Hey y’all! I hope you enjoyed this video. If so, don’t forget to subscribe and all that junk so that the junk can beget more junk and the call to action can call to action. And don’t forget to name check a few red flag movies I may have forgotten to name over in the comments too and stuff! ✌️ Additionally, feel free to leave a tip or subscribe to my patreon if you’re so inclined, or to check out my two podcasts Media Obscura/Glaring Admissions if you wanna hear me talk about movies. It’s available on your favorite podcast player under the name “Media Obscura,” as well as on this channel.
This is the 1st video I saw of yours. I was so excited to see someone talking about a phenomenon I have been aware of since the 2000's. I have since seen some of your other videos and have been equally pleased with your work. You've got a new subscriber. Thanks for doing such a great job! P.S. It was so important that you didn't cheapen this video. With a segway into a Better Help add. I was worried the whole time that it was going to happen.
One example I'd include that applies to women is Gone Girl(2014) it's a great movie, but I've seen a lot of women that see the lead as this empowered girlboss type, and gloss over the horrible shit she thinks of other women (for one example)
To be fair, that one is also misinterpreted by misogynistic men who see the reveal of Amy's psychopathy as a retaliation against women who falsely accuse men -- when such women are, in reality, very rare, and frankly Affleck's character is still a bad person even though he isn't guilty of murder. (I say "misinterpreted," but honestly... it feels a bit like a valid interpretation despite being a harmful one.) I prefer to see it more as a commentary on the duality of presentation: we all appear to be one thing, but no one really knows anyone, not even the people they're closest to. And how our media-obsessed society enables these people, and we should be willing to interrogate the wealthy and powerful.
Modern recontextualisation of these films is still off the mark, just overcompensating in the other direction. Society has identified toxic masculinity but has not yet found a direction it agrees on for positive masculinity, and feels uncomfortable with honest, nuanced explorations of the ideal.
That’s because it doesn’t intend for there to BE any “positive” masculinity, as it doesn’t intend for there to be ANY masculinity at all (you know…being that it’s the kind of thing that tends to lead to slave revolts, and all.😉)!
People don't agree on positive masculinity because the very concept of masculinity/femininity is constructed. What one culture sees as masculine, another sees as feminine and vice versa. There is some overlap, sure, but the idea was never unified to begin with, so why expect positive masculinity to have more unity than older conceptions of masculinity?
Fight Club did a great job at showing how small subversive groups can easily lose their values and succumb to group think. It taught me about how rebellion against one type of oppression can lead to another. The search for meaning can lead to dark places.
You mean Chuck Palahnuik, the writer of the book? Yep. He even wrote two graphic novel sequels to Fight Club that made it even more clear to the people who missed the point of the movie
I seriously can't fathom how someone can see Travis as a role model, he's so clearly a deeply sick (in a sick society for sure) individual and i kid you not, i understood that at like, age 12..
@notjimmy6486 for real, that has always baffled me. Like, best case scenario the dude is completely imagining things, worst case scenario he's a psychopathic serial killer. Like, what's the attractive part here to people? Hell, even Bateman as a character (apart from being a murderer) is depicted as shallow, narcissistic douche canoe
It's because they're in desperate need for an identity. Though wording it as "role model" isn't entirely accurate, it stems from simply relating themselves to the character. They don't see it as positive traits to don, they're still aware that it's pathetic, unlikable, and just other general faults with the character that they identify with. But you see, they revel in the fact that it's an identity full of faults. They revel in the idea of being the "loser." Though it's less of just seeing a 1-1 relation in themselves and Travis (or other characters alike,) and more about *wanting* to see a relation between the two. "He who despises himself, nevertheless esteems himself thereby, as a despiser." Most people have a need to set an identity for themselves, a common example you see from most people online are the people who make a certain interest/hobby their main personality. It's just in this case, it's people attaching themselves to 'outcast' characters and the like. It's ironic the lack of self awareness there is in this mentality though, as likening yourself to these loner characters is actually so common. They like to think they're so alone, but millions of other people identify with the very same thing.
Here are some other great films that would fit this category: The King of Comedy (1983) The Heartbreak Kid (1972) In The Company of Men (1997) Mikey and Nicky (1976) Naked (1993) The Swimmer (1968) Modern Romance (1981) About Schmidt (2002) Five Easy Pieces (1970) Buffalo 66 (1998)
I think both Vince Gilligan and Shawn Ryan have talked about the difficulty of writing anti-heroes on TV when the fans identify too strongly with the lead. For me, the ending of The Shield did a slightly better job of trying to point out that, hey, Vic was NOT the good guy here...
Writing anti-heroes is hard, because the industry for the most part doesn’t know what an anti-hero is, and they write anti-heroes to actually appear cool. Prime example is the character of Rorschach in the Watchmen film. This is why The Punisher will never be able to fit into the MCU, and definitely not Disney’s MCU. There is nothing wrong with being on the side of an anti-hero as long as you understand you’re only on their side when they’re going against people worse then them, but that they are going to do things that you should be totally against.
I haven't seen Taxi Driver yet but I've seen Fight Club a few times. Great film. The thing with a lot of movies & the appeal to them is that people can find different meanings to them despite what the creators originally planned out but that's also a double-edged sword especially when it comes to movies like Fight Club & 500 Days of Summer & TV shows like Breaking Bad. I remember seeing some people rooting for characters like Walter & Tom & hating on characters like Skylar & Summer even though we are meant to hate them & feel bad for Skylar & Summer. Maybe why some people relate to them might be a power fantasy (for both men & women) were we are tired of our jobs & just want to stick it to the man like some of these characters that actually do this.
cool video. saw fight club my freshman year at uni and it always stood out to me. Im not proud of it but I used to think it was so bad ass. I think it’s a phase that many boys go through but some get stuck with
I see most of the identification or appreciation with these "red flag" characters and movies as an outlet for frustrations and carnal desires and aspirations, rather than actual role models that vast majority of people would really want to imitate in their own lives. The assassins you mention at the end are obviously not made to be as such because of a movie they watched or videogame they played, it just became an insufficient outlet that wasn't able to contain their issues.
I think a lot of issue is that there's a general lack of positive male role models in modern media. So many depictions try to solve toxic masculinity by removing masculinity, because positive masculinity tends to be moderated versions of toxic traits and it's hard to show moderation in a movie.
Is it a red flag that I love Jet Li's hero but don't jibe with its "Sacrifice for your leaders" message? Honestly, my red flag is people who have red flag movies. Those people are probably judgemental pricks.
I do like that you don't do what literally every other video essay type does and go on a dismissive narcissistic self-righteous rant about how "intellectually and morally deficient" you think the people who like these movies are. Seeing someone have empathy for people who are unhappy with their lives/the world, even if they express it in a way you disagree with, is nice.
I feel like the order some events helps with justifying/empathizing their bad actions. Seeing the events from their perspective versus seeing it justified via a flashback, can change how well the audience sees themselves in the character
Ex Machina, Sucker Punch and Mojave another one of those red flag films I've found. For all genders. I know you've been taking from the POV you know: Male, so I love your video on that premise. I think taking and doing a video on red flag films that are that for all (Women and other genders aren't free from adopting the mindsets of Jack/Tyler and Travis) genders is toxic because while men want to be this archetype - women/male attracted genders want to date them! That can be dangerous and get them into toxic and abusive relationships.
A lot of good takes here, but also I'll say the "go to therapy" mantra really needs more perspective. What a lot of people are missing is loving welcoming community. Therapy can help, but that's also not directly meeting that need. The alienation in our culture requires a radical shift and while Tyler went about it in a toxic way, he did create community. We simply need healing nurturing space to balance out the often quite understandable anger at terrible treatment. Essentializing that also helps no one. Men need empathy, women need anger. We all need to have the whole range of feelings, and we all need each other
I don't know, maybe I'm tired of being appraised as having negative worth as an individual by society. Maybe I'm getting tired if being told what it's okay to think or believe, even if (or perhaps especially because) I happen to agree. In other words, representation matters. Edit: Hypocrisy is normal human behaviour. Sad but true. We can't help but act out of our wounds; even if we turn sides in the battle, it's the same battle. I have seen it again and again. It's human. Also, therapy doesn't always work. Some people are resistant to it. I know I am despite several decades of engaging in it trying to get help. So no, it's not always a solution for the individual even if it "works" on a macro level, like any medical intervention. People are irreducibly complex. Saying a treatment is 85% effective doesn't imply that if you are given it you'll get 85% better. Furthermore, an important thing to understand about therapy is that, unless you're committed to the change it's offering, it won't work. Full stop. In any case, I'm open to a good faith discussion.
Perhaps hypocrisy means that the hypocrite has impractical opinions or divided loyalties. Therapy sometimes fails because the therapist charges clients too much money, our society stereotypes neurodiverse people as movie villains, and mental hospitals used to torture and abuse their patients, especially if they were LGBTQ+ or alternative teenagers. Also, our culture's idea of mental health is based on neurotypical straight, white Christian men's desired behavior. Some therapists may think one is psychotic for acting differently from this model. Some patients, such as those with personality disorders never seek treatment because they believe they are mentally healthy. An 85% success rate for therapy means it cures most patients.
@@darlalathan6143 maybe so, but even with an 85% success rate (which I just pulled out of the air btw), that's still 15% of people who are not resistant, and that's alot of people. It only takes one to do a terrible thing (or to be the protagonist of a movie, if you prefer). I guess I just have bad experiences with being told "get therapy" after being in it for a quarter century... I'm trying my best but it's not a panacea. I would argue that everyone has divided loyalties and impractical beliefs... ultimately it comes down to choosing the level of hypocrisy (often unwitting) one is comfortable working at. Basic shadow work. Generally agreed otherwise
Another thing about therapy is you have to put in work as a patient and be open and honest. It can be like paying a personal trainer to chat with while sitting around watching youtube.
I honestly find it hard to believe that people identify with these characters as strongly, in the way that is supposed to be scary, in the numbers that generally seem to be stated. I hear far more people talking about how crazy it is that people think Walter White is the good guy than actual people saying Walter White is the good guy… in fact, I can’t think of the last time I actually heard that, in such un nuanced terms. Just my opinion/perspective
I mean, I get that it’s hard to believe, but the video does also show articles/posts online about these movies and how people read them haha. Also someone did try to kill a president because of Taxi Driver back in the 80s Edit: swapped “shoot” for “kill”
I mean people defend eren from attack on titan, and that commits confusing end aside. Very strange to have arguments to go full . yeah But eren going there is well done I mean people can be weird about when he, yeah.
@@NicheCaesar I’m not trying to criticize you, man, your work is good, I’m just expressing how things look from my admittedly singular and therefore limited (like anyone’s) perspective.
Oooh all good additions to the list. 500 Days of Summer is a surprisingly subtle one since many fail to recognize that Tom is a pretty flawed, somewhat toxic guy for most of it.
We need a deepi dive like this on how communities have sexually fetishized villains, especially from kid content. Harley Quinn and Poison Ivy come to mind.
What are you talking about? They're fictional and they've been hyper sexualizing female comic book characters since the ink 1st hit the pages, during the last century. Before any child who has adopted these characters as their own, were even born. It's not like they took the Frozen princess and turned her into a prostitute or something. These characters are like 80 years old in some cases.
My theory is it was only because of the Hayes Code animation being for kids became a thing. Betty Boop, one of the earliest cartoon characters made, was blatantly sexualized. Animation also served to tell stories we could not in live action. CGI in our Marvel movies are a modern trick to blend two different mediums in film. So in a NSFW context, we tend to desire what we can't have. I am a horrible writer with a speech impediment so I could never do a video essay on it lmao
Part of it and I am going to lift this from Macabre Storytelling is that these characters represent our Id (which I agree with). I will give you my own example. I just finished Breaking Bad a few months ago and while it is easy to say that Walter White isn't a good person I see a lot of myself in him in the fact that he gets little respect from other people (I did by some people), that like him my peers are so far ahead me for reasons that were not all of my own doing, and having a little too much pride. In that regard its easy to see why I can relate to WW despite him being bad. I agree that I think some of these characters validate some view point a person has and I also thing that they see part of themselves in those characters just as see part of myself in Walter White.
The problem is the black and white thinking of today. At the time these red flag movies were made, it was possible to agree with many things Tyler proclaimed, while still recognizing he was wrong. It was possible to understand Travis’ disgust, while understanding his methods were “unsound,” to allude to Colonel Kurtz. We used to call that nuance. Nuance today is dead as a doornail. These characters MUST BE either heroes or villains, and never the twain shall…you know
Yes, yes, never the Twain shall Mark 🤔. That’s the saying right? Haha. But yes, that’s the whole point of these characters. They’re right to be upset, but they’re channeling it into the wrong place. Durden is right to hate the world of 1999. But he’s wrong to use it as an excuse to sell fascism to his followers under the guise of anarchism. Same goes for Bickle and his whole Rebel With A Taxi crusade.
Are Hannibal, Dexter, Saw, and Se7en "red flag" movies/shows? Because the protagonists of these movies/shows (Hannibal Lecter, Dexter Morgan, John Kramer, and John Doe) are all literally me.
10:05 min ! I see what you did there! Quite multi-layered. And probably the most sophisticated, most low-key way of calling someone a "dick" I have ever witnessed. Not bad kid, not bad at all!
Well the thing is, it may not be people being dumb. It’s that people are uber literal these days and so stuff like Theme and Subtext don’t exist. Slight tangent, I watched a review of The Fifth Element. In that film, there is a throw away line in that film of Bruce Willis’ character prefers his cat to “the real thing.” As in women. As in, a very obvious pu$$y joke. And this reviewer got annoyed that the film “introduced the concept of artificial animals and does nothing with it.” So yeah. I’m not surprised people don’t understand movies anymore. Plus there’s the fact that people just like to vicariously live through the cruelty of others to get over their little dick syndrome. Shame because Fight Club is my favourite film. Don’t like Tyler Durden being upheld as a role model when the flick shows he’s a cult leader/terrorist that is ultimately REJECTED by the main protagonist.
True. But then again there is a lot more dog whistling and people plainly saying the silent part out loud. This shifted the whole way fiction gets read. Both in the assumption of critics but also in the people using the negative traits to confirm their own flawed ideas.
Oh, believe me, I know. There may or may not be a cut section on media literacy that I was hoping to turn into a full essay by the end of the year haha. And agreed on Fight Club; I actually forgot how much I loved the film until I sat down to rewatch it for this video, as well as how overdue I am to reread the book. The whole misreading Tyler Durden as the ubermench thing becomes 10x funnier when you've read the book because the narrator basically gushes over how hot Tyler is on a nudist beach when he meets him.
@@NicheCaesar It’s a strange phenomenon where you get people making entire careers pointing out “plot holes” and illogical fallacies in a work of fiction, but end up just showing they can’t read between the lines. That’s not to say there aren’t plot contrivances that deserve criticism, but they spend hours essentially saying “this isn’t real.” Boggles the mind.
A man I worked with once mentioned that ‘Leon the Professional’ is his favorite movie. That was a big red flag for me. I’m friends with him on Facebook (for whatever reason), and he posts a lot of misogynistic memes. It grossed me out how Natalie Portman was sexualized as a child in that movie. Also, I couldn’t watch ‘Moonlight Kingdom’ after that scene with two 12 year olds talking about having sex with each other and then showing an upskirt shot of the 12 year old girl getting into a tent. ‘Falling Down’ is another red flag movie for me.
Depends how. I mean unless you do like how she tries to be sexy for him its pretty wholesome. Because he very explicit sees himself parental and she might use it as coping with issues and play? Point is its probably her cope and play and he, is clearly treating her more like , through she could be framed different for sure.
Could _The Dark Knight_ be a red flag movie, generally? I mean beyond people who idolize the Joker. People overlook how unhinged Harvey Dent is from the beginning. People choose to ignore Batman's goal being a city without a Batman and his objection to being idolized and seen as a role model.
Yeah it totally could. I’ve always find it funny how many people Stan that movie online/how common posts where guys say they’re like Batman are when that movie opens on a bunch of Batman copycats nearly dying
It's the cinematic version of You Gotta Fight For Your Right To Party...The Beastie Boys were MOCKING, but the song drew them in! Then they had a bunch of d-bags they didn't like coming to their shows!
These movies are tragedies. You're watching someone at a crossroads take the wrong path and the aftermath from that decision. You're supposed to take that lesson from them.
A thing I would like to add, a very convincing reason why these characters do not seek therapy, is that they are American. It is notoriously difficult for someone who can barely make a living wage (these characters definitely fit the bill) to be able to afford therapy. As someone who has been stuck in the wage slave hell most of my adult life, I don't know a single person who even has insurance at all. Maybe one or two will forego working so they can qualify for Medicaid, and get marginal coverage at best at the worst doctors available.
It to be that guy but these characters definitely do not fit that bill. Jack is depicted as living in a luxury apartment and was spending his time and money buying IKEA furniture and redecorating. He also continues to get his salary by blackmailing his boss. Travis, while definitely not as well off, is also doing fine financially. He explicitly states that money is no problem for him in the movie. And yes, you’re right to state that there are problems with insurance and medical treatment in America; but that doesn’t mean the entire system is broken or that we should automatically move to discredit it. It is more functional than it isn’t. On the subject of therapy, there are groups like the Open Path Collective that allow people without insurance to get proper therapy for as little as $15 a session. It’s a great group that many high quality therapists are a part of that I can vouch for as a person who used it when I didn’t have insurance.
I kinda hate "therapy can fix things" thinking. Nobody can do the work for you, that's why we call it "help", and people do need help, but there are different ways of doing that
I mean you kinda glossed over the operative word there, “can.” I don’t think I minced my words when I brought up the value of therapy here. I point out that it has flaws but that, by and large, it does more good than bad and it’s silly to stigmatize it.
@@NicheCaesar i agree. You did not do that. You did a good job. Sometimes I am trying to speak to the crowd, since I am not used to actually hearing from the video makers themselves. On that note, great job! I'm probably going to check out some more stuff on your channel
I hate that I'm 32 and loved fight club growing up as well as scarface and got that even tho it was cool and flashy it was not a life you wanted to live, but it seems no one else did.
Allow me to cause more to you: they shave heads in a nod to how Neo-Nazi’s look, place a premium on loss of personal identity in service of a greater cause for a leader/group (autocracy), and believe in exerting their opinions (a call for anarchy) in militaristic ways. Yeah, anarchist fascism.
People also genuinely forget the innate homosexual undertones of fight club; I mean mostly naked men, writhing on the ground together, showing male closeness in really the only way for men to see it. Also peak “everyone is the hero in their own story” that the people who see these movies don’t understand. Also media literacy has a big part of why we are seeing people not understanding these films more and more. Not understanding that they aren’t seeing these films with the correct context.
People miss the homoeroticism of Fight Club because they grew up with homophobic stereotypes of gay men as femme hair stylists and interior designers, and never saw the Castro Clones, leather daddies, and bears in leather bars and Tom of Finland's comics. Most movies show heroic protagonists, so some people misinterpret all protagonists as heroes. Media literacy is not formally taught in schools or colleges.
@@darlalathan6143 I know it’s not taught in school but maybe it should be is my point. Seeing as media is such a big part of our society, but again they don even teach kids to do taxes and that’s waaay more important so maybe I’m putting my energy in the wrong place lol.
I don't know if Niche Ceasar realizes this but the narrator of Fight Club is am unreliable narrator, and Marla is another character that is a figment of his imagination. A lot of the events in the movie are purely imagined by the narrator. Jack had a psychotic break after being diagnosed with testicular cancer while living alone with no true friends or support. Tyler is hypermasculine because that is what Jack wants to be, while Marla is what he fears becoming after he loses his testicles.
I’m pretty sure that’s just an old creepy pasta or fan theory. Jack very well could have testicular cancer, but the movie doesn’t make any statements on that being the case, nor does the book and its sequels. In fact, the graphic novel sequel to the book even gives Jack a son, which would be pretty difficult thanks to the reading you shared. A reading where Marla is also a real person (which she was all along, since the film establishes that she is her own person with her own autonomy that interacts with other people other than Jack) Either way, that reading of the movie also doesn’t really affect the video? It’s just an alternate reading of it. One that’s been shared many times over the years but never had much concrete proof that it was what the movie/book was truly about (quotes from the writers, director, etc).
As a guy who got threats on a video he made about IASIP for *several years* until he disabled comments, yup. Huge red flag series (despite it being a great comedy).
Oh, i was confused 'cause i put off responding for a while wanting to respond in a way that wouldn't cause a fight or argument since I'm already going through a ton, only to finally get over my anxiety and see that you changed your reply, lol... to be clear it wasn't that i thought you'd be difficult but i didn't look at the name of who commented BTW, I'm really sorry that you got death threats i get that they can be really difficult and even terrifying in some instances, not to mention the possibility of being doxed especially as a public figure, hope things are better now, don't want to assume just cause you allow comments now that it's not as much an issue or something... but yeah, even with their black face episode and problematic parts, still gotta love the show; they're highlarious
as the former bassist for John Hinkley Jr, and a grown up who pays attention (and has a modest history of vigilantism) this video is nail on the head. i hope some young men watch and absorb
As much as I love Peaky Blinders, men who think Tommy Shelby is this sigma grindset gigachad and post cringe memes about how dangerous they are when you mess with them made me become very suspicious of any man who says they love the show 👀
A Clockwork Orange I suppose A Serbian Film would be a red flag movie but I've never encountered anyone who even claimed to enjoy it. Or I dunno, if Come And See was your favorite movie and you regularly rewatched it. But I've definitely met people who claimed A Clockwork Orange as their favorite movie and those people sucked.
@@NicheCaesar I have a masters in teaching critical thinking and I did a project in school on Fight Club because it does challenge the assumptions that the audience was making so effectively. There was also a presentation component and I told everyone to watch the movie BEFORE the presentation. Day of, none of the women had seen it. All of the men had seen it, including the professor. So that meant I had to throw out my prepared presentation and talk *around* the plot twist in order to preserve the assumption-challenging quality of the movie for the women in the class. At the end of the presentation, my prof was like, "I didn't think it was possible [to do a good presentation without revealing the reveal], but that was a pretty good presentation." Point is: I think a lot of women would actually get a lot out of this movie if they gave it a chance, but due to the perception of the movie, they just tune out. It's kind of unfortunate that even when someone is saying "no, you will get something out of this experience, and also it's required homework," they still won't give it a chance.
Wow that is such an interesting story; thats a great encapsulation of what I think has happened to a lot of these red flag movies. So many of them are genuinely great films with so much to say that can apply to men and women alike, but it's become almost too easy to throw your hands up and disregard them completely after years of them developing a bad, unearned reputation. Thanks for the insight!
Joker, American Sniper, Whiplash, Marvel's Punisher, Game of Thrones, Dave Chappelle, Rick and Morty, 50 Shades of Gray, God's Not Dead, Boondock Saints, Passion of the Christ, Sound of Freedom, or anything directed by Micheal Bay, Zack Snyder, and Martin Scorsese. Alternatively, anyone who hates The Last Jedi, Captain Marvel, Star Trek Discovery, Netflix's Cowboy Bebop, She-Hulk, or the Little Mermaid is throwing all kinds of red flags. Ironically, the Matrix is being appropriated by the toxic manosphere. It was originally written as a metaphor for being transgender in the 90s, and now it has become a favorite of transphobic communities.
Lots of great choices on your list, and huge yup at The Matrix. And I don’t even have anything against disliking those movies/shows you mentioned (though I personally enjoyed The Last Jedi, was lukewarm on Captain Marvel, and haven’t seen the remake of The Little Mermaid). It’s the whole making that your personality that raises those red flags, though. As for Sound of Freedom: haven’t seen it and am not particularly interested in seeing it, but I don’t know if that movie is being misinterpreted so much as it’s being read the way it wanted to be read, which just so happens to maybe raise some red flags on its own. Again, can’t really weigh in there since I haven’t seen it, but that’s my understanding based off of what I’ve heard about it
@MylekHolliday it took me like an hour to remember a lot of the most toxic creeps that I have ever known, their weirdly strong opinions on media, and their incredibly unhealthy reasons for doing so. I also limited my parameters to only movies and TV shows that I have actually seen. That said, I definitely put some work into making this list. It was a fun little project for me, and I'm very proud of the results.
Anyone who judges people based on the studio produced entertainment that they do or don't like raises all kinds of red flags for me. Very toxic to think that people are what entertains them.
@MuRpHyKn0t I think that's an oversimplification. It's not a matter of judging based on what they do or do not like, but WHY they feel the way they do about it. Some people's reasoning is really messed up. The worst of them simply tend to congregate around a particular set of certain titles.
@@jellosquishier That’s too bad, because Archie Bunker was intended to be an object of ridicule, and yet a HUGE amount of people actually identified with him and his views.
@NelsonStJames Apparently a lot of people still do. An exchange I had on Twitter today revealed that clips from the show still garner that response on Facebook. Norman Lear shows are admittedly a blind spot for me so I can’t fully comment on it, but it’s depressing that people kept misreading a character that was pretty deliberately put in situations where he had to learn to stop being such a bastard
another woke trash video essay. as if there isn't already enough of this trash on this website. also, you're the one misunderstanding some of these movies. you might be correct about fight club but that's all I'll give you.
Building a tight-knit community, ideally one with a proper third place, independent of faith is better. Why point to god when the building and upkeep of a community is in and of itself a great purpose which i believe most faiths will approve anyway? Another solution is to build up better mental health care. Works with every faith aaaand is usually more reliable than praying for better mental health since you can tell whether it works. Better than praying and wondering whether your prayer is answered, not answered or left on read.
@juliawolf156 As the video pointed out, community in and of itself isn't inherently constructive. Faith provides context and meaning to the suffering in the world. Trying to take the secondary benefits of religion and divorce them from faith is like taking the taste of food and divorcing it from nutrients. The body quickly withers away. Mental healthcare is a powerful way to treat symptoms, yet it can't truly address root causes, whereas faith in Christ can.
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Hey y’all! I hope you enjoyed this video. If so, don’t forget to subscribe and all that junk so that the junk can beget more junk and the call to action can call to action. And don’t forget to name check a few red flag movies I may have forgotten to name over in the comments too and stuff! ✌️
Additionally, feel free to leave a tip or subscribe to my patreon if you’re so inclined, or to check out my two podcasts Media Obscura/Glaring Admissions if you wanna hear me talk about movies. It’s available on your favorite podcast player under the name “Media Obscura,” as well as on this channel.
This is the 1st video I saw of yours. I was so excited to see someone talking about a phenomenon I have been aware of since the 2000's. I have since seen some of your other videos and have been equally pleased with your work. You've got a new subscriber. Thanks for doing such a great job!
P.S. It was so important that you didn't cheapen this video. With a segway into a Better Help add. I was worried the whole time that it was going to happen.
One example I'd include that applies to women is Gone Girl(2014) it's a great movie, but I've seen a lot of women that see the lead as this empowered girlboss type, and gloss over the horrible shit she thinks of other women (for one example)
To be fair, that one is also misinterpreted by misogynistic men who see the reveal of Amy's psychopathy as a retaliation against women who falsely accuse men -- when such women are, in reality, very rare, and frankly Affleck's character is still a bad person even though he isn't guilty of murder. (I say "misinterpreted," but honestly... it feels a bit like a valid interpretation despite being a harmful one.)
I prefer to see it more as a commentary on the duality of presentation: we all appear to be one thing, but no one really knows anyone, not even the people they're closest to. And how our media-obsessed society enables these people, and we should be willing to interrogate the wealthy and powerful.
Modern recontextualisation of these films is still off the mark, just overcompensating in the other direction. Society has identified toxic masculinity but has not yet found a direction it agrees on for positive masculinity, and feels uncomfortable with honest, nuanced explorations of the ideal.
That’s because it doesn’t intend for there to BE any “positive” masculinity, as it doesn’t intend for there to be ANY masculinity at all (you know…being that it’s the kind of thing that tends to lead to slave revolts, and all.😉)!
People don't agree on positive masculinity because the very concept of masculinity/femininity is constructed. What one culture sees as masculine, another sees as feminine and vice versa. There is some overlap, sure, but the idea was never unified to begin with, so why expect positive masculinity to have more unity than older conceptions of masculinity?
Fight Club did a great job at showing how small subversive groups can easily lose their values and succumb to group think. It taught me about how rebellion against one type of oppression can lead to another. The search for meaning can lead to dark places.
Hmm. Even the writer of Fight Club pretty explicitly states that you're not supposed to identify with Jack/Tyler
You mean Chuck Palahnuik, the writer of the book? Yep. He even wrote two graphic novel sequels to Fight Club that made it even more clear to the people who missed the point of the movie
To me it was more like a warning...
breaking bad for sure
the sopranos too
Yellowstone
Peaky fucking Blinders.
The Red Flag with that one is specifically how they talk about Skylar
@@terpsidance.true
I seriously can't fathom how someone can see Travis as a role model, he's so clearly a deeply sick (in a sick society for sure) individual and i kid you not, i understood that at like, age 12..
More baffling to me is how a lot of dudes idolise Patrick Bateman.
@notjimmy6486 for real, that has always baffled me. Like, best case scenario the dude is completely imagining things, worst case scenario he's a psychopathic serial killer. Like, what's the attractive part here to people? Hell, even Bateman as a character (apart from being a murderer) is depicted as shallow, narcissistic douche canoe
@@notjimmy6486 You wouldn't get it
It's because they're in desperate need for an identity. Though wording it as "role model" isn't entirely accurate, it stems from simply relating themselves to the character. They don't see it as positive traits to don, they're still aware that it's pathetic, unlikable, and just other general faults with the character that they identify with.
But you see, they revel in the fact that it's an identity full of faults. They revel in the idea of being the "loser." Though it's less of just seeing a 1-1 relation in themselves and Travis (or other characters alike,) and more about *wanting* to see a relation between the two. "He who despises himself, nevertheless esteems himself thereby, as a despiser."
Most people have a need to set an identity for themselves, a common example you see from most people online are the people who make a certain interest/hobby their main personality. It's just in this case, it's people attaching themselves to 'outcast' characters and the like. It's ironic the lack of self awareness there is in this mentality though, as likening yourself to these loner characters is actually so common. They like to think they're so alone, but millions of other people identify with the very same thing.
Here are some other great films that would fit this category:
The King of Comedy (1983)
The Heartbreak Kid (1972)
In The Company of Men (1997)
Mikey and Nicky (1976)
Naked (1993)
The Swimmer (1968)
Modern Romance (1981)
About Schmidt (2002)
Five Easy Pieces (1970)
Buffalo 66 (1998)
I think both Vince Gilligan and Shawn Ryan have talked about the difficulty of writing anti-heroes on TV when the fans identify too strongly with the lead. For me, the ending of The Shield did a slightly better job of trying to point out that, hey, Vic was NOT the good guy here...
Writing anti-heroes is hard, because the industry for the most part doesn’t know what an anti-hero is, and they write anti-heroes to actually appear cool. Prime example is the character of Rorschach in the Watchmen film. This is why The Punisher will never be able to fit into the MCU, and definitely not Disney’s MCU. There is nothing wrong with being on the side of an anti-hero as long as you understand you’re only on their side when they’re going against people worse then them, but that they are going to do things that you should be totally against.
Bojack Horseman deconstructed the Peak TV anti hero
I haven't seen Taxi Driver yet but I've seen Fight Club a few times. Great film. The thing with a lot of movies & the appeal to them is that people can find different meanings to them despite what the creators originally planned out but that's also a double-edged sword especially when it comes to movies like Fight Club & 500 Days of Summer & TV shows like Breaking Bad. I remember seeing some people rooting for characters like Walter & Tom & hating on characters like Skylar & Summer even though we are meant to hate them & feel bad for Skylar & Summer. Maybe why some people relate to them might be a power fantasy (for both men & women) were we are tired of our jobs & just want to stick it to the man like some of these characters that actually do this.
cool video. saw fight club my freshman year at uni and it always stood out to me. Im not proud of it but I used to think it was so bad ass. I think it’s a phase that many boys go through but some get stuck with
just own what you like dude lol
To be fair,it is a “badass” movie in the way it goes about the plot and the fight scenes.
I see most of the identification or appreciation with these "red flag" characters and movies as an outlet for frustrations and carnal desires and aspirations, rather than actual role models that vast majority of people would really want to imitate in their own lives. The assassins you mention at the end are obviously not made to be as such because of a movie they watched or videogame they played, it just became an insufficient outlet that wasn't able to contain their issues.
I think a lot of issue is that there's a general lack of positive male role models in modern media. So many depictions try to solve toxic masculinity by removing masculinity, because positive masculinity tends to be moderated versions of toxic traits and it's hard to show moderation in a movie.
I've come to sum up arguments like these as the difference between "you're missing the point" and "and you've lost the plot."
Is it a red flag that I love Jet Li's hero but don't jibe with its "Sacrifice for your leaders" message? Honestly, my red flag is people who have red flag movies. Those people are probably judgemental pricks.
Its probably chinese aproved for nationalism? That bit, still great movie.
Little big soldier too kinda? And its a great anto war dark comedy drama.
"Why don't they try therapy?"
Screenwriter guy: "So the movie can happen."
I do like that you don't do what literally every other video essay type does and go on a dismissive narcissistic self-righteous rant about how "intellectually and morally deficient" you think the people who like these movies are. Seeing someone have empathy for people who are unhappy with their lives/the world, even if they express it in a way you disagree with, is nice.
I feel like the order some events helps with justifying/empathizing their bad actions. Seeing the events from their perspective versus seeing it justified via a flashback, can change how well the audience sees themselves in the character
40:35 For a moment I thought he taped Rollos to his ankle and totally bought into that being a fantastic idea.
Ex Machina, Sucker Punch and Mojave another one of those red flag films I've found. For all genders. I know you've been taking from the POV you know: Male, so I love your video on that premise. I think taking and doing a video on red flag films that are that for all (Women and other genders aren't free from adopting the mindsets of Jack/Tyler and Travis) genders is toxic because while men want to be this archetype - women/male attracted genders want to date them! That can be dangerous and get them into toxic and abusive relationships.
A lot of good takes here, but also I'll say the "go to therapy" mantra really needs more perspective. What a lot of people are missing is loving welcoming community. Therapy can help, but that's also not directly meeting that need. The alienation in our culture requires a radical shift and while Tyler went about it in a toxic way, he did create community.
We simply need healing nurturing space to balance out the often quite understandable anger at terrible treatment. Essentializing that also helps no one. Men need empathy, women need anger. We all need to have the whole range of feelings, and we all need each other
I don't know, maybe I'm tired of being appraised as having negative worth as an individual by society. Maybe I'm getting tired if being told what it's okay to think or believe, even if (or perhaps especially because) I happen to agree.
In other words, representation matters.
Edit: Hypocrisy is normal human behaviour. Sad but true. We can't help but act out of our wounds; even if we turn sides in the battle, it's the same battle. I have seen it again and again. It's human.
Also, therapy doesn't always work. Some people are resistant to it. I know I am despite several decades of engaging in it trying to get help. So no, it's not always a solution for the individual even if it "works" on a macro level, like any medical intervention. People are irreducibly complex. Saying a treatment is 85% effective doesn't imply that if you are given it you'll get 85% better. Furthermore, an important thing to understand about therapy is that, unless you're committed to the change it's offering, it won't work. Full stop.
In any case, I'm open to a good faith discussion.
Perhaps hypocrisy means that the hypocrite has impractical opinions or divided loyalties. Therapy sometimes fails because the therapist charges clients too much money, our society stereotypes neurodiverse people as movie villains, and mental hospitals used to torture and abuse their patients, especially if they were LGBTQ+ or alternative teenagers. Also, our culture's idea of mental health is based on neurotypical straight, white Christian men's desired behavior. Some therapists may think one is psychotic for acting differently from this model. Some patients, such as those with personality disorders never seek treatment because they believe they are mentally healthy. An 85% success rate for therapy means it cures most patients.
@@darlalathan6143 maybe so, but even with an 85% success rate (which I just pulled out of the air btw), that's still 15% of people who are not resistant, and that's alot of people. It only takes one to do a terrible thing (or to be the protagonist of a movie, if you prefer).
I guess I just have bad experiences with being told "get therapy" after being in it for a quarter century... I'm trying my best but it's not a panacea.
I would argue that everyone has divided loyalties and impractical beliefs... ultimately it comes down to choosing the level of hypocrisy (often unwitting) one is comfortable working at. Basic shadow work.
Generally agreed otherwise
Another thing about therapy is you have to put in work as a patient and be open and honest. It can be like paying a personal trainer to chat with while sitting around watching youtube.
I honestly find it hard to believe that people identify with these characters as strongly, in the way that is supposed to be scary, in the numbers that generally seem to be stated. I hear far more people talking about how crazy it is that people think Walter White is the good guy than actual people saying Walter White is the good guy… in fact, I can’t think of the last time I actually heard that, in such un nuanced terms. Just my opinion/perspective
I mean, I get that it’s hard to believe, but the video does also show articles/posts online about these movies and how people read them haha. Also someone did try to kill a president because of Taxi Driver back in the 80s
Edit: swapped “shoot” for “kill”
He didn't just try. He shot Reagan. He only failed as an assassin.
Yes, yes, you’re right. Thanks for correcting me-I literally showed footage of it in the video lol, my mind must have slipped
I mean people defend eren from attack on titan, and that commits confusing end aside. Very strange to have arguments to go full . yeah
But eren going there is well done
I mean people can be weird about when he, yeah.
@@NicheCaesar I’m not trying to criticize you, man, your work is good, I’m just expressing how things look from my admittedly singular and therefore limited (like anyone’s) perspective.
Other films for the list are (500) days of summer, uncut gems, and American beauty.
Oooh all good additions to the list. 500 Days of Summer is a surprisingly subtle one since many fail to recognize that Tom is a pretty flawed, somewhat toxic guy for most of it.
It's just this 2024 edition of media literacy that can't handle reader interpretation.
I'm cool with this as long as we agree there are characters that if women identify with makes them suspect as well
I had an interview for an art and design course today and much to my surprise I got in! 🥳 also I’m going to play some guitar and write something new
We need a deepi dive like this on how communities have sexually fetishized villains, especially from kid content. Harley Quinn and Poison Ivy come to mind.
@@kasi4363 just a discussion about the phenomenon. it's not new i just never really see any discourse.
What are you talking about? They're fictional and they've been hyper sexualizing female comic book characters since the ink 1st hit the pages, during the last century. Before any child who has adopted these characters as their own, were even born. It's not like they took the Frozen princess and turned her into a prostitute or something. These characters are like 80 years old in some cases.
@@afrolund80 that's exactly what I am talking about. Also yes, there is a LOT of frozen porn.lmao
My theory is it was only because of the Hayes Code animation being for kids became a thing. Betty Boop, one of the earliest cartoon characters made, was blatantly sexualized. Animation also served to tell stories we could not in live action. CGI in our Marvel movies are a modern trick to blend two different mediums in film. So in a NSFW context, we tend to desire what we can't have. I am a horrible writer with a speech impediment so I could never do a video essay on it lmao
Part of it and I am going to lift this from Macabre Storytelling is that these characters represent our Id (which I agree with). I will give you my own example. I just finished Breaking Bad a few months ago and while it is easy to say that Walter White isn't a good person I see a lot of myself in him in the fact that he gets little respect from other people (I did by some people), that like him my peers are so far ahead me for reasons that were not all of my own doing, and having a little too much pride. In that regard its easy to see why I can relate to WW despite him being bad. I agree that I think some of these characters validate some view point a person has and I also thing that they see part of themselves in those characters just as see part of myself in Walter White.
The problem is the black and white thinking of today. At the time these red flag movies were made, it was possible to agree with many things Tyler proclaimed, while still recognizing he was wrong. It was possible to understand Travis’ disgust, while understanding his methods were “unsound,” to allude to Colonel Kurtz. We used to call that nuance. Nuance today is dead as a doornail. These characters MUST BE either heroes or villains, and never the twain shall…you know
Yes, yes, never the Twain shall Mark 🤔. That’s the saying right? Haha.
But yes, that’s the whole point of these characters. They’re right to be upset, but they’re channeling it into the wrong place. Durden is right to hate the world of 1999. But he’s wrong to use it as an excuse to sell fascism to his followers under the guise of anarchism. Same goes for Bickle and his whole Rebel With A Taxi crusade.
Are Hannibal, Dexter, Saw, and Se7en "red flag" movies/shows? Because the protagonists of these movies/shows (Hannibal Lecter, Dexter Morgan, John Kramer, and John Doe) are all literally me.
Wow! your commentary is really engaging. Thanks for the video! Dropping you a like!!
Glad you enjoyed it and thanks for the like!
10:05 min ! I see what you did there! Quite multi-layered. And probably the most sophisticated, most low-key way of calling someone a "dick" I have ever witnessed. Not bad kid, not bad at all!
Well the thing is, it may not be people being dumb. It’s that people are uber literal these days and so stuff like Theme and Subtext don’t exist.
Slight tangent, I watched a review of The Fifth Element. In that film, there is a throw away line in that film of Bruce Willis’ character prefers his cat to “the real thing.” As in women. As in, a very obvious pu$$y joke.
And this reviewer got annoyed that the film “introduced the concept of artificial animals and does nothing with it.”
So yeah. I’m not surprised people don’t understand movies anymore.
Plus there’s the fact that people just like to vicariously live through the cruelty of others to get over their little dick syndrome.
Shame because Fight Club is my favourite film. Don’t like Tyler Durden being upheld as a role model when the flick shows he’s a cult leader/terrorist that is ultimately REJECTED by the main protagonist.
True. But then again there is a lot more dog whistling and people plainly saying the silent part out loud. This shifted the whole way fiction gets read. Both in the assumption of critics but also in the people using the negative traits to confirm their own flawed ideas.
Oh, believe me, I know. There may or may not be a cut section on media literacy that I was hoping to turn into a full essay by the end of the year haha. And agreed on Fight Club; I actually forgot how much I loved the film until I sat down to rewatch it for this video, as well as how overdue I am to reread the book. The whole misreading Tyler Durden as the ubermench thing becomes 10x funnier when you've read the book because the narrator basically gushes over how hot Tyler is on a nudist beach when he meets him.
@@NicheCaesar It’s a strange phenomenon where you get people making entire careers pointing out “plot holes” and illogical fallacies in a work of fiction, but end up just showing they can’t read between the lines. That’s not to say there aren’t plot contrivances that deserve criticism, but they spend hours essentially saying “this isn’t real.” Boggles the mind.
Yep, that’s the SEO economy for you. Saw a lot of job openings as a script/article writer for those kinds of posts back when I was a freelancer
I needed to watch this video to find out the book fight club has sequels
They flew under the radar for most due to being graphic novel sequels to the book that got released in the early 2010s.
(1993) “Falling Down”
A man I worked with once mentioned that ‘Leon the Professional’ is his favorite movie. That was a big red flag for me. I’m friends with him on Facebook (for whatever reason), and he posts a lot of misogynistic memes. It grossed me out how Natalie Portman was sexualized as a child in that movie. Also, I couldn’t watch ‘Moonlight Kingdom’ after that scene with two 12 year olds talking about having sex with each other and then showing an upskirt shot of the 12 year old girl getting into a tent. ‘Falling Down’ is another red flag movie for me.
While I do like both of those movies, yeah I can 100% see why seeing someone gush about them would be a red flag.
Depends how. I mean unless you do like how she tries to be sexy for him its pretty wholesome. Because he very explicit sees himself parental and she might use it as coping with issues and play?
Point is its probably her cope and play and he, is clearly treating her more like , through she could be framed different for sure.
rick and morty
Could _The Dark Knight_ be a red flag movie, generally? I mean beyond people who idolize the Joker. People overlook how unhinged Harvey Dent is from the beginning. People choose to ignore Batman's goal being a city without a Batman and his objection to being idolized and seen as a role model.
Yeah it totally could. I’ve always find it funny how many people Stan that movie online/how common posts where guys say they’re like Batman are when that movie opens on a bunch of Batman copycats nearly dying
It's the cinematic version of You Gotta Fight For Your Right To Party...The Beastie Boys were MOCKING, but the song drew them in! Then they had a bunch of d-bags they didn't like coming to their shows!
Based Beasties comparison
You mean those movies aren't about being a total bad ass? Was Michael Douglass the bad guy in Falling Down? Geez! I wish someone would've told me.
B-b-but look at the way Michael D got to eat from the breakfast menu at lunchtime! That’s alpha shit!
@@NicheCaesar 😂
These movies are tragedies. You're watching someone at a crossroads take the wrong path and the aftermath from that decision. You're supposed to take that lesson from them.
A thing I would like to add, a very convincing reason why these characters do not seek therapy, is that they are American. It is notoriously difficult for someone who can barely make a living wage (these characters definitely fit the bill) to be able to afford therapy. As someone who has been stuck in the wage slave hell most of my adult life, I don't know a single person who even has insurance at all. Maybe one or two will forego working so they can qualify for Medicaid, and get marginal coverage at best at the worst doctors available.
It to be that guy but these characters definitely do not fit that bill. Jack is depicted as living in a luxury apartment and was spending his time and money buying IKEA furniture and redecorating. He also continues to get his salary by blackmailing his boss.
Travis, while definitely not as well off, is also doing fine financially. He explicitly states that money is no problem for him in the movie.
And yes, you’re right to state that there are problems with insurance and medical treatment in America; but that doesn’t mean the entire system is broken or that we should automatically move to discredit it. It is more functional than it isn’t. On the subject of therapy, there are groups like the Open Path Collective that allow people without insurance to get proper therapy for as little as $15 a session. It’s a great group that many high quality therapists are a part of that I can vouch for as a person who used it when I didn’t have insurance.
@@NicheCaesar Wow thank you for such a well thought out and informative response!
It's called movie magic for a reason. Sometimes movies can create reality. And Hollywood is a red flag in and of itself!
I kinda hate "therapy can fix things" thinking. Nobody can do the work for you, that's why we call it "help", and people do need help, but there are different ways of doing that
I mean you kinda glossed over the operative word there, “can.”
I don’t think I minced my words when I brought up the value of therapy here. I point out that it has flaws but that, by and large, it does more good than bad and it’s silly to stigmatize it.
@@NicheCaesar i agree. You did not do that. You did a good job. Sometimes I am trying to speak to the crowd, since I am not used to actually hearing from the video makers themselves.
On that note, great job! I'm probably going to check out some more stuff on your channel
No worries! Just wanted to make sure, and glad you dig the video!
If many people see a movie a certain way, it becomes reality.
I hate that I'm 32 and loved fight club growing up as well as scarface and got that even tho it was cool and flashy it was not a life you wanted to live, but it seems no one else did.
I feel like this a good video for open minded individuals
Calling project mayhem an "anarchist fascist group" has caused incalculable amounts of psychic damage to me.
Allow me to cause more to you: they shave heads in a nod to how Neo-Nazi’s look, place a premium on loss of personal identity in service of a greater cause for a leader/group (autocracy), and believe in exerting their opinions (a call for anarchy) in militaristic ways.
Yeah, anarchist fascism.
People also genuinely forget the innate homosexual undertones of fight club; I mean mostly naked men, writhing on the ground together, showing male closeness in really the only way for men to see it.
Also peak “everyone is the hero in their own story” that the people who see these movies don’t understand.
Also media literacy has a big part of why we are seeing people not understanding these films more and more. Not understanding that they aren’t seeing these films with the correct context.
People miss the homoeroticism of Fight Club because they grew up with
homophobic stereotypes of gay men as femme hair stylists and interior designers, and never saw the Castro Clones, leather daddies, and bears in leather bars and Tom of Finland's comics. Most movies show heroic protagonists, so some people misinterpret all protagonists as heroes. Media literacy is not formally taught in schools or colleges.
@@darlalathan6143 I know it’s not taught in school but maybe it should be is my point.
Seeing as media is such a big part of our society, but again they don even teach kids to do taxes and that’s waaay more important so maybe I’m putting my energy in the wrong place lol.
anything Joker
I don't know if Niche Ceasar realizes this but the narrator of Fight Club is am unreliable narrator, and Marla is another character that is a figment of his imagination. A lot of the events in the movie are purely imagined by the narrator. Jack had a psychotic break after being diagnosed with testicular cancer while living alone with no true friends or support. Tyler is hypermasculine because that is what Jack wants to be, while Marla is what he fears becoming after he loses his testicles.
I’m pretty sure that’s just an old creepy pasta or fan theory. Jack very well could have testicular cancer, but the movie doesn’t make any statements on that being the case, nor does the book and its sequels. In fact, the graphic novel sequel to the book even gives Jack a son, which would be pretty difficult thanks to the reading you shared. A reading where Marla is also a real person (which she was all along, since the film establishes that she is her own person with her own autonomy that interacts with other people other than Jack)
Either way, that reading of the movie also doesn’t really affect the video? It’s just an alternate reading of it. One that’s been shared many times over the years but never had much concrete proof that it was what the movie/book was truly about (quotes from the writers, director, etc).
It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia
As a guy who got threats on a video he made about IASIP for *several years* until he disabled comments, yup. Huge red flag series (despite it being a great comedy).
Oh, i was confused 'cause i put off responding for a while wanting to respond in a way that wouldn't cause a fight or argument since I'm already going through a ton, only to finally get over my anxiety and see that you changed your reply, lol... to be clear it wasn't that i thought you'd be difficult but i didn't look at the name of who commented
BTW, I'm really sorry that you got death threats i get that they can be really difficult and even terrifying in some instances, not to mention the possibility of being doxed especially as a public figure, hope things are better now, don't want to assume just cause you allow comments now that it's not as much an issue or something... but yeah, even with their black face episode and problematic parts, still gotta love the show; they're highlarious
Oh, sorry yeah that was another person who asked... my bad
lol don’t sweat it. The only change I made was because of a typo from typing it on my phone.
@NicheCaesar yeah, i maybe overreacted a bit, but then again, probably shouldn't wait till 3am to respond lol
as the former bassist for John Hinkley Jr, and a grown up who pays attention (and has a modest history of vigilantism) this video is nail on the head. i hope some young men watch and absorb
I believe in broad self-defense laws. Mr. Scorsese, I accept your terms and conditions.
The only red flag is that your culture needs these men more then it needs anything else. No exceptions.
As much as I love Peaky Blinders, men who think Tommy Shelby is this sigma grindset gigachad and post cringe memes about how dangerous they are when you mess with them made me become very suspicious of any man who says they love the show 👀
Are you happy and fulfilled?
Rehna hai tere Dil main(rhtdm) it's a bollywood movie.
A Clockwork Orange
I suppose A Serbian Film would be a red flag movie but I've never encountered anyone who even claimed to enjoy it. Or I dunno, if Come And See was your favorite movie and you regularly rewatched it. But I've definitely met people who claimed A Clockwork Orange as their favorite movie and those people sucked.
Really my guy spoilers come on
Watching Fight Club made me realize I was full of internalized misogyny. 😅
Nothing wrong with realizing that! If anything it’s a good thing ✌️
@@NicheCaesar I have a masters in teaching critical thinking and I did a project in school on Fight Club because it does challenge the assumptions that the audience was making so effectively. There was also a presentation component and I told everyone to watch the movie BEFORE the presentation. Day of, none of the women had seen it. All of the men had seen it, including the professor. So that meant I had to throw out my prepared presentation and talk *around* the plot twist in order to preserve the assumption-challenging quality of the movie for the women in the class. At the end of the presentation, my prof was like, "I didn't think it was possible [to do a good presentation without revealing the reveal], but that was a pretty good presentation."
Point is: I think a lot of women would actually get a lot out of this movie if they gave it a chance, but due to the perception of the movie, they just tune out. It's kind of unfortunate that even when someone is saying "no, you will get something out of this experience, and also it's required homework," they still won't give it a chance.
Wow that is such an interesting story; thats a great encapsulation of what I think has happened to a lot of these red flag movies. So many of them are genuinely great films with so much to say that can apply to men and women alike, but it's become almost too easy to throw your hands up and disregard them completely after years of them developing a bad, unearned reputation. Thanks for the insight!
THE JOCKER
Judge Dredd, I believe. Another one.
fantastic video. RED FLAG MOVIES.
High Fidelity feels like a textbook red flag movie, as it pretty much laid the groundwork for the male manipulator stereotype.
Joker, American Sniper, Whiplash, Marvel's Punisher, Game of Thrones, Dave Chappelle, Rick and Morty, 50 Shades of Gray, God's Not Dead, Boondock Saints, Passion of the Christ, Sound of Freedom, or anything directed by Micheal Bay, Zack Snyder, and Martin Scorsese.
Alternatively, anyone who hates The Last Jedi, Captain Marvel, Star Trek Discovery, Netflix's Cowboy Bebop, She-Hulk, or the Little Mermaid is throwing all kinds of red flags.
Ironically, the Matrix is being appropriated by the toxic manosphere. It was originally written as a metaphor for being transgender in the 90s, and now it has become a favorite of transphobic communities.
Lots of great choices on your list, and huge yup at The Matrix.
And I don’t even have anything against disliking those movies/shows you mentioned (though I personally enjoyed The Last Jedi, was lukewarm on Captain Marvel, and haven’t seen the remake of The Little Mermaid). It’s the whole making that your personality that raises those red flags, though.
As for Sound of Freedom: haven’t seen it and am not particularly interested in seeing it, but I don’t know if that movie is being misinterpreted so much as it’s being read the way it wanted to be read, which just so happens to maybe raise some red flags on its own. Again, can’t really weigh in there since I haven’t seen it, but that’s my understanding based off of what I’ve heard about it
How did you come up with your lists? If you don't mind me asking.
@MylekHolliday it took me like an hour to remember a lot of the most toxic creeps that I have ever known, their weirdly strong opinions on media, and their incredibly unhealthy reasons for doing so. I also limited my parameters to only movies and TV shows that I have actually seen. That said, I definitely put some work into making this list. It was a fun little project for me, and I'm very proud of the results.
Anyone who judges people based on the studio produced entertainment that they do or don't like raises all kinds of red flags for me. Very toxic to think that people are what entertains them.
@MuRpHyKn0t I think that's an oversimplification. It's not a matter of judging based on what they do or do not like, but WHY they feel the way they do about it. Some people's reasoning is really messed up. The worst of them simply tend to congregate around a particular set of certain titles.
👍👍❗💗
All in the Family anybody?
Nope
@@jellosquishier That’s too bad, because Archie Bunker was intended to be an object of ridicule, and yet a HUGE amount of people actually identified with him and his views.
@NelsonStJames Apparently a lot of people still do. An exchange I had on Twitter today revealed that clips from the show still garner that response on Facebook. Norman Lear shows are admittedly a blind spot for me so I can’t fully comment on it, but it’s depressing that people kept misreading a character that was pretty deliberately put in situations where he had to learn to stop being such a bastard
Uhhh. Seriously. You're unironically making videos about toxic masculinity in 2024.
The worst.
Cry harder about it snowflake 😂
will you cry?
I'm glad I'm not the only one tired of getting recommended these woke liberal video essays.
@@modern-day_warrior Can you speak in anything other than catch phrases?
Why are you so triggered?
another woke trash video essay. as if there isn't already enough of this trash on this website. also, you're the one misunderstanding some of these movies. you might be correct about fight club but that's all I'll give you.
☝️ Triggered ❄️❄️❄️
Okay "modern-day_warrior" ass writing youtube comments with a Lain pfp. Shouldn't you be out "saving the west" or something dork?
Building a tight-knit community, ideally one with a proper third place, independent of faith is better. Why point to god when the building and upkeep of a community is in and of itself a great purpose which i believe most faiths will approve anyway?
Another solution is to build up better mental health care. Works with every faith aaaand is usually more reliable than praying for better mental health since you can tell whether it works. Better than praying and wondering whether your prayer is answered, not answered or left on read.
@juliawolf156 As the video pointed out, community in and of itself isn't inherently constructive. Faith provides context and meaning to the suffering in the world. Trying to take the secondary benefits of religion and divorce them from faith is like taking the taste of food and divorcing it from nutrients. The body quickly withers away.
Mental healthcare is a powerful way to treat symptoms, yet it can't truly address root causes, whereas faith in Christ can.
@@41Chewbacca41 We've seen what faith did on Jan 6th.