I asked this specific question to my agent when I was delivering food only. The ride share addon was not necessary for food only. The company was StateFarm in Georgia. Sidenote: The first step when involved in an accident while driving for Domino's is to remove the topper with the logo on it.
@Click The restaurants I've worked for always wanted drivers to use their own insurance for accidents. The restaurants are required to have insurance for drivers and didn't want their insurance to go up if you had an accident. Most don't mention the commercial license requirement to drive. That's a dirty secret of the service industry. Add to it that if you have a car topper cops will be more likely to turn a blind eye to speeding.
If you did not get that in writing you are certain to get the claim denied. Agents are not experts in what their policies do and do not cover.... only what they think they should and should not cover. Claims adjusters will look for any way to deny you that they can. (Not that I wasted a decade of my life working in insurance or anything)
Many years ago, I did pizza delivery for a major chain. Word among drivers was not to mention you were delivering pizza if you were involved in a collision.
My sister had this happen 10 yrs ago. She was delivering Pizza as a part time job during college. Luckily the vehicle was only damaged (she was ok) and not at fault for someone else's repairs. Cost her several thousand dollars out of pocket and lesson learned. Completely negated all of the money she'd made that fall.
@@cw3598 every time you buy a car insurance policy, they ask whether your vehicle is being used in an occupational capacity. If she had answered yes, her insurance might have been a bit more expensive, but they would have covered it.
@@cw3598 Why? Honestly asking. We don't know all the facts, but drivers (at least here) are to maintain their own vehicles and that includes proper insurance coverage. It is not on the business to provide coverage unless you use their vehicles.
@@RoseKindred ^ this and more this, most pizza places I ever delivered for, had you sign a mountain of paper work stating it was your job to keep insurance, the car running blah blah blah and most states legally back the pizza place on this too. The pizza place in most states in court will win and be like "you waived our responsibility" only time the pizza place got involved was if I got hurt, n that was workers comp.
I own an independent agency. This happens all the time. We ask everyone whether they do any gig work with their vehicle. If they do not disclose it, they are not covered. Also, pizza delivery is not included in this gig coverage. Gig workers need to also make sure they know what Uber, DoorDash, and all those companies cover and WHEN they will cover them.
I would say that YOU, the independent insurance agency owner, should understand what and when Uber, Door dash and all those companies cover. You are the expert. Then you can charge and make proper money.
@@ronblack7870 no, some insurances don't cover it. Geico have a rideshare insurance, but doesn't cover deliveries at all. I had to switch insurances when I started working on delivery apps. State farm have deliveries covered by default, but rideshare cost more. Every insurance company is different.
@@tonymouannes Geico actually got screwed on this with my insurance, they wanted you to do everything online and there was not a way to report food delivery because they did not want to cover it but they had no mention of it anywhere in the policy as being prohibited but did have sections on Ride share or other commercial uses. They had to pay but did cancel my policy which made me get a better cheaper policy from State Farm who permits part time food delivery.
This happened to a luckless individual many years ago, when I was working as a caregiver for developmentally disabled adults in a community housing situation. We were obligated to transport them in our private vehicles, and of course our exploitive employer never breathed a word about any special insurance requirements. The pay was crap, the working conditions were crap, and the worker who got into an accident with a client onboard had to eat crap.
@@jadesluv No, they did not. It was a typical scene wherein we were working for peanuts and so effectively had no rights. The DD industry (and it is an industry) was corrupt and exploitive, preying upon clients and carers alike. I hope it has improved since those days, but I bet it hasn’t.
@@jeanettewaverly2590 they nationalised the industry in Australia with the creation of NDIS... Basically combined everything into one platform, creating a "disability support marketplace". Crap in crap out though. And not to forget the people ripping off the system by putting in fake claims and getting away with millions
@@jeanettewaverly2590 it absolutely hasn't. Which is y I WILL NOT transport any1 I'm caring 4 n an "employment capacity" n my own personal vehicle. Nope! Unless ur gonna pay my ins premiums AND issue a pay increase, then no! I'll care 4 them n their homes n call an ambulance n the event sumthn happens. They r always tryna screw the little people.
My wife is a home caregiver and that still goes on today. I steered her away from companies that felt it was ok to let people drive around folks that need round the clock care and just expect them to do it.
When I was researching if I even wanted to gig work, Progressive raised my premiums. FYI Six ($6) dollars per month. I upgraded to 250/500/250 - a higher amount because I knew I was at more risk. The total, it cost me less than $10 per month. In Michigan the 'ride share' with Progressive covers delivering people, food, packages or any thing for a fee.
I live in Massachusetts and own a small landscaping business. I went to a seminar when we were starting out that was put on by the DOT. Before it started, we were all having a meet and greet with the trooper. When he got up to speak, he noted that a lot of our vehicles were not in compliance and subject to tickets, fines, being put out of service and being towed. He also commented that many vehicles were not registered properly. It opened my eyes, I did my research and continued to do so as we moved forward. I’ve tried to share my experiences with people I know and honestly I don’t recall anyone accepting my advice as valid. The excuses range from its just a money maker or I’ll worry about it when it happens. Many years later I was pulled out of a line of cars for a DOT safety check and although I had a minor volition, I was let go with a warning. The trooper was impressed that I did my research and had my vehicle and trailer in compliance. Insurance is expensive but to me it’s way cheaper than the alternative. Thanks for all the knowledge and advice - So grateful for your efforts! Happy New Year! 🎉
I briefly had a pizza delivery job, and I got stranded in a ditch coming back from a delivery. I had AAA membership and insurance, and when the insurance company found out I had used the car commercially, they didn't renew my policy. I learned my lesson the relatively inexpensive way.
My mother was a teacher at a local public school. The kids were scheduled for a field trip. There were more kids then the bus could take. Her principal told her to take the excess kids in her car. She called the car insurance to ask if She coulf transport her students on s field trip. They told her " no". So she told her boss she couodnt do it. However, a different teacher did do it.
Something tell me that other teacher was not told why your mother refused. So lets say that other would have got in an accident and have her claim refused for the exact same reason, could the teacher have go after the principle, a person in authority over him/her who hid the information about the insurance issue.
@@ripvanrevs The distinction is whether you're making money off of doing it. If he's just a parent taking his kid to the game and giving the others a lift since they're going to the same place, then he's fine (they're just carpooling). But if he's being paid as a coach or something for the team, then yes he'd need commercial coverage. (OTOH, I'm not sure if he'd be covered for carrying that many kids unbelted in a pickup bed.) OP's teacher story ends up requiring commercial insurance because the kids are going on the trip as a school function. And the teacher is employed by the school and chaperoning the kids as part of their duties as a school employee. So the teacher was being paid to haul the overflow kids.
@@solandri69 12 teenagers in the back of a pick up truck? How many seats are registered for that make and model of car? Do the teenagers have proper seatbelts in the back of the pickup truck? No, this is not covered. The whole private/commercial does not matter.
I actually had a similar thing happen with my boat (without an accident happening). I had State Farm insurance and they swore up and down that they covered my boat while taking people out fishing as a fishing guide. Come to find out over a year later it does NOT cover me as a fishing guide. I had to move to a specialty insurance because State Farm didn't have anything that would cover me.
(former licensed agent) You're covered if your agent says you're covered. They might try to fight it but they'd lose, hard. We had to be suuuuuper careful not to imply any kind of coverage that wasn't actually on the policy because the company (and our employment and licenses) would be on the hook.
@@enriquekahn9405 If he has any sort of documentation to prove that the agent said he was covered he probably would win a lawsuit against the agency for that coverage. I wouldnt want to have to bet on it though.
@@jadesluv That agent is risking losing their license, incurring a 5-figure fine and possibly triggering an investigation of the whole company's sales practices. And yes it actually happens because sales guys are idiots. One reason I left the industry. But my point is, if you can make a vaguely convincing case that the agent said or implied you had the coverage (which could be as simple as showing that they or other people at the agency had done so in other cases) you've won.
I drove briefly for PostMates and Lyft to make some money after I had gotten laid off from my job. In the training material, they make it abundantly clear you need to tell your insurance company that you are working for them and to get the proper insurance. I do believe my insurance company called it "Ride Share Insurance." Also, it wasnt expensive. Just $2 more per month. Not only does the company tell you this, but they *REQUIRE* getting a copy of your insurance to show that you are covered. And as at least one person mentioned in the comments that you need a commercial driver's license, that isnt true. Neither the insurance or the companies required a it. Of course, I couldnt have gotten the insurance coverage, if it did.
the commercial driver's license is up to state rules. some require it for any driving while on the clock, others have certain thresholds, like if you are paid to drive a delivery truck above a certain size, or a bus holding more than a set number of passengers.
@kenbrown2808 only class that may req. A CDL is Uber Black as Uber requires the driver to be a licensed limo service. The old "taxi" license fell away a couple decades ago. Now NYC has its own rules since the taxis/ride share are controlled by the taxi mafia.
@kenbrown2808 of course, but 2 things. 1. Topic was about the USA 2. I never assumed that anyone was from NYC. Just pointed our they had their own rules that are different from state laws.
Anytime I've ever opened a new policy, they specifically asked how much I would be driving the vehicle. The more you're on the road, the more you pay for insurance. At least that's how I understood it.
Yes, but it also depends on what the purpose of the driving is. Personal use/commuting is something else then "ride share"/delivery for money. The insurance can show you the math that it is. If you want an intuitive example: If you commute to work, you always drive the same roads and know the situation. If you deliver, you regularly drive routes unknown to you.
I worked at a pizza company who required you to have your own insurance and you did not need commercial insurance. They actually got better pricing to insure their drivers if diver could prove it was currently carrying auto insurance of any kind. It was also understood that while driving Pizzas our personal insurance was invalid but the companies insurance was covering us. The owner said it was kinda expensive but easier than trying to get the drivers to get right insurance.
The "Hired and Non-Owned Auto" coverage that the pizza place has wants to know that everyone has their own insurance so that if someone is involved in an accident when they ARE NOT working, they don't get scammed into coverage for it.
I know at the time when I had my accident, they called it "commercial insurance", which wasn't worthwhile to get when I was getting minimum wage plus tips.
I'm surprised Uber doesn't already have an automotive insurance coverage available for their drivers... (Right up there with whatever car rental companies try to push)... From what I've observed Uber is one of those companies that L-O-V-E-S to find ways to take more money from their drivers.
Up until recently, I was a licensed auto insurance agent. Most policies exclude food delivery or using your personal car for business. Once Uber became so common, insurance companies started offering “ride share” as an endorsement to add the coverage to the policy. This includes app based food delivery service. I recommend people to review all your policies (auto, home, etc) at least once a year to make sure you don’t have any gaps in coverage. Also- don’t skimp on liability coverage!
@@michaelsommers2356 not really. It could literally be done for cheaper by a government agency. Private insurance is just taxes for people who suck at math
@@jillianb1744 Thank God it's actually something that would be a required payout. Living in Hawaii taught me that even if you pay for volcano insurance your entire life, the second a volcano comes about they will do everything to deny coverage - from insisting that "fire damage" from the volcano to "flood damage" from fighting the fires and doing the operations to divert the lava from the volcano is somehow not related to the volcano - they would refuse to pay until the State came out and said that everyone's license would be suspended if they didn't pay. Insurance without government backing is the epitome of a racket.
Yes, every auto policy I ever bought asked if the vehicle was used for delivery or ride sharing. When I was younger, I delivered pizza, I had the delivery rider on my insurance policy, which costs extra.
@@wescald I just look it up Average Domino's Driver hourly pay in Missouri is approximately $16.86, which is 8% above the national average. If that's working for free. I will gladly do it. Just some friendly advice fact check before posting, especially ALL politicians.
@@stevenwoodward5923 16 bucks a hour is working for free. That’s slave wages right there. If you work a job in general you’re an idiot. Doesn’t take long to learn how to trade or start a business. People are lazy asf and would rather drive pizzas around
I would also like to point out, that most policies with this Rideshare coverage only cover it if you are doing it part-time. It's very important to read your policy documents. If you are going to be doing food delivery or Uber ride sharing Services full-time, it is very important that you get an actual commercial vehicle policy.
When I was going into the 9th grade (1962 - in the dark ages) I rode to school with a teacher. There were four of us that rode with her and we paid some small amount for the ride. My dad explained that the teacher had to add insurance coverage for us riding and we were paying for the insurance and a little for the convenience. So since I was 14 I have known that you needed special insurance for ride share. I was in the Army in 1972 and became a member of USAA. I have carried their insurance for over 50 years. Use of the vehicle is one of the first questions asked when getting insurance from them and every time I renew. If it is anything other than normal - to and from work, pleasure, etc., there will be an increase in the cost and an additional rider to cover the exception. I guess most people don't know these things or purposely choose to ignore them. Personally, the few dollars extra are worth the security to me.
USAA told me that work use, limited miles for no more than two days a week, no signage on my vehicle does not require added coverage. They had no premium for 92 miles each way commute in 2007-2009. I've never had an accident except backed into a pole once; started driving in 1963.
@@ronjones-6977 at least they have a non-profit motive and can be swayed by election. The literal structure of insurance agencies is to take as much money as possible and deny every claim possible.
In 1991 when I got a job delivering pizza. My Dad called the insurance company following my first shift and I was informed that if I continued to deliver pizza with my personal vehicle I had to pay $400 a month for the insurance. So my pizza delivery career ended after one 4 hour shift. 😊
That's exactly why I will never use my personal vehicle for work. The cost of the additional insurance for using my vehicles, even for a field technician position, was outrageous.
I had a sister in-law who was an insurance adjuster. She told me to NEVER use your personal vehicle for ANYTHING work related. She said even taking your boss's mail to the post office, while on your lunch break, could cause you to be denied if you have a crash during that trip.
@@ETT64 Why would you disclose information about the purpose of your trip to your insurance company though? Even just forgetting about any concern regarding a potential denial of coverage due to a use of the vehicle not covered by the policy, it isn't something I would mention to an insurance agent in the first place.
@@joelglanton6531 Why are you assuming the person disclose anything ?? Mail is in personal vehicle, vehicle in crash, driver incapacitated, mail found in car, insurance adjuster denies coverage/claim.
@@ETT64 I would be really interested in hearing about any instances of things like that happening. I wouldn't think that particular example would lead to a denial without some more concrete evidence of what the driver was doing, but then again we are talking about insurance companies and like you implied, they're always looking for any reason to deny coverage.
Yes, you have to take commercial driver's licence to get the proper insurance coverage if you have accident while doing your business. This is applicable in basically every country.
Wrong. Some companies explicitly cover it on all personal policies for uber, pizza delivery, etc. You only need commercial license for trucks over 10k lbs in the US
I can tell you with 100% certainty you are wrong. I drove briefly for PostMates. I told my insurance company that I was driving for PostMates and they said it wasnt an issue. I just had to pay a little extra in insurance. $2 per month more and I was fully insured. And I could ***NOT*** have gotten insurance if I needed a commercial driver's license.
Had a friend who swore up and down that he didn't need commercial insurance as a Skip the Dishes driver. I warned him. He ended up in a major accident involving injuries AND was assessed fault. He'll be paying out of pocket for years.
If she was on the way to pick up an order, or delivering it, she needs to contact Ubers insurance. They have $1,000,000 coverage for all drivers. If she was just online waiting for orders, she sol.
I remember this being an issue with pizza delivery workers using their own cars. I think people would be surprised by what things they need to consider before using their own car for anything work-related. My buddy is a state trooper and pulls people over all of the time only to find out that they need commercial registration, hazmat signs, and such, but don’t have it.
What is not mentioned is that some companies will drop you like a hot rock when you ask about rideshare or delivery, and leave you to fend for yourself to get new insurance.
it's dumb because it's not a terribly expensive add-on. the only problem is there are only, like, 3 companies that does them. i know state farm does, mercury might be another, and i cannot remember the 3rd.
It’s honestly better that the insurance company drops you if coverage is excluded on the policy for the way you’re using the vehicle. Finding a new policy that actually provides coverage is way better than paying or a policy that will deny any claim due to the excluded usage of the vehicle.
in the UK a standard policy is social, domestic, or pleasure. People who deliver for Uber/Just Eat/Deliveroo need a policy extension to cover them. There have been several people who have been charged with not having insurance.
I've seen a few stories like this here in Australia recently. People running side business from their homes are having their house insurance cancelled or claims not honoured when the insurance company finds out about the side business.
I was doing Uber/Lyft and carried Progressive Insurance for rideshare. I was paying $732 a month. I upgraded my vehicle so I could go from Uber X to Uber Black. My premium jumped $600. I also drive a charter bus full time. Uber was just to make some extra cash. The premium was as much as I was making in the bus in 1 pay period. I gave up on rideshare.
I worked for pizza hut 20 years ago. They provided insurance for their drivers. The drivers would get bonuses for not getting tickets or accidents. Nowadays, some of these companies are relying on insurance fraud as part of their business model.
Back in the day when car services still existed, I drove for one while in college. One of the things we did was deliver food and alcohol (usually to one of the local no-tell motels). We treated the delivery just like a fare. I assume the insurance companies view it the same way.
@@no_peace -- Food doesn't, but I do. And, so might someone I hit. Adding to the greater risk of driving many more miles than a typical driver, you're trying to produce (meaning take more calls) because that earns you more money.
As an old P&C license holder, livery services are never covered by the base auto policy that most have. Commercial needs to be written under commercial policies.
Every time I've re-uped my policy, my insurance company asks me the standard questions, one of which is whether or not I use the car for commercial purposes to inlcude uber, lift, grubhub or any rideshare/delivery purpose. They ask these questions to determine the likelihood of a claim which effects your premium. if you dont disclose this to your insurance company that's on you.
I'm wondering what the $400 dollars a month covers! My insurance in the UK costs around that per year, but covers "commercial use" and around 20k miles per year- it excludes "for-hire" and "racing", naturally. Insurance sounds very complex in the US, and very expensive, in this example.
Part of it is that insurance in the UK probably doesn't need to cover hospital care as the health care trust presumably picks up the tab on that. If you think about it, treating injuries, and deaths, are the biggest possible payments that an insurer has to make. If it's just deaths, then you're looking at the cost of repairing/replacing cars and fixing property damage.
@@SmallSpoonBrigade oddly, the only time I had a bill for healthcare was when I was checked out after a motorbike accident in the late 80s - I passed it on to my insurance company and they paid it, road traffic accidents aren't covered by the NHS (though they don't charge upfront)
@@SmallSpoonBrigade I did not know this but after 2leftthumbs post, I looked it it. Insurance in the UK DOES cover hospital care where personal injury compensation is awarded. The NHS will bill the insurer.
Thank you for this video. Absolutely great advice to look at your insurance policies. If you have an agent, make an appointment to talk things over but 100% read it yourself. Yes, it's dense but it'll prevent those surprises in the future. Education on insurance should be mandatory with obtaining your license when insurance is mandatory in your state (or country). All people driving vehicles should know at a minimum: 1) What to do if you get into an accident (while at the scene) 2) How to report a claim 3) What different insurance coverages mean 4) How much insurance coverage you have 5) How much insurance you legally need Lying to insurance companies when obtaining your insurance can be a crime. You're certifying information is true in order to contract with the insurance company. It's also not a victimless crime because they're using that information to set rates for everyone. So many people like to justify the 'big bad companies' are just taking advantage of people. I'm sure some are, but the people handling your claims aren't (generally) stamping your claim denied out of hand laughing over their stacks of fat cash they stole from you because insurance was mandatory. They're doing a hard job trying to stick to their contract against the flood of 'No one will notice this one exaggeration, this one omission, this tiny lie" soft fraud and the threat of government fines. They have to make sure they have enough money to pay for all the claims that are going to come in while remaining a solvent company. You're probably also victimizing future-you when past -you thinks you can get one over on 'the big company'. In some states, if you lie in your insurance application and they discover after the fact, they can void your policy to creation date, hand your money back and say "You didn't have coverage with us. Good luck to you in the future." You get what you pay for. It's like going to a McDonalds, ordering a Big Mac, giving them $6 and being mad they didn't deliver you a juicy steak because now that you're eating you really want something else. Heck, if you're lying to your insurance company, it's like giving McDonalds a counterfeit $10 and then being mad they didn't deliver that steak you didn't pay for or ask for in the first place. Ride share/Transportation Network/Food Delivery laws are still being written and refined. Every state is different. Some states actually had a moratorium on excluding food or parcel delivery from insurance claims during COVID. In some states, your insurance company can't deny food delivery entirely, but only down to state minimum limits or they may have to document sending you a notice that ride share is specifically excluded every renewal. I'm not saying insurance companies are great or they can't be money grubbing jerks who don't hold up their end of the bargain sometimes. But they are highly regulated in many states. You have recourse to contact your local department or bureau of insurance if you think something fishy is going on. But the only recourse you have against your own ignorance is educating yourself.
This reads like you work in insurance. A lot of good info but honestly I laugh at the thought of a local department or bureau doing anything. I call bs at the highly regulated since they write their own rules that get passed. The whole insurance industry is a scam. Pay them to get denied. They know most of us can't afford a lawyer and lawyers don't work for free. Profit several hundred million and my rates go up. I pay almost double from 2 years ago with no accidents or tickets. Yet they are regulated? Laughable at best. Maybe on paper but not in the real world.
Finally! A comment from someone one who understands how insurance works! As a retired commercial Insurance underwriter it makes me nuts when people think insurance companies are all trying to scam you.
Dad used to work in insurance. He told us to NEVER EVER allow the car to be used by our place of work as we were not paying commercial insurance rate so we'd be up the creek if we "just ran something down the street" as it were. I'm guessing commercial insurance rate is significantly higher than what normal mortals pay, not to mention other obnoxious restrictions.
I am an independent contractor for a delivery company, my commercial vehicle policy is around $4,000 per year. I drive about 110,000 miles per year. To make that worth it you have to earn a lot of money. None of the food delivery apps and services pay enough to make that cost worth it.
For my insurance company they define Rideshare as working for a Transportation Network Company wither or not it is Uber, Lyft, Postmates, Eats there's no difference it is considered ride sharing. If you are working directly for Domino's, Papa Johns, Jersey Mikes or other restaurant directly then its considered commercial and not coverage. Also their Rideshare coverage is not available in every state. There are some states where ride share is excluded and can't be added and in other states where it's not offered and is still covered. Insurance rules can be insane.
@@ronblack7870 it depends on your insurance company underwriters and what they deem as an appropriate risk. It's similar to working say as a real estate agent vs a general contractor with their tools and supplies in their truck/van. Contractors with tools and supplies in the truck often need commercial and real estate agents just need to disclose they are driving for business appointments vs commutes to and from office
Hundos, two, count them two, unfolded, between the passenger side of the turbine car, not in the box, and the drivers side of the #71 Daytona, on the right side top of the main cabinet. 30.
I work as an auto adjuster, our contracts are designed to exclude this and other commercial risks. Uber has a policy that protects you while you have a delivery in your vehicle but doesn't protect you in between.
For years now, every time I'm gonna renew my insurance they ask if I use the vehicle to work with app transport or delivery. There's a giant clause saying if you use the vehicle for working with app for transport or delivery then that insurance will be voided, and you need a special insurance for that.
This is why different policies exist, and you make an informed decision before you buy any. There was a case in the UK a while back where a rider was stopped for something (don't remember what) but during the discussion he said he was on his way to work. Police ran his registration (plate) and asked to see his insurance - which he showed them. It was for "Social, Domestic and Pleasure" only. So he got done for riding without insurance because at that time he was. He fought it but lost because the police were right. He was commuting and didn't have a "Commuting" addition to his policy, so at that time it wasn't valid.
This is also why it makes sense to get an insurance agent. If you're just getting insurance for personal uses an insurance agent is probably overkill, but an insurance agent can answer questions about what is and isn't covered and if they're an independent agent, they probably won't even mention it to the insurance company unless it's a question on the forms.
Awesome as always! A related incident I experienced...Years ago when traveling internationally, I would rent a car and use my GOLD card and the credit card acted as the car insurance to save me big bucks, all the time....One of my travel buddies cautioned me to check and see what is covered. I called them and checked, turns out car covered 100 percent. I asked about liability in case someone was hurt or killed in an accident...NO LIABILITY COVERAGE AT ALL, ZERO!!! Never did that again....as Steve says, make sure you know what is covered.
You say, "Denied" and I say, "Hello, hello, hello" I don't know why you say, "Denied", I say, "Hello, hello, hello" Why, why, why, why, why, why, do you Say, "Denied, denied, bye, bye"? Oh no!
they will try to weasel their way out of any claim but in this case to be fair, regular personal use is much different to being on the road for most of the day, 5 days a week, every week as that is your work.
My wife ran a childcare from home, and that was something our car insurance company, State Farm, specifically mentioned, i.e., transporting kids she is being paid to care for is not covered as personal use of our vehicle. Made perfect sense to me, and the cost of the insurance rider we had to add to our vehicle insurance was 100% deductible as a business expense. (This was 30 years ago so it may not be as simple today.)
I wonder how this works for real estate agents that drive people in cars showing them houses with the hope that they'll buy. I was in real estate sales in the mid-80's for a few years and didn't have extra insurance coverage. Luckily, I never got into an accident.
I would have assumed that real estate agents register the cars as company property for tax reason. Those miles and gas are not cheap, so you want to pay them with company money (before personal income taxes). Coming from that perspective, the whole question is irrelevant: The insurance might go up, but you can deduct the whole insurance fees from the income. This does not negate the effect of higher insurance fee, but... that you pick up drinks for potential buyers on the way to property and you just happen to also buy your personal grocery while your at the grocery store happens to add up.
ive always wondered if uber drivers lied to their insurance companies. that was one of my first questions on hearing about ride sharing, when it first came out. 400 a month for insurance? what was she driving? what is her driving history?
I’m in Iowa and pay $480/month in insurance. 6 vehicles and only 2 adult drivers with a deer strike 7 years ago and 2 speeding tickets 3 or more years ago.
That's what I wondered. I have excellent coverage, but my insurance is less than half that. I also have zero points on my license, and have never filed an auto claim, nearly 30 years now.
some do or they just don't mention it and hope they avoid accidents. others expect to rely on uber's own insurance (which is very conditional and has a fairly high deductible). it's honestly stupid because it's fairly cheap.
Here in NY, depending on your driving history, that amount would be “full coverage” for a lot of drivers and a requirement for any new car under a lease agreement with the auto dealership. Unless she’s driving a 2022 Mercedes, something’s sounding fishy
Interestingly, in Utah, you don't have to be a licensed driver to purchase a vehicle, license a vehicle, insure a vehicle and use a vehicle, you just can't be the driver of the vehicle.
Yep, When I delivered pizza I had business insurance on the car so I'd be covered. Yes it was more than regular insurance, but it wasn't that expensive. If you don't know what your insurance covers, you need to ask your insurance agent and read the policy.
I delivered pizzas 40+ years ago for a summer (the summer of 1980) and didn't have additional insurance coverage. Luckily, I didn't get into an accident. Back in those days, there was of course no internet (basically) and no apps or GPS tracking.
@@sunchips5 40+ years ago you didn't have million dollar lawsiuts for the littlest thing, and a fender bender wasn't a multi-thousand dollar specialized repair.
21 year licensed broker here..:in my experience, Progressive and State Farm will do just about anything to avoid paying a claim. I have State Farm myself and have had to sue them twice to force them to pay valid claims. If you have good credit and multiple vehicles and properties, they are often the most cost effective. Just be aware that if something happens you may have to involve lawyers.
This was a good post! I’m glad you explained the second $100 bill, as I look for it in every episode. I was thinking maybe you upped the ante for some poor soul *still* working under the misguided ideal that somewhere in the United States, someone can drive without the proper documentation. I love that. I can’t believe anyone thinks this. The Uber thing was interesting. I was also thinking that Uber should be required to put into their paperwork for drivers. I realise there is always someone who doesn’t read the vital paperwork, I came across it in Human Resources. Often people sign all this paperwork and just whip through it, not reading it. I ask them if they read it, I received answers in the area of, “Why?” or “Ah, it’s not important.” I’d educated them on the importance of doing that. I read everything I’m given. It must just be us…
I used to work of an insurance company and my wife used to train insurance consultant staff. The risk for a vehicle that is used for private use if very different than that used for commercial purposes. I used to deliver Pizzas last millennium and checked with my insurer if I needed to upgrade before I started. At that time as it was only a few shifts per week my private policy covered me.
No, it's only if you have a delivery. A delivery gives you a "waybill" which is coverage of insurance, origination and destination. Unless you accept AND START a delivery, you're not covered. And you are on your own between deliveries. You are on your own until you actually have the item in your car. The only time you're covered by Uber is between the restaurant and the customer.
I remember reading an article about 15 years ago about definitions and contracts. It pointed out that in one contract it used the word firearm, and later on in the document it defined firearm and included knives in the definition.
That struck me as well. I live in Ireland, where insurance companies charge an arm and a leg as we have USA style personal injury settlements. My policy (albeit for a small car) is €800 p.a.
1) She wasn't engaged in a commercial use; as she wasn't actively engaged. In other words, if she isn't going to a pick-up or a drop-off; the driving is not commercial. 2) She is being charged based on mileage, how she gets to that mileage figure is her business. If the insurance company wants to examine what she is doing, they should have asked explicitly at her most recent renewal. It is the responsibility of the insurance company to understand their risk at inception of each contract; it is not the responsibility of the consumer to explain risk to the insurance writer. 3) Unless she specifically said she wasn't using her vehicle for commercial use and was in fact using for a commercial use; the insurance company doesn't have a leg to stand on. Those who cave to insurance companies in situations like this; deserve what they are getting. Push back, fight back, bring in state insurance commissioner, and if necessary take it to a jury trial. Insurance companies are likely to settle out if she is aggressive enough and has a half decent lawyer. Edit: Just looked at my original and most recent auto-renewal insurance policy. Mine has NO mention of commercial exclusion or requirement to disclose. Only the original policy had some verbiage on commercial trailer usage. I suggest people do the same BEFORE calling insurance if they are doing this kind of work. If it is prohibited by the contract; it should really be stated as prohibited IN the contract.
Isn't it interesting that uber is letting their drivers drive without knowing that you need a commercial license and commercial insurance. Just shows how much they care about their drivers.
Youre tecnically self employed contractors in most states. Its not the responsibility of uber to make sure youre insured correctly. If you look in the terms of service they probably require you to be properly insured. They put the onus on the contractor to know and follow the rules.
@@supernova743 the point of the original comment is to point out that Uber doesn’t really try hard to let people know Nice try being a know it all but you’re both right. Your reply simply had little to do with the line the conversation
When I got rideshare insurance it was a "hybrid" policy (personal and commercial coverage) offered by Geico Commercial. The consequence is that the commercial policy wasn't reported on my personal credit report. When I tried to switch back to personal insurance, every company's automated quote system decided I was uninsured for the past 4 years and quoted me ridiculous rates. Even Geico's own systems did not account for my history with Geico commercial. I finally lowered my rates after an arduous process of obtaining proof of insurance to manually override the system of my current insurer.
Lol, glad you found your 100$ bill Steve. Something like that would drive me crazy wondering if someone broke in and left all my other valuables but took that 100$ bill.
And her own car insurance won't pay unless she reported that she was driving for her job. I turned down an office cleaning supervisor job due to needing to drive to multiple locations each night. I asked if the cleaning company would cover the cost of the rise in my car insurance, and they told me not to report it. Not worth the little bit of extra pay. These delivery drivers don't realize that they will pay for the wear and tear they are putting on their car along with increased car insurance or cancellation if their insurance company finds out.
In the UK you MUST have commercial insurance for food /parcel delivery or taxi/uber (any business use) not only will the y not pay your claim but the police will prosecute you for invalid insurance(even if there is not an accident) which could mean large fines a revoked licence a retest or in extreme cases prision
@@rusticpartyeditz They can issue you with a fixed penalty notice but the police do have the option of sending it to the courts. They also have the added bonus to seize the vehicle and send it to the crusher for no insurance
this is a topic that has long been known/discussed in driver communities. there are 3 carriers that actually offer 'rideshare' policy - state farm is one and progressive isn't - and it costs a little more than 10/month. there's always been people who ignore it.
I used to deliver for a long time. Never had full coverage, never had an accident. Had some close calls of other people running red lights, but I always look in all directions when I get a green light and as I'm crossing. When it comes down to it, you get insurance to cover your screw up. There's very few realistic situations that you can't avoid getting hit. Majority of the time, it takes two to tango. Would be good if she read her policy.
@@hugh007 only time, I've ever had that happen I was pinned in my lane. the last few close calls with a rear end, I was able to see them coming full bore and crank the wheel hard and get the hell outta that lane before they slammed into the person infront of me.
Way back in the '60s when my sisters and I started driving in our small town, our insurance man told my parents to firmly impress upon us girls that this insurance policy does not cover joy riding with all of our friends in car. One sister did n't listen - the insurance agent saw her then called our parents. Well she never did that again. I think part of the big issue was that the car was insurance for the photography business as well because my parents traveled within 100 miles to photograph weddings and police photos etc. So it was a business car basically. We girls would need to run business errands and go to school - that was it. A friend was joy riding after a school dance. He had an accident. The most severely injured girl was grounded. Her parents got a call thinking she was in her room. That really enforced the no joy riding in business car.
I thought the second Ben on the set was just due to inflation. While Steve Lehto says, "Insurance is a contract," I use a simpler word. "Insurance is a bet. You're betting that something bad will happen to you. The company is betting it won't, but they wrote the bet, so there are many ways they can invalidate the bet."
I'm going to bet she was texting her customer and venture to say that she caused some serious injuries. They'll be on the hook for some of it for sure.
She had no "customer" at the time of the accident which is why Uber's insurance is not paying for the damage to her vehicle. If the accident happened while she was doing a pickup/delivery, the damage to her car would have been covered by Uber except for a $2500 deductible.
@@ubermothman5584 or she was in cahoots with the customer to get them to cancel the order in the app, then deliver it for cash, thus screwing over Uber AND the restaurant.
I used to sell insurance, never lie to your insurance company. If you're going to be doing the occasional food delivery on the side, tell them. That way they will cover it. It might cost you more, but at least you know you won't be left with a broken car and somebody else's bill. I also recommend everybody read their policy thoroughly. Especially these newer rideshare policy riders. In my experience, in Reading several of them, they only cover rideshare businesses when you are doing them part time. If you are doing Rideshare as a full-time job, or food delivery as a full-time job, you must get commercial insurance. As a delivery driver myself, I watched another driver get burned by his insurance company because he lied to them and told them he was not using the vehicle for delivery. When he had an accident, not only did his insurance company drop him, but then he could not get insurance from anybody else without a huge down payment out front. And they also did not replace or cover his vehicle.
Hey Steve. In Michigan this is fairly straightforward. I drove for Lyft a number of years ago when my wife and I were saving up for a large purchase. After doing some quick research I had to purchase a "rideshare rider" for doing rideshare from my insurance company (State Farm). Essentially the insurance company broke down when the "rider" was applicable and when it wasn't. The ride share companies also provide insurance to their members, but it's really quite useless. Step 1 is to contact your own insurance company and step 2 is to leave a message and we might get back to you. :) If memory serves me Lyft provides insurance under fairly narrow circumstances and it was capped at a low amount. I don't recall the specifics now, but it wasn't good. For instance, if you are driving around with the app on, but nobody in the car and you're not on your way to pick somebody up then the Lyft insurance was no applicable, but unfortunately neither is your standard car insurance for the reasons you stated in the video (e.g. the car is being used for a commercial purpose). The rider wasn't that expensive, but that may have since changed.
When I used my 1/4 ton truck as a courier for about 4 months, I had to insure my truck for commercial use. The good thing was that my package policy was still in effect when I was driving the truck for personal use. The commercial use insurance was a "rider" clause. When I stopped doing courier work, my insurance simply dropped the commercial rider.
I'm always amazed how many people don't know this. With State Farm you need delivery insurance and if you Uber people then you need additional ride share insurance. All you people delivering pizza with your own car better make sure you are insured properly.
She had the Uber Eats app on so Uber's insurance covers $25k bodily injury and $25k for whatever she hit. If she had been actively doing an Uber Eats pickup/delivery, then Uber's $1 million liability policy kicks in plus coverage for damage to the driver's vehicle minus a $2500 deductible. The limits on coverage when not actively doing a pickup/delivery makes sense because otherwise I could just turn on the Uber Eats app, ignore all delivery requests, and use Uber's insurance as my car insurance as I do my usual driving around town.
This is why I think there's something not being reported. She probably called the customer and got them to cancel the order after it was cooked, and said "I'll deliver it for half the normal Uber delivery fee" (which is still more than they pay drivers anyhow) and then gets to the restaurant and feigns surprise at the canceled order. Then she says "well, cut your losses, I'll buy it for half price since you can't serve it now" and does this scam all over town. Hell, there may not even BE a customer, she could just be doing this for free lunches, knowing some of the scam artists I've run across as a legitimate driver.
And this surprised anyone how? Back in the late 80s, I was delivering for Dominos, and an accident involving a pedestrian. Called the insurance company (Aetna) to make a claim. Agent told me that they were going to fight it. Later on, they told me that they weren't going to fight it, due to a clause in the policy that if you got a fee for delivering something, which in this case was the 50 cent commission per delivered order, it violated the policy. Had to hire a lawyer to get the insurance company to cover the accident, because the lawyer successfully argued that the agent already said that they were going to cover it.
We got a letter informing us that we were not covered for commercial use of our cars and noted that commercial activities like transporting food, items or people were not covered.
Wow, I wasn’t expecting you to talk about this one that quickly. I forgot to mention. When I tried finding the email to send in to I found that I was unsubscribed and had to resub.
Allstate has a similar policy for food deliveries. It's called rideshare in name only but it lists the major food apps in description as well. It only costs me an additional $3 a month for that coverage in Wyoming.
The timing is impecable, my son and I were just talking about this two days ago. I told him I didn't believe that insurance would cover food delivery without paying exta. I almost hate to be right on this one.
In the Uk it's called the public liability clause which includes for hire or reward. Also, you have to state if you will use it to travel to and from your place of work, because insurance companies don't like paying out.
Agreed, it's not just transporting things/people, if you are using your car for work then you need to declare it (and pay extra). Some insurers even charge extra if you have your business name on the car.
@@andrewharrison8436yes but some don't, mine was like an extra £30 a year for adding business use (I do some local delivers of my stock saves on shipping)
If you lie on the insurance application, they will not cover it. They explicitly ask whether the case will be used for ride sharing. If so, one must carry the additional coverage.
I will 10000000% vouch for the accuracy of this!!! Holy fuck!!! I work at Pizza Hut. Before I had a job change (that was a mess), I got into a small fender bender. This lady didn't move and Iswtfg, the more i think about what happened, the more I start to believe it was 100% intentional on her end. But anyways, because of her choice that didn't make a lick of sense, I ended up tapping her back bumper. THAT FUCKIN VAN GOT AWAY WITH A SOFTBALL SIZE DENT! MEANWHILE MY CAR HAS A DAMAGED FRONY BUMPER AND ISSUES WITH THE PASSANGER LIGHT STAYING ON OR EVEN WORKING! EXPLAIN TO ME HOW I GOT WAY MORE DAMAGE THAN SHE DID!!! But anyways, I filed it at work because I was on the clock taking some orders out. This was like 8 at night. And because it was filed through work, naturally my insurance company got ahold of it. I give my insurance all the info and they tell me a month after the incident that, despite getting a damaged vehicle, they won't cover it because I was using my personal vehicle for work!!! I WAS LIVID! I STILL AM! BECAUSE NOW MY CAR ISN'T LEGAL! I LEGIT WOULD HAVE TO REPLACE THE BUMP PROBABLY AND FIGURE OUT WHAT'S GOING ON WITH WIRING AND BRACKETS OR WHATEVER INTERNALLY!!! LIKE FFS! MY BATTERY DIED THERE/GOT JOLTED APART! I may have seemed calm, but i was internally crying in a fuckin ball. I'm still SO FUCKIN PISSED OFF! That i got no assistance! Not from my own insurance company OR my works insurance!!! I'D BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO USE A COMPANY VEHICLE TO MAKE MY DELIVERS! IT'S AN OPTION IN OUR SYSTEM BUT WE DON'T HAVE THEM!!!
I drove for Uber for almost three years in the MD/DC/VA market. My personal car insurance was GEICO and I checked with them regarding using my car for rideshare. Initially they didn't have a problem with it but after about a year they notified me about a policy change regarding rideshare drivers. GEICO was forcing rideshare drivers insured by them to take out Commercial Vehicle (i.e. tractor/trailers, bread delivery, plumber vehicles, etc.) insurance if the car was going to be used for ridesharing, otherwise GEICO would refuse any claims. Commercial Insurance would raise the monthly premiums by over 500% from my previous monthly rate, so this GEICO customer of 45 years told them to pound sand and I explored other options. I was finally able to get "regular" insurance from Progressive with a rideshare rider attached. This increased my monthly premium by only about 20% as opposed to 500%. I guess GEICO (formerly the "Government Employees Insurance COmpany) had spent too much paying for a CGI reptile and needed to recoup some costs. Well they ended up losing more revenue with their money grab.
i know someone who got a 700K settlement for a minor injury. He wasn't injured until he found out the other driver had a 5 Mil policy...he then needed outpatient neck surgery....he was able to function fairly normal the next day (bending, etc)....but got 700K
What were you doing with the car at the time of the accident? Driving, I was driving it. From a location where I was, to a location where I needed to be.
That's one of the things I'd heard about years ago as a reason to not deliver pizzas. The pay isn't good, though you may make a lot in tips, and meanwhile you're putting a lot more miles on your vehicle, and need a more expensive insurance policy. Some people like to just count their fuel cost, but you're also wearing out various parts. You *could* take meticulous notes of oil changes, brake jobs, belt replacements, tire replacement, etc., or you could just use the federal guidelines for business deduction, where you can look up a per-mile allowance. You can look it up, but the second half of this year, the allowance was $0.625 per mile. Drive a typical vehicle 100 miles for delivering pizza, and you've spent about $62.50 for the car use, not counting the insurance.
Honestly, the most surprising thing to me in retrospect, is that states aren't cracking down on people driving for pay with non-commercial licenses. Most states have a standard non-commercial class C license for most drivers. That standard driver's license does not allow you to drive for pay. If you are going to drive for work, like a taxi driver would, for instance, states require you to get a class C commercial driver's license. It's a little more complicated to get one, and there may be more fees involved, and you have to have a medical ID card as well if I recall correctly. I think this is exactly the sort of thing that a CDL (class A,B or C) exists for, and it's kind of surprising that that is not being enforced, especially with the number of unskilled Uber drivers there are.
When I started driving Uber in 2015, I had to change insurance companies. Uber made it clear that their insurance only covers you when you have passengers or a delivery in progress. Uber made it clear that insurance that specifically covered rideshare was required. That regular insurance would not cover rideshare activities such as driving to pick up a rideshare passenger or delivery.
I've seen this happen a couple times. Pizza delivery, Uber, Lyft.... those are commercial uses for a vehicle, and standard insurance policies specifically exclude coverage if the vehicle is used in commercial service. State Farm is no different.
I got into an accident in my car a couple years ago. I was picking up food to take back home lol.. When I filed my claim they did ask me if I was doing this for a food delivery service.. I said nope my own personal food. They covered the claim just fine. It is a good thing I never did any work for these delivery places, because they could have delayed my claim until after they made sure I was not doing any commercial work with my car.
I used to sell insurance years ago and I have warned dozens of people whose kids delivered pizza and such that their car insurance would not cover them. Most people said they didn't believe that so I said, "If you don't believe me car you insurance company.". My neighbor drives for Lyft and I warned him and he replied that they'd have to prove it. DUMB.
My daughter was involved in a multi car accident. The driver at fault was a Uber driver with a passenger in her back seat. Her car was totaled and her insurance company denied her collision coverage because of the reason you're explaining. She was also fined by the Department of Motor Vehicles for not titling her vehicle as Used For Hire.
This has been an issue in NY. A taxi driver is required to have a class E license, "for hire insurance", and taxi/livery registration. UBER and Lyft bought enough politicians to be exempt. Drivers with basic liability insurance only are hauling people around. Insurance will not cover any injuries.
I asked this specific question to my agent when I was delivering food only. The ride share addon was not necessary for food only. The company was StateFarm in Georgia.
Sidenote: The first step when involved in an accident while driving for Domino's is to remove the topper with the logo on it.
@Click The restaurants I've worked for always wanted drivers to use their own insurance for accidents. The restaurants are required to have insurance for drivers and didn't want their insurance to go up if you had an accident. Most don't mention the commercial license requirement to drive. That's a dirty secret of the service industry. Add to it that if you have a car topper cops will be more likely to turn a blind eye to speeding.
If you did not get that in writing you are certain to get the claim denied. Agents are not experts in what their policies do and do not cover.... only what they think they should and should not cover. Claims adjusters will look for any way to deny you that they can. (Not that I wasted a decade of my life working in insurance or anything)
Many years ago, I did pizza delivery for a major chain. Word among drivers was not to mention you were delivering pizza if you were involved in a collision.
@@TheRealScooterGuy Tampering with evidence, lying to police, is not a good plan.
@@cartoonistaaronhazouri no you're not. It's a state farm policy. You should get it in writing but it's a known policy
My sister had this happen 10 yrs ago. She was delivering Pizza as a part time job during college. Luckily the vehicle was only damaged (she was ok) and not at fault for someone else's repairs. Cost her several thousand dollars out of pocket and lesson learned. Completely negated all of the money she'd made that fall.
She should have sued the pizza company.
@@cw3598 every time you buy a car insurance policy, they ask whether your vehicle is being used in an occupational capacity. If she had answered yes, her insurance might have been a bit more expensive, but they would have covered it.
@@cw3598 100% this.
@@cw3598 Why? Honestly asking. We don't know all the facts, but drivers (at least here) are to maintain their own vehicles and that includes proper insurance coverage. It is not on the business to provide coverage unless you use their vehicles.
@@RoseKindred ^ this and more this, most pizza places I ever delivered for, had you sign a mountain of paper work stating it was your job to keep insurance, the car running blah blah blah and most states legally back the pizza place on this too. The pizza place in most states in court will win and be like "you waived our responsibility" only time the pizza place got involved was if I got hurt, n that was workers comp.
I own an independent agency. This happens all the time. We ask everyone whether they do any gig work with their vehicle. If they do not disclose it, they are not covered. Also, pizza delivery is not included in this gig coverage. Gig workers need to also make sure they know what Uber, DoorDash, and all those companies cover and WHEN they will cover them.
so pizza delivery is ok without extra coverage ? wow that's unusual. is it cause it's grandfathered in from the old days?
I would say that YOU, the independent insurance agency owner, should understand what and when Uber, Door dash and all those companies cover. You are the expert. Then you can charge and make proper money.
@@ronblack7870 No he is saying they can pay extra for "gig coverage", but that extra coverage does not extend to pizza delivery.
@@ronblack7870 no, some insurances don't cover it. Geico have a rideshare insurance, but doesn't cover deliveries at all. I had to switch insurances when I started working on delivery apps. State farm have deliveries covered by default, but rideshare cost more. Every insurance company is different.
@@tonymouannes Geico actually got screwed on this with my insurance, they wanted you to do everything online and there was not a way to report food delivery because they did not want to cover it but they had no mention of it anywhere in the policy as being prohibited but did have sections on Ride share or other commercial uses. They had to pay but did cancel my policy which made me get a better cheaper policy from State Farm who permits part time food delivery.
This happened to a luckless individual many years ago, when I was working as a caregiver for developmentally disabled adults in a community housing situation. We were obligated to transport them in our private vehicles, and of course our exploitive employer never breathed a word about any special insurance requirements. The pay was crap, the working conditions were crap, and the worker who got into an accident with a client onboard had to eat crap.
And the crap eater probably didn‘t have money to engage in a lawsuit against the employer.
@@jadesluv No, they did not. It was a typical scene wherein we were working for peanuts and so effectively had no rights. The DD industry (and it is an industry) was corrupt and exploitive, preying upon clients and carers alike. I hope it has improved since those days, but I bet it hasn’t.
@@jeanettewaverly2590 they nationalised the industry in Australia with the creation of NDIS... Basically combined everything into one platform, creating a "disability support marketplace". Crap in crap out though. And not to forget the people ripping off the system by putting in fake claims and getting away with millions
@@jeanettewaverly2590 it absolutely hasn't. Which is y I WILL NOT transport any1 I'm caring 4 n an "employment capacity" n my own personal vehicle. Nope! Unless ur gonna pay my ins premiums AND issue a pay increase, then no! I'll care 4 them n their homes n call an ambulance n the event sumthn happens. They r always tryna screw the little people.
My wife is a home caregiver and that still goes on today. I steered her away from companies that felt it was ok to let people drive around folks that need round the clock care and just expect them to do it.
When I was researching if I even wanted to gig work, Progressive raised my premiums. FYI Six ($6) dollars per month. I upgraded to 250/500/250 - a higher amount because I knew I was at more risk. The total, it cost me less than $10 per month. In Michigan the 'ride share' with Progressive covers delivering people, food, packages or any thing for a fee.
I live in Massachusetts and own a small landscaping business. I went to a seminar when we were starting out that was put on by the DOT. Before it started, we were all having a meet and greet with the trooper. When he got up to speak, he noted that a lot of our vehicles were not in compliance and subject to tickets, fines, being put out of service and being towed. He also commented that many vehicles were not registered properly.
It opened my eyes, I did my research and continued to do so as we moved forward.
I’ve tried to share my experiences with people I know and honestly I don’t recall anyone accepting my advice as valid. The excuses range from its just a money maker or I’ll worry about it when it happens.
Many years later I was pulled out of a line of cars for a DOT safety check and although I had a minor volition, I was let go with a warning. The trooper was impressed that I did my research and had my vehicle and trailer in compliance.
Insurance is expensive but to me it’s way cheaper than the alternative.
Thanks for all the knowledge and advice - So grateful for your efforts!
Happy New Year! 🎉
I briefly had a pizza delivery job, and I got stranded in a ditch coming back from a delivery. I had AAA membership and insurance, and when the insurance company found out I had used the car commercially, they didn't renew my policy. I learned my lesson the relatively inexpensive way.
My mother was a teacher at a local public school. The kids were scheduled for a field trip. There were more kids then the bus could take. Her principal told her to take the excess kids in her car. She called the car insurance to ask if She coulf transport her students on s field trip. They told her " no". So she told her boss she couodnt do it. However, a different teacher did do it.
Something tell me that other teacher was not told why your mother refused. So lets say that other would have got in an accident and have her claim refused for the exact same reason, could the teacher have go after the principle, a person in authority over him/her who hid the information about the insurance issue.
Wonder if my dad was covered when he loaded a ball team of 12 teenagers in the back of a pickup truck (with a cap) and took us to ballgames?
@@ripvanrevs Different times back then when we weren’t in a litigious society & no one thought much of carrying people in the back end of a pickup.
@@ripvanrevs The distinction is whether you're making money off of doing it. If he's just a parent taking his kid to the game and giving the others a lift since they're going to the same place, then he's fine (they're just carpooling). But if he's being paid as a coach or something for the team, then yes he'd need commercial coverage. (OTOH, I'm not sure if he'd be covered for carrying that many kids unbelted in a pickup bed.)
OP's teacher story ends up requiring commercial insurance because the kids are going on the trip as a school function. And the teacher is employed by the school and chaperoning the kids as part of their duties as a school employee. So the teacher was being paid to haul the overflow kids.
@@solandri69 12 teenagers in the back of a pick up truck? How many seats are registered for that make and model of car? Do the teenagers have proper seatbelts in the back of the pickup truck? No, this is not covered. The whole private/commercial does not matter.
I actually had a similar thing happen with my boat (without an accident happening). I had State Farm insurance and they swore up and down that they covered my boat while taking people out fishing as a fishing guide. Come to find out over a year later it does NOT cover me as a fishing guide. I had to move to a specialty insurance because State Farm didn't have anything that would cover me.
(former licensed agent) You're covered if your agent says you're covered. They might try to fight it but they'd lose, hard.
We had to be suuuuuper careful not to imply any kind of coverage that wasn't actually on the policy because the company (and our employment and licenses) would be on the hook.
Hmmm, the agent writing the policy had a quota, so he lied through his teeth.
@@enriquekahn9405 If he has any sort of documentation to prove that the agent said he was covered he probably would win a lawsuit against the agency for that coverage. I wouldnt want to have to bet on it though.
@@enriquekahn9405 Good luck proving the agent said that. "A verbal contract is only worth the paper it's printed on."
@@jadesluv That agent is risking losing their license, incurring a 5-figure fine and possibly triggering an investigation of the whole company's sales practices.
And yes it actually happens because sales guys are idiots. One reason I left the industry. But my point is, if you can make a vaguely convincing case that the agent said or implied you had the coverage (which could be as simple as showing that they or other people at the agency had done so in other cases) you've won.
I drove briefly for PostMates and Lyft to make some money after I had gotten laid off from my job. In the training material, they make it abundantly clear you need to tell your insurance company that you are working for them and to get the proper insurance. I do believe my insurance company called it "Ride Share Insurance." Also, it wasnt expensive. Just $2 more per month. Not only does the company tell you this, but they *REQUIRE* getting a copy of your insurance to show that you are covered. And as at least one person mentioned in the comments that you need a commercial driver's license, that isnt true. Neither the insurance or the companies required a it. Of course, I couldnt have gotten the insurance coverage, if it did.
the commercial driver's license is up to state rules. some require it for any driving while on the clock, others have certain thresholds, like if you are paid to drive a delivery truck above a certain size, or a bus holding more than a set number of passengers.
@kenbrown2808 only class that may req. A CDL is Uber Black as Uber requires the driver to be a licensed limo service. The old "taxi" license fell away a couple decades ago. Now NYC has its own rules since the taxis/ride share are controlled by the taxi mafia.
@@moguaiato5583 you do know there is a lot of the world that isn't NYC, right?
@kenbrown2808 of course, but 2 things.
1. Topic was about the USA
2. I never assumed that anyone was from NYC. Just pointed our they had their own rules that are different from state laws.
they require you to have insurance because that will be the primary insurance. if you have none then their insurance has to pay.
Anytime I've ever opened a new policy, they specifically asked how much I would be driving the vehicle. The more you're on the road, the more you pay for insurance. At least that's how I understood it.
Yes, but it also depends on what the purpose of the driving is.
Personal use/commuting is something else then "ride share"/delivery for money.
The insurance can show you the math that it is.
If you want an intuitive example:
If you commute to work, you always drive the same roads and know the situation.
If you deliver, you regularly drive routes unknown to you.
obviously
I worked at a pizza company who required you to have your own insurance and you did not need commercial insurance.
They actually got better pricing to insure their drivers if diver could prove it was currently carrying auto insurance of any kind.
It was also understood that while driving Pizzas our personal insurance was invalid but the companies insurance was covering us.
The owner said it was kinda expensive but easier than trying to get the drivers to get right insurance.
I have a friend that delivers newspapers and they do the same thing for insurance.
The "Hired and Non-Owned Auto" coverage that the pizza place has wants to know that everyone has their own insurance so that if someone is involved in an accident when they ARE NOT working, they don't get scammed into coverage for it.
I know at the time when I had my accident, they called it "commercial insurance", which wasn't worthwhile to get when I was getting minimum wage plus tips.
I'm surprised Uber doesn't already have an automotive insurance coverage available for their drivers... (Right up there with whatever car rental companies try to push)... From what I've observed Uber is one of those companies that L-O-V-E-S to find ways to take more money from their drivers.
I just failed to mention that to my insurance company. Lol. They never asked and covered my claim
Up until recently, I was a licensed auto insurance agent. Most policies exclude food delivery or using your personal car for business. Once Uber became so common, insurance companies started offering “ride share” as an endorsement to add the coverage to the policy. This includes app based food delivery service.
I recommend people to review all your policies (auto, home, etc) at least once a year to make sure you don’t have any gaps in coverage. Also- don’t skimp on liability coverage!
Congrats on getting out of the insurance racket and moving onto actual work.
@@nsahandler lol! I got out of property & casualty insurance and do solely FEMA flood policies now. It pays the bills. 😆
@@nsahandler If everyone got out of the insurance "racket", then there'd be no insurance, and you'd be personally liable for all accidents.
@@michaelsommers2356 not really. It could literally be done for cheaper by a government agency.
Private insurance is just taxes for people who suck at math
@@jillianb1744 Thank God it's actually something that would be a required payout.
Living in Hawaii taught me that even if you pay for volcano insurance your entire life, the second a volcano comes about they will do everything to deny coverage - from insisting that "fire damage" from the volcano to "flood damage" from fighting the fires and doing the operations to divert the lava from the volcano is somehow not related to the volcano - they would refuse to pay until the State came out and said that everyone's license would be suspended if they didn't pay.
Insurance without government backing is the epitome of a racket.
Yes, every auto policy I ever bought asked if the vehicle was used for delivery or ride sharing. When I was younger, I delivered pizza, I had the delivery rider on my insurance policy, which costs extra.
I've never seen that question until the last few years.
What a dumb job to have. Literally working for free. This world is a scam
@@wescald I just look it up Average Domino's Driver hourly pay in Missouri is approximately $16.86, which is 8% above the national average. If that's working for free. I will gladly do it. Just some friendly advice fact check before posting, especially ALL politicians.
@@stevenwoodward5923 16 bucks a hour is working for free. That’s slave wages right there. If you work a job in general you’re an idiot. Doesn’t take long to learn how to trade or start a business. People are lazy asf and would rather drive pizzas around
I would also like to point out, that most policies with this Rideshare coverage only cover it if you are doing it part-time. It's very important to read your policy documents. If you are going to be doing food delivery or Uber ride sharing Services full-time, it is very important that you get an actual commercial vehicle policy.
When I was going into the 9th grade (1962 - in the dark ages) I rode to school with a teacher. There were four of us that rode with her and we paid some small amount for the ride. My dad explained that the teacher had to add insurance coverage for us riding and we were paying for the insurance and a little for the convenience. So since I was 14 I have known that you needed special insurance for ride share. I was in the Army in 1972 and became a member of USAA. I have carried their insurance for over 50 years. Use of the vehicle is one of the first questions asked when getting insurance from them and every time I renew. If it is anything other than normal - to and from work, pleasure, etc., there will be an increase in the cost and an additional rider to cover the exception. I guess most people don't know these things or purposely choose to ignore them. Personally, the few dollars extra are worth the security to me.
Adult son was in a fender bender a few days ago. USAA asked the “delivery/work” question several times. It wasn’t, all appears to be good.
Personally, insurance is a racket that needs to be taken up by the government. Lol
@@nsahandler Sure, they do such a quality job with EVERYTHING they do.
USAA told me that work use, limited miles for no more than two days a week, no signage on my vehicle does not require added coverage. They had no premium for 92 miles each way commute in 2007-2009. I've never had an accident except backed into a pole once; started driving in 1963.
@@ronjones-6977 at least they have a non-profit motive and can be swayed by election.
The literal structure of insurance agencies is to take as much money as possible and deny every claim possible.
In 1991 when I got a job delivering pizza. My Dad called the insurance company following my first shift and I was informed that if I continued to deliver pizza with my personal vehicle I had to pay $400 a month for the insurance. So my pizza delivery career ended after one 4 hour shift. 😊
My local Dominos pays delivery drivers $27/hour +tips because they know most young drivers can't afford the insurance
That's exactly why I will never use my personal vehicle for work. The cost of the additional insurance for using my vehicles, even for a field technician position, was outrageous.
I had a sister in-law who was an insurance adjuster. She told me to NEVER use your personal vehicle for ANYTHING work related.
She said even taking your boss's mail to the post office, while on your lunch break, could cause you to be denied if you have a crash during that trip.
@@ETT64 Why would you disclose information about the purpose of your trip to your insurance company though? Even just forgetting about any concern regarding a potential denial of coverage due to a use of the vehicle not covered by the policy, it isn't something I would mention to an insurance agent in the first place.
@@joelglanton6531 Why are you assuming the person disclose anything ??
Mail is in personal vehicle, vehicle in crash, driver incapacitated, mail found in car, insurance adjuster denies coverage/claim.
@@ETT64 I would be really interested in hearing about any instances of things like that happening. I wouldn't think that particular example would lead to a denial without some more concrete evidence of what the driver was doing, but then again we are talking about insurance companies and like you implied, they're always looking for any reason to deny coverage.
Yes, you have to take commercial driver's licence to get the proper insurance coverage if you have accident while doing your business. This is applicable in basically every country.
Driving for uber is not operating a business. not in any country.
You don’t need a commercial operators license but commercial insurance coverage.
@@jhoughjr1 If you're making money doing something you're either an employee or you are and operating a business.
Wrong. Some companies explicitly cover it on all personal policies for uber, pizza delivery, etc.
You only need commercial license for trucks over 10k lbs in the US
I can tell you with 100% certainty you are wrong. I drove briefly for PostMates. I told my insurance company that I was driving for PostMates and they said it wasnt an issue. I just had to pay a little extra in insurance. $2 per month more and I was fully insured. And I could ***NOT*** have gotten insurance if I needed a commercial driver's license.
Ben - In duplicate ??? Steve's left.
Had a friend who swore up and down that he didn't need commercial insurance as a Skip the Dishes driver. I warned him. He ended up in a major accident involving injuries AND was assessed fault. He'll be paying out of pocket for years.
If she was on the way to pick up an order, or delivering it, she needs to contact Ubers insurance. They have $1,000,000 coverage for all drivers. If she was just online waiting for orders, she sol.
Also Uber’s deductable to repair your car is $2,500, you pay out of pocket if you are at fault.
"What were you doing with your vehicle?"
Me: "Driving it."
"Driving with a cheeseburger and fries."
"Your burger?"
"Well not exac-"
"DENIED!"
@@Mark-sn6kh then they add: please resubmit for further disapproval
That's all they need to know. People give up too much info and talk themselves right into trouble.
@@Itsa_Mea EXACTLY.
If you say that and get caught, a charge of fraud could be filed.
I remember this being an issue with pizza delivery workers using their own cars. I think people would be surprised by what things they need to consider before using their own car for anything work-related. My buddy is a state trooper and pulls people over all of the time only to find out that they need commercial registration, hazmat signs, and such, but don’t have it.
fun fact: In Canada, NEVER say YOU hit a moose (or deer or whatever large animal). You say the moose hit you otherwise the insurance won't cover it
In Soviet Russia, moose hit you
What is not mentioned is that some companies will drop you like a hot rock when you ask about rideshare or delivery, and leave you to fend for yourself to get new insurance.
it's dumb because it's not a terribly expensive add-on. the only problem is there are only, like, 3 companies that does them. i know state farm does, mercury might be another, and i cannot remember the 3rd.
@@DisillusionedAcronym State Farm is terrible
@@DisillusionedAcronym progressive
Geico will drop you if you say you deliver
It’s honestly better that the insurance company drops you if coverage is excluded on the policy for the way you’re using the vehicle. Finding a new policy that actually provides coverage is way better than paying or a policy that will deny any claim due to the excluded usage of the vehicle.
That was literally the 2nd thing I was asked after an accident.
I was not ride-sharing and eventually convinced the arbitrator it was ALL their fault.
in the UK a standard policy is social, domestic, or pleasure. People who deliver for Uber/Just Eat/Deliveroo need a policy extension to cover them. There have been several people who have been charged with not having insurance.
Yeah, they’re called policy endorsements in the USA.
I've seen a few stories like this here in Australia recently. People running side business from their homes are having their house insurance cancelled or claims not honoured when the insurance company finds out about the side business.
I was doing Uber/Lyft and carried Progressive Insurance for rideshare. I was paying $732 a month. I upgraded my vehicle so I could go from Uber X to Uber Black. My premium jumped $600. I also drive a charter bus full time. Uber was just to make some extra cash. The premium was as much as I was making in the bus in 1 pay period. I gave up on rideshare.
700 USD per month? Are you driving a Bugatti? I pay 30 Euros per month in Germany...
I worked for pizza hut 20 years ago. They provided insurance for their drivers. The drivers would get bonuses for not getting tickets or accidents. Nowadays, some of these companies are relying on insurance fraud as part of their business model.
Back in the day when car services still existed, I drove for one while in college. One of the things we did was deliver food and alcohol (usually to one of the local no-tell motels). We treated the delivery just like a fare. I assume the insurance companies view it the same way.
They don't, they're totally different
Food doesn't have medical bills
in the UK it is the same - it comes under hire and reward insurance - which you just either pay as a top-up or in most cases as your main insurance
@@no_peace -- Food doesn't, but I do. And, so might someone I hit. Adding to the greater risk of driving many more miles than a typical driver, you're trying to produce (meaning take more calls) because that earns you more money.
@@QALibrary -- In our case, because we were a car service, we had to have livery plates and livery insurance.
As an old P&C license holder, livery services are never covered by the base auto policy that most have. Commercial needs to be written under commercial policies.
Every time I've re-uped my policy, my insurance company asks me the standard questions, one of which is whether or not I use the car for commercial purposes to inlcude uber, lift, grubhub or any rideshare/delivery purpose. They ask these questions to determine the likelihood of a claim which effects your premium. if you dont disclose this to your insurance company that's on you.
I'm wondering what the $400 dollars a month covers! My insurance in the UK costs around that per year, but covers "commercial use" and around 20k miles per year- it excludes "for-hire" and "racing", naturally. Insurance sounds very complex in the US, and very expensive, in this example.
Part of it is that insurance in the UK probably doesn't need to cover hospital care as the health care trust presumably picks up the tab on that. If you think about it, treating injuries, and deaths, are the biggest possible payments that an insurer has to make. If it's just deaths, then you're looking at the cost of repairing/replacing cars and fixing property damage.
Somethings tells me it's not her first, or second or even third accident. This maybe the type of person who should not be spending more time driving.
@@SmallSpoonBrigade oddly, the only time I had a bill for healthcare was when I was checked out after a motorbike accident in the late 80s - I passed it on to my insurance company and they paid it, road traffic accidents aren't covered by the NHS (though they don't charge upfront)
@@SmallSpoonBrigade I did not know this but after 2leftthumbs post, I looked it it.
Insurance in the UK DOES cover hospital care where personal injury compensation is awarded. The NHS will bill the insurer.
No kidding, I don't pay that much for 6 months.
Thank you for this video. Absolutely great advice to look at your insurance policies. If you have an agent, make an appointment to talk things over but 100% read it yourself. Yes, it's dense but it'll prevent those surprises in the future.
Education on insurance should be mandatory with obtaining your license when insurance is mandatory in your state (or country). All people driving vehicles should know at a minimum:
1) What to do if you get into an accident (while at the scene)
2) How to report a claim
3) What different insurance coverages mean
4) How much insurance coverage you have
5) How much insurance you legally need
Lying to insurance companies when obtaining your insurance can be a crime. You're certifying information is true in order to contract with the insurance company. It's also not a victimless crime because they're using that information to set rates for everyone. So many people like to justify the 'big bad companies' are just taking advantage of people. I'm sure some are, but the people handling your claims aren't (generally) stamping your claim denied out of hand laughing over their stacks of fat cash they stole from you because insurance was mandatory. They're doing a hard job trying to stick to their contract against the flood of 'No one will notice this one exaggeration, this one omission, this tiny lie" soft fraud and the threat of government fines.
They have to make sure they have enough money to pay for all the claims that are going to come in while remaining a solvent company. You're probably also victimizing future-you when past -you thinks you can get one over on 'the big company'. In some states, if you lie in your insurance application and they discover after the fact, they can void your policy to creation date, hand your money back and say "You didn't have coverage with us. Good luck to you in the future."
You get what you pay for. It's like going to a McDonalds, ordering a Big Mac, giving them $6 and being mad they didn't deliver you a juicy steak because now that you're eating you really want something else. Heck, if you're lying to your insurance company, it's like giving McDonalds a counterfeit $10 and then being mad they didn't deliver that steak you didn't pay for or ask for in the first place.
Ride share/Transportation Network/Food Delivery laws are still being written and refined. Every state is different. Some states actually had a moratorium on excluding food or parcel delivery from insurance claims during COVID. In some states, your insurance company can't deny food delivery entirely, but only down to state minimum limits or they may have to document sending you a notice that ride share is specifically excluded every renewal.
I'm not saying insurance companies are great or they can't be money grubbing jerks who don't hold up their end of the bargain sometimes. But they are highly regulated in many states. You have recourse to contact your local department or bureau of insurance if you think something fishy is going on. But the only recourse you have against your own ignorance is educating yourself.
This reads like you work in insurance. A lot of good info but honestly I laugh at the thought of a local department or bureau doing anything. I call bs at the highly regulated since they write their own rules that get passed. The whole insurance industry is a scam. Pay them to get denied. They know most of us can't afford a lawyer and lawyers don't work for free.
Profit several hundred million and my rates go up. I pay almost double from 2 years ago with no accidents or tickets. Yet they are regulated? Laughable at best. Maybe on paper but not in the real world.
Finally! A comment from someone one who understands how insurance works! As a retired commercial Insurance underwriter it makes me nuts when people think insurance companies are all trying to scam you.
Dad used to work in insurance. He told us to NEVER EVER allow the car to be used by our place of work as we were not paying commercial insurance rate so we'd be up the creek if we "just ran something down the street" as it were. I'm guessing commercial insurance rate is significantly higher than what normal mortals pay, not to mention other obnoxious restrictions.
I am an independent contractor for a delivery company, my commercial vehicle policy is around $4,000 per year. I drive about 110,000 miles per year. To make that worth it you have to earn a lot of money. None of the food delivery apps and services pay enough to make that cost worth it.
For my insurance company they define Rideshare as working for a Transportation Network Company wither or not it is Uber, Lyft, Postmates, Eats there's no difference it is considered ride sharing. If you are working directly for Domino's, Papa Johns, Jersey Mikes or other restaurant directly then its considered commercial and not coverage. Also their Rideshare coverage is not available in every state. There are some states where ride share is excluded and can't be added and in other states where it's not offered and is still covered. Insurance rules can be insane.
@3D Printing- wow...I was seriously thinking about delivering for Amazon part time. I had no idea that I would need to change my insurance.
you are saying delivering pizzas is not covered by insurance ?
@@ronblack7870 it depends on your insurance company underwriters and what they deem as an appropriate risk. It's similar to working say as a real estate agent vs a general contractor with their tools and supplies in their truck/van. Contractors with tools and supplies in the truck often need commercial and real estate agents just need to disclose they are driving for business appointments vs commutes to and from office
I used to work in the Industry and its Earnestly fascinating to see how many adults seem to lack the ability to read their policies.
Hundos, two, count them two, unfolded, between the passenger side of the turbine car, not in the box, and the drivers side of the #71 Daytona, on the right side top of the main cabinet. 30.
💯👀💯👀
Does that mean, that from now on, there will be two of 'em to find?
Ahh, a hundo hid from Steve. A slip and fall accident. I guess that is why in very rare episodes we can't find it either.
I work as an auto adjuster, our contracts are designed to exclude this and other commercial risks. Uber has a policy that protects you while you have a delivery in your vehicle but doesn't protect you in between.
For years now, every time I'm gonna renew my insurance they ask if I use the vehicle to work with app transport or delivery.
There's a giant clause saying if you use the vehicle for working with app for transport or delivery then that insurance will be voided, and you need a special insurance for that.
This is why different policies exist, and you make an informed decision before you buy any. There was a case in the UK a while back where a rider was stopped for something (don't remember what) but during the discussion he said he was on his way to work. Police ran his registration (plate) and asked to see his insurance - which he showed them. It was for "Social, Domestic and Pleasure" only. So he got done for riding without insurance because at that time he was. He fought it but lost because the police were right. He was commuting and didn't have a "Commuting" addition to his policy, so at that time it wasn't valid.
Very strange.
This is also why it makes sense to get an insurance agent. If you're just getting insurance for personal uses an insurance agent is probably overkill, but an insurance agent can answer questions about what is and isn't covered and if they're an independent agent, they probably won't even mention it to the insurance company unless it's a question on the forms.
Wait a minute $400 premium
$400 a month
For that kind of money the gecko himself needs to show up and fix my car
Awesome as always! A related incident I experienced...Years ago when traveling internationally, I would rent a car and use my GOLD card and the credit card acted as the car insurance to save me big bucks, all the time....One of my travel buddies cautioned me to check and see what is covered. I called them and checked, turns out car covered 100 percent. I asked about liability in case someone was hurt or killed in an accident...NO LIABILITY COVERAGE AT ALL, ZERO!!! Never did that again....as Steve says, make sure you know what is covered.
You say, "Denied" and I say, "Hello, hello, hello"
I don't know why you say, "Denied", I say, "Hello, hello, hello"
Why, why, why, why, why, why, do you
Say, "Denied, denied, bye, bye"? Oh no!
Thanks for that 🤣 it'll be banging around my head all day...
Never put uber or lyft stickers. When adjusters come out to authorized repairs. They will report it back to your insurance
Insurance companies will weasel out any way they possibly can. You can't be too careful. Cheers!
they will try to weasel their way out of any claim but in this case to be fair, regular personal use is much different to being on the road for most of the day, 5 days a week, every week as that is your work.
My wife ran a childcare from home, and that was something our car insurance company, State Farm, specifically mentioned, i.e., transporting kids she is being paid to care for is not covered as personal use of our vehicle. Made perfect sense to me, and the cost of the insurance rider we had to add to our vehicle insurance was 100% deductible as a business expense. (This was 30 years ago so it may not be as simple today.)
I wonder how this works for real estate agents that drive people in cars showing them houses with the hope that they'll buy. I was in real estate sales in the mid-80's for a few years and didn't have extra insurance coverage. Luckily, I never got into an accident.
I would have assumed that real estate agents register the cars as company property for tax reason.
Those miles and gas are not cheap, so you want to pay them with company money (before personal income taxes).
Coming from that perspective, the whole question is irrelevant:
The insurance might go up, but you can deduct the whole insurance fees from the income.
This does not negate the effect of higher insurance fee, but... that you pick up drinks for potential buyers on the way to property and you just happen to also buy your personal grocery while your at the grocery store happens to add up.
In 1971 when I became a volunteer firefighter my car insurance company said, when the green light on your car goes on, your insurance goes off.
Every time I get into an Uber I ask if the driver has ride share coverage on their insurance policy. I get a lot of shoulder shrugs.
Does it ever start a conversation?
@@j.l.m.6862 lol 👍
Who cares? Uber had their own policy that covers the ride.
Steve, where would TH-cam be without your stories? I look forward to there every day... keep up the good work!
ive always wondered if uber drivers lied to their insurance companies. that was one of my first questions on hearing about ride sharing, when it first came out.
400 a month for insurance? what was she driving? what is her driving history?
I’m in Iowa and pay $480/month in insurance. 6 vehicles and only 2 adult drivers with a deer strike 7 years ago and 2 speeding tickets 3 or more years ago.
That's what I wondered.
I have excellent coverage, but my insurance is less than half that.
I also have zero points on my license, and have never filed an auto claim, nearly 30 years now.
some do or they just don't mention it and hope they avoid accidents. others expect to rely on uber's own insurance (which is very conditional and has a fairly high deductible).
it's honestly stupid because it's fairly cheap.
Here in NY, depending on your driving history, that amount would be “full coverage” for a lot of drivers and a requirement for any new car under a lease agreement with the auto dealership. Unless she’s driving a 2022 Mercedes, something’s sounding fishy
Interestingly, in Utah, you don't have to be a licensed driver to purchase a vehicle, license a vehicle, insure a vehicle and use a vehicle, you just can't be the driver of the vehicle.
Yep, When I delivered pizza I had business insurance on the car so I'd be covered. Yes it was more than regular insurance, but it wasn't that expensive.
If you don't know what your insurance covers, you need to ask your insurance agent and read the policy.
I delivered pizzas 40+ years ago for a summer (the summer of 1980) and didn't have additional insurance coverage. Luckily, I didn't get into an accident.
Back in those days, there was of course no internet (basically) and no apps or GPS tracking.
@@sunchips5 40+ years ago you didn't have million dollar lawsiuts for the littlest thing, and a fender bender wasn't a multi-thousand dollar specialized repair.
21 year licensed broker here..:in my experience, Progressive and State Farm will do just about anything to avoid paying a claim. I have State Farm myself and have had to sue them twice to force them to pay valid claims. If you have good credit and multiple vehicles and properties, they are often the most cost effective. Just be aware that if something happens you may have to involve lawyers.
This was a good post! I’m glad you explained the second $100 bill, as I look for it in every episode. I was thinking maybe you upped the ante for some poor soul *still* working under the misguided ideal that somewhere in the United States, someone can drive without the proper documentation. I love that. I can’t believe anyone thinks this.
The Uber thing was interesting. I was also thinking that Uber should be required to put into their paperwork for drivers. I realise there is always someone who doesn’t read the vital paperwork, I came across it in Human Resources. Often people sign all this paperwork and just whip through it, not reading it. I ask them if they read it, I received answers in the area of, “Why?” or “Ah, it’s not important.” I’d educated them on the importance of doing that. I read everything I’m given. It must just be us…
I used to work of an insurance company and my wife used to train insurance consultant staff. The risk for a vehicle that is used for private use if very different than that used for commercial purposes. I used to deliver Pizzas last millennium and checked with my insurer if I needed to upgrade before I started. At that time as it was only a few shifts per week my private policy covered me.
"It fallen, and can't get up." 😂🤣😂🤣
I hope that younger people get this reference.
"I'm having chest pains!"
Uber says that their insurance covers you while you are actually online.
No, it's only if you have a delivery. A delivery gives you a "waybill" which is coverage of insurance, origination and destination. Unless you accept AND START a delivery, you're not covered. And you are on your own between deliveries. You are on your own until you actually have the item in your car. The only time you're covered by Uber is between the restaurant and the customer.
I remember reading an article about 15 years ago about definitions and contracts. It pointed out that in one contract it used the word firearm, and later on in the document it defined firearm and included knives in the definition.
I'm still stuck that her insurance premium was $400 a month and that WASN'T even the ride sharing version!?!?!?
That struck me as well. I live in Ireland, where insurance companies charge an arm and a leg as we have USA style personal injury settlements. My policy (albeit for a small car) is €800 p.a.
Who knows what infraction she had on her driver's license. Maybe she's a bad driver.
Also note, she rear ended the other driver. $400 is very high even for full coverage. My guess she is SR-22 or something.
Probably not her first accident.
@@ewanduffy Move up north! £270 a year in Coleraine.
1) She wasn't engaged in a commercial use; as she wasn't actively engaged. In other words, if she isn't going to a pick-up or a drop-off; the driving is not commercial.
2) She is being charged based on mileage, how she gets to that mileage figure is her business. If the insurance company wants to examine what she is doing, they should have asked explicitly at her most recent renewal. It is the responsibility of the insurance company to understand their risk at inception of each contract; it is not the responsibility of the consumer to explain risk to the insurance writer.
3) Unless she specifically said she wasn't using her vehicle for commercial use and was in fact using for a commercial use; the insurance company doesn't have a leg to stand on.
Those who cave to insurance companies in situations like this; deserve what they are getting. Push back, fight back, bring in state insurance commissioner, and if necessary take it to a jury trial. Insurance companies are likely to settle out if she is aggressive enough and has a half decent lawyer.
Edit:
Just looked at my original and most recent auto-renewal insurance policy. Mine has NO mention of commercial exclusion or requirement to disclose. Only the original policy had some verbiage on commercial trailer usage. I suggest people do the same BEFORE calling insurance if they are doing this kind of work. If it is prohibited by the contract; it should really be stated as prohibited IN the contract.
Isn't it interesting that uber is letting their drivers drive without knowing that you need a commercial license and commercial insurance. Just shows how much they care about their drivers.
Youre tecnically self employed contractors in most states. Its not the responsibility of uber to make sure youre insured correctly. If you look in the terms of service they probably require you to be properly insured. They put the onus on the contractor to know and follow the rules.
@@supernova743 the point of the original comment is to point out that Uber doesn’t really try hard to let people know
Nice try being a know it all but you’re both right. Your reply simply had little to do with the line the conversation
if by "interesting" you mean totally predictable, then yes.
Uber has insurance it has a huge deductible though
No, you don't need commercial license/insurance for Uber most of the time. There are exceptions but by and large you're just wrong.
When I got rideshare insurance it was a "hybrid" policy (personal and commercial coverage) offered by Geico Commercial. The consequence is that the commercial policy wasn't reported on my personal credit report. When I tried to switch back to personal insurance, every company's automated quote system decided I was uninsured for the past 4 years and quoted me ridiculous rates. Even Geico's own systems did not account for my history with Geico commercial. I finally lowered my rates after an arduous process of obtaining proof of insurance to manually override the system of my current insurer.
Lol, glad you found your 100$ bill Steve. Something like that would drive me crazy wondering if someone broke in and left all my other valuables but took that 100$ bill.
And her own car insurance won't pay unless she reported that she was driving for her job. I turned down an office cleaning supervisor job due to needing to drive to multiple locations each night. I asked if the cleaning company would cover the cost of the rise in my car insurance, and they told me not to report it. Not worth the little bit of extra pay. These delivery drivers don't realize that they will pay for the wear and tear they are putting on their car along with increased car insurance or cancellation if their insurance company finds out.
In the UK you MUST have commercial insurance for food /parcel delivery or taxi/uber (any business use) not only will the y not pay your claim but the police will prosecute you for invalid insurance(even if there is not an accident) which could mean large fines a revoked licence a retest or in extreme cases prision
To quantify, in ENGLAND, the Police don't decide prosecutions in Scotland, and the court imposes the sentence.
@@alanbrown5593 Anywhere in the UK you can accept a fixed penalty and fine by the police for driving with no insurance. It doen't have to go to court.
@@rusticpartyeditz They can issue you with a fixed penalty notice but the police do have the option of sending it to the courts. They also have the added bonus to seize the vehicle and send it to the crusher for no insurance
this is a topic that has long been known/discussed in driver communities. there are 3 carriers that actually offer 'rideshare' policy - state farm is one and progressive isn't - and it costs a little more than 10/month. there's always been people who ignore it.
I used to deliver for a long time. Never had full coverage, never had an accident. Had some close calls of other people running red lights, but I always look in all directions when I get a green light and as I'm crossing. When it comes down to it, you get insurance to cover your screw up. There's very few realistic situations that you can't avoid getting hit. Majority of the time, it takes two to tango. Would be good if she read her policy.
Hit in the back while stopped at a red.
@@hugh007 only time, I've ever had that happen I was pinned in my lane. the last few close calls with a rear end, I was able to see them coming full bore and crank the wheel hard and get the hell outta that lane before they slammed into the person infront of me.
There's still the issue of liability, and government requirements for liability insurance.
Way back in the '60s when my sisters and I started driving in our small town, our insurance man told my parents to firmly impress upon us girls that this insurance policy does not cover joy riding with all of our friends in car. One sister did n't listen - the insurance agent saw her then called our parents. Well she never did that again.
I think part of the big issue was that the car was insurance for the photography business as well because my parents traveled within 100 miles to photograph weddings and police photos etc. So it was a business car basically. We girls would need to run business errands and go to school - that was it.
A friend was joy riding after a school dance. He had an accident. The most severely injured girl was grounded. Her parents got a call thinking she was in her room. That really enforced the no joy riding in business car.
I thought the second Ben on the set was just due to inflation.
While Steve Lehto says, "Insurance is a contract," I use a simpler word. "Insurance is a bet. You're betting that something bad will happen to you. The company is betting it won't, but they wrote the bet, so there are many ways they can invalidate the bet."
Well put
Insurance is risk pooling. You see it as a bet, but one you legally have to make.
More so and more so.
Jeepers! $400+ per month for insurance in the US?? That's mental. I pay that per year in the UK
I'm going to bet she was texting her customer and venture to say that she caused some serious injuries.
They'll be on the hook for some of it for sure.
She had no "customer" at the time of the accident which is why Uber's insurance is not paying for the damage to her vehicle. If the accident happened while she was doing a pickup/delivery, the damage to her car would have been covered by Uber except for a $2500 deductible.
@@ubermothman5584 or she was in cahoots with the customer to get them to cancel the order in the app, then deliver it for cash, thus screwing over Uber AND the restaurant.
@@arcxjo Sounds plausible.
I used to sell insurance, never lie to your insurance company. If you're going to be doing the occasional food delivery on the side, tell them. That way they will cover it. It might cost you more, but at least you know you won't be left with a broken car and somebody else's bill. I also recommend everybody read their policy thoroughly. Especially these newer rideshare policy riders. In my experience, in Reading several of them, they only cover rideshare businesses when you are doing them part time. If you are doing Rideshare as a full-time job, or food delivery as a full-time job, you must get commercial insurance. As a delivery driver myself, I watched another driver get burned by his insurance company because he lied to them and told them he was not using the vehicle for delivery. When he had an accident, not only did his insurance company drop him, but then he could not get insurance from anybody else without a huge down payment out front. And they also did not replace or cover his vehicle.
Fun fact: "the shared economy" of uber/lyft/airBnB suddenly does not work when following the same regulations "regular economy" is under.
Hey Steve. In Michigan this is fairly straightforward. I drove for Lyft a number of years ago when my wife and I were saving up for a large purchase. After doing some quick research I had to purchase a "rideshare rider" for doing rideshare from my insurance company (State Farm). Essentially the insurance company broke down when the "rider" was applicable and when it wasn't. The ride share companies also provide insurance to their members, but it's really quite useless. Step 1 is to contact your own insurance company and step 2 is to leave a message and we might get back to you. :) If memory serves me Lyft provides insurance under fairly narrow circumstances and it was capped at a low amount. I don't recall the specifics now, but it wasn't good. For instance, if you are driving around with the app on, but nobody in the car and you're not on your way to pick somebody up then the Lyft insurance was no applicable, but unfortunately neither is your standard car insurance for the reasons you stated in the video (e.g. the car is being used for a commercial purpose). The rider wasn't that expensive, but that may have since changed.
When I used my 1/4 ton truck as a courier for about 4 months, I had to insure my truck for commercial use. The good thing was that my package policy was still in effect when I was driving the truck for personal use. The commercial use insurance was a "rider" clause. When I stopped doing courier work, my insurance simply dropped the commercial rider.
I'm always amazed how many people don't know this. With State Farm you need delivery insurance and if you Uber people then you need additional ride share insurance. All you people delivering pizza with your own car better make sure you are insured properly.
I have paid thousands of dollars into car insurance throughout my life and I have not received one tangible benefit for all the money I have paid.
She had the Uber Eats app on so Uber's insurance covers $25k bodily injury and $25k for whatever she hit.
If she had been actively doing an Uber Eats pickup/delivery, then Uber's $1 million liability policy kicks in plus coverage for damage to the driver's vehicle minus a $2500 deductible.
The limits on coverage when not actively doing a pickup/delivery makes sense because otherwise I could just turn on the Uber Eats app, ignore all delivery requests, and use Uber's insurance as my car insurance as I do my usual driving around town.
This is why I think there's something not being reported. She probably called the customer and got them to cancel the order after it was cooked, and said "I'll deliver it for half the normal Uber delivery fee" (which is still more than they pay drivers anyhow) and then gets to the restaurant and feigns surprise at the canceled order. Then she says "well, cut your losses, I'll buy it for half price since you can't serve it now" and does this scam all over town. Hell, there may not even BE a customer, she could just be doing this for free lunches, knowing some of the scam artists I've run across as a legitimate driver.
And this surprised anyone how?
Back in the late 80s, I was delivering for Dominos, and an accident involving a pedestrian. Called the insurance company (Aetna) to make a claim. Agent told me that they were going to fight it. Later on, they told me that they weren't going to fight it, due to a clause in the policy that if you got a fee for delivering something, which in this case was the 50 cent commission per delivered order, it violated the policy.
Had to hire a lawyer to get the insurance company to cover the accident, because the lawyer successfully argued that the agent already said that they were going to cover it.
We got a letter informing us that we were not covered for commercial use of our cars and noted that commercial activities like transporting food, items or people were not covered.
Wow, I wasn’t expecting you to talk about this one that quickly. I forgot to mention. When I tried finding the email to send in to I found that I was unsubscribed and had to resub.
Allstate has a similar policy for food deliveries. It's called rideshare in name only but it lists the major food apps in description as well. It only costs me an additional $3 a month for that coverage in Wyoming.
I would recommend reading the rideshare policy, I bet it doesn't cover it if you are doing it full-time.
The timing is impecable, my son and I were just talking about this two days ago. I told him I didn't believe that insurance would cover food delivery without paying exta. I almost hate to be right on this one.
In the Uk it's called the public liability clause which includes for hire or reward. Also, you have to state if you will use it to travel to and from your place of work, because insurance companies don't like paying out.
Agreed, it's not just transporting things/people, if you are using your car for work then you need to declare it (and pay extra).
Some insurers even charge extra if you have your business name on the car.
@@andrewharrison8436yes but some don't, mine was like an extra £30 a year for adding business use (I do some local delivers of my stock saves on shipping)
If you lie on the insurance application, they will not cover it.
They explicitly ask whether the case will be used for ride sharing. If so, one must carry the additional coverage.
I will 10000000% vouch for the accuracy of this!!! Holy fuck!!! I work at Pizza Hut. Before I had a job change (that was a mess), I got into a small fender bender. This lady didn't move and Iswtfg, the more i think about what happened, the more I start to believe it was 100% intentional on her end. But anyways, because of her choice that didn't make a lick of sense, I ended up tapping her back bumper. THAT FUCKIN VAN GOT AWAY WITH A SOFTBALL SIZE DENT! MEANWHILE MY CAR HAS A DAMAGED FRONY BUMPER AND ISSUES WITH THE PASSANGER LIGHT STAYING ON OR EVEN WORKING! EXPLAIN TO ME HOW I GOT WAY MORE DAMAGE THAN SHE DID!!!
But anyways, I filed it at work because I was on the clock taking some orders out. This was like 8 at night. And because it was filed through work, naturally my insurance company got ahold of it. I give my insurance all the info and they tell me a month after the incident that, despite getting a damaged vehicle, they won't cover it because I was using my personal vehicle for work!!! I WAS LIVID! I STILL AM! BECAUSE NOW MY CAR ISN'T LEGAL! I LEGIT WOULD HAVE TO REPLACE THE BUMP PROBABLY AND FIGURE OUT WHAT'S GOING ON WITH WIRING AND BRACKETS OR WHATEVER INTERNALLY!!! LIKE FFS! MY BATTERY DIED THERE/GOT JOLTED APART! I may have seemed calm, but i was internally crying in a fuckin ball. I'm still SO FUCKIN PISSED OFF! That i got no assistance! Not from my own insurance company OR my works insurance!!! I'D BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO USE A COMPANY VEHICLE TO MAKE MY DELIVERS! IT'S AN OPTION IN OUR SYSTEM BUT WE DON'T HAVE THEM!!!
I drove for Uber for almost three years in the MD/DC/VA market. My personal car insurance was GEICO and I checked with them regarding using my car for rideshare. Initially they didn't have a problem with it but after about a year they notified me about a policy change regarding rideshare drivers. GEICO was forcing rideshare drivers insured by them to take out Commercial Vehicle (i.e. tractor/trailers, bread delivery, plumber vehicles, etc.) insurance if the car was going to be used for ridesharing, otherwise GEICO would refuse any claims. Commercial Insurance would raise the monthly premiums by over 500% from my previous monthly rate, so this GEICO customer of 45 years told them to pound sand and I explored other options. I was finally able to get "regular" insurance from Progressive with a rideshare rider attached. This increased my monthly premium by only about 20% as opposed to 500%. I guess GEICO (formerly the "Government Employees Insurance COmpany) had spent too much paying for a CGI reptile and needed to recoup some costs. Well they ended up losing more revenue with their money grab.
i know someone who got a 700K settlement for a minor injury. He wasn't injured until he found out the other driver had a 5 Mil policy...he then needed outpatient neck surgery....he was able to function fairly normal the next day (bending, etc)....but got 700K
What were you doing with the car at the time of the accident? Driving, I was driving it. From a location where I was, to a location where I needed to be.
And the purpose of the journey was? They'll ask!
That's one of the things I'd heard about years ago as a reason to not deliver pizzas. The pay isn't good, though you may make a lot in tips, and meanwhile you're putting a lot more miles on your vehicle, and need a more expensive insurance policy. Some people like to just count their fuel cost, but you're also wearing out various parts. You *could* take meticulous notes of oil changes, brake jobs, belt replacements, tire replacement, etc., or you could just use the federal guidelines for business deduction, where you can look up a per-mile allowance. You can look it up, but the second half of this year, the allowance was $0.625 per mile. Drive a typical vehicle 100 miles for delivering pizza, and you've spent about $62.50 for the car use, not counting the insurance.
Honestly, the most surprising thing to me in retrospect, is that states aren't cracking down on people driving for pay with non-commercial licenses.
Most states have a standard non-commercial class C license for most drivers. That standard driver's license does not allow you to drive for pay. If you are going to drive for work, like a taxi driver would, for instance, states require you to get a class C commercial driver's license. It's a little more complicated to get one, and there may be more fees involved, and you have to have a medical ID card as well if I recall correctly.
I think this is exactly the sort of thing that a CDL (class A,B or C) exists for, and it's kind of surprising that that is not being enforced, especially with the number of unskilled Uber drivers there are.
When I started driving Uber in 2015, I had to change insurance companies. Uber made it clear that their insurance only covers you when you have passengers or a delivery in progress. Uber made it clear that insurance that specifically covered rideshare was required. That regular insurance would not cover rideshare activities such as driving to pick up a rideshare passenger or delivery.
I've seen this happen a couple times. Pizza delivery, Uber, Lyft.... those are commercial uses for a vehicle, and standard insurance policies specifically exclude coverage if the vehicle is used in commercial service. State Farm is no different.
The north Dakota attorney General did a big public announcement about people who work in this type of industry need special insurance.
I got into an accident in my car a couple years ago. I was picking up food to take back home lol.. When I filed my claim they did ask me if I was doing this for a food delivery service.. I said nope my own personal food. They covered the claim just fine. It is a good thing I never did any work for these delivery places, because they could have delayed my claim until after they made sure I was not doing any commercial work with my car.
I used to sell insurance years ago and I have warned dozens of people whose kids delivered pizza and such that their car insurance would not cover them. Most people said they didn't believe that so I said, "If you don't believe me car you insurance company.". My neighbor drives for Lyft and I warned him and he replied that they'd have to prove it. DUMB.
My daughter was involved in a multi car accident. The driver at fault was a Uber driver with a passenger in her back seat. Her car was totaled and her insurance company denied her collision coverage because of the reason you're explaining. She was also fined by the Department of Motor Vehicles for not titling her vehicle as Used For Hire.
This has been an issue in NY. A taxi driver is required to have a class E license, "for hire insurance", and taxi/livery registration. UBER and Lyft bought enough politicians to be exempt. Drivers with basic liability insurance only are hauling people around. Insurance will not cover any injuries.