Pogačar Slams ‘Scared’ Vingegaard + Does Roglič Have A Problem? - Wild Ones Pro Show TdF Stage 9
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ต.ค. 2024
- Highlights and discussion from Stage 9 of the Tour de France 2024 and Stage 1 of the Giro d'Italia Women.
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Guy comes back from injury with broken ribs, punctured lung and so on and people want him to take a huge risk and compete on terrain, that suits his opponents :D. Let's see how many times Remco attacks up the mountain while he is still in GC.
Yeah I think Jonas is being more tactical for future stages
Not to mention on someone elses bike.
Everytime pogi attacked,only 1 rider followed since st Luca,Vinni. Remco is just a flat surface rider he shld sit down and relax
Exactly, TJ. It's such nonsense that TP and RE are calling him "scared". Pure projection I think. Who attacks a competitor when they aren't on their own bike. Can't wait for when JV puts it on 'em both in the high mountains. Both of them are noobs.
Jonas is the smartest rider in the Tour...no way should he join those guys in attacking Roglic and Rodriquez.
I’m with Emily on this one, Jonas is in Pog’s head. It’s weird to think you could have determined the podium today with only a minute gap to Roglic. Bora would have worked with Ineos to drag them back. And in Pog’s own words “you can’t win the tour on this kind of stage, but you can lose it.” Meaning a mechanical would screw you over. So if Roglic doesn’t puncture, the 30-60s they could potentially get over him wouldn’t secure GC podiums, not when you can lose 7 mins on 1 climb even as the best cyclist in the world (like last year).
Jonas was also justified in his decision with his puncture at 3km to go. If that had happened when isolated with Pog and Remco, he would have lost a heap of time. It’s not about being scared, it’s about not being dumb.
Follow up to the above, Remco was very reasonable. Yes he didn’t race the smartest, but that is how he races. And yes he was disappointed that Jonas didn’t work with them, but he also accepted the reasons and could understand why Jonas wouldn’t want to and he knows that is part of racing.
@@gettysb19 He was totally contradicting himself. Backpedalling when he realized he fucked up with the no balls comment about a 2 time TDF winner.
I agree with Emily. Jonas is in Pog's head. I think Pog figured he could drop Jonas today which is what he would've tried to do had they rode away. Jonas played it smart and Pog is annoyed. If they ride Pog's way then Pog's up by a lot on GC and it's a boring TdF. Today was a great stage and it's awesome that we have riders with different characteristics and tactics. It makes the race.
@@miche_amico it is not just man v man… Jonas did the right thing by waiting for his team. The biggest takeaway from it is that seems Jonas really doesn’t care where Roglic is…. As putting time into Rogla would be the only reason to keep riding with Pog and Remco at that point.
@@MichaelBoogerd true, he wanted to keep himself safe and I don't think they see Rogla as a threat at the moment. I do hope Rogla can get in there and compete. It would be awesome to see.
@@MichaelBoogerdwas stated as much by Jorgensen in post race interview
Jonas was also still on Tratniks bike when they attacked him over and over ... So that also talks to Jonas not wanting to put himself in a worse situation than he already was in . Remco was also angry with Jonas. His team boss actually told him that Jonas was still on the wrong bike to calm him down
@@Nicoztrike Tho Tratniks bike is almost 1:1 with his, only saddle height is like 3mm off
The thing with Vingegaard negotiating his own way back up to the front after getting Tratnik's bike could most likely only have happened because he told them to stay put. He doesn't get the credit for it, but he's actually excellent at positioning and navigating in a peloton. So no need to be flabbergasted and he wa never out of the peloton.
Laporte came onto the back of the group behind Vingegarrd, so it’s very likely he helped him across the gap first, before Van Aert brought him back through the group.
@@rob-c. We saw most of the ride back up to the front and Jonas mentioned after the stage that he was never out of the peloton. And I only saw WvA as Vingo nudged him and then passed him soon after on the way up.
Laporte came back to help but also got a puncture. He said it in an interview
Definitely. He told them to stay because he could make his own way up and needed them fresh when he got there
Tadej's comment is pure projection. He knows Jonas' form is better than anyone thought and HE is now the one who is getting scared. Him saying that it's Visma strategy reveals it all, because he knows all too well that Visams' strategy the last two years was to allow Tadej to win the first week and UAE to appear dominant, and then take over in week three. He knows that's what's going to happen now. For Jonas to be all over Tadej despite being on a teammate's bike, and not care about Remco or his former Visma teammate and instead purely marking Tadej shows Jonas is super strong just two months after a scary accidnet.
This! 🎯
That's when visma had the best team and could wear Tadej down. UAE have a way stronger team now.
@@oscardot It remains to be seen. On paper, this is definitely true, but only in the mountains. UAE is now overstacked in the moutnains and thus lack rouleurs to control the rest of the race as they may like to do. Visma weren't so much wearing Tadej down as letting him wear himself down earlier and then isolating him later. That will be difficult this time. However, this time, Tadej will be suffering from six weeks of racing in 11 weeks, while Jonas has been using this past week as training from what he missed from being in the hospital in April.
I don't understand what the point would be for Jonas to take pulls with the two guys ahead of him in the GC. He is definitely not going to drop them on a gravel stage, so the only outcome of pulling would be to finish third (among the three)
You can see Jonas isn’t 100% but the frustrating part is that for some reason Pogi and UAE seem to think that it automatically means that they can drop him with a few moves. UAE are more and more often showing poor strategy and positioning and are allowing Pogi to be isolated.
Also massive props to Matteo for bringing Jonas back
Well I understand Pogi's comments (and recently saw what Remco had to say, a bit frustrated as well) BUT they have to understand that Jonas is running a different race. Honestly big respect for Jonas and Visma, they did really well (and also got into Pogi's head which is probably what they had wanted to do all along) and really looking forward to the next stages. I'm sure Jonas is saving his punches for the last stretch and for the mountain stages.
Why would Jonas help Tadej take some bonus points on him? Tadej is frustrated. And if he would have been so much stronger then he would have been able to get away, but he didn’t, and it isn’t because of lack of trying
The difference is not Jonas vs Poggi but TLB vs UAE. Today, without team support Jonas surely may have been dropped but La Porte and Jorgensen saved him. The UAE strategy is a total failure.
Man vs man, we all know that Poggi beats Jonas
@@Photoguti It was definitely easier for Jonas because of the team, but tbh i don't think Pogi could drop him in the long run today. He simply doesn't look stronger
Thank you for the Pro show! It has been such a nice addition to following the Tour. I like the form, the timing, the guests, your takes on matters and especially just the right depth of analyzing the race that doesn't require a watcher to have a racing career of their own to follow but isn't "TdF for dummies" either.
As a Dane, let me compliment Emily for the pitch perfect pronunciation of 'Vingegaard'. Not something you hear every day in non-Danish media.
NBC is the worst, embarrassing, can’t pronounce name correctly after many years.
Always a Dane…
Haha nicely done (ps one more here)@@donwasinger6654
Its pronounced Vingeroid or Vingebore most of the time Vingeshithead
@@ellendilregent1008 Good one.
This reminds me of the rivalry of
James Hunt vs Niki Lauda
Niki was very analytical and tactical
While James was let’s just go race
Yes very similar. The same criticisms were leveled at Lauda, cool and unemotional.
Prost v Senna came to mind as well.
@@Chiller11 Vingegaard is pretty emotional. I've seen him tear up more than once.
I love this show, such a great addition to the channel. Please do one for all Grand tours
I absolutely, positively, undeniably do NOT think "boring" when I think of Jonas. What DO I think? I think he is Mozart on a Bicycle. Just an amazing job today...on a teammate's bike no less.
calm down
Jonas is the Real Madrid of cycling.He gets things done,no matter how ugly you might think
@@ELPapito-sq2ks You need to watch more cycling......
People calling Jonas boring is getting boring.
Jonas is extremely exciting...
Why? He is a boring, one dimensional rider.......Only winning Tours does not make you a great cyclist....
@@Andy_ATB You're not a one dimensional rider if you win the Tour de France twice, with Pogi (the best rider in the world) in the peloton.
Stupid comment 🤣 "Only winning Tours does not make you a great cyclist"
You just won "The most stupid comment of the day" 👏👏👏
Nobody was calling Jonas boring on Col du Granon, Mount Ventoux, Hautacam, Col de la Loze, Marie Blanque, La Planche des Belles Filles.
@@Andy_ATB Are you sure about that? I think it is pretty great.
I agree he is boring he had the best team 2 yrs straight he just sucks wheels,let me see him race all the same races in a season as pogi classics,one day one week etc @WerdnaLiten
If you look back the past 2 years, i don't think Jonas has ever pulled with Pog to get away. He either pulled away himself or he had a GC lead over Pog and just hung on to the wheel, cause he didn't have anything to gain from helping Pog. Jonas is well aware of his own strength and those lie in higher altitude long mountain stages. He probably doesn't worry about Roglic cause he knows he would have smoked him last year during the Vuelta, if not for Sepp and the whole team drama.
Also, why would the iTT world champ and the 2nd best iTT rider this TdF, need Jonas to get away. They could have pulled away and get a big gap on Jonas and the rest.
Pog is getting outsmarted and hes not happy😅
What people are missing is that Jonas isnt riding with the others first of all doesnt stop Pog and Remco from riding, they are interested in isolating Jonas and playing their sprint. they are 2 and have a breakaway in front of them and could continue, so in essence they were scared to continue the effort They both wanted to take time on Jonas by this move not neccesarily the other.
Jonas shows absolute confidence by just following and stopping, as it shows he has confidence in breaking his competitors later on and is not needing to distance roglic, It isnt his job to distance those 2 further from the likes of roglic and other competitors. It shows Jonas has confidence in their plan and that he will break them on other points in the race.
They want it over now because they are scared of Jonas later in the race. Jonas is absolutely in Pogis head, I think Remco doesnt really know much as its his first tdf.
We will see how strong Jonas is on stage 15 and 19 which is by my estimations the clearly toughests ones the ones that should be in his gameplan. I have a feeling he is even stronger in the mountains than last year especially the longer ones than earlier years - why?
Because he is visibly skinnier than last year(probably due to the crash and lack of training for muscle gain earlier in the season), and rumors are he is 4 kgs lighter bringing him down to 56-57 ish kg. And despite this he has still been able to get through the bad stages for such a light rider relatively unscathed only 1:15 down. With 2-3 kgs less muscle mass than last year he will not have the kick but will have to write pure pace watts/kg on a long run on those days that has the most altitude meters, Im pretty sure pogi cant follow him there, but we will see with Remco.
Better condition than last year? How could that possibly be true and on the level after being in the icu and missing weeks of training. That hospital juice must be cutting end
because he is lighter, he is not as strong as he could be but look at him compared to last yearh hes 4 kg lighter. r, and if you look at the looses he has lost vs pogacar its only due to sprint power missing, which is completely expected, hes close to 10 kg lower than pogacar, something he has never been before.
On the climb where Pogacar took 6 -8 seconds over the top was due to corners and the power pogacar put down after the corner aka acceleration not constant power. And on the down hill he only gained time on straight where weight is pulling the speed. And today, only on the hill with loose gravel where Jonas weight wasnt enough to get grip so his wheel just turned around with no grip.
With all this and seeing what is coming, playing into Jonas normal power and him being lighter than ever I would be scared if I was pogacar.
@@TellusJD Only problem is that Jonas has no teammate to make the race hard this year especially when going up a mountain. This has always been the tactic and to isolate Pogachar. UAE can just play it safe not forcing anything and Vingeggard will have to make it hard mostly on his own meaning he will have to ride much sooner and longer than he ever did without exploding.
@@Nyelands Somewhat true, but not true Entirely, I think you underestimate Jorgensen, he has shown real strength maybe on par with kuss. He still has tempo riders for the mountain.
But your analysis matches mine, and this is were the unlucky part - him loosing 4 kgs because of lack of training and musclemass can be a plus. He used to have his strength in a 12-16 minutes window where he could beat everyone. Now I think his main strength is just continual tempo no brutal attack just ride them off the wheel when its steep enough.
When you say that Visma rides boringly, I think you are missing the fact that they ride using tactics where Pogi rides using raw power. It's essentially the age old brain vs brawn argument. There is nothing more exciting than that.
if indeed Pogacar is super strong why didn't Pogacar and Remco left Jonas to dust?...maybe because they realized they are stupid?? Jonas is a smart athlete, he has brains intact in his head unlike others who are all "BRAWN NO BRAIN...". Boring?
Its riders like Pog that make it worth watching.
If it’s to see his huge ego get crushed when he loses, then, yeah.
yes its really fun to watch someone doing stupidity...why is that anyway?
That Vingegaard is even riding the tour is astonishing given his injuries of only a few months ago. He’s going well imo. Anyone criticizing Jonas V and riding the tour himself would do well to hope like hell they’re never in the same situation.
Knock it off - he wasn't as bad as they say; otherwise he wouldn't be here......Jonas/ Visma have been 'sandbagging'.....
The gravel stages need to be a regular thing in the tour. This was super entertaining.
I would love more of them if GC is neutralised for them. Yea I agree was the best stage to watch so far and prob will be for the whole tour, but id hate to see someone drop out of GC contention from a puncture on it. Not just lose time, lose all chance through bad luck.
Hope you all feel better. Love the show, I’ve watched every episode since the Tour started.
It's time they adapted the entry system for the grand tours to where you have to collect a number of points in the Grand Tours as well as throughout the your in classics and maybe smaller tours to do away with these purpose built GT teams.
Jonas isn't obligated to play the game.
Just want to say I really enjoy the format and what you all are doing with this show. Have watched every day. Keep up the good work!
Vingegaard being a boring rider is being over-egged. We basically haven't gotten to the part of the tour where he's likely to attack.
he's defending for his life... in the hope he finds his legs in week 3 like the previous 2 years where the same strategy was well planned in advance and prepared for... not sure its a spoiler at this point, but that prep wasn't completed this time.. aerobically he should be quite short and fatigue will hit with more impact the longer the race goes on. To balance that argument, Pogi is going to feel the Giro in his legs at some point too...
Agree, It's as though folks don't understand the tactics of grand tour.
No. He is boring and always rides like that. His attacks are his team cooking whole stage and he then rides away with watts at last climb...
@@fangru7294 id like to see them try cooking with this team… Even if Wout is sandbagging, Benoot, Jorgensen and Kelderman are not about to drop Yates, Almeida and Ayuso.
I would disagree as well. It seems like Jonas solely attacks when it’s exactly as planned and everything is perfectly set up even when he is in top shape. Just feels quite cold and unexciting even though it’s effective.
Thanks guys.
You are doing a great job.
With work and other commitments i rarely get the chance to watch the Tour.
Usually watch the ITV catch up at 7pm.
I am finding this a great and more entertaining alternative!
Top job!
👍
Its pretty clear these dont really have the full tactical knowledge and appreciation. Listen to Chris Horner's youtube channel to get the more informed view. Whenever someone calls Jonas boring you know they dont really understand cycling and the brilliant tactics that are also part of cycling. As a cycling fan i was amazed at the cool head tactics Jonas employed on stage 9. Briliant to see he did not get sucked into doing something unintelligent. Its like the difference between a Butterbean and a Hopkins/Holyfield in boxing. Some just want the Butterbean style because they dont really understand nor appreciate tactics.
Rider sits back to save energy. How is that a bad thing?
I’ve really been enjoying these daily breakdown videos.
I would love if y’all could do a similar format for the Giro and Vuelta as well.
Keep it up guys.
Best stage in the TDF I have seen in a long time! How could you not agree?!
Great show, guys. Thanks for making the TDF even more enjoyable. 👍
25 tires on a gravel stage is bonkers man should have just road flat bars while at it
Like i just had the same argument with George Hincapie, gravel has been in the TDF since 1911. The first mountain stages were mostly unpaved mountain passes. So gravel has a place in races to some extent, though ASO and UCI need to make a rule change that if necessary a bike change can come from someone at the roadside. Same as wheels. Because theres no way the cars can go past up to a rider 🤷♂️🤔, the TDF in the Pinnacle of racing and the riders should be able to traverse all types of roads.
If we are going to use 1911 as a reason to do things, lets just revert all the changes made since then ay? I do not ever want to see a GC battle lost because someone gets a mechanical on a gravel stage. Yes it was an awesome stage to watch, but it would suck hard losing because you got a puncture from a rock.
Maybe if they neutralised GC for those stages and just put sprint/mountain points in it and other prizes, extra cash prize for winning or something.
On the gravel stage it would have been silly for JV to isolate himself from his teammates with TP.
Emily's take seems far more likely than the bald guy's take. If TP is so confident he'll win why would he complain?
"the bald guy" xD
Think of the hypothetical scenario where, in 2025, the riders are allowed to do this stage on a full-blown gravel bike:
- less concerns over punctures and mechanical failures;
- more speed on the gravel surfaces;
- bike brands get to place their gravel products on the most important 'storefront' of all;
- you add an extra point of interest to the race by seeing how the pros give their all on a fat tire bike;
Imo, all advantages! It would be quite a spectacle.
Pogue attack and then complaint when jonas and Matteo did nit want to pull. Lolololol
I think it is a mistake to assume that only Visma and Jonas have a strategy. I think Tadej’s attacks are designed to push Jonas to his limit over the first two weeks, so that any hope of a surprise attack won’t materialize. Wear him out at the start. Jonas is clearly trying to save his energy and hope that Tadej will wear himself out as well. I think it will come down to whichever rider has more endurance come Weeks 2 and 3 of the race.
You guys are doing a great job! Keep it up!
He’s building his fitness back up, why would he be offensive at this stage?
Thing is he is never offensive never exciting to watch, like a bloody vampire.
@@tonyg3091 Visma are very strategic. For them it’s about minimum effort and maximum results, as it should be on a grand tour with their goals. I get it that it isn’t as exciting but that isn’t always the smart thing to do
@@tonyg3091 Visma were leading the peloton most of the day to set a high pace. And a high pace it were. Had it not been a high pace Visma, would have risked Pogo had more energy for more explosions. UAE tried to slow down peloton all day and did so by not leading. NOT boring at all if you understand what you see. It´s not a one day race but the worlds hardest bicycle race lasting 3 weeks in grueling varied terrain. This were a thrilling stage!
@@tonyg3091 Did you forget to turn on your tv? In 2022, he nearly crashed into the side of a mountain in the last TT (where he gifted the stage to Wout), even though he had already won. He has also attacked Pogi multiple times both in 2022 and 2023 on the longer climbs, where his strengths are. Maybe you should criticize Pogacar for not sprinting on flat stages to try and get bonus seconds?
@@YannickOkpara-d5l LOL, the thing is Pog DOES sprint quite often but nice try…
With the lack of conditioning coming into the tour for Jonas, i don't understand how everyone thinks he's only going to get stronger and not just crack in the 3rd week? He's been on his limits multiple times and even in this gravel stage he had to get brought back by Matteo as he couldn't bridge. This goes against all logic and the way we have looked at anyone else that had a major accident leading into a grand tour.
Yeah, agree. It doesn't work like that.....a lot of nonsense being spoken.
this tour is awesome so far!!
I love this series...
I expected Pog to do something special today and gain a chunk of time on GC.
Perhaps Vingegaard is playing it safe all the way through the Tour, gaining fitness and he'll hit the TT at the end for the win.
From the giro and the first TT Pog has clearly been working on it.
Listening to the official TdF highlights, you could hear the coach telling Vingegaard to intentionally just sit on Pogacar and Evenepoel.
Jonas is being the exact way a GC rider should …… not expending an ounce of energy more than is necessary. Economy of effort matters in that third week. Boring yes, but a tried and tested formula for tour champions. That said Jonas could have put to bed any chances Rodriguez, Ayuso and Almeida of being on the podium if he would have soft pedalled through a few times. It would have sealed a three horse race but it’s not his favoured terrain so he’s going to make his efforts in week 3
Jonas was in hospital not long ago, everyone has forgotten
Hospital coffee must be next level to be riding this good
The more I watch Cade Media's Wild Ones the more I feel that Emily has more cycling knowledge and taste than her compatriots. She should have her own show. Was happy to see Jimmy get rid or his dime a dozen smart watch and start wearing a mechanical from his expensive watch collection.
Vingegaard is playing it clever so fair play to him Pogacar is clearly worried that he might get smoked in the final week
JV doesn't want the three of them on the podium, he wants the highest spot on the podium. he's using his head, not his emotions.
Ok - everybody thinks Vingegaard is boring, but it works!
Also; Pogi being hungry for some “scrappy racing” is something a competitor shouldn’t care about in the grand scheme of the GC on days like “the gravel stage”.
If Pogi went solo he wouldn’t have carried on to the breakaway. He would’ve sat down and waited for the peloton and wanted to up the pace even more.
The only thing that guy has is guts, confidence backed by a Saudi state and nothing to loose in this point of his career. Of course he’s cocky
So why does everyone think he is going to get better?? So last year as Pog was struggling the last year people were like well he lost so much training time but this year it’s a guy who lost more time is going to for sure get better??
Not everyone, but you can ride yourself into fitness. I thought last year Pog suffered from the interrupted training, it also looked like he was sick on one of the stages. But he also admitted to forgetting to fuel on the stage where he lost 7 mins so he just bonked. Pog also won stages last year, so it’s not the best evidence to use.
When Vingegaard found himself with Pogy and Remco in front... either he participated or not made sense, maybe he didn't want to pull two dangerous contenders way more dangerous than Remco. But when he was in front with just Pogy, he had a unique opportunity to take time on Remco and Primoz... when you play to win the Tour, you can't reasonably expect that everything will go as planned in the mountains. Okey Pogacar is the favourite, but Roglic and Evenepoel are no tourists
Awesome stage 💯
You need to start keeping a running total on how much everyone has won on the bets.
Jonas will still be recovering from the crash, if not physically then mentally. The teams knew in advance that it was a gravel stage and quite a few seemed to be using incorrect tyres.
Some riders who did a recon complained that the last 5-6 sectors had tons of gravel added last minute so riders were swimming in deep gravel, unexpected.
Vingegard bike swap is a non story. 3mm difference in saddle height...3mm. Irrelevant.
Merckx would have freaked😅
I'm with Emily on the mind-games
Pog and Remco just shot too many loads in this stage. Strong as they are, they are now at a greater disadvantage going into future stages.
I’m with Emily on Vismas strategy plus consider Jonas is still conditioning vs peak Pog…it isn’t a level playing field yet. Oh and let’s keep Remco on the burner before the mountains…act in haste, repent at leisure.
letting Vingegaard ride into form could be a fatal mistake to the other GC riders...Mateo as first LT was impressive yesterday
Jonas have done something really good, since there is so much complains from Tadej and Remco. 😄
Jonas did the right thing. Yes Primoz has a problem. He is 34 and only the 4th best GC rider in this race and he knows it. The other guys are stronger. I am a huge Primoz fan would love to see win but right now the other top 4 are better. Jonas wont be boring in the last week.
I very much like your show. Specially the girl, not because she is very pretty and nice but because of her commentary, her contribution. Thank you.
I normally don't leave comments in videos but since I have been following TDF this year and have been a pretty big fan of Jonas in the last 2 TDFs and Tadej with Giro and Strade Bianche, i'll say this:
I wonder if this ages well when Jonas drops and gets the jersey from Tadej on week three when Tadej and his team cracks.
Tadej was favored to win in 2022 and 2023. Jonas wasnt even Visma's leader in 2022, I think it was Roglic. And Jonas is doing what he did the last 2 tours. Being patient and wait for his moment to shine. Even if Tadej gets a minute if he cracks on climbs Jonas will be there and Tadej might not be able to respond.
Both Pogacar and Remco wanted Jonas to contribute and drop Roglic and the other GC riders from the podium.
I can’t seem to find this interview where pog apparently ‘slams jonas for being scared’. I can find a transcript of him saying they are focusing on me and underestimating the other gc contenders though.
I’m assuming its not one of the english interviews.
It's the Remco interview where he accuses Jonas of being scared and having 'no balls' !! What a little jerk !!
@@samc231 cheers, so this was remcos words? Remco had a lot to say in that interview and does say jonas he felt didn’t have the balls to race, but I still can’t find the part where pogi is criticising jonas?
Its a french interview. Pogi says that they are scared of him
Do any of you actually race bikes? The TdF, is NOT won by being an 'interesting rider'. Who the F cares if he's interesting or not. He's getting paid to win! It's tactics, tactics, tactics, your team, your nutrition, fitness, and energy conservation! Why SHOULD Vingegaard work with the other two GC contenders? He absolutely did the right thing here given the situation he found himself in! He's tactically brilliant and he also doesn't waste energy unless absolutely necessary. He rode brilliantly. He weighs less than 135! He doesn't ride gravel unlike Remco and Tadej (he's too small, light) so he was completely out of his element and not even on his own bike! Unlike the top 2 leaders, Jonas is a GC specialist, and really a climber. Both Remco and Tadej can race and win on gravel and pave, and in some ways one could argue are more versatile. What Jonas did today was like a sprinter--Jasper Philipsen- trying to place on a mtn stage! Wait until week 3. Jonas will get his revenge def. on Remco and we'll have to see with Tadej. He's got better fitness than last year's tour and Jonas's injury may have hampered his fitness. It's definitely one of the most exciting Tours I've seen!
Jonas is "brainy" ; Pogacar and Remco are "brawnies" ....Jonas works smartly while Pogacar and Remco works hard without thinking...that is the summary
Matteo Jorg. saved Vingegaard's butt today.
Its a teamsport, seems like you don't get that - just like Pog and Remco.
Jimmy can I ask why do you call Jonas, Vingergo?
In ball sports, they say defense wins championships. That’s how Jonas races and it’s worked out for him so far. I don’t blame him. It’s not exciting racing, but that’s what the other classifications are for, to keep people entertained
Pogacar races from the heart, if feels like going, he'll go. Vingegaard does things from the textbook, there's nothing daring, off the cuff. Plus, if his still in recovery mode from his awful crash a few months back, why is he still able to ride so well ??? No one on the shows have picked-up on that. His 3rd, riding better then other unhurt riders in the peloton. Maybe there's stuff we, the public don't know about and as you highlighted, Pogacar is sharing his Strava details whereas Vingegarard doesn't divulge anything. On the matter of mechanicals, Evenepoel, Pogacar had just as much to lose if the 3 rode away after bridging across the breakaway, but Vingegaard wasn't interested. USING THAT to justify as reason not to make a trio up the road (gravel if you like) is lame. Either one of those riders could've had problems/incidents. But Pogacar is ok with that, because he had no team helpers, around, Evenepoel had no team around either. Vingegaard decides well i can't, i got no one to help, and does his usual, sits-on and stays 3rd wheel. Like many others, i like the racing aspect that Pogacar, Evenepoel bring. That's what ignited today's stage. .
why should Jonas lay his cards?....if really Pogacar and Remco are Gods they should have left Jonas and eat their dust but didn't. Isn't it?. Too much whining....Jonas is smarter than them accept it...
19:40 I’ll assume there’s time bonuses for position though, so maybe it’s not enough to be defensive
So how is the "Vingegard will get better as the days progress" going?
Go Longo Borghini!
Why does Pogacar end up most of the time without team mates around him? In the Giro Majka was his shadow but seems here in the tour there is nobody
That’s so crazy to think Jonas is NOT in pogs head. If someone is talking about you that you are completing against, then that means you’re in their head. Especially if that person has lost the past two times to them. That’s soooooooooooooooooo crazy that ol’ baldy disagrees with that.
It’s actually the other way around. Jonas and Visma are on the back foot - very unlike 2023. All of their statements are framed and if you decipher them, they are borderline desperate. It’s Pogis Tour and they know it
Classic case of tortoise and the hare I’m afraid to say.. pogs gunna blow early to mid third week.. jonas will breeze past and take the win. shame as I love to see Tadej race.
Wednesday is going to be hell.
No it won’t be. Not even close to what comes Saturday
If Jonas would have pulled through and the big three take the stage...it would have gone down as one of the best stages of all time.
I agree with Emily that it was smart of Jonas to wait for his team. I also agree with Jimmy that Pogacar (and Remco) both just love to race. I hope at some stage both Pogacar and Remco end up off the front together. I think they'd work together and rip the race apart.
They could have worked together today
Isnt it mind blowing the number of professional cyclists and DS-es on social media today after "riding" stage 9 of the 2024 TDF from their couches 😂😂😂 What a wonderful world.
No mention of Drege? And the tragedy?
They did this yesterday.
"scared of me and just followed"... I like Pogacher but Jonas was riding on a bike that was not his... what does he expect?
Jonas is a typical stoic Scandinavian. He lives in Tadej’s head.
Why does everyone think Jonas will get stronger and Pog weaker as the weeks go on? Can’t have it both ways 🤔
Happened last year so why not?
Visma LaB likes catenaccio cycling, so does Vingegaard. Gets them results but it's boring to watch. See for example Tour de France last year, Tour de France this year, Dutch National Championships this year.
Vingegaard is boring as hell, but he wins. I guess that is what matters the most.
As entertaining as Pogi is, the Giro was an utter bore, but it showed why these masters of this era need each other. Be thankful -- it could be an Armstrong or Indurain era and who'd want that?
Emmily is realy right with Poggi more annoyed with Jonas as vis versa...
Gravel stages are fun, but I don't want more of them. It would lead to tours being decided by who has the most mechanicals, which really kinda sucks.
That's just racing, mechanicals, or punctures happen; same as in motorsport.
Lets get rid of mountains then......as they stop more riders being able to win......
@@Andy_ATB Sure, mechanicals happen and that's part of it, but in motorsports, it's not the terrain that's usually causing the mechanicals. It's usually down to engineering, crashes or poor tire choice. In gravel stages, it's random chance. You can have everyone with the exact same setup and not predict who's going to flat or not. It's more of a dice roll than designing parts that last like motorsports do.
Vingegaard not taking turns and riding tactically is nothing to frown at - just that he covered Pogi‘s moves after getting back on is a sign of how strong he is. The thing with being boring is that Pogi dominating the race with his personal presence and wirk is just as boring as it is watching Visma controlling the race by numbers.
Vingegaard rides TdF like the England team plays the Euros.
How many Tours have you watched? How many GTs?
Greatest stage ever? Perhaps
Definitely said “the 4th”.
Aggressive racing is one thing, childish trash-talking is something else.
What about the MTB World Cup in Les Gets.......MTB getting a raw deal, again.
Listem, you guys can't be this amateurish in your evaluations of things. It's hard to listen to this kind of lack of knowledge of what's going on.
1) Vingegaard IS in Pogacar's head. He's trying and trying and trying and he just can't really drop Vingegaard and he knows what a beast Vingegaard can be in the later half of the Tour, having being trounced and mauled two years in a row. Pogacar revealed himself today, HE is scared of Vingegaard and he can't shake him any more than he could the last two years.
2) Evenepoel's comment about the podium shows that he doesn't know how to win. Vingegaard isn't here to race for a place on the podium and the more competitors "alive" in the race, the more help Visma and Vingegaard can get. If Roglic goes in a break away, it's not Vingegaard who's the one to chase him, for instance. Down to three it's much more of a predictable situation and that favors the status quo.
3) Visma's team isn't as strong as the last years. They need to stay true to their game plan in order to succeed. They can't waste energy on anything else and have to ride very conservatively and bet on Vingegaards restitution making the difference in week 3. UAE's team is scary strong - at least in the mountains - but their game plan seems to be "let's see how Pogacar will ride it when we get there" and that can loose them the Tour this year. Evenepoel's team seems okay, but not totally amazing. That's why he wants to get into a every man for himself kind of Tour, because that's where his chances lie.
Visma is scared of Pog. That's why they don't take chances against him.
@@armandolopez2282 Their team is missing at least four of their best riders. That's why they stick to their plan. They even had to take a guy with them who's almost a rookie and hasn't ever ridden a GT before.
They're not scared of Pogacar. They know exactly what he can do and so far their game plan has held up. And they're not scared because they are the dark horse in the race with Vingegaards crash. Nobody really expects Vingegaard to win, except for Pogacar and Evenepoel.
The frustration from Pogacar is clearly visible and he's projecting. So is Evenepoel.
I'm not saying Vingegaard is the stronger of the three, I'm saying they're staying to their game plan and this has clearly frustrated both Pogacar and Evenepoel with their remarks todsy. 🙂
Jonas Vingegaard has never taken a risk. If Jumbo Visma had not CONTROLLED the 2 tours he won, he would be an also ran.
Did you watch his TT last year? And the year before?