Tom Walker AKA Jonathan Pie on satire, freedom of speech and debating better
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 ก.ค. 2024
- Political satirist Tom Walker, best known for his viral comedy character Jonathan Pie, talks to Krishnan Guru-Murthy about the purpose behind his satire, why the left need to reclaim freedom of speech and how he’d change the world if given the chance.
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Awsome bloke. His free-speech rant outside the courts was legendary.
@Viktor Sligo But true
@Viktor Sligo legendary
But he doesn't believe in what he says as Jonathan pie.
@@SkandalouzStyle That's not at all what he said, "Steve".
That was the first Johnathan Pie video I ever watched and I’ve been hooked ever since!
He's a comedian who is taking on proper political discourse in a more mature manner than many of the talking heads wheels out for TV news spots. He raises excellent questions about identity politics and its regressive nature. Many a true word is said in jest.
Hellyers Well said!
I get all of my news from comedians.
They are more truthful than the corporate media
yeah sadly hes not a political leader lol.
Philip Donelan says a lot about the state of the current climate
AS a economic right winger i find Tom Walker is obviously someone of the left, but he is a left winger who thinks rather than repeats the party line and gets offended. I don't agree with all his politics, but by golly he is funny.
Walker is my kind of leftie. I admire his honesty and his refusal to conform.
@Reggie Cyde Uhm no.
@Edpistemic I dont think it's a refusal to conform. I think it's just the truth, or as the trump-voting idiots in the US would say 'he's telling it like it is'. Without their rightwing bullshit ofcourse ;)
@@feenstma Agreed. He does tell it like it is. But, these days, that is refusing to conform because there is such a pressure to tow the line on a lot of political correctness.
Too right, always.
22:28. I have been saying this for 2 years. Why is it that BREXIT and Trump happened? It's NOT because voters are racist or bigoted, it's because politicians failed to engage with millions of people for so long that the public simply wanted change. This is because Politicians are more aligned to Corporations and the Banks than they are the People who voted for them. Add to the pot an absolutely embarrassing Mainstream media and this helps explain how Trump and Brexit happened. Tom, I salute you.
And the American opposition and media seemed to have learn't nowt since 2016
Trump/Brexit happened b/c the Media is no longer a voice of the people, but of the govt or their political beliefs; and the Govt as you stated only works for their parties and the corporations that keep them in political power. I cannot speak in depth on Brexit, but for Trump, well that also happened b/c Hillary is seen as a terrible person and govt insider and corrupt to the core, Trump is seen as 2 of those three, but people were tired of the professional politician, its why Obama won, even though he was in congress it wasn't a lifetime. Trump was a political outsider, and, like his message or hate it, he wasn't trying to be poltical in what he was saying. He also went to the inner cities and the rust belt telling them he was going to work at getting their jobs back, or securing their jobs.
"People who voted for them". and who pay their wages!
Read Habermaas . . . not easy . . . but he explains and was explaining a long long time ago.
@Russ Hawkins - you egg. Reuters is owned by Thomson Reuters. Thomson Reuters is chaired by David Thomson who took over from his father.
But yeah . . . it's another Rothschilds conspiracy . . .
I agree with Pie about 40% of the time but this interview has shown how 'genuine' a human being Tom Walker is. This is the most refreshing interview I have seen for a long time. Long live freedom of speech.
It's kind of sad that freedom of speech only really exists in one country in the entire world, America. Even in Australia we have ""hate speech" laws.
@@delailama736 You should check out Europe man.
@@Blikmin Which countries in Europe don't have hate speech laws?
@@delailama736 every where has freedom of speech. You can say whatever you like when ever you want, to who ever you want.... That's not the same as being free from any consequences for that speech. You want to stand on a street corner and shout about how you think one ethnic group is the route of all the woes of the world then that's fine... But someone from that demographic might smack you in the mouth. Freedom of speed is a ridiculous notion, unless i physically gag you then you can always say what you like... Just not consequence free.
@@BowerBomB Your arguement is a little flawed. There's a difference between social consequences and legal consequences. Also, someone socking someone in the face for their opinion is against the law. Don't justify it.
We need the Tom Walkers of this world to hold up a mirror to the rest of us and challenge our thinking, regardless of our political leanings. So good Tom, keep it up.
Undoubtedly one of the most intelligent and genuine commentators of our time. Absolutely LOVE Jonathan Pie. The thinking person's Alan Partridge.
I think the atmosphere has turned rrrrrrrather sour.
Yup, as talented + intelligent as Stewart Lee - they both help us survive 13 yrs of #ERGToryCorruption
@@palomapepe1He's way more talented (and likeable) than Lee.
We need more leftie libertarians like Tom. Love his alter ego's rants. Has me in stitches but his points are so salient and spot on. Jonathan Pie talks way more sense than any real life political commentators. Big fan of your work Tom.
_'leftie libertarians'_ 🤨
Wow I haven't seen him out of character before. He's very engaging, charismatic, expressive and quite sexy :p
Yes, I too felt the same, he is so important to today's narrative, and he is so cute!
Jeez, keep 'em under your jumper, luv. ;-)
@Jay & Violent Mob ur not my real mom!
Ha!
"and quite sexy" haha, i was just thinking this.
Good dialogue. I’m a lefty as well, and I agree that freedom of speech is paramount.
Special Agent Kingston
Lefties who don't think freedom of speech is paramount, are not true lefties, but are in fact neoliberals masquerading as lefties, in the worse kind of political hypocrisy.
Identity politics, and dividing people against people, those things are precisely the opposite of left.
Genuine right and genuine left usually have something valuable to contribute or add to a debate,
the problem is with the technocratic centrists with no ideology whatsoever, that can only make policy based around think tanks and social engineering and agenda setting, those are the dangerous ones, and they must be stopped!
Howard Fisher
Exactly! A refreshing comment to read, thanks.
I'm a lefty too and the modern "left" disgusts me. Walker and Pie are my type of leftist.
I am a right winger and I agree with you 100% mate. Free speech is vital.
I'm left-leaning too and hold freedom of speech as one of the most important parts of our society.
I do however think many people need to take some time to develop an understanding of what freedom of speech is. We've never had *absolute* freedom of speech, like many seem to think - laws against harassment, abuse and breach of the peace have always been a thing and probably always will be. We do however have to work together to make sure those in power don't use those laws to silence the opposition.
Unfortunately it's an incredibly difficult thing to get right, especially as we are confronting one of the biggest changes in human history - the internet.
What an intelligent man, likeable and succinct. Been watching Pie vids since the start and always liked him and it's great to see the man behind Pie. Really impressed, least not because he can turn swearing off and on!
I'm a lefty...this guy is right. The identity politics is unhelpful and divisive.
Absolutely love this man! Keep helping us on the left spread the message of free speech - there's nowhere near enough of it from us nowadays
So none of the socialist governments of Britain between 1945-78 had freedom of speech? Are you sure you don't simply mean the left wing authoritarian governments of Mao, Lenin and Stalin?
"Leftism is built on group identity, group think and censorship". Eh, no. Nice try projecting everything you don't like on the political "side" you don't like.
Cameron Smith exactly. Do you think these people have ever looked at the actions and policies of the 1945-1951 Labour government. An openly socialist government that probably achieved the most of any in 20th century Britain.
Free speech has nothing to with "left" and "right" (which are already in itself quite meaningless, a simplification of the political spectrum so we can pick a "side" and can have a common enemy on the other "side"). Authoritarianism and censorship can be found and has existed in every political direction. Jonathan Pie/Tom Walker is a socialist and defends free speech, which is in no shape or form a contradiction. How do you even leave the left? It's not like "the left" or "the right" is an organization, group or party.
I don't think it's possible to have proper discourse, when somebody calls the side he disagrees with paedophiles. People really have a misconception what free speech means. Kanye is in no shape or form censored and can freely express his opinion. It's within the freedom of others to publicly disagree with his statements or even think them objectionable. That's not the same thing as saying he has not the right to express his opinion. Disagreement or thinking a statement is wrong and expressing that is not the same thing as oppressing speech. if this would be the case any kind of discussion would be oppression of speech. Oppression of free speech is getting prosecuted for having an unpopular opinion.
I'm a right winger and I love Pie.
Good for you
Me too. Love him so much, even when he is bashing the Tories, largely because I dislike them as well. Just find it odd really that people get so steamed up about what he says.
Well there are different kinds within the Labour Party and within the Conservative Party so a lot of Labour types aren't the stereotype and the same is true of Tories.
I like him attacking the Tories because under the right person I could vote for them but May is just terrible.
Equally there are plenty of lefties who are pissed off with some of the regressive crap.
I think that's why it works.
Steak & Kidney?
thats good dom
As a History and Politics teacher I've actually recommended some of your work to students and we all love and applaud you for it. ❤
Channel 4‽
😉
@@-xirx- No, he/she meant Jonathan Pie's videos on TH-cam.
I love Jonathan Pie and thought Tom Walker came across amazingly in this interview. What a legend and his character has managed to engage me into the world of politics. Bravo sir!
Tom, you are refreshingly sensible and you say what needs to be said, and heard! I'm delighted you created Jonathan to make us think and laugh - you deserve success, long may it continue.
Great interview. I liked that Krishnan didn't say: "So what you're saying is..." very often.
It's a tactic used by many people like him to make people think that what he is saying is true. Just watch the Jordan Peterson interview with Cathy Newman. Every scentence if prefaced with "So what you're saying is"...
I imagine Dom C was aware of this and hence used the phrase.
That's correct Mr Sixpence.
thats cos krishnan is actualy a good journalist
Dom C It's almost like Jordan Peterson is so vacuous in his statements, she had to try and paraphrase what he was saying (maybe badly) to get an actual statement from him. Not the best technique, but certainly better than letting him ramble on.
I'm a new fan of Tom Walker and his work as Jonathan Pie. You know someone is a great artist when you can basically imagine the character living on the actor but still knows how to flip the character's switch off when needed. Tom Walker's really an amazing artist. We need more performers and artists like him.
Had the feeling Tom Walker aka J. Pie was walking on a tightrope all the way through this interview. A very clever man indeed.
John Eskins ... and that 'nice' interviewer was subtly applying grease to parts of that rope.
Guru Murphy is notoriously disingenuous in interviews. Richard Ayoade and Robert Downey Jr demonstrated that well enough
@@142doddy Tarantino had a go at him aswell
Tom Walker the man who plays Jonathan pie is absolute genius is the nearest thing we've got to the late great Robin Williams in his attitude to politics.
I would love to see Tom Walker as an LBC presenter - great radio voice and grasp of current affairs + the satire might actually lighten the place up
Too right wing for Walker.
O'Brien wouldn't allow it.
Guru-Murthy considers the truth an "agenda". Says it all really.
It's productive to challenge the person your interviewing regardless of one's own beliefs. KGM doesn't have to be "anti-truth" to make that statement.
He is predicting the defeat of Labour and the Liberals in 2019 right here. Truly spot on.
Pie is a bridge between right and left. I can't think of any others. He seems like the lefts last chance before total capitulation. No debate means you concede defeat and that is the lefts stance on many issues.
Shuggy Thomas no debate? Just insults? Seems you prove my point. Thank you.
Maajid Nawaz is also a good bridge, on Islam
PraxeoLiberty is that the lbc radio host?
Ross Graver yes.
Used to be a big fan of Nawaaz but his attack on Tommy Robinson was uncalled for and it seems he's not been very honest about his past. But I'm not sure what he's trying to achieve if it's all some kind of ruse. He seems to be fighting the good fight.
I am probably centre right in my political thinking, but Tom Walker is 100 percent correct in saying that you don't win arguments by shouting racist am bigots at people . For what it is worth my views on certain issues have changed because someone of a complete political opinion then mine had a conversation as two adults. As soon as someone labels me a racist or bigot then they concrete my view and more importantly my vote to the opposite way they want me to.
Michael Yeovil Absolutely. As a left winger myself, I agree that the only way to win an argument is by having a rational conversation with them, as soon as it turns into a shouting match the original point of the debate is lost. It's just a shame that there are people on the left, right and centre who don't seem to like debate and instead want to silence opposition
I totally agree. I'm slightly left but the far-left idiots are mental (and, for the record, all authoritarians are evil twats). You don't get elected by alienating everyone to the right of Karl Marx, and that's what they seem intent on doing. Using the R-word is divisive and not persuasive. The extreme leftist authoritarians reject reason, science, common sense, and free speech, all things I believe to be of paramount importance.
Look at this! Right wing and left wing ideas are finally engaging in proper discussion!
Fucking finally
Indeed. The same can be said about some radical vegans. I had someone trying to "convert" me by accusing me and calling me a killer. I am open to eat less meat, but that made me angry.
It's so inspiring to have a true representative of the Thinking Left standing up to the Unthinking Left (or "perma-offended woke twats", as he calls them).
This guy single-handedly jolted me out of that regressive, divisive kind of thinking and partisan intolerance with his Trump video.
Bigot! Juuuuuus kidding.
Pie presents a brutally honest view on all news that crosses the screen/paper. Neither; Right, left or centrist just a solid opinion. Keep going Tommy Boy !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thomas Amos he's a lefty dude lol... he states it about twenty times in this video
All politics No economics i think they meant that people accross the political spectrum can agree with him
the RT story is fascinating and really shows the reality of living as an artist - well played old son.
Writing this years after this interview... The world doesn't actually get any better, but 'Jonothan Pie's' video's are so spot on, so articulate and so very helpful for us understanding all UK and overall madness🙃 X Lucie and Rogier from Amsterdam
Great interview. I'm stunned that Tom Walker is considered conservative by some. I thought he was 'common sense' left! And I'd never judge him on working for RT censorship free!! Wow, impressive.
It gives me hope to see someone genuine breakthrough and make it. Spent his 20s scrubbing it, skipping meals and doing rubbish jobs to pursue his goal, could've given up at any point and fell into a regular 9-5 but stuck at his craft.
Best of luck with everything mate.
I love how energetic and passionate he is about his work and freedom of speech. Love Jonathan Pie he speaks facts and one have to be brave these days to do it so.
One of the few ‘relevant’ voices in media today on either side of the isle/planet. Brash, outspoken, brilliantly laying it all out thread bare for us with language everyone else is too PC to even contemplate. Thank you Mr Pie for your courage and your humor as we desperately need both in these perilous times.
interesting that Russia Today are being talked about as a propaganda machine and yet they were the only ones who gave him editorial control
Not very interesting, actually. They still are a propaganda machine. And an awful one as such. This stuff is not binary. Not Pepsi or Coke. If you hate [insert your preferred media outlet], that doesn't make RT suddenly a less vile media outlet.
It was a good point, well made though.I wonder if any other media outlets would make him such an offer? Just out of curiosity Tobias, why do you find RT vile?
RT do good alternate coverage of world events. Its up to you to decide how biased they are about a particular topic, same as when viewing the BBC or other news.
@@siliconvalets8036 Completely agree. I find RT are one of the only media outlets who show you the most world wide media coverage. You just have to take it in knowing there is a slant towards Mother Russia. I like Russia today but I also read the DM, Guadian... its important to make your own opinion from multiple sources, whilst understanding what you are reading.
RT perform the role that Channel4 news used to many moons ago.
Count Dankula is appealing his conviction, has crowdfunded 100,000 pounds in a single day from 4,500 people. #FreeSpeech #FreeDankula
Olive Birdy no fucking way????? That is amazing! I imagine that a fantastic story like that will be all over the news and will be made into a Hollywood movie???? NOT!
P T I remember the father ted episode where ‘Ted’ looked like Hitler and looked like he was shouting out at a Chinese family..... very almost the same joke
Olive Birdy who cares his dog wasn't that funny
Over 150k now.
As we all know, the ability to raise money from an angry mob is the BEST proof of innocence.
I love this guys so much. Everything he says is exactly how I feel.
Debate, discuss, connect, communicate with one another, he's opening up our thinking, ThankYou Pie ❤
Intelligent, interesting and thoroughly engaging. I could listen to him talk for hours.
Regarding his accusers, they're always caught out when they try to debate someone who only speaks the truth. He understands exactly what he's doing when he writes Pie too. I share his ability to look at a news story or social situation from another angle and it really resonates with me and, judging by his popularity, many others.
Self made success story too?.. Long may it continue.
Great interview here, Tom seems a lot more coherent than previous interviews. I also read news/opinion from left and right sources and I would recommend it just as the video does!
This was brilliant. I have so much more respect for this dude after this. And I had a lot of respect before!!
Love it when you say "I'm not gonna write my stuff for stupid people".... Tom Walker, yes. Never give in!
Satire is absolutely required for keeping people sane! Thank you. Your work is like the fresh air coming in through a genuine window in the wall of self-congratulatory mirrors this suffocating culture has created. Freedom of speech and "listen to the guy you disagree with" warrior. If you don't listen to people, you can't persuade them to your argument!
Love him he says it like it is .holding a mirror in the face of society and politics .thank you Tim for this .your inadvertently providing a essential service doing what you do .
Great interview, trying to force him to say working with RT was a mistake was bad though, ultimately it gave him a platform to go where he is now and I'm glad the Pie defended his decision and even though he disagrees with them now it's a valuable part of his life
As Robert Downey Jr said about this interviewer, hes kind a of a schmuck.
Yeah, but Robert Downey Jr is an Americorn. Can't expect him to catch all the nuances.
Even so, highly disingenuous of Krishnan to try to get an apology for working at R.T. Didn't work. Typical of the feminard media though, all they want is apologies, then they know they've won. Like all arguments with women.
BBC, RT, state news.
@@agentjackstone3543 Takes one to know one.
Take home message: people don't want to debate and hear the other side; they just want to hear themselves.
Well said.
i met Tom and thanked him for Jonathan Pie. Don't have enough words as to how much his type of analysis is needed. thanks for this interview
This interview should be mandatory watching for all politicians, all students and anyone who likes debate or argument, and I love both. Great comments, well put, and fended the interviewer off like a pro.Top man
This was a terrific interview. As a Brexiteer and person of the right, I’m rightfully suspicious of Channel 4 content but I have to hand it to KGM in this instance, he did an excellent job. And Tom Walker is a wonderful breath of fresh air in the political sphere even though there’s much we wouldn’t agree on.
"As a Brexiteer" how's it feel to cut off your own nose to spite your own face?
My two fav people on TV. I am impressed with Pie/Tom - I wish more of us were able to bring more truth and debate and make people laugh at the same time. Thank you
This interview puts a totally different light on Johnathan Pie. It’s one that I find refreshing. Keep doing what you’re doing, dude. You have their schtick down pat. Kind of frightening that we live in this world where a comedian can come across as more trustworthy than the actual news. Speaks volumes. Whether you’re on the left or the right, he does make you think about the dichotomy of what’s being said vs. what’s being done. Excellent political satirist in a field that’s become far too politically correct. Don’t ever stop!
I was born in the late '60's.
My parents chose to move into a New Town in Washington in 1969. They'd moved from industrial Gateshead to a 4 bedroom 2 bathroom Council house that Harold Wilson's Government created. Down the street we had a GP, 4 doors away we had a Labour member of Parliament.
I was blessed with vision lead by a visionary Labour in the 60's and the '70's.
I met Harold Wilson in our Neighbours house when I was a little girl.
He was charming, interesting and interested in what my family thought about New Towns just like Washington New Town. I love my childhood. I love what Labour created in the late '60's early '70's.
Please can we have it again?
One of the most interesting and engaging 39.50 mins/secs I've had in a long time. Compelling viewing.
Would love to see Pie rant about western military intervention, russophobia, military-industrial complex. Big fan from India.
Wow... He's one of the most intelligent nice guys I've seen on such a TV/net programm... what a very cool guy! Possibly the best, most honest, clever interview I've seen in years.. (quite sad it took me over 4 years to see that)!
I would love to get to chat with him one day!
Thank you for doing it Channel 4..
And mostly, giving the time, for the philosophies of it all!
And remember, he's not a genius, he is just a very nice guy, a Man with the wisdom, and the humor, and the curiosity, and the brain, and the experience, and the will to talk... like so many of us could, but that never had the chance or will, to do it..!
From my side... wow! I am very very happy that Tom Walker exists and finally shows that there are some clear, interesting, clever minds to talk true in the UK, and indeed the world!
I will check more, about what he has to say these days!
I love his stuff. It's not just the content but the way he says it. He takes a serious subject, throws a tantrum about it but he makes it funny and entertaining at the same time.
Excellent interview, Tom is a star and Pie is so to the point, love it :)
Tom Walker is genuine, passionate and well spoken. Another slice of
pie please!
Love him 💕 we need more people like him to raise issues and show how it is. I don't believe anything that MSM tells me. Keep up the good work making us laugh at how stupid we have got.☮️🙏🌟
God the interviewer is not ready to accept the flaws within the mainstream media, that unfortunately is universally true.
These are great. Amazing that news channels are now switching to the podcast format!
Mcconartist 123 Mc I agree! I think KGM does a good job of challenging and allowing him to speak also. Props to c4 who have been interviewing interesting people in long format - from Hitchens and Peterson to Varoufakis and Zizek for well over a year. They can't be accused of not stepping outside their bubble
This guy is doing some phenomenal work...
Excellent interview. Pie has gained so much recognition in such a short period of time. I am glad I found him when he had no more than a few hundreds subscribers. He is quite something...
Mr. Walker echos my political stances almost perfectly. Well spoken.
Please, please can we have these two talking together again? Soon? Superb pairing, balanced, no shouty, mouthy stuff. Wonderful.
I was there from the beginning seeing Tom as Pie. He's a Great Guy.. I love what he does. At first I thought he was really going off. Lol. Love your work man.
That was time worth spending to get to know all about this character, I congratulate you sir👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
Extremely happy things worked out for Tom Walker! I really enjoy his rants.
Extremely good interview. Kudos to the host.
I would love to see Tom's take on Shakespeare.
If only Krishnan had said at the end "OK, who's for a pint"
Awesome interview! I'm a left wing, corbyn voting, gay man, labour member and I completely agree that freedom of speech is a necessary core value of a functioning democracy. People have to be able to voice their opinions and point of views, so that a descution can take place. Shutting someone up because you currently think their wrong completely kills the chance of any useful discussion.
Loved this interview, even though it's 2 years later. Good job Krishnan Guru-Murthy and well done Tom Walker.
I didn't mean to see this, TH-cam brought it randomly after another video. I'm very glad to have seen this. He's made enough valid points and helped me understand, I was one of the stupid ones. Would love to thank him so here it is. Thanks. I can't believe how relatable to life he is. I appreciate his truths with RT.
Lord this interviewer is proving Tom's points in real time. Actually trying to spin a preferred response and narrative out of him in the same minute as being told about how disingenuous the 'media' is.
7:30 Being a straight, white male myself, I suffer the exact same prejudice. I'm automatically assumed to be a bigoted Trump voter. This is what's wrong with political discussion today. It's all about leaping to conclusions instead of finding answers.
Are you a trump fan
What an excellent interview ! Keep doing what you're doing......BOTH of you !! Information is King !
Thanks for this. I wanted to hear what he was really like, and what the process is. Nice.
Love what he said about Blair. The first time I saw Blair on tv my immediate thought was that I don't trust that man. It was instantaneous. Nice to know I wasn't alone.
I like how one of the most articulate political interviews I've seen in recent times is with a satirist. Although admittedly I'm not surprised in the slightest.
Saw him live and have to say nobody else out there is holding up the mirror !! he is a clever and intelligent comedian
Whenever I am wondering how on earth this or that could have happened (Trump? People voting for Brexit ? politicians misbehaving etc etc) I look for Jonathan Pie. He never fails me.
I always feel better after listening to him.
Great that he can say what a lot would like to.
Cool guy. I really like him, and it's a heroic struggle he's taken on
I waited a long time for this type of satire. Love the man. Will hope to see his live stage show in October.
Great interview, few questions with the right amount of time to answer, amazing :)
Nice job, Krishnan Guru-Murthy. Faith in journalistic interviewing, restored. Cathy Newman had basically killed my hope until I saw this 40 min discussion, so thank you!
As a right leaning supporter I find Pie funny! But I do understand that he and his character are lefties.
His character is NOT a leftie. Listen to what the man says (and has said).
His character is a centrist
Supporting Jeremy Corbyn, calling New Labour right-wing, wanting to boost public spending in everything, and raise taxes is centrist now?
Elwin Owen
New Labour, neoliberals are conservative though.
wow Jeff Taylor I'm a subscriber of yours :)
My goodness Tom. How far you have come and how right you are.
Very revealing & honest What a breath of fresh air ,
Just admit it, Tom.....Johnatan Pie is purely therapeutic 🤣🤣 I love that character.
What an interesting and likeable chap!
Great interview! Tom's points of view on all the topics discussed are pretty solid in my opinion; his thoughts on freedom of speech in particular strike a chord with me.
You know, Tom is a *comedian*, but he (as well as Pie) is just so RIGHT about so many of these issues. The first of his work I ever saw was the one in his "studio" the day after Trump was elected. The opening bits were good, but when he got into the main meat, about the need to *engage* in real debate with the people who disagree with you, rather than slap a convenient label on them, I felt like standing up and CHEERING. I go back every couple of months and watch that video again - it's just too good and too spot on.
Tom, you're doing a fantastic job - keep it up!
I loved how he stood his ground saying it was not a mistake to work for RT.
36:55 Oh boy, he was fishing that sound bite, and you didn't bite it. Good job.
That was great insight into his character - Tom Walker is a gem!
I love your skits! So wonderful, thought provocing. Love debating. Seems a lost art. People take things very seriously. Word Rage! They seem to misunderstand words and phrases. And get angry, instead of asking, 'What did you mean, sorry I may have misunderdtood what you said. Great success with your career & family. ♥️🍾
The point of Pie is the point of all comedians - The truth.
When Tom talks about the pay gap - and says he argued using 'facts', and Mr Guru-Murthy says "You're undermining the whole case around gender pay... they finally have some figures to take to their employers...."
Tom replies "And all I'm doing is pointing out they're disingenuous".
THAT IS THE ISSUE. RIGHT THERE.
If people make arguments using facts; sorted. If you make an argument using "not-facts", and people point out that they are not facts, you can't win the argument by 'then' playing "Well, you're a straight white male".
When you ask Tom "Are you less left-wing now?" - it's a question I often reflect on. As he says, as someone who's pro NHS and a Labour voter, I do ask myself, often, am I still left-wing. For me, anyway. I don't see how "believing in debate and freedom of speech" is not a left-wing issue.
If it is no longer a left-wing issue, then yes - I'm less left-wing now.
In fairness to Gurumurthy he's playing devils advocate which is what a good interviewer should be doing, Cathy Newman was was purposely misunderstanding and taking Peterson out of context
In answer to the question "are you less left wing now?" - I don't think I am, personally, but I think the aim left wing conversations are moving even farther left than me. I've stayed in relatively the same place.
One good thing about online, text-based political debates on forums or even in TH-cam comments is that sometimes I'm given a notification to a comment I made 4 years ago, when I thought of myself as about as left as a person could get - and my views were still very much the same. Yet now I feel more like I need to self-identify as a centrist, because the most prominent left wing conversations are pretty radical.
I have long been an advocate for criticising your own side. We need to be better than them, and you win an argument with the truth, not lies*
*okay, that's not always true, but it makes your position unassailable from a rational debate context, rather than a frothing Daily Mail headline one
I... will agree that a good interviewer should be playing devils advocate. And I'll defer to you, and hope that was Mr Guru-Murthy's intention.
I'm not 100% convinced I believe it. But I'd like to. ;^)
Facts are important, as long as you're presenting all the facts and not just the ones that support your own argument. I think that should apply to everyone, whatever your politics.
My only problem with the argument about free speech is this myth that speech doesn't have consequences, which it objectively does have. I'm not talking being politically incorrect, which I don't really care about. I mean people who hide behind free speech whilst spreading hatred and misinformation and covertly encouraging others to commit violence.
I don't know where you draw the line with that.
Absolutely brilliant, true British journalism & humour.
So much respect for you and your work. plus a real value of Channel 4 realised