I’d guess around 500-600apm. But that’s not the part that is thought provoking. Anyone can move that fast. You just have to practice. Melee is a fluid game. Not only must you move fast to prevent getting embarrassed you have to move fast enough to fullly punish positional inaccuracies by your opponent and earn kills. Four times in a row (x2 for set) then over the span of a full tournament it gets exhausting 😊
@@NintenJoe Honestly, I think if it wasn't for this video, I never would have reached the level I'm at today. Something about seeing the tandem movement triggered connections that were locked until then. Probably should be noted for those that aren't privy: hitting an edge: platform, stage, anything, will cancel the animation that is occurring. That's what they are doing. Aerial attack into landing on edge platform will animation cancel into neutral stance. From neutral stance, you are actionable on frame 1 out of 60. Also, the game allows for a short window of buffer. If you buffer another input that sequence will execute on frame 1 after the initial animation cancel. Buffer inputs allows for a very potent flow of pressure. This is also partially present using L-cancelling, but this technique is even more efficient. Knowing this you can edge* cancel an attack (safely) hitting an edge and input (ahead of time) another attack to follow frame perfect thus keeping you safe from counter play. Finding edges to cancel allows you to essentially do multiple moves at the same time. That's why Lovage and HMW are never landing center platform. Of course, there are dozens of other high-level techniques. If anyone is curious, I'll explain the mechanics. Also, the game is very generous in what it considers to be a ledge. :) If you are close, animation will be cancelled allowing you to fair, shine, bair, or dair at will.
That being said, I don’t think anything they do is terribly difficult with practice, it was just very original when the video is first seen. Like “oh shit”, you can do that?? Then you grab your controller and realize it’s all very doable
Wooow, now I know what to work for. You guys outdid yourselves. Can't wait till my hand is fixed so I can make my own in tribute to this amazing piece of work!
@Conqlusion19 invisible shine lands made possible by the sloped ground near the edge of yoshi's story, you can only do them on that specific piece of ground and you have to time the shine land perfectly. if anyone has any questions about what we did check out the scene transcript in the smashboards thread.
@incronaut invisible shine landing, you can do it from certain distances from platform to ground, pretty much only found if a slope is under a platform. they can also be done by walljumps. you have to do it frame perfect
just when you thought you were becoming a pretty technical falco, these players make you realise how far behind you are. And the thing is, they aren't even the top falco or foxes, so imagine how much more is possible. Good stuff.
@Jughand it takes longer to do a turnaround shine -> wavedash than simply a shine -> wavedash, yes, however it doesn't break the combo. Hitstun affects the player hit by the attack and not the attacker.
@TheGosu I don't know if there is a trick to doing wave shine turnarounds easily, but you can change the direction your facing while you have the reflector. I guess just really quickly tap the other direction after you press down-b, but before you press jump.
@ty13rx146 im doing shine lands. the shine doesnt really show up until the 4th frame so you can only see a slight flash. that was just a filler clip lol
@Slashtap3 yea man but bat drops are so fresh and unique, and require so much creativity this is like SO easy in comparison right lol no wonder cort played peach
@killaforchicken this sounds like a good idea, but it would be pretty hard i think cause you have to change DI constantly to ledgecancel(at least for me), and the different timings for things such as short phantasms would be hard to show i'd think
hey lovage, not sure if you know this already but on DL64 with falco you edgecancel between the 2 low level platforms by dropping down a while then jumping for a half a second, then do a full phantasm. takes timing but its ez to get down.
@SilentWolf444 Yeah that's what I assumed, but wasn't sure. That's really impressive, on top of this video being amazing. Kinda' pushed me back into Melee.
@SilentWolf444 Two questions which are essential to be answered lol.... 1 - 1:34 what were you using to jump out the shines so fast 2 - What is that triple walljump thing at 1:41, i just kinda wanted it explained with what actually happened lol...
Any advice in regards to efficiently practicing technical stuff? I don't have much time for video games but melee is so good and I'd like to at least be able to avoid embarrassing myself. Thanks
when you turnaround waveshine hitting someone so quickly like that are you turning around before you press down B? I thought there was some sort of hitstun that made it so you couldn't turn around and jump out as fast when you hit someone with a shine, someone please enlighten me!
It's a shame that Silent Wolf & Lovage won't be able to click & watch this video themselves, because any NORMAL person wouldn't have hands...or even arms after some shit like this >__> Good shit dudes, this video actually made me tear from the awesomeness :)
![Adventure, Fox McCloud [TAS] (Reupload)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/mXZrRjc6jmU/mqdefault.jpg)
This aged well.
just watched in 2023, this is still od
id love if someone re-made this vid with button inputs on screen, a la "How fast is melee?"
I’d guess around 500-600apm. But that’s not the part that is thought provoking. Anyone can move that fast. You just have to practice. Melee is a fluid game. Not only must you move fast to prevent getting embarrassed you have to move fast enough to fullly punish positional inaccuracies by your opponent and earn kills. Four times in a row (x2 for set) then over the span of a full tournament it gets exhausting 😊
Dude I think this may be one of the best tech skill videos even to this day
theres more technical ones nowadays but I'm still impressed especially for 2010
Plus lovage was literally shield dropping, insane for 2010
@@NintenJoe Honestly, I think if it wasn't for this video, I never would have reached the level I'm at today. Something about seeing the tandem movement triggered connections that were locked until then.
Probably should be noted for those that aren't privy: hitting an edge: platform, stage, anything, will cancel the animation that is occurring. That's what they are doing. Aerial attack into landing on edge platform will animation cancel into neutral stance. From neutral stance, you are actionable on frame 1 out of 60. Also, the game allows for a short window of buffer. If you buffer another input that sequence will execute on frame 1 after the initial animation cancel. Buffer inputs allows for a very potent flow of pressure. This is also partially present using L-cancelling, but this technique is even more efficient. Knowing this you can edge* cancel an attack (safely) hitting an edge and input (ahead of time) another attack to follow frame perfect thus keeping you safe from counter play. Finding edges to cancel allows you to essentially do multiple moves at the same time. That's why Lovage and HMW are never landing center platform.
Of course, there are dozens of other high-level techniques. If anyone is curious, I'll explain the mechanics.
Also, the game is very generous in what it considers to be a ledge. :) If you are close, animation will be cancelled allowing you to fair, shine, bair, or dair at will.
That being said, I don’t think anything they do is terribly difficult with practice, it was just very original when the video is first seen. Like “oh shit”, you can do that?? Then you grab your controller and realize it’s all very doable
Shine jump-canceling while turning around every time... what the hell are their fingers made of?
metal
Shoutouts to Smash Summit 2
The tech skill is off the charts
too good guys, watching you guys do the 2 person parts in person was amazing
this is seriously one of the most impressive things I've even seen, ever.
@yttuty Yeah SW did all the fox clips and Lovage did all the falco clips.
Toph you lookin kinda fresh today smash?
i was able to watch them make this and the thoughts that go thru their heads are crazy! mad props to yall! nice meeting you otto
one of the best ssbm videos ever!
Wooow, now I know what to work for. You guys outdid yourselves. Can't wait till my hand is fixed so I can make my own in tribute to this amazing piece of work!
It's so beautiful....
If there was Melee Parkour, this would be it.
@Conqlusion19 invisible shine lands made possible by the sloped ground near the edge of yoshi's story, you can only do them on that specific piece of ground and you have to time the shine land perfectly. if anyone has any questions about what we did check out the scene transcript in the smashboards thread.
Damn, I never knew Lovage had this crazy tech skill
Lovage is insane
That was way better than I expected. And I expected a lot.
you guys play in a totally different dimension of time with them space animals.best tech skill video to date
@incronaut invisible shine landing, you can do it from certain distances from platform to ground, pretty much only found if a slope is under a platform. they can also be done by walljumps. you have to do it frame perfect
this is the shit
true
@@royeric5 true
By far.. The best tech skill video out there... Nice job guys!
just when you thought you were becoming a pretty technical falco, these players make you realise how far behind you are. And the thing is, they aren't even the top falco or foxes, so imagine how much more is possible. Good stuff.
Possibly the greatest tech skill video ever created. Insane. . .
@Yardomaster no, we just turn around because its cooler/harder. you can only do it from a certain point in your jump/walljump.
Incredibly impressive, great stuff to both players.
@Jughand it takes longer to do a turnaround shine -> wavedash than simply a shine -> wavedash, yes, however it doesn't break the combo.
Hitstun affects the player hit by the attack and not the attacker.
Easily the best tech skill vid out there.
holy shit
things just get crazier and crazier with tech skill
i love melee
Looks like 6 people were struck so hard by the awesomeness of this video they accidentally clicked Dislike instead of Like.
I have no words for this...just way to awesome
It's amazing how far Melee has gone. This sets a good example.
Ode to thy Smash.
@TheGosu I don't know if there is a trick to doing wave shine turnarounds easily, but you can change the direction your facing while you have the reflector. I guess just really quickly tap the other direction after you press down-b, but before you press jump.
@SilentWolf444 Ahh, I see, thank you. Hope to play you and the rest of WeWa sometime soon!
@ty13rx146 im doing shine lands. the shine doesnt really show up until the 4th frame so you can only see a slight flash. that was just a filler clip lol
it's..so beautiful and graceful
And I thought I had good tech skills....
Amazing video! Keep it up guys
@liinkk I think that was rapid repeated walljumps -> wavelands.
I love that Illusion Ledgecancelling thing-
Or whatever it's called.
@Slashtap3 yea man but bat drops are so fresh and unique, and require so much creativity
this is like SO easy in comparison right
lol no wonder cort played peach
the start was like pairs figure skating.
The beggining where both of them simultaniously do crazy tech skill shit? That was unbelievable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We gotta have more stuff like that.
the clip with both of them were awesome !
@killaforchicken this sounds like a good idea, but it would be pretty hard i think cause you have to change DI constantly to ledgecancel(at least for me), and the different timings for things such as short phantasms would be hard to show i'd think
@JFLikesPie those are shines after every hop
what happens exactly at 1:40. ive watched it over and over. looks like wall jumping into teching or something. really weird
Walljump waveland x3, walljump.
@@snail15 im looking back now, fucking insane to this day. no notched controllers and just insane stuff happening here.
Wow. Falco and Fox are the coolest character to look the coolest with in the coolest game ever Super Smash Bros. Melee.
@SparkWereRabbit OMG HAND IDEA REALLY GOOD . i like it. kinda ruins the cool effect though, but it'd be really good to have it!
the taunt is the epitome of tech skill
Incredible.
that stuff on the samus warning level was ridiculous
Dayum so fast and technical.
beautiful
Captain Falcon asked them to SHOW ME YA MOVES.
So they did. The Falcon is VERY pleased.
awesome choreography
Can someone teach me how to do wave shine TURNAROUNDS?
Those look so freakin sick.
i was supposed to send an important email in my 10 minutes of break time but instead i watched this like 2 1/2 times over...
this is like the greatest thing ive ever seen, goddamn that was awesome
WHAOUUUUUU incredible !!!
@rebelian777 he was also moving to the left while doing them
Disgustingly good
Also, that stage progression shit at the end was Piiimp!
hey lovage, not sure if you know this already but on DL64 with falco you edgecancel between the 2 low level platforms by dropping down a while then jumping for a half a second, then do a full phantasm. takes timing but its ez to get down.
I'm sure that if you were to open up Lovage and Silent Wolf's brain, you'd find an AR.
Looks like Oscar's been... Ottomated.
@Yardomaster walljump invisible shine land. you can see it in action in lovages last clip and my brinstar clip with the ready GO
i bet silent wolf's tech skill is the reason that planet is about to explode lol
WOW
my thumbs hurt while watching fox do those moonwalks on corneria
1:40 is :O that must be so hard 2 time
I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO jealous of these two. My eyes still can't believe what they just saw. @_____@
ganon on ice approves
@LanternTheLiar who said any of this was made to be effective fighting techs lol. theres specific ways you have to do it that are hard.
Holy Hell, that was nuts.
Now if this had been entered in the contest, would they both have won?
song?
looks like a breakdance-contest between fox and falco
@Pnut2371 develop mode with action replay on the stage in all star mode cuz its long enough to run for that long if u slow run
Spacies can look ridiculously pretty if you can move your hands fast enough.
Though ... what good does being able to blank the shine do you?
These boys are NOT fucking around.
God damn, this video made my head spin...
LOL i just realized the song they use they cut out the first 2 mins of the actual song and put in the part that fits with the vid. lol good shit
@SilentWolf444 Pshhh that was GREAT!
@SilentWolf444
Yeah that's what I assumed, but wasn't sure. That's really impressive, on top of this video being amazing. Kinda' pushed me back into Melee.
who needs TAS when you have these guys?
@SilentWolf444 Two questions which are essential to be answered lol....
1 - 1:34 what were you using to jump out the shines so fast
2 - What is that triple walljump thing at 1:41, i just kinda wanted it explained with what actually happened lol...
This was so good!
Any advice in regards to efficiently practicing technical stuff? I don't have much time for video games but melee is so good and I'd like to at least be able to avoid embarrassing myself. Thanks
How did you do the screen at the end with both of you winning?
Wow, duel tech skill video, now i've seen everything, this easily would of one HMW's tech skill contest.
@TheShootingStarKing yeah it was 3 of those.
my hands got tired from watching this.
check out F. Zero's "How to Train your Falcon" video
@MooseEatsBear yeah, but that could be SilentSpectre+Lovage. (also an awesome teaim).
Silent Lovewolf?
could not blink for the longest time
good stuff guys i saw alot of hard work and frustration haha
Wow, this is sick.
This is real, the maps are accessible though the games debug menu. U just need an action replay to get there.
when you turnaround waveshine hitting someone so quickly like that are you turning around before you press down B? I thought there was some sort of hitstun that made it so you couldn't turn around and jump out as fast when you hit someone with a shine, someone please enlighten me!
That was sick.
It's a shame that Silent Wolf & Lovage won't be able to click & watch this video themselves, because any NORMAL person wouldn't have hands...or even arms after some shit like this >__>
Good shit dudes, this video actually made me tear from the awesomeness :)