I got my Control forge after watching this video. Today six years later I watched it again and realised you not only explain the CF, you also manage to explain the very core of modular behaviour.
Thank you for demystifying this module. It looked intimidating at first but now I see it’s easy to understand and use. I’d like to own one, but am scratching my head as to how to employ it ‘meaningfully’ (as you eluded to). Still, I think for the pure joy of experimentation and exploration, it would be worth my while.
Is the only way to sync ctrl forge to external tempo that of setting it at the same bpm and resetting its “sequence” from the trigger input every X bars?
Many thanks for this demo: it's clearly an astonishingly powerful module, but intimidatingly so. Your demo helps break down some of that intimidation and open up its enticing possibilities.
now see... to ME... crazy 100 cable patches with a dozen modules are more complicated. i'd rather use this than a dozen utilities (especially maths & rampage... god do i ever HATE those "hide your functions" modules) yes... as far as MODULES go, it's a BIT complicated, but once you learn how to "define a step" in a preset, then each step afterwards becomes redundant after you get by the learning curve of what each variation in "curves" sounds like. then you'd have to learn how to stack your presets into sequences. once you get past the learning curve, it would get a lot easier AND, once you save your presets, you can save A LOT of time repatching & dialing. i like the idea of working on a screen where you can both see & edit your "steps" as well as being able to go nuts on timing. it works the way modulations "should work" for me.
Thank you. This was interesting, surprisingly easy to understand, and I'm also surprised to see how relatively old this module is. Love how shallow it is regarding menu and apparent ease of operation, and yet again surprised to see this in contrast to how much consideration and thought it needs when deciding how and what it should be programmed to do. I am experienced enough to know that this would be pearls before swine on me as I would probably only scratch it's surface and make it do either to simple or really silly stuff. But as part of the fun with eurorack is to explore and learn, not only the modules and functions I got or want, I'm very intrigued and now more curious about Rossum's line of modules in general. For me it is equally interesting to try to understand how makers of modules think as how composers and musicians work.
IMO, Rossum developed this module too early and made some mistakes that have significantly limited its appeal. You can’t argue with the underlying engineering, but the UX and some of the practical limitations have made it a niche product.
@@MartinDoudoroffLLC Thank you Martin for replying to a comment for such an old post. I don't know much more than what you demonstrated but I think for the size and functions It should have more outputs. I have since I wrote that comment had a look and listen to some of their/his other modules, and to me the Spectral Resynthesizer is the most appealing out of all of them, although it is rather big. Would not mind trying the filters either but I found out that I preferer several smaller and simpler than a complex one, although a stereo filter would be good. In general I preferer less complex modules and although the sampler is probably good, it does not interest me that much. Then the Mob of Emus look nice to, although with Pamela's New Workout and the Abstract Data Octocontroller I have enough of multi function and multi output modules and Oscillators. Still interesting though to see and follow what makers like Rossum who think a bit outside the box are coming up with.
@@jonaseggen2230 XAOC Devices Zadar often scratches the itch for more “arbitrary” fluctuating CV in a simpler package. Mob of Emus is intriguing, but may have fatal flaws, based on the thread commentary I’ve read. As for size, I would submit you need to recalibrate: all Eurorack modules, even the largest of them, are already small-they are ALL miniaturized devices. It’s popular these days to try to cram as many hyper-miniaturized modules as possible into a small rack, but it comes at a chronically underestimated cost in usability and focus.
@@MartinDoudoroffLLC Yes I agree. I like real knobs and a reason for why I didn't go down the Korg Volca rout. My oscillators are usually connected to Mordax Data in tuning mode because it is to easy to get them out of tune by accident when playing : ) I also in general preferer simpler modules so that, 1) I don't get lost in a module but relate to the whole and or relationship between the modules and sounds, and 2) Can keep an overview as functions are not hidden inside. This last is one of my main reasons for eurorack instead of regular synths.
Yes I have to agree...this is THE mothership of all CV generators as far as I know. That Wogglebug or a Swamp is a great satellite for this planet! Thanks for making this easy to understand!
Thanks definitely helpful, I was surching just this to step into programming more easy Let me just remind all users that all this power and flexibility is at hand in play mode which really takes away the pressure to thoughtful programming and lets you play buttons and 2 knobs over whichever selected program, that is gorgeous
@@ritec Some folks love it, some do not. You may be able to get a deal on a used one. In the end, you either gel with the gestalt or you do not. Ultimately, I did not. Too fussy for me. If you’re sufficiently motivated to master it and work with it, there’s no question that it can do things nothing else can, but it takes work.
Thanks - that was a really helpful overview. I think I have a handle on what the module is now - I may have to get one. Now, if you could do the same type of overview for Band of Emus, that would be great!
I only just discovered Dave Rossum's modules a few weeks ago. I have to say, if I'd known about his stuff a year ago, I'd have not bought many of the modules I have, and would have had a rack built mainly of his modules. I'm itching to get my hands on a Trident, a Panharmonium, a Morpheus, etc, quite astounding stuff really (the Control Forge .. maybe). Interesting that you mention Orthogonal Devices, but their availability makes them not so attractive. Whereas Dave Rossum's modules are readily available, and although not the same (exactly) as OD, they seam to have similar 'deep' possibilities that no other module makers are offering.
This thing seems awesome but why can't you sequence it based on musical time (notes, bars) and then clock it? Who has time to calculate the number of seconds for a dotted eigths based on X BPM ?
i mean every rossum module is gold, because we all know he is a genius. but the acid rain maestro can do very similar things, with less work eventho without screen. i have both.
this is almost EXACTLY the tool i've been imagining to be able to break out of LFO/ADSR straight jackets. THIS is how you make boings & dubstep wobbles. the only thing missing, would be being able to trigger it and have it follow a pitch so you could PLAY the sequences, but it's cool for 1 shot sound design & i never would have imagined the "granular" of "crossfade" envelopes, but CURVES are VERY cool. now, if rossum could COMBINE the CV envelopes with pitch tracking AND envelopes, they'd REALLY have something, but as it stands now, i'd call it 100x cooler than maths or rampage, but THIS module's "straightjacket" is its one pitch only limit.
i'm talking about the kind of pitch modulations you can do with AWESOME control forge... even if it doesn't keyboard track & let you play your envelopes. follow a pitch = play a note (on a keyboard) that's modulated, like, say, a violin trill. i don't speak modular, sorry, but i could have SWORN that "pitch tracking" was the technical term for keyboard modulation of pitch with CVs. i mean, when you play C#, control forge would apply your pitch envelope to C# as it would EVERY note you play instead of just make one off notes of its own, so you could, for instance, draw a "doo-wah" pitch envelope & then PLAY a "doo-wah *DOO-WAH doo-wah* doo-wah" (or, limiter portamento style, in your language... but with fine control over the CURVEs & timing and NOT awful ARTIFICIAL sounding, if you ask me, linear slew limiter glides, or in MY LANGUAGE... "put some stank on it") bass line or make a springy "boing boing boing" INSTRUMENT that you can play with a keyboard. i'd like to PLAY tones that have swoopy warbles or the sound like "slow down, then speed up" scratches etc. it's really hard speaking plain english to techs! LOL
Ok. So, conceptually, Control Forge is like a wildly elaborated ADSR. Instead of having four segments (A-D-S-R) you have 1-8 segments (or more, by chaining them together), and each can have different transition behaviors (rather than linear signal movement) and logic. If you use it in place of an ADSR to control a VCA or filter cutoff, it doesn’t care what pitch you play because in that scenario it has nothing to do with pitch-it is “agnostic”. So, yes, you can sort of do the things you describe, but it’s not going to get you out of artificial territory like, say, MPE MIDI (Linnstrument, ROLI) or a Haken Continuum. CF can do gymnastics, but they’re not specially expressive gymnastics.
I got my Control forge after watching this video. Today six years later I watched it again and realised you not only explain the CF, you also manage to explain the very core of modular behaviour.
I watch this video every month, I wish Rossum would compensate you to make a series of videos for this and all its different uses. Thank You Again!!
Thank you for demystifying this module. It looked intimidating at first but now I see it’s easy to understand and use. I’d like to own one, but am scratching my head as to how to employ it ‘meaningfully’ (as you eluded to). Still, I think for the pure joy of experimentation and exploration, it would be worth my while.
Best control forge video thanks
Is the only way to sync ctrl forge to external tempo that of setting it at the same bpm and resetting its “sequence” from the trigger input every X bars?
very helpful....you are a very good instructor!
Great video. Moved CF from 'I think I want this' into 'I definitely want this'. Appreciate your Just Friends videos as well.
Many thanks for this demo: it's clearly an astonishingly powerful module, but intimidatingly so. Your demo helps break down some of that intimidation and open up its enticing possibilities.
now see... to ME... crazy 100 cable patches with a dozen modules are more complicated. i'd rather use this than a dozen utilities (especially maths & rampage... god do i ever HATE those "hide your functions" modules)
yes... as far as MODULES go, it's a BIT complicated, but once you learn how to "define a step" in a preset, then each step afterwards becomes redundant after you get by the learning curve of what each variation in "curves" sounds like. then you'd have to learn how to stack your presets into sequences.
once you get past the learning curve, it would get a lot easier AND, once you save your presets, you can save A LOT of time repatching & dialing.
i like the idea of working on a screen where you can both see & edit your "steps" as well as being able to go nuts on timing. it works the way modulations "should work" for me.
Thank you. This was interesting, surprisingly easy to understand, and I'm also surprised to see how relatively old this module is. Love how shallow it is regarding menu and apparent ease of operation, and yet again surprised to see this in contrast to how much consideration and thought it needs when deciding how and what it should be programmed to do. I am experienced enough to know that this would be pearls before swine on me as I would probably only scratch it's surface and make it do either to simple or really silly stuff. But as part of the fun with eurorack is to explore and learn, not only the modules and functions I got or want, I'm very intrigued and now more curious about Rossum's line of modules in general. For me it is equally interesting to try to understand how makers of modules think as how composers and musicians work.
IMO, Rossum developed this module too early and made some mistakes that have significantly limited its appeal. You can’t argue with the underlying engineering, but the UX and some of the practical limitations have made it a niche product.
@@MartinDoudoroffLLC Thank you Martin for replying to a comment for such an old post. I don't know much more than what you demonstrated but I think for the size and functions It should have more outputs.
I have since I wrote that comment had a look and listen to some of their/his other modules, and to me the Spectral Resynthesizer is the most appealing out of all of them, although it is rather big. Would not mind trying the filters either but I found out that I preferer several smaller and simpler than a complex one, although a stereo filter would be good. In general I preferer less complex modules and although the sampler is probably good, it does not interest me that much.
Then the Mob of Emus look nice to, although with Pamela's New Workout and the Abstract Data Octocontroller I have enough of multi function and multi output modules and Oscillators.
Still interesting though to see and follow what makers like Rossum who think a bit outside the box are coming up with.
@@jonaseggen2230 XAOC Devices Zadar often scratches the itch for more “arbitrary” fluctuating CV in a simpler package. Mob of Emus is intriguing, but may have fatal flaws, based on the thread commentary I’ve read. As for size, I would submit you need to recalibrate: all Eurorack modules, even the largest of them, are already small-they are ALL miniaturized devices. It’s popular these days to try to cram as many hyper-miniaturized modules as possible into a small rack, but it comes at a chronically underestimated cost in usability and focus.
@@MartinDoudoroffLLC Yes I agree. I like real knobs and a reason for why I didn't go down the Korg Volca rout. My oscillators are usually connected to Mordax Data in tuning mode because it is to easy to get them out of tune by accident when playing : )
I also in general preferer simpler modules so that, 1) I don't get lost in a module but relate to the whole and or relationship between the modules and sounds, and 2) Can keep an overview as functions are not hidden inside. This last is one of my main reasons for eurorack instead of regular synths.
Yes I have to agree...this is THE mothership of all CV generators as far as I know. That Wogglebug or a Swamp is a great satellite for this planet! Thanks for making this easy to understand!
Thanks definitely helpful, I was surching just this to step into programming more easy
Let me just remind all users that all this power and flexibility is at hand in play mode which really takes away the pressure to thoughtful programming and lets you play buttons and 2 knobs over whichever selected program, that is gorgeous
What sort of play mode techniques have you found particularly useful?
maybe you could show us in a video?
working on it from same profil radpix
This is like a super elaborate and deep voltage block… one output instead of 8 though.
Yeah, sort of. Both tools pertain to arbitrarily fluctuating voltage.
@@MartinDoudoroffLLC I am wondering if I need one now 😅 I am into crazy sound design and this seems quite helpful for that.
@@ritec Some folks love it, some do not. You may be able to get a deal on a used one. In the end, you either gel with the gestalt or you do not. Ultimately, I did not. Too fussy for me. If you’re sufficiently motivated to master it and work with it, there’s no question that it can do things nothing else can, but it takes work.
Thanks - that was a really helpful overview. I think I have a handle on what the module is now - I may have to get one. Now, if you could do the same type of overview for Band of Emus, that would be great!
Alas, I don’t have a Mob of Emus to make a video demo for. From what I’ve read, it’s a bit odd.
I only just discovered Dave Rossum's modules a few weeks ago. I have to say, if I'd known about his stuff a year ago, I'd have not bought many of the modules I have, and would have had a rack built mainly of his modules. I'm itching to get my hands on a Trident, a Panharmonium, a Morpheus, etc, quite astounding stuff really (the Control Forge .. maybe).
Interesting that you mention Orthogonal Devices, but their availability makes them not so attractive. Whereas Dave Rossum's modules are readily available, and although not the same (exactly) as OD, they seam to have similar 'deep' possibilities that no other module makers are offering.
Oh man, same.
Great overview! Interesting to know there’s a module that does this kind of feedback programming
I guess I'm pretty off topic but does anyone know of a good website to watch newly released series online?
@Jonathan Harlan Ehh atm i have been using flixportal. just google after it:P -watson
@Watson Zaire Thank you, signed up and it seems like a nice service :) I really appreciate it !!
@Jonathan Harlan happy to help :)
@@jonathanharlan8237 you’re good at guessing!
This thing seems awesome but why can't you sequence it based on musical time (notes, bars) and then clock it? Who has time to calculate the number of seconds for a dotted eigths based on X BPM ?
CF is not a step sequencer. It’s something else.
Brilliant! thank you.
thanks for the demonstration
i mean every rossum module is gold, because we all know he is a genius. but the acid rain maestro can do very similar things, with less work eventho without screen. i have both.
hiya any possibilities youll do a modcan quad fo tutorial too ? thanks so much!
great 👍🏻
add bookmarks for the topics and this video would be perfect ;)
Thanks!
damn....I actually understand it 😄
This prompted me to buy one, thanks... :/
LOL! Well, it’s unique. A couple really excellent tutorials here:
www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2442157#2442157
and
www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2450353#2450353
this is almost EXACTLY the tool i've been imagining to be able to break out of LFO/ADSR straight jackets. THIS is how you make boings & dubstep wobbles. the only thing missing, would be being able to trigger it and have it follow a pitch so you could PLAY the sequences, but it's cool for 1 shot sound design & i never would have imagined the "granular" of "crossfade" envelopes, but CURVES are VERY cool.
now, if rossum could COMBINE the CV envelopes with pitch tracking AND envelopes, they'd REALLY have something, but as it stands now, i'd call it 100x cooler than maths or rampage, but THIS module's "straightjacket" is its one pitch only limit.
I’ve read this a few times and still do not understand what you mean by “follow a pitch” or “pitch tracking” in this context.
i'm talking about the kind of pitch modulations you can do with AWESOME control forge... even if it doesn't keyboard track & let you play your envelopes.
follow a pitch = play a note (on a keyboard) that's modulated, like, say, a violin trill. i don't speak modular, sorry, but i could have SWORN that "pitch tracking" was the technical term for keyboard modulation of pitch with CVs.
i mean, when you play C#, control forge would apply your pitch envelope to C# as it would EVERY note you play instead of just make one off notes of its own, so you could, for instance, draw a "doo-wah" pitch envelope & then PLAY a "doo-wah *DOO-WAH doo-wah* doo-wah" (or, limiter portamento style, in your language... but with fine control over the CURVEs & timing and NOT awful ARTIFICIAL sounding, if you ask me, linear slew limiter glides, or in MY LANGUAGE... "put some stank on it") bass line or make a springy "boing boing boing" INSTRUMENT that you can play with a keyboard. i'd like to PLAY tones that have swoopy warbles or the sound like "slow down, then speed up" scratches etc.
it's really hard speaking plain english to techs! LOL
Ok. So, conceptually, Control Forge is like a wildly elaborated ADSR. Instead of having four segments (A-D-S-R) you have 1-8 segments (or more, by chaining them together), and each can have different transition behaviors (rather than linear signal movement) and logic. If you use it in place of an ADSR to control a VCA or filter cutoff, it doesn’t care what pitch you play because in that scenario it has nothing to do with pitch-it is “agnostic”. So, yes, you can sort of do the things you describe, but it’s not going to get you out of artificial territory like, say, MPE MIDI (Linnstrument, ROLI) or a Haken Continuum. CF can do gymnastics, but they’re not specially expressive gymnastics.
why would you need this
well, it ain’t for everybody