Explore Scientific Ultra Light Dob Review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ส.ค. 2024
- An in-depth review of the Explore Scientific Ultra Light Dob 12" (305mm).
NOTE: Initially I tried contacting Explore Scientific regarding the issues with the altitude movement but received no response. I have since been contacted by Scott Roberts, President of Explorer Scientific. Mr. Roberts assured me they are looking at ways to address the problems presented in this video to improve their Ultra Light Dob.
This may have been the best review I've seen. Thank you for the entire effort, especially the solutions.
sorry to be so offtopic but does anybody know a way to log back into an Instagram account..?
I was stupid forgot my password. I would love any assistance you can give me
@Bronson Davion Instablaster =)
i have to give you props on a really great (truly in-depth) review and unboxing. Some of those issues would have made me sad in the excitement of opening such an awesome scope though. This is the first vid i ran into of yours and i doubt it will be the last. Thanks!
glad you found it useful.
I know this is six years old but your attention to detail is what makes this interesting. I wish I could compare the quality control of all the major brands. Thanks
Great review , fantastic attitude , tremendous to see someone who works through problems , real cando spirit , big pat on the back , clear skys
Great review. I've been waiting a review like this since this dob had appeared. I conclude that if you want this dobsonian(the reason why I'd purchase it is the light weight it has and the compact it is(it's more transportable than my 8" dob) you have to think about the mechanical issues you will have to solve. Thank you so much for sharing it.
I absolutely love the 12" Dob. I just had my first all nighter new moon in a great dark campsite. This scope will blow your mind! I found so many galaxies and nebulae.
Agreed. :-) And you got to love the portability and low eyepiece height for the kids.
Holy crap I can't believe this thing used to be under $1,000. It's now $2,000, that's crazy.
Thanks for the review, saved me some money here. I've had pretty good luck with my AR102 so I was interested in the ES Dob, but not any more. I don't mind paying extra to get me out viewing rather than engineering solutions.
Thanks for the tip - I've got an ES 10" Hybrid Truss coming soon, and the suggestion for focuser orientation is easy to do, as all it takes is to pick the position of the cage during assembly. I've spanned in an old iPhone 5 which is still functional, using the Star Chart app - when on a cellphone holder + dovetail, actually acts like a 'guidescope' and gives good enough guidance to get a faint object in the main POV of my current 4" Maksutov on EQ mount.
Cool! Congrats on the ES 10", too.
@@DakotaStarryNights Much obliged - here in NZ, a 10" is a BIG telescope, immediately putting me in the top 5% of amateur's. Next big save-up will be for a classic C8. But a 10" light bucket will be like owning a starship - and sexy with the Serrurier Truss - otherwise a dob is just a tube and a box (which is not necessarily bad) - the truss just makes it into something more serious and practical at once.
@@martinlagrange8821 Agreed. I started out with a 10" and really could have stayed with it much longer than I did. But you know, I came down with a bad case of aperture fever. The bigger scopes, like the 10", do draw the crowd in, that for sure. Real pretty country NZ. I've only got to see it in Lord of the Rings, though. :)
Great review! I'm waiting for the next batch of scopes to be delivered to my local store here in California. Seriously looking at the 12" but also have an eye on the 16". Again, Thanks for the efforts!
which one did u get? the 16 inch is twice the price of the 12 lmao but i read somewhere it has like 50 percent more light gathering.
What a wonderful service you did in Reviewing this scope. Very informative and useful to me as a woman astronomer. I would never have been able to perform those fixes. Thanks for the wonderful review.
Glad to be of help. Dakota
Thank you for the very informative and painstaking review. I would be so in for this if not for the QC issues. What I saw looked inexcusable to me. Rust is a total NO-GO!
In one scene as you're raising the elevation to the zenith the whole telescope shudders in a way that made me shudder. Not just the tube, but everything down to the rocker box. That made the whole telescope look very flimsy. The price of weight savings... But I CAN'T EVEN CONSIDER spending money for a whole telescope only to have to completely rebuild the [RUSTY] rocker box. (I hope you're reading this, ES!)
That said, the design looks very intriguing. I particularly liked the novel access to collimation controls.
Thank you again for your fine review DSN!
hard to believe its not all aluminum. Mixing steel and Al is a bad thing.
As of my comment date, there are no reviews on the ES website for any of their dobs. You should post this video on their review page. Thanks for sharing.
+Rony Aguirre Scott Roberts, president of ES, called to inform me that he and his product development people are aware of the review and are looking at was to resolve these issues. They are welcome to post this review as it is embeddable. Clear Skies.
Great, patient review. "You get what you pay for", seems to be the appropriate adage...
Yeah, that's how it plays out sometimes. And some times you don't even get what you paid for. 😏
I'm running a tad late in finding this video! This is totally awesome!
A thank you is always appreciated, now matter the time. Thanks. 🪐
I really like Explore Scientific, I was wide eyed when I saw a video for a ES Dob but this looks terrible. I think you've done an amazing job, I'd of been back to the shop quick smart. You have the patience of a saint.... Thanks for sharing.
Hi Mark, ES does make some nice kit for the price point they're selling at. That said, it is obvious I got a lemon. A real lemon. But I managed to make lemonade out of it. :) Also, they have made some major improvements as a result of this video. And I understand the ES Ultra Light-2 is much better. The President of Explorer Scientific, Mr. Roberts, reached out to me and they were very much concerned and offer to replace the scope for a better one. So don't let this stop you. They're pretty decent dobs. Thanks for posting!
@@DakotaStarryNights That's good to know, I know you put your heart and soul into this but I hope you took them up on their offer.
I just picked mine up from Costco 650 bucks thanks for your unboxing are really help especially about vacuuming and shaving they work everywhere
Sweet! That's a heck of a buy. Congrats!
"So this is a great scope for kids!" Lol. Love this review. You are hyper observant and you have high standards. You helped me avoid this scope....for which I am extremely grateful. Think I'm going to spend some extra money and consider a 15 inch Obsession (second hand).
Thanks! I'm glad you found it useful. 😊
Thanks so much, I don't have the knowledge to get the fixes, if ever, since I'm looking for buying my first telescope, I think I'll go with the MEADE 10" DOBSONIAN LIGHTBRIDGE instead. This review was a blessing for me.
I don't believe the fixes will be necessary now. I understand Explore Scientific has addressed the issues I've pointed out here. I would easily buy another ES Ultra Light if something was to happen to the one I have now. The ES offers a lot of nice features that the Meade does not have. But of course I respect your decision to go with the Meade instead.
That's good then. No rush here, I shall place my order when the over ten feet high snow banks will have melt. We're burried under snow this year. Thanks I'll keep you posted.
Nice review, Thanks. Disappointing to see all of the quality issues. I would gladly pay more if they used quality components and the fit/finish was a little better.
Thanks again sir! This review helped me decide to order this telescope.
The Gen II is much better from what I've been told. Congrats!
Thank you very much for this review and for the improvement ideas.
+Dan Constantinescu You're welcome Dan.
Thank you very much for this great review! I own a SW 120/900 ED and I'm considering to swap it for this scope( Gen.II that is). The SW gives great images of the planets, though DSO stay quite dim. I guess that problem will be solved with this dob. Kind regards from Holland, Menno
Like you said the SW 120ED is great for planets and the moon but for DSO's a guy needs aperture. The 12" ES Ultra Light is the right combination of size and portability. And even though mine isn't a Gen.II I plan on holding on to it for that reason. I had some amazing views of Jupiter with it at a category 1 dark site here in South Dakota; such as details in Jupiter's cloud belts showing festoons and bands of alternating color. With night vision and the ES 12, DSO's are beyond belief, really. Clear Skies. Thanks for posting.
No nonsense detailed review. Very useful.
Thanks for the review! I watched it twice, and that saved my mirror from an extremely bad design and manufacturing.
I was sure the box was aluminum, and was curious where your rust came from, so I started probing with a magnet.
The box is in fact aluminum. What you found ferromagnetic are actually steel weight plates on the inside.
These plates are held only by silicone glue. One plate on my was loose, and it fell off when I tipped the box over. Good thing I was prepared. Otherwise it would have crashed right into the primary!!
For those who have these truss telescopes, check these weight plates and secure them! Better safe than sorry.
The dob I reviewed was Gen1, which didn't come with steel weight plates. It was single wall sheet metal. But you've answered a question I had regarding a previous poster who said a plate had come lose and crashed on his mirror. Ouch. I couldn't understand what plate he was referring to until now. Using just silicone glue for such an application is not a good idea at all. Thanks for posting.
Thank you so much for your video; it's extremely useful! Greatings from France and clear skies to you :-)
You're welcome. Kind of a coincidence here as this is the second greeting I've received from France. I met one of your compatriots just this week on the trail in Canyonlands National Park, UT. Thanks for posting!
Thanks .. you just saved me eleven hundred bucks. Chinese optics may be 'ok' these days, but the fit and finish on at least the Chinese iOptron, Sky-Watcher, and Orion scopes and mounts I've bought were shoddy, but hey theyre nowhere near the cost of Takahasi, Astrophysics, Bisque, Losmandy, etc., and the way I look at it they are good bases to mod and build upon if you've got some machining and painting skills. I've no experience with Explore .. but that rust was an instant no no for me .. so again thanks. P.S. really good video itself .. it was actually very interesting 👍
Great review and demo I really appreciate your efforts to explain your trials and tribulations and detailing the ways you conquered the issues. I have the same scope and have/had almost identical problems. The altitude wheels/PTFE pads are the weak spot for sure. Adding the additional felt pads helped to some degree to square-up the movement, still not perfect but functional. Thanks for the tip on rotating the cage, I'll have to try that. My optics are great. Where we differ other than I'm retired Air Force, is that I have a RACI and Telerad. The added weight is an issue and I have been using a couple heavy magnets to make it balance when I use my ES 30mm. No rust so far.
interesting video, just wish you could have shown us how to assemble this monster, as knowing how delicate you have to be with the mirrors during assembly is a great thing to know BEFORE purchasing it, but on the good side, at least you told us about the rusting problem, thanks.
I've had a similar problem with the mirror box hitting the inside of the rocker in a home-built Dobsonian. It's critical that the altitude bearings be symmetrical with each other. The bearings seem large enough but the combination of materials used might be inferior to Teflon and laminate which have been used by the best manufacturers.
Thanks for the solid review, this helped me with the purchasing decision.
After reading multiple good comments on various forums about this scope, I have to thank Dakota Starry Nights for making this video. The QC is trash. Definitely looking elsewhere.
Hi, excellent review, I'm looking at the new 20 inch, I don't suppose you've had any experience with it. I was looking at the Skywatcher Stargate 20 but has alt/az issues.
Just received my Gen. II. They seem to have fixed most of the problems you encountered.
To be fair, I’ve only put it together and haven’t even collimated it yet. But one problem I noticed is that the hockey puck clutch nob seems to not do much at all and moves at zenith. Looking to order some counter weights for it now as well as a shroud. Got a coma corrector and. an APM 20mm XWA HV specifically for this scope ( my first dob). Seems a little more robust than I thought it would be. Will reply here if I encounter any major problems as there’s not a lot of info or reviews out there on this scope
Congrats on your Gen. II! First dob...? Wow, looks like your off to a great start. What size you get, Phil? I found counter weights a must for my set up. With a 55mm TeleVue Plossl, coma corrector, finder scope and PVS14 night vision there's no way a guy would keep it all balanced without them. But the views are heavenly! Thanks for posting. Dakota
My Gen II came with the counter weights. I am in the UK, so it might be different here.
Thank you for this excellent review.
Excellent review. One of the things that disappoints me with all but the most expensive amateur astronomy equipment is build quality. I was wanting one of the ES Dobs, but I can make something much better once I purchase mirrors and focuser. I do like the way this provides for collimation from the front so will incorporate that feature in my Dob.
Yeah, if you've got the skill sets and money to build one yourself, that's the way to go.👍 Cheers!
@@DakotaStarryNights Retired machinist modelmaker designer. I ended up buying one just because the whole scope is cheaper than just the mirrors. If it is better than yours will use it with some modifications. Otherwise I have a focuser and mirrors. Arrived yesterday and will unbox this afternoon.
@@DakotaStarryNights Just finished setting mine up for the first time. Definitely better than what you received. No rust, no stray holes or other issues. I am not at all keen on the focuser so will probably replace it. No caps for protecting the secondary so will have to deal with that issue. The textured bearing material is a bit rough and makes noise in use. Still good value for the money.
@@cattaraugustonawanda4426 Glad to hear you got a good sample. Mine was a dog but once ES saw the review that wasted no time addressing the problems at the factory. 👍 They are better now from what I've been hearing. I found the Alt bearings a bit rough too. I took some 100 girt sand paper and smooth them out a bit. If you decide to try that, be careful not to take off too much. Do a little at a time until you feel you've taken it as far as practical. For a secondary cover I used an inverted protein can. I did one for my Hubble Optics UL16, too. Starting at 4:07 in the timeline. th-cam.com/video/KIIOt2bNdaA/w-d-xo.html Congrats on the new glass and Happy New Year!🥳
@@DakotaStarryNights Thanks for the info ! My home made 6" Dob mount has a lazy Susan bearing on the azimuth and Teflon/brass bearings on the alt all of which are very smooth/silky but the scope is well balanced.
This product was discontinued and relaunched with a new manufacturer. The new Dobs are called Generation II - so as much as this was a good review of the original product, the quality issues discussed are no longer relevant.
This has been noted in the description above and in posts made below. However, the critic is still relevant as it serves as a reminder to manufactures to pay closer attention to quality requirements and design issues of their products before launch. In that regard Scott Roberts was very responsive to the problems I pointed out resulting in the creation of the Gen. II. Although it's important to point out I have not had a first hand look but I understand it's better. Thanks for posting. Clear Skies
I'm seriously considering this vs a 12" Lightbridge. The ES Gen II does not look as robust. It's tough to decide because there is no store nearby so I can get my hand on both products. I'm looking to replace my Orion 8" tube that was damaged in a move. do you know how the optics compare between the 2 scopes? What do you consider the best attributes of the ES? do you need a shrowd? thx!
@@DakotaStarryNights Does anyone know if Gen II has corrected all these issues you note, because as it is i wouldn't buy this particular scope given all the issues you found.
@@MichaelJohnson-xg2vq I'd go with the ES Gen II in a heart beat. Much more portable and there's none easier to collimate. And jumping from an 8" to a 12" is noticeable at the eyepiece. Check out my new vid on the ES Gen II th-cam.com/video/C8zgk_Iflh0/w-d-xo.html for more updates. This scope is hard to beat in its price range. Add setting circles and your rule the sky.
Solid, thorough review!
I have to wonder how they are managing galvanic corrosion issues, if they are mixing aluminum and steel. wonder if that's the source of your rust?
Good point. Mixing Steel and Al is normally a bad thing. I wonder how the unit fared in terms of rust in the years since?
I'm BETWEEN skywatcher 12" dobs and explore scientific ultra light 16''. Which of the two I buy? Exelent review.
+Aiolos Sp It really depends on what you intend to do with it. If you plan on taking it out often to a dark site then the ultra light is the better of the two. A 16" skywatcher would probably require a truck to haul around due to it's size. It also would be really heavy, 177 lbs. when fully assembled. As the old saying goes "the telescope that's used the most is the best telescope." When compared to the skywatcher 16" the 12" ES ultra light is like a grab and go scope. :-)
If you have a big car I would buy the 16"dob without thinking twice. The diferences between a 12" and 16" dobsonians are great, specially in deep sky objects
wow. Unacceptable QA - rust on a brand new unit is NOT good.
Great job! Thanks. Learned a LOT.
You're a really nice guy to accept it as it is and do modifications on something new,
even if you didn't pay 1,000 dollars for this Telescope, it should have been in better condition. It is assumed to be new. Unless it was sold to you as is and you knew it.
It was sold to me as new. One of the first ones out. Anyway, at least it brought QC issues to the attention of Explorer Scientific. They apparently stopped production to sought things out. The Gen's II are reportedly better. Thanks for posting!
4 years later ES has still not fixed the metal particles you found in the mirror box. I bought the 12“ and had to send it back. Mirror box has 10+ metal particles up to an half inch long. Primary Mirror was obviously scratched. There is a design problem here.
Mine unfortunately came with scratches too. I can hear shavings in it. Thankfully I didn't have such an experience like you did though. Mine almost lasted a year before needing major repair :I
Excellent review. I wonder if the QC is any better now in 2020.
They've since come out with a Gen II version of this scope after this video posted. I understand they've made some improvements. Once I fixed the problems I found it to be a pretty nice scope.
I have this scope, but I think it must be a newer version. Mine doesn't have the adjusting screw at 16:40, nor does it have any of the other problems mentioned here, so it does look as though they have improved the design.
This is the early version. They shut down production shortly after my review posted and made some changes. Which showed Explore Scientific really cares. So, you probably have the newer one, which is much better. Congrats!
@@DakotaStarryNights Yes that makes sense. I can also confirm that the box on the v2 is largely made of aluminium.
Great review man, Thanks!!
Update: so i bought the same telescope this month and it came will packed, base wasn't rustic and the overall quality was great, only problem i had was the tough friction
Try rubbing a bar of soap (dry) along the altitude bearing. You can always wipe it off if you put too much.
Dakota Starry Nights good idea i will try that, thanks a lot
The condition of that new 'scope is terrible imo! Rust and broken fasteners on a brand new Telescope !?? That's just inexcusable imo! Great in depth review though, and i think you were very gentle in your comments about defects! I'd have been much more critical! New should mean absolutely flawless and certainly no broken parts!! Also, dust and flakes of metal inside Mirror compartment!?? How bad does this have to get!?? Shocking and completely indefensible imo! Thanks again, clear skies! ( and better condition new 'scopes my friend! lol ) Wes, Liverpool, UK.
The eyepiece may be more comfortable where you moved it..But if you notice it would be easier to drop an eyepiece on the main mirror at that position...Would be ok with a cover on the telescope
Just bought one, hope i get the same experience as everyone in the comments, wish me luck guys and gals 🤞🏼
Congrats! After I sorted out the problems with this one it turned out to be great scope. The Gen II's are better as I understand it.
Dakota Starry Nights this was my first ever experience with a telescope and found it really easy thanks to your videos, I actually got the Gen1 bought it slightly used, couldn’t pass the price.
I got HOOKED when i saw a nebula !!!
For now I’ll do the cover and upgrade the finder scope
@@TalalBuHazza Not all the Gen1's were lemons. =) Glad you got a keeper. Clear skies!
Nice review. Do you think the Gen II available now has corrected any of the flaws you pointed out? I was thinking of buying one but this has given me 2nd thoughts about it. Thanks for your efforts!
As I understand it they have made some improvements with the Gen II. But not having one, I can't speak from personal experience. I've heard mostly good about the Gen II version but also some bad. In all fairness, that's par with a lot of the goods made overseas. Have you've looked at the Hubble Optics UL12? That's the lightest one out there. You could literally put it in a backpack. Cheers!
@@DakotaStarryNights Unable to find any actually for sale and not indefinitely backordered I went with a Zhumell Z10, readily available and shipped from Celestron in California. No backpack with that but ok for what I'll use it for here in AZ. Thanks!
@@Mainuh Actually, I started out with a Z10. Great scope and a real decent focuser. Congrats!
Great review! Can you please comment on the hearings and how smooth is moving the scope up and down including when tracking at high magnification. Thanks
Anyone knows if the issues mentioned in this video were resolved in 2021 with the "second generation" of Dobsonians?
Thank you for the in-depth review. I am considering getting the little brother the 10" I saw one displayed at the NEAF in New York. Explorer Scientific booth. What attracted me to it was the sheer size, and on how it will compact down to a very small box. I currently have an 8" collapsable Sky Watcher. Was a little dismayed after purchase due to the 10" was the same height at zenith! Come to find out the 10" has a faster mirror. Anyway now I am torn Should I go with the Explore scientific or should I return to Sky Watcher? Just fearing the newer true tube might have the same issues.
+Clayton Tanner Well, a move to a 10" from an 8" will not show much of difference light wise. Of course there will be a difference but you may find not as much as you were hoping for. If you could compare a 10" and with your 8 before you make the jump that should settle it. Going from an 8 to a 12 does make a noticeable difference. I had an 8" Edge and found the deep sky views lacking. Not because of the optics, they were pretty darn good. But the aperture was just not enough for me to get excited about what I was seeing. But when I made the move to the 12 things got a whole lot more interesting. And I sold the Edge.
As a former aircraft mechanic, anytime you have steel meeting aluminum, you will get dissimilar metal corrosion. That's what you have there. I hope you're able remove most of it by treatments.
Mixing steel with aluminum was a bad decision. ES should have know better. I'm not sure the reasoning behind their material selection for the bolts. If it was for strength they could have gone with a larger aluminum bolt. The bolts connect the truss poles to the mirror box. Excessive corrosion could led to breakage at the point where the steel bolts come in contact with the aluminum mirror box. If that happens it will be difficult to fix.
As a remedy, I wire brushed them then added a coating of wheel bearing grease to reduce oxidation. It seems to be working for now.
@@DakotaStarryNights, I'm glad to see you treated them. Should last you in good stead for a long time. Brian
Completely changed my mind and have one of the updated models on order. What light shroud are you using in the closing shot? And does it fully close off the mirror box with those bearings in the way? Also, do you have the outside dimensions of the rocker box by any chance? I want to build a leveling base with a setting circle and need to make sure I have the right size plywood handy.
I made the light shroud myself. The shroud slips between the bearings so they are not in the way. I've made a leveling base too. Very useful as it keeps the rocker box off the ground and aids greatly in the accuracy of the Az. setting circle. The rocker box is 17.5 inches square. I was out last Saturday at a class 1 dark site with a couple of guys from the Black Hills Astronomical Society. The views through the ES 12 with a Tele Vue 13mm Ethos had us all impressed. And there were a number of "wows" throughout the night from guys who have seen it all before.
Thank you!
You're welcome.
thank you sincerely for this awesome review. For myself, the purchase of one of these will truly be a once in a lifetime purchases. Therefore I will need look elsewhere now. Thank you sincerely !!!!
Do You still make and sell the movement handle that you show in another TH-cam episode?
Great review. Do you happen to know whether the issues you have pointed out here were remedied with the Gen II scope now sold by Explore Scientific?
Scott Roberts called me shortly after the review posted and ES stopped production of the Ultra Light in order to address the issues brought up in this review. So, as I understand it, the Ultra Light Gen II version has address these issues. It should be noted that I have not had a chance to go over a Gen II myself but I'm hearing they're much improved. Thanks for posting. Dakota
lol I also vacuum the mirror. For stickier dust I use it together with a squeeze bulb that has a filter. Too bad that most dust doesn't even come off with that approach.
I own the ES 16" Dobson. Would you recommend to store the mirror box on top of the lower rocker box for weeks or even months? Or would the weight cause too much strain to the teflon pads and base for such a long time?
Regarding dustfree storage I'm not sure if it's enough to simply close the mirror box and cover its carrying holes. Or if I should build a cover for the primary, how do you handle that?
Hi Adio; To be on the safe side it may be better not to store the mirror box on top of the rocker box for the reasons you pointed out. It might cause a dent or ripple that would effect smooth Alt movement. Just saying... To help prevent dust from getting on the primary I have a double wall cardboard corrugated panel (notched out for the three allen head adjusting screws) that sits about 3/4" above the mirror. It helps keep dust and any objects from falling on the mirror when putting the dob together. I put it back on at the end of the night and it stays there until the next time out. Seemed to have made a difference. If you store the dob in a dust pron area than plugging up the carrying holes with foam or something is probably a good idea. Clear skies!
Great! I definitely gonna do that! I'm always afraid of dropping something on the mirror while putting the dob together.
Thanks for the reply.
In my country price of this dobsonian is more then average wage and twice the price of dso or SW. For that much of money what I get? Rust and remains after drilling? DIY center point? Half aluminium case? In description of telescope there is stated that it breaks down into two aluminium cases. This Dobsonian was my favorite, because I thought that I will get some quality one for my money. Not anymore, I am really disappointed...
Wow! I cant believe all the metal shaving and such on such a delicate piece of equipment. They at least owe you an apology. I wouldnt expect that if it was a wrought iron fence let alone something with such an expensive piece of glass. But I would still die for one of those.
Yeah, it was a bit surprising. But they're a reportedly better now. And, yes, it's a blast out at a good dark site.
Have they made improvements in the QA/QC ?
It would seem they rushed these, and with optics thats bad...
Great review, thx!
Great review. Seems like a lot of problems here, did they fix these on Gen II?
Soon after the review posted Scott Roberts of ES contacted me. They stopped production and redesigned the ES Ultra Light. From what I understand the problems pointed out were addressed. I've read later reviews that indicated as much. I still have my Gen I twelve inch. And just last night a couple of us got together and were killing it, nailing one target after another using setting circles. It's a keeper for me.
Thanks for the review. I was just going to order one but I have decided to wait for their updated versions.
I have a question. How well does it hold its collimation during the night. Does it change as the temperatures does.
+Yiangoss I believe the new version is due out next month. I will be posting a new video here on Dakota Starry Night soon covering collimation using the Pro SteadyGrip lever on the 12" ES Ultra Light. The Pro SteadyGrip helps maintain optical alignment throughout the night. It also makes it much easier to slowly move the scope in Alt or AZ; especially the AZ movement when the scope is pointed at or near zenith.
+Dakota Starry Nights my main fear is that because it is made out of aluminium (and in some parts steel) the expansion and contraction of the metals may course the scope to warp slightly. This may be enough to class the scope as unreliable. I will look out for your next video.
Great review, hope they get out an improved model soon. Did you happen to weigh the components, as in what's the heaviest piece you have to carry? The specs given don't quite makes sense... "Primary mirror weight 50.5 lbs, Rocker box weight 15.7 lbs, Total weight 66.2 lbs." What about the trusses and the secondary cage, don't they weigh anything?
I haven't weigh the different components. The heaviest, though, is the primary mirror box as would be expected. But due to its compact size and carrying handles it's easy to transport; unless you have some sought of back injury perhaps. The trusses are made of aluminum and are light as a feather. The weight of the secondary cage is negligible. Overall, it's got to be the most portable dob out there for the money without heavy partial board. I've added a setting circle for AZ and finding targets got even easier when used with a tablet.
Thanks for the quick response. True, it is nice and compact. If you get a chance, can you stand on a scale while holding the mirror box, and do the math? 50 lbs is a bit intimidating, but 40 would be less so. (I have stairs to deal with.)
Oh boy, hopefully they improved it with Generation II, but I can see now why people buy refractors and premium Dobs.
They did improve it with the Gen 2 version.
La correzione ottica dello specchio di quanto potrebbe essere?
Don't really know.
Thank you very much for the great review!
I'm about to order the 16" ES dobsonian. Do you might have an advice which eyepieces for a set of 3 would make most sense? I consider buying the ES 82° 30mm along with the ES 82° 14mm. I already own a Meade UWA 6.7mm. Not sure if I should get the 18mm instead of the 14mm though (82° because of the price).
It's a tough call because either the 14mm or 18 would be good choices. And I might add, having a set of just 3 or 4 eyepieces is the way to go. I have a TelVue Ethos 13mm that I use most of the time. A 17mm Ethos would be nice but at the time I got the 13 Ethos 17's weren't available then. That said, I'm sure the 16" ES Ultra Light is going to rock your world. I still very much enjoy my 12" despite the problems I had with it starting out. Here's a link that might help you decide on which eyepiece: astronomy.tools/calculators/field_of_view/ Clear Skies, Dakota
Wow that's a great page, thank you for the link, it helped me a lot for the decision! I finally completed the order of the telescope and the eyepieces. I got the ES 82° 14mm and the 82° 24mm (instead of the 30mm). I might get the ES 100° 9mm or 82° 8.8mm in the future to fill the gap between my 6.7mm, time/experience will tell if it's needed.
Now comes the hardest part of all... waiting patiently for the delivery lol.
Clear skies
Rattle inside secondary cage is a pop rivet centre i suspect and won"t come out.
The finish on this perticular scope aside...There is no other dob of similar design on the market for the money.
The optics are likely equal to that of a Lightbridge.
I'm guessing this review is why the version I ordered today is called "generation 2" lol good work.
Yeah, Stephen. To their credit, ES stopped production shortly after this video posted to sort out the problems. Gen II is reportedly better. Congrats!
@@DakotaStarryNights I got my 12" in the mail and the focuser was broken so I can't use it yet. It's so obviously beautiful and now I have a $1700 paperweight in my room until it's fixed!
I’m still an amazed at how solid it feels and how good it looks put together. I just got a shot of bad luck that’s all. Unfortunately I couldn't transfer the focuser over from my xt8 I got desperate and hoped it was still useable but no too big. Still waiting to hear back from ES wish me luck sir.
@@DakotaStarryNights Then a weight from the inside of the mirror box seprated from its glue and fell on the primary mirror... so much for that then
@@Stephen-wb3wf I sure hope they make good on it and provide you with a replacement.
@@DakotaStarryNights I exchanged for the Skywatcher 12" collapsible. It was about $500 less than the ES so I used the difference to buy myself a Delos 6mm and the shroud for it. I waited till now when it's all put together, new telrad on, and it's looks like im safe from my new scope breaking itself to tell you it's all good now.
Going to Nockamixon Park in PA tmrw night with my local astronomy group. After being a newbie with my xt8 and homemade dew shield last time in October I'm gonna look like a real deal amateur astronomer now! Still love your videos. Thanks for your support as well, the time in bewtween the inner weight breaking the primary on the 1st 12" and now was a really horrible one. But now it's behind me.
Hi I was wondering if the scope, when packed, wasn't too heavy... I'm only 16 and I don't want it to disgust me from astronomy as I am just starting. This model seems nice as it is possible to take it on a trip during hollidays in a small car.
So what do you think ?
+FK Orangina The ES Ultra Light 12" is your best bet for portability. It breaks down into two or three manageable small packages as seen in the video. Twelve inches of aperture can show you a lot of what's up there. It's probable all you'll ever need for visual work. And has the best weight to to "light grab" ratio IMHO. Just add dark clear skies and you're off on a journey of discovery! Dakota
+Dakota Starry Nights
Thanks for your fast reply ! Just to know, how much do each part weight ?
PS : I'll be purchasing the 10" instead ;) (not enough money ^^)
+FK Orangina Well I've never weigh the parts. But the mirror is the heaviest component. Though I can easily lift it by the two hand cutouts on the side of the mirror box while leaning it again my stomach. The 10" should be a piece of cake I'm thinking. PS: if you can wait and save up the money the 12" would bring in a bit more detail on some of the fainter objects. As these things go, after a while a guy always wants to go deeper and wishes they had gotten a bigger dob. Not that the 10" is a bad choice. It's going to lighter and more compact than the 12" for sure. And at the end of the day the best scope is the one that's going to get used the most.
+Dakota Starry Nights
Is there a handle on the mirror box ?
+FK Orangina two cutouts; one on each side.
I think there is a generation 2 now of this telescope which is much better? Maybe you have to do a new test of that one? Seems only fair.
Nevertheless this is a great and honest review
Seems reasonable but I already have the UL-ES12 and just got a Hubble Optics UL16. (Did a review on that one too.) So it wouldn't make sense to spend more money on another UL-ES12. They don't give them to me. I buy them just like everybody else. This one I got from Optics Planet. Thanks for posting. Dakota
Wow, you really had issues with the scope... I must say that I got the exact same model this year (the packaging appeared to have come from the Netherlands originally), and apart from flimsy RDF and a particle inside secondary cage, I did not have any problems with it:
- my scope didn't have fiberglass over the aluminium on altitude wheels and at the bottom of the rocker box, seems to work very nicely and smooth
- I haven't noticed any rust (although I haven't done a thorough inspection)
- there are no rivets or altitude tension knob causing problems with altitude movement, nor any felt or anything like that inside the rocker box
- there was a battery box supplied with the scope
I moved the truss connector positions in the secondary cage to get a better angle for the focuser (as you described as the 3rd option), and it has worked rather well.
Why I'm saying this is that there really seems to be quite a bit of variation in quality and also apparently design of this particular scope model. Anyone contemplating getting one should probably carefully find out what kind of model that particular unit is. It seems I got a good one (and I've been quite happy with it).
+Ari Kesäniemi Glad to hear you made out ok. Like I said a guy might get lucky, like you, and not have any issues at all. I'm really happy with the dob now after working out the problems. But not everyone will want to, or can, fix it if they get a lemon. Thanks for posting. Clear Skies. Dakota
+Dakota Starry Nights Did you purchase the scope from the official Explore Scientific website or another seller? I plan to buy this scope from a different website since the main website is not in stock.. Hopefully I get a good model...
+boxcarjakey I got it from Optics Planet but they are out of stock now (11-24-2015) Telescopes.net has them in stock as of this writing.
+boxcarjakey I got it online from Optics Planet.
is it worth buying this over a CPC 800 XLT Celestron for more objects observation ?
Yes, jumping up 4 inches in aperture makes a noticeable difference. Going from a 10 to a 12 not as much but better.
Dakota Starry Nights really appreciate it, thanks
I notice a difference on deep sky jumping from a 10" to a 12". Globulars are much brighter.
Better late than never but there's some serious quality control issues with this scope. There's no excuse for rust in a telescope straight out of the box and that's even before other mechanical issues.
I just bought what I think (in 2020) is the 2020 version (mark 2) of this unit.
Great scope, really. In 2020 you got the V2. Congrats.
@@DakotaStarryNights Yeah my dealer says ES has taken the Gen 1 flaws to heart.
I do like the fact that these are SO simple that if there's something slightly amiss, I can probably shim it here and there with some felt or some teflon, or add my own counter weight or something, if I want. It's really "your scope" once you buy it.
Looks like Astronomy hobbyists are like the Amateur Radio hobbyists I know, in that they tend to be resourceful DIY'ers.
Best review i have ever seen on a dob. And this is the poor and a worst quality telescope i have ever seen. SHAME ON EXPLORE SCIENTIFIC. What are you taking money for if you cant even remove the shavings and all that. GSO from tiwan is far better.
Just received my 12" explore scientific. Few things to mention attaching the altitude bearing to the bottom wholes will cause friction on the inside of the box against the back of some screws, so go for the top whole. Once all assembled all parts were moving smoothly . First light came about the next day, collimation was a breeze and once the mirror cooled down the stars were tack sharp, impressed! The red dot finder went straight to the bin after failing misreabaly to see the stars through it's dim glass, very poor and flimsy. Like Dakota mentioned either rotate the cage or get a box to raise the scope as the EP angle is trying. Made in china but great design and really decent optics
Slim Loghmari I have a Celestron 8" telescope, is it worth getting this one for more clear sky ? and was yours also rusty ?
Ahmad Isa mine had no rust whatsoever, it's a fantastic telescope, my first views of the heavens was spectacular. I am really impressed with the optics. A lot of telescope for the price
Slim Loghmari oh thanks for telling me that, I am going to buy it within 2 days, did you have this swing offset also ?
Ahmad Isa nope all working in order the alt/Azimuth are smooth but one word of advise if you are observing in a lit area I advise you to get a shield or a heavy duty bin bag to stop the light hitting your secondary mirror as you will see the spiders in the eyepiece if no shielded
Slim Loghmari yeah I know what you mean, that's it I am going to buy it now, thanks
Is it a solid mirror or the honeycomb?
+Neal Kleinman Solid. I believe it's Sky-Watcher that's introducing the honeycomb type for their 18".
4:55 so? Ive seen 25$ pc cases without issues like that so im sure it can be done better on that.
In their defense I think that problem has been solved
What are some of the quality brands?
Actually Explore Scientific has upgraded this dob. Gen II is better. This review was on the first release. There is also Hubble Optics, Sky Watcher and Orion Telescopes in this price category. I do like the Sky Watcher collapsible dob compared to the standard offerings for portability. But the base can get heavy once you pass the 8" model for both Sky Watcher and Orion. Hubble Optics has about the lightest offerings weight wise. For those with deeper pockets and looking for a custom fit and even better quality, there's Obsession Telescopes, Lockwood Custom Optics and many others.
OMG Rust, Flakes of Aluminum rough looking... How Much does that cost with shipping?
It depends. They often have them on sale. As of now the 10" is on sale for $760 us and the 12" is $1500. These are Gen II dobs. Mine was a Gen I. The Gen II has reportedly been fixed. I know I got a lemon but I still wouldn't hesitate to recommend the ES ultra dobs due to the ease of transportation and the 10" is a good buy. If you want to get the most out of these light buckets you need to travel to a good dark site. That said, the Hubble Optics UL series is my preferred choice. Clear skies!
Rust like that is indicative of a product made in southeast asia under poor conditions...extreme high humidity and poor storage facilities leads to a lot of rusty metal products
Is this review of gen 1 or 2?
This was Gen 1. Gen 2, I've been told, has been improved. More about that in the description above. Season's greetings!
How are the optics compared. To all tbose expensive ones? Been looking for a bigger aperture than my edge 8. Was eyeing a 12in celestron dob but really want to see.galaxy spirals and not.sure 12.is.enough.
The optics on the sample I received was good; which is why I decided to keep it, even though ES offered to replace the dob after seeing this review. But these are built to meet a price point. So, your sample is likely not to be as good as the dobs going for thousands of dollars more. What really would make a difference, for any DSO with any telescope, is a good dark site. 💫
Thank you for your time man. I'm just confused cause I don't know if I would be able to tell the difference between looking through an Explorer scientific dab. Or one that costs thousands of dollars if I was used in the same televue eye piece
There are so many other factors that would effect the view, operator experience at an eyepiece, dark sky, atmospheric turbulence, collimation ect., that the average guy probably wouldn't notice any difference. But anyone of the above conditions being below average, you would notice the difference.
7 years later, this same telescope is now double the price and completely out of stock :(
I recently got the 2nd gen 16 inch, much better quality I think. Found NGC 281 among others in bortle 3 skies at first light.
The gen 2's are much better indeed. Nice capture under bortle 3, congrats!
Made without very good QC and I'd hate to see what Explore Scientific deemed was unacceptable. See holes that haven't been deburred, rusty welds and heavy grind marks tells me very likely poor welds. Full of metal chips and a focuser that has something rattling around. There is no excuse for rust with the inexpensive coatings available. I've had issues with some Explore Scientific products too and I don't know why they even bother to put their crummy red dot finders on, better off without it. Shouldn't have to "fix" the scope before using it even if it is cheap. I have a center-finder head for my Starrett tri-square and it makes checking the mirror center easy.
My mistake when I was a beginner was buying a cheap wobbly ES scope and mount, sent it back and joined my local Astronomy club something I should have done before buying anything. My club had scopes I could borrow plus going to meetings and outreaches I learned quite fast on what to buy plus it is always advantageous to try out a scope first.
They make tools to shave rivets and you can even shave scews with it if need be. Talk to an aircraft mechanic at your local airport.
Under 1k? The ES 12" now (in 2020) is $1800 :(
kudos for the review !
Easy collimation great. The rest, I would have returned the whole thing due to the rust. Unspotted mirror?!
If there occurred Brown rust, the material used is not aluminium. But this was proposed on the specification. This is a Skandal!
Forget about the telescope, from 0:42 to 0:56 and from 1:26 to 1:37, is that a fox, or a wolf, or a dog?
Wolf dog. Female.
Ultra light weight? 66 pounds? Budget telescope? $2000?
Times have changed. :)
Sorry to see you got such a shoddy level of quality on your scope. Did they remedy your issues at all?
At first I tried customer service but got no response. Then Scott
Roberts contacted me after seeing this video. He offered to replace it
and even thanked me for the in depth review. I understand that have
since addressed the issues I presented here. Since I fixed what was
wrong and thought the mirror was above average, which later proved to be
true, I told Scott I'd keep it instead. A bad mirror is something you
can't fix. And I got a real good one, so...