The fact that the Spanish system can build everything for a relatively affordable cost is what I find to be really impressive. They really should have been consulted when California was designing its HSR line because just Phase 1 of that is going to cost more than Spain's entire railway network.
Well, Saudi Arabia did, and that turned into a political scandal... What's also a factor is that acquiring land in the USA is much, much more expensive than in Europe, let alone China. In Europe, the government can acquire your land via a court case or even a legislative process. But in the USA, with its emphasis on individual rights, this is much more difficult and expensive.
It’s far more difficult to make HSR in the US because of cost and the land acquisition policies, they’re known be very strict especially when it’s one’s land who doesn’t want to give it up along with the cost to build rail per kilometer. In China it cost less than 20M. Europe in general is in the 30-50M due to labor costs. In the US it’s far higher than that. Don’t forget the lobbyist preparing to strangle any method of competitive transportation that will challenge their flight and automobile profits California should be done with the middle phase by 2029 I believe. It’s going to make coming from LA to SF a fast dream
@@SeverityOne California uses imminent domain clauses to build malls and parking lots all the time. And to expand highways. What you're saying is the proverbial excuse that everyone uses, kinda like saying US cities don't have "enough density" (which everyone knows is pure bullshit if one has ever visited a European city off tourist season lmao) for urban transit. The issue is that in the US, semilegal corruption within the government is geared more towards nepotism and corporate shareholders, and have less to do with results that also happen to benefit the public. Countries like China and Spain also have corrupt governments, but there you can't just yell BLM or MAGA (depending on where you live) while taking everyone's money and expect your constituents to not complain. There was a nice research article published recently about "productive corruption".
@@mathieumaticien I'm not really knowledgeable enough about corruption in the US to have an opinion about it. I live in a rather corrupt country myself (southern Europe, comes with the territory). There are plans to build a metro... oh boy.
When I visited Spain for the first time my jaw dropped to the floor when I saw how good public transport was there. But what really shocked me in a positive manner was the fact that you could hop on a high speed train and travel 400km for a mere 40€.
unfortunately due to cheap flights and buses, 40€ is still too much for many people, especially considering that it's not a return ticket. Spain desperately needs more low-cost train companies like Ouigo and Avlo.
@@owenernst7768 pues en mi ciudad es muy bueno el transporte público (bus) y no vivo ni en madrid ni en barcelona ni en ninguna de las principales ciudades españolas (sevilla, zaragoza)
Thanks for the video. I think the Spanish high speed rail network is often overlooked because of the French high speed rail network and its TGV rolling stock. The Spanish network needs to get the credit it deserves as it's quite astoundibg how quickly and cheaply it was built. Keep up the good work👍😊
Was hoping you'd talk about the infamous "Variante de Pajares", a railway line from León to Asturias that started construction in 2005, was due to open in 2010 but is still not open in 2022 (due for late 2022-early 2023 now... Supposedly). On the issues of low occupancy, it's often attributed to several factors. First the incomplete lines that don't connect that many cities. Prices are often considered high and can't match bus or even aircraft ticket prices (consider Spain's relatively low wages compared to other European countries). And Spain is also very dense in airports which often means it's easier to fly than travel by train.
In democracies sometimes it is cheaper to go underground with a number of modern multi modal TBM working 24/7 than have expensive court cases. A single 11 psi Maglev tunnel can increase speed from 600 km/h to 700km/h while still being breathable and passing stations would allow daytime trains to stop where needed with overnight container trains beating any truck by eight hours over 1,000 kilometres between freight sidings eliminating daytime planes and reducing trucks. Using Sydney to Melbourne as an example with passing stations at Canberra and Albury it would cost $60,000,000,000 and return $20,000,000 per night which makes it able to subsidise daytime fares below planes and still have a return of 10% Perhaps cooperation between Japan, China and America can develop the maglev container train with Australia to use an international guideway to benefit the world.
@@edwardbarnett6571 fyi: Japan is already working on a maglev line to connect Tokyo and Osaka. It set a speed record of 603Km/h back in 2015. Would the increase of top speed really be worth the overhead of maintaining depressurized tunnels? Please bare in mind that at that speed you'll anyway spend most of the time accelerating and decelerating between stops. The added top speed will have marginal effects on transit time.
@@e1123581321345589144 Without overnight container trains I doubt it would be economical and if all done in a single tunnel it would push pressure build up out the exhaust valves every launch shaft attaining 700 km/h and beating truck between Sydney and Melbourne by 8 hours.
You seem to have the wrong information about Spain...The reason why they have not completed that project it is because of the altitude and the many tunnels of the Picos de Europa;...And the wages are not that much lower in comparison to the rest of Europe.....Remember, Spain has the longest track with the high speed trains in Europe and the First modern train was built by Talgo in 1942
From what I understand at least one of the tunnels collapsed having been inundated by a landslide during construction which sent everyone back to the drawing board. If you live in Asturias and have been over the Pajares pass you'll know just how treacherous the terrain is up there. They've even managed to complete and open the Madrid-Galicia AVE line which is way longer and has a ridiculous number of bridges & tunnels on it before this one's been done, but the terrain on that one is not dissimilar to what they faced building the Madrid-Zaragoza-Barca line so they were in more familiar territory. The Asturias line just runs into a massive wall of vertical rock north of Leon and there's absolutely no other way through to the coast so it's gotta be one helluva job for the engineers to figure out how to get that line completed & operational without any other collapses and without ploughing a big chunk of Spain's GDP into it.
Spain is proof that for short and medium distances, rail is net superior to air travel. Sure, a flight might be 1-2h, but you have to add the trip from city to airport, the check in and boarding procedures (around 1.5-2h) and then the trip from airport to city, whereas the train stations are generally in the city itself and also you just hop in, no check in and boarding necessary.
Spain has really good transport infrastructure, I visited in 2018 and the motorways alongside the metros, conmuter trains and long distance trains (high speed or not) were very good and comfortable, no need for air travel there.
@@BadBoy93143 The infrastructe I agree ( excluding catalonia and Valencia where regional Trains are horrible and the central gov refuses to invest more ). The big problem is that the customer service offered by renfe is so bad a lot of people avoid the train entierly for that sible reason ( or just bc the website is so bad they where unable to buy a ticket, yes, that is a thing )
@@BadBoy93143 I dont disagree there. But they arent from Renfe, I am talking about regional trains. There has even been a moovement last months where people refused to pay as a protest for the pior service Renfe gives. And again, regional trains not metro not bus not AVE
The key is the price. I'm soon traveling from Barcelona to Madrid with my wife for 20€/each, which considering distance and speed is a wonderful price (Ouigo). We traveled for even cheaper from Madrid to Zaragoza a while ago. However for those lines without competition, prices are quite high. Therefore when we once traveled to Sevilla, it was waaay cheaper to do so with Ryanair... We're so looking forward to extra competition in all corridors. Once it's there, we'll travel to a different city each weekend
@@aaronhpa prices are high because there is no competition. The price of the infrastructure is better amortized the more travelers there are. An in terms of passenger utilization we're still significantly below countries like France, Germany or Japan
More competition is sorely needed all across Europe. Competition brings prices down and improves punctuality and overall service quality. Spain and Italy, where the market was liberalized, have much cheaper ticket prices than most other countries.
One thing to consider is that AVE was one of the most expensive rail systems in Europe until very recently. When SNCF through the OUIGO brand began operation on the Madrid-Barcelona route, prices plummeted. Because of the pandemic, it's too early to see how this impacted ridership.
The best way i ever travelled? The AVE Train from Barcelona to Sevilla. Unbelievable fast, comfortable for me and my family. We was on the way with the interrail and backpacks. Luxury travelling.
There was a recent interview with the boss of RENFE where he admitted that while they had added stations to the AVE system since 2019 there had been no additional orders of trains, meaning that the same number of trains had to go round more destinations. Malaga has 10 trains a day now (with an additional train being added in a month) versus 13-14 trains a day in 2019. This is in addition to the shortage of drivers which seems to apply to all levels of the Spanish network - local, regional and AVE.
One of the keys of building a successful high speed network is the building cost for Km. or Mile. Spain has developed the ability and know-how for having the lower European costs in building reliable and safe high speed tracks.
Not really sure about that. Are you aware Spain is the most mountainous country of Europe after Switzerland? Some lines such as in Galicia and Asturias are full of some of the longer tunnels in Europe. Same for the bigger bridges to cross deep valleys
@@pedrofmc0000 Obvio. La LAV Madrid - Valladolid tuvo un coste de 24,5 M€ por Km. teniendo en cuenta la orografía y los túneles construidos. Pero el promedio de cada Km. de LAV español está en 18M€ por Km.
@@pasodeminick If you take the total amount since these lines began (1986/1992-Sevilla) maybe it's what you are saying. But if you take into consideration the first budgets and translate them to current values, I don't think it's like that little. Indeed, I've found a link where it says exactly that amount per km. But you can find easily another link (El Mundo) where it speaks about 40 Million euros per km for the new sections.
Having good high speed intercity rail and not investing enough in commuter and suburban railways it's like having a good metro/subway and poor bus or commuter rail networks. Transportation is a system and every part of it matters to make it work.
China and Italy are a good example of it, especially in Italy, cause, China investing a lot in subways. In contrary, Russia and Turkey are countries with good subways and commuter rails, but high-speed rail is not a priority for them. Turkey is even a country with poor intercity rail transport, except HSR and commuter rail.
@@kuanysh_sartay The thing with Italy is that building any sort of underground infrastructure is much more expensive and takes much longer, because of the amount of architectural infrastructure from Roman times. The best example is to compare Rome and Milan. They are similar in size, but Milan has 4 lines that mostly run under the city, while Rome has 3 lines with one being basically a converted commuter rail. Milan is also in the middle of constructing a new line, while Rome has nothing. That can be attributed to the fact that it is much easier to build in Milan as opposed to Rome, because they don’t have that much ruins under their city.
Very true, and it's also immediately the argument why HSR will never work in the US. Investing in that much public transport will never be profitable and probably only be a tax burden on the taxpayers. I see people say all the time that they should just do high-speed rail in the US, but besides this, a lot of people don't realize the true size of the US, which would make HSR impossible and even slow. I love high-speed rail but when I see Spain connecting small towns with an HSR network it just doesn't make much sense anymore.
@@timokho20 The thing is that many US cities are heavily investing in public transit. Look at Seattle or LA, maybe even Austin. Furthermore many American cities already have decent public transit particularly those in the north east. At one point we cannot keep excusing ourselves that stuff is too expensive when US has a largely toll free interstate network, extremely bloated military budget and the most inefficient health care system in developed world. There are many places where we can find the money, we are just choosing to not do that, because it is easier and at the same time we please all the lobbyists. Truth is that we are going to face a climate change and if we actually want to reduce our emissions we have to look into our lifestyle and design of our living spaces, which includes cities.
The problem with the comparison of usage with other countries is that it doesn't take into consideration the abyssal state of the conventional network after almost a century of under-investment. For all purposes, Spain's passenger rail system solely consists of the HSL network and commuter lines, as barely anyone uses mid or long distance conventional trains. They're simply not competitive against bus, much less air. With that in mind, it's simply impossible to have any decent figures until the HSL form a real network instead of separate corridors. I also missed some discussion about the liberalization process, as it's by far the most ambitious going on right now in Europe.
I don't think that the comparison with other networks in terms of passengers/km is fair, since the distances between cities are very large and the network in Spain is incomplete, not like the networks of France, Japan or Germany. For example, the main selling point of the north corridor is the connection between Madrid and País Vasco/French border, since the cities in the middle are not very large. A lot of kms have already been built, but until the line connects the french border with Madrid, there won't be that much traffic. Finished corridors like Madrid-Barcelona, Madrid-Levante and Madrid-Sevilla have way better numbers, and the Corredor Mediterráneo will also connect a lot of people, but it is currently unfinished.
If you are refering to passenger-KM he mentioned at 13:49, it is measured by passenger * km, not p/km, so naturally this index is favouring long distance between cities.
Exhaustive information. Congrats. 👍👏👏👏👏👏 And a little detaiñ: Lleida is denominated this way only in Catalonia. For the rest of Spain speaking in castelian, is LERIDA from the start.
The Spanish system is interesting indeed. I just came back from Spain, travelling on different AVE high-speed trains, some AVANT and ALVIA trains as well. Having the tracks gauges changes while on board of the train is a cool experience. If you don't know what's going on, you don't even notice it. However, there is so much to improve and some trains are just not frequent enough, mainly because Madrid is the main focus point of the network what doesn't always makes sense. I guess frequency is more king than speed in many situations, and this can be improved a lot. What really is missing are good international connections. If you want to encourage international train travel this must simply be better. If you need some of my content for your video's, let me know. I'm more than happy to help you. Btw, my first Spanish video will be published this Thursday, on the most popular route Madrid - Barcelona.
Yeah, that is definitely one big drawback of spanish HSR, it just doesn't have the frequency and/or a senseful connection. (Though I gotta say, french TGV isn't that much better. I will have to make a 600 km detour to Paris on my Barcelona-Basel route, because it rather goes straight to Paris instead of making a stop at the branching station of Dijon.) Thankfully, Spain is actually fixing these problems. The frequency problem is being solved by openning competition to the lines. This should definitely increase the numbers of train connections, I am certain. Especially since a spanish inland-airline is also joining as an investor in one of the private competitors. And the centralization of the network is also being worked on by having a mediterranean connection (along the mediterranean coastline), a connection between Zaragoza and Vitoria-Gasteiz that connects Catalunia with the Basque country, and in planning, a new connection along the northern coast (which is still very early in planning/ideation since it's incredibly shitty terrain). So, to me, it looks like the initial centralization was just a means to start, with Madrid and Barcelona being by far the biggest cities in Spain. Also, in contrast to Paris, Madrid is actually in the middle of the country, not like Paris. So centralization wasn't actually that much of a detour. (Yeah, grim look at you Paris, your centralization is literally bullshit! At least take central city if you want to make everything from a central point!) Last but not least, I think the biggest drawback of Spain is, that even though HSR is great, Spain is really bad in public transportation when it comes to local stuff. Everyone that isn't living in a big city must have a car, because there are very weak bus connections and basically no local trains. This results in the fact, that everyone must take the car anyways to and from your destination and origin go to the trainstation, so you can also just go to the airport instead of the railstation and be a bit cheaper and faster... Therefore, I think, the next very important thing for Spain is, to fix it's transit system. Once that is up and running, I forsee great times for spanish public transport!
@@aurelspecker6740 The AVE trains are there to replace domestic flights, which aren't very frequent either. There is no point to have a high speed train every hour because there just isn't the demand for it.
What annoys me the most about Spanish HSR is that every single train requires a seat reservation. If you have an interrail ticket as a traveler, this is a nightmare, because you can't buy a reservation by itself online or at a vending machine, you HAVE TO go to a ticket counter where no one speaks English and no one is interested in helping you if you don't speak Spanish.
@@FlorianHWave have you checked domestic flights? it's incredible how many flights there are. Even from remote locations. But even from Madrid to Barcelona, where the train is realistically just simply better. About your argument of having to do everything at the train station ticked desk, I totally agree. I think most renfe employees are incredibly good and open to communicate even when you have no common language, but this is simply an unecessary hassle. Having an easy way to book seats online should be the bare minimum. Even with actually buying tickets (not just interrail reservations), I am not sure if you can do that online. I am currently in Spain, and I realized just on my last trip, that not a single passenger had a print@home or mobile ticket. So yeah, digitalization of customer service is an easy way for renfe to improve (and probably safe money doing so). Let's hope that the competition sparks some innovation in this direction.
@@FlorianHWavesome routes there are too many domestic flights. San Sebastian- Barcelona, I know it's not an AVE, however I recently made a trip report in this (not published yet). The reason for me to make a video on this route is because there are 6 flights per day and 1 direct train (before covid 4 trains). Spain is good at building a lot of small airports. Even if I would support flying, I think that making more regional bigger airports would make a big difference in connections by plane (however I started youtube to inform people about traveling by train instead of anything else haha).
1:43 they should definitely build an expansion from Huesca (north-eastern Spain) to Montpellier. That would greatly reduced trave time from Madrid to Paris. Alternatively a shorter section can be build to Tolouse, though that would not reduce much travel time between the two capitals.
@@alexandrejuve1305 well France is currently co-financing a 25 BILLION euro railway between Lyon and Turin so...I think it can also *co-finance* this other railway to Spain. Also, Spain will obviously also contribute, since much of the line would fall within Spanish borders. Idk...I think it's quite doable actually.
@@TheHortoman this is why it came to me that easily to spot a provincial comment, I live surrounded by this kind of people who need to underline their superiority 🤣
Damn 60 Billion Euros spent and Spain has one of the greatest high speed rail in the world. Meanwhile California has spent 100 Billion Dollars and not a single train has operated thus far.
Great video. Not only the conventional rail, Madrid also beneficial for High Speed Railway thanks to it Geographical position. Not surprising because World event like Olympic and World Fair make this HSR possibl.
Living in California since 1986 I have been hearing about the HSR line between Los Angeles to San Francisco for 30 years and doesn't seem to be finished anytime soon. With Spain there are other factors. Spain has a very low population (Comparing with other European countries), The country has 42 international airports and a very good highway system (One of the best in Europe) and at her peak of international tourism reached 84 million visitors before Covid 19. I was very critical about the useless HSR lines to low population areas of the country but I have to admit that they proved me wrong. Once they complete the Mediterranean corredor, the Atlantic corredor and the overhaul of the train stations in Madrid with a connection to Barajas airport most of the connectivity problems will be a breeze.
Even though I love HSR in Spain and it's super comfortable to move around the country (if you live in Madrid, that is), there is so much wasted potential in comuter and short distance intercity services that could lower emissions, improve local connectivity... The government should prioritize on cheaper and tbh more useful local improvements to these lines (actually RUN trains on the Miño line for example)
Investment in the conventional railways is improving. For the 2021-2025 period €8.7 billion have been allocated to Adif (conventional rail infrastructure operator) and €4 billion to Adif AV (high speed rail infrastructure). And Renfe is investing €3.5 billion renewing their Cernanias and medium distance rolling stock
If the Talgo 250 (operating as alvia) is compared with the Acela. The Acela looks like an outdated train. The talgo is lighter almost 200t less lol. Both operate at almost the same speed, the Talgo is a hybrid, and they have practically the same capacity per set.
The Acela is built to share a 150-year-old freight ROW, which limits the top speed and requires heavier cars and locomotives. The Acela also works across three different electrical standards. Acela isn't particularly outdated, but the ROW is an embarrassment.
@@daniellewis1789 Talgo 250 hybrid was built for use in both conventional lines from the 1800s and new, high speed lines. But that is not to say that acela is bad, it's clearly the way that the US needs to go to improve its railways.
@@rub1316 I'd argue that Brightline is a better example - mixed use where rail lines exist and can be upgraded for acceptable intercity service, dedicated ROW paralleling interstates where new line is needed Honestly I can't wait to see videos of Brightline West surrounded by a traffic jam on both sides, zooming by at 200 mph. Acela is a very good solution to a niche problem, and unfortunately there aren't other major electrified networks in the US (thanks for nothing, Milwaukee Road administrators) for similar trains to run on. New builds should definitely be built to a higher standard.
@@daniellewis1789 Well I just wanted to give an example that is currenlty working and not a line that is not yet built and paid for. Given the cost per mile of the California HSL project, I do not believe the amount Brightline is telling us its going to cost (8 billion total at 20 million per kilometer).
Spanish HSR are quick and efficient when you go one big city to another, but the options are very limited. it appears that from Madrid to Sevilla, it does not open for any other, lower-speed options. actually, many people who are traveling in the area instead opted for bus becuase of the lack of connection and the high prices, unless it is between the 3 biggest cities. Italy, on the other hand, is lower in speed (and less punctual) but with a huge variety of connections.
The largest and most technically advanced high speed train network in Europe. Its just amazing experience how you get 300 kmh in few minutes while in some other countries you run at 250
I congratulate you for the video. It is very clear and illustrative, and the information is accurate. I just have to make a comment: Andalusia is not a province, it is an autonomous community. Within Andalusia are the provinces of Malaga, Seville, Cordoba, Granada among others.
@@RailwaysExplained To further clarify the issue, Spain has one more level of administrative division than most countries, which often confuses foreigners. Most countries have provinces or states immediately below the country itself. In Spain we have an intermediate level, formally the 'autonomous community' which is a mouthful so I'll call it 'region'. So, it goes Country (Spain), Regions (Andalusia, Catalonia, etc) , Provinces (Málaga, Barcelona) and Cities (too many to mention). Provinces exist mostly for historical reasons and they have no political power (you don't elect provincial officials) they are just administrative subdivisions of the region. Most government administrative functions lie with the regional government. Some regions have no provinces (Madrid, Murcia, La Rioja, Santander) while Andalusia has the most, with 12 provinces and most are somewhere in between. To further complicate matters, there are several repetitions: Valencia might refer to the region, the province or the city, they are all called the same. Think of it as in the USA, where they have regions like New England, the Midwest or the Great Plains, encompassing several states. However, the difference in Spain is that the entity that has the political power is the region, not the province.
@@danielbarreiro8228 yes that’s it but just to clear it up Andalucía has 8 provinces but Castilla y León which is less populated is the one with most provinces with 9
Unfortunately right now if you want to travel to any city from any city that isn't Madrid it takes way too long. Don't get me wrong, whenever I had to go to Madrid it was a bless using the HSR, but if I want to go to Barcelona I'll probably take anything other than HSR. I'm really looking forward to getting more connections between cities other than Madrid, I'm sure people would use it more.
They added a service from Granada to Malaga a couple of months ago that reduced travel time to about 75 minutes. Unfortunately there are only a few trains a day currently and evidently it's mostly booked up - and that's before the tourist season began.
india & Europe Joint Partnership Railway Network the Indian railway network is the world's second largest under one management. The network covers more than 7,000 stations and has a route length of 67,312 kilometers. The United States has the world's longest railway network, with a route length of over 250,000 kilometers. The Indian railway network also owns facilities like locomotives and coach-production at several places. The network has divisional officers, divisional heads, station masters, manufacturing units, training establishments, PSUs, and other undertakings.
Sería interesante explicar que el proyecto de AVE en España está también en relación con el cambio de ancho de vía, además del turismo. Y me extraña que no se aluda a las mayores obras de infraestructura en los túneles de Madrid a la meseta (9 y 26 kilómetros) y en Asturias.
Although the cost and wether such large Network is actually required is questionable, you need to take into consideration that Spain has a very large unnemployment rate, above 15%. Such infracstructure projects provide much needed jobs. Also Spain is very tourist dependant and in long term, It will help in providing a state of the art system for people to move around. Now low cost companies are allowed to run trains, which are bringing prices down, which has been a turn off until now, (as prices were too expensive for the average person) Spain Will be well prepared when Airlines are requested to stop short trips flights...which is already happening (EU regulations). So yes, might sound expensive now but It has its advantages too... I can only assume passengers will increase significantly this decade due to abovementioned factors...
@@BlackHoleSpain the real one is much lower since alot of spaniards work in the underground economy they get payed lower than minimum wage but they dont pay taxes
Spain really seems to be optimally prepared if short haul flights get banned in the EU. Germany for example will struggle hard, as their rail network is already congested and plagued with constant delays.
It is really poorly thought when you se the use numbers on the HSR. For the salary of the people in Spain, it is not easy to pay the costs even when so many times is cheaper to go by plane than the HSR. I needed to do every 1-2 month during 6m the route Barcelona-Madrid (the 2 biggest cities) and only once was a better choice to go by HSR than Plane… imwhen I was in Japan, all times was better to go by HSR than plane each time.
Bueno... Que sea más barato hacer el viaje en avión no significa que sea mejor. Para tomar un avión, debes de presentarte en el aeropuerto con bastante tiempo de antelación para facturar, hacer checking, etc etc... Un tren prácticamente es llegar y montarse. Si los españoles no usamos los trenes de alta velocidad no es por el precio, es porque seguimos usando mucho el coche. Los españoles preferimos la versatilidad y comodidad que ofrece viajar en un coche con la familia que un tren de alta velocidad.
'The province of andalusia' sounds disgusting as an andalusian myself hahaha (it is never called a province, a term used for smaller territories, for example "Andalucia" is divided in 8 provinces). Also not great pronuncation of places like Vigo or Málaga, but besides that great video, so detailed 9.9/10 👍
Spain... Even the Trams here reach 110kmh, Spain got the first Tram-Train doing Intercity and Metro service at same time since 15 years ago, the CITYLINK light train... CITYLINK (property os Stadler Rail now) today is used from UK to Germany or México, and its copied by other Tram manufacturers.
If you want to travel to or from Madrid, the system works. And other than Barcelona to Valencia, the system sucks. Try going from Valencia to Granada or Valencia to Leon. Valencia to Leon would be about a 1.5 hour flight, but none is offered, so you spend 6+ hours on the HSL because you have to travel through Madrid and spend a good hour there stopped in both train stations. I live here and I drive everywhere.
@@klausbriesma9050 but the vast majority of Spanish population, industry and tourism is located along the Mediterranean coast, so it would make a lot of sense to make HSR there (studies show it would be very beneficial and the EU also asked for and gave funds for it). But the government is only pushing for HSR to and from Madrid, and that way you end up with the 2nd and 3rd cities of the country, which are superclose to each other (Valencia and Barcelona) not being connected by HSR yet...
Railway lines in Spain were very old. Many of which were built by the end of the XIX century or in the first half of XX. To put an example, to travel from Madrid to Malaga you needed nearly 10 hours while now it's about 2h30m. So you can imagine that it was mandatory to build fully new lines to make the system usufull. No savings were posible upgrading old lines. Also Spain has less population and differently distributed than France, China or Japan so it's more difficult to get high percentage occupation of trains but it's experted that with the introduction of new competitors such french and Italians trains, prices will significantly decrease and new quality services will make far more attractive the high speed network. The show starts really now!! It's really very exciting .
Este video toda vía le faltan vías ave, pues hay una línea, Toledo, Cáceres, Merida, Badajoz Evora Lisboa... Las conexiones de Burgos y País Vasco no salen, y que desembocan en Francia por Irun Hendaya. Y la conexión de León por Pajares, a Oviedo y Gijon. Tampoco sale la conexión ave Madrid Ciudad Real, Córdoba Granada y que en nada seguirá a Almería y a Lorca y Alicante.
The Portuguese government is not interested in building the line, however the line is being built in the Spanish side so hopefully some day we'll have Madrid-Lisbon in less than three hours
Ten years ago, Portugal was in the midst of the financial crisis so they cancelled a lot of expensive infrastructure programs. Portugal is now again planning to build two lines, one from Lisbon to its other large cities in the north towards Galicia, and another from the Spanish border until Évora, halfway to Lisbon.
There was some political issues there. Barcelona already had a lot of investment in infrastructure to support the Olympics so it wasn't politically acceptable that it would have the HSR as well. And, anyway, most of the attendees to the Olympics were not going to be arriving by train anyway, since the connection to France was not even being discussed at the time. And, Catalans always want to connect to all of the world, except to the rest of Spain, which also was a main cause of the delay on the line Madrid-Barcelona.
Well, the prime minister was from Seville... If Josep Borrell was prime minister of Spain back then, I'm sure the line to Barcelona would have been the first built!
@@danielbarreiro8228 You can't justify the high speed line construction to seville just because in Barcelona there was already sufficient inversion. If you are going to build a high speed corridor, do it where you know there will be more demand. From 1992 to 2007, in 15 years there would have been a way bigger accumulation of cash flows from the Madrid Barcelona line, in contrast with the Andalusian corridor. Not doing this line first has been worse for the whole country economy and development.
It's been argued that the exposure of politicians cutting ribbons may have been a factor in Spain's HSL expansion. Considering its GDP per capita, the question arises whether these were prudent investments, or fanciful halo projects. Because a high-speed line is much more glamorous than some commuter railway. So... I'm a bit ambivalent about the Spanish HSR adventure. It's impressive, it covers most of the country, but is it really worth it? We have seen in other countries, notably Japan but also France, that a high-speed rail network allows people to move quicker, and it can have a positive effect on the economy. Whether this is the case in Spain, or whether it will be so in the future, is not clear to me.
The line between Madrid and Barcelona is the most traveled high speed route in Europe, so much so that other european operators like SNCF and Trenitalia are starting to run their own high speed trains on the line to compete with Renfe. The line has basically paid for itself at this point.
Passenger numbers are increasing with the new low cost operators and the completion of the line to Galicia. The agreement between Iberia (airline) and Renfe (trains) to unify tickets between 14 cities and Madrid Airport is also helping; regional flights were always loss makers for Iberia and now they are giving up wherever possible.
Y otra cosa que no dice el video, es que circulan trenes de las operadoras RENFE y la AVLO española estatal, ILSA Española privada, OUIGO francesa y la IRYO Italiana. Solamente se ven del operador RENFE, y casualmente un OUIGO, en todo el video.
They haven't been beneficial to society? I highly doubt that. High speed rail is so much more convenient than air travel, and also a lot cleaner and therefore better for the environment.
It will be less of a financial burden for Spanish passengers to keep traveling long-distance as oil (and one of its main derivatives, plane tickets) keeps getting more expensive. Plus, Spain has tons of untapped solar power capacity which can be used to pump electricity into the grid during the day (when the trains are running).
As a spanish citizen, let me tell you that what Spain lacks still to this day is improving its short distance (conventional) railways. HSR is cool and does a lot of marketing but it has been designed poorly and with a political scope (instead of technical). So it is a huge waste of money. And wasting money is not beneficial to society
I love the Spanish railway system, but the prices for the medium and long distance trips are not affordable for the average people. It's more than twice than what would cost going by car even with today's gas prices. Also, travelling on main lines are a joy, but once anyone needs to travel somewhere that's not on the way to Madrid, it becomes painfully slow and expensive, like Cádiz-Málaga which is +1h compared to going by car.
I had a pleasure of travelling on an AVE train from Madrid's Atocha to Barcelona's Sants. Pretty cool. One issue though, not related to trains, was that Barcelona's cab drivers refuse to speak foreign languages and I don't know Spanish/Catalan.
Most high speed railways in Europe are already pretty standard. With the Spanish high speed network being standard gauge, 25 kV AC and having ERTMS, I'd say they're pretty close to that standard. Iberian gauge is only used for lower speed railways
Coudl you do a video on Poland's or the Czech Republic's plan to more or less emulate Spain in terms of HSR construction in the next 12 years? Poland will connect most cities to the new airport between Warsaw and Łódź while the Czechs basically want to connect lines to all of their neightbours.
Da ist das System in Deutschland halt schon besser, weil es nicht nur auf die Hauptstadt ausgerichtet ist und die Züge auch viel öfter fahren. Bisher hat man meistens jede Stunde eine Fahrmöglichkeit in eine Richtung und mit dem Deutschlandtakt dann sogar alle 30min.
What I like most about the German trains is that there are no security checks to get to the platform. But after 2004, I can't really say I blame the Spaniards for being cautious.
Starting to think USA should just give up on HSR and go straight to maglev for new intercity services then wipeout all long distance trains east of I-35
0:38 Looking at that map, it looks like they are completely trying to avoid Portugal. As far as I know, there's not a single rail connection in operation these days between the two countries, which is kind of a shame to be honest.
There is a Madrid to Lisbon high speed conection planned. Also, the Madrid-Lisbon line was the prefered line when Spain began building it's high speed Network, but the Portuguese were not interested
This is the fault of the successive Portuguese governments that didn’t want to invest on a truly high speed network connected with Spain (and the rest of Europe)
It's all Portugal's fault. The line Madrid-Extremadura is being built but Portugal doesn't wanna continue it until Lisbon. Portugal now wants to be connected to Galicia by high speed train, but they have not build anything. So what are they waiting for?
I really enjoy these videos... but god damn I get sometimes triggered by the pronunciation of some names! Like Madrid, Barcelona and Lleida for example are very good. But on some others like Málaga or Córdoba I'm just like WTF! It's MÁlaga and CÓRdoba, instead of MáLAga and CórDOba... I'm I the only one? Or am I being triggered for nothing? xD
When we learn English names we try pronouncing them as the English speakers do...Others should do the same with the Spanish ones...But I noticed this is rarely done by foreigners...
to be completely honest with you, the problem here is putting madrid as an unskippable station. there't tons of people in the valencian region that want to go to barcelona by train and while the euromed is pretty alright, an ave line would definately help. Cuz now if I, for example, living in Castellón, want to go to barcelona using the AVE, I'd have to first wait for a train to come here (which is a lot less often than in other places) go to valencia at a much slower speed than it should, wait there as it technically is a terminus, then go to madrid. Once in Madrid, i'd have to get on a different train to go to barcelona. which is just stupid. Madrid is the grave of spanish economy, it should never have become the capital.
You already have the Euromed that takes 2:10 from Castellón to Barcelona. These will get faster once the work between Valencia and Vandellós is completed
@@francisquito4590 Still high speed rail. There will not be a full 300km/h line as the thin and undulating strip of land between the sea and the mountains does not allow for that (at a reasonable cost)
We've been 30 years building the network... and must begin from somewhere useful. Which place would have you chosen instead? Everything is done, nobody will be left behind. But remember we're the 2nd biggest country in Europe and these things take time.
@@BlackHoleSpain Why make an Alicante Madrid Line instead of an Alicante Valencia Line, The AL-VAL Line would've attracted more passengerxkm than an Alicante Madrid Line, its a shame the fact of branching lines to prioritise the fast connections with madrid instead of neigbouring cities.
They are working in the med corridor from tarragona to granada some sections are already finished the section between murcia and almeria will open in 2026 and btween almeria and granada in 2028
Dedicated to the two people below, that talked without knowledge @Ayman LA and @123bmwck, there is no possibility of doing more than 300kms by High Speed Rail within Spain in the Mediterranean. Only two major cities are connected: Barcelona and Tarragona plus on a single rail line when it was meant to be 2 lines. So please next time, do a bit of research, so that you can spare some time looking like fools :)
@@bfedezl2018 Well since you are calling me a fool, I will address you as a clown (which btw u are) and thank you for clarifying that you worked on the project, no wonder that if people with 0IQ work on this, it is more than normal that it will take ages to complete. Can you let me know in which comment I said something about years? I only said that the vast majority of budget, investment and funding went to Madrid and not to the Mediterranean corridor, which is true there are thousands of public certified documents that support this, I encourage to do some research and better prepare yourself before chatting bs on internet, so you can spare yourself looking like a D, like you are now.
It should be emphasized that Belgium is the absolute leader in ERTMS (in terms of track distance covered) , followed by France and then Spain. Luxembourg is the relative leader with having 100% coverage and ETCS L1 being a requirement to operate on the Luxembourgish network.
@euskoferre there have been many many pieces done on Spain's massive over spending on rail. Maybe time to be a bit less lazy, and do your homework. Type in Spain overspending rail. Maybe educate yourself instead of posting nonsense
The size of the network has been driven by populism. I appreciate the comfort you have and the technology but high-speed lines are very expensive to maintain and are meant for wealthy countries. As far as I know, none of the lines brings any profit other than looking good like I said. The first line was constructed to the home town of the company´s director. This is the level of logic/planning they had when building many lines... The worst part is that they are extending them which means even higher maintenance costs while regional lines that do the ¨heavy lifting¨ face delays, accidents and struggle to deliver despite the big confidence that passengers have in this type of transport. They bring an immense ecological value compared to planes and it could be the selling and turning point but if they are not marketed enough the opportunity to make the finally profitable will go to waste. After the arrival of SNCF, we can buy tickets starting at 5€ (SNCF) or 9E (AVLO). I am curious what Trenitalia will bring too later this year, if the launch is still on schedule.
@euskoferre They do though. Healthcare and education maybe qualify for what you say. But even for these, the return of investment is a healthy and educated population. Public transport can and needs to not be a whole in the budget otherwise it will have no research, no progress, dated rolling stock, low speed and overall be a very low quality end product.
@euskoferre What's wrong with public services generating money? Let's talk about historical facts. All railway networks started as privately owned and funded. Later, after they became bigger and each region had its own, the discussion about centralization appeared. Again, there are fields where public funding is the only solution like the medical field.
@euskoferre Railways started private pretty much everywhere in Europe. In Spain, the first line was Barcelona - Mataro. Then others were created mainly where industries needed them like coal mining for example and as they expanded the formed regional railways. These later united into what we have now. Sorry but countries like China, Iran, North Korea don't really qualify as having a normal economy due to their political regimes which is a different topic.
As the network may be impressive,we must remmember the cost of a single ticket from BCN to MAD,for example. The cheapest is around 99€. Thats why AVLO was created. For the average user the cheapest way to travel from BCN to MAD is to get on a plane with Iberia or Vueling for 45€ or less (pre covid 2019 prices). Even today people preffer to take the plane rather than pay Renfe for its HSR. Renfe knew that the "monopoly" they have over the railnetwork is going to be over when the market opens to foreign companies. Currently FS is getting the necesary permits to operate in spain with its Frecciarossa trains. Ouigo just slapped them in the face with cheap tickets. And unfortunatelly they lost a lot of passengers and its costing a LOT of money to tax payers to maintain and pay for those "public" 3622km of high speed network. Also is interesting to mention the corruption or abuse of power. There are almost 20 stations that caused concern to the public eye due to their "unusual" location while serving a village with no more than 20.000 inhabitants. As you mentioned in the video, yes the numbers are fancy, the rolling stock is great but they are so full of crap that its beyond imagination. Just look at the state of the commuter network. Branch lines are closing due to lack of passengers. Prices skyrocketed, you have a S-Bahn type train going to Valencia in some instances
@@tucuuk and here comes the first hater... The truth usually hurts. I bet you are very hardcore fan of renfe ,given your bland and boring response. Cheers.
@@Alex18800 Can you name those 20 stations in villages with no more than 20000 people? Can you explain why I can buy a ticket from Madrid to Barcelona for €19 at Renfe's site...You are the one that should be providing proof...
@@tucuuk You can google it yourself. There is an article on some very nice newspapers from spain, abc for example. Now yes,you can buy for 19€ ticket after they got slapped in the face from Ouigo and airtravel. The facts are out there.
Several points. Any metric on a "per km" basis is going to penalize a country like Spain with dense cities located relatively far away from each other. By contrast, Spain has very very cheap construction costs, so in metrics like "passengers per invested euro" Spain is actually above other countries in Europe. In addition, there is a long way to go in terms of improving the use of the network. Specific bottle necks (such as the tunnel connecting Atocha and Chamartín, or the fact that Valencia has a cul de sac station, or the fact that the network does not connect yet to any major airport) significantly deter network scaling. Nevertheless, with the introduction of private competition and the fixing of some of those bottle necks, greater use will be achieved in the short run. HSR network construction is, ironically, a marathon and as should it should be taken.
@@amparoalvarez9001 The national language is Catalan, even if Spanish is also official. The official name of the city is Girona (not Gerona), and if you write in a foreign language (in this case English) and you don't have a name in that language, you must use the local name (in this case Catalan) instead of using a third-language name.
@@mussaranya As per whom... you? The only language spoken in all Spain is Spanish, then you have the regional languages or dialects...So no, I would say it in Spanish...Everyone knows Spanish...Who knows Catalán? Not that many people...Spanish is the second most spoken language in the world...Good day and I rest my case...
@@amparoalvarez9001 If you can't distinguish a language and a dialect, is not worthy to talk with you, due to your ignorance. Btw, Spanish is not "the second most spoken language", because you have English, Chinese and Hindi, then maybe Spanish.
@@mussaranya No dear: It is Chinese, Spanish and English, in that order...And I know what a language is... I speak four of them...and I know Catalán is a regional language...Or are you trying to tell me they speak Catalán all over Spain? You are upset because I do not agree with your ego based opinion about what Catalán is, A REGIONAL LANGUAGE while Spanish is an international language, THE SECOND AFTER CHINESE...It doesn't matter if it hurts your feelings...The truth needs to be said...Let your ego take a walk...Good bye...Not interested in your pettiness...
@euskoferre do you know how many stations from that network were closed just months after been finished? Do you know how many miles of that rail network are actually out of service due to null demand? Do you know how much does each mile of that network cost?
@euskoferre also check out for average users per network mile and compare this data with the data from other high speed train networks worldwide. This network will never be amortized. PD: circula, no molestes más.
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I rode the Spanish rail system last summer and will do so again this summer. I was amazed how quickly I arrived in Zaragoza from Madrid and back.
Not surprising as this route has Super high speed trains allowed to proceed at a maximum 210mph (335kph).
The fact that the Spanish system can build everything for a relatively affordable cost is what I find to be really impressive. They really should have been consulted when California was designing its HSR line because just Phase 1 of that is going to cost more than Spain's entire railway network.
Well, Saudi Arabia did, and that turned into a political scandal...
What's also a factor is that acquiring land in the USA is much, much more expensive than in Europe, let alone China. In Europe, the government can acquire your land via a court case or even a legislative process. But in the USA, with its emphasis on individual rights, this is much more difficult and expensive.
It’s far more difficult to make HSR in the US because of cost and the land acquisition policies, they’re known be very strict especially when it’s one’s land who doesn’t want to give it up along with the cost to build rail per kilometer. In China it cost less than 20M. Europe in general is in the 30-50M due to labor costs. In the US it’s far higher than that. Don’t forget the lobbyist preparing to strangle any method of competitive transportation that will challenge their flight and automobile profits
California should be done with the middle phase by 2029 I believe. It’s going to make coming from LA to SF a fast dream
Texas Central Railway consults Renfe for operation!
@@SeverityOne California uses imminent domain clauses to build malls and parking lots all the time. And to expand highways. What you're saying is the proverbial excuse that everyone uses, kinda like saying US cities don't have "enough density" (which everyone knows is pure bullshit if one has ever visited a European city off tourist season lmao) for urban transit.
The issue is that in the US, semilegal corruption within the government is geared more towards nepotism and corporate shareholders, and have less to do with results that also happen to benefit the public. Countries like China and Spain also have corrupt governments, but there you can't just yell BLM or MAGA (depending on where you live) while taking everyone's money and expect your constituents to not complain.
There was a nice research article published recently about "productive corruption".
@@mathieumaticien I'm not really knowledgeable enough about corruption in the US to have an opinion about it. I live in a rather corrupt country myself (southern Europe, comes with the territory). There are plans to build a metro... oh boy.
When I visited Spain for the first time my jaw dropped to the floor when I saw how good public transport was there.
But what really shocked me in a positive manner was the fact that you could hop on a high speed train and travel 400km for a mere 40€.
unfortunately due to cheap flights and buses, 40€ is still too much for many people, especially considering that it's not a return ticket.
Spain desperately needs more low-cost train companies like Ouigo and Avlo.
Euhm i think you visited only barcelona or madrid. Since oublic transport outside of these cities is not that good.
@@owenernst7768 pues en mi ciudad es muy bueno el transporte público (bus) y no vivo ni en madrid ni en barcelona ni en ninguna de las principales ciudades españolas (sevilla, zaragoza)
@@owenernst7768 eso es mentira
@@kikokusy9974my brother in Christ, in germany, buying spontaneous cost you 300€ minimum
Thanks for the video. I think the Spanish high speed rail network is often overlooked because of the French high speed rail network and its TGV rolling stock. The Spanish network needs to get the credit it deserves as it's quite astoundibg how quickly and cheaply it was built. Keep up the good work👍😊
It is worth noting that Madrid has the largest metro system in the EU too.
word? i suspected but didnt know for sure
@@TheHortoman know that the UK is out of the UE, thus London not counted, it probably is
@@martinpandofernandez5288 i was still counting on paris to have a bigger one, a welcome surprise if i may add
I always go to Madrid bc im spanish and for me is so small😭😭🤣🤣
@@MIAU08X what
Was hoping you'd talk about the infamous "Variante de Pajares", a railway line from León to Asturias that started construction in 2005, was due to open in 2010 but is still not open in 2022 (due for late 2022-early 2023 now... Supposedly).
On the issues of low occupancy, it's often attributed to several factors. First the incomplete lines that don't connect that many cities. Prices are often considered high and can't match bus or even aircraft ticket prices (consider Spain's relatively low wages compared to other European countries). And Spain is also very dense in airports which often means it's easier to fly than travel by train.
In democracies sometimes it is cheaper to go underground with a number of modern multi modal TBM working 24/7 than have expensive court cases.
A single 11 psi Maglev tunnel can increase speed from 600 km/h to 700km/h while still being breathable and passing stations would allow daytime trains to stop where needed with overnight container trains beating any truck by eight hours over 1,000 kilometres between freight sidings eliminating daytime planes and reducing trucks.
Using Sydney to Melbourne as an example with passing stations at Canberra and Albury it would cost $60,000,000,000 and return $20,000,000 per night which makes it able to subsidise daytime fares below planes and still have a return of 10%
Perhaps cooperation between Japan, China and America can develop the maglev container train with Australia to use an international guideway to benefit the world.
@@edwardbarnett6571 fyi: Japan is already working on a maglev line to connect Tokyo and Osaka. It set a speed record of 603Km/h back in 2015.
Would the increase of top speed really be worth the overhead of maintaining depressurized tunnels? Please bare in mind that at that speed you'll anyway spend most of the time accelerating and decelerating between stops. The added top speed will have marginal effects on transit time.
@@e1123581321345589144 Without overnight container trains I doubt it would be economical and if all done in a single tunnel it would push pressure build up out the exhaust valves every launch shaft attaining 700 km/h and beating truck between Sydney and Melbourne by 8 hours.
You seem to have the wrong information about Spain...The reason why they have not completed that project it is because of the altitude and the many tunnels of the Picos de Europa;...And the wages are not that much lower in comparison to the rest of Europe.....Remember, Spain has the longest track with the high speed trains in Europe and the First modern train was built by Talgo in 1942
From what I understand at least one of the tunnels collapsed having been inundated by a landslide during construction which sent everyone back to the drawing board. If you live in Asturias and have been over the Pajares pass you'll know just how treacherous the terrain is up there. They've even managed to complete and open the Madrid-Galicia AVE line which is way longer and has a ridiculous number of bridges & tunnels on it before this one's been done, but the terrain on that one is not dissimilar to what they faced building the Madrid-Zaragoza-Barca line so they were in more familiar territory. The Asturias line just runs into a massive wall of vertical rock north of Leon and there's absolutely no other way through to the coast so it's gotta be one helluva job for the engineers to figure out how to get that line completed & operational without any other collapses and without ploughing a big chunk of Spain's GDP into it.
Spain is proof that for short and medium distances, rail is net superior to air travel. Sure, a flight might be 1-2h, but you have to add the trip from city to airport, the check in and boarding procedures (around 1.5-2h) and then the trip from airport to city, whereas the train stations are generally in the city itself and also you just hop in, no check in and boarding necessary.
Yes, the sad truth is that BCN-MAD in plain is 20€, in AVE is 120€. Even if plane is longer and less confortable I know what I'm going to chose
Spain has really good transport infrastructure, I visited in 2018 and the motorways alongside the metros, conmuter trains and long distance trains (high speed or not) were very good and comfortable, no need for air travel there.
@@BadBoy93143 The infrastructe I agree ( excluding catalonia and Valencia where regional Trains are horrible and the central gov refuses to invest more ). The big problem is that the customer service offered by renfe is so bad a lot of people avoid the train entierly for that sible reason ( or just bc the website is so bad they where unable to buy a ticket, yes, that is a thing )
@@joelimbergamo639 well Barcelona's metro system is really good.
What I really liked was the so easy access it gives to the beach (Barceloneta Beach).
@@BadBoy93143 I dont disagree there. But they arent from Renfe, I am talking about regional trains. There has even been a moovement last months where people refused to pay as a protest for the pior service Renfe gives. And again, regional trains not metro not bus not AVE
The key is the price. I'm soon traveling from Barcelona to Madrid with my wife for 20€/each, which considering distance and speed is a wonderful price (Ouigo). We traveled for even cheaper from Madrid to Zaragoza a while ago.
However for those lines without competition, prices are quite high. Therefore when we once traveled to Sevilla, it was waaay cheaper to do so with Ryanair... We're so looking forward to extra competition in all corridors. Once it's there, we'll travel to a different city each weekend
The problem is that those prices are high in order to pay the really expensive cost of the HSLs
@@aaronhpa prices are high because there is no competition. The price of the infrastructure is better amortized the more travelers there are. An in terms of passenger utilization we're still significantly below countries like France, Germany or Japan
More competition is sorely needed all across Europe. Competition brings prices down and improves punctuality and overall service quality. Spain and Italy, where the market was liberalized, have much cheaper ticket prices than most other countries.
One thing to consider is that AVE was one of the most expensive rail systems in Europe until very recently. When SNCF through the OUIGO brand began operation on the Madrid-Barcelona route, prices plummeted. Because of the pandemic, it's too early to see how this impacted ridership.
The best way i ever travelled? The AVE Train from Barcelona to Sevilla. Unbelievable fast, comfortable for me and my family. We was on the way with the interrail and backpacks. Luxury travelling.
There was a recent interview with the boss of RENFE where he admitted that while they had added stations to the AVE system since 2019 there had been no additional orders of trains, meaning that the same number of trains had to go round more destinations. Malaga has 10 trains a day now (with an additional train being added in a month) versus 13-14 trains a day in 2019. This is in addition to the shortage of drivers which seems to apply to all levels of the Spanish network - local, regional and AVE.
One of the keys of building a successful high speed network is the building cost for Km. or Mile.
Spain has developed the ability and know-how for having the lower European costs in building reliable and safe high speed tracks.
Not really sure about that. Are you aware Spain is the most mountainous country of Europe after Switzerland? Some lines such as in Galicia and Asturias are full of some of the longer tunnels in Europe. Same for the bigger bridges to cross deep valleys
@@pedrofmc0000 Obvio. La LAV Madrid - Valladolid tuvo un coste de 24,5 M€ por Km. teniendo en cuenta la orografía y los túneles construidos.
Pero el promedio de cada Km. de LAV español está en 18M€ por Km.
@@pasodeminick If you take the total amount since these lines began (1986/1992-Sevilla) maybe it's what you are saying. But if you take into consideration the first budgets and translate them to current values, I don't think it's like that little. Indeed, I've found a link where it says exactly that amount per km. But you can find easily another link (El Mundo) where it speaks about 40 Million euros per km for the new sections.
Having good high speed intercity rail and not investing enough in commuter and suburban railways it's like having a good metro/subway and poor bus or commuter rail networks. Transportation is a system and every part of it matters to make it work.
Tell china that lol
China and Italy are a good example of it, especially in Italy, cause, China investing a lot in subways. In contrary, Russia and Turkey are countries with good subways and commuter rails, but high-speed rail is not a priority for them. Turkey is even a country with poor intercity rail transport, except HSR and commuter rail.
@@kuanysh_sartay The thing with Italy is that
building any sort of underground infrastructure is much more expensive and takes much longer, because of the amount of architectural infrastructure from Roman times. The best example is to compare Rome and Milan. They are similar in size, but Milan has 4 lines that mostly run under the city, while Rome has 3 lines with one being basically a converted commuter rail. Milan is also in the middle of constructing a new line, while Rome has nothing. That can be attributed to the fact that it is much easier to build in Milan as opposed to Rome, because they don’t have that much ruins under their city.
Very true, and it's also immediately the argument why HSR will never work in the US. Investing in that much public transport will never be profitable and probably only be a tax burden on the taxpayers. I see people say all the time that they should just do high-speed rail in the US, but besides this, a lot of people don't realize the true size of the US, which would make HSR impossible and even slow. I love high-speed rail but when I see Spain connecting small towns with an HSR network it just doesn't make much sense anymore.
@@timokho20 The thing is that many US cities are heavily investing in public transit. Look at Seattle or LA, maybe even Austin. Furthermore many American cities already have decent public transit particularly those in the north east. At one point we cannot keep excusing ourselves that stuff is too expensive when US has a largely toll free interstate network, extremely bloated military budget and the most inefficient health care system in developed world. There are many places where we can find the money, we are just choosing to not do that, because it is easier and at the same time we please all the lobbyists.
Truth is that we are going to face a climate change and if we actually want to reduce our emissions we have to look into our lifestyle and design of our living spaces, which includes cities.
The problem with the comparison of usage with other countries is that it doesn't take into consideration the abyssal state of the conventional network after almost a century of under-investment. For all purposes, Spain's passenger rail system solely consists of the HSL network and commuter lines, as barely anyone uses mid or long distance conventional trains. They're simply not competitive against bus, much less air. With that in mind, it's simply impossible to have any decent figures until the HSL form a real network instead of separate corridors. I also missed some discussion about the liberalization process, as it's by far the most ambitious going on right now in Europe.
Always great videos from you guys. Very in-depth, great research, and well formulated. You guys rock!
Thank you 🙂
I don't think that the comparison with other networks in terms of passengers/km is fair, since the distances between cities are very large and the network in Spain is incomplete, not like the networks of France, Japan or Germany. For example, the main selling point of the north corridor is the connection between Madrid and País Vasco/French border, since the cities in the middle are not very large. A lot of kms have already been built, but until the line connects the french border with Madrid, there won't be that much traffic. Finished corridors like Madrid-Barcelona, Madrid-Levante and Madrid-Sevilla have way better numbers, and the Corredor Mediterráneo will also connect a lot of people, but it is currently unfinished.
If you are refering to passenger-KM he mentioned at 13:49, it is measured by passenger * km, not p/km, so naturally this index is favouring long distance between cities.
Well explained and animated 👏👏👏
Thanks
I love that you included how extrensive it will be in the near future, instead of only what has been built so far.
Exhaustive information. Congrats. 👍👏👏👏👏👏 And a little detaiñ: Lleida is denominated this way only in Catalonia. For the rest of Spain speaking in castelian, is LERIDA from the start.
The title is a bit of an understatement. It is the largest high speed rail network in the world after China :)
The Spanish system is interesting indeed. I just came back from Spain, travelling on different AVE high-speed trains, some AVANT and ALVIA trains as well. Having the tracks gauges changes while on board of the train is a cool experience. If you don't know what's going on, you don't even notice it. However, there is so much to improve and some trains are just not frequent enough, mainly because Madrid is the main focus point of the network what doesn't always makes sense. I guess frequency is more king than speed in many situations, and this can be improved a lot.
What really is missing are good international connections. If you want to encourage international train travel this must simply be better.
If you need some of my content for your video's, let me know. I'm more than happy to help you.
Btw, my first Spanish video will be published this Thursday, on the most popular route Madrid - Barcelona.
Yeah, that is definitely one big drawback of spanish HSR, it just doesn't have the frequency and/or a senseful connection. (Though I gotta say, french TGV isn't that much better. I will have to make a 600 km detour to Paris on my Barcelona-Basel route, because it rather goes straight to Paris instead of making a stop at the branching station of Dijon.) Thankfully, Spain is actually fixing these problems.
The frequency problem is being solved by openning competition to the lines. This should definitely increase the numbers of train connections, I am certain. Especially since a spanish inland-airline is also joining as an investor in one of the private competitors.
And the centralization of the network is also being worked on by having a mediterranean connection (along the mediterranean coastline), a connection between Zaragoza and Vitoria-Gasteiz that connects Catalunia with the Basque country, and in planning, a new connection along the northern coast (which is still very early in planning/ideation since it's incredibly shitty terrain). So, to me, it looks like the initial centralization was just a means to start, with Madrid and Barcelona being by far the biggest cities in Spain.
Also, in contrast to Paris, Madrid is actually in the middle of the country, not like Paris. So centralization wasn't actually that much of a detour. (Yeah, grim look at you Paris, your centralization is literally bullshit! At least take central city if you want to make everything from a central point!)
Last but not least, I think the biggest drawback of Spain is, that even though HSR is great, Spain is really bad in public transportation when it comes to local stuff. Everyone that isn't living in a big city must have a car, because there are very weak bus connections and basically no local trains. This results in the fact, that everyone must take the car anyways to and from your destination and origin go to the trainstation, so you can also just go to the airport instead of the railstation and be a bit cheaper and faster...
Therefore, I think, the next very important thing for Spain is, to fix it's transit system. Once that is up and running, I forsee great times for spanish public transport!
@@aurelspecker6740 The AVE trains are there to replace domestic flights, which aren't very frequent either. There is no point to have a high speed train every hour because there just isn't the demand for it.
What annoys me the most about Spanish HSR is that every single train requires a seat reservation. If you have an interrail ticket as a traveler, this is a nightmare, because you can't buy a reservation by itself online or at a vending machine, you HAVE TO go to a ticket counter where no one speaks English and no one is interested in helping you if you don't speak Spanish.
@@FlorianHWave have you checked domestic flights? it's incredible how many flights there are. Even from remote locations. But even from Madrid to Barcelona, where the train is realistically just simply better.
About your argument of having to do everything at the train station ticked desk, I totally agree. I think most renfe employees are incredibly good and open to communicate even when you have no common language, but this is simply an unecessary hassle. Having an easy way to book seats online should be the bare minimum.
Even with actually buying tickets (not just interrail reservations), I am not sure if you can do that online. I am currently in Spain, and I realized just on my last trip, that not a single passenger had a print@home or mobile ticket.
So yeah, digitalization of customer service is an easy way for renfe to improve (and probably safe money doing so).
Let's hope that the competition sparks some innovation in this direction.
@@FlorianHWavesome routes there are too many domestic flights. San Sebastian- Barcelona, I know it's not an AVE, however I recently made a trip report in this (not published yet). The reason for me to make a video on this route is because there are 6 flights per day and 1 direct train (before covid 4 trains). Spain is good at building a lot of small airports. Even if I would support flying, I think that making more regional bigger airports would make a big difference in connections by plane (however I started youtube to inform people about traveling by train instead of anything else haha).
1:43 they should definitely build an expansion from Huesca (north-eastern Spain) to Montpellier. That would greatly reduced trave time from Madrid to Paris.
Alternatively a shorter section can be build to Tolouse, though that would not reduce much travel time between the two capitals.
France would never build that.
@@alexandrejuve1305 well France is currently co-financing a 25 BILLION euro railway between Lyon and Turin so...I think it can also *co-finance* this other railway to Spain. Also, Spain will obviously also contribute, since much of the line would fall within Spanish borders.
Idk...I think it's quite doable actually.
There is one from Gerona to Montpelier, between Huesca and France there are mountains of around 2000m
Excellent video and informative content 👌
Thanks
We have Done a travel with AVE Valencia toMadrid. Fantastic train. You do not fell the speed very Nice and fast ride and cheap
Informative. However, Andalusia is not a province, it is an autonomous community made up of various provinces.
Oh, it may be an autonomous community but is very provincial
Spanish communities are considered as provinces and provinces are considered as counties
@@kubaproszowski4279 and you are and asSholle but this is not the point .
@@kubaproszowski4279 you have a slavic surname talking about provincial 😂
@@TheHortoman this is why it came to me that easily to spot a provincial comment, I live surrounded by this kind of people who need to underline their superiority 🤣
HRS in spain is standard gauge. Only freight and slow passenger rail still use Iberian gauge.
He said that a couple of seconds after
Slow passenger raíl = 220 to 250kmh 🤦
Damn 60 Billion Euros spent and Spain has one of the greatest high speed rail in the world. Meanwhile California has spent 100 Billion Dollars and not a single train has operated thus far.
California hasn’t spent 100 billion. That is a pessimistic estimate for the whole system (phase 1&2)
Because Spain is one of the greatest countries of the world. We are leaders in a lot of sectors
Did you ;know that Talgo has been building trains in the USA since the 1940s?
Great video. Not only the conventional rail, Madrid also beneficial for High Speed Railway thanks to it Geographical position. Not surprising because World event like Olympic and World Fair make this HSR possibl.
Living in California since 1986 I have been hearing about the HSR line between Los Angeles to San Francisco for 30 years and doesn't seem to be finished anytime soon. With Spain there are other factors. Spain has a very low population (Comparing with other European countries), The country has 42 international airports and a very good highway system (One of the best in Europe) and at her peak of international tourism reached 84 million visitors before Covid 19. I was very critical about the useless HSR lines to low population areas of the country but I have to admit that they proved me wrong. Once they complete the Mediterranean corredor, the Atlantic corredor and the overhaul of the train stations in Madrid with a connection to Barajas airport most of the connectivity problems will be a breeze.
Even though I love HSR in Spain and it's super comfortable to move around the country (if you live in Madrid, that is), there is so much wasted potential in comuter and short distance intercity services that could lower emissions, improve local connectivity...
The government should prioritize on cheaper and tbh more useful local improvements to these lines (actually RUN trains on the Miño line for example)
Investment in the conventional railways is improving. For the 2021-2025 period €8.7 billion have been allocated to Adif (conventional rail infrastructure operator) and €4 billion to Adif AV (high speed rail infrastructure). And Renfe is investing €3.5 billion renewing their Cernanias and medium distance rolling stock
Recientemente Renfe cambió el logo del AVE para conmemorar los 30 años que cumple la Alta Velocidad en España 👍🇪🇸
Is this new logo?
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e3/Renfe_AVE.svg
@@RailwaysExplained yeah, it's hasn't changed much.
It's nice
España construyó el primer tren moderno en 1942
Anticuado desde su nacimiento
If the Talgo 250 (operating as alvia) is compared with the Acela. The Acela looks like an outdated train. The talgo is lighter almost 200t less lol. Both operate at almost the same speed, the Talgo is a hybrid, and they have practically the same capacity per set.
Don´t forget that Talgo 250 is also gauge changing and dual-voltage.
The Acela is built to share a 150-year-old freight ROW, which limits the top speed and requires heavier cars and locomotives. The Acela also works across three different electrical standards.
Acela isn't particularly outdated, but the ROW is an embarrassment.
@@daniellewis1789 Talgo 250 hybrid was built for use in both conventional lines from the 1800s and new, high speed lines. But that is not to say that acela is bad, it's clearly the way that the US needs to go to improve its railways.
@@rub1316 I'd argue that Brightline is a better example - mixed use where rail lines exist and can be upgraded for acceptable intercity service, dedicated ROW paralleling interstates where new line is needed
Honestly I can't wait to see videos of Brightline West surrounded by a traffic jam on both sides, zooming by at 200 mph.
Acela is a very good solution to a niche problem, and unfortunately there aren't other major electrified networks in the US (thanks for nothing, Milwaukee Road administrators) for similar trains to run on. New builds should definitely be built to a higher standard.
@@daniellewis1789 Well I just wanted to give an example that is currenlty working and not a line that is not yet built and paid for. Given the cost per mile of the California HSL project, I do not believe the amount Brightline is telling us its going to cost (8 billion total at 20 million per kilometer).
Spanish HSR are quick and efficient when you go one big city to another, but the options are very limited. it appears that from Madrid to Sevilla, it does not open for any other, lower-speed options. actually, many people who are traveling in the area instead opted for bus becuase of the lack of connection and the high prices, unless it is between the 3 biggest cities. Italy, on the other hand, is lower in speed (and less punctual) but with a huge variety of connections.
Brilliant research and video!! Congratulations!!
Thank you!
👏 ¡increíble! great works in Spain
The largest and most technically advanced high speed train network in Europe. Its just amazing experience how you get 300 kmh in few minutes while in some other countries you run at 250
@@klausbriesma9050 Que rico! / how advanced /
Always good content, i don't even need to say it, just watch the video
Thank you. Glad you enjoy our content 🙂
I congratulate you for the video. It is very clear and illustrative, and the information is accurate. I just have to make a comment: Andalusia is not a province, it is an autonomous community. Within Andalusia are the provinces of Malaga, Seville, Cordoba, Granada among others.
Thanks for the information. 🙂
@@RailwaysExplained To further clarify the issue, Spain has one more level of administrative division than most countries, which often confuses foreigners. Most countries have provinces or states immediately below the country itself. In Spain we have an intermediate level, formally the 'autonomous community' which is a mouthful so I'll call it 'region'. So, it goes Country (Spain), Regions (Andalusia, Catalonia, etc) , Provinces (Málaga, Barcelona) and Cities (too many to mention). Provinces exist mostly for historical reasons and they have no political power (you don't elect provincial officials) they are just administrative subdivisions of the region. Most government administrative functions lie with the regional government. Some regions have no provinces (Madrid, Murcia, La Rioja, Santander) while Andalusia has the most, with 12 provinces and most are somewhere in between. To further complicate matters, there are several repetitions: Valencia might refer to the region, the province or the city, they are all called the same. Think of it as in the USA, where they have regions like New England, the Midwest or the Great Plains, encompassing several states. However, the difference in Spain is that the entity that has the political power is the region, not the province.
@@danielbarreiro8228 Autonomous regions are 'de facto' equivalent to states in federal countries. However we decided not to go for the federal scheme.
@@danielbarreiro8228 yes that’s it but just to clear it up Andalucía has 8 provinces but Castilla y León which is less populated is the one with most provinces with 9
Unfortunately right now if you want to travel to any city from any city that isn't Madrid it takes way too long. Don't get me wrong, whenever I had to go to Madrid it was a bless using the HSR, but if I want to go to Barcelona I'll probably take anything other than HSR.
I'm really looking forward to getting more connections between cities other than Madrid, I'm sure people would use it more.
They added a service from Granada to Malaga a couple of months ago that reduced travel time to about 75 minutes. Unfortunately there are only a few trains a day currently and evidently it's mostly booked up - and that's before the tourist season began.
The first Spanish Train,in Cuba.
india & Europe Joint Partnership Railway Network the Indian railway network is the world's second largest under one management. The network covers more than 7,000 stations and has a route length of 67,312 kilometers. The United States has the world's longest railway network, with a route length of over 250,000 kilometers.
The Indian railway network also owns facilities like locomotives and coach-production at several places. The network has divisional officers, divisional heads, station masters, manufacturing units, training establishments, PSUs, and other undertakings.
Sería interesante explicar que el proyecto de AVE en España está también en relación con el cambio de ancho de vía, además del turismo. Y me extraña que no se aluda a las mayores obras de infraestructura en los túneles de Madrid a la meseta (9 y 26 kilómetros) y en Asturias.
Vete a tu pueblo
gauge changer is like the lever to activate 4x4 in a car but for trains
Although the cost and wether such large Network is actually required is questionable, you need to take into consideration that Spain has a very large unnemployment rate, above 15%.
Such infracstructure projects provide much needed jobs.
Also Spain is very tourist dependant and in long term, It will help in providing a state of the art system for people to move around.
Now low cost companies are allowed to run trains, which are bringing prices down, which has been a turn off until now, (as prices were too expensive for the average person)
Spain Will be well prepared when Airlines are requested to stop short trips flights...which is already happening (EU regulations).
So yes, might sound expensive now but It has its advantages too...
I can only assume passengers will increase significantly this decade due to abovementioned factors...
2021 unemployement rate in spain is 13,1% not above 15
@@aymanla471 Official one, not *real* one 🙄
@@BlackHoleSpain the real one is much lower since alot of spaniards work in the underground economy they get payed lower than minimum wage but they dont pay taxes
Spain really seems to be optimally prepared if short haul flights get banned in the EU. Germany for example will struggle hard, as their rail network is already congested and plagued with constant delays.
It is really poorly thought when you se the use numbers on the HSR. For the salary of the people in Spain, it is not easy to pay the costs even when so many times is cheaper to go by plane than the HSR. I needed to do every 1-2 month during 6m the route Barcelona-Madrid (the 2 biggest cities) and only once was a better choice to go by HSR than Plane… imwhen I was in Japan, all times was better to go by HSR than plane each time.
Bueno... Que sea más barato hacer el viaje en avión no significa que sea mejor. Para tomar un avión, debes de presentarte en el aeropuerto con bastante tiempo de antelación para facturar, hacer checking, etc etc... Un tren prácticamente es llegar y montarse. Si los españoles no usamos los trenes de alta velocidad no es por el precio, es porque seguimos usando mucho el coche. Los españoles preferimos la versatilidad y comodidad que ofrece viajar en un coche con la familia que un tren de alta velocidad.
nice video, Can you do maybe the rail evolution of South African (the country)
'The province of andalusia' sounds disgusting as an andalusian myself hahaha (it is never called a province, a term used for smaller territories, for example "Andalucia" is divided in 8 provinces). Also not great pronuncation of places like Vigo or Málaga, but besides that great video, so detailed 9.9/10 👍
Spain... Even the Trams here reach 110kmh, Spain got the first Tram-Train doing Intercity and Metro service at same time since 15 years ago, the CITYLINK light train... CITYLINK (property os Stadler Rail now) today is used from UK to Germany or México, and its copied by other Tram manufacturers.
If you want to travel to or from Madrid, the system works. And other than Barcelona to Valencia, the system sucks. Try going from Valencia to Granada or Valencia to Leon. Valencia to Leon would be about a 1.5 hour flight, but none is offered, so you spend 6+ hours on the HSL because you have to travel through Madrid and spend a good hour there stopped in both train stations. I live here and I drive everywhere.
Madrid is the capital of Spain and it's right in the middle. It's clear
@@klausbriesma9050 No shit, that's what I said.
@@klausbriesma9050 but the vast majority of Spanish population, industry and tourism is located along the Mediterranean coast, so it would make a lot of sense to make HSR there (studies show it would be very beneficial and the EU also asked for and gave funds for it).
But the government is only pushing for HSR to and from Madrid, and that way you end up with the 2nd and 3rd cities of the country, which are superclose to each other (Valencia and Barcelona) not being connected by HSR yet...
With all these HSR lines you wonder why Spain’s gdp isn’t the size of Japan’s?
Because Japan has more than double our population. HSR can be build for (relatively) cheap if done well, and Spain is proof of that.
Can you make a video about Turkish HSR too?
Any plans to discuss the new high-speed train contract for Siemens in Egypt?
Sure
Looking forward that. There are also several railway projects being done currently.
7:55 the connection was EXECUTED not "realized.
The largest and most technically advanced high speed train network in Europe
So very nice.
Can you make a video on INDIAN RAILWAYS ?
Railway lines in Spain were very old. Many of which were built by the end of the XIX century or in the first half of XX. To put an example, to travel from Madrid to Malaga you needed nearly 10 hours while now it's about 2h30m. So you can imagine that it was mandatory to build fully new lines to make the system usufull. No savings were posible upgrading old lines. Also Spain has less population and differently distributed than France, China or Japan so it's more difficult to get high percentage occupation of trains but it's experted that with the introduction of new competitors such french and Italians trains, prices will significantly decrease and new quality services will make far more attractive the high speed network. The show starts really now!! It's really very exciting .
Not really....Spain gets 84 million tourists and they love the trains better than the planes...The trains do not delay like the planes...
Be careful. €30 extra charge per suitcase when traveling on AVELO.
Can't wait for the italian video :D
Este video toda vía le faltan vías ave, pues hay una línea, Toledo, Cáceres, Merida, Badajoz Evora Lisboa...
Las conexiones de Burgos y País Vasco no salen, y que desembocan en Francia por Irun Hendaya.
Y la conexión de León por Pajares, a Oviedo y Gijon.
Tampoco sale la conexión ave Madrid Ciudad Real, Córdoba Granada y que en nada seguirá a Almería y a Lorca y Alicante.
Las líneas planificadas salen un momento en la explicación con líneas discontínuas. No hablemos todavía de cosas que no están en funcionamiento.
Wow, Spain's 3622km high-speed rail mileage is 1000km more than my hometown in Anhui Province, China😁
yea china sometimes bad at it
5500km soon
Are they using 1668 mm gauge for HSR?
No, standard UIC gauge.
Meanwhile here in Portugal we don't have anything.
Sucks.
Our international connections are also terrible.
The network looks indeed interesting, but the lack of the HSR connection between Madrid and Lisbon is somewhat surprising
The Portuguese government is not interested in building the line, however the line is being built in the Spanish side so hopefully some day we'll have Madrid-Lisbon in less than three hours
Ten years ago, Portugal was in the midst of the financial crisis so they cancelled a lot of expensive infrastructure programs. Portugal is now again planning to build two lines, one from Lisbon to its other large cities in the north towards Galicia, and another from the Spanish border until Évora, halfway to Lisbon.
Lisbon needs to update their system....They have to pay for it....
Why there is no high-speed rail to Portugal?
It's on the way, it will connect Lisbon-Oporto-Vigo
So mean the first High-speed Line was Madrid-Seville. That year Seville held the 1992 Expo, BUT Barcelona had the 1992 Olympics...
There was some political issues there. Barcelona already had a lot of investment in infrastructure to support the Olympics so it wasn't politically acceptable that it would have the HSR as well. And, anyway, most of the attendees to the Olympics were not going to be arriving by train anyway, since the connection to France was not even being discussed at the time. And, Catalans always want to connect to all of the world, except to the rest of Spain, which also was a main cause of the delay on the line Madrid-Barcelona.
Well, the prime minister was from Seville... If Josep Borrell was prime minister of Spain back then, I'm sure the line to Barcelona would have been the first built!
@@danielbarreiro8228 You can't justify the high speed line construction to seville just because in Barcelona there was already sufficient inversion. If you are going to build a high speed corridor, do it where you know there will be more demand. From 1992 to 2007, in 15 years there would have been a way bigger accumulation of cash flows from the Madrid Barcelona line, in contrast with the Andalusian corridor. Not doing this line first has been worse for the whole country economy and development.
Please tell me are you form one of yhe yugoslav countries?
Yes. We are from Serbia!
Znao sam, čuje se akcenat kad izgovaraš imena gradova.
It's been argued that the exposure of politicians cutting ribbons may have been a factor in Spain's HSL expansion. Considering its GDP per capita, the question arises whether these were prudent investments, or fanciful halo projects. Because a high-speed line is much more glamorous than some commuter railway.
So... I'm a bit ambivalent about the Spanish HSR adventure. It's impressive, it covers most of the country, but is it really worth it? We have seen in other countries, notably Japan but also France, that a high-speed rail network allows people to move quicker, and it can have a positive effect on the economy. Whether this is the case in Spain, or whether it will be so in the future, is not clear to me.
The line between Madrid and Barcelona is the most traveled high speed route in Europe, so much so that other european operators like SNCF and Trenitalia are starting to run their own high speed trains on the line to compete with Renfe. The line has basically paid for itself at this point.
Passenger numbers are increasing with the new low cost operators and the completion of the line to Galicia. The agreement between Iberia (airline) and Renfe (trains) to unify tickets between 14 cities and Madrid Airport is also helping; regional flights were always loss makers for Iberia and now they are giving up wherever possible.
@@AlexDahl See, that's the kind of news I like to hear. Thanks!
@@tucuuk Cool, thanks for the info.
Feels like you are on a political crusade and you couldn't care less about the actual network and what it brings. Enjoy your pandering
Extremadura is lava
Y otra cosa que no dice el video, es que circulan trenes de las operadoras RENFE y la AVLO española estatal, ILSA Española privada, OUIGO francesa y la IRYO Italiana.
Solamente se ven del operador RENFE, y casualmente un OUIGO, en todo el video.
Lo explica en el otro video
They haven't been beneficial to society? I highly doubt that. High speed rail is so much more convenient than air travel, and also a lot cleaner and therefore better for the environment.
It will be less of a financial burden for Spanish passengers to keep traveling long-distance as oil (and one of its main derivatives, plane tickets) keeps getting more expensive. Plus, Spain has tons of untapped solar power capacity which can be used to pump electricity into the grid during the day (when the trains are running).
@@wyqtor Yup.
@@wyqtor not exactly a fan of destroying huge patches of environment and landscape to put solar pannels. i much prefer nuclear power
@@francisquito4590 Normally I would agree with you, but Spain has vast tracts of semidesert bushlands on which it can install solar panels.
As a spanish citizen, let me tell you that what Spain lacks still to this day is improving its short distance (conventional) railways. HSR is cool and does a lot of marketing but it has been designed poorly and with a political scope (instead of technical). So it is a huge waste of money. And wasting money is not beneficial to society
I love the Spanish railway system, but the prices for the medium and long distance trips are not affordable for the average people. It's more than twice than what would cost going by car even with today's gas prices.
Also, travelling on main lines are a joy, but once anyone needs to travel somewhere that's not on the way to Madrid, it becomes painfully slow and expensive, like Cádiz-Málaga which is +1h compared to going by car.
I had a pleasure of travelling on an AVE train from Madrid's Atocha to Barcelona's Sants. Pretty cool. One issue though, not related to trains, was that Barcelona's cab drivers refuse to speak foreign languages and I don't know Spanish/Catalan.
They know Spanish but refuse to speak sometimes...Everyone knows Spanish...
Viva Vigho
I just WISH they'd finish the Lisbon line and the Mediterranean corridor.
Blood Madrid-centric
When rail nation India will come?
Waiting eagerly!
Europe should have standardised track gauge width…. Like IEEESA, to have standardised operational protocol in high speed railways.
Most high speed railways in Europe are already pretty standard. With the Spanish high speed network being standard gauge, 25 kV AC and having ERTMS, I'd say they're pretty close to that standard. Iberian gauge is only used for lower speed railways
Coudl you do a video on Poland's or the Czech Republic's plan to more or less emulate Spain in terms of HSR construction in the next 12 years? Poland will connect most cities to the new airport between Warsaw and Łódź while the Czechs basically want to connect lines to all of their neightbours.
Da ist das System in Deutschland halt schon besser, weil es nicht nur auf die Hauptstadt ausgerichtet ist und die Züge auch viel öfter fahren. Bisher hat man meistens jede Stunde eine Fahrmöglichkeit in eine Richtung und mit dem Deutschlandtakt dann sogar alle 30min.
Genau, aber die Deutsche ICE sind durchschnittlich leider nicht so Pünktlich wie die Spanische AVE.
@@javierserrano4257 ja das liegt halt an den Mischstrecken und den vielen Zwischenhalten
@@stuttgartspotting Eben
What I like most about the German trains is that there are no security checks to get to the platform. But after 2004, I can't really say I blame the Spaniards for being cautious.
Starting to think USA should just give up on HSR and go straight to maglev for new intercity services then wipeout all long distance trains east of I-35
You want to build even more expensive tracks when we can't even get 125 mph service on the NE corridor?
0:38 Looking at that map, it looks like they are completely trying to avoid Portugal. As far as I know, there's not a single rail connection in operation these days between the two countries, which is kind of a shame to be honest.
There is a Madrid to Lisbon high speed conection planned.
Also, the Madrid-Lisbon line was the prefered line when Spain began building it's high speed Network, but the Portuguese were not interested
There is. There's a conventional line running trains between north Portugal and the Spanish region of Galicia.
This is the fault of the successive Portuguese governments that didn’t want to invest on a truly high speed network connected with Spain (and the rest of Europe)
The Madrid-Extremadura-Portugal border is being built. It would be up to Portugal from there.
It's all Portugal's fault. The line Madrid-Extremadura is being built but Portugal doesn't wanna continue it until Lisbon. Portugal now wants to be connected to Galicia by high speed train, but they have not build anything. So what are they waiting for?
we got diferent mm in the rails to avoid the french use them to takeover.
There were no railroads in Spain in 1808
@@danielmarero334 edited cuz i was high
@@danielmarero334 The first one was in 1848 between Barcelona and Mataró...The first modern train was built by Talgo in 1942
I really enjoy these videos... but god damn I get sometimes triggered by the pronunciation of some names! Like Madrid, Barcelona and Lleida for example are very good. But on some others like Málaga or Córdoba I'm just like WTF! It's MÁlaga and CÓRdoba, instead of MáLAga and CórDOba...
I'm I the only one? Or am I being triggered for nothing? xD
When we learn English names we try pronouncing them as the English speakers do...Others should do the same with the Spanish ones...But I noticed this is rarely done by foreigners...
👍👍
to be completely honest with you, the problem here is putting madrid as an unskippable station. there't tons of people in the valencian region that want to go to barcelona by train and while the euromed is pretty alright, an ave line would definately help. Cuz now if I, for example, living in Castellón, want to go to barcelona using the AVE, I'd have to first wait for a train to come here (which is a lot less often than in other places) go to valencia at a much slower speed than it should, wait there as it technically is a terminus, then go to madrid. Once in Madrid, i'd have to get on a different train to go to barcelona. which is just stupid. Madrid is the grave of spanish economy, it should never have become the capital.
You already have the Euromed that takes 2:10 from Castellón to Barcelona. These will get faster once the work between Valencia and Vandellós is completed
@@tucuuk yes but we are talking strictly about the AVE here.
@@francisquito4590 Still high speed rail. There will not be a full 300km/h line as the thin and undulating strip of land between the sea and the mountains does not allow for that (at a reasonable cost)
2nd an 3rd largest cities no connected?
From Barcelona to Valencia? Of course not, we hate each other >:(
(just kidding)
@@xedea0 Si pero Valencia es mejor
Madrid-centric view of the network, as always...
Spanish president ???
Such an amazing system, but as a user is a shame that all HSR lines link with madrid, is pretty inneficient for most of the times.
The corredor mediterráneo is being built
We've been 30 years building the network... and must begin from somewhere useful. Which place would have you chosen instead?
Everything is done, nobody will be left behind. But remember we're the 2nd biggest country in Europe and these things take time.
@@BlackHoleSpain Why make an Alicante Madrid Line instead of an Alicante Valencia Line, The AL-VAL Line would've attracted more passengerxkm than an Alicante Madrid Line, its a shame the fact of branching lines to prioritise the fast connections with madrid instead of neigbouring cities.
Let's not forget about how Spanish politicians only care about centered transport and have left abandoned the Mediterranean corridor
They are working in the med corridor from tarragona to granada some sections are already finished the section between murcia and almeria will open in 2026 and btween almeria and granada in 2028
That is why they are investing in the Mediterranean corridor building railways in Madrid...
Dedicated to the two people below, that talked without knowledge @Ayman LA and @123bmwck, there is no possibility of doing more than 300kms by High Speed Rail within Spain in the Mediterranean. Only two major cities are connected: Barcelona and Tarragona plus on a single rail line when it was meant to be 2 lines.
So please next time, do a bit of research, so that you can spare some time looking like fools :)
@@AM-ud4xf The only fool here is you. Dude I have worked in the project and the age you are portraying is simply false
@@bfedezl2018 Well since you are calling me a fool, I will address you as a clown (which btw u are) and thank you for clarifying that you worked on the project, no wonder that if people with 0IQ work on this, it is more than normal that it will take ages to complete. Can you let me know in which comment I said something about years? I only said that the vast majority of budget, investment and funding went to Madrid and not to the Mediterranean corridor, which is true there are thousands of public certified documents that support this, I encourage to do some research and better prepare yourself before chatting bs on internet, so you can spare yourself looking like a D, like you are now.
It should be emphasized that Belgium is the absolute leader in ERTMS (in terms of track distance covered) , followed by France and then Spain. Luxembourg is the relative leader with having 100% coverage and ETCS L1 being a requirement to operate on the Luxembourgish network.
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Lots of right angles in Spain. Doesn’t mane much sense.
Except Spain is now drowning in debt
@euskoferre this is one big piece
@euskoferre yes, do your homework and learn
@euskoferre there have been many many pieces done on Spain's massive over spending on rail. Maybe time to be a bit less lazy, and do your homework. Type in Spain overspending rail. Maybe educate yourself instead of posting nonsense
@euskoferre are you Spanish
The size of the network has been driven by populism. I appreciate the comfort you have and the technology but high-speed lines are very expensive to maintain and are meant for wealthy countries. As far as I know, none of the lines brings any profit other than looking good like I said. The first line was constructed to the home town of the company´s director. This is the level of logic/planning they had when building many lines...
The worst part is that they are extending them which means even higher maintenance costs while regional lines that do the ¨heavy lifting¨ face delays, accidents and struggle to deliver despite the big confidence that passengers have in this type of transport.
They bring an immense ecological value compared to planes and it could be the selling and turning point but if they are not marketed enough the opportunity to make the finally profitable will go to waste.
After the arrival of SNCF, we can buy tickets starting at 5€ (SNCF) or 9E (AVLO). I am curious what Trenitalia will bring too later this year, if the launch is still on schedule.
"none of the lines brings any profit" the Madrid vs Barcelona does indeed, that's why so many other operators bid to compete there
@@whispie. Madrid-Sevilla too
@euskoferre They do though. Healthcare and education maybe qualify for what you say. But even for these, the return of investment is a healthy and educated population.
Public transport can and needs to not be a whole in the budget otherwise it will have no research, no progress, dated rolling stock, low speed and overall be a very low quality end product.
@euskoferre What's wrong with public services generating money?
Let's talk about historical facts. All railway networks started as privately owned and funded. Later, after they became bigger and each region had its own, the discussion about centralization appeared.
Again, there are fields where public funding is the only solution like the medical field.
@euskoferre Railways started private pretty much everywhere in Europe.
In Spain, the first line was Barcelona - Mataro. Then others were created mainly where industries needed them like coal mining for example and as they expanded the formed regional railways. These later united into what we have now.
Sorry but countries like China, Iran, North Korea don't really qualify as having a normal economy due to their political regimes which is a different topic.
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As the network may be impressive,we must remmember the cost of a single ticket from BCN to MAD,for example. The cheapest is around 99€. Thats why AVLO was created. For the average user the cheapest way to travel from BCN to MAD is to get on a plane with Iberia or Vueling for 45€ or less (pre covid 2019 prices). Even today people preffer to take the plane rather than pay Renfe for its HSR.
Renfe knew that the "monopoly" they have over the railnetwork is going to be over when the market opens to foreign companies. Currently FS is getting the necesary permits to operate in spain with its Frecciarossa trains. Ouigo just slapped them in the face with cheap tickets. And unfortunatelly they lost a lot of passengers and its costing a LOT of money to tax payers to maintain and pay for those "public" 3622km of high speed network. Also is interesting to mention the corruption or abuse of power. There are almost 20 stations that caused concern to the public eye due to their "unusual" location while serving a village with no more than 20.000 inhabitants. As you mentioned in the video, yes the numbers are fancy, the rolling stock is great but they are so full of crap that its beyond imagination. Just look at the state of the commuter network. Branch lines are closing due to lack of passengers. Prices skyrocketed, you have a S-Bahn type train going to Valencia in some instances
I can see that you read the talking points of the airline and fossil fuel lobbies.
@@tucuuk and here comes the first hater... The truth usually hurts. I bet you are very hardcore fan of renfe ,given your bland and boring response. Cheers.
@@Alex18800 Can you name those 20 stations in villages with no more than 20000 people? Can you explain why I can buy a ticket from Madrid to Barcelona for €19 at Renfe's site...You are the one that should be providing proof...
@@tucuuk You can google it yourself. There is an article on some very nice newspapers from spain, abc for example. Now yes,you can buy for 19€ ticket after they got slapped in the face from Ouigo and airtravel. The facts are out there.
@@Alex18800 So you admit that you have no evidence?
Sorry but you lost me at ertms so I switched off 🤷
I did expect HSR in Spain to be innefficient, but not like this, oh my god
Several points. Any metric on a "per km" basis is going to penalize a country like Spain with dense cities located relatively far away from each other. By contrast, Spain has very very cheap construction costs, so in metrics like "passengers per invested euro" Spain is actually above other countries in Europe. In addition, there is a long way to go in terms of improving the use of the network. Specific bottle necks (such as the tunnel connecting Atocha and Chamartín, or the fact that Valencia has a cul de sac station, or the fact that the network does not connect yet to any major airport) significantly deter network scaling. Nevertheless, with the introduction of private competition and the fixing of some of those bottle necks, greater use will be achieved in the short run. HSR network construction is, ironically, a marathon and as should it should be taken.
You chose to look at the half empty glass, not the half full one...Opinions can be misleading,,
0:40 Is not "Gerona" but "Girona".
Same for "Castelló" instead of "Castellón", and "Alacant" instead of "Alicante".
The national language is Spanish, therefore is it ok to write it or say it...
@@amparoalvarez9001 The national language is Catalan, even if Spanish is also official.
The official name of the city is Girona (not Gerona), and if you write in a foreign language (in this case English) and you don't have a name in that language, you must use the local name (in this case Catalan) instead of using a third-language name.
@@mussaranya As per whom... you? The only language spoken in all Spain is Spanish, then you have the regional languages or dialects...So no, I would say it in Spanish...Everyone knows Spanish...Who knows Catalán? Not that many people...Spanish is the second most spoken language in the world...Good day and I rest my case...
@@amparoalvarez9001 If you can't distinguish a language and a dialect, is not worthy to talk with you, due to your ignorance.
Btw, Spanish is not "the second most spoken language", because you have English, Chinese and Hindi, then maybe Spanish.
@@mussaranya No dear: It is Chinese, Spanish and English, in that order...And I know what a language is... I speak four of them...and I know Catalán is a regional language...Or are you trying to tell me they speak Catalán all over Spain? You are upset because I do not agree with your ego based opinion about what Catalán is, A REGIONAL LANGUAGE while Spanish is an international language, THE SECOND AFTER CHINESE...It doesn't matter if it hurts your feelings...The truth needs to be said...Let your ego take a walk...Good bye...Not interested in your pettiness...
The titles misleading. Spain merely has the longest high speed rail line. For network it would be Germany.
Not high speed
We are talking about high speed train tracks nothing else...
The largest and also the most stupid High-Speed Rail network not in Europe, but in the whole world.
@euskoferre do you know how many stations from that network were closed just months after been finished? Do you know how many miles of that rail network are actually out of service due to null demand? Do you know how much does each mile of that network cost?
@euskoferre google for ghost stations and non used network you lazy arse
@euskoferre also check out for average users per network mile and compare this data with the data from other high speed train networks worldwide. This network will never be amortized.
PD: circula, no molestes más.
@euskoferre discussion? Me? With you? Ain't no argue unless you show some kind of braincell activity.