Regular service scenes of Septa's Brill "Bullets" on the former Philadelphia & Western line from 69th Street to Norristown. Video shot from 1988 to 1990.
The Chicago CTA 6000 el cars used in the 90's were a great ride too. They were light and ran on PCC type trucks, fast and bouncy on the curves, an exciting trip. In Chicago they were nicknamed "spam cans." All good memories.
In 1976 my father took me on this train to Norristown one day, I was then hooked, these old bullit cars were 1/3 trolley, 1/3 subway car and the rest was pure speed demon! These cars were an industry first! Placed in to service in 1936, they were sleek and fast, and capable of speeds up to 80 miles an hour or more! They are a true testament to the ingenuity and craftsmanship of the J.G. Brill company, which was based here in Philadelphia I might add, great footage and with original sound to.
The Bullets actually date to 1931. They ran until about 1990 which really says something about the quality of Brill's manufacturing and the maintenance skills of the Victory Avenue shops.
Great memories. I grew up in Upper Darby, just a block away from the P&W line at the Parkview Station. At that point the line was running adjacent to the Karakung Golf Course. We used to play around the station, always avoiding that third rail! I loved that the station had a concrete bridge over the tracks, connecting the two sides, and watching the bullet cars and the Strafford cars pass underneath. My big regret is that I only rode it a few times, but did go all the way to Norristown.
@fmnut Actually 5 MFSE Budd single cars (a.k.a., "Almond Joys") were used on this line for a short time. They were standard-gauged using trucks from scrapped PATH K-cars.
The whine of their motors is unmistakeable. These were long high-speed cars with plush seating and a scenic grade-separated right of way. Bullet cars were a pleasure to ride, no other experience is quite like it. The viaduct is one of the best parts, too.
This type of transit seems to make so much sense. Where I live the transportation authorities refuse to consider trollies or streetcars. Buses and concrete elevated trains is their strategy.
1:43 - 5:05 , 6:42 : Listen to that traction motor whine!!! Thanks so much for allowing us to relive our memories. Now if only my HO scale Bullets could sound like that!!
Theoretically they could hit 95 to 100 but were limited to about 70 mph in revenue service due to the number of curves on the line. Al Ricketts cranked one of them (207, IIRC) up to 86 on a fan trip.
The Strafford cars ran on this line under three owners - P&W, Red Arrow, and SEPTA. They were heavier and slower than the Bullets so they tended to be used for tripper service between 69th St. and Bryn Mawr, but were sometimes run to Norristown in snow and ice because they had somewhat better traction.
Wonder how many people remember when the P&W tracks crossed Main street, and went all the way up Swede, then out Markely? I grew up in Norristown, and remember when they removed the tracks, and the bridge across Main. I lived in the 700 block of Swede, and the Six hundred block was all paved with Concrete. That was back in the late 50's.
Oh, yes! Those tracks were actually used by LVT, the Liberty Bell Line which ran all the way to the Lehigh Valley. IIRC any use by P&W cars would have been limited to the original 40-series cars and early-configuration Strafford cars, both of which had poles for street running as well as third-rail shoes. Poles were removed from the Strafford cars when street running wasn't needed. Interestingly, most of the cars that have been preserved in museums have regained their poles because there aren't third rails.
I definitely remember these high speed line cars as they passed through Villanova. At least externally they're nicer looking than the boxy cars that Septa is using today. I think i even remember seeing an orange one at a station once. Very nostalgic video.
To add some info about equipment: - Yes, the Strafford cars were part of the roster along with the Bullets. They were slower than the Bullets and tended to be used more on the Strafford Branch (RIP) which was shorter and had lower demand. When the Strafford Branch was abandoned the cars were used mostly for local service to Bryn Mawr. They were heavier and had better traction in snow so they would be used for Norristown service when the going got tough.
I stand corrected, I had the service dates crossed with the Brill high speed cars in use over the Delaware river bridge (currently the Ben Franklin)to camden, they being the most distinctive subway cars ever installed on the Philadelphia subway system. J.G. Brill was an exceptional coach and streetcar builder, the Brill DRPA/Broad Street cars were nicknamed the "Buck rodgers cars" in 1936 by a visiting journalist from New York. Thank's for the correction.
These cars have always remained in my memory from my few visits to Philadelphia when I was little in the 40s & 50s. Thanks for posting this video. (PS: check your date in the explanation, "1998-1990": A typo?
What a great video. Thanks so much for posting it. What runs on that line now? I went to Philly about two years ago. I want to go back in the fall and ride as much as I can.
Third rail can support speeds up to 100 MPH but not much more. For triple-digit speeds nothing beats high-voltage AC overhead for durability, though third rail is cheaper to install since it does not require costly catenary structures.
Is it an advantage or a disadvantage to be 3rd rail powered as these were? I can see how they'd be faster vehicles with a 3rd rail, and there's no overhead line to maintain, but how does it compare maintenance-wise, flexibility-wise, and weather-wise with an overhead line?
i made a special trip to ride these cars back in the mid-1970's, when they were still in orange garb despite septa, and hung out the "baggage????" door with just a strap across the opening for most of the trip. could be one of the reasons my first wife divorced me, but i thought she enjoyed it......she DID freak out on the Cyclone in coney island, but that's what life's all about.
. No. 200 - Scrapped after crash with 167 at West Overbrook. No. 201 - Scrapped after electrical fire. No. 202 - Scrapped after fire and vandalism. No. 203 - Seashore Trolley Museum, restored to orange paint scheme. No. 204 - Body, sans trucks, at National Museum of Transport in St. Louis, MO. No. 205 - Fitted with trolley poles and occasionally runs at the Rock Hill Trolley Museum in Orbisonia, PA. No. 206 - Electric City Trolley Museum, Scranton, PA. Nos. 207-208 - Seashore Trolley Museum.
Joseph Heston no, the Bullets were designed as high speed interurbans. PCCs were streetcars. Other than the choice of aluminum for the bodies there were no common design elements. The streamlining on the PCC was strictly for looks, as they weren't really capable of reaching speeds where improved aerodynamics made a difference.
The Chicago CTA 6000 el cars used in the 90's were a great ride too. They were light and ran on PCC type trucks, fast and bouncy on the curves, an exciting trip. In Chicago they were nicknamed "spam cans." All good memories.
I rode that several times with my mom, when I was a kid in the 1970's, from 69th St. to Norristown and back again.
In 1976 my father took me on this train to Norristown one day, I was then hooked, these old bullit cars were 1/3 trolley, 1/3 subway car and the rest was pure speed demon! These cars were an industry first! Placed in to service in 1936, they were sleek and fast, and capable of speeds up to 80 miles an hour or more! They are a true testament to the ingenuity and craftsmanship of the J.G. Brill company, which was based here in Philadelphia I might add, great footage and with original sound to.
The Bullets actually date to 1931. They ran until about 1990 which really says something about the quality of Brill's manufacturing and the maintenance skills of the Victory Avenue shops.
Great memories. I grew up in Upper Darby, just a block away from the P&W line at the Parkview Station. At that point the line was running adjacent to the Karakung Golf Course. We used to play around the station, always avoiding that third rail! I loved that the station had a concrete bridge over the tracks, connecting the two sides, and watching the bullet cars and the Strafford cars pass underneath. My big regret is that I only rode it a few times, but did go all the way to Norristown.
Great footage . So familiar.
@fmnut Actually 5 MFSE Budd single cars (a.k.a., "Almond Joys") were used on this line for a short time. They were standard-gauged using trucks from scrapped PATH K-cars.
The whine of their motors is unmistakeable. These were long high-speed cars with plush seating and a scenic grade-separated right of way. Bullet cars were a pleasure to ride, no other experience is quite like it. The viaduct is one of the best parts, too.
This type of transit seems to make so much sense. Where I live the transportation authorities refuse to consider trollies or streetcars. Buses and concrete elevated trains is their strategy.
1:43 - 5:05 , 6:42 : Listen to that traction motor whine!!! Thanks so much for allowing us to relive our memories. Now if only my HO scale Bullets could sound like that!!
Simply marvelous video. I grew up in Philly but never saw these. Are they still running? How fast do these go? I heard they could do 100 mph.
Theoretically they could hit 95 to 100 but were limited to about 70 mph in revenue service due to the number of curves on the line. Al Ricketts cranked one of them (207, IIRC) up to 86 on a fan trip.
Unusually good footage of a fascinating transit operation. I really enjoyed riding this line while visiting the Philadelphia area.
Weren't Stafford cars also used here? Or was that on the Red Arrow?
The Strafford cars ran on this line under three owners - P&W, Red Arrow, and SEPTA. They were heavier and slower than the Bullets so they tended to be used for tripper service between 69th St. and Bryn Mawr, but were sometimes run to Norristown in snow and ice because they had somewhat better traction.
Sounds like R1-9 Trains in NYC, Propulsion wise.
Glad someone filmed the Bullets in action. Wish I'd been as smart.
Wonder how many people remember when the P&W tracks crossed Main street, and went all the way up Swede, then out Markely? I grew up in Norristown, and remember when they removed the tracks, and the bridge across Main. I lived in the 700 block of Swede, and the Six hundred block was all paved with Concrete.
That was back in the late 50's.
Oh, yes! Those tracks were actually used by LVT, the Liberty Bell Line which ran all the way to the Lehigh Valley. IIRC any use by P&W cars would have been limited to the original 40-series cars and early-configuration Strafford cars, both of which had poles for street running as well as third-rail shoes. Poles were removed from the Strafford cars when street running wasn't needed. Interestingly, most of the cars that have been preserved in museums have regained their poles because there aren't third rails.
I definitely remember these high speed line cars as they passed through Villanova. At least externally they're nicer looking than the boxy cars that Septa is using today. I think i even remember seeing an orange one at a station once. Very nostalgic video.
To add some info about equipment:
- Yes, the Strafford cars were part of the roster along with the Bullets. They were slower than the Bullets and tended to be used more on the Strafford Branch (RIP) which was shorter and had lower demand. When the Strafford Branch was abandoned the cars were used mostly for local service to Bryn Mawr. They were heavier and had better traction in snow so they would be used for Norristown service when the going got tough.
I stand corrected, I had the service dates crossed with the Brill high speed cars in use over the Delaware river bridge (currently the Ben Franklin)to camden, they being the most distinctive subway cars ever installed on the Philadelphia subway system. J.G. Brill was an exceptional coach and streetcar builder, the Brill DRPA/Broad Street cars were nicknamed the "Buck rodgers cars" in 1936 by a visiting journalist from New York. Thank's for the correction.
These cars have always remained in my memory from my few visits to Philadelphia when I was little in the 40s & 50s. Thanks for posting this video. (PS: check your date in the explanation, "1998-1990": A typo?
Also septa used a few of the old Budd Market Frankford cars as well.
What a great video. Thanks so much for posting it. What runs on that line now? I went to Philly about two years ago. I want to go back in the fall and ride as much as I can.
Third rail can support speeds up to 100 MPH but not much more. For triple-digit speeds nothing beats high-voltage AC overhead for durability, though third rail is cheaper to install since it does not require costly catenary structures.
@fmnut I have a few photos of MFSE cars running on the line. In fact there was once a charter trip on the P&W using a two-car train of "Almond Joys."
Is it an advantage or a disadvantage to be 3rd rail powered as these were? I can see how they'd be faster vehicles with a 3rd rail, and there's no overhead line to maintain, but how does it compare maintenance-wise, flexibility-wise, and weather-wise with an overhead line?
i made a special trip to ride these cars back in the mid-1970's, when they were still in orange garb despite septa, and hung out the "baggage????" door with just a strap across the opening for most of the trip. could be one of the reasons my first wife divorced me, but i thought she enjoyed it......she DID freak out on the Cyclone in coney island, but that's what life's all about.
Very well done. Bravo!
bullets went hell bent for leather
Al Ricketts had one cranked up to 86 mph on a fan trip!
No. 209 - PA Trolley Museum.
.
No. 200 - Scrapped after crash with 167 at West Overbrook.
No. 201 - Scrapped after electrical fire.
No. 202 - Scrapped after fire and vandalism.
No. 203 - Seashore Trolley Museum, restored to orange paint scheme.
No. 204 - Body, sans trucks, at National Museum of Transport in St. Louis, MO.
No. 205 - Fitted with trolley poles and occasionally runs at the Rock Hill Trolley Museum in Orbisonia, PA.
No. 206 - Electric City Trolley Museum, Scranton, PA.
Nos. 207-208 - Seashore Trolley Museum.
Is 205 the only operational car?
Did the Bullets play a part in the development of the PCC?
Joseph Heston no, the Bullets were designed as high speed interurbans. PCCs were streetcars. Other than the choice of aluminum for the bodies there were no common design elements. The streamlining on the PCC was strictly for looks, as they weren't really capable of reaching speeds where improved aerodynamics made a difference.
I know that. I was asking did the Bullets play a role in the development of the PCC (like the Washington pre-PCCs did).
No they didn't.
They look like the PCC’s to me also.
I miss riding the Bullet Cars they went hell bent for leather
a.k.a. "Almond Joys."