Who knew an episode of BR could end on a cliff hanger note. Side note - you mentioned in her introduction episode, she reached 130km/h - good grief, that's fantasy speed in my world - reaching 100km/h in my 300tdi is a Facebook moment
Very interesting! I like you get jealous over how good some countries have it rust wise ! My stage 1 had disintegrated where the rust trap on the body frame is . The 2nd row door one you referred too. Nice one Mike
Mike I think definitely paint the chassis. I have done a few now and I use a small gravity feed spray gun with a 0.8mm nozzle and about 40psi of air. Much faster than a brush and it really gives a factory look. I would put rust converter on first, followed by ZincPhosphate primer and then satin black chassis paint. Then treat it with crown
The striations are caused by the pinion head teeth. The pinion bearings must have failed and they rebuilt the axle. The backlash is massive, so it looks like they didn’t bother setting all the shims correctly. You’ll have to start from scratch, setting up the pinion depth and checking the preload for the lateral bearings, and then transferring some of those to move the diff laterally to get the right mesh and backlash. The manual tells you how to move the correct thickness of shims from one side to the other for the backlash based on how much backlash you have once the pinion is set correctly, so it’s not as much a case of trial and error as it appears. Still not a fun job, given the need to remove the lateral bearing inner races each time you adjust the shims.
@@BritannicaRestorations, they would certainly have been replaced after such a failure as they’d be heavily damaged, which could be why their current mesh and backlash appear wrong. But that diff centre has definitely been in contact with the pinion. Given how the tolerances are generally good enough that you can swap pinions and diff centres from axle to axle without touching the shims and have the mesh spot on, even when changing ratios from 4.71 to 3.54 or vice versa, I imagine the failed pinion bearings trashed the pinion shims behind the outer race and the new pinion was set up wrong, but I’d expect the diff centre shims to be OK. Since you have the pinion night setting block and the dial gauge and mount, it should be a relatively quick fix for you - drifting the pinion bearing race in and out to adjust shims is easy; it’s buggering about with the diff centre shims that is hard as the inner races have to be removed with a puller without crushing the shims.
I remember when Hylomar Blue first came out. It was the bodgers go to. You would lift a bonnet and see it squeezing out like icing on a cake. We didn't know how good a product it was back then because we associated it will bodging.
Any normal person doing "a couple of little jobs" might fettle the brakes and wash the car....you dump the rear diff!......and that's why I love this channel :)
Lanogard here in UK, I live 4 miles away from the salt mines in Cheshire 🇬🇧 and when they salt / grit the road's around here they lash it on big time. (Lanogard is a bi product from sheep )🐑 .
Deffo paint and Crown. Looks pretty good! That diff - got to be previous damage from a failed bearing no? Looks like the pinion has been pushed into the crown wheel and damaged it?
Repaint the chassis Mike. I’ve have mine waxoyled twice, it just forms a crust and still rusts underneath. The other advantage is that you don’t get covered in black crud that you can’t get off every time you go under the car….
And that is why I do not recommend Waxoyl as it fails is the cold - here in Canada we have a better temperature stable wax, but it is messy - so maybe you can see why I like the Krown so much - easy too apply, creeps and protects quite well
To be fair, I've noticed that several manufacturers put logos on their springs "upside down".... and then buyers just fit them with the logo the right way up. Honestly, I think a lot of spring manufacturers just copy each other's products without really thinking about the design too much. I recall, years ago, there was quite a bit of debate about the "correct" way to fit rising-rate springs. About the only reason I ever bought-into was that some coil-over-dampers had adjusters at the top (either for adjusting the height of the spring-seat or adjusting valves in the damper) so you'd fit the tightly-wound coils at the bottom simply so you could get a C-spanner or screwdriver into the top of the damper. On a 4x4, the likelihood of getting crap wedged in the spring is probably the biggest concern so fitting springs with the tightly-wound coils at the top is the smart thing to do.... unless you're driving a Bowler, which might have fancy, adjustable, coil-over-damper suspension I suppose.
Every Defender factory spring fitment I have seen, is tight coils at the bottom, but as you say, mud and stones get into the spring and cannot get out - I will leave these as they are as I expect this will never leave the asphalt...
Mike, every single landy I restore I clean and buff up the chassis as best I can with sandpaper or wire grinder then degrease it and then paint it in Corroless primer and then Corroless topcoat. It’s the best stuff, lovley to paint on and easy to spray. Lasts for donkeys years and looks identical to the original paint. Good luck
@@BritannicaRestorations yes it’s the best stuff I’ve ever used. I have to order 2.5 litres of each because 1 litre is just under what’s needed for a 90. But 2.5 litres has done a 90 and 110 easily. Make sure you slap it on there real thick and once your done…go to town with your crown rustproofing too in the holes. My 1984 90 has no rust whatsoever because of it
I remember stripping my Salisbury, it did have double the backlash and wasn't bad,l end up putting a elocker in it and getting it to specs,was not a good centre to adjust. Was a pinch noisy but ok now after 10000km or so. The front rover diff was sweet to adjust and elocker with new bearings,not easy over 60 Getting under a land rover with axle stands,l needed LandroverSophie to give it the touch in her bathroom. 😁😁😁
Looks like the pinion bearing failed or the preload was not set right - BUT it has been repaired as the is zero debris in the axle, and the gears are nice
Hi Mike! That odd wear you're seeing is where the pinion bearing has worn, I had the same on my 110 years ago and managed to replace the axle as I was struggling to set the preload on the bearing be great if you could show me how to do it in a video with this one! But yes I dare say they haven't set the pinion to crown wheel mesh properly as it is fairly tricky, best of luck!
Yes it looks like it has been the pinion bearing OR someone has not set the preload on the pinion when changing the seal - there was no debris in the housing leading me to believe that it has been repaired, but I think they have not changed the carrier bearings - see future video
A good pressure washing for the chassis, then pour on the "Krown" rustproofing inside and out. Protective paint coats will only properly adhere to sand blasted clean surfaces, any less prep just leads to moisture getting trapped beneath the coating.
Buy a galvanized chassis. $2500 + shipping. Then install new bushings and then your running gear. When it’s all ready, swap it out. Blaster has a new undercoating. (PB Blaster brand.)
That is easy to type, but a lot of work for something that is already solid Not sure where you buy your chassis, but Rovers North are minimum $4,900 USD
@@BritannicaRestorations don’t buy anything from RoversNorth unless you’ve done your homework of the prices. It’s quality stuff, but quite pricey. I talk with Megan at Britcar and the shipping via Royal Mail has been excellent. RoversNorth sells gaskets for $7 that cost 50 cents. Their markup is crazy. richardschassis.co.uk/land-rover-defender-110/ they were cheaper two years ago. Covid has shot of the prices of steal. There is East Coast Customs you could ask about their source of Chassis, but sounds like yours is good. Not sure the exchange rate with Euro at this point. Sounded like you were not satisfied with your chassis. ERR4632 $108 from Britcar RoversNorth $239 Oil cap $17 RNorth $2.26 Britcar
think you just said it crown wheel not meshing perhaps been put back without enough shims to the pinion (diffs are very unlikely to have been repaired to the letter in most garages - i've been finding timken bearing from england, france and USA mixed up in the same assemblies) , looks like rear calipers have been changed at some point. Repaint with a a steel primer and overcoat, afaik, all steel primer red oxide primer will consolidate the rust ? Too much slop, backlash well out, be interesting to see the inner races.
The diff seems intact but where did that wear come from, ts like something kept knocking it for a long time until deeper noticeable grooves came. I can't wait for the next episode on this because I have one of the last 300Tdi defender 110 but clunks like there's no tomorrow. I fear tempering with it just yet because am not sure what am gonna get into😁
@@BritannicaRestorations Wild stab:- the diff' is out of alignment and somebody's added a bunch of shims to the pinion to take up the slack and pushed it so far in that it's marked the diff'. I've noticed a lot of youtubers talking about adjusting/shimming diff's recently and they make it look pretty straightforward but it's a bloody nightmare in real-life (IMO, at least). Only ever done it properly once, and that was cos I bought a new axle for a 90 and spent months tinkering with it before finally bunging it on the car.
I met a guy in Brazil that would get them off the factory delivery truck and outfit them with snorkel, winch, and a few other things. He said that every one of them had tons if slack in the drivetrain. He said that he would put it in first and you could move the rig back and forth a lot. I told him I want to take the slack out of the transfer box and front and rear diffs and he said it’s not possible. I know it is, but just showing that these things come many times from the factory out of their own tolerance specs.
It seems to me now the diff is out, that the pinion bearing has failed or the preload not set( maybe someone changed the pinion oil seal and over tightened it?) The gears are perfect and no debris in the axle, which leads me to believe this had had the gears replaced, BUT the carrier bearings are shot, hence the clunk
I have heard about these on vehicles, and replaced many on boats in Australia years ago, but these were in constant contact with salt water - not sure how they would work on a chassis
Looks like the pinion dropped down onto the carrier and someone thought the noise was perfectly normal for a Land Rover. I bet this axle has been done twice: once then failed, then to its current state.
I tend to agree = This has suffered damage in the past and as you will see in a future video when I strip it, the current crown wheel and pinion are in perfect conditions. You would expect with the amount of metal ground out of the carrier, that there would be a lot of metal in the housing - not so When I drove it it sounded fine - but clunked - more on that later
Ask anyone who’s ever owned a Nissan navara (D40) what they think about Spanish chassis. They’ve cost the buyers thousands of pounds due to shoddy work and poor welding. Any thing with a chassis made in Spain should be very wary of quality. I lost half the value of my Nissan virtually overnight
Who knew an episode of BR could end on a cliff hanger note.
Side note - you mentioned in her introduction episode, she reached 130km/h - good grief, that's fantasy speed in my world - reaching 100km/h in my 300tdi is a Facebook moment
That's what I am saying - 130km/hr for over an hour - IF the differential was THAT bad - it would have blown - all it was, was excessive clunking
Very interesting! I like you get jealous over how good some countries have it rust wise ! My stage 1 had disintegrated where the rust trap on the body frame is . The 2nd row door one you referred too. Nice one Mike
Interesting!
That’s one tidy chassis 👍👍👍👍
Mike I think definitely paint the chassis. I have done a few now and I use a small gravity feed spray gun with a 0.8mm nozzle and about 40psi of air. Much faster than a brush and it really gives a factory look. I would put rust converter on first, followed by ZincPhosphate primer and then satin black chassis paint. Then treat it with crown
That is what I intend to do Tom!
Mike
That’s a good one, unusual for you Mike ! I would just paint the chassis, crown it , last another 25 years.
My thoughts exactly!
The striations are caused by the pinion head teeth. The pinion bearings must have failed and they rebuilt the axle. The backlash is massive, so it looks like they didn’t bother setting all the shims correctly. You’ll have to start from scratch, setting up the pinion depth and checking the preload for the lateral bearings, and then transferring some of those to move the diff laterally to get the right mesh and backlash.
The manual tells you how to move the correct thickness of shims from one side to the other for the backlash based on how much backlash you have once the pinion is set correctly, so it’s not as much a case of trial and error as it appears. Still not a fun job, given the need to remove the lateral bearing inner races each time you adjust the shims.
I have a feeling these are not the same crownwheel and pinion - you would have thought the pinion would be ground bad - but it was not
@@BritannicaRestorations, they would certainly have been replaced after such a failure as they’d be heavily damaged, which could be why their current mesh and backlash appear wrong. But that diff centre has definitely been in contact with the pinion.
Given how the tolerances are generally good enough that you can swap pinions and diff centres from axle to axle without touching the shims and have the mesh spot on, even when changing ratios from 4.71 to 3.54 or vice versa, I imagine the failed pinion bearings trashed the pinion shims behind the outer race and the new pinion was set up wrong, but I’d expect the diff centre shims to be OK. Since you have the pinion night setting block and the dial gauge and mount, it should be a relatively quick fix for you - drifting the pinion bearing race in and out to adjust shims is easy; it’s buggering about with the diff centre shims that is hard as the inner races have to be removed with a puller without crushing the shims.
I remember when Hylomar Blue first came out. It was the bodgers go to. You would lift a bonnet and see it squeezing out like icing on a cake.
We didn't know how good a product it was back then because we associated it will bodging.
I have no idea what this silicon was but it stuck pretty well and had no gasket
Any normal person doing "a couple of little jobs" might fettle the brakes and wash the car....you dump the rear diff!......and that's why I love this channel :)
5 minute jobs = we love them!
So nice to work on a vehicle that is not rotten, and the bolts come out!
Lanogard here in UK, I live 4 miles away from the salt mines in Cheshire 🇬🇧 and when they salt / grit the road's around here they lash it on big time. (Lanogard is a bi product from sheep )🐑 .
Deffo paint and Crown. Looks pretty good!
That diff - got to be previous damage from a failed bearing no? Looks like the pinion has been pushed into the crown wheel and damaged it?
Correct!
Repaint the chassis Mike. I’ve have mine waxoyled twice, it just forms a crust and still rusts underneath. The other advantage is that you don’t get covered in black crud that you can’t get off every time you go under the car….
And that is why I do not recommend Waxoyl as it fails is the cold - here in Canada we have a better temperature stable wax, but it is messy - so maybe you can see why I like the Krown so much - easy too apply, creeps and protects quite well
Aliens rear axle has aliens in it. Same as mine. Cheers King Mike 🥃
To be fair, I've noticed that several manufacturers put logos on their springs "upside down".... and then buyers just fit them with the logo the right way up.
Honestly, I think a lot of spring manufacturers just copy each other's products without really thinking about the design too much.
I recall, years ago, there was quite a bit of debate about the "correct" way to fit rising-rate springs.
About the only reason I ever bought-into was that some coil-over-dampers had adjusters at the top (either for adjusting the height of the spring-seat or adjusting valves in the damper) so you'd fit the tightly-wound coils at the bottom simply so you could get a C-spanner or screwdriver into the top of the damper.
On a 4x4, the likelihood of getting crap wedged in the spring is probably the biggest concern so fitting springs with the tightly-wound coils at the top is the smart thing to do.... unless you're driving a Bowler, which might have fancy, adjustable, coil-over-damper suspension I suppose.
Every Defender factory spring fitment I have seen, is tight coils at the bottom, but as you say, mud and stones get into the spring and cannot get out - I will leave these as they are as I expect this will never leave the asphalt...
That wear is very common with Salisbury 3.5.4.
Mike, every single landy I restore I clean and buff up the chassis as best I can with sandpaper or wire grinder then degrease it and then paint it in Corroless primer and then Corroless topcoat. It’s the best stuff, lovley to paint on and easy to spray. Lasts for donkeys years and looks identical to the original paint. Good luck
I have some on order!
@@BritannicaRestorations yes it’s the best stuff I’ve ever used. I have to order 2.5 litres of each because 1 litre is just under what’s needed for a 90. But 2.5 litres has done a 90 and 110 easily. Make sure you slap it on there real thick and once your done…go to town with your crown rustproofing too in the holes. My 1984 90 has no rust whatsoever because of it
Another mystery to solve. Woohoo. Thanks Mike. 😊
You bet!
I remember stripping my Salisbury, it did have double the backlash and wasn't bad,l end up putting a elocker in it and getting it to specs,was not a good centre to adjust. Was a pinch noisy but ok now after 10000km or so. The front rover diff was sweet to adjust and elocker with new bearings,not easy over 60 Getting under a land rover with axle stands,l needed LandroverSophie to give it the touch in her bathroom. 😁😁😁
Looks like the pinion bearing failed or the preload was not set right - BUT it has been repaired as the is zero debris in the axle, and the gears are nice
Hi Mike!
That odd wear you're seeing is where the pinion bearing has worn, I had the same on my 110 years ago and managed to replace the axle as I was struggling to set the preload on the bearing be great if you could show me how to do it in a video with this one! But yes I dare say they haven't set the pinion to crown wheel mesh properly as it is fairly tricky, best of luck!
Yes it looks like it has been the pinion bearing OR someone has not set the preload on the pinion when changing the seal - there was no debris in the housing leading me to believe that it has been repaired, but I think they have not changed the carrier bearings - see future video
Bilt hamber products are amazing, used their rust converter on my 300tdi and it outlasted the vehicle.
A good pressure washing for the chassis, then pour on the "Krown" rustproofing inside and out. Protective paint coats will only properly adhere to sand blasted clean surfaces, any less prep just leads to moisture getting trapped beneath the coating.
Mike, I’ve had good results brushing on Ospho prior to painting undersides like that.
The pinion bearing has failed and been hitting crown wheel and kept driving
I think it has too, however there is no debris in the housing leading me to believe this has been repaired in the past as the gears are perfect
Buy a galvanized chassis. $2500 + shipping. Then install new bushings and then your running gear. When it’s all ready, swap it out.
Blaster has a new undercoating. (PB Blaster brand.)
That is easy to type, but a lot of work for something that is already solid
Not sure where you buy your chassis, but Rovers North are minimum $4,900 USD
@@BritannicaRestorations don’t buy anything from RoversNorth unless you’ve done your homework of the prices. It’s quality stuff, but quite pricey.
I talk with Megan at Britcar and the shipping via Royal Mail has been excellent. RoversNorth sells gaskets for $7 that cost 50 cents. Their markup is crazy.
richardschassis.co.uk/land-rover-defender-110/ they were cheaper two years ago. Covid has shot of the prices of steal. There is East Coast Customs you could ask about their source of Chassis, but sounds like yours is good.
Not sure the exchange rate with Euro at this point. Sounded like you were not satisfied with your chassis.
ERR4632 $108 from Britcar
RoversNorth $239
Oil cap $17 RNorth
$2.26 Britcar
think you just said it crown wheel not meshing perhaps been put back without enough shims to the pinion (diffs are very unlikely to have been repaired to the letter in most garages - i've been finding timken bearing from england, france and USA mixed up in the same assemblies) , looks like rear calipers have been changed at some point. Repaint with a a steel primer and overcoat, afaik, all steel primer red oxide primer will consolidate the rust ? Too much slop, backlash well out, be interesting to see the inner races.
The diff seems intact but where did that wear come from, ts like something kept knocking it for a long time until deeper noticeable grooves came. I can't wait for the next episode on this because I have one of the last 300Tdi defender 110 but clunks like there's no tomorrow. I fear tempering with it just yet because am not sure what am gonna get into😁
See the video when I strip it down and you will be just as puzzled! Coming soon!
Where do you get those splitting chisels you use? Looking for something just like that but can’t find anything as thin!
Simple! In my shop!
britrest.com/shop
Mike. Deary me another sad Salisbury ! Would it be simpler to replace the whole rear axle with D1 24 spline from Ludi ? V.
Nope
Looks great - those damn rear diff clunks seem to be built into them from LR
Seems so - this is a mystery!
@@BritannicaRestorations Wild stab:- the diff' is out of alignment and somebody's added a bunch of shims to the pinion to take up the slack and pushed it so far in that it's marked the diff'.
I've noticed a lot of youtubers talking about adjusting/shimming diff's recently and they make it look pretty straightforward but it's a bloody nightmare in real-life (IMO, at least).
Only ever done it properly once, and that was cos I bought a new axle for a 90 and spent months tinkering with it before finally bunging it on the car.
Can you buy an OEM clunk from Britpart?
I met a guy in Brazil that would get them off the factory delivery truck and outfit them with snorkel, winch, and a few other things. He said that every one of them had tons if slack in the drivetrain. He said that he would put it in first and you could move the rig back and forth a lot.
I told him I want to take the slack out of the transfer box and front and rear diffs and he said it’s not possible. I know it is, but just showing that these things come many times from the factory out of their own tolerance specs.
It seems to me now the diff is out, that the pinion bearing has failed or the preload not set( maybe someone changed the pinion oil seal and over tightened it?)
The gears are perfect and no debris in the axle, which leads me to believe this had had the gears replaced, BUT the carrier bearings are shot, hence the clunk
would some of those sacrificial zinc anodes that are used on boats to prevent corrosion work on the frame?
I have heard about these on vehicles, and replaced many on boats in Australia years ago, but these were in constant contact with salt water - not sure how they would work on a chassis
Looks like the pinion dropped down onto the carrier and someone thought the noise was perfectly normal for a Land Rover. I bet this axle has been done twice: once then failed, then to its current state.
I tend to agree = This has suffered damage in the past and as you will see in a future video when I strip it, the current crown wheel and pinion are in perfect conditions.
You would expect with the amount of metal ground out of the carrier, that there would be a lot of metal in the housing - not so
When I drove it it sounded fine - but clunked - more on that later
Ask anyone who’s ever owned a Nissan navara (D40) what they think about Spanish chassis. They’ve cost the buyers thousands of pounds due to shoddy work and poor welding. Any thing with a chassis made in Spain should be very wary of quality. I lost half the value of my Nissan virtually overnight
This chassis was made by GKN in the UK, but spent its life in a dry climate in Spain
Have you seen the results dry ice cleaning can achieve on the underside of a vehicle?
th-cam.com/video/yGuTUGjh9Ns/w-d-xo.html
Have you seen the prices of these! Starts at $15,000 USD! Makes a nice job but a bit pricey!
@@BritannicaRestorations I'm sure you could make one.