it increases bilks instead of decreases. I don’t have enough space on terrace to off-grid so I have to connect to my existing panel.
To save money I'm putting this video on 144p
This video does have a bit more visuals than normal so 144p may not be enough.
This is easy for you because you understand how electricity works
I modified my videocard and it converts the video to 8-bit.
That's really saving me a fortune!
I do that when I watch on the bus using my data :)
I've actually wondered how much power consumption differs on different video resolutions.
Nice, good job
=D Thanks!
Great video, you area a natural teacher! Anyone have a link to a UL listed one for purchase?
BtB! This has made me interested in researching solar power on a small scale--like your two panels. Here, in Texas, some people have half their roofs covered in panels. I don't want to do that--not attractive real estate.. This helps a lot. Thanks, my friend. Take care.
I didn't want to put down $10-20k for a system having to wait 20 years to get a return. This way, I can experiment and play with it a little. It's about 1/30th of the $10k investment.
Gary B not attractive real estate??? Are you high? Everyone I know would love to have a solar system already installed onto their new house. You must be in a area full of boomers that hate new technology.
@@markm0000 I was just about to say if I saw a house with solar panels I'd be like um yes this one please, lol
I think his view point might just be from an aesthetics point of view.
The guy next door to me just had a full blown system installed by a solar company. No kidding...3 days later his house was on the market. Apparently, his realtor advised him to install a fully compliant solar system to raise the asking price of the house. He had an offer within a few days, so he will not actually get to enjoy any benefit of the system, other than it helping to get a quick sale. Is this a common sales tactic these days?
interesting, i really enjoyed your informative knowlege, but when you plug in your system into the recepticle , do you have to turn off the main breaker from the panel box. im thinking if you dont turn off the main breaker maybe you will experience a back feed from the panel box. help?
Thank you.
You're welcome!
this guy was an electric engineer for a long time.
NICE VIDEO THANKS FOR MAKING IT. GIVES ME SOME IDEAS
=D
I always wanted to use solar panel or wind turbine in my home for reusable energy. I also plan to install rainwater harvesting system to collect rainwater from my roof and even make my own LPG, as I live in the rural side.
Wind power for residential homes are borderline worthless. They need to be up 60 feet to truly work, and even at that, they hardly produce. 1 extra solar panel will run circles around 10 wind turbines. (Hey they look neat though)
Good job! I am thinking of adding a grid tie connection to my setup.
It’s fun even if you only partially supplement you energy use.
@@BeatTheBush Indeed. Currently, the Solar project I am building is on my garage. With the goal of charging my PHEV vehicle.
Ultimately I want to expand it later to supply the house as well. Though that will be a separate system.
Excellent
love your video. i suspect your grid tie inverted has to have input from the grid to match the sine wave of utility company
Hi. I heard that a typical household in the US receives 2 phases (Here in germany it's 3), but your inverter can only supply 1 phase. How did you make sure that you cover most of your appliances? Are all circuits in your house connected to a single phase? Or did you just make sure that most of the appliances are connected to the solar phase?
Great Explanation
=D
Awesome video and buying a solar panel is a smart way because it will save a ton of money on electricity
With a max output of 150 watts, when the sun is shining, it won't "save a ton of money on electricity".
Break even is 3 years. The savings will be about $100/year after.
@@DisabilityExams ok lesson learned
@@BeatTheBush Saving $100 per year consider is a big money.Can use the $100 to invest to make more money
I connected my grid tie 8nverter to the grid power for a month and when I got the bill it was actually double of what I paid the previous month...so I'm back to using it all off grid!
Thank you for sharing your exprience. I was wondering this because one need to deal with the utility. They might need to change the meter etc. In my area, without any permits I cannot touch the grid at all. Only way to go is off grid
That's a very nice digital multimeter (DMM) you have there. I recognize the brand. It must pay to buy the high quality product, take care of it, and keep it for years versus buying a lesser quality one.
Fluke meters are the standard. This is a very old meter... more than 10 years.
I have a couple questions. Does this reverse on your meter? Didn't you say you saw negative power consumption on your meter? Also, do you get in trouble if you don't notify your electric company?
I guess these grid tied inverters have in built redundancies in the case that the feature that senses the grid voltage fails, but I'm wondering if you can add your own redundancy somewhere else to automatically shut off from the grid power when it goes down and automatically re-engage grid power when it comes back on?
Great video!! I have been looking for a 'plug and play' solar panels set up, somthing I can litterally plug in and use to reduce my bills but then easily unplug if moving house and I think this is the solution!
Yeah, this is it. But it still needs its own circuit breaker not shown on this video. Also, the panels are not mounted so it's not wind proof for high wind areas.
@@BeatTheBush brilliant, thanks for the advice!
Great job man ! you've really simplified this explanation to a level anyone can make sense of it. That is how you teach people "stuff" . Keep up the great work! Now you have at least one subscriber in New Zealand! :D
Thank you! Not the dangers of doing this yourself and local hookup regulations with your electricity provider though.
@@BeatTheBush Absolutely! you made that really clear in your video. I am actually going off the grid altogether in the new year , but I watch and learn EVERYTHING solar, anyway. In this instance, I actually forwarded your link, to family on the grid, who are considering grid tie (in the US) . If anyone doesn't understand the concept, after watching your video, then i give up! :D
Am I correct in assuming that the outlet used matters. That it will only feed power to the leg of your panel that you put into?
If your speaker wire is 18 gauge (like mine is) and you connect both of the wires together for each leg of the circuit, you will effectively have 15 gauge wire. At 18 gauge it is referred to as lamp cord and was adequate to run the old 100watt incandescent light bulbs in table lamps. But, you have doubled the wire thickness on each leg so for your 130 watt system, I say no worries.
I like your affordable experiment that lets you explore the whole solar power possibility without the typical $20k expense. My neighbor is not really happy with the results $$$ of his expensive solar install. I believe the pigeons are definitely cutting into his cost of ownership significantly.
He had to hire a solar panel cleaning specialist to go on his room and power wash the dirty panels. Now that is an up and coming service career opportunity!
Your videos are great!
It took some time to wipe it clean. If I had it on my roof, I would probably just strap myself to some safety harness and wipe it down with windex. This is indeed a learning platform and it did its job. I may work up to adding to it later.
Speaker cable and lamp cord degrade in the sun, plus the insulation isn’t rated for DC (DC has a higher arc/flame potential) and is hazardous. 15ga is also insufficient to efficiently carry the solar electricity for any distance.
This is all just wrong. Unsafe, not efficient.
Finally Bro Ur amazing thanks
=D
omg we asked about this in a long time ago :)
Thanks for getting back to us
People kept asking so I had to respond. =D
Very cool!
=D
Yes, you are right! I have studied and indeed when the power goes out, the inverter stops working.
BUT!!!!! But the question is: if you produce more power than you consume, you will send power to the Grid. You will have negative energy metering. This is a signal to the electric company that you have an illegal solar system.
I recommend buying an inverter with a limiter. Solar on Grid Tie Inverter Power Limiter 1000w. In this case, if you do not have big consumption but the solar panel produces electricity, the inverter GTIL2 will stop the excess energy. It reads your consumption using the CT sensor and limits production. Therefore, with such an investor you will NEVER send excess power to the grid!
How's your grow?
@@auntyuber5127 Today I’m waiting for a tool to put a lug on DC wires to GTIL2 1000w. And Today I will test launch the system: 4 panels of 280 watts ea and everything else. 10 elements of protection.
I turned off everything in the house and let only the solar power run for an hour to get negative power on purpose. It shows on my smart meter but I ended up not receiving credit but it registered 0.
@@BeatTheBush Just do not let the meter readings go into the negative zone, because then they (Energy Mafia) will send to you an inspector. Therefore, inverters with a limiter were invented So that you do not accidentally go into the negative zone.
@@BeatTheBush Interesting. So you were never contacted by the elec company when your meter went negative. You just never received credit, which is understandable since you don't have "net metering" meter and contract in place. I suppose if they were alerted by your standard smart meter and had an issue with your system, they'd send out some sort of cease and desist notice. So maybe they were not alerted because your smart meter doesn't have that capability. That tidbit of info would be interesting to know.
Great video! I'm thinking of doing the same setup but with 4 panels max...plug-and-play style. Will this cause any issues with the power company if they notice any power going back into the grid here in LA Cali?
Have you had any problems ?
One thing is that this should be connected to a dedicated circuit. If there is a draw somewhere in the branch circuit, it could be fed by both the main panel and your inverter exceeding the capacity of the wire.
this is simple.! the current that goes through wires are Voltage devide by the load. Load decides how much current goes through wires at that particular time.
It will be the same current regardless of solar or grid, or solar grid all together providing the electricity.
Great idea that I would like to try out!.. After doing some research, I found the following in a blog: “Not only are those "plug in" inverters not legal some are down right dangerous and tend to go up in flames. It would be a big mistake to use one.”.. Is it correct that a setup like this can cause a fire and, if so, what would be the circumstances that would happen? Also, how can it be prevented? Thank you and keep up the great work!!!
Assuming I don't have the ability to use a speaker wire. Or shrink wrap / sodder what line could I buy to accomplish what you did here?
What amp going in? You did not mention circuit breaker which you draw but you showed direct from grief tie to Main without circuit breaker?
Excellent!! Now can you show us how to connect a backup battery supply - THANK YOU.
I wont be getting a battery because this system does not allow you to just bolt one on. Also, it increases cost and extends the break even to 10+ years while this batteryless one is only 3 years.
Just get a battery backup system. Trying to go from solar to batteries to home grid is a lot of work. Batteries can get very expensive. Lithium are $950 per 100Ah. BTB's solution is ideally simple and saves you the same money. If you want solar for back up, just get a backup power system.
inspiring, thanks
Up here in Canada they just approved a 400MW megaproject, Greengate Travers. They plan on setting up 1.5 million 200 watt solar panels (with possible expansion to 2.5 million panels if everything goes ok) Its not all that far from where I am. The chose the spot as it is the sunniest in Canada, and its also located close to a dam which can provide hydro power during the night, but conserve water during the day.
Nice! It's always fun to look at those large projects.
I use my solar setup for preparation in case of blackout. So I need the battery to keep empowering my house lighting.
Grid tie wont have a battery and the controller isn't meant for that.
Thanks for sharing. Your grid tie inverter, how does it operate in the event of a power outage? Isn"t it like the utility guy cut off the power?
Yes. It doesn't work in an outage.
Can you have multiple grid tie inverter plugged on your normal power distributor?
Great video! I'm planning to do the same setup here in LA Cali. with 2 more panels in series but what will happen if the power company red-flags you? Will they fine you?
Hi,you better use off grid solar system with batteries.
Hello friend, how does the circuit breaker works and makes stove consume energy. its little confusing for my self. it seems cheaper solution compared to zero export system ? thanks alot
Very cool.
=D
whats the point of a grid tie solar that dies if the grid goes down? yeah you need a disconnect like a Generator has so that the generator output doesn't feed back into the grid but that should be done out at your breaker (for a small setup like this) or at the meter (for a whole house setup) not at the inverter.
Also really curious how this thing can tell the difference between the A/C voltage it outputs and the house voltage.
Thank you for the video. One question I have would be is there a way you can place an extension cord from the Grid Tie Inverter to the outlet in my home? Looking to put the solar panels in my yard about 100 feet from my home. Does this reduce the amount of power coming from the panels through resistance in anyway? or better question may be is there a specific type of extension I would need to use for this? Thank you.
Ac is designed to transfer well over a distance but there will still be some loss. I’d say a few percent. Thicker the cable the less loss.
You can take the engineer of the engineering job, but you can’t take the engineering out of the engineer 😉
Working at a typical job, you wont get to play with a system like this unless maybe you work for a solar company.
Very interesting and educational information. I thought the grid tied inverter is no difference from a regular inverter, such as the one I used in my car, inverting 12V DC to 110V AC.
Yeah... you cant just plug your car inverter into the wall, it will probably blow a fuse.
Would be Kool to make a collaboration with jehu García?
Don't you need a solar charge controller with the solar tie in? Someone please help if you know. Also do you know if there is a wattage minimum for this inverter?
Smack some power storage into that setup and you won't be sitting in the dark during the next blackout.
Exactly thinking about that like storage in DC batteries!
I have separate backups if I want lights during a blackout.
Batteries are expensive and don’t last forever. A generator can power most of your home for a couple days until the power comes back.
@@BeatTheBush Do you have a separate video up talking about your back up system for blackouts. I want to keep computer and few lights running as we have a few power outage a year
If power is out then it probably wont power the internet either. With my low burn rate and minimal resource usage, I can probably go a week or two with no power. LOL. No video on living with next to nothing just yet.
cool little experiment, can you use batteries with this system?
I bought NewPowa 100 watt mono solar panels and still have not used them. This is my DIY channel but will be adding them to my other channel. I may try picking up a grid tie inverter for a 400 watt array.
Wow this really reminds me of highschool.
This was called science fiction back in my day
=D I learned a lot just from getting this small setup. It was my goal while getting a little solar energy while doing it.
So you can have this plugged in any wall socket in the home , and use another wall socket elsewhere - example Kitchen and Bedroom , and saving pulling power from the grid still applies ?
When all your breakers are on, the AC lines are all connected. You must then make sure not to over load the wires from the panels to the load. Hence a properly size breaker before connecting to AC is needed.
I’m planning to build an apartment with a submeter for electricity in it. Can I install solar panels on my apartment so that my tenants can use the solar power?
So what did you ask DWP ?
Or say to give them your energy ?
What happens if you add an additional inverter (multiple inverters), each connected to its own set of PV panels, and have them both/all plugged into the same home (on same or even different circuits)? Will you simply get a cumulative effect where you are producing more power for your home devices, or will there be some sort of conflict between the different inverters?
Another question is can typical smart utility meters sense when you are pushing power back into the grid and subsequently get you into trouble? I suppose you could easily calculate your base usage level (the amount of power your home never goes below) and try to approach that level with your panels without ever feeding back to grid.
I have not done so but my guess is that you can just connect it all to the same circuit. Each inverter will only increase the voltage very slightly by a fraction of a volt to push energy back. Each one senses the phase of the power line and matches it in order to push power back.
I purposely pushed power back to negative as an experiment. I talked about it in my previous video with screen shots from the utility company. I was not given credit and paid zero for it instead.
Why batteries storage is good for emergency use?
Great video. If your pulling 150w from your solar panels and absolutely nothing in your home is drawing power, the 150w will go to the utility grid company..... will they know? Does your meter turn backwards? Do you save money?
They will know but it depends on the company if they will flag it and do something about it. I have a smart meter and it does turn backwards. You must have a contract with the utility company in order to sell electricity back to them.
will the power from the electric company back feed on my set up if i leave the main breaker open? im thinking the power will come back in on my setup and trip my 15 or 20 amp breaker , help
You would generate better production by shortening your lines from the panels to the inverter, then running the distance of 30 feet (or however much you need) to the wall via AC power. Also, a question I was wondering. In your example where you are generating 150w and no systems are pulling that energy thus pumping back to the utility company. Would your meter begin to think you are consuming that energy? Since it is not net metering, would it just think that the energy passing through your meter is going to the house and not to the grid?
Yes, you would get billed for your own energy production if the meter doesn't "know" which direction the juice is flowing.
So if the grid goes down you have no electricity from your panels. If you have a UPS then when the grid goes down you can flip the mains breaker to the grid and trip your grid tie inverter into thinking the grid is up and running. Then you can use your panels during the entire outage. When your neighbors lights go back on then turn off the UPS and flip the mains breaker. At least that's my plan. I want to install 4 used (25 cents/w) 330W panels to power my electric car with Level 1 power and feed back any leftovers to the grid. Thanks for showing how easy it is to do.
I feel your explanation was the best I have ever seen. I like many others I'd guess would like to dabble in solar power. I like that you make it doable for the average person to mess with it also. I want to do this also and get my feet wet in solar power. You'll never truly know what you are missing until you jump into the ring and do it. Thanks for making this video and taking the heat of the experts and answering the back seat drivers. I want to know something about this shit! I want to get dirty also! Making only a drop of your own power has to be a little bit exciting. We are so controlled by the power companies and there bend over and pay the bill bullshit. It always goes up, and you feel trapped into there paradigm. Always brand new trucks and pay the bill yesterday corporate threats.
Me buying this system had multiple purposes. First really was to try it out and I actually did learn a lot. It's pretty fun to generate your own. Second is lower my electric bill even if its a little. Third is I can make a video on it! =D
It's also a fun conversation piece when people see it. I also just like looking at it.
Thanks, great Video. I have some harbor freight solar panels and didn't know I could get such thing as a grid tie inverter. I would like to get at least 1. Now I can go solar making my solar system modular and scalable modular system. Where can I get a grid tie inverter that is safety approved by UL? Can't find your link.
Link is in the video description. I think the one I have is not UL approved as I do not see the marking on it.
Thanks for the simple explanation! At work it bothers me when people give complicated explanations just to sound smarter. Also, did you improve the end music? For some reason I like it more now.
Nope, ,it's the same end music. I think I just naturally talk in a simple way. I annoy myself when using big words unnecessarily.
@@BeatTheBush maybe I heard it so many times that I like it more, lol. And yes, me too
Great video, but I don't see the sense if when power is gone inverter won't work. Is that something just to offset your light?
It's really just a toy for learning. Power is usually not out.
I'd love to see how you end up mounting these. I too am scared about drilling holes into my new roof lol.
It must be done the right way so that it doesn't leak. I haven't done this yet though.
Don't impede the flow of water, and anywhere you put screws: make sure to use roofing tar or another _good_ sealant before you screw into your roof.
Then you'll be good.
If you have tornados: my advice is null.
Thanks for the awesome video! I have an old 3.1kw grid tied system I bought (from solar city/Tesla) many years ago. Can I add something like this to pickup a little extra power? My biggest concern would be dual inverters tricking each other to stay online during a power outage. I would not mind that if I could trick it after I remove it from the line after flipping the main breaker. Random FYI, my current inverter cannot handle any more panels directly. Thanks again
Technically, you can attach any number of grid tie to the grid. But I have to reserve actual recommendation here because you might void any contract your have with your actual solar system. Also, remember you need a breaker between the grid tie inverter and the mains which I did not show.
@@BeatTheBush Thanks, I did see your power strip had a breaker built in. I am looking forward to trying this out. Do you have any knowledge about the micro grid tie inverters?
If we connect inverter directly to the solar the inverter will not damage sir... Shall we can connect inverter directly...
Does this solar power setup power lights(or other appliances) that are connected to a different breaker than the one connected to the solar power setup?
If all breakers are on, and powered by external AC then yes. If no external AC not detected, this grid tie system will not provide power.
Is that 150 watts per hour feeding back into the grid?
Thanks for the video. Do all grid-tie power inverters have the automatic cut-off safety feature?
Not sure. But the one I showed will not send back into the grid without already having power there.
@@BeatTheBush Thanks BB
You forgot to mention that the power from the inverter is only going too one leg of the 220 volt that is supplied from the grid. Nice simple setup but I would use a limiter. So inspiring.
Yeah, I didn't mention that.
so question, if your power were to get cut off during a storm or outage, would you not be able to generate power from the panels?
The grid tie inverter does not generate AC out when the mains is not powered. The panels will generate power but you will need an off-grid inverter to do so.
If I do this system and then later what to add another system can you plug two systems into outlets and increase your output. Meaning will the two systems work together for more power or against each other?
My guess is that yes you can but I have not tried it myself. Each system will look at the voltage on the line and raise their own voltage slightly to push power out. So someone down the street having the same mini system will work also.
3:22 You measure voltage across the wires wires straight from the panel and claim it has something to do with the inverter logic. Was that a mistake?
which fuse/breaker do you suggest?
Did you mention that those plug-in grid-tie inverters aren't UL listed?
Don't think let me add pictures.
I bought used panels 2x 230w
Right now it's telling me power 270w on digital timer with voltage 123.88 not sure if it's gred tie using 123.88
And 270w I'm left with ?