Oh man. Lots of pop science and popular misconception in this one. 0:38 Treated wool, particularly treated merino, works as a wicking layer because of the way it is commonly chemically treated, which strips the vast majority of the lanolin from the material. In other words, it is not naturally wicking. 0:50 Wool will absolutely feel damp or clammy once it has absorbed 30% of its weight in water; this is one of its big drawbacks, that it retains so much water compared to nylon (8%) or polyesters (~1%). 0:55 An even bigger misconception is that wool produces heat as it dries -- so many merino wool companies eagerly spread this one, but it isn't true. This idea is only popular because wool maintains a greater percentage of its dry clo at a given level of saturation, compared to synthetics. In other words, it will keep you warmer when wet than it would if you were wearing an identical synthetic baselayer with a comparable level of saturation. This has nothing to do with "breaking up" hydrogen bonds. 1:03 Wool is not technically "antimicrobial." We perceive it that way because the bacteria that thrive on wool are less odorous than bacteria which thrive on synthetics. Technically speaking, the only baselayer material that is antimicrobial, i.e. bacteria do not grown on it in lab tests, is rayon / viscose. The part about not hiking in down is great advice.
Maxwell, I found this comment to be particularly insightful. Do you happen to have any knowledge on fishnet base layers and alpaca wool as an alternative to merino wool which tends to be highly processed?
Interesting about rayon. Tencel is basically the same stuff albeit with a less environmentally concerning production method. So a wool/tencel mix could outperform straight merino in odour?
@@seankelleher4222 Potentially, but merino is very effective at reducing microbial odor by itself. A rayon blend could be useful for some specific purposes, but I'm struggling to understand which ones you would be targeting.
@@kadencampbell4425 Hey Kevin. I'm not sure what you're asking here -- most alpaca layers are processed using similar methods to merino, with the exception of Arms of Andes, which purposefully tries to minimize chemical solvents and harsh chlorinated / peroxidal processing techniques in production (as far as I know, there could be other companies doing this). There are companies which process merino wool in ways which are more enviornmentally friendly, and which retain more of the natural lanolin that contributes to its odor-neutralizing ability, such as Duckworth. I'm not sure I would call them a performance outdoor apparel brand, but some of their clothing is suited for that kind of thing. As far as fishnet base layers -- I'm also a little confused here as to what you're asking. I've seen fishnet layers produced out of nylon, merino blends, polyester, and polypropylene. Are you wondering which fishnet options are minimally processed? Or are you trying to figure out which fishnet options have the best performance characteristics for a particular purpose?
@@maxwellerickson7066 a number of very light “sun shirt” merinos like Icebreaker Cool lite and Wilderness Wear Cool Merino already have 30-50% tencel for strength.
There have been so many videos about layers and I have watched a disturbing amount of videos on this topic from backpackers, hikers, mushers, bushcrafters, etc. You are the FIRST to fully explain what is the ideal layers to use and WHERE as well as WHY. Easy to understand, right to the point, explaining weight, water retention, insulation properties when wet, compression, etc. I am sure others have hit all these points, but the way you executed it in this video made it easy to understand and quick to take home notes on the topic.
The latest thing I've heard about is using mesh as a base layer because it's even better at getting water away from the skin and allowing air to dry off, plus the gaps in the mesh allow the layer above it to trap air pockets for a better warmth to weight ratio than other base layers. I've tried it with a cheap mesh shirt I bought on Amazon and my initial impression is that it works as advertised. I haven't had the chance to test it out on a strenuous hike in below-freezing weather yet, though.
I recently got some Norwegian polypropylene mesh baselayer garments and have found that they keep my body temperature at a more middling level. When I'm active the water vapor that leaves my body goes straight through to the next layer so cooling is better. When I stop and would normally get cold, I stop sweating and the air in the gaps in the mesh acts as a good insulator. Cooler when active, not clammy when stopped. This is in temps around 30F to 50F and high humidity. (NZ alpine spring-summer-fall environment, it hasn't been winter since I got them.) They don't not soak up water; I can put on the garments straight out of the washing machine. They have no anti-stink treatment so they get washed often. The polypropylene is at least as comfortable as merino to me (I prefer cotton to everything else including silk, but that's just me. Merino is bearable when I'm outdoors.)
1933 a Norwegian army captain made the first one, not quite new. 40-50 years ago lots people wore string vests in the UK (unfortunately it would be often on show in the summer time as if this made them still decent) and perhaps people still do. Perhaps a string vest or the modern equivalent with a fleece could work well, fleece agains skin is clammy (hence normally used as a mid layer) but the string vest would keep the fleece off the skin.
If it gets really really cold outside, you should wear a mesh as the inner layer. A mesh made either by Merino wool or Polypropylene. Brynje of Norway is a brand that excels in making meshes like these, and they are widely used by mountain climbers and arctic explorers to stay warm and dry in extreme conditions. First on the next layer, meaning on the outside of the mesh, should you wear a solid merino wool sweater. Greetings from the cold North of Norway, winters here can be quite chilly.
I agree. Poly fibers retain little moisture so a poly mesh base layer means that your sweat will not collect against your skin. Your mid layers should be wool so that your sweat is drawn out of the poly base layer and into the wool mid-layers. As the wool becomes saturated, its insulative capacity decreases. Therefore, as you sweat, the insulative capacity of your clothing decreases and you cool down. Alternatively, Once you stop sweating, the wool mid-layers begin to dry out and their insulative capacity increases, allowing you to stay comfortably warm.
Thank you for the link. I age 77 and I enjoy your posts. My comment was not intended to question your statement that wool can raise the temperature but, as the article you sent me stated, it is heated by the metabolism of the bacteria not by dissociation of water. I probably should not be so picky but after teaching physics and chemistry for 30 years I sometimes can’t help myself! I was not aware of that external warming from wool (teaching science is mostly teaching theory - not practical applications! I hiked the John Muir trail at age 73 and hope to tackle the Arizona trail in 2025 so I need all hiking tips I can get. Thank you for your work!
I think the bit about wool changing water into its component atoms was a brainstorm by a wool clothing company’s marketing department. And sales people will spin any ridiculous idea if it sounds cool to them. Turning liquid water into its gaseous state doesn’t change the water molecule, heat just causes water molecules to spread out which allows the molecules to lose their ability to attract a molecule and allows them to rise into the air and disperse. I wore a SW 150 layer under a Columbia fleece vest in an airport and was sweating profusely as I made my way to the gate to wait. When I got out of the seat, the seat back had a visible layer of moisture on it, but my fleece and wool were less than damp. First time I really got to see how well these layers worked at allowing moisture out.
It's a misrepresentation of the actual science. The inner structure of a wool fiber temporarily adsorbs water molecules through hydrogen bonding, and this releases heat (adsorption is always exothermic). It cools by a reversal of the same process and release of the water molecule (which is never split into hydrogen and oxygen). Wool doesn't change the state of water - in fact because the outer shell of a wool fiber is hydrophobic only water vapour can enter the inner cortex to be adsorbed (having a hydrophobic shell and hydrophilic inner core is one of wool's critical characteristics).
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process. As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester. Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool: mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20) www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619 www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
Yeah. 20+ years (including 10 as a product trainer for REI) in the outdoor industry and Im gonna need to see data that wool a) generates heat when drying? and b) creates a chemical reaction? I was trained that your body heat forces the moisture vapor away from you, which then sits on the wool fibers so it can evaporate. I love this channel, but im not buying it. If wool generates heat while drying, then I should be able to soak a pair of wool socks. leave them on my counter and use an infra red thermometer to measure the heat.... Right?
Here you go: www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00288233.1960.10419304 I also tested this myself as I had always heard it but wanted to know. I had a wool sock, synthetic sock and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees colder than the ambient air. The control sock was 1 degree warmer than the ambient air. Nothing beats a dry sock but my test did seem to confirm wool could generate small amounts of heat as it’s drying. In the end I didn’t include this test in the video because it was going to take up a fair amount of the video and I didn’t think it was interesting enough.
That is the exact combination that I wear. I wear a wool short sleeve shirt, then fleece long sleeve shirt and finally a down/fiberfill vest. What I really miss for winter sports are wool knickers. They are, were, the best breathable, warm, water resistant wear for winter sports. Too bad no one makes them anymore.
@@KnittedSchnauzer atleast in europe its quite easy and common to find wool outerwear. I personally own 2, Varusteleka wool blanket hoodie and then one a tailor made for me from old ww2 wool blanket. Pricey yes, but lasts forever and more.
During winter I deal with -20f with winds at times for hours on end with on and off walking. 1 I wear running t shirt and leggings (synthetic) designed to wick away sweat and dry fast 2 wool baselayer, then 3 this is the mix up for pants I wear Belay pants (down pants) relativaly tight wool sweater that’s a mid layer. 4 I wear a down jacket 5 I wear waxed pants or ski pants and my jacket is either a waxed jacket or a rain jacket. My socks is a thin silk sock then a heavy wool blended knee high sock that is between my down pants and wool baselayer. Or I wear my regular heavy hiking socks and a thick hand knitted wool leg wrap that goes below my foot and up to my knees covering over my pants (pants tucked into) I wear a wool beanie until I heat up and switch to fleece earmuffs and I wear a buff around my face and gloves can vary due to task I’m doing. If I heat up I take off whatever layer in under my outermost layer for chest and legs. Super comfy to wear on a couple day hike aswell and I can hop into my sleeping bag that’s 100% not designed for freezing temps. Only downside is I need to take off boots for down slippers. I’ve noticed only thing I need to change and wash is the silk socks my running tights and shirt that’s against my skin. Everything else maybe get a little smell but nothing noteworthy.
I have a half a dozen of the Eddie Bauer jackets and in every single situation they are perfect they are all down jackets from 650 fill power up to 800 fill power with a 90/10 split snow storms ice 🧊 is not a problem I am researching if wool is just as good but running out of cold weather but hopefully next year I can buy some mid layers and start from there 😊
@MyLifeOutdoors As you like experimenting, how about test in an old-times string vest to see its performance in hot and cold as a baselayer? Interesting to see how it compares with merino wool (and in price). If you can summit Everest in a string vest and an overshirt...
Sadly though, the fleece is not good for the enviroment and will shed when washed and bring micro plast into the water. I prefer wool as a midlayer too
I wouldn’t take wool or down anything on a multi day activity far from help. Both will perform worse if disaster strikes and you and your gear get soaked. Polyester fleece and a synthetic puffy will dry quicker and keep you warmer when wet than the former - they do better if you have to wring water out of them too. I love wool and wear it all the time for day trips and travel though.
If its really cold fleece midlayer can be changed out with another smaller puffy coat. I got a 100$ synthetic one I can hike in while its snowing or sleep in. Then in camp use your packed down jacket ontop of it.
I would love to see a video about the Icelandic popular fishnets baselayer. I’ve heard a little about it but have no idea how it holds up in the field.
I would like to see that video as well. I have not used it. Wool on my direct skin. Make me want to crawl out of my skin. So yes please show a video on alternative. Thank you
This is great. I'm not arguing, just want to tell you that the best base layer I've used, much better than merino wool, is Alpaca Wool. Appalachian Gear Company Alpaca Sun Hoodie and 8020 Long Sleeve Tee are the best base layers I've ever used - and I've tested a lot. Keep the great videos coming!
This was a great video. Gave me an idea... what if the fleece garment had wool (preferably alpaca) in the armpits? Then you'd get the lightness of fleece PLUS really good odor control where it counts. Garment companies... why not mix-media your garments?
This was really helpful. I appreciate the studies you linked as well. There will forever be debates on which is best for what, but this gives an excellent idea on layering and what may be best to try. Is the wool baselayer good for summer as well or would you recommend moving to a synthetic like poly or something like it?
Would love to hear your perspective on two other clothing technologies being used as part of a layered system: mesh base layers (e.g. Brynje) and Alpha Direct. Function and use cases would be interesting to hear about on the channel.
Best method is to control your body temperature. Too hot you sweat, which is a waste of energy and extra weight in water that you have to carry. The moment you start to exercise take your hat off and put it under the mid layer. When you stop put the warm hat on. Try to not sweat, get used to feeling a bit cold.
I started hiking in the mountains in around 0F conditions with pretty strong winds and active elevation gains and drops during the day. What can I say - wool base layers are absolutely useless in this case. Just because it dries for a very long time. In such conditions, the intensity of your load is constantly changing, the release of your heat is changing, the force of the wind around you is changing, everything very dynamic. And it is the dry base layer that ensures the comfort of movement during the day. Brynje Super Thermo or X-Bionic Energy Accumulator base layers works best, not wool. Also, any hardshell - useless for moving like this. You need breathable softshell and carry hardshell only to worn in case when wind over 20-30 mph
I enjoy the channel, but would highly recommend editing the section about wool because the chemistry is highly inaccurate. The water molecules are not decomposed or broken down. The heating and cooling properties of wool are down to how the water vaporizes and condenses, changing state (ie. gas or liquid) not chemical form.
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process. As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester. Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool: mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20) www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619 www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
@@MyLifeOutdoors I appreciate you following up with my and others comments! To be clear, I never thought you were trying to deceive us, just thought you made a mistake (as we all do). As for the chemistry (and, for reference, I am a chemist), I can believe that wool and specific types of wool are better at keeping us warm, it was just that the chemical mechanism you described sounded highly suspicious. No worries, though, I'm glad to see you trying to correct and get things right. I enjoy your videos and have learned a lot over the years. Cheers
Depends on the wool and clothing item. I have a homespun thick cable knitted wool vest I can hardly even wear, down is cooler! Water actually beads on the vest. Now this is nothing like the high tech wool you’re discussing here for a base layer, but it’s incredibly insulating even in wet (ocean fishing/boating) environments
wool - fleece - down. I would definitely include felt. I had pure felt boots (great) and still have my felt pants and a coat. There is a reason why it's used for generations.
What?! I love your videos but not the chemistry. You say wool chemically dissociates water into hydrogen and oxygen and produces heat? The chemistry I learned says this dissociation of water requires energy and that would cool the surroundings not heat them. Can you refer me to a source that claims wool has the ability to electrolyze water?
@@leahheffernan4644 This is only a problem for non outdoor people where the jargon gets mixed-up. Puffy jackets can have different filling like fluffy polyester or thin thread like balls/ clumps of polyester instead of the down in down jackets. That is why he specifically mentions down jackets. As down only has this great warmth to weight performance. Where poly filled puffy jackets only mimic the look and even come way short in warmth to weight & compression. And he clearly addressed that a poly fleece is named 'fleece' after wool fleece as it was intended to replace wool for that purpose. Again brands just muddying the waters with terms.
I highly doubt that wool breaks down the hydrogen in the water. Fluid Water in the fabric evaporates as a whole molecule and contains, just as before, two Hydrogens and one Oxygen. This process leads to evaporative cooling. The Bond between Oxygen and Hydrogen is extremely strong, this is why it is so energy intensive to pruduce fluid Hydrogen using electrolysis. So, even if wool was able to break down the hydrogen, it would take massive amounts of energy (heat), rather than producing any of it. But I can still agree on your message that wool performs good when it is wet 👍
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process. As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester. Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool: mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20) www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619 www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
a few questionable statements 1. wool is not really good at transporting moisture, at least not merino wool - it tends to hold on to moisture, which is its natural capacity, couples with lanolin oil, is a great property, we wash off the lanolin oil (which is the main reason wool can generate heat) and most of these properties are lost. Also the generation heat part, it takes a pretty good amount to actually produce some heat (and the loss of heat due to loss to moisture would be larger) in general you dont really want the process of heat creation, as of consumes material - which on a sheep which makes new wool all the time, is not an issue, in your baselayer, well :) big fan of wool here, but it has its limitation, and as a baselayer i prefer i in a mesh structure and/or a blend of other natural fibres (tencel) or synthetics, gives much better moisture transfer and durability
A weird question but how much of this applies when not active? Do people just buy 1 bulky northface/canada goose jacket and call it quits? Or can you apply this logic to just walking around shop hopping in cold wintery cities?
Is gore-tex still worth it as a shell material? A motorcycle channel called Fortnine seems to think it’s now an overpriced rip-off, so what’s your view?
You nearly froze to death recently, so I think you might not be qualified to speak about layering. Using wool or not depends very much about how much you are sweating / how intense your movement is. It's best for slower moving activities where you won't sweat much. Best layering would be a synthetic (or wool if not so intense activity) mesh base layer, then either a wool mid layer or some sort of grid fleece, then (if you need it) whatever shell or insulation is appropriate (synthetic, down, waterproof, windproof etc). Also always carry a good, warm hat, and use appropriate socks. Merino is better for socks as feet sweat less, but if they do get wet in a downpour or water crossing etc, then they will not make your feet freeze.
There is no such thing like this alleged chemical reaction breaking down water and generating heat in wool. When wool is drying on your body the evaporation of the water is drawing heat energy from your body making you feel cold. That is also the purpose of sweating - cooling your body.
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process. As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester. Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool: mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20) www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619 www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
@@MyLifeOutdoors I should have written ”stop it with the bond breaking” and not ”self heating/bond breaking” as the heat of sorption is a real thing! I scrolled through the articles you linked and did a 10 minute google dance which resulted in me (being a test enginner who has worked a bit with precise heat measuring/calorimetry) forming this opinion: Outside of the lab all fibers are the same in regard to ”creating” (and ”loosing”) heat unless proved differently with *very* good arguments. The differences are miniscule. Thank you for caring!!!!
There are some synthetic down subsitutes now that outperform all but 900FP down on warmth to weight scales... and they don't require killing geese to make... but they are petroleum based (sigh - it's always something) For example, my EE Torrid (synthetic) is every bit as warm as my Mountain Whisperer (down) and just a tiny fraction of an ounce heavier for the entire jacket, and it's every bit as packable.... but the synthetic will never wet out no matter how long it's been since a treatment, so easy win for the synthetic there.
To gain the resources that allows you to live someone has to kill animals or destroyed they habitat in some regards. If you really want to lower the impact, become a farmer. Animals die during farming plants as well. Either directly or by taking out the habitat. I come from a farmer family, seen how uneducated vegetarians are. It sickens me as they don’t actually care about environment or the habitat for animals.
Love to hear more about this chemical reaction that "produces heat as it dries" by "breaking-down hydrogen in the water, generating a chemical reaction that produces heat?" With a nice animation showing hydrogen breaking its bonds with Oxygen and disappearing. Very convincing. And stated so authoritatively. A revolutionary concept, since when hydrogen combines with oxygen to produce water it is so exothermic (producing heat). Now that you've found a process that also produces heat when breaking the hydrogen bond from oxygen, it would seems perpetual energy's been discovered. We must notify the Nobel-Prize Committee. (more...) And of course if you were to claim misstatement, that you didn't mean to suggest breaking molecular bonds, rather merely a change-of-state (water to vapor), then there may also be a Nobel prize in your future, since everyone knows it requires heat to cause water to turn to vapor and producing water vapor always cools the subject. It's the whole basis of sweating. Body produces sweat. Sweat turns to vapor, thus cooling the body. Your new discovery, which is the exact opposite, is surely worth a Nobel Prize? After all, if one can both gain heat and lose heat from producing steam, then perpetual-motion has finally been discovered! Great job.
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process. As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester. Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool: mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20) www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619 www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
@@MyLifeOutdoors - A valiant attempt. There are substances that heat when wet, however they consume material(s). Hot hands, for example contain iron and salt that heat by 'rusting' when exposed to air and heat faster in higher humidity; however water is neither created nor lost in the process and iron is consumed. Can we agree wool is neither created nor lost when wet? That leaves the two processes of adsorption, neither purporting to require a person's heat generation. The two processes are 1) vapor-to-liquid adsorption, 2) liquid adsorption, both rapidly achieving equilibrium. (more...) Equilibrium meaning any small heating effect of adsorption is soon counterbalanced by corresponding cooling effect of evaporation. If wool starts in a 0% humidity environment (say, in an otherwise sealed box) and is suddenly exposed to 20% humid air, the wool may adsorb moisture and thus temporarily slightly warm until it reaches equilibrium by evaporating an equal amount as it adsorbs. This period of time might be measured in an experiment with wool in an isolated box, for example and any temperature effect might be expected to reach equilibrium in a matter of seconds (e.g. less than a hundred seconds?). However, one might be expecting to wear wool for hours, not seconds. Same with liquid adsorption, with any thermic effect attenuated by the increased mass of liquid water. In other words, any tiny thermic adsorption effect is fleeting, because equilibrium occurs within seconds. And equilibrium means that continuing a constant humidity or 'wetted' state doesn't generate any net heat. Once equilibrium is achieved, any heat from new water being adsorbed is balanced by that heat being evaporated or conducted away. Returning to our experiment of wool in a box, the wool can not and will not generate heat on its own after those first few seconds. Otherwise, wool in a cardboard box in one's closet would eventually combust into flames (being able to adsorb moisture, but also being self-insulating). However such adsorption events never occur, otherwise half the homes storing wool sweaters over the summer would be burned to the ground. As noted in original-post, these misguided notions all lead to perpetual-motion rabbit-holes. So far this is for wool alone, without a body sourcing heat energy into the wool, however the body's heat engine does not work in favor of adsorptive heating theories, since body heat only serves to increase evaporation and body-heat dominates any tiny and temporary heating by adsorption.
Ngl this guys whole channel is just designed to make you buy stuff from his sponsers and if not that then buy gear you don’t need. Once you see it Youl hate this guy. + he’s just not right at all this time
So, you covered some great things...but what about the synthetic down jackets that aren't as heavy as a "puffy" but really are closer to something like fleece. Outdoor Vitals Ventus or their Jacket Arc'Teryx Proton Hoody Patagonia Nano Air or Patagonia Nano Air Light Hybrid (fleece / synthetic hybrid) and so many others that use things like primaloft silver/gold or proprietary insulation My personal favorite is the Patagonia...but i'm just curious if you could cover something like these in-between jackets
Wool Base Layer: geni.us/iL0Cc
Down Jacket: geni.us/K9tmV
Fleece: geni.us/na67aH6
Use Code: MLOSG20 for 20% off SkyGoat Hoodies
Oh man. Lots of pop science and popular misconception in this one.
0:38
Treated wool, particularly treated merino, works as a wicking layer because of the way it is commonly chemically treated, which strips the vast majority of the lanolin from the material. In other words, it is not naturally wicking.
0:50
Wool will absolutely feel damp or clammy once it has absorbed 30% of its weight in water; this is one of its big drawbacks, that it retains so much water compared to nylon (8%) or polyesters (~1%).
0:55
An even bigger misconception is that wool produces heat as it dries -- so many merino wool companies eagerly spread this one, but it isn't true. This idea is only popular because wool maintains a greater percentage of its dry clo at a given level of saturation, compared to synthetics. In other words, it will keep you warmer when wet than it would if you were wearing an identical synthetic baselayer with a comparable level of saturation. This has nothing to do with "breaking up" hydrogen bonds.
1:03
Wool is not technically "antimicrobial." We perceive it that way because the bacteria that thrive on wool are less odorous than bacteria which thrive on synthetics. Technically speaking, the only baselayer material that is antimicrobial, i.e. bacteria do not grown on it in lab tests, is rayon / viscose.
The part about not hiking in down is great advice.
Maxwell, I found this comment to be particularly insightful. Do you happen to have any knowledge on fishnet base layers and alpaca wool as an alternative to merino wool which tends to be highly processed?
Interesting about rayon. Tencel is basically the same stuff albeit with a less environmentally concerning production method. So a wool/tencel mix could outperform straight merino in odour?
@@seankelleher4222 Potentially, but merino is very effective at reducing microbial odor by itself. A rayon blend could be useful for some specific purposes, but I'm struggling to understand which ones you would be targeting.
@@kadencampbell4425 Hey Kevin. I'm not sure what you're asking here -- most alpaca layers are processed using similar methods to merino, with the exception of Arms of Andes, which purposefully tries to minimize chemical solvents and harsh chlorinated / peroxidal processing techniques in production (as far as I know, there could be other companies doing this).
There are companies which process merino wool in ways which are more enviornmentally friendly, and which retain more of the natural lanolin that contributes to its odor-neutralizing ability, such as Duckworth. I'm not sure I would call them a performance outdoor apparel brand, but some of their clothing is suited for that kind of thing.
As far as fishnet base layers -- I'm also a little confused here as to what you're asking. I've seen fishnet layers produced out of nylon, merino blends, polyester, and polypropylene. Are you wondering which fishnet options are minimally processed? Or are you trying to figure out which fishnet options have the best performance characteristics for a particular purpose?
@@maxwellerickson7066 a number of very light “sun shirt” merinos like Icebreaker Cool lite and Wilderness Wear Cool Merino already have 30-50% tencel for strength.
There have been so many videos about layers and I have watched a disturbing amount of videos on this topic from backpackers, hikers, mushers, bushcrafters, etc.
You are the FIRST to fully explain what is the ideal layers to use and WHERE as well as WHY. Easy to understand, right to the point, explaining weight, water retention, insulation properties when wet, compression, etc. I am sure others have hit all these points, but the way you executed it in this video made it easy to understand and quick to take home notes on the topic.
One of the simplest and just informative explanation of layering I've seen. This is an area I overthink and this put it simply. Thank you
The latest thing I've heard about is using mesh as a base layer because it's even better at getting water away from the skin and allowing air to dry off, plus the gaps in the mesh allow the layer above it to trap air pockets for a better warmth to weight ratio than other base layers. I've tried it with a cheap mesh shirt I bought on Amazon and my initial impression is that it works as advertised. I haven't had the chance to test it out on a strenuous hike in below-freezing weather yet, though.
I recently got some Norwegian polypropylene mesh baselayer garments and have found that they keep my body temperature at a more middling level. When I'm active the water vapor that leaves my body goes straight through to the next layer so cooling is better. When I stop and would normally get cold, I stop sweating and the air in the gaps in the mesh acts as a good insulator. Cooler when active, not clammy when stopped. This is in temps around 30F to 50F and high humidity. (NZ alpine spring-summer-fall environment, it hasn't been winter since I got them.) They don't not soak up water; I can put on the garments straight out of the washing machine. They have no anti-stink treatment so they get washed often. The polypropylene is at least as comfortable as merino to me (I prefer cotton to everything else including silk, but that's just me. Merino is bearable when I'm outdoors.)
1933 a Norwegian army captain made the first one, not quite new. 40-50 years ago lots people wore string vests in the UK (unfortunately it would be often on show in the summer time as if this made them still decent) and perhaps people still do.
Perhaps a string vest or the modern equivalent with a fleece could work well, fleece agains skin is clammy (hence normally used as a mid layer) but the string vest would keep the fleece off the skin.
I have that same Sky Goat! Love it. It's a little clingy at first, but man...soooo light, so warm and love the hooded version.
If it gets really really cold outside, you should wear a mesh as the inner layer. A mesh made either by Merino wool or Polypropylene. Brynje of Norway is a brand that excels in making meshes like these, and they are widely used by mountain climbers and arctic explorers to stay warm and dry in extreme conditions. First on the next layer, meaning on the outside of the mesh, should you wear a solid merino wool sweater. Greetings from the cold North of Norway, winters here can be quite chilly.
I agree. Poly fibers retain little moisture so a poly mesh base layer means that your sweat will not collect against your skin. Your mid layers should be wool so that your sweat is drawn out of the poly base layer and into the wool mid-layers. As the wool becomes saturated, its insulative capacity decreases. Therefore, as you sweat, the insulative capacity of your clothing decreases and you cool down. Alternatively, Once you stop sweating, the wool mid-layers begin to dry out and their insulative capacity increases, allowing you to stay comfortably warm.
Thank you for the link. I age 77 and I enjoy your posts. My comment was not intended to question your statement that wool can raise the temperature but, as the article you sent me stated, it is heated by the metabolism of the bacteria not by dissociation of water. I probably should not be so picky but after teaching physics and chemistry for 30 years I sometimes can’t help myself! I was not aware of that external warming from wool (teaching science is mostly teaching theory - not practical applications! I hiked the John Muir trail at age 73 and hope to tackle the Arizona trail in 2025 so I need all hiking tips I can get. Thank you for your work!
I think the bit about wool changing water into its component atoms was a brainstorm by a wool clothing company’s marketing department. And sales people will spin any ridiculous idea if it sounds cool to them. Turning liquid water into its gaseous state doesn’t change the water molecule, heat just causes water molecules to spread out which allows the molecules to lose their ability to attract a molecule and allows them to rise into the air and disperse. I wore a SW 150 layer under a Columbia fleece vest in an airport and was sweating profusely as I made my way to the gate to wait. When I got out of the seat, the seat back had a visible layer of moisture on it, but my fleece and wool were less than damp. First time I really got to see how well these layers worked at allowing moisture out.
It's a misrepresentation of the actual science. The inner structure of a wool fiber temporarily adsorbs water molecules through hydrogen bonding, and this releases heat (adsorption is always exothermic). It cools by a reversal of the same process and release of the water molecule (which is never split into hydrogen and oxygen).
Wool doesn't change the state of water - in fact because the outer shell of a wool fiber is hydrophobic only water vapour can enter the inner cortex to be adsorbed (having a hydrophobic shell and hydrophilic inner core is one of wool's critical characteristics).
I appreciate this explanation. You understand the characteristics of wool better than I do.
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process.
As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester.
Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool:
mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20)
www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619
www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed
journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
I have never heard the claim that wool generates heat while drying. Can you tell us where that information is from?
Yeah. 20+ years (including 10 as a product trainer for REI) in the outdoor industry and Im gonna need to see data that wool a) generates heat when drying? and b) creates a chemical reaction? I was trained that your body heat forces the moisture vapor away from you, which then sits on the wool fibers so it can evaporate. I love this channel, but im not buying it. If wool generates heat while drying, then I should be able to soak a pair of wool socks. leave them on my counter and use an infra red thermometer to measure the heat.... Right?
Awaiting replies
Here you go: www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00288233.1960.10419304
I also tested this myself as I had always heard it but wanted to know. I had a wool sock, synthetic sock and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees colder than the ambient air. The control sock was 1 degree warmer than the ambient air. Nothing beats a dry sock but my test did seem to confirm wool could generate small amounts of heat as it’s drying. In the end I didn’t include this test in the video because it was going to take up a fair amount of the video and I didn’t think it was interesting enough.
@@MyLifeOutdoorsreally interesting, Thankyou
@ureOtaku Lol... It's common knowledge that wool creates heat while drying... you serious? th-cam.com/video/LomSDfhUIHw/w-d-xo.html
You're the best at this stuff hands down.
Only if you don't check the facts
Wow what a simple video that probably did one of the best comparison of the materials compared to many other videos.
That is the exact combination that I wear. I wear a wool short sleeve shirt, then fleece long sleeve shirt and finally a down/fiberfill vest. What I really miss for winter sports are wool knickers. They are, were, the best breathable, warm, water resistant wear for winter sports. Too bad no one makes them anymore.
What? Wool underwear (both male and female) are available from many manufacturers
@@northernswedenstories1028 Not wool underwear, wool knickers - outwear.
@@KnittedSchnauzer atleast in europe its quite easy and common to find wool outerwear. I personally own 2, Varusteleka wool blanket hoodie and then one a tailor made for me from old ww2 wool blanket. Pricey yes, but lasts forever and more.
@@KnittedSchnauzer snickers means womens underwear in British English
knickers != Snickers
You should look into fishnet base layers.
but im straight. i love women 😂
@@vincentvega5686 try to manage your insecurity. good luck
@@vincentvega5686What does that have to do with fishnet baselayers? They’re some of the most effective baselayers you can wear in the backcountry
@@vincentvega5686 So are most Norwegian fishermen and oil rig workers.
During winter I deal with -20f with winds at times for hours on end with on and off walking. 1 I wear running t shirt and leggings (synthetic) designed to wick away sweat and dry fast 2 wool baselayer, then 3 this is the mix up for pants I wear Belay pants (down pants) relativaly tight wool sweater that’s a mid layer. 4 I wear a down jacket 5 I wear waxed pants or ski pants and my jacket is either a waxed jacket or a rain jacket. My socks is a thin silk sock then a heavy wool blended knee high sock that is between my down pants and wool baselayer. Or I wear my regular heavy hiking socks and a thick hand knitted wool leg wrap that goes below my foot and up to my knees covering over my pants (pants tucked into) I wear a wool beanie until I heat up and switch to fleece earmuffs and I wear a buff around my face and gloves can vary due to task I’m doing.
If I heat up I take off whatever layer in under my outermost layer for chest and legs. Super comfy to wear on a couple day hike aswell and I can hop into my sleeping bag that’s 100% not designed for freezing temps. Only downside is I need to take off boots for down slippers. I’ve noticed only thing I need to change and wash is the silk socks my running tights and shirt that’s against my skin. Everything else maybe get a little smell but nothing noteworthy.
I have a half a dozen of the Eddie Bauer jackets and in every single situation they are perfect they are all down jackets from 650 fill power up to 800 fill power with a 90/10 split snow storms ice 🧊 is not a problem I am researching if wool is just as good but running out of cold weather but hopefully next year I can buy some mid layers and start from there 😊
Excellent breakdown, Steven! 🐑
@MyLifeOutdoors As you like experimenting, how about test in an old-times string vest to see its performance in hot and cold as a baselayer?
Interesting to see how it compares with merino wool (and in price). If you can summit Everest in a string vest and an overshirt...
Sadly though, the fleece is not good for the enviroment and will shed when washed and bring micro plast into the water. I prefer wool as a midlayer too
That's why I never wash my fleece. Never really gets too dirty or stinky because I don't wear it next to my skin. No need to wash it.
so what are we gonna do with the trillions of plastic bottles? theyre not gonna recycle themselves lol
I wouldn’t take wool or down anything on a multi day activity far from help. Both will perform worse if disaster strikes and you and your gear get soaked. Polyester fleece and a synthetic puffy will dry quicker and keep you warmer when wet than the former - they do better if you have to wring water out of them too. I love wool and wear it all the time for day trips and travel though.
Base layer: Icebreaker Merino wool 175 shirt
Next layer: military base layer
Love my woollen base layer.
If its really cold fleece midlayer can be changed out with another smaller puffy coat. I got a 100$ synthetic one I can hike in while its snowing or sleep in. Then in camp use your packed down jacket ontop of it.
I would love to see a video about the Icelandic popular fishnets baselayer. I’ve heard a little about it but have no idea how it holds up in the field.
I would like to see that video as well. I have not used it. Wool on my direct skin. Make me want to crawl out of my skin. So yes please show a video on alternative. Thank you
This is great. I'm not arguing, just want to tell you that the best base layer I've used, much better than merino wool, is Alpaca Wool. Appalachian Gear Company Alpaca Sun Hoodie and 8020 Long Sleeve Tee are the best base layers I've ever used - and I've tested a lot. Keep the great videos coming!
100% agree
This was a great video. Gave me an idea... what if the fleece garment had wool (preferably alpaca) in the armpits? Then you'd get the lightness of fleece PLUS really good odor control where it counts. Garment companies... why not mix-media your garments?
Very insightful video I must admit I am a wool fan boy But we're a lot of acrylic simply because I can never find my wool beanie
Almost makes me want to go hiking.
This was really helpful. I appreciate the studies you linked as well. There will forever be debates on which is best for what, but this gives an excellent idea on layering and what may be best to try. Is the wool baselayer good for summer as well or would you recommend moving to a synthetic like poly or something like it?
I'd like to see a comparison test of wool v. mesh base layers
Would love to hear your perspective on two other clothing technologies being used as part of a layered system: mesh base layers (e.g. Brynje) and Alpha Direct. Function and use cases would be interesting to hear about on the channel.
He had a video recently about mesh actually
Outstanding!
Brilliant, this explains a lot! Have you ever played with mesh base layers?
Best method is to control your body temperature.
Too hot you sweat, which is a waste of energy and extra weight in water that you have to carry.
The moment you start to exercise take your hat off and put it under the mid layer.
When you stop put the warm hat on.
Try to not sweat, get used to feeling a bit cold.
I started hiking in the mountains in around 0F conditions with pretty strong winds and active elevation gains and drops during the day. What can I say - wool base layers are absolutely useless in this case. Just because it dries for a very long time. In such conditions, the intensity of your load is constantly changing, the release of your heat is changing, the force of the wind around you is changing, everything very dynamic. And it is the dry base layer that ensures the comfort of movement during the day. Brynje Super Thermo or X-Bionic Energy Accumulator base layers works best, not wool.
Also, any hardshell - useless for moving like this. You need breathable softshell and carry hardshell only to worn in case when wind over 20-30 mph
❤😂🎉🎉🎉 Brilliant!! Need to know info!! Thanks again Steven!!😊
I enjoy the channel, but would highly recommend editing the section about wool because the chemistry is highly inaccurate. The water molecules are not decomposed or broken down. The heating and cooling properties of wool are down to how the water vaporizes and condenses, changing state (ie. gas or liquid) not chemical form.
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process.
As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester.
Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool:
mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20)
www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619
www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed
journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
@@MyLifeOutdoors I appreciate you following up with my and others comments! To be clear, I never thought you were trying to deceive us, just thought you made a mistake (as we all do). As for the chemistry (and, for reference, I am a chemist), I can believe that wool and specific types of wool are better at keeping us warm, it was just that the chemical mechanism you described sounded highly suspicious. No worries, though, I'm glad to see you trying to correct and get things right. I enjoy your videos and have learned a lot over the years. Cheers
Depends on the wool and clothing item. I have a homespun thick cable knitted wool vest I can hardly even wear, down is cooler! Water actually beads on the vest. Now this is nothing like the high tech wool you’re discussing here for a base layer, but it’s incredibly insulating even in wet (ocean fishing/boating) environments
What about a fishnet base layer? Popular in Norway apparently. Worn by Sir Edmund Hilary when he summitted Everest.
This is such a good channel.
well done. yabadaba doo 🤙
Excellent review
Exactly correct Steve!
❤ From 🇮🇪
wool - fleece - down. I would definitely include felt. I had pure felt boots (great) and still have my felt pants and a coat. There is a reason why it's used for generations.
I have felt inserts for my leather Lundhags boots. They are damn amazing in winter as i never have to put my foot into a frozen boot
Great video
Be bold, start Cold
Rich content! Thanks
I wear ONLY synthetic base layers. YEP, "Wool can absorb up to 30% of its weight in moisture." which synthetics DON'T.
'nuff sed!
Wool is peak
What are your thoughts or experience regarding mesh base layers? Like something from Brynje.
There are synthetic base layers that wick moister faster than wool thou
Great vid
What?! I love your videos but not the chemistry. You say wool chemically dissociates water into hydrogen and oxygen and produces heat? The chemistry I learned says this dissociation of water requires energy and that would cool the surroundings not heat them. Can you refer me to a source that claims wool has the ability to electrolyze water?
Also using terms like "down" or "fleece" is as subjective and ambiguous as it gets.
It's fluffy polyester and polyester 9 times out of ten
I agree disassociating water would endothermic; but it wouldn't be "electrolysis".
i thought it was common knowledge that wool is a catalyst for water breaking the H and O bonds with ease 😉😀
Here you go: www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00288233.1960.10419304
@@leahheffernan4644 This is only a problem for non outdoor people where the jargon gets mixed-up. Puffy jackets can have different filling like fluffy polyester or thin thread like balls/ clumps of polyester instead of the down in down jackets. That is why he specifically mentions down jackets. As down only has this great warmth to weight performance. Where poly filled puffy jackets only mimic the look and even come way short in warmth to weight & compression.
And he clearly addressed that a poly fleece is named 'fleece' after wool fleece as it was intended to replace wool for that purpose. Again brands just muddying the waters with terms.
I keep getting advertisements for the Vaucluse Ultralight Ventilation Backpack Frame and wanted your thoughts on it.
Wet wool
Nothing like it
Just don’t expect it to dry
So damp wool will cool you as it cools
Synthetic base wicks sweat
I was interested in the hoodie, but couldn't find the usual Technical info, primarily how much does it weigh, and the materials used?
100% true
I highly doubt that wool breaks down the hydrogen in the water. Fluid Water in the fabric evaporates as a whole molecule and contains, just as before, two Hydrogens and one Oxygen.
This process leads to evaporative cooling.
The Bond between Oxygen and Hydrogen is extremely strong, this is why it is so energy intensive to pruduce fluid Hydrogen using electrolysis.
So, even if wool was able to break down the hydrogen, it would take massive amounts of energy (heat), rather than producing any of it.
But I can still agree on your message that wool performs good when it is wet 👍
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process.
As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester.
Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool:
mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20)
www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619
www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed
journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
a few questionable statements 1. wool is not really good at transporting moisture, at least not merino wool - it tends to hold on to moisture, which is its natural capacity, couples with lanolin oil, is a great property, we wash off the lanolin oil (which is the main reason wool can generate heat) and most of these properties are lost. Also the generation heat part, it takes a pretty good amount to actually produce some heat (and the loss of heat due to loss to moisture would be larger) in general you dont really want the process of heat creation, as of consumes material - which on a sheep which makes new wool all the time, is not an issue, in your baselayer, well :) big fan of wool here, but it has its limitation, and as a baselayer i prefer i in a mesh structure and/or a blend of other natural fibres (tencel) or synthetics, gives much better moisture transfer and durability
A weird question but how much of this applies when not active? Do people just buy 1 bulky northface/canada goose jacket and call it quits? Or can you apply this logic to just walking around shop hopping in cold wintery cities?
Some brands (like Revolution Race) have bamboo base layers, I wonder how that compares to wool?
REVIEW THE NEW NEMO CHAIR!!!
I can't stand merino as base layer - it's scratchy and makes me sweaty and cold. What is a good alternative for base layer?
Where do I find these gloves ?
Wool is so much better
❤❤❤❤😊
Is gore-tex still worth it as a shell material? A motorcycle channel called Fortnine seems to think it’s now an overpriced rip-off, so what’s your view?
But…fleece contributes to micro plastics, which should factor into your choice.
You nearly froze to death recently, so I think you might not be qualified to speak about layering. Using wool or not depends very much about how much you are sweating / how intense your movement is. It's best for slower moving activities where you won't sweat much. Best layering would be a synthetic (or wool if not so intense activity) mesh base layer, then either a wool mid layer or some sort of grid fleece, then (if you need it) whatever shell or insulation is appropriate (synthetic, down, waterproof, windproof etc). Also always carry a good, warm hat, and use appropriate socks. Merino is better for socks as feet sweat less, but if they do get wet in a downpour or water crossing etc, then they will not make your feet freeze.
String vest. Done. Mic drop.
There is no such thing like this alleged chemical reaction breaking down water and generating heat in wool. When wool is drying on your body the evaporation of the water is drawing heat energy from your body making you feel cold. That is also the purpose of sweating - cooling your body.
This is an oversimplification of what is actually happening. Go look up the heat of sorption. I posted more information in the description.
wool is the best !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Stop with the self heating/bond breaking pseudoscience please! It’s a stain on this channels normal level of quality and factualness!
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process.
As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester.
Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool:
mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20)
www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619
www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed
journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
@@MyLifeOutdoors I should have written ”stop it with the bond breaking” and not ”self heating/bond breaking” as the heat of sorption is a real thing!
I scrolled through the articles you linked and did a 10 minute google dance which resulted in me (being a test enginner who has worked a bit with precise heat measuring/calorimetry) forming this opinion:
Outside of the lab all fibers are the same in regard to ”creating” (and ”loosing”) heat unless proved differently with *very* good arguments. The differences are miniscule.
Thank you for caring!!!!
@@MyLifeOutdoors I shall revise again is there does seem to be a bond involved in this!
No water molecules are being broken up though.
There are some synthetic down subsitutes now that outperform all but 900FP down on warmth to weight scales... and they don't require killing geese to make... but they are petroleum based (sigh - it's always something)
For example, my EE Torrid (synthetic) is every bit as warm as my Mountain Whisperer (down) and just a tiny fraction of an ounce heavier for the entire jacket, and it's every bit as packable.... but the synthetic will never wet out no matter how long it's been since a treatment, so easy win for the synthetic there.
To gain the resources that allows you to live someone has to kill animals or destroyed they habitat in some regards.
If you really want to lower the impact, become a farmer.
Animals die during farming plants as well. Either directly or by taking out the habitat.
I come from a farmer family, seen how uneducated vegetarians are. It sickens me as they don’t actually care about environment or the habitat for animals.
Love to hear more about this chemical reaction that "produces heat as it dries" by "breaking-down hydrogen in the water, generating a chemical reaction that produces heat?" With a nice animation showing hydrogen breaking its bonds with Oxygen and disappearing. Very convincing. And stated so authoritatively. A revolutionary concept, since when hydrogen combines with oxygen to produce water it is so exothermic (producing heat). Now that you've found a process that also produces heat when breaking the hydrogen bond from oxygen, it would seems perpetual energy's been discovered. We must notify the Nobel-Prize Committee. (more...)
And of course if you were to claim misstatement, that you didn't mean to suggest breaking molecular bonds, rather merely a change-of-state (water to vapor), then there may also be a Nobel prize in your future, since everyone knows it requires heat to cause water to turn to vapor and producing water vapor always cools the subject. It's the whole basis of sweating. Body produces sweat. Sweat turns to vapor, thus cooling the body. Your new discovery, which is the exact opposite, is surely worth a Nobel Prize? After all, if one can both gain heat and lose heat from producing steam, then perpetual-motion has finally been discovered! Great job.
Ok I have been on the hunt all afternoon trying to prove or disprove my statements in the video. First a confession, the chemical heating of wet wool is something I’ve heard for years and have accepted as true. There are numerous websites that claim this happens by the wool breaking down the hydrogen in water. But I cannot substantiate this with highly credible sources. What I have found is the heat of sorption or the heat of wetting is highest in wool fibers as compared to other fibers that absorb water. Some research seems to suggest this heat can be felt by those wearing wool. I don’t claim to fully understand sorption but from what I understand it is a chemical process.
As part of this video I did do some testing that I ultimately decided to leave out of the video because I didn’t think it would hold interest. I’m my test I had a wet synthetic sock, a wet wool sock, and a dry control sock. The wet wool sock was consistently 1 degree F warmer than the wet synthetic sock but 3-4 degrees F colder then the ambient air temperature. The control sock was constantly 1 degree F warmer than the ambient air. I concluded the 1 degree difference was due to the warming of wet wool I’ve always heard about, but admit it could just be that wet wool is better at insulating than wet polyester.
Some articles below that seem to support the heat of Sorption in wool:
mytextilenotes.blogspot.com/2009/10/why-wool-feels-warm.html?m=1#:~:text=As%20we%20can%20see%20from,eight%20hours”%20(Source%20)
www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/19447025308662619
www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemistry/heat-of-adsorption#:~:text=The%20heat%20of%20sorption%20is,if%20the%20vapor%20simply%20condensed
journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/004051756603600809?journalCode=trjc
@@MyLifeOutdoors - A valiant attempt. There are substances that heat when wet, however they consume material(s). Hot hands, for example contain iron and salt that heat by 'rusting' when exposed to air and heat faster in higher humidity; however water is neither created nor lost in the process and iron is consumed. Can we agree wool is neither created nor lost when wet? That leaves the two processes of adsorption, neither purporting to require a person's heat generation. The two processes are 1) vapor-to-liquid adsorption, 2) liquid adsorption, both rapidly achieving equilibrium. (more...)
Equilibrium meaning any small heating effect of adsorption is soon counterbalanced by corresponding cooling effect of evaporation. If wool starts in a 0% humidity environment (say, in an otherwise sealed box) and is suddenly exposed to 20% humid air, the wool may adsorb moisture and thus temporarily slightly warm until it reaches equilibrium by evaporating an equal amount as it adsorbs. This period of time might be measured in an experiment with wool in an isolated box, for example and any temperature effect might be expected to reach equilibrium in a matter of seconds (e.g. less than a hundred seconds?). However, one might be expecting to wear wool for hours, not seconds.
Same with liquid adsorption, with any thermic effect attenuated by the increased mass of liquid water.
In other words, any tiny thermic adsorption effect is fleeting, because equilibrium occurs within seconds. And equilibrium means that continuing a constant humidity or 'wetted' state doesn't generate any net heat. Once equilibrium is achieved, any heat from new water being adsorbed is balanced by that heat being evaporated or conducted away. Returning to our experiment of wool in a box, the wool can not and will not generate heat on its own after those first few seconds. Otherwise, wool in a cardboard box in one's closet would eventually combust into flames (being able to adsorb moisture, but also being self-insulating). However such adsorption events never occur, otherwise half the homes storing wool sweaters over the summer would be burned to the ground. As noted in original-post, these misguided notions all lead to perpetual-motion rabbit-holes.
So far this is for wool alone, without a body sourcing heat energy into the wool, however the body's heat engine does not work in favor of adsorptive heating theories, since body heat only serves to increase evaporation and body-heat dominates any tiny and temporary heating by adsorption.
Anything but primaloft.
Ngl this guys whole channel is just designed to make you buy stuff from his sponsers and if not that then buy gear you don’t need. Once you see it Youl hate this guy. + he’s just not right at all this time
Lol I only use wool , PNW outdoors person here. What the hell is this fake scienc tho?!!
So, you covered some great things...but what about the synthetic down jackets that aren't as heavy as a "puffy" but really are closer to something like fleece.
Outdoor Vitals Ventus or their Jacket
Arc'Teryx Proton Hoody
Patagonia Nano Air or Patagonia Nano Air Light Hybrid (fleece / synthetic hybrid)
and so many others that use things like primaloft silver/gold or proprietary insulation
My personal favorite is the Patagonia...but i'm just curious if you could cover something like these in-between jackets