Therapist Reacts to Will Smith and Chris Rock
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 มี.ค. 2022
- Therapist Reacts to Will Smith and Chris Rock //
The slap heard around the world! Watch this video as Therapist Reacts to Will Smith slapping Chris Rock at the 2022 Oscars. Was this toxic masculinity? Or was it awesome that he defended his wife?
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After reading his book and watching his mini series leading up to the book. Will talks a lot about feeling like a coward and it being directly tied to not standing up for his mother when she was being abused by his father and running and hiding in other situations where he could’ve protected someone and he hid and how he’s lived with it. He also talked about how his situation with his father has caused him to be a people pleaser and hides a his anger and frustration behind his humor and is very focused on being likable even at his own expense and how all of this has defined him as a man. And he’s working through this through therapy…. I think at the Oscar’s everything boiled over he struggled to find the balance between being the “nice guy” persona and finding the courage to be the protector (which he associates with his manhood)… I also think it’s important to note that he and jada have been the butt end of jokes for 2 years now and he hasn’t been able to protect his family. I think king Richard has given him some courage to try but he has not figured out how to do so in a healthy way just yet. I hope will will find a healthy middle ground through therapy soon
Beautifully said.
THIS
Really great insight here! ❤
You're talking about a 53 year old man like he's a junior high student. If Will hasn't used his boundless resources to address his issues and get his house in order by now, that's complacency and willfully keeping himself ill, and that's on him. He blames others, and that's not what a man does.
@@MoeMentos no… that’s judgemental everyone grows and becomes self aware In their own time (if ever at all) both will and jada are actively in therapy trying to heal through their individual issues and it’s on no one’s time line but their own however long it takes it’s not a quick “fix” it’s continual work. Everyone on has their flaws and week points, it’s not to be judged or assessed by any one else
I appreciate how you discussed this without demonizing anyone. There’s been a lot of that but as you said, we’re all human and we slip up at times.
Well said 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
Not demonizing? He demonized Rock by justifying the insane drunk behavior of Smith. Defending her wife of what? Was she in such danger that assault was necessary?
And then, we are the ones to blame for violent behavior. What about you condoning assault?
@@dmzone64 that was precisely my take away as well. And especially coming from a therapist I found it both distasteful and concerning
I’m demonizing Will. Demon on!
I've only seen one video talking about Will being ADHD, and seeing his reaction shift so quickly, it definitely reminded me of times that my emotional dysregulation/impulse control has gotten the best of me (especially when feeling protective of family/friends). The brain sees RAGE and then it feels like seconds later, reality is back and I'm immediately ashamed and feel terrible about my actions.
Adding in his stress levels with Best Actor nomination and his delicate relationship with Jada, I think it was a perfect storm of trigger points. I don't condone the violence, but I can certainly understand it.
Fuuuuuuuuuu(ck) same. That rage is scary when you're on the other side of it.
Idk about you, but for me it's like there's a psychopath switch, and once flipped there is no room sympathy or empathy left. Just rage. Like Liam Neason in Taken rage.
To be fair, it's not something that typically happens when people do things to me, I live in a constant state of feeling like I've done something wrong but haven't realized what yet. But uh, you come for someone who is vulnerable? Especially if it's someone I care about?? Run.
@@Victoria-dh9vb Yep, I've got a particular set of skills.. it's data gathering and I'm about to cut you a new one because I can poke at your insecurities like no one's business, no holds barred.. being late diagnosed ADHD, I'm realising the amount of CPTSD that I just didn't recognise, like hypervigilance (cough data gathering) and emotional dysregulation (RAAAAAAGE). CBT has helped me a lot in understanding internal vs external narratives.
@@Victoria-dh9vb I really recommend this channel, it has led to some really profound "Ohhhhhhh, that's why I'm doing this behaviour" moments:
th-cam.com/channels/bWvYupGqq3aMJ6LsG4q-Yg.html
I had that problem when I was younger, but I grew up and learned how to control and discharge that. It is NEVER okay to act out your rage on another human being. Go for a walk, do the dishes, sweep the floor, anything to interrupt your focus and move away from the anger.
Because we ADHD folk have really low blood pressure, we often get mad in order to get enough blood flow to our brains so we can think straight. There are other ways to do this. Take meds to raise your blood pressure a little, go for a brisk walk, jump up and down, but don't let your anger get out of control and start yelling at people. We are responsible for what we do and who we hurt with our actions.
@@eshbena blood... pressure... you're sure you didn't switch something up there?
I heard that Chris Rock was physically (and sexually) assaulted when he was in high school, and that he never learnt how to cope with that trauma in his growing age. I think that slap did more to him than we realise and I genuinely feel so bad for him, despite not wanting to. His joke was bad, period. But this whole situation has me feeling more sympathy for him than for anyone else. It just goes to show the ineffectiveness of using violence to communicate an understandable feeling.
He compared her to a badass, strong female character. The joke wasn't even mean spirited. Chris will be fine, he is already doing his comedy tour and after Will's slap, tickets have sky-rocketed for Chris's shows.
@@arraikcruor6407 That sounds super dismissive of people with unprocessed traumas - it can affect your entire life with feelings of shame and low self-esteem, not ideal for a stand up. And to have it available for constant replay? Hard to imagine it's not triggering some emotional issues for him.
@@arraikcruor6407 even after the slap while on tour he was still affected. He may be fine but let's hope that he fully gets over the embarrassment he may have felt
Honestly, I think it was a series of actions that weren't thought through properly on both sides. Chris Rock didn't think that joke through and didn't have the perspective of a person living with that type of condition (not that you need the experience to know that's a tasteless joke) and Will Smith reacted like a man at his breaking point who reacted instead of thinking it through. I know we don't like to think about this when enjoying a comedian making us laugh, but comedy is almost always (if not always) a way to cope with serious trauma! So two comedians triggering one another (even if by accident) is bound to end badly. It's possible to have empathy for all three people involved even if we don't agree with the actions of two of them.
@@kaitlyne1870 I wonder if Chris was even knew that Jada has alopecia. He might have just seen it as a lighthearted joke about her style.
Stephen Colbert said something that I had said to my partner the night it happened, which was that just not laughing would have been painful enough for Chris Rock. I said he could have let the joke fall flat and stayed in his seat yelling what he yelled, if he felt so inclined, and that would have gotten the point across just fine. They were both out of line, but the fact that they both apologized and did it so very kindly shows that lessons were learned on every side. It was definitely "toxic" behavior, but it's good to see that they were both able to take responsibility and can hopefully now move on and be bigger and better people going forward.
The issue is this has been an ongoing issue with Chris rock where will has told him multiple time to stop the jokes at some point people crack
@@rubiatfusigboye316 Chris Rock has previously said he has been diagnosed as being on the spectrum, specifically challenged in reading human faces/emotions. So, there's a reason
@@Hawther as someone on the spectrum and who has friends on the spectrum, that’s not an excuse. If this was the first or second time, I’d get it. But this is a repeated problem where people told him it was inappropriate and he should stop.
Chris Rock never apologized. There was a thing passed around being touted as a apology that turned out to be fake and not from Chris at all
Bang on the money.
For a seasoned professional - Will's behaviour is even more shocking. He could have ripped Chris apart in his acceptance speech or made a public post about how tasteless it was. His reaction suggests he's not doing too well mentally. For a man that grew up in a violent household, he knows the impact violence has on another. He took away his own moment at the Oscars and unfortunately for several others because of his actions. Not a legacy either will be proud of. Violence was not the answer, especially not on a platform being streamed to millions around the world.
agree!
Yep, 100%.
Yesssss!!
Come down on Will?? Maybe because he attacked someone for making a joke that he himself was laughing at SMH
And this wasn't between two men... Chris was roasting MANY celebrities that night, which is what he was hired to do.
Will attacking that man had more to do about Will's mental state than the joke.
He should seek help, obviously he's got much suppressed rage from all the shenanigans going on in his home.
Finally!!! Thanks for the comment. I was thinking of the consequences of that action of violence. I saw a second of fear in Chris Rock's eyes and that hit me like a truck. How that act will change comedy? Or The awards' show? It will have consequences
I really appreciate your example of looking at both sides with compassion and understanding. Too often, we see things in black and white when there are grey areas and so many factors involved in one situation. You give a great opportunity for guided critical thinking and I love it. Thank you for the fresh perspective. So much respect for your channels!
I could not agree with you more I agree with you absolutely wholeheartedly that in life today we need more thinking that isn't black and white bravo for saying that but in this case the guy missed the boat by a long long way he was NOT making fun of a medical condition he was joking about her haircut he like myself and the overwhelming majority of people had NO freaking idea about her alopecia mate he blew it
I just want to add my own perspective to this conversation. Firstly, I am a cis woman with health issues and disabilities (not alopecia though), and am a big proponent of having family members or close friends support and advocate for my health issues, particularly because I am not always in a position to do things without assistance. That being said, my family only does so with my consent and within the parameters that I have indicated being comfortable with. If my partner, family member, or friend responded like this to a comment/jibe/joke/etc. about my health issues, I would lose a lot of trust in that person because they have now opened me up for further criticism, judgement, and attacks. I also want to be given the opportunity to respond myself (if I can or want to), in my own voice, without someone else taking my power away from me further by impulsively acting on my behalf. It also perpetuates ableism, by creating assumptions that those with disabilities cannot take any action themselves, but instead must rely on a healthy, able-bodied person to do everything instead. I feel like this incident is something that could have been handled privately, with a public apology made later.
You said it better than I did. I hope more people pay attention to your words. Loss of trust and safety is huge.
Thank you. This sums up my thoughts better than I could!
100% agree. And along with ableism, it infantilizes women, perpetuating the idea that we cannot stand up for ourselves and need a strong man to do it for us. I get wanting to stand up for loved ones. But we should only do that when they want us to and they cannot do so for themselves.
Y'know, as someone with my own 'issues' that make my life challenging too, (still getting used to the idea of calling them 'disabilities,' to be honest 🙂) I was trying to find a way of articulating what you've said here. I couldn't have come up with a better way than you just did - you nailed it, thank you.
I completely understand what you're saying... but at the same time I sympathize with Will Smith.
Nothing makes me fly off the handle like people intentionally trying to harm my loved ones. Not because I believe my loved ones to be weak, or incapable of defending themselves, but because watching someone else hurt them feels worse than being hurt myself.
I also have a huge problem with bullies in general. It's not just about defending the person that is being harassed... I have a deep seeded desire to eviscerate anyone who has the mindset that it's acceptable to belittle and abuse others for their own enjoyment or benefit.
I have big "it's not about the money, it's about sending a message" energy.
Re: "of course they would apologize. It was a PR nightmare." And "the apologies were probably fake."
I've seen a lot of terrible apologies by people with the resources to have a professional write their apology. I think it takes a lot of maturity to agree to post an apology where you are admitting blame. Even if you are still hurt by the other party, or still feel somewhat justified, it shows a professionalism and courtesy not shown by everyone.
I think most people who hurt someone in the heat of the moment or thoughtlessly regret it when they've calmed down.
At this point, since both apologies were very good and addressed the wrong done clearly, I think the public has been given the resolution they need. If the apologies were fake, or there is more resolution needed, it is only between Chris Rock, Will Smith, Jada, the Academy, and possibly certain other concerned parties.
yeah! I totally agree. Even if it was fake, they still would of had to get their pride in check to agree to post something that puts them in a position of vulnerability. There are many people, who even if failing to do so would destroy their reputation and career, still would prefer to sit on their high horse and not accept blame of any sort. Even if the apologies in this scenario were fake, they were a step in the right direction.
I don't understand why they would have to apologize to the public. We were neither slapped nor ridiculed for a medical condition.
@@tyriaxepheles7996 exactly. I feel a lot more traumatized by having to explain to kindergartners that the shooting happened yesterday, they are safe at school today, and Noone is in an armed standoff in their neighborhood today.
@@tyriaxepheles7996 To say Jada was “ridiculed” by a ROAST comedian for a medical condition isn’t fair and considering context, as Chris Rock (and most of us) weren’t aware she had alopecia. Let’s not pretend she hadn’t sported a short hairdo for many, many years. It’s really too bad so many of you assume he’s malicious & out to hurt people, especially when he’s a comedian who has done this his WHOLE career, and he was severely bullied as a child. I feel like people just love to be offended these days (and that’s just a general observation, not to you specifically). Chris Rock could’ve joked about far worse things, like Jada’s “entanglement” with a man 25 years younger, that devastated Will Smith.
The public deserved an apology. Think about it. Will Smith interrupted a live awards ceremony in an incredibly disturbing way. That rage was so palpable. I can’t even begin to explain to you how triggering watching this stuff can be to those with trauma, specifically victims of assault, physical abuse/violence and emotional abuse who have experienced similar things. It can cause flashbacks, bring up past memories, amplify emotions, cause emotional dysregulation. I can’t even watch him yelling at Chris Rock. That anger was too familiar, kinda scary. Something more was going on; Will Smith’s response came from a far deeper place. It wasn’t just about a comedian whose cracked jokes like this his whole career. The apology was important.
For the laugh thing, I assumed it was one of those instant reaction laughs that you do in a situation you either haven’t fully comprehended yet or are unsure how to take.
Ya know? Like someone says some messed up joke or sketchy little bit, and at first you’re just huffing a little as you plan out how to go forward?
I remember being younger and someone made fun of me in a group and the only reaction I had for a few seconds as everyone around me laughed was to laugh lightly with them. At least until my thoughts started realigning. Does that make sense?
To me, it does absolutely make sense what you say. It reminds me of myself "laughing" at the misogynistic jokes of one of my (male) teachers back then at high school
Yep, perfect sense.
humans do not tolerate silence well. We 'um' while we put together a sentence to speak next, and we chuckle at things we might not think are actually funny -- because the alternative is outside our instinctual comfort.
I’ve usually been only Black person in any given group, and I’ve done that uncomfortable laugh at a racist joke. I can stand up for others, no problem, but standing up for yourself is much harder.
Oh, you described this so well! Yes, I know what you mean exactly. It's also what I thought happened here.
It's good to hear from someone suffering with alopecia. One thing I noticed with all the immediate press coverage was that it was about the two men in the situation. The one who made the ableist joke, and the one who resorted to violence. No one was addressing the woman who was made fun of, her thoughts and feelings, or respecting that she is a full grown woman who can think, speak and act for herself. She showed great restraint in not into this fight, publicly and riding above the crap.
So, ableist jokes aren't violence?
@@moraynerblacksmith5686 Sorry, I was referring to physical violence. I didn't mean to insinuate that they're not.
Not many people talk about her, because she did nothing wrong in this situation. We talk about two men who either both did something wrong or just one of them depending on personal opinion of the viewer.
i did see some people addressing the woman who was made fun of, but it was literally doubling down on the harassment suggesting SNL do bits about her cheating on will, saying she wears the pants in the relationship, saying he shouldn't even be with her much less defending her because of "all her cheating." basically continuing to punch down, and refusing to acknowledge that that is, in fact, punching down. as usual whenever a woman is victimized in some way, the outcome is always that the woman ends up victimized further.
@@moraynerblacksmith5686 Boldness is not a disability. Men used to make fun of being bold all the time. No one ever had a problem with that.
The thing I’ve found with laughing as a reaction is sometimes that initial laugh is a tension release. I know sometimes when I’m being vulnerable and feel myself choking up, laughing is me trying to ease that tension. Sometimes it’s reflexive.
great summary
Yes, exactly!
Plus, GI Jane is so dated, it could’ve taken a minute for him to remember what it meant
@@TheElicest That's a really good point.
Totally agree. I tend to laugh when I'm either nervous or uncomfortable.
I remember my initial reaction was: "good, he deserved the slap". And it took a couple of days for me to come to the conclusion that the way Will Smith stood up for someone he loves was not the best. I believe it's because I think that if someone made a joke about either my SO or any other member of my family, and I saw the pain on their faces, I would have slapped the dude twice in the heat of the moment.
Maybe if I had time to sit on the event a couple of minutes, I would just say something like: "That was not okay. You cannot poke fun at a person's appearance. Your joke was pathetic, and in bad taste". But in the moment, the rage most probably would take over me. Which doesn't make it all right, but I'm saying that it's an emotional reaction and in that moment some people might be unable to regain control over their emotions and behaviour that quick.
But unlike Will, you probably would have been arrested for assault, since you're not rich and famous.
@petrosinella well, that depends if the person they slapped chose to press charges, like how Chris was the one who chose not to press charges
As someone who also struggles with very rosy cheeks, when you shared your childhood struggle with feeling ostracized and feeling overweight that hit like a ton of bricks. I also look back at pictures and wonder why I thought so poorly of myself. I would love if you could do a video about your journey with dealing with body shaming and accepting your rosy cheeks, since I am still struggling and I find myself deeply ashamed and embarrassed of them.
One takeaway I get from this is how a single bad decision can turn a person from victim to villain and turn a winner to a loser. Before the slap, when Chris Rock told the joke, the crowd turned on him. You heard the groans and he tried to give a weak justification. "Oh come on that was a light one, okay."
Had Will left well enough alone, Chris would've left that stage looking like a heel. Maybe 10% of the people offended would think less of hi., and it would've been forgotten by 90%. But Will didn't. He got up and committed a felony on a live, worldwide broadcast. He risked kicked out, arrested, sued, and blacklisted for life over a wack joke. Will lost a few fans, and tarnished an impeccable image crafted over 30 yrs in less than 10 seconds. Chris, on the other hand, has won the sympathy of EVERY stand up comedian, and many people who saw him physically attacked. His respect skyrocketed for his poise, professionalism, tough chin, and generosity for NOT pressing charges, or responding with some nasty low hanging fruit that could've annihilated Will Smith's fractured ego. (He IS Chris Rock, the G.I. Jane joke really was a love tap by his capabilities.) That's why his concert is suddenly sold out, and one of his lamest jokes could've sparked a comeback. Will may owe him a real apology, but when the dust settles, Chris may owe Will a thank you while counting all his just got slapped money.
The protecting his wife narrative doesn't ride with me. He could've done that one on one, or just shouted his disapproval from his seat. I'm a married man. If I had to slap someone to protect my wife from words I would've already slapped both of her parents, one of mine, two uncles, two cousins, and a niece. Verbal attacks warrant verbal defenses and Will is articulate enough to use his words effectively.
I totally agree with your comments with one small revision. My comment is not based on semantics, but on legal definitions.
Will did not commit a felony. He committed a misdemeanor battery.
Depending on which State you’re in, if you did what Will did to Chris and were formally charged, you’d face get a maximum possible penalty of 30 days in jail, and that would likely be turned into no jail time, if it were a first offense.
Ironically, people generally use the legal term “assault” for what Will did because they believe that assaults require bodily contact. They don’t.
A “battery” is what requires physical contact. An “assault” is a verbal attack, which is arguably what Chris did to Jada.
That’s the clarification I wanted to make. Most people don’t understand the distinction between an assault and a battery and typically mix them up.
Will committed a misdemeanor battery because his physical contact did not result in “serious physical harm” to Chris, which would’ve turned Will’s slap into a felony battery.
Best response to a hurtful comment about somebody else was from a friend defending her sister. She looked at him, gave him her full attention and waited until she had his. She said "Not cool. Don't do it again." and then held that eye contact until they nodded and then she broke it. It was a line in the sand and it was clear that she was not going to accept his behavior. It wasn't playful and it wasn't physical. It was just a declaration in front of mutual friends that he crossed a line. She was 16 or so and the rest of us were about the same age or younger. But we were all mutual friends. And she was clear that she wasn't going to allow that. It was never mentioned again and it didn't need to be. It was just a moment in time. I don't remember who she said it to. But we were all careful about that line in the sand because none of us wanted to run up against the strength of will it takes to stare somebody down in high school.
As a therapist, I’ve been talking with clients about how triggered they felt by the violence they witnessed. Personally, I heard the joke, Jada as GI Jane, as aligning them - strong, powerful, beautiful women. Obviously that was not how she heard it. I wondered more, in the aftermath, about their child saying that’s how we do it in the Smith family. Violence? That worried me.
I actually thought the same thing towards the "joke". I thought, but GI Jane is a BADASS, and I would hold that as a compliment if it were ever said to me... but I also don't have a medical condition that causes me to lose my hair. Perspective matters. Not condoning the joke or the slap, but I understand the place where both came from.
I found Jaden Smith's comment was a bit unsettling too.
@@kriscynical Jada isn't bald by choice, no: but she's more than rich enough to present however she wishes. I'm not sure she belongs in the same category as women who can't afford a closet full of wigs and a team of stylists to properly secure & remove them before & after a big event. It doesn't make mocking her ok, but I do think that she was there, on that evening, with a bald head by choice.
@@iloveprivacy8167 Yeah. Because she tries to _bring awareness_ about the condition; it's not an invitation for ableist mockery. What on earth is this comment supposed to be? It has really strong victim blaming vibes regardless of your intent - after all, _she could have covered up._ 🤨
The fact GI Jane was badass is not a point to be considered because it wasn't a consideration of the joke. The joke was based around her being a bald woman. The badass thing is a justification you make for a child being bullied but as adults we know the intention. It's also easy for people who were not the but of the joke to say they'd take it as a compliment because they obviously didn't put real consideration into it using this they feel self conscience of in it place. Some women are bald by choice and could easily say they wouldn't be offended but that's not Jada's story.
My initial thought was of shock. The point could have gotten across with words rather than to strike another person who did not strike you first. I would have stood up for my loved one, but I would have only walked up to announce that they have a medical condition and that we should not poke fun at an autoimmune disease. If I was too heated to do so, I would have taken the time I had sitting to collect my thoughts until I was up to speak. Physical violence is never okay unless you're defending yourself or another person that's being physically harmed. Yes, there are moments where people have breaking points, but at a joke such as that at the Oscars? It wasn't even Chris' best joke, and it could have been taken one way or another. G.I. Jane is a badass character and Jada is a badass woman. It could have been taken as a compliment because it was relating Jada to G.I. Jane, but Jada took it differently because it was in reference to her hair. I know some people with the same condition, and they had said they would have taken it as a compliment because it's a brighter look on their situations. They felt self-conscious about their looks but being related to a badass character that didn't have hair either made them feel more confident.
Completely agree. Just to add, I wouldn't have felt "stood up for" if I had been in her position, I'd have felt terrible that I was the excuse for someone to vent their frustrations. Smith had plenty of time to reconsider his response as he strutted up to the stage, it wasn't an impulsive "crime of passion" by that point.
YES!!! thank you
That comment was more empowering: You can overcome anything, and she decided to.play the victim, and throw under the bus Will Smith.
I have noticed an extreme amount of gaslighting when it comes to the Smith family. I do not believe what Will did was right, but the fact that everyone is gaslighting Will and Jada, saying things like “they are too thin-skinned” or “it’s just a joke,” is unacceptable to me. The violence is also unacceptable. As I have taught my kids and as you stated in your video, defending yourself physically should only be done when you are being hurt physically. If someone is using words to hurt, you have the choice to walk away, or in the case of my children in school, go to an adult and let them know what is happening so the situation can be resolved. There are other ways to remedy the situation, but verbal abuse (Rock), violence (Smith) and/or gaslighting somebody for “not being able to take a joke“ (the general public) is not acceptable.
Verbal abuse?
It is comedy. There are good and bad jokes. But that is no verbal abuse...
And while I do not think so called VIPs should be okay with everything...
A joke is what you have to endure when you are that damn rich and still making money by publicly talking about your private life.
@@siggilinde5623 So because they are rich, its ok for people to make fun of what is potentially a traumatic medical issue?? Rich or poor, why is it ok to make fun of peoples medical problems? If it were another type of medical issue would it be ok? What if it was a disability? Or is this more ok as it happens to be about a womens appearance, which is basically fair game. 💁🏼♀️
Perhaps one of the reasons Will snapped is because they have to keep pretending its ok, that its not humiliating or painful for her, because God forbid a rich person should have feelings or be capable of being insulted. Perhaps if they were able to talk about these things without futher ridicule or being told to suck it up, you're rich, people wouldn't end up reaching breaking point & doing such stupid things.
Baring in mind that sometimes it's a 'joke', other times people will have said things to Jada about her hair that was out & out rude & insulting, again & again & again.. it's not like it was even a member of the public, this was another rich successful dude, supposedly their friend, singling her out in a room filled with people, as an easy target. At what point does it become abuse to keep repeating the same 'joke' they never said was funny in the first place, when as a 'friend' you should already know they have received insults, abuse & harassment about it, & it hurts like hell. But its ok, because its tv, & it's all for a laugh. Ok.
@@madhatterline I do not care if a joke is about a woman or a man.
If it is a serious medical condition there would had been other ways to make it clear a bondery was overstepped.
But yes. If you are making your money by sharing your private life you have to expect jokes. Funny jokes, bad jokes, rude jokes. I do not say they have to suck everything up. They are just people. But come on. If you go to the Oscars or Emmys you know that there will be jokes. Actually...it is part of their work! So imagine we all react to something that pisses us off at work like that. What a world that would be.
I also agree that people sometimes snap. For various reasons. While it should not happen and most people regret it later.. yes it is just human. We all make mistakes.
So considering all this...
Yes I still think that a grown up should be able to behave himself at work and do not slap someones face because of a stupid joke. I still think that he should at least apologize like a grown up. I still think a standing ovation after that moment is kind of strange. And celebrating himself like nothing has happened? No. That is not how a grown up behaves.
I wouldn't call it verbal abuse. Chris' joke was nothing compared to stuff you hear from most award show hosts. I think some roast comedians' jokes can be considered verbal abuse, but this wasn't one of them. Joan Rivers, for example, would never have told a joke like this--WAY too tame for her.
I hate so much that TH-camrs are exposed to internet hate, because so many creators (like you!) are SO wonderful and competent and doing really important work. I wish those creators never had to deal with being torn down
As a woman that has always been teased about my obbesity, I completely understood Jada's face as soon as I saw her. I, like Vanessa says in her post, have seen that face in the mirror a million times. I think Will was laughing at the joke because, as he said in his acceptance speech, we are forced to smile to not ruin the moment or whatever, but those moments when we let things go, turns into scars that are so difficult to heal... I think WIll knows Jada's scars and that's why he lost it. Now, did he made a mistake punching Chris? Yes, he did, he ruined one the most glorious moments of his career and ruin a lot of people's night by acting like that. I love what Denzel said to him and I truly believe in his appology. On the other hand, comedy has to stop using people weakness to make other people laugh. Our kids grow up watching us laughing at comedians making fun of everybody and they think it's cool, then they go to school and become bullies, they hurt other kids, is a circle, it never ends. We have to change as society, we have to be better, it is the only way to avoid this kind of things from happening.
I also think that a lot of the people judging and critiquing from one side or the other are hypocrites because, given the situation, a lot of them would react like that in real life, so... What I'm most sorry about all this is that in a world where there is so much divisions, black or white, democrats or republicans, white or asian, Rusia or Ukraine, rich and poor, american or latin, adding one more reason to divide us is unbearable.
You have said it also well. I agree.
I wholeheartedly agree...you said it perfectly.
In light of the extreme bullying Chris Rock endured as a kid, I can't help but be concerned for him. He's talked a lot about all the therapy he's doing in order to combat that trauma and work through it. Jada has exuded nothing but confidence over her choice to go bald due to her alopecia so I can understand why it wouldn't have felt like a low blow from Chris's perspective. Chris is also a roast comedian and considering the things he could have gone after and poked fun at, this must have seemed very tame.
Will Smith might have insight into the ways Jada has struggled with her alopecia but the fact he laughed first and then, without asking Jada how she wanted this dealt with, went up and slapped Chris Rock speaks to this being more complicated. Slapping seems like such a shaming thing to do. Ultimately, I trust that Chris Rock with continue to go to therapy and he'll do the work to heal and become a better person. I hope Will Smith will do the same.
Jada has rocked shaved head on and off according to fashion of the day. In all photos of her that I’ve seen there’s no iota of alopecia.
That's how I feel. I don't think his joke was meant to even beat roast.. like he was dissing her (in my honest opinion). He could have said worse things. She was compared to another strong and beautiful woman.
Idk man, I don't think it's fair to condone the joke just because she acts confident about it.
When you have something taken away from you, and you have no control, it feels horrible. It takes so much to try to hold onto your dignity, and putting on a good face doesn't mean you feel good about it 100% of the time.
Sort of in the same way that people who choose not to have children and people physically incapable of having children are going to feel very differently about someone making light of the fact that they don't have kids.
When you are robbed of choices it's *always* going to hurt when someone targets you for whatever it may be
@@Victoria-dh9vb Ive heard waaaay worse jokes at the oscars and it didnt result in a assault. Is this the precedent were setting now? Someone hurts your feeling, so its ok to attack them? Are you living in the wild west? Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me. Do yourself a favor and live by these words
@@Victoria-dh9vb yes, having no control feels horrible. However, she DOES have control over her appearance. I have hair that can only grow short and thin, but since I would rather have thick long hair, I use extensions. That said, I'm open about that fact and joke about how unfair it is that I, a woman, can grow long beautiful hair everywhere but my head. Obviously wigs are also a thing. Now, there's nothing in the world wrong with being bald. I'm just saying that going out rocking that look DOES exude confidence and comfortability with it, so for that reason it feels a little hypocritical to not be able to take a joke about it. Just my way of thinking, but I think that if you're going to confidently and openly own something about yourself, that includes not letting certain comments rock you. I'm not saying that such hurtful comments are ever okay, but you choose how you carry yourself and if you're choosing to be confident, you have to understand that crumbling over a joke isn't true confidence.
As a person who was in an abusive relationship for a short time (under a year) I saw the prideful look of satisfaction on Wills face right after the slap and it reminded me of my ex. I don't believe he is sorry because I feel he was manipulative afterwards in his acceptance speech (the crying and justification) I saw that in my ex after he was abusive. Should have Rock said it, no. That was not cause for will Smith to get physical! He could've booed him and I'm sure the crowd would've done the same.
I wonder how much the slap was really on Jada's behalf - & how much was his own shame BECAUSE HE LAUGHED, TOO!
I wish the crowd had booed without any prompt from anyone or anything but the feeling that that joke was not ok and should be called out.
I’m so sorry for what you went through, that’s so horrible and I hope you’re healing and safe now!
I noticed a disturbing smug arrogance in his expression and walk as he left the stage. I think if he booed that would’ve gotten way more laughs than the joke itself, and he would’ve come out glowing. Instead we saw an abused person becoming an abuser. That’s my thought anyway. Because based on what information we have, I believe his wife is a complete narcissist and that he’s acting unhinged after years of abuse and shame. Now he’s the abuser. I hope he gets serious help, and it would benefit everyone who saw that debacle and himself if he’s held very accountable in whatever ways possible.
Agree (also having a experienced an abusive relationship) that look of satisfaction on Will’s face after the slap was disturbing as were his tearful words of “being called to love & protect” during his acceptance speech. Gave me the shivers to hear that kind of justification for his choice of violence. Also agree that there were so many ways he could have got the point across without violence. He & his family have a huge platform & access to media, their words on this topic would have been well & truly heard. Jada’s scathing face alone was getting Chris to start back peddling on his joke before Will had even stopped laughing at it.
@@jewelie1981 thank you I am good now. Thankfully I had loving parents that kept the lines of communication open to me and sent me a plane ticket as soon as I called them asking for help. I too hope he truly seeks help for the anger he has.
I like how you took this video, ty. The last couple of days any time I've tried to say, both sides made mistakes I get told I'm condoning violence. I was even told "Will Smith is a bad person so it doesn't matter" which made me feel a bit sick. How can you condone someone making fun of another's medical condition saying it's okay because you don't like the victim??
People are making strawmen. I've also pointed out that both men did something wrong. That comedy can't be used as a shield against consequences. While also making it clear I do not condone what Will Smith did.
And people make a strawman, accusing me of the very thing I clearly said I don't. It is a rethoric that is very harmful.
@@Ikajo if he didn’t know about her condition then how is this a low blow? News flash-everyone is not tuning into Red Table like the delusional super fans on this thread.
@@smitty847 How do we know he didn't know? He very well could, he and Will Smith aren't exactly strangers to each other. Maybe he doesn't. I won't be making any assumptions about it either way.
My feelings about this are a little bit complex, so I'll try to explain it the best I can.
First things first, I don't think that there are any "bad guys" here. Both of them had inappropriate behavior in the moment, but I empathize with both of them and I understand why all of this happened.
When it comes to Chris Rock's joke, I can see how it happened. God knows I've had my fair share of faux pas when I'm trying to be funny in a lot of situations, even if I haven't been on stage. I agree with his apology in that when you are telling jokes, it can be very hard to know what lines to cross, and I truly believe he didn't mean to hurt or harass Jada, even if his action did do it.
As for Will Smith, I can also empathize with him. I too have people in my live that I would give anything for, like my brother, and I even though I don't know anything about his and Jada's personal live, I can only think that this medical condition has put a lot of stress in the relationship, so to have that poked and made fun of must have hurt a lot. I believe that Will's actions were warranted (especially in his state of heightened emotions) but they were inappropriate. I don't condone violence, but I completely understand why he felt the need to do that. I don't think he's to blame for wanting to have that dealt with in the moment, even if he didn't go about it the best way, I think it would have driven the point better to talk the microphone and speak his mind (especially because he didn't know he'd win), but, in the heat o the moment, people don't think, we act. I also don't recon that it was toxic masculinity to want to defend the people you love and to do so. I do think that one needs to think things through before taking action.
So since you think both people are not wrong, do you think what happened is okay ?
I mean even if it was after the hit Chris Rock's refusal to just don't talk about Jada are not "not knowing what lines to cross"
While I don't condone Will getting violent on Chris, he should have just called him out on embarrassing Jada publicly, without the slap. Still, at least Will apologised to Chris, with Chris managing to diffuse the situation, to his credit.
He didn't use his fists xd it was a slap
I wish people would stop saying "hit", "punch", "fist", etc. There's a very big difference between punching someone and slapping them.
@@kriscynical not really. Violence is violence.
@@carr0760 Yes, really. Accuracy is important. 🤨
@@kriscynical you said there's a "very big difference" between a punch and a slap. There really isn't. Both are assault. Both are a hand coming into contact with another person in a violent way.
It's not like a slap is okay and a punch isn't.
Once someone in my band made a rape joke. JOKED about rape.
I told them that it wasn't funny, but they insisted that it was. Over and over again I emphasized that it wasn't funny, then they responded with, "yeah, it is."
Eventually I broke, sprinted to my best friend, and bawled my eyes out to her over the trigger. I can imagine how Will's wife felt after something like that happened to her on public television with millions of people watching.
I'm sorry that happened. That sucks. 😞
I'm so glad I found this channel. I thought it was awesome at first. I have genetically bad teeth and a boyfriend knocked a guy in the face at a bar for making fun of me. I felt like he stood up for me but later on I had to sit him down and be like violence isn't okay.
As someone who's been a fan of both Will Smith and Chris Rock for decades the thing I've found most interesting about this whole situation is how many people are willing to give Will every benefit of the doubt for this situation and how few are willing to do the same for Chris Rock. Did Chris know that Jada had Alopecia? I can't speak for Chris but I didn't know. Did he know what psychological situation she or Will were in when he made that joke? Considering he's not a licensed therapist himself I doubt it.
Are we now saying that comedians and jokes in general should be outlawed because no matter what joke it is someone is going to get hurt regardless of intentions? Chris literally made a joke about another couple's possible schism over who will win an Oscar or not right beforehand, why is that one not out of bounds? What if there had been hidden turmoil in there relationship that Chris couldn't have known about but it offended them enough that they would've taken action before Will got the chance?
If so many are willing to bend over backwards to defend and empathize with only one party of this indecent but not the other I'd at least ask those people to look themselves in the mirror and ask why.
Chris Rock made the documentary "Good Hair" a few years ago, which was a wonderful film about the very sensitive topic of hair in the African-American community. Rock expressed his heartbreak that his own daughter hated the hair on her head, because it wasn't 'good hair.' I find it incomprehensible that Rock would choose to make a Black woman's hair a topic of public ridicule
@@clairenollet2389 It wasn't ridicule. He just compared to her to a movie character with a shaved head. Nothing about the joke was malicious. It was a dumb joke but it wasn't the big insult everyone makes it out to be.
@@jcdrummerz96 no the nuance stands.
You cannot as a black man speak on how bad misogynoir is and how it affects your daughter, how colourism has also affected them and weaponize a similar bigotry for a "joke".
The reason is we have had so much convos of black male comedians using racist, stereotypical and misogynoir humour at the expense of black women, he knows about it, so why would he do it?
So while I can say Smith shouldn't have slapped him, the joke was gross.
@@YourMoonJoy He compared a woman with a shaved head to a movie character with a shaved head. It could be read as a compliment given that GI Jane is about a badass female protagonist. Jada didn't take it that way. That's fine. But it isn't fair to assume any vitriol behind the joke when there is no way to prove that was Rock's intention. Nevertheless, Rock apologized, so I think focusing on the substance of his joke is pointless when Will's behavior was 1000× more egregious, bordering on criminal.
@@jcdrummerz96 there doesn't need to be active malice for something to be based in bigotry. Like I said we can agree that Smith was absolutely wrong but I'm explaining why many of use are angry with Chris Rock, maybe listen to what multiple black women what said about the situation instead saying it's just a dumb joke, especially since he knows better.
I agree with you that at this point in human history, making fun of people for things they have no control over, is ridiculous. Looks, neurodivergent behavior, someone's gender, sexual orientation, nationality, or religious beliefs (which I suppose people do have control over but it's still a thing that gets mocked) should not be points of ridicule or shame.
Having been bullied for more than half of the things I mentioned, and watching it happen to people I care about, I do not fault anyone for wanting knock someone into next week. Chris Rock was out of line with a joke like that.
However, the fact that we're in a time where someone can just get up out of their seat, walk on stage, and slap someone for a joke, and face ZERO consequences... seems to be a worse indication of where we're headed as a society.
His excuse of smiling and taking it for years, is laughable. Name ONE industry, where there aren't people who treat you like absolute garbage and you have to take it without a negative reaction.
I'm not saying that as a society we shouldn't just, y'know STOP treating people like garbage, that we shouldn't see, as you said, another human being on the other end of our comment. We should start seeing people, as people, and treating them like sentient beings. But I am saying, resorting to violence, however mild, is not okay. Call bullies out, let them know it's not okay, stand up for those around you, and yourself, but don't resort to violence.
Anyhow, this was a great video and you made a lot of good points.
"However, the fact that we're in a time where someone can just get up out of their seat, walk on stage, and slap someone for a joke, and face ZERO consequences..."
That's not the case. The Academy is convening a special board meeting to discuss disciplinary action against Smith, and in accordance with California law they have given him 15 days to communicate with the Academy in his own defense. If what you are really looking for is immediate consequences, you're pretty much talking about police, and I'm not on board with involving the police in everything, especially where black men are concerned.
Sometimes violence _is_ necessary, you know. Not in _most_ aspects of life, but at least in _some._
@@hannahmetzger6622 That comment of yours was somehow extremely unnecessary
I have to disagree on one point: I don't especially think he CHOSE to get up out of his seat; or, perhaps he did intend to go to the microphone and *say words* directly to Rock.
But I also think that maybe this is the slap heard round the world in terms of when verbal assault is okay (never) and what to do about changing and challenging our acceptance, as a society, of verbal abuse as "not violent" simply because no one's body was touched.
I think it may turn out to have been very necessary.
@@hannahmetzger6622 Not in this case.
I always found it so strange how people are so upset by physical violence but verbal violence is completely okay when framed as a 'joke'. I've experienced slaps and verbal abuse, both were horrible. But I can no longer feel the pain of those slaps unlike the words that still cause me pain today
i understand your perspective, but i think its critical to distinguish what qualifies as “verbal violence.” I don’t think it’s fair to classify the occasionally crass oscar presenter jokes as “verbal violence.” It sets the bar too low if we use this as a catch-all term for even slightly uncomfortable statements. If someone likens someone else’s haircut to someone in a movie with a similar haircut, and they simply didnt know the deeper, saddening story behind the haircut, it doesn’t immediately make the commentator malicious, nor should it be grouped it with the more severe notion of verbal violence, in my opinion. Just sharing my perspective.
I honestly could not agree more. The bullying and verbal abuse I experienced as a child has left me a shadow of myself with the depression I have experienced as a result of it. While neither is okay, I think our society downplays one over the other
@@girlonire But why make jokes on someone's appearance at all?
@@sternentigerkatze I have been asking this. I think comedy should be about ourselves and events that are not targeting particular people. I sometimes feel it is an excuse to be cruel and using humour as the excuse.
I agree. Verbal abuse is emotional/psychological abuse, so the damage isn't something that other people can actually see. But it's far more deeply traumatising long term. People often simply don't have the imagination/empathy to put themselves in someone else's shoes. They need some bruises and/or broken bones before anything qualifies as abuse to them.
As a woman, my initial reaction was a sudden drop in my stomach. A similar feeling when I get scared during an unsafe situation.
As someone who's going thru a spiritual awakening rn, my initial thought was people around the world are gonna learn from this - Will Smith's experience will be used as an example on what to do and what not to do during these situations.
I hope not. Will Smith did what he did cause he could. For all defending him, unless they are just as rich and famous, they better not emulate WS. Chances are you won't get an award and standing ovation after. In the real world, standing up for your family is not getting yourself fired from your job and an assault charge because you punched someone over words.
@@JLJ8039 I'm not condoning the act of violence that Will Smith did. What I meant with "learning what to do and what not to do in this situation" is that this is resonating with a lot of people rn. Personally, it reminded me of the things I said out of anger and seeing people's reactions is making me realize how my anger in the past could've affected those who witnessed what I did.
It's really making people reflect. Not necessarily following what happened but realizing how anger can affect your surroundings and how it can hurt you as well because of the shame you will feel right after.
I had that reaction too
I absolutely do not think it was the right thing to do. I work as a police officer so my pov comes from that sort of perspective. I only believe in violence when it is absolutely necessary, and even when I've had to be violent I always do my best to use the least amount of violence or "force" necessary to do what needs to be done. I couldn't even tell you the number of times I've had someone detained for assaulting someone and their excuse was that they were "disrespected". All that tells me is that person is so weak minded and fragile that someone simply speaking to them causes them to resort to an act of violence. I get "disrespected" on a daily basis, I either simply ignore it or respond with just words, it never crosses my mind to resort to violence based on what someone says to me. There was a much better way for Will to address the joke with Chris, but he chose violence instead.
And not only was this a wrong choice in my opinion morally, but it set a precedent for people who are impressionable and look up to him. There's many people out there this event reinforced their belief that violence is ok when someone says something they didn't like. Furthermore, these people saw that Will suffered no consequences with the law for his terrible behavior. Will is rich and privileged enough to not have to worry about the consequences I guess, at minimum he should have been asked to leave. It's crazy to me that he could act this way and they still allowed him to go up on stage and give a speech.
And get a standing ovation?! I can’t even, it disgusted me.
And I agree with you 100%.
Yes. Every abusers feel disrespected and entitled to punish.
The sad thing is apparently he WAS asked to leave.
Asked.
He said no, and they didn’t force the issue. Probably too concerned about what sort of news story would come out of forcing the likes of Will Smith out.
The whole situation just leaves a gross taste in one’s mouth
I enjoy your perspective, your ability to talk about the failings of both individuals in the situation, and your choice to highlight the apologies… it’s just very human, empathetic and focused on building up instead of tearing down. Thank you for creating this free content for people, it’s a valuable resource
Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
I understand how painful words can be. I was verbally abused when I was a kid and I was bullied in school for many reasons including my race, height, and faith. Part of the problem with the Oscars situation is the comedians they invite to host or present are encouraged to roast the audience. Sometimes it is good for us to try to find the humor in our own situations. I have Celiac disease and have been in a wheelchair and suffered internal bleeding from it, memes about my illness can be both hilarious or hurtful. Perhaps what Chris Rock said was out of line but I did not think it was meant in a mean-spirited way but in the typical Oscar host roast sort of way.
I understand the desire to protect your loved ones. I’ve been in some situations where physical safety was a concern. I’ve also witnessed my loved ones being verbally abused. I think it is important to distinguish between the two. I can sympathize with Will Smith’s reasons but he still assaulted Chris Rock. If Rock wanted to press charges he would have every right, assault is not legal. It is refreshing to see such healthy apologies from both.
Again, thank you for sharing your thoughts and for finding a post from someone with alopecia to try to find their perspective.
I wanted to let you know, you have made me cry (in a therapeutic sense) more in the past two weeks than I have in 3 years. You are a wonderful person, therapist and just genuinely awesome. Never let anyone hurt you, especially some keyboard nothing warrior.
I think Will Smith was defending his ego and attempting to earn respect in the eyes of his wife. His family drama was been the centerpiece of the Smith family for past few years in which he may have felt emasculated and disrespected by the public as well as his own spouse. I disliked that Will Smith took out an internal and systemic issue of respect on the much smaller and less intimidating Chris Rock. I do not believe Will Smith would have done the same to an actor/comedian who was larger in size and had a reputation as a physical person like Terry Crews or Craig Robinson.
Having worked with addicts, men's groups, and anger, this incident was too reminiscent of "defending my spouse's honor" when through deeper work we realize that is "defending myself because I've felt so little respect in my life". Something Will has discussed in his autobiography and in various interviews.
I found Chris Rock's joke to be mild, however, if I was Jada, I can see how I would be very upset with this insecurity. The context of the situation is that Chris Rock's job is to roast and make jokes of celebrities as previous ceremonies have proven this point, meaning everyone came to the show knowing jokes and roasts were coming. However, the comedians did not attend with the expectation to be assaulted. I see fault in both individuals but Will Smith takes the biggest slice of the pie here because the use of violence carries the same justification of family protection whether it is about jokes about appearance, LGBTQ issues in school, banning abortion, or religious extremism. Both sides of the political spectrum may justify their violence due to a higher calling to "protect family values". It is a scary precedent if taken to its fullest potential and I disagree with any justification of violence when only speech is involved.
Also, Kareem Abdul Jabbar's blog on this slap was a nuanced and cultural view on this situation that is worth reading.
That was a good recommendation. The blog post expressed something that had been on my mind as well. That it was patronizing, infantilizing behavior towards his wife who could have very well defended herself against the words. I keep thinking that if it was me and my husband - I think I might not find the courage to say anything, probably being startled and lost for words, but so would he, and then later I would rant at home and talk to myself under the shower, going through what I could have said and he would calm me down. And then forget about it. The only one he has to defend me from is the occasional emotional abuse from my mother-in-law. Because it's his mother, he has to be the mediator. Sometimes, unfortunately.
I agree.
I also think the joke was kinda lame regardless of how you take it.
And to think just a week ago she posted a video about being bald and how she does NOT care what other people think about it because she loves it…
When I look from that video to his display of physical violence, of bullying, I am very upset that anyone justifies what he did. That was a decent walk for him to get from his seat to the podium, he had SO many opportunities to change course. When I saw what he did, I saw an abuser, plain and simple. But I believe I saw an abuser that I believe has been abused and shamed by that very wife for many years, and this display looked a lot to me like a horrible thing done completely out of character that often happens when narcissistically abused people come unhinged. I really hope he’s held VERY accountable, otherwise what message are we sending? But I also hope he gets some very good help/therapy.
I was bullied at school for years... Because I was shy, I grew too fast as a girl, large breasts, and I changed hair color a lot, which made kids laugh at me and tell jokes. It is so much in me even now... And I'm 34.
You are right we are laughing about somebodies appearances all the time... I Don't know really how I feel about this all... I am sorry for this happened on Will's triumph day
... And I think he will be haunted by this for years. :((
All of this has actually triggered my CPTSD a lot, mainly because I was severely bullied for over 15 years, because of looks and other things. But another thing is that Chris Rock has NLVD, and so do I, however some people in the NLVD community are using his disorder as an excuse for his behavior and terrible joke. To me that is very frustrating because no matter if your mental illness or learning disability ect you are always responsible for your own actions even if you didn't mean to hurt anyone you should always apologize!
Idk what you think of the link between the disorder and his poor judgment, but I think it had nothing to do with each other and he just crossed a line and made a stupid mistake.
So yeah, I don't think a slap was the right thing, but I do understand why he got lost in the heat of the moment and his emotions.
But I also think Chris should have not gone any further when he noticed the joke didn't take well, he started poking the bear and that was just plain stupid and typical Hollywood TV stunt in my opinion.
Greets form Anna
As a neurodiverse person, I agree that Rock has a responsibility to himself to either learn the cues he doesn't innately recognize, or stay away from material that might conceivably make somebody want to slap him....
I don't think the slap came out of nowhere, though; I don't think Smith is that person. I feel like he must have, sometime between 2016 and now, told Rock that he and his wife wanted Rock to stop singling her out for personal remarks. The man has enough experience to control himself, even if he doesn't have the instinct. Both of them do.
And, yes: I have seen more than one ND person who uses a diagnosis as an excuse not to take responsibility. Some people sincerely can't help themselves. But by the time you're 57 years old, you ought to understand enough to keep yourself from getting slapped.
And I'm sorry that this has triggered you. You deserve to live in a world that nurtures you.
For context, I am a wheelchair user due to a genetic disorder. People have a lot to say about my appearance and it's really bizarre. I've heard comments about how "tragic" it is for a pretty girl to be in a wheelchair and they have basically said that my husband only keeps me around as eye candy that he can "do anything to" because of my limited mobility. It's beyond gross to make assumptions about my marriage and really confusing that the wheelchair is seen as tragic considering the fact that I am in constant pain. It's definitely a bigger deal to me.
I lost my teeth due to my illness and couldn't use dentures because the roof of my mouth is deformed. 40k and 3 years later, I was able to get implants. When I didn't have teeth, people were really awful about it. Apparently, looking bad is unforgivable. These are the same people who cried when I was diagnosed and said they would do anything for me to be well again. A lack of teeth kept me from eating solid food and speaking clearly, but only a select few showed any kind of empathy. I have lost a lot due to my illness, but this broke me. I stopped leaving the house completely. I could have handled strangers being rude, but knowing that I didn't even have the support of people who claimed to love me was too much. Things changed completely when I got my dental implants and they look better than my natural teeth did. The same pinecones that were hateful to me were suddenly kind again and always compliment my smile. They also insult people who have serious dental problems like I would want to join in now that I am no longer like them. I've seen the worst of these people and I can't unsee it.
I don't agree with smacking people, but I do understand Will's anger. We are often treated like second class citizens and we are just expected to take it. We are asked really inappropriate questions like "what's wrong with you?" or "why didn't your husband leave you?". Their excuse is that they were curious. That's too bad. If you are an adult then you know that it's not appropriate to be nosy. You also know that it's ableist and gross to declare us as "one of the good ones" because we can work or live independently while insulting those who can't. YOU know better but you think that it's OK because we aren't real people. I don't think that it is good enough to say that it was a joke and they have to be OK with it. No, you need to be called out of ableist behavior and if you really care, then you won't do it again. We aren't required to be the bigger person in every single situation where you are purposely being ableist.
I saw a great post that posited that Will's reaction was an example of a Trauma response. I tend to agree with that assessment. Compounding that with the view of his wife being targeted made the leap to violence a shorter one to take, than it might otherwise have been.
We are not created in a vacuum. Our previous experiences shape who we are. Some at a level we may not immediately, or even consciously, recognize. It's great that all involved are assessing their actions and seem to be growing from it. Growth is the key here. And something we should all strive for.
Thanks for your assessment.
I just read that post and it was written so well. When it first happened I felt it was a trauma response and felt that the next day he would be traumatised. He has admitted that his process of losing the weight he gained (and filmed it while doing it) unearthed many demons. I am reading a book called The body keeps score and the therapist has worked with VETS, and children and others and he talks about the Trauma response a lot.
You guys are Kidding right? Please tell me you guys didn’t fall for that fakeness
@@Pyrochik2”The Body Keeps the Score” has educated me on the trauma response, too.
This book is not a pop psychology book at all. It is backed up with solid science and explains how our brains are hardwired after experiencing trauma. If you’re looking to increase your understanding of why people do things, even things against their own self-interests like slapping someone in public, I suggest reading this book.
@@ninjanibba4259 I truly wonder, after all that has come out about these two batcrap cray cray people, how embarrassed all the people here are who have been defending a man who assaulted someone over words. Not spiteful, threatening or harmful words btw. Words that were directed toward a woman has been consistently mocking and trying her best to deplete her 'husband's' self-esteem. A husband she obviously has been trying to get rid of since 2016. I'd feel so stupid but alas I have never condoned violence in such a manner. I found it in complete distaste especially coming from a therapist that a first reaction to seeing violence was complete and total agreement.
Here's my question... would people be ok if a female comedian made the joke and she got slapped? In a time where we want equality, we should treat this as bad as if we saw a girl getting slapped in defense of his wife. I applaud Chris for being professional after being assaulted physically.
Did Chris make a bad joke, sure but they were in the front seat of a show that has comedians make fun of people. The Smiths decided to put themselves in the line of fire.
On another note, that violence, I believe, was not for Chris. I believe Chris was just the last drop that overflowed the cup. Will needs help, he looks broken.
there is a diference to a joke and a roste this "joke" falls squairly in the rost teretory
For that to happen the Oscars would have to actually trust women in important roles. You know, like not cramming three women as hosts that will overstep each other just because "at least one of them will be funny", when literally it is an unnecessary role lol
If it was a woman, some people will think it is wrong, some people wouldn't. Not hunting women is a value that has been taught to many people, it is natural a lot of them will have the instinct that it is wrong. A lot of other people wouldn't mind as well just because she is a woman. However the slap would have clearly been different, just because in was clear Will didn't want to just disfigure Crish on the spot, so depending on the age and complexion of the person, an area in which women tend to be less sturdy, it is natural that he would have made it proporcional, just as if he was against someone very old or much more young
@@rubenjanssen1672 This was in the abusive humiliation category. In front of the entire world.
It seemed to me he felt the need to prove his “masculinity” as from my experience I’ve had guys catcall me in less than graceful ways while a partner got aggressive in “defence”. But I can say I did not need that. It was no longer about me, it was about my partners feelings and insecurities of what was happening and I did NOT appreciate his reactions. I can fight my own battles and tell people MYSELF if I’m hurt or not by empty words.
There was no equality in Regina Halls Covid bit ,where she inappropriately sexualized and fondled male actors,also while saying she would swabbed them with her tongue.Imagine if CR or any other male comic would have done the same bit,people would have wanted his head the next morning.There can’t be a double standard.
I want to go on record and say that you are an amazing human being & I absolutely love everything you have posted. Cinema Therapy is amazing! My kids & I watch it often & then discuss it afterwards. You & your buddy have an amazing friendship as well as interesting POV's. My adult daughter follows you & NEVER missed an "episode". Keep being you bc you TOTALLY rock at it. Thank you for your insight, your professional opinions & your POV as a dad & a husband.
I have big patches of acne rosacea on my cheeks. I got reaaaaally teased about it. Every question, every “why are you embarrassed?”, or “why is your face always red?”. It STUNG. My boyfriend figured that out and he tells me it’s adorable. He constantly reinforced me against my insecurity, and now I’m much better. I really know what it’s like to be bullied for something you literally cannot change, and that adds to your entire charm. I think the Chris and Will story is actually a story of healthy masculinity, in that they both humbled themselves after their mistakes and said sorry.
I would have had respect for Smith if -- and only after consulting with Jada to see if she wanted him to make a response -- he had said in his acceptance speech, "You know, Chris, a few years ago, you were the producer on 'Good Hair,' which was a wonderful film about the very sensitive topic of hair in the African-American community. You expressed your heartbreak that your own daughter hated the hair on her head, because it wasn't 'good hair.' I find it incomprehensible that you would choose to make my wife's hair a topic of public ridicule."
YES
Love this!
My initial reaction was just the same as yours! At first, I was like hell yeah! Then I thought about it, and I do agree with you 100%. Both people were in the wrong. I'm pleased that both of them apologized because I felt Will's acceptance speech wasn't the best way to go about "apologizing" either. I'm glad that once he calmed down, he was able to see that his reaction wasn't the best, and I'm happy that Chris Rock apologized too.
I feel like everyone is so shocked by the slap, that the majority of people forget one of the major aspects of this situation. Comedians calling bullying jokes. It happens a lot. Jokes about choices are perfectly acceptable. Mock, belittle, comment my choices, all you want, but mocking a condition is a hard no. Even if you do not know what the condition is. Alopecia is horrible, but imagine it was cancer. The fact that you don't know doesn't give you the right to run your mouth. Research your material. Will Smith did something shocking, and insulting. He showed aggression. Yeah... anger is a real thing, and yeah ager can be born out of need to protect without being toxic masculinity. We try and teach our kids to stand up for themselves, to not let bullies mock them, but god forbid an adult follows that advice... ooooh the outrage!
Exactly! Society is filled with so many double standards it’s sickening. I was just sharing this same sentiment with someone- and, of course, they didn’t want to wrap their minds around it.
I think the were both wrong, particularly Will in using actual physical violence. That being said, my heart absolutely broke for Will, because you could see that he knew he'd made a mistake. He knew he'd crossed a line in a moment of emotion in a very real and public way, a way that he couldn't take back. And, in doing so, he's offered himself up to be publicly crucified.
As a person who has made many mistakes in my life, and done things in the heat of the moment that do not represent the person I want to be, I hope that these men can accept one another's apologies, reconcile, and move forward. The one thing I've learned about making spectacular mistakes is that they can be vehicles to provoke genuine change. I doubt that in similar circumstances, either men would ever react the same way again.
I share the same sentiment.
I really appreciate you sharing your personal experiences and taking it so humanly and kindly. It helps me get a healthier perspective of reality, which is something I put daily effort into but struggle very hard. The moment when you said "how sad it is when adults never grow out of that?" I felt like: THAT'S IT. THAT'S EXACTLY HOW I FEEL EVERYDAY. The amount of violence and aggression that is normalized gets me so confused that it gets hard to keep standing for these values and I often feel erased for defending the non-violence. Also even more erased for being violence victim from different sources in the past and present. So, my point is that your personal story and the fact that you stand for empathy and compassion and mental health, helps me a lot. Thank you.
I can’t condemn someone for acting in a way that I might in the same situation. That being said, I believe in the ability to laugh at oneself. As someone with body image issues being able to laugh at myself has helped me accept myself. But I know not everyone can do this. Nor should anyone have too. I hope everyone can overcome this incident.
What people seem to overlook is the fact that Jada Pinkett Smith is an actress. She is not some random famous actor's wife. She has been in the movie industry since she was young. She and her husband, Will Smith, are well aware of what goes on at such "roasting" events, as far as being the butt of jokes in front of a large audience is concern. Will Smith walking boldly on stage and hitting someone hard across the face because he and his wife felt offended by a silly joke is simply inexcusable!
One of the first things that came to mind was of a time back in Arkansas when I was living with my parents briefly. My mom had gone out for a walk. When she came back, she was feeling fairly glum, and I found out that while she was walking, some guys had driven by in a pickup (it's always a pickup) and shouted insults out of their window at her about her weight. She's does struggle with her weight and has always been self conscious about her appearance. Violence wasn't an option for me since I hadn't been there and couldn't reach back through time to throw something at their truck, but that definitely was and would have been my first instinct if I'd had the option. Intellectually, I know it's not noble and/or probably not helpful, but that was my first emotion. Since it wasn't an option, I talked with my Mom for a while, cussed the guys out on her behalf, and did my best to make it clear that those guys were the bad guys and shouldn't be listened to. After we talked, I called both my Dad and brother, telling them about it, and they both immediately called my Mom to check on her and give her the same sort of talk. She asked me later if I'd called them, and I was like "Yes!" She seemed a little embarrassed, but mostly touched by everyone swooping in to comfort and defend her. I guess the lack of options for violence left me with no option but to rise to my better nature. Bah humbug.
Also, Jonathan, to hell with anyone who is nasty or rude to you on TH-cam. You're doing good in the world with this channel and with CinemaTherapy. Thank you for doing this. I'm a professor of creative writing and composition, and I have used some of your videos in my classes as part of conversations we're having about different topics. I even have something you said about the things we fear most are often things we created through our lack of compassion as a quote on my office door. You are well spoken, intelligent, and kind. You're the sort of person I would love to have as a therapist and/or friend. Also, your wife has good taste; you are quite cute. ^_^
Will: Laughs awkwardly.
Jada: Annoyed eye roll.
Will: That's it, Rock, you've gone TOO far now!
people have criticized your intelligence, appearance, morality, etc? I honestly can't imagine how that must have made you feel. you are an amazing man, leader, father, and husband. I watch all your videos both on here and on cinema therapy and I cannot express enough how you changed my life for the better. please don't take those criticizims seriously. sending love from California! 💛
As a person with 3 autoimmune disorders I AGREE NO ONE SHOULD MAKE FUN OF WHAT SOMEONE CAN'T CONTROL ESPECIALLY MEDICAL
Something people aren’t talking about is the intense pressure that black women have around their hair. Chris Rock himself made a documentary about that… He should have known better.
I’m not in support of resolving things with a punch. But I want people to acknowledge that insult comedy is fucking bullying. It’s horrible. It’s toxic. It normalizes hurting people.
There are days when I wish I’d punched my bullies back when I was bullied so severely it ruined my self esteem for decades. This stuff has consequences. It’s not comedy. I know it would have been wrong to retaliate physically. Or at least, it would be less of the nonviolent path. But at some point I wonder, where’s the difference between being the better person and being a doormat? It’s all the same to the bully.
In regards to the laugh: People have awkward responses to awkward situations. I’ve laughed when people said of things in the past.
"vanessa mcwilliams" from what you read, was a first rate class act. I don’t think anyone could’ve said it better than she did. Thank you for reading that and putting that up. I had no idea she had done that.
There's a single little detail i would've worded differently: the "beside" in the end... to me as a non-native speaker, it's too close to "by the side" as in "in support". So i feel "apart from" might've been better.
@@irrelevant_noob in the English language, beside means exactly what it means, and is used legitimately in this case. As a native speaker, we understand it, and apart from is more formal what can in some cases, Rob what you’re saying of it’s empathy and compassion. Language can be used to build walls between people, or it can be used to reach out and hold each other as I think was the intent here. It’s all about the nuance.
@@LiluBob sorry, but if you're going to argue like that, i'll just dig into what dictionaries say... And in fact, the FIRST meaning of that word is "(preposition) by or at the side of; near"... and only the third one is "apart from; not connected with".
@@irrelevant_noob when speaking to a native speaker, a culture and a country that is not your own it is best not to be an arrogant fool. Common speech is different from formal speech, and, like I said, it’s all about the nuances. If you wanna be an uptight arrogant know it all go ahead, you’re not gonna make many friends, and native speakers won’t trust you. Why? Because you don’t have respect for them or their culture.
My initial reaction was don't tell jokes that you're not ready to get hit for lol
But at the end of the day Will Smith was wrong we're taught in kindergarten to keep your hands to yourself. Chris Rock was wrong. Jada is a person who can't help what's happening to her hair. And it's not the first time Chris Rock has taken a jab at her.
Girl we are taught that in Pre K. (There is a difference between rough play and being mean). The first thing that we are taught in communication is the word "no" and hitting, kicking, biting, etc. is a "no no". We are taught that at 2 or 3.
As someone with red hair and freckles, and a strange personality, being teased and outcasted in my whole childhood, I can relate to the discomfort of Jaden. I did not follow these news streams about the case, only saw headlines and I didn’t really care. However, watching this video and seeing the sincere apologies, I teared up. That is the world I want to live in. Reminds me the night when we had our 10 years high school meeting with our old class, and a lot of people came up to me to apologize for making fun of me and excluding me in my high school years. One of the guys was holding my hand the whole night and was acting protective over me in a non-intrusive way, and I thought it was sweet. Yes, kids are dumb… and I, in my whole life, will probably never feel like I fit in anywhere. But that’s my thing to carry now.
He's an award-winning actor. Maybe he automatically masked the awkwardness as he's trained to do, to not draw news attention to her (since the camera would obviously pan onto their reaction) as one of those private chat-later things and then noticed she'd already been really affected by it and everyone else had noticed so it was already a public humiliation thing at her expense. Knowing how the media would likely report and speculate on her reactions on something she didn't even want attention drawn to, with the news and entertainment industry profiting at her expense was probably what made him decide to go up there. It must be incredibly frustrating watching people punching down constantly and then casually playing off the harm they do in mocking someone's lived experience as something that person should just laugh about. Maybe he also found Chris Rock's "not my best" apology inadequate.
this guy missed the boat by a long long way he was NOT making fun of a medical condition he was joking about her haircut he like myself and the overwhelming majority of people had NO freaking idea about her alopecia mate you blew it
The sad thing about all of this is that it is broadcast for the entire world to see. Regardless of who's right or wrong, no one deserves to be constantly slandered by thousands upon thousands of people who feel like they're allowed to bully someone just because they're famous. We all make mistakes, we all crack under pressure sometimes. The difference is in our lives, it rarely goes further than our entourage.
A few years ago, my mom made a joke about cancer while my grandfather was slowly dying from it. He laughed so hard tears were streaming down his face. Even though he found it hilarious, his wife was appalled and tried to cause friction within the family. For a few days, it was a mess. That was just us, though. I can't imagine the whole world chiming in and saying cruel things about something they were never a part of, sometimes for years at a time.
Instead of publicly debating about who to support, maybe we should all start by being kinder to one another, including the people we see daily but will never know personally.
This is a great point. Drama is hard enough to deal with when there isn’t a worldwide record of it and thousands of people weighing in.
I could not agree with you more. Human beings have created such awkward situations for themselves innumerable times for thousands and thousands of years. Apologizing sincerely and agreeing to let it be in the past is the only way forward for both parties.
What bothers me, aside from everybody witnessing an assault and doing absolutely nothing about it, is how a man made a decision to commit a physical a lot of violence and yet the public holds the woman accountable for his actions.
My literal first thought when I heard about the slap was, "Who cares?" I only looked more into it two days later.
I was slapped every time I told something my parents didn't agree with. It wouldn't even be offensive, something as simple as "I don't want to wear this dress. I want to wear that one." I literally could not bring myself to care. Not when I trained myself to be beingstoic in the face of such physical and verbal abuse.
Now with more context, I can recognise that Chris Rock did make a bad joke, the only comfort being he didn't call Jadda something as horrible as Voldemort.
I can also recognise that Will Smith should have reacted more gracefully. A total boss move would have been him walking on the stage, plucking the mic, and then calling Chris Rock an idiot for making fun of a person with a medical condition. Because no, that is a line you do not cross.
I can also recognise that Will Smith was probably in a bad place.
Both need to apologise.
Hopefully this is the last I will look into this topic and focus on my own health and well being.
Good to see a response looking at both sides & with the intention of reserving judgement. Also good to see a response from someone with alopecia included, though I’ve also seen responses from people with alopecia saying they didn’t find the joke offensive so it’s also good to acknowledge that everyone responds differently to words, especially joking words, & it really depends on individuals & their experiences.
From a personal pov (& I bring this up because I don’t think it’s discussed enough) when I saw “the slap” I immediately appreciated my husband (& told him so), cause he would never dream of stepping in on my behalf with physical violence in response to words, particularly if those words were a joke but even if words were intended to hurt me. He respects that I am more than capable of defending myself when it comes to words & would of course back me (with words not violence) if I needed it but only if I wanted that, rather than letting his own emotional response to my distress (because he would be mad as hell) override the course of action I choose to take. My husband’s a truly emotional person so I know the amount of self awareness & control that takes for him & that is super attractive! It’s why there was pretty much a universal cheer in Frozen 2 when Kristoff asks Anna “what do you need?” instead of riding in to save the day in whatever way he sees fit.
Another interesting aspect that no one is talking about is the “apology culture” we’re experiencing at the moment. There’s an interesting episode on it in the docuseries “Explained” on Netflix. It’s worth watching but to sum it up, we’re seeing a trend of people doing pretty much whatever they like & then issuing a public apology, which is starting to water-down the impact of all these apologies & also raises the question of whether we are actually becoming less accountable for our actions because we can wipe it all away with words later.
I’ve already said a lot so won’t go into all the ways this whole situation could have (& really should have) gone differently. I think that’s pretty well discussed already.
Will's reaction was definitely extreme...however I think it was only a matter of time before he snapped. People have been poking at Will, Jada and their kids for YEARS even before the entanglement scandal because the Smiths don't live their lives and express themselves in ways that others expect them to (i.e. questioning Will and Jaden's masculinity, coming for the kids for how they grew up and express themselves, Will & Jada's open marriage, etc.). Like Will said in his speech, you're supposed to smile and let it slide due to the nature of their profession...but it was only a matter of time before he stopped smiling. Unfortunately, Chris's joke was the thing that pushed him over the edge.
In regards to Will's response being labelled as "Toxic Masculinity" I don't label it as such because I simply saw it as one of 3 things (or an amalgamation of all 3): 1) ego, 2) stress from all the social media BS coming to a head and 3) protectiveness for one's spouse since he is one of the few people intimately aware of Jada's feelings regarding her hair loss (even though she shaved her hair to "let it go" doesn't meant that she's 100% come to grips with it yet). Were Will's actions toxic? Absolutely! However, I don't associate these things with masculinity because they are not inherently masculine to me and are qualities that are seen in men and women.
In a side note, I found irony in Chris's joke and found it kind of odd that he made that type of joke because this is a man who made the "Good Hair" documentary addressing beauty standards in relation to Black women and girls, especially in regards to their hair. He made this documentary because his wife and daughters' were struggling with their own self-worth because society's standards toward Black women's beauty. So for him to make this type of joke when he is aware of the cultural significance of Black women and hair (regardless of Jada wearing her hair short) just seemed odd to me.
Exactly
👆
I came down with alopecia errata during the Covid pandemic. I was totally isolated, lost friends and wasn’t getting enough vitamin D. The joke landed badly. Something like that happened to me . Two of my friends joked about me looking like Gandhi which might be complimentary from a spiritual perspective but I had just broken up with one person and had been rejected by someone else and Gandhi wasn’t exactly known for his looks. But they apologised once I explained and I forgave them. That said Will Smith has a position of respect , people look up to him, if he had taken the mic from Mr Rock and talked about the condition and how hurtful the joke would be to thousands of alopecia sufferers and people who have had to remove their hair because of sickness in general he would have lived up to that responsibility. Instead he spread a harmful stereotype that men (particularly men of colour) can only communicate violently. It also paints women as property to be defended. It was a bad move.
As someone that has endured a whole school life bullied and alone, I have a deep respect for your work on the platform.
(And to anyone else out there still suffering: it gets better, with time and the right environment, it can.)
That is why I can say this with confidence: Whatever wrongs or insults you have been exposed, especially when you are at your most vulnerable, or when it is an ongoing grind...
Please know this: You are not alone.
And as long as you are respectful towards yourself and to others, that turns you in my eyes into a shining beacon of hope and humanity.
...
I find your comments here to be spot on, humane, and real (warts and all). Equally I agree with the author of the refered post. Fully.
...
And as a final thought...
"toxic behaviour" or "toxic learned reactions" instead of "toxic masculinity"... could that be a more accurate wording? ... maybe?
Thanks for your kind insights
Much love
But if they changed the term then the discussion wouldn't devolve into wether it's an appropriate term and it wouldn't make dudes defensive upon hearing it, also it couldn't be used as term by some to mean masculinity in itself is toxic. Also if they changed the term people wouldn't have to clarify what they mean every time they use the term when new people are involved, and others wouldn't bring up why when it comes to dudes it's called toxic masculinity, and when it comes to women it's internalized misogyny.
Hope I didn't come off to strong, I don't like the term. Toxic behavior does sound like a better term.
You seem like a wonderful, empathic and intelligent human being Jonathan, what dreadful things you had to experience when you were young. You seem like an excellent therapist. If we could make 15 copies of you and send it out to the world that would be great. Thank you for doing the work you are doing on this channel and on Cinema Therapy, I am such a big fan! Have a great weekend 🌻
I completely agree with Vanessa. Thank you for covering Jada's side of the story. It's upsetting how so many people don't even mention her when telling this story.
My biggest concern is Jada. She was the one being joked about, but Will is the one everyone is talking about. Did SHE want him to slap Chris about it? Did SHE want him to bellow swear words at him about it? Did those things further HER embarrassment? Would she rather stand up for HERSELF? Who cares about Will acting like he was on Jerry Springer? I'm focused on Jada, the one this whole thing actually concerns. She said, "This is a season for healing and I am here for it." What a strong and courageous lady.
What Will did was wrong but a small part of me is happy that someone put Chris in his place. His joke was making fun of a disability and the one right before was misogynistic. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't greatly satisfied when I learned the context of the slap
I'm surprised Chris even joked about that. He made a thoughtful documentary called Good Hair and explored how hair is tied up with self esteem and did this doc on behalf of his daughter. This was a poor joke because he knew better. I don't approve of Will's actions but if he didn't, people would think that joke was ok.
Like there' only this one way to make clear that a joke has crossed a line: hitting someone.
I think Will's actions showed viewers that have watched the academy awards that everyone there is still human, and can make mistakes. Sure I could sit here and judge both of them for what they did/said. But what is more productive is to discuss how we can grow as a society having experienced this. It was very telling that everyone thought that what Will had done was a joke. It was only when it continued, and the emotion and pain poured from Will as he sat down and began yelling and cussing Chris, that it was apparent that this was very real.
I (as a woman) had the same initial reaction as you had, but now I may think different about it (I haven't made up my mind yet). Thank you for your - as always - very compassionate and nuanced take on this.
I'm really pleased to hear your take on this Jonathan.
This event affected me much more than I thought it would. For me, when I love someone or hold them in high regard, I have had the habit of excusing some really bad behaviours (intimidation, manipulation, aggression, cruelty) because those actions seemed 'unthinkable' 'out of character' 'an exception' 'probably they had a good reason'. I think it's because I didn't want to lose my high opinion of that person because they were so important to me. Its been a coping strategy that I've needed therapy to address.
In Will's case, he is so beloved (and powerful) that it feels like the world is willing to overlook physical assault in a way it wouldn't have if someone well-loved had done the same. I have found the lack of consequence for Will a bit disturbing. I think there are some actions that we should ALL agree are unacceptable no matter what, and violence is one of these. (I agree that violence can only be justified when someone is in danger of physical harm/self-defence)
I'm sure my reaction is coloured by my personal experiences (as is everyone's of course) but for me I've always loved Will - he was even my first crush as a kid! - so I just honestly feel really disappointed.
Thanks for covering this topic in a nuanced way, and I really enjoy your channel.
*less well-loved
I don't think this can be reduced to toxic masculinity- if I see someone I love being humilliated for the way they look and specially for a dissease and something they can't control, I would have done the same, not only that, I have done it. My brother was mercilessly bullied and one day I was done with it and I attacked the bully. I don't regret it. I believe its hard to act coldly or pretend you don't mind when its something that makes others so vulnerable. Maybe will smith could have acted differently, but that doesn't matter now... this was the way he acted... and its because of his action that we are talking about the tasteless jokes that need to stop. Chris Rock produced an amazing documentary about black women's hair, so he knows the importance it haves culturally, wich makes his joke more awfull.
The main difference in your situation and the one with Will Smith is that the bully was physically attacking your brother. You were stopping the physical attack that is self-defense Will Smith has more than 20 lb of muscle on Chris Rock. Almost a full foot of height and as far as I know, Chris Rock doesn't have any hand-to-hand combat training. Will Smith does. One of the first things taught in hand-to-hand combat is you meet force with the minimum amount of force needed Will Smith is incredibly intelligent and witty with a few words he could have torn Chris Rock apart. Whether what Chris Rock said was mean or not, that doesn't give the right to Will Smith to strike a person. People said horrible things to me over and over again. Growing up I was bigger. I was stronger. I could have torn them up. I didn't.
@@rohanwilliams239 he was not physically attacking my brother, he was humilliating him, my brother has autism so he really was unable to defend himself. So I was the one that got physical, that said, I do understand what you mean, I don't admire Will Smith for the way he acted, and neither does Will Smith himself, I think he knows it was not the best way to deal with it
Theres a difference between teasing and bullying and a well timed joke done by a professional comedian. I was a victim of bullying for 6 years of my life as a kid. This joke was between adults who are aware of the intentions that comedians have. It seems like during our generation comedy will be dead and gone because people are way too sensitive to understand what comedians do and have done since forever. Again, jokes have to be delivered well in order to land well, and the joke Chris told was never a joke against alopecia itself, tbh the issue of alopecia wouldn't have been mentioned had it not been for that assault. Taking a comedians joke to heart just speaks to the insecurities of people. Making fun of oneself is what actually liberated me from my own insecurities and it helped me create a barrier where no one can touch me. Comedy saves people, it helps people. If only people wouldn't take every damn word seriously or better yet, understand the intentions behind it. This is why comedy exists, or now, why it existed.
Society should grow up in not taking your body too seriously. This is where all our problems lie. We think we are the center of this Universe, and we are not. We think our weight, hair, freckles, wrinkles, etc. are important. They are NOT. It's just a body that will change and eventually die and become part of the earth again. That's it. Live your life with joy and don't poison it - don't take ANYTHING too serious. Because it's all temporary.
I appreciate the real people on the other end of this channel and on Cinematherapy. The content on this channel really helps me and also is entertaining/educational. Everyone whose involved in these videos are awesome and I'm glad they're all here!
Honestly, I had the same response and thoughts, speaking as 1 of many Black women raised in North America in this generation, as a mid millennial. I saw what Will did as respectable he did not punch Chris Rock as he could have. Chris, also on the receiving end, also took that consequence respectably and like the seasoned showman, he is carried on. I don't think it was a display of toxic masculinity on either of them. If Will was going around slapping and punching people daily for any and every offence, I would have a different view. I don't think it was right but watching it was cathartic. Bullies getting away with things was upsetting as a kid and is still upsetting as an adult. I think it was a display of being overwhelmed and responding in a not socially acceptable way. There is a reality that Black women, Native women and a lot of PoC women don't get to/rarely see that sort of energy for them in their lifetimes there's only so many times one can turn the other cheek before they snap and that so many haven't in usual cases, is important. I didn't like the violence, but watching in the context of the situation was satisfying; but I wish it was dealt with differently. I would not want to actually see a man physically defend me in that way from a verbal thing.
The Chris Rock apology seems to be a doctored response and not official Unfortunatly. He's going to mink this since he's on tour now.
Thank you so much for this video and your thoughts on all this. They align with my own which I haven’t seen a lot from others who have expressed an opinion. Most people seem to be taking one side or the other but I feel like It’s more nuanced and it was really helpful to hear your thoughts on this.
As to whether or not this is an example of toxic masculinity- I think that it’s difficult to say this single act is “toxic masculinity”. Some people are definitely more prone to violence than others, either due to their nature or environment, but I do think that we ’re all capable of violence depending on the circumstances. Since we haven’t seen this behavior in the past from Mr. Smith, I think it’s most likely not the way he deals with things normally. I feel that toxic masculinity is more an overall way of acting/reacting , whereas this incident seems like a one time reaction for some reason, but I don’t think we can say that it’s due to toxic masculinity.
And finally kudos to both men for owning their actions and apologizing - which is the opposite of toxic masculinity.
The moment was textbook toxic masculinity.
Healthy masculinity would have been seeking to protect your family and loved ones the best way you can.
Toxic masculinity is seeking to accomplish that task strictly through violence.
A person can have moments of toxicity without being inherently toxic themselves.
Will has had 40 years of a spotless record as a role model and talent in the entertainment industry before this blemish appeared.
It's unfortunate and wrong that the academy is overextending itself to punish him the way they did when they haven't punished any other actors who behaved way worse than he did.
The punishment rings false and patently Ra*ist.
Thank you for sharing your wisdom and knowledge with all of us. I can’t tell you how much your Cinema Therapy courses have helped me and my family. We aren’t perfect, but we are trying and will continue to keep trying. We have the tools from therapy to do so.
I had a huge problem as a pupil dealing with emotional bullying. I can't even say why they did it, as there was nothing peculiar about me, maybe they simply didn't like me as a person. Before therapy (but already as an adult) I remember feeling so angry about it, that if I only could turn back time I would have gone back there and shoot them all. I felt that only an act of physical violence would have stopped them, because nothing else worked, nothing I could have said or done to make them respect me. Now I don't feel the anger anymore, I've worked through it. But still there is this sense of being vulnerable and hopeless in contact with crude, ill-willing, stupid people.
Why are kids cruel? Shouldn't they be innocent?
it was great to hear your thoughts around this situation! It's really multifaceted and calls for a lot of different perspectives and focus points. I don't think Smith's action was the best alternative, but at the same time I feel like the aftermath and reactions against him have been a bit overboard. It's also interesting how little focus has been on Jada Pinkett-Smith's thoughts about this whole thing.
My reaction is twofold. I can understand and empathize with Will Smith in this moment. For me teasing me is fine but do not tease my loved ones. However, violence is not the answer. So I agree with his words but not the slap. I don’t think it was toxic masculinity. I think it was done out of love for his wife.
The cool thing is that both Will Smith and Chris Rock learned and grew from this experience.
So many times, I've done things that I regretted. It made me feel like years of trying to be a better person was wasted over a simple act of being fed up, tired or excited. But the truth is, we cannot be judged over one action, it is not who we are all the time, it can just reflect a point in our life where we need comprehension and love.
It's toxic masculinity almost definitionally: Will got emotional, and directed that emotion into violence instead of a million other ways he could have directed it. That happened because of what is expected of men, and considered okay ways to express our emotions. He was also defending his wife, when she is a powerful woman who can defend herself if she so chooses. There wasn't an actual physical threat where the physical differences between men and women are relevant.
However, that doesn't mean it isn't understandable on some level. It's not hard to empathize with him, and the joke was in poor taste. In the end, there are no winners here. I hope they both learn from it.
This reaction was spot-on and completely in line with what I've been thinking and saying this week. I'm glad I watched and thanks for including Vanessa's valuable comments.
I've only commented on this issue one other place, and I said essentially the same thing. All I saw was a person defending his loved one's mental health. Yes, he went too far, but it's all too common in Hollywood to expect people to smile and bury their pain for the sake of others' entertainment. I think Will was going along with the crowd until he saw how much the joke hurt her. I also think that, because of their marital troubles, he might have wanted to "prove" that he was on her side, and decided to make a stand.
I would have loved to see Chris, apologize to Jada and acknowledge that the joke was tasteless, there on stage.
In the end, my hope is that Hollywood might steer away from such tasteless jokes in the future. So, maybe it'll be a learning moment.
I love that you included a statement from someone in the community that was hurt the most.
I think the best take on this was that yes Chris Rock deserved to be slapped, but it was still wrong of Will to actually do it. The two statements are simultaneously true.
That might be your best take in your world. But my best take is that you don't fight words with fists. And hell, that was one mild joke that Chris Rock made. I hope your not OK with bald jokes made towards men neither.
@@EvySversa not fighting words with fists is the exact point of the statement.
Exactly, the thing that stood out to me the most among all the scandal was how I hadn't read any headline of people talking about jada or how she felt and focusing more on how wrong it is to be dealing with these 'it was only a joke' situations.
The only thing I can say by reading the comments and the press is people are projecting a whole lot of their own personal history into this event - and I make no exception
It reminded me of this time when I was a teenager and in the school bus I shared my meal with a boy who happened to have Down syndrom, another boy aired loudly that it was gross and disgusting, but the big brother of the boy I was eating with was around... He snapped out in a split second and punched the assaulter in the face and all I thought was "good boy, he's lucky to have you, he's unfortunately gonna need it".
It reminded me of the time I stood up for my disabled husband in a very similar way : someone (who already broke his harm once) was relentlessly verbally assaulting him. My husband was already broken in tears and begging him to stop, everyone around including me had asked him to stop. He lashed out for hours, we were trapped in the contryside, with no vehicle of our own, depending on someone else to leave the situation, my husband was in a wheelchair, the tone of the offender was escalating and his face getting scarier... Iit's only after I slapped him that he finally put an end to his avalanche of degrading comments - and all the fingers pointed at me for being violent, not at his abuse.
It reminded me of every time we accused a victim defending themselves in an attempt to put an end to the unspeakable. Or blamed them for not having reacted strongly. Seems that there's no right answer.
It reminded me that sadly people still think verbal and psychological abuse is less abusive than physical abuse.
And how I advocate that you cannot treat domestic abuse like "it takes two to tango" and you have to intervene because the abused' intervention could never put an end to anything, they're powerless, and it will continue until someone from outside steps in.
And at the same time it feels completely disproportionate... Chris Rock genuinely seems to not be able to read the room. Would I have been Will Smith, I would have assumed good intention and called him out saying something along "I will assume you didn't intent harm but she has a condition and shaved her hair to stop concealing it and you just shamed her in front of the entire planet, I think it's time to apologize" and would have react according to his reaction to that.
But I don't know the background. I don't know if it's a first time offense and if there's already been warnings. I don't know shit about Will and Jada's relationship because I don't give a shit about famous people. All I know is I hate how their childhood background is stirred in this poisonnous stew because STIGMA, for Christ's sake. And I can see now how difficult it can be to step in when the situation seems so unclear and you're afraid to back up the wrong person. One really has to weight the whole dynamics at play.
The only thing I'm rocksteady about is I don't see it as toxic masculinity (even though I'm a radical feminist...) I see it as a devoid extreme of standing up in front of an abuser if you see it happen in front of you, possibly taking the relay for someone freezing (you know, the infamous "but you didn't defend yourself", well, this story.) - and the necessity to condone ableism just like we do racism and all acts of hate.
We had a very rough time during this pandemic with people spurting eugenicist stuff all over the place in total impunity. I hope that this disastrous incident could at least bring to light how common yet absolutely not acceptable ableism is.
This isn't the first time Chris Rock took shots at them, he made a joke about them in 2016 as well when they weren't present. And if talking to a bully doesn't help, sometimes you have to punch a bully. I think he might have laughed initially because of what he said about "having to pretend everything is fine"
Thank you so much for this video. While I was shocked at Will Smith's reaction, I also felt almost moved by it. I do not think Will's behavior was anymore toxic than Chris Rock's in this case. Ever since hearing about this, it seems everyone has been upset with Will for the slap, and no one has considered what caused the slap in the first place. So many thanks to Vanessa for sharing her side of the story, because she so eloquently expressed what I have thought since seeing the event happen!
Like Vanessa said, we don't know what Will and Jada are going through. Jada seems to present a confident front in public, but surely in the privacy of her own home, surrounded by people she can be vulnerable with, there's a chance there is some major suffering taking place as it is an awful medical condition to deal with. It surely could affect their marriage and happiness and even mental health. So to judge Will's actions in defense of his wife as more toxic than Chris's awful, bullying joke is just unfair.
I am also glad that Vanessa said Will's action felt like he was standing up for members of her community. That is precisely what I thought. When I was a kid, I was relentlessly bullied for my appearance. I mean, it was so staggering that I'm still trying to find the shreds of my self-confidence even to this day, in my 30s. A lot of bullies, if they get in trouble for their bullying, will say things like, "It was just a joke." But it was NOT just a joke. Poking fun at things that people cannot change - like their appearance or a medical condition, or sexual orientation - is NOT a joke. It is demeaning of the person they are and downright cruel. After seeing what Will did for Jada, it made me think that if I had had even one friend stand up for me like that with the bullies, I would have been so grateful. So moved. As it is, I did not. And now I am still dealing with the trauma of it. This kind of bullying truly can cause people to take their own lives.
So in the end, I am glad that Will did what he did. Because he stood up not only for his wife, but for all members of the alopecia community, by showing the joke was not okay. It felt to me that he stood up for all people who get bullied for their looks, or for medical conditions, in the disguise of "it was just a joke." It's sad he needed to get physical. But at least the discussion has now been created. I'm grateful.
I LOVE your comment...you are SO spot on with everything! And yes, "it was just a joke" is said ALL the time by abusive people who make cruel comments disguised as 'jokes'. They then try to gaslight you into believing that you're the problem...you're just 'too touchy' and you don't have 'a sense of humour'. I am totally done with all that.
Yes! "Just a joke" implies that only intentions matter. But the reception matters just as much. Taking responsibility for ones actions mean to be able to take responsibility for both intentions behind and the reception of your actions. Otherwise, anyone could clean their hands off wrongdoing by just saying "my intentions were good!" or "it was just a joke!". It's immature and shows that the person doesn't realize they have an impact on the people around them
@@letsrock1729 Exactly. Truly just tired of it. Hopefully this will have created the discussion that making fun of such things is no longer okay. (At the moment, though, seems like most people are upset with Will rather than Chris, which I just cannot understand. Where is the empathy?)
@@sandraskj1 Agreed. I know we are responsible for how we react to something, and Will Smith probably jumped the gun with his reaction. However, he is also human, and I think his response is a natural one when someone you love is being publicly humiliated by another, all with the excuse, "It was just a joke." These kinds of things simply are not jokes. They aren't joking material. And since I heard that this is the second time (?) Chris has made that kind of joke towards Jada, and that it wasn't received well the first time either, he should have known not to do it.
Also, apparently he made a racist joke about Asian people previously when he hosted the Oscars, so really, surely by this time he should be aware that some things (i.e. things people cannot change about themselves, such as race, medical condition, sexual orientiation, etc.) are simply off the table. I don't understand how people have empathy for Chris for "just making a joke", but can't see where Will was coming from considering he knows his wife better than any of us, and how this must have affected her. (I've actually seen a lot of hate thrown towards Jada as well, which is just unconscionable.) We really need more empathy in our society...
@@alexandrialeonora6542 Yes, it's all very disheartening, to say the least. Most people seeming to be more upset with Will than Chris exemplifies what's wrong with society's view of what is acceptable treatment of others.
It seems that we can treat people as badly we like (even better if it's under the guise of "it was only a joke"), as long as we don't physically touch them.
The dynamic of this whole incident and the public's reaction to it reminds me very much of reactive abuse...where the abused person eventually lashes out because they can't take it any more, and then the police take the abuser's side (because they don't understand the insidious nature of what's going on).
Obviously the Will/Chris incident isn't the same kind of 'set up', but the comparisons here are very striking.
My thoughts on this is that Will should have been her support, someone to have her back. In my eyes, he stepped all over her autonomy. He should have looked to her and gotten her input into how to support and comfort her in a time of hurting instead of instead of just making sure the aggressor was hurt worse. In very simple words, it became aggression (the joke) + revenge (the slap) instead of aggression (the joke) + healing (see and hear her in a situation about her).
I would never want to have someone make a decision to be violent towards someone on my behalf because then I become responsible for that violence whether I like it or not. And even if I wanted someone to be violent for me, that is a step too far and what a person being asked thay should do is say "no, I'll support you but not in this way". Because it is also wrong to put such burden on someone else.
So all in all, for me, the joke was wrong and the slap was wong. But more over the way Will supported the person who matter to him was done in the wrong way. Because the joke was about HER and so SHE should be the one to decide the type of comfort/reaction she needed from her spouse (again: within reason). Because, really, the whole "I know what you need and want better that you so I'll make all the decisions for you" is something I thought we learned from Twilight was bad.
Don't know if this rambling make sense to anyone else potentially reading this though...
"Not because one is a man , but because one has the ability." This is the best, non-gendered expression of, for lack of a better term, chivalry I have even heard. It is something anyone can do, regardless of gender, ability, or expertise. Thank you!
My mom gave me the most powerfull tool to deal with people criticizing my apearence: "Kid, not everyone needs to find you beautiful. There is beauty in all sizes, shapes and colors, that means that not everyone will think roses are beautiful, not everyone will like chocolate, but there is always someone that thinks tomatos are the greatest, and people that don't like peaches. The right people for you will like you for you."
I never cared again what people I don't know think of the way I look. I care of How I look to myself and what my husband thinks.