i had my pietta 1858 new model army chain fire the cylinder to its right., left a nice lead and powder streak down the side of my gun didn't mess anything up but scared the fuck out of me.
I don't know if you've seen the other rants about the jackhammer, but the reason he has such distaste for that one specifically is because it's used in several shows/games as what is supposed to be some kind of amazing, futuristic shotgun. So even though it was just experimental and didn't really work, because of how it's been shown in games and media, it has some kind of mythical reputation. He doesn't like that a bad gun is seen as amazing basically.
At least the katana show wide use. Nowhere near as good as media, mostly anime and games, depict it, but it saw use. The jackhammer was not good enough to see ANY use. It was a failed experiment.
11:20 Fun fact. There was a case that these trumpets were used during WW2 because one of British officers didn't trust radios to be reliable enough so he had his soldiers trained in trumpet signals so when radio broke units were coordinating using trumpets.
10:05 fun fact: this is why putting a revolving cylinder on a rifle never took off. It was relatively harmless if scary and annoying when all 6 chambers would fire on your pistol revolver, on a rifle it'd blow your fingers off. It's why they developed lever action repeating rifles instead. Though I suppose you could make a modern revolving rifle, if you really wanted to.
so! there was in fact for a short time before the first lever action where the united states union states in fact used a revolver rifle, common medic complaints were missing fingers.
They do exist, they’re not very common though. I see them every once in a while while looking at revolvers or lever actions in specific calibers. But you’d be better off saving a little more and buying a lever action. Though there is one I’d love to get my hands on, and it’s the Russian one that another commenter mentioned, they’re chambered in either 9x39, or 12.7x55mm.
The Nagant revolver has variants for gate loading and a swing out cylinder, there is no top break variant. It is a great suppressible revolver though, probably the best.
@@izaakburningham3188 the cool part about the OTs-38 is that the ammunition is suppressed, not the gun. 7.62x42 SP-4 has a piston between the powder and the bullet that seals the cartridge before any gas can escape, minimizing noise. There's a few videos of semi automatic suppressed ammo guns firing, and the loudest noise in those is the slide hiding the back end of travel. Imagine how quiet the revolvers are! Also, unrelated to how quiet it is, the OTs-38 fires from the bottom cylinder. The top barrel looking thing is a laser.
The Hilarious thing about Mike saying "there could be more than one they could have some hiding" about the Pancor Jackhammer is that earlier this year they actually found another one that the wife of the designer had lying around not realizing that it was a functioning firearm.
Sorry, but the Nagant isn't a top-break revolver. It has a loading gate. Since the cylinder needs to move forward for the seal, the Belgians developing it couldn't make it a breaker as well.
Yeah, I thought so too. While looking it up to be sure, I found out that there was a 1910 variant with a swing-out cylinder, though it wasn't exactly great by most accounts.
@@stephennelson9212 Is there a 1898 variant though? It would make sense that there might be, given that's when the Russians purchased the manufacturing rights
Though actually, the mechanism does work with non-fixed cylinder versions. See the Pieper revolving carbine, which uses the same technique but is a swing-out revolver.
The nagant isn’t the only revolver capable of being supressed. With enough clamshell fuckery you can supress any revolver, take a look at the PSDR-3. Also you can also make a case of it being a prime example of engineers being too busy trying to see if they could, to ask if they should.
"Why this thing looks like it's dipped in chrome even the grip is shiny" it's not even a game engine issue, just that the modder either messed up the normal map or didn't make an environmental map for the model.
Millennia does good work, but as I recall he made the weapons for fonv/fo3 pretty early before modelers got the variable environs working. Could be wrong, haven't used his weapon packs in my fonv build in a long time, I'd have to look at the mesh to see if it has enviros.
Every Millenia weapon mod uses his ("her" now since the transition) own environmental map which was very likely set too strong in the program used for integrating the weapon into the game. If it were missing, it would have looked comically shiny.
The "accuracy by volume of fire" concept guns have been popping up since sometime after WWII. There were some studies done that found that, for average infantryman, volume of fire is more important than his shot-by-shot accuracy. This resulted with various attempts by both the West (like Project SPIW and SALVO, duplex rounds) and the East (like An-94 and AEK-971), to increase soldier's accuracy by increasing the volume of fire. Some of them were mant to fire so fast as to be able to fire multiple bullets, before the recoil impulse hit the shooter, and disrupted his aim. These studies also provide good proof for why bolt aftion rifles are obsolete.
I feel like range drastically affects this issue though. At longer range single shot just makes more sense. One accurate bullet in the target is better then 10 going around the target. In close range volume of fire makes a lot more sense since your very likely to hit the target.
@@lunaticbz3594 They discovered that a typical infantry engagement ranges aren't longer that 300m. For a typical infantryman (not a sniper or a dedicated marksman) accuracy by volume of fire makes sense at these ranges. In WWII it took on average 45 000 rounds per enemy kill. For a military it's cheaper to spend more on ammo than to train soldiers for pinpoint accuracy.
Well the AN-94 had something special for this tho, it had a moving barrel which after the first bullet was fired moved backwards and in theory only after the second bullet was shot the recoil kicks in. So the moving barrel was made to theoretically completely zero the recoil of the first round so the shooter would hit 2 rounds very close into the same target, of course practically this didn't work so well and also it was super pricey to make them, heavy af and some other problems so it didn't got used much. Today only the Spetznas use it i belive.
The AS VAL was meant for Alpha, GRU, the SVR's Zaslon, and other Spetsnaz units. Also @ 15:40, see the FGC-9; a 3d printed SMG. It's really popular, and some states (2a Sanctuaries to be exact) allow you to do so _without_ an FFL since the ATF can't do anything about it in said states.
@@LiteralCrimeRave Yep, I know. This is coming from someone who lives half of the year in Alaska, where ATF agents are straight-up detained most of the time, and the other half in Idaho.
@@killermlg5360 First of all, as implied, Alaska and Idaho are 2A sanctuaries. In Idaho, ATF agents are usually told to exit the state. In Alaska, they detain them, then escort them to the nearest airport, port/harbor, etc. so they can leave. That, combined with the fact Alaska has a lot of hunters, and bears, are some of the reasons why iirc.
Back in the day they actually experimented with adding a shield to revolving rifles to protect the shooters' forearms (one of the main reasons they fell out of use), but soon found out doing so greatly increased risk of chain fire.
See, this is why I love it when you (and a few other military related channels) cover videos like this. I learn a lot from Mike and Zack's misadventures that I wouldn't have otherwise, but people can always add additional info that someone else might not know. Hearing you give additional information about some of these weapon's histories is always a treat!
11:10 the clouds of smoke was also why no one gave a care if muskets or even rifles were incredibly inaccurate, you can't see who you're shooting at anyways, you just needed to shoot on command. Its also why even though rifles were more accurate, many commanders preferred smoothbore muskets, as they had a higher rate of fire.
@The Hittite Exactly. Honestly the entire debate between the two in the 18th century is fascinating and is entirely over looked by people who default to pop history. God I hate myself for typing that last bit....
AS Val was developed, because before that Spetsnaz had to use regular subsonic ammunition(which was just usual ammo with less gunpowder used) and regular AKM with silencer. Which was really bad against enemy equipped with bodyarmor, and also inaccurate - bad qualities for stealth. First version was VSS Vintorez, VSS translates from Russian as "Special Sniper Rifle" - sniper rifle with integrated suppressor and flashhider, that is effective up to 400 meters. AS Val is assault rifle version.
Nowadays there is a form of trigger called a Binary Trigger available to civilians that when you flip the selector switch to it fires 1 round when you pull it and fires 1 round when you release the trigger. This gives civilians in effect what is a 2 round burst firearm legally as the pull and release of the trigger is counted as 2 different actions in law. Another trigger type is the FRT or Forced Reset Trigger which makes it so when you pull the trigger and fire the weapon it forces to trigger back into the non firing position so when you squeeze the trigger and hold it consistently you can have a form of slow full auto. This one the ATF claims makes a weapon a machinegun illegally when you look at the law it actually does not. Because of this the company that produces the FRT has continued production and basically told the ATF if your so sure about that then set up a court date.
the remingotn 870 has a riveted extractor, but the 500 is screwed in. the extractor is a part that almost never breaks, but with the mossberg it's a 5 minute fix. the remington needs a propper gunsmithing shop.
Real fun! Any of the campfire series Related to the military I’m game for. Love getting your take on things further up the chain of command than our poor E-4 Zach
The Russian revolver you're thinking about is the 1895 Nagant. While you are correct that it can be suppressed if you thread the barrel, it is not a top break. It loads and unloads much in the same way that an old Colt 45 would. I've got one.
In an old Arma group I was forced to clear a path through a minefield. Solution? Turn on my mine detector and book it to the other side like I was cosplaying a Toyota hilux.
Thank you for including that little note at the start about "expert opinions." Any expert will tell you that things can and do change in the fields they study, and that definitive answers are anything but. We only know as much as we know in the present. The future can change that in an instant. Also, good eye pointing out how a land mine was an inconvenience to Zach as he was walking along lol ( 6:03 ). Late-game Fallout numbs you to how powerful you actually get by the later half of the game. Zach's character is the post-apocalyptic equivalent to a mailman, and a jury-rigged landmine barely inconvenienced him as he was travelling 😆
10:21 reminds me of this sketch from Lock Stock and Two Smoking Barrel movie "Ah!" "What is it?" "They shot me!" "Well shot them back!" *Shoots a short double barrel shotgun with tons of smoke that takes up the whole room* "Jesus, Plank, you couldn't bring smokeless cartridges?!"
Oh man, I remember that movie. It was hilarious. All of a sudden I can imagine Zach and Mike having a conversation like: Mike:You mean guns that shoot bullets? Zach:Well, you must be the brains of the operation. Yes, guns that shoot bullets.
I've only started watching these reaction videos when Mikeburnfire hit the block, and it's kind of fun watching Paul go from just trying to get an idea of Mike and Zack and breaking down everything they say and giving thought out explanations. But you watch now, and it's just Paul enjoying their videos giving little comments without pausing, just enjoying the video, smiling and chuckling more. It's fun watching him become a fan of my favorite fallout content creators. :D
If memory serves, the reason why so many games use the Pancor Jackhammer, or a look alike, is because the exterior specs were provided online by the gun's designer at no charge, so it was really easy to add with no legal strings attached. Been a while since I saw the forgotten weapons video on it, and that's a good channel to learn about the history and mechanics of firearms.
3:40 the Nagant 1895 is a solid frame side gate loader like the Colt Peacemaker. It uses a combo of a spring loaded cylinder that moves forward when the action is cocked, and special ammo where the bullet is seated deep in the case, and the brass extended beyond the face of the cylinder and into the barrel when the cylinder is forward. Thus creating a gas seal. Interestingly, its mechanism is broadly similar to a Civil War era revolver, the Savage Navy revolver, a blackpowder cap-and-ball lever action revolver. It is a pretty neat mechanism.
In fallout 4 I often use the GIAT FAMAS (a mods), making it full auto ... at the end of the day if I don't have about 1000 ammo or more, (5.56mm), I end up running out of ammo within 5 minutes cleaning the various places for missions. xD
The Russian revolver he mentioned as being one of the few able to be effectively suppressed is the Russian M1895 Nagant revolver, chambered in 7.62x38R. It was able to be suppressed because of the unique cylinder on the thing, which would lock forward with the barrel when the gun was cocked, forming a seal which allowed for a suppressor to actual do it's job and vent the gasses quietly, rather than the typical all at once due to the nature of flash gap. It wasn't break action though, it had a loading gate.
I love the aa12 man it’s such an accurate weapon for an automatic combat shotgun and has very low recoil for a max of 32 drum mag. Which was also made compatible with frag 12 rounds for the military. Though it was only used by mercenaries and bodyguard type forces that doesn’t discount the awe I have for this weapon.
While I happily own both a Mossberg 500 and a Remington 870, I will say I prefer the tang safety of the Mossberg and the location of its slide release over the 870’s, but that really is just personal preference.
Funny story there - when I was in HS a friend and I each bought a "Sten kit". It shipped you the parts and you assembled it and did some minor work on it. The funniest part was they added a funny "Warning" - "Don't do this or you'll make it fully automatic". Anyone else buy one of those kits as a teen/young adult?
A bit more AK-74U trivia. It was temporarily adopted by the Russian police forces. They needed an assault rifle that doesn't shoot through the walls killing civillians. Problem with AK-74U was that instead of going through the walls, the bullet bounced like hell, so police had to settle for modded PP-2000 "Vityaz", an smg with options for 7,62
Also Last I checked the Marine Corp uses the 590 and the full sized models comes with a bayonet lug. This is the main reason I have a 590A1 Retrograde that comes with a heatshield ghost ring sights and wooden furniture. It fits the classic M7 bayonet as well as the new M9 bayonet even though the M9 makes a better utility knife than a bayonet. So I can put a bayonet on it and call it my Trench Wench.
Hello there. It's good to see a friendly face. Almost took you for a raider, I did. Name's Malcolm. Malcolm Holmes. Don't suppose you'd care to trade? I'm missing a few essentials and- oh, screw this. Lying just ain't in my nature. I'll tell it to you straight. I've been following you for a good bit now.
Fun fact, they made a black power revolver in a rifle version. It was not so popular because when it chain fires, your other hand just happens to be infront of the chamber…
That whole "I don't know" thing reminds me of a puzzle in Star Trek: A Final Unity where to get into a temple, whatever character you're controlling has to effectively say "I don't know for sure" to all the questions because the subculture in question sees admitting ignorance as enlightenment. I, for one, like that line of thinking. There should be nothing wrong in admitting that you don't know for sure about anything.
Maybe check out the Alaska/Africa campfire story since that focuses on Mike's experiences instead of Zachs, it's kind of funny to see how different their experiences were
Well, I don't know if Popenker can be classified as an "expert"... He is quite a character, to put it mildly. But I'm no expert either, so what he said in interviews with Ian might be absolutely correct. I'd still take it with a grain of salt, though.
1895 Nagant, to be exact. Anemic little cartridge but the system worked. Not a top break, but a gate loaded pistol like a Colt SAA. Personal theory is the gas sealing was a side effect of the actual intent (original explanations being lost to time); having the nose of the case push into and then obturate onto it's equivalent of a forcing cone meant that the cylinder couldn't fire out of time. It was always perfectly timed (perfect alignment between cylinder and barrel) because it physically had no other choice, to be misaligned prevented the cylinder movement forwards and that wouldn't allow the hammer to cock. And since there's a taper to the cartridge, to be that far out of time literally means the pistol would have to be badly broken, and not just worn. Due to this the pistol wouldn't need tuning nearly as much as a standard revolver, which is rare to begin with... so basically, you'd likely never see it wear enough to stop functioning during a *career* in the Russian army.
13:13 so the point of the weapon was to increase hit probability by increasing the number of rounds in a decreased area. The us army tried to do the same with operation salvo and spiw but those revolved around multiple projectile rounds.
The difference between an expert and an "expert" is that an expert knows where their knowledge ends. Such a perfect way to explain it. As a marketing expert, we have to constantly tell people "Look, the research SAYS this is going to happen. The testing SAYS this is going to happen. Will it happen? Maybe. If it doesn't happen...then we have no idea why."
Everyone talked about the 1895 Nagant, but Russia had a second top-break revolver: Contract built S&W Model 3's in .44 Russian. A development of the "Schofield" and original Model 3.
4:03 The Japanese were the first to create spiked bats, and before baseball was even invented. They're known as kanabō. Which translates to "metal stick." They were used to crush armor and sometimes break the legs of enemy cavalry's horses. They were so brutal, they are often depicted as the weapon of choice for oni, or demons.
Ok, as an armorer from the 90s, 76y, I have to chime up on the Mossberg VS. Remington. Mossberg was the first company to use dual slide rails, the 870 had one. Also the Mossberg 590 is the only shotgun to pass every military and government test for shotguns...
02:50 Not sure if it's the same documentary but Vice did a mini documentary about a fellow called Arturo Rojas in Dallas who works as a restaurant dishwasher and does custom gun engraving by hand
There's two prototypes of the Pancor Jackhammer, the first being basically a tool room prototype, and the second being an unfinished Mk. 3 prototype, that has the potential to be finished and actually function. Look it up on Wikipedia, and watch Forgotten Weapons' two videos on the guns. Really cool.
I always thought the main reason they kept full auto in Vietnam was because the enemy would often just pop at them from somewhere in hiding and it was usually best to hold the trigger down and, uh, "redecorate" the forests in the general direction of the enemy because you might hit something.
the other issue with the pankor jackahammer is the drum mag was made to be turned into a landmine. you could pull the drum out and apparently cock a pin that fired off all the shells at once when stepped into but fun little fact thats a war crime if used by the us military and the designer fully knew that going into this
Dunno if anyone has said anything, but the Mosin M1895 is not a top break revolver, it has a loading gate with a manual ejecting rod, unlike a top break revolver which automatically ejects the rounds as soon as you break the action. Just wanted to give some more insight into the revolver. The MP412 REX, is a revolver that was designed for export, as the name implies Revolver for EXport.
I would also add that it's not that easy to suppress Nagant since the barrel doesn't have a thread for a suppressor and the front iron sight is where that thread would have to be. So "out of the box" Nagant requires some "bicycle shop" modifications to actually become suppressable
3:44 the nagant is not a to break, but it has a loading gate on the side, and while yes, it theory you could put a silencer on one, it wasn't done very often.
The MP412-EX was supposed to be for Exporting, I think mainly to the US market. Sadly never happened. Where Zach was incorrect is that there were 3 or 4 Pancor Jackhammers that were built. Several were tested and destroyed, while the last is the only remaining one in existence. There were non-firing prototypes that were made but the guy ran out of money before he could have the US military test them. And finally, the Mossberg 590 is the only shotgun between Mossberg and Remington that actually met the military standards. The 870 has not done so.
there was also nitro powder inbetween black and smokeless powder it had only short use because the guns needed remaking with how powerful it was and people ended up needing remaking with how unstable it was it wasnt very popular
the MP412 revolver was never produced AFAIK, it was only prototyped. it was meant to be an export to the US, but then the late 90s happened, so it never entered full production.
The prototype Pancor Jackhammer that we all know was never meant to be used in combat. From what I hear it is quite different from the version that was given to the military for testing. Unfortunately the prototypes submitted have been destroyed, so we actually don't know what it might have looked like, and we probably never will.
You mentioned the Nagant revolver in the beginning as a top break revolver with a gas seal and could be suppressed, except that's not true. The Nagant revolver was a revolver with a gas seal system, but it was not a top break, it was a gate loading single action, but some of them were modified to shoot double action. It can theoretically be suppressed, but in practice, you have to move the front sight and thread the barrel. The Russians did use a top break revolver before the October revolution, which was the Smith and Wesson No. 3, chambered in .44 Russian. It's worth noting that this is the reason that .44 Magnum is actually a .42 caliber bore, and .38 special is actually a .357 caliber bore. The reason for this is because the hard cast bullets common at the time required a waxy lubrication on the bullet itself. Originally, they had been .44 caliber bore diameter, but the bullet was the same diameter as the case and the waxy lubricant was exposed to the elements. By shrinking the bullets, they could seal the lubricant in the case.
I’m a diehard Mossberg guy, love my 590A1, 20 inch barrel, 9 shell tube, bayonet lug, Ghost ring sights, it runs like a dream too, it’s actually built to the exact same spec as the ones the Marines use, it’s a fucking beast of a shotgun it’s heavy as hell but hey, if you run out of shells and your bayonet goes dull you can always beat somebody with it
Funny thing about the pancor, but I believe there are actually three models with two being semi-functional shotguns. Only thing is that to reload it you need tools to pull out the cylinder, but aside from that it's a real working shotgun..... just only the two
I thought there were 3 jackhammers made? The Pancor Corporation Jackhammer is a 12-gauge, blow-forward gas-operated bullpup automatic shotgun designed in 1984 and patented in 1987. Only three working prototypes of the Jackhammer were built. Nonetheless, its distinctive aesthetics and futuristic design have made it a prop in action films, television programs, and video games. -wikipedia
22:35 Still prefer the Mossberg 500, especially the 590 variants which are the US Army standard issue shotgun. Monstrously durable (survived a punishing 1000 round torture test). It uses a mass production version of the Remington Model 31 "Ball Bearing Action" though said system has no such bearings in it as I've seen the insides of one they're all just indivially hand fitted for an exceptionally smooth action. But this was expensive and it was discontinued so eventually Mossberg bought up the rights and managed to duplicate the effects very closely with something that can actually be spat out of an assembly line with minimal hand fitting. Even the retrograde Maverick 88 budget version has some of those qualities and even plowed through TFB's shotgun torture test. Though ultimately the Remington 870 and Mossberg 500 are basically just conventional tube fed pump action shotguns with MANY *MANY* derivatives, do your research; and find the one right for you!
So fun fact it's actually not illegal to make a fully automatic firearm in the us, so long as you acquire the proper paperwork with the ATF. I'm hugely oversimplifying but you can basically build whatever as long as you don't sell it.
I prefer the Mossberg for the top mounted ambi safety, and especially for where the tab for unlocking the pump is located. That being said, the 870 and the 500 are both great firearms.
Latest episode of my Podcast: A hat the Army believed would make Soldiers fight harder bit.ly/3xLv5gi
i had my pietta 1858 new model army chain fire the cylinder to its right., left a nice lead and powder streak down the side of my gun didn't mess anything up but scared the fuck out of me.
I don't know if you've seen the other rants about the jackhammer, but the reason he has such distaste for that one specifically is because it's used in several shows/games as what is supposed to be some kind of amazing, futuristic shotgun. So even though it was just experimental and didn't really work, because of how it's been shown in games and media, it has some kind of mythical reputation. He doesn't like that a bad gun is seen as amazing basically.
Ah, the Katana Effect, got it.
@@fabiangamboa1714 basically, yeah
Unless that gun is the gyro jet
@@fabiangamboa1714 Pretty much.
At least the katana show wide use. Nowhere near as good as media, mostly anime and games, depict it, but it saw use. The jackhammer was not good enough to see ANY use. It was a failed experiment.
11:20 Fun fact. There was a case that these trumpets were used during WW2 because one of British officers didn't trust radios to be reliable enough so he had his soldiers trained in trumpet signals so when radio broke units were coordinating using trumpets.
tfw your a German fighting in WW2 and the f--king Rohirrim charge your position.
10:05 fun fact: this is why putting a revolving cylinder on a rifle never took off. It was relatively harmless if scary and annoying when all 6 chambers would fire on your pistol revolver, on a rifle it'd blow your fingers off. It's why they developed lever action repeating rifles instead.
Though I suppose you could make a modern revolving rifle, if you really wanted to.
There's a modern Russian revolver rifle
so! there was in fact for a short time before the first lever action where the united states union states in fact used a revolver rifle, common medic complaints were missing fingers.
@@nobudgetcomments2742 Well the problem is less prominent if not completely solved with modern gunpowder.
Rossi Circuit Judge is a revoler rifle/shotgun in .45Colt/.410. They have a .22 version in both LR and Mag also.
They do exist, they’re not very common though. I see them every once in a while while looking at revolvers or lever actions in specific calibers. But you’d be better off saving a little more and buying a lever action. Though there is one I’d love to get my hands on, and it’s the Russian one that another commenter mentioned, they’re chambered in either 9x39, or 12.7x55mm.
The Nagant revolver has variants for gate loading and a swing out cylinder, there is no top break variant. It is a great suppressible revolver though, probably the best.
Possibly the only one
Yeah, he's conjoined it with the Smith & Wesson number 3.
Russians did do another one though, the OTs-38.
@@izaakburningham3188 the cool part about the OTs-38 is that the ammunition is suppressed, not the gun. 7.62x42 SP-4 has a piston between the powder and the bullet that seals the cartridge before any gas can escape, minimizing noise.
There's a few videos of semi automatic suppressed ammo guns firing, and the loudest noise in those is the slide hiding the back end of travel. Imagine how quiet the revolvers are!
Also, unrelated to how quiet it is, the OTs-38 fires from the bottom cylinder. The top barrel looking thing is a laser.
...and it's not Russian either.
The Hilarious thing about Mike saying "there could be more than one they could have some hiding" about the Pancor Jackhammer is that earlier this year they actually found another one that the wife of the designer had lying around not realizing that it was a functioning firearm.
I’ve been watching your videos non stop since I ended up in the hospital with leukemia. Really brightens my day when you upload!
Good luck friend
Godspeed
And give leukemia a black eye for me will ya?
Feel better and get well soon my man!
Sorry, but the Nagant isn't a top-break revolver. It has a loading gate. Since the cylinder needs to move forward for the seal, the Belgians developing it couldn't make it a breaker as well.
Yeah, I thought so too. While looking it up to be sure, I found out that there was a 1910 variant with a swing-out cylinder, though it wasn't exactly great by most accounts.
Yeah it’s also the called the m1895 not the m1898 and it looks nothing like the revolver in the video.
@@stephennelson9212 Is there a 1898 variant though? It would make sense that there might be, given that's when the Russians purchased the manufacturing rights
Though actually, the mechanism does work with non-fixed cylinder versions. See the Pieper revolving carbine, which uses the same technique but is a swing-out revolver.
The nagant isn’t the only revolver capable of being supressed.
With enough clamshell fuckery you can supress any revolver, take a look at the PSDR-3.
Also you can also make a case of it being a prime example of engineers being too busy trying to see if they could, to ask if they should.
ah yes, the power of "fuck this gun in particular"
I just googled it, and it looks like boba fett's carbine from Star Wars.
How to silence your revolver: Build a slightly larger revolver over the first.
"Why this thing looks like it's dipped in chrome even the grip is shiny" it's not even a game engine issue, just that the modder either messed up the normal map or didn't make an environmental map for the model.
If I remember correctly, it's Millenia mod and that dude doesn't mess up. It's shiny on purpose.
Afaik, in MW3, MP412 Rex is also shiny as all get out
Millennia does good work, but as I recall he made the weapons for fonv/fo3 pretty early before modelers got the variable environs working. Could be wrong, haven't used his weapon packs in my fonv build in a long time, I'd have to look at the mesh to see if it has enviros.
Every Millenia weapon mod uses his ("her" now since the transition) own environmental map which was very likely set too strong in the program used for integrating the weapon into the game. If it were missing, it would have looked comically shiny.
The "accuracy by volume of fire" concept guns have been popping up since sometime after WWII. There were some studies done that found that, for average infantryman, volume of fire is more important than his shot-by-shot accuracy. This resulted with various attempts by both the West (like Project SPIW and SALVO, duplex rounds) and the East (like An-94 and AEK-971), to increase soldier's accuracy by increasing the volume of fire. Some of them were mant to fire so fast as to be able to fire multiple bullets, before the recoil impulse hit the shooter, and disrupted his aim.
These studies also provide good proof for why bolt aftion rifles are obsolete.
There were also really cool duplex and triplex cartridges. It's such a shame it went nowhere, thoigh.
@@AliceLoverdrive "So you like bullets? We put bullets in your bullets, so you can shoot while you shoot!"
I feel like range drastically affects this issue though. At longer range single shot just makes more sense. One accurate bullet in the target is better then 10 going around the target.
In close range volume of fire makes a lot more sense since your very likely to hit the target.
@@lunaticbz3594 They discovered that a typical infantry engagement ranges aren't longer that 300m. For a typical infantryman (not a sniper or a dedicated marksman) accuracy by volume of fire makes sense at these ranges. In WWII it took on average 45 000 rounds per enemy kill. For a military it's cheaper to spend more on ammo than to train soldiers for pinpoint accuracy.
Well the AN-94 had something special for this tho, it had a moving barrel which after the first bullet was fired moved backwards and in theory only after the second bullet was shot the recoil kicks in. So the moving barrel was made to theoretically completely zero the recoil of the first round so the shooter would hit 2 rounds very close into the same target, of course practically this didn't work so well and also it was super pricey to make them, heavy af and some other problems so it didn't got used much. Today only the Spetznas use it i belive.
The AS VAL was meant for Alpha, GRU, the SVR's Zaslon, and other Spetsnaz units.
Also @ 15:40, see the FGC-9; a 3d printed SMG. It's really popular, and some states (2a Sanctuaries to be exact) allow you to do so _without_ an FFL since the ATF can't do anything about it in said states.
Local law enforcement are ordered not to assist the ATF
@@LiteralCrimeRave Yep, I know.
This is coming from someone who lives half of the year in Alaska, where ATF agents are straight-up detained most of the time, and the other half in Idaho.
@@JoMiMi_h Wait, why are the ATF detained in Alaska?
@@killermlg5360 First of all, as implied, Alaska and Idaho are 2A sanctuaries. In Idaho, ATF agents are usually told to exit the state. In Alaska, they detain them, then escort them to the nearest airport, port/harbor, etc. so they can leave. That, combined with the fact Alaska has a lot of hunters, and bears, are some of the reasons why iirc.
@@JoMiMi_h now only if they did that in more states
Back in the day they actually experimented with adding a shield to revolving rifles to protect the shooters' forearms (one of the main reasons they fell out of use), but soon found out doing so greatly increased risk of chain fire.
I always look forward to these gun rant reactions, much like I always look forward to the ones where you have something tactical to say.
See, this is why I love it when you (and a few other military related channels) cover videos like this. I learn a lot from Mike and Zack's misadventures that I wouldn't have otherwise, but people can always add additional info that someone else might not know. Hearing you give additional information about some of these weapon's histories is always a treat!
11:10 the clouds of smoke was also why no one gave a care if muskets or even rifles were incredibly inaccurate, you can't see who you're shooting at anyways, you just needed to shoot on command. Its also why even though rifles were more accurate, many commanders preferred smoothbore muskets, as they had a higher rate of fire.
@The Hittite Exactly. Honestly the entire debate between the two in the 18th century is fascinating and is entirely over looked by people who default to pop history.
God I hate myself for typing that last bit....
AS Val was developed, because before that Spetsnaz had to use regular subsonic ammunition(which was just usual ammo with less gunpowder used) and regular AKM with silencer. Which was really bad against enemy equipped with bodyarmor, and also inaccurate - bad qualities for stealth.
First version was VSS Vintorez, VSS translates from Russian as "Special Sniper Rifle" - sniper rifle with integrated suppressor and flashhider, that is effective up to 400 meters. AS Val is assault rifle version.
they were mostly made to replace the AKS-74UB if i remember correctly.
Nowadays there is a form of trigger called a Binary Trigger available to civilians that when you flip the selector switch to it fires 1 round when you pull it and fires 1 round when you release the trigger.
This gives civilians in effect what is a 2 round burst firearm legally as the pull and release of the trigger is counted as 2 different actions in law.
Another trigger type is the FRT or Forced Reset Trigger which makes it so when you pull the trigger and fire the weapon it forces to trigger back into the non firing position so when you squeeze the trigger and hold it consistently you can have a form of slow full auto.
This one the ATF claims makes a weapon a machinegun illegally when you look at the law it actually does not. Because of this the company that produces the FRT has continued production and basically told the ATF if your so sure about that then set up a court date.
the remingotn 870 has a riveted extractor, but the 500 is screwed in. the extractor is a part that almost never breaks, but with the mossberg it's a 5 minute fix. the remington needs a propper gunsmithing shop.
Real fun! Any of the campfire series Related to the military I’m game for. Love getting your take on things further up the chain of command than our poor E-4 Zach
The Russian revolver you're thinking about is the 1895 Nagant. While you are correct that it can be suppressed if you thread the barrel, it is not a top break. It loads and unloads much in the same way that an old Colt 45 would. I've got one.
“Wow. Shots fired. I mean, not out of a Pancor Jackhammer. But, you know, in general.”
I feel like Zach would love that line.
In an old Arma group I was forced to clear a path through a minefield. Solution? Turn on my mine detector and book it to the other side like I was cosplaying a Toyota hilux.
Thank you for including that little note at the start about "expert opinions." Any expert will tell you that things can and do change in the fields they study, and that definitive answers are anything but. We only know as much as we know in the present. The future can change that in an instant.
Also, good eye pointing out how a land mine was an inconvenience to Zach as he was walking along lol ( 6:03 ). Late-game Fallout numbs you to how powerful you actually get by the later half of the game. Zach's character is the post-apocalyptic equivalent to a mailman, and a jury-rigged landmine barely inconvenienced him as he was travelling 😆
"The only thing that defines experts - Taco Bell coming with the build your own cravings box."
goddamnit TACO BELL!!!!!
0:55
10:21 reminds me of this sketch from Lock Stock and Two Smoking Barrel movie
"Ah!"
"What is it?"
"They shot me!"
"Well shot them back!"
*Shoots a short double barrel shotgun with tons of smoke that takes up the whole room*
"Jesus, Plank, you couldn't bring smokeless cartridges?!"
Oh man, I remember that movie. It was hilarious. All of a sudden I can imagine Zach and Mike having a conversation like:
Mike:You mean guns that shoot bullets?
Zach:Well, you must be the brains of the operation. Yes, guns that shoot bullets.
Definitely do part two! I love MikeBurnFire and you breaking it all down makes it twice as good.
I've only started watching these reaction videos when Mikeburnfire hit the block, and it's kind of fun watching Paul go from just trying to get an idea of Mike and Zack and breaking down everything they say and giving thought out explanations.
But you watch now, and it's just Paul enjoying their videos giving little comments without pausing, just enjoying the video, smiling and chuckling more. It's fun watching him become a fan of my favorite fallout content creators. :D
5:28 The AS VAL was developed from the VSS Vintorez, which was a full auto integrity suppressed urban sniper rifle/marksman rifle for use by spetznas.
I hope to see you do part 2 of zach gun rant
Yes I was waiting for this can’t wait for Zachs gun rants 2 and 3
If memory serves, the reason why so many games use the Pancor Jackhammer, or a look alike, is because the exterior specs were provided online by the gun's designer at no charge, so it was really easy to add with no legal strings attached. Been a while since I saw the forgotten weapons video on it, and that's a good channel to learn about the history and mechanics of firearms.
3:40 the Nagant 1895 is a solid frame side gate loader like the Colt Peacemaker. It uses a combo of a spring loaded cylinder that moves forward when the action is cocked, and special ammo where the bullet is seated deep in the case, and the brass extended beyond the face of the cylinder and into the barrel when the cylinder is forward. Thus creating a gas seal.
Interestingly, its mechanism is broadly similar to a Civil War era revolver, the Savage Navy revolver, a blackpowder cap-and-ball lever action revolver. It is a pretty neat mechanism.
"'The 870 is a real oldschool Remington design" , me with a Remington bolt action .22 from the 1800s that my great great grandfather owned "huh ?"
Just to rebuttal your first talking point, Paul Harrell also said something similar; the Dunning Kruger Effect
Aka, wherein you are so incompetent you are unaware of your own incompetence.
In fallout 4 I often use the GIAT FAMAS (a mods), making it full auto ... at the end of the day if I don't have about 1000 ammo or more, (5.56mm), I end up running out of ammo within 5 minutes cleaning the various places for missions. xD
Love watching your reaction videos! Especially when you unintentionally say exactly what Zach is about to say lol.
The Russian revolver he mentioned as being one of the few able to be effectively suppressed is the Russian M1895 Nagant revolver, chambered in 7.62x38R. It was able to be suppressed because of the unique cylinder on the thing, which would lock forward with the barrel when the gun was cocked, forming a seal which allowed for a suppressor to actual do it's job and vent the gasses quietly, rather than the typical all at once due to the nature of flash gap. It wasn't break action though, it had a loading gate.
I love the aa12 man it’s such an accurate weapon for an automatic combat shotgun and has very low recoil for a max of 32 drum mag. Which was also made compatible with frag 12 rounds for the military. Though it was only used by mercenaries and bodyguard type forces that doesn’t discount the awe I have for this weapon.
For some reason hearing Paul say "gee whiz" is so satisfying.
I have been enjoying these react videos to Zach's gun rants quite a bit, very fun!
AEK 971 was designed to use 2 round burst so fast that the recoil would occur after the second round left the barrel. It is similar to project salvo.
Like the G-11 with its 3 round burst
You might be getting the AEK confused with the AN-94
@@MellowGrunt10 I believe you are correct.
I think you are referring to the AN-94. This one had a moving barrel so the soldier in theory only has to deal with the recoil of the second round.
"Engravings..... Give no Tactical advantage what so ever."- some video game I never played
I dunno, Nazi Zombies taught me that engraved M1911 shoots fucking rockets instead of bullet, sounds like an advantage to me
While I happily own both a Mossberg 500 and a Remington 870, I will say I prefer the tang safety of the Mossberg and the location of its slide release over the 870’s, but that really is just personal preference.
1:40 decent explanation of the dunning-kruger effect
To get around the word gun. I'd just use the word force multiplier while other weapons are just force enchantments helps other channels.
I remember the first time I heard "force multiplier" was from Roanoke Gaming.
More please sir, I enjoy the insight that only someone with your experience can give.
"Flash powered muzzle hider."
I don't know why that got me.
Funny story there - when I was in HS a friend and I each bought a "Sten kit". It shipped you the parts and you assembled it and did some minor work on it. The funniest part was they added a funny "Warning" - "Don't do this or you'll make it fully automatic". Anyone else buy one of those kits as a teen/young adult?
A bit more AK-74U trivia. It was temporarily adopted by the Russian police forces.
They needed an assault rifle that doesn't shoot through the walls killing civillians.
Problem with AK-74U was that instead of going through the walls, the bullet bounced like hell, so police had to settle for modded PP-2000 "Vityaz", an smg with options for 7,62
Also Last I checked the Marine Corp uses the 590 and the full sized models comes with a bayonet lug.
This is the main reason I have a 590A1 Retrograde that comes with a heatshield ghost ring sights and wooden furniture. It fits the classic M7 bayonet as well as the new M9 bayonet even though the M9 makes a better utility knife than a bayonet. So I can put a bayonet on it and call it my Trench Wench.
Mike pissing off Zack with the pancor jackhammer is hilarious
It'd be great to see you go further into the saga of Zach's gun rants
Hello there. It's good to see a friendly face. Almost took you for a raider, I did. Name's Malcolm. Malcolm Holmes. Don't suppose you'd care to trade? I'm missing a few essentials and- oh, screw this. Lying just ain't in my nature. I'll tell it to you straight. I've been following you for a good bit now.
Love it :)
@@The_Bizzler1 If you say so. Maybe we'll meet again.
Oh god he's even here.
@@KillerBlade555 If you say so. Maybe we'll meet again.
Yes part 2 please! It's very entertaining and the funniest Zach gun rants (according to me)
Fun fact, they made a black power revolver in a rifle version. It was not so popular because when it chain fires, your other hand just happens to be infront of the chamber…
That whole "I don't know" thing reminds me of a puzzle in Star Trek: A Final Unity where to get into a temple, whatever character you're controlling has to effectively say "I don't know for sure" to all the questions because the subculture in question sees admitting ignorance as enlightenment.
I, for one, like that line of thinking. There should be nothing wrong in admitting that you don't know for sure about anything.
THE PANCOR JACKHAMMER! Aka good on paper
"Invented by the Cyborg Russians!"
Maybe check out the Alaska/Africa campfire story since that focuses on Mike's experiences instead of Zachs, it's kind of funny to see how different their experiences were
5:27 Ian At Forgotten Weapons has a whole video discussing with a Russian firearms expert on the 9x39mm and the various compatible weapons.
Ian also covered the Pancor Jackhammer.
Well, I don't know if Popenker can be classified as an "expert"... He is quite a character, to put it mildly.
But I'm no expert either, so what he said in interviews with Ian might be absolutely correct. I'd still take it with a grain of salt, though.
1895 Nagant, to be exact. Anemic little cartridge but the system worked. Not a top break, but a gate loaded pistol like a Colt SAA. Personal theory is the gas sealing was a side effect of the actual intent (original explanations being lost to time); having the nose of the case push into and then obturate onto it's equivalent of a forcing cone meant that the cylinder couldn't fire out of time. It was always perfectly timed (perfect alignment between cylinder and barrel) because it physically had no other choice, to be misaligned prevented the cylinder movement forwards and that wouldn't allow the hammer to cock. And since there's a taper to the cartridge, to be that far out of time literally means the pistol would have to be badly broken, and not just worn. Due to this the pistol wouldn't need tuning nearly as much as a standard revolver, which is rare to begin with... so basically, you'd likely never see it wear enough to stop functioning during a *career* in the Russian army.
13:13 so the point of the weapon was to increase hit probability by increasing the number of rounds in a decreased area. The us army tried to do the same with operation salvo and spiw but those revolved around multiple projectile rounds.
The difference between an expert and an "expert" is that an expert knows where their knowledge ends.
Such a perfect way to explain it. As a marketing expert, we have to constantly tell people "Look, the research SAYS this is going to happen. The testing SAYS this is going to happen. Will it happen? Maybe. If it doesn't happen...then we have no idea why."
Everyone talked about the 1895 Nagant, but Russia had a second top-break revolver: Contract built S&W Model 3's in .44 Russian. A development of the "Schofield" and original Model 3.
4:03 The Japanese were the first to create spiked bats, and before baseball was even invented. They're known as kanabō. Which translates to "metal stick." They were used to crush armor and sometimes break the legs of enemy cavalry's horses.
They were so brutal, they are often depicted as the weapon of choice for oni, or demons.
I'll take "mace" for $400
@@josephgilboy6259 Maces aren't in the shape of baseball bats.
Ok, as an armorer from the 90s, 76y, I have to chime up on the Mossberg VS. Remington. Mossberg was the first company to use dual slide rails, the 870 had one. Also the Mossberg 590 is the only shotgun to pass every military and government test for shotguns...
3:47 Ah you seemed to have mixed up the S and W model 3 and the nagunt revolver and do a part two
(Fun fact the rex can also be silenced)
02:50 Not sure if it's the same documentary but Vice did a mini documentary about a fellow called Arturo Rojas in Dallas who works as a restaurant dishwasher and does custom gun engraving by hand
There's two prototypes of the Pancor Jackhammer, the first being basically a tool room prototype, and the second being an unfinished Mk. 3 prototype, that has the potential to be finished and actually function. Look it up on Wikipedia, and watch Forgotten Weapons' two videos on the guns. Really cool.
The Maus of shotguns
I always thought the main reason they kept full auto in Vietnam was because the enemy would often just pop at them from somewhere in hiding and it was usually best to hold the trigger down and, uh, "redecorate" the forests in the general direction of the enemy because you might hit something.
"Shots fired...but not from a Pancor."
Lel
You've heard of build-a-bear, now get ready for BUILD-A-BULLET
The 1895 Nagant revolver is a top break revolver. It's a gate loading revolver, though it can be suppressed due to it's gas seal function.
the other issue with the pankor jackahammer is the drum mag was made to be turned into a landmine. you could pull the drum out and apparently cock a pin that fired off all the shells at once when stepped into but fun little fact thats a war crime if used by the us military and the designer fully knew that going into this
And if the US had signed the Geneva Conventions, that might matter
Dunno if anyone has said anything, but the Mosin M1895 is not a top break revolver, it has a loading gate with a manual ejecting rod, unlike a top break revolver which automatically ejects the rounds as soon as you break the action. Just wanted to give some more insight into the revolver. The MP412 REX, is a revolver that was designed for export, as the name implies Revolver for EXport.
I would also add that it's not that easy to suppress Nagant since the barrel doesn't have a thread for a suppressor and the front iron sight is where that thread would have to be. So "out of the box" Nagant requires some "bicycle shop" modifications to actually become suppressable
You should check out the campfire story talking about the US army beret
I would very much like to see a part 2
I am shocked and appalled that there are people that would consider violating US law. 😱😱😱😱😱
You mean criminals don't care about the law...🤯
Has a drink without caffeine and the addict almost dies... hope he had coffee on deck
3:44 the nagant is not a to break, but it has a loading gate on the side, and while yes, it theory you could put a silencer on one, it wasn't done very often.
The 1898 Nagant Revolver IS NOT a top Break. It's a gate loader.
The MP412-EX was supposed to be for Exporting, I think mainly to the US market. Sadly never happened.
Where Zach was incorrect is that there were 3 or 4 Pancor Jackhammers that were built. Several were tested and destroyed, while the last is the only remaining one in existence. There were non-firing prototypes that were made but the guy ran out of money before he could have the US military test them.
And finally, the Mossberg 590 is the only shotgun between Mossberg and Remington that actually met the military standards. The 870 has not done so.
there was also nitro powder inbetween black and smokeless powder
it had only short use because the guns needed remaking with how powerful it was
and people ended up needing remaking with how unstable it was
it wasnt very popular
the MP412 revolver was never produced AFAIK, it was only prototyped.
it was meant to be an export to the US, but then the late 90s happened, so it never entered full production.
The prototype Pancor Jackhammer that we all know was never meant to be used in combat. From what I hear it is quite different from the version that was given to the military for testing. Unfortunately the prototypes submitted have been destroyed, so we actually don't know what it might have looked like, and we probably never will.
I hope you do all three of the gun rants
You mentioned the Nagant revolver in the beginning as a top break revolver with a gas seal and could be suppressed, except that's not true. The Nagant revolver was a revolver with a gas seal system, but it was not a top break, it was a gate loading single action, but some of them were modified to shoot double action. It can theoretically be suppressed, but in practice, you have to move the front sight and thread the barrel. The Russians did use a top break revolver before the October revolution, which was the Smith and Wesson No. 3, chambered in .44 Russian. It's worth noting that this is the reason that .44 Magnum is actually a .42 caliber bore, and .38 special is actually a .357 caliber bore. The reason for this is because the hard cast bullets common at the time required a waxy lubrication on the bullet itself. Originally, they had been .44 caliber bore diameter, but the bullet was the same diameter as the case and the waxy lubricant was exposed to the elements. By shrinking the bullets, they could seal the lubricant in the case.
The color correction on the camera is making his shirt magically switch form light blue/gray to white.
I'd say 9x39 was developed, because 5.45 is a very light round, and it won't pierce jack if fired as subsonic velocity.
I’m a diehard Mossberg guy, love my 590A1, 20 inch barrel, 9 shell tube, bayonet lug, Ghost ring sights, it runs like a dream too, it’s actually built to the exact same spec as the ones the Marines use, it’s a fucking beast of a shotgun it’s heavy as hell but hey, if you run out of shells and your bayonet goes dull you can always beat somebody with it
Funny thing about the pancor, but I believe there are actually three models with two being semi-functional shotguns. Only thing is that to reload it you need tools to pull out the cylinder, but aside from that it's a real working shotgun..... just only the two
Yes please do parts 2 and 3.
I thought there were 3 jackhammers made?
The Pancor Corporation Jackhammer is a 12-gauge, blow-forward gas-operated bullpup automatic shotgun designed in 1984 and patented in 1987. Only three working prototypes of the Jackhammer were built. Nonetheless, its distinctive aesthetics and futuristic design have made it a prop in action films, television programs, and video games. -wikipedia
22:35 Still prefer the Mossberg 500, especially the 590 variants which are the US Army standard issue shotgun. Monstrously durable (survived a punishing 1000 round torture test). It uses a mass production version of the Remington Model 31 "Ball Bearing Action" though said system has no such bearings in it as I've seen the insides of one they're all just indivially hand fitted for an exceptionally smooth action. But this was expensive and it was discontinued so eventually Mossberg bought up the rights and managed to duplicate the effects very closely with something that can actually be spat out of an assembly line with minimal hand fitting. Even the retrograde Maverick 88 budget version has some of those qualities and even plowed through TFB's shotgun torture test. Though ultimately the Remington 870 and Mossberg 500 are basically just conventional tube fed pump action shotguns with MANY *MANY* derivatives, do your research; and find the one right for you!
So fun fact it's actually not illegal to make a fully automatic firearm in the us, so long as you acquire the proper paperwork with the ATF. I'm hugely oversimplifying but you can basically build whatever as long as you don't sell it.
I prefer the Mossberg for the top mounted ambi safety, and especially for where the tab for unlocking the pump is located. That being said, the 870 and the 500 are both great firearms.
Would love more coverings of gun rants. My favorite videos of your’s personally. Though that may just be because I’m a maniacal gun guy.
3 minutes in and all im thinking is, "Engravings, give you no tactical advantage whatsoever."
Something they didn't say about the Jackhammer and why it sucks is that you require a screwdriver to reload it.