Hearts: symbolize love Spades: symbolize war and/or physical power Clubs: symbolize luck and/or happiness Diamonds: symbolize wealth My ideas Cogs: To symbolize reason Crowns: To symbolize Power of control Scale or a part of a scale: To symbolize morality Stars: To symbolize faith as they kinda fall in between a cross and David's star (so it can symbolize any type of faith, not just Christianity)
Cogs, crowns, stars, all good ideas, just like shields, cups, and towers. These symbols have the same solidity and simplicity as the current four. The scale is perhaps not simple enough as a card symbol. The eagle, racket, and wheel symbols in the video do not work for that same reason, I think.
@@Ploskkky If the scale is a semicircle with 2 lines it might work, but then the empty space issue is still there. and the cog would have to have no more than 5 teeth and no inside before things fall into the complexity issue. Maybe if its a 5 toothed cog it can be in the same color as the star. Though crowns aren't a very universal concept and are often associated less with control and more with the past now a-days while cogs are still used in modern machinery...
I really like this as Stars just by themselves feel out of place, but with both Stars and Moons, you can do all sorts of shenanigans with cosmological/astrological symbolism.
There are an extremely small number of TH-cam channels that I actively go out of my way to make time to watch when I see they've uploaded. This channel is one of them.
One of my many personal grab-bag of half-finished game design projects was a playing-card-based RPG, with four stats based on the standard suits: ♡ Hearts - Charisma, resolve ◇ Diamonds - Deception, conniving ♤ Spades - Working power, endurance ♧ Clubs - Brute strength, fighting capabilities And four new suits that each mirrored the standard four: ¤ Mind - Intelligence, smarts (Mental compared to hearts' passion) ☆ Reserve - Willpower, resolve, as well as general magic stats (Calm and thoughtful, compared to diamonds' impulse) ➹ Arrow - Reflexes, dexterity (Quick and snappy, compared to spades' slow and steady) ⛨ Shield - Bulk, resistance (Defensive constitution, compared to clubs' offensive force) I never got too far with designing it, but I like the suits that I came up with as nice counterparts to the originals.
I have also thought of tying card suits to RPG style stats, never had any actual projects use it though. I thought of hearts being HP and diamonds as defense while spades and clubs would be speed and power. I also thought of the idea of using the joker to represent all or any of those four stats. It would probably only work for a very minimalist type of game, it is just a bit limiting to have only four stats. I feel like there is also an issue of the stats not having enough intuitive association with their assigned card suit so it could end up feeling too forced and arbitrary. There is a lot of options for what type of stat you could assign to each suit.
There's also a numerical trend with certain parts of the suits: Spade has 1 point Heart has 2 lobes Club has 3 leaves Diamond has 4 points And including the most common fifth suit, Star has 5 points. As well as Stars, I have ideas for 4 further suits: Flowers (6 petals, shaped like a cartoon version of a daisy, 6 petals arranged at intervals of 60 degrees around a circle) Berries (7 round parts, shaped like 7 circles packed together into a hexagon shape (2 on top, 3 in middle, 2 on bottom), like a simplified representation of a blackberry/raspberry, and as such, could be black and/or red, or a new colour like purple in a multicolour deck) Wheels (8 spokes/segments, shaped like a circle split into 8 sectors of 45 degrees each by 8 equidistant radii from the centre to the edge) As for 9, that would get very complicated, unless you wanted to do something like a Triforce from The Legend of Zelda, for 3 x 3 = 9 (that said, you could have as many petals or as many spokes as you like on the flower or wheel). So I have decided to go the other way for my next suit: going below 1. Coins have _0_ points, because they're round. To distinguish from Wheels, the other round suit (and from being just a plain circle), there could be a hole in the middle like in ancient Chinese coins. Coins and wheels are round, and thus perfectly symmetrical, and flowers and berries are both based around a central circle with six surrounding parts in a hexagonal shape, so also symmetrical. Coins reference the old suit of coins/tarot suit of pentacles, flowers and berries are remisicent of the nature themed suits of old like leaves and acorns, and wheels, as well as appearing in this video, could be taken to represent travel, motion or even technology (and from there, exploration and conquest for the "black = war" thing)
Replace the wheel with the cog (filled in to avoid empty center space) for the sake of it actually having more obvious and noticeable spokes and you have something going there...
@@Solesteam the only problem I have with the cog is it would look to similar to the coin, however this could be avoided if they were different colors. I agree wheel is not good because of the empty space. I would suggest a 8 ray sun shape instead of the cog. It is different enough from the coin and a little easier to see then the cog.
technically speaking, the "major arcana" from tarot, tarock and tarocco decks (which are gaming cards first and foremost, divination came later) are already the fifth suit in french suited cards (french tarot uses french suits, as does the industrie und glück tarock deck, swiss 1JJ tarot uses italian suits, and tarocco siciliano uses Portuguese suits). To make them more balanced you can remove enough tarots/tarocks so there's as much tarots as cards per suit which might vary between the exact deck. also, the japanese unsun karuta (based on portuguese suited cards brought there by merchants) use portuguese suits and a fifth suit of empty coins, a derivative of the latin suit of coins.
On the subject of Japanese suits, hanafuda have twelve "suits,' each themed after a month and a flower or plant associated with that month. Each suit, however, contains a comparatively small four cards each, making the set four cards smaller than a Standard 52-Card deck. Despite it being somewhat antithetical to the month-theming, I am somewhat curious as to how a thirteenth suit might be arranged for hanafuda. I propose this question only because doing so would allow for a deck to be manufactured which could easily be used as either 52-card standard deck for, say, Poker or Black Jack, or a set of hanafuda (Alternatively, just lop off either Ace or King's to accomplish the same)
@@melvinshaw7574A double nine domino pack has 55 tiles, and those are occasionally manufactured in card form. There are a few games I play with friends that use 56 domino cards, with the double 12 card added in as a joker.
I feel like the fifth suit would either be a five pointed star, to simbolize faith, wonder and knowledge; or a water dropplet, to simbolize well... water, and is necessary for the other 4 suits to exist. They are both things that medieval people would know of and are simple to draw. The dropplet would be nice because hearts and spades are similar, but clubs and diamons aren't. So here comes the dropplet, it is pointed like a diamond and round like a club. If would also fit really well with the chinese elements, if you consider that hearts=fire (passion burns?); diamonds=earth (whats more valuable than land); clubs=wood; spades=metal; and dropplet=water. The star being faith and knowledge is also nice because for most of medieval history, only those in the church (or nobles) would have access to books, and stuff. If you imagine that hearts=health; spades=strength; clubs=prosperity; and diamonds=wealth; then knowledge or faith would also fit right in
I think a related subject could be when you assign unique colors to the existing french suits, for games where the suit really matters but not the matching colors, so you use a 4-color deck. I've seen green clubs and blue diamonds in poker shows. However, I kinda like the idea that "red" suits should be "warm" colors, and "black" suits should be "cool" colors. I've been playing Balatro with high contrast deck, which has blue clubs and yellow diamonds.
I personally like the shields and cups. I think they fit in well, given that they draw from similarities between other suits of their respective colors (shields has a pointed bottom like hearts and diamonds, cups have a tail like clubs and spades)
One huge problem I have with it is the theming between them as Shields fit more with clubs and Spades and cups fit more with the Indulgence of love and wealth
@@RakoonCD I personally feel the opposite. Cups or chalices make me think of greed and gluttony, while the protection of shields feels closer to love and prosperity. But both can be interpreted both ways, so I think they actually have a nice unifying factor.
@@tycho25 definitely, I think those designs are the best we can physically get. I tried designing some more but it kept coming back to those 6 designs. Really, the best we can do now are crosses and circles.
In Argentina we still use the "Tarot" suits to play certain card games (the most famous one being Truco) Clubs = Basto, Coin = Oro, Swords = Espada and Cups = Copa
I've seen some video games toy with this idea recently. In "Dungeons and Degenerate Gamblers", in which the suits give special rewards like coins, defense, health, and attack, there is also the Nothing suit, which is a black circle and gives no bonus. Additionally, there is the Wild suit, which is all four suits mashed into four quadrants and gives all bonuses at once. It's not really elegant, but at least the messaging is clear.
I would go with Stars and Roses. Stars as you described them earlier and Roses as 5 crescents curving into a shared point. The Black Suits share bases, the Red Suits share simplicity, and the stars and Roses are both Radially symmetrical
My ideas for new suits are as follows: Planet (or Saturn) paired with star, both represent not only faith, as most gods of older religions (talking Nordic, Greek, and the like) were named after the planets, as well as the star being similar to the star of David, as well as being able to be represented by any number of points between 3 and 9 without looking cluttered, could also be a stand in for the cross, as others have pointed out, but both also represent our future, as we look towards conquering the stars and colonizing new planets. If I were to give a color to these, I would give yellow, gold, or orange. Grapes and cups, cups could represent wealth, as you stated in your video, but it could also mean extravagance, especially if paired with the grapes from before. Wine was a popular drink of not just royals, but of commoners as well, but grape wine was usually resaved for the upper echelon of society. Grapes are commonly shown as the snacking choice of royals and gods, both now with tv and movies, but also in some older paintings of gods as well. So it could also represent royalty, or the upper echelon. The color I would give this suit is magenta, because it's light enough to be different from black, while also being clearly a different color than just light grey.
My four ideas next suits would be would be ⭐️Stars (5 point star), ⌛️Logs (Hourglass shape, aka log glass), ⚡️Bolts (standard lightning bolts) and 🎵 Notes. The first two being navigation-esque and the latter two being energy -esque. I could swap notes for 🔔 bells as it is also a good shape
Heraldry has several familiar shapes that commonly appear in patterns: beside diamonds and hearts, there are stars, crescents, discs (and rings), mascles (hollow diamonds), drops of liquid, fleurs de lis, martlets (little birds) …
I think the shape itself can be relatively abstract, meanwhile the vaguely associated name can have a strong literal meaning that helps people remember what the shape is called That’s part of why I think stars work so well. If you look at a literal star, it just looks like a speck in the sky. Or a large flaming ball. But the shape is associated in a very similar way to a “heart” or a “diamond” which all look nothing like their object counterpart
I disagree I think ♥️ does look like a human heart, it even has the two halves. Look at depictions of the sacred heart of Jesus and you can easily see the derivation. It's probably exactly what I would draw if asked to come up with a simplified human heart. I think people are just thrown off because of images that include the connected blood vessles. And diamonds can be any number of shapes, and there is a cut called a lozenge which is explicitly this shape♦️. And the NATURAL structure of a diamond is octahedral, and octahedrons DO have a ♦️ shaped shaped silhouette. I just looked this up now, but apparently in Europe before the late middle ages, diamonds were ALWAYS used in their natural octahedral state without any fancy cuts.
There is something else in common that I didn't see truly emphasized. The suits of a specific color have traits in common. The black spades and clubs have the tails or bases on the bottom. The red hearts and diamonds both have a point on the bottom. These are opposites of each other but also are specifically on the same side of the suit symbol. If I added a 5th and 6th suit, I'd either tie them into the patterns of red and black or create a new color and pair of symbols that contrast to this existing pattern. The latter seems the harder option though.
fun fact (an obscure one) a little minigame in Super Mario Party; Suit Yourselves is related to playing cards, but only the suits. The object of the game is that all cards are flipped over all members must find a card that has the target suit. two new suits are added in the game, and for what I know are never the target suit. these are a triangle (red) and a square (black)
Tears, Clouds, Points, and Coins. For the base shapes. Star too. and Hives for hexes. Fun stuff. Cross works. I also like suitless void card idea. Full house of voids sounds like a strong hand. Shields is nice.
Here's my idea, based on the original versions of the suits: Gold/yellow: -Stars/pentacles -Cups Silver/gray: -Swords -Shields Gold can be sorted with red and silver with black. The design of the cup is just a shield with a base, so there is a connection. (They might have a concave top, if diamonds are concave instead of straight.) Pentacles might be circles with a hole in the shape of a star, but that would break one of the rules. The swords would look like the flower/cross but with a longer and pointed top (or bottom).
I feel like the hourglass shape is a prime candidate for a cards suit, if you fill it in it's a recognizable shape, simple to draw. I'd say it pairs well with the stars suit for a complete gold set. Plus you could dive deep into the meaning of it with "the passage of time" or something like that, which also pairs well with stars for "exploration" or "the unknown".
Halfway through the video I thought of 2 possible pips that might actually work for a fifth and sixth suit: So you got the standard Clubs, Diams, Hearts, and Spades. Then what I thought of was Stars and Fleur-de-lis. Stars would be a red suit symbolizing Wisdom or Prosperity, Fleur-de-lis would be a black suit symbolizing Nature and Peace (the calm before the storm mayhaps) Idk just food for thought. Great video!
@10:13-.-Red stars, Black shields, Red bells (Just a circle with an extra line added), Black spears, Blue drops (doesn’t really fit into red or black), Red cups, Red triangles (invoking fire), Red pine tree, Red cross, Blue wheel.
When I conceived additional suits, my first instinct was stars, moons, Crowns, and shields (5 point star, a crescent, a cartoon crown similar to that of King K Rool, and shield designs similar to those shown in the video. At one point I wanted more Unique pips, so I did suns, mushrooms, tears, and bows.
I can’t believe I haven’t seen a mention of the 8 suited Heckadeack with the standard Hearts, Diamonds, Clubs and Spades but also swords, clouds, acorns and planets
Heckadeck didn't really get a lot of traction, even when it wound up at Barnes and Noble. It's a little too cartoony, I think. Plus it has extra cards that are weird or borderline useless, which more to ask of people who will already be thrown sideways by the new ranks and suits.
I know I'm super late to this video but I thought of four suits for a horror themed deck for fun. Skulls, a skull shape is fairly complicated but can be simplified and is easily recognisable. knives, might need to be stylised a bit but you could simplify them into being a pointed cross with a short bottom point. Blood, a teardrop shape but since it's a red suit everyone would associate it with blood. I couldn't really think of a fourth suit, I tossed around ideas like fangs or bones or even graves but I couldn't decide.
Not sure why youtube is bumping this _now_ but hey, good video, can't complain :) One could have very reasonably repurposed "eagles" as a Suit of Birds. A black semicircle with a triangle tip at the top, maybe a base for a tail if you're feeling fancy. It's not much more abstract than the "spade", which I still have trouble seeing as anything but "black upside down heart" to this day :P
I saw this on r/playingcards:eight suits deck with added blue four leaf clovers(for clubs) and cups,yellow four pointed stars(for diamonds) and shields plus the traditional black spades and trefoil shaped hammers,red hearts and lozenges(tall diamonds),of which each color's latter was demolished in my version in favor of blue clubs and yellow diamonds The cup suit is derived from spades and the shield suit is derived from hearts
There's another aspect of the four suits: numbers. When you see a diamond the number 4 pops up for the 4 sides/ points. A club brings to mind 3 for the 3 "petals" or leaves. A heart has two lobes that come to two points. And the Spade is a bit like a stylized 1. Naturally the five-pointed star for the 5th suit would make sense. The "Blue Cross" has 6 arms, so maybe a 6-armed cross for a 6th suit. Higher numbers would inherently be more difficult to design, especially for odd numbers.
Stars. The game of setup has 80 tiles/cards(2x 40 cards) Ranked 1 to 8 Suits:spades(black),clovers(purple),stars(yellow),hearts(red) and diamonds(cyan) Alignment chart: Evil(Spade) Neutral(Heart Star) Good(Diamond Clover)
Here's My Idea of a Five Set Card Suit: Black Side: ♤The Spade of Power ♧The Clover of Luck ⛨The Shield of Perseverence Red Side: ♡The Heart of Love ◇The Diamond of Wealth ☆The Star of Hope
I need to comment that the original 4 suits have a function to display ranking as well: the correct order is Spade, Heart, Club, then diamond. The spade has a single point on top, so it represents the 1st rank. The next is 2 bumps for the heart, 3 leaves for the clover, and 4 corners in the diamond. So a 5-pointed star and a 6-handled wheel makes a perfect use of the ranking as well. Those have always had my vote.
Great video! I love playing cards and they're one of my favourite sort of things to collect and research but interestingly I've never come across the idea of adding additional suits (outside of the Tarot's line of trumps) to the game. If I had to come up with new suits and still try to keep things nice and balanced, I'd go for golden stars and wheels to get sort of a heavenly feel with images that also relate to and mirror each other within their colour. And since I very much like the four-point balance of the traditional suits, I might just go ahead and add two more - crowns and shields in green :)
I like expanded/extended playing card decks a lot, because I always prefer to have a less regular thing in card decks. The more suits and ranks it has, and maybe some suit pairing systems (for games like an extended-like game of super solitaire), the more I like them. Unfortunately, in most cases these decks of cards are only designed for players to invent their own games or to play commercial card games with these cards instead. I'd like to see some sets of rules for extended versions of existing card games or new card game ideas included with these decks. I have a few Fat Pack playing card decks. I like the suit structure they created for these. The box actually implies/suggests which rank order the suits have if you're planning to play an 8 suited version of trick taking games like Bridge. Specifically Bridge has this ranking system for suits where Spades is highest, followed by Hearts, Diamonds and Clubs, in that order. The Fat Pack expands on that suggestion by the order printed on the box. The order here is Spades, Hearts, Diamonds, Clubs, Roses, Axes, Tridents and Doves. I understand the thematic meaning behind these suits. The red suits represent peace and love, while the black suits represent war and conflict. However, my personal preference would have been to replace Tridents with Swords and rank the Swords higher than Axes. The Fat Pack is also very practical to play a 6-player version of Pachisi related games with cards instead of dice, such as the German game of DOG/DOG Royal, a commercial game called Sorry, the English game of Tock, the Scottish game of Stramash and the Dutch game of Keezen (a game most similar to Tock, but with slightly different card effects and rules). These games usually come with regular playing cards, but for every player in the game a suit must be in the deck, which can be a small problem when separating cards that are not included, because there are double suit sets in a game with more than 4 players, and if 2 decks are included with the game, the card backs are often different, which is not recommended. The Fat Pack has no double sets of suits, so it solves that problem. Specifically for the official/original version Keezen there are board setups and rules for an odd number of players and it can even be played by up to 8 players. The Fat Pack is perfect for use with any player count. And you can play a few good versions of 8 suited solitaire with it. The only downside, in my my opinion is that the design on the card backs is asymmetric. I also have the 5 Crowns card game. I like it, but it's not very suitable to play other games with it, since this double deck is designed for the game in the box as it is. The card quality is okay, but could be better, in my opinion. Two other decks I have that have not been mentioned in this video are both pre-designed decks I ordered from a print studio's webstore, such as drivethrucards.com. The first one is the K6T Infinity deck, which comes with 234 cards containing 6 suits; Spades, Clubs, Hearts, Diamonds, Moons and 8 pointed Stars/Suns. Each suit has numbered ranks from 0 (can be treated as a Joker (either wild or suited) to 24, including a 1, two different versions (faces and chess pieces) of royal cards Jack, Cavelier, Bishop, Rook/Tower, Queen and King, an Ace and an Infinity. The other deck is the Badger Deck, including the extended ranks sets. It is a 321 card deck consisting of 10 suits; Spades, Hearts, Diamonds, Clubs, Moons, Stars, Flowers, Bats, Pyramids and Coins. Each suit has 32 ranks, except for the Coins, which have an extra unranked Pheonix card. These ranks are 0 to 20, including a 1, Fool, Monster, Sorceress, Wizard, Hero, Jack, Princess, Queen, King, Castle and Ace. The face cards in this deck have not been ranked in a specific order, because the designer wanted the players to have total freedom of ranking them themselves, since this is just a deck to play around with in any way they like. I particularly like the design of the cards. Each suit has its own theme. The face cards show characters linked to that theme; for example ancient Egyptians for the Pyramid suit and horror characters, such as a Dracula look-alike, for the Bat suit. The numbered cards are looking good as well, with an interesting twist. The cards ranked from 11 to 20 look like the cards ranked from 1 to 10, but with a big suit symbol on the background, which has a value of 10. For example, a 16 of Clubs looks like a 6 of Clubs with a lighter giant Club symbol in the background, so the 6 small Clubs worth 1 each plus the giant background Club worth 10 make it the 16 of Clubs. Allthough this deck was designed for any playtesting and experimental purposes, its use of artwork seems to be done for players for the game of Tichu deliberately (some of the 0 cards have pictures of animals/creatures from that game printed on them, and also the Pheonix seems to be made to play Tichu. There is actually a user on BGG that has invented a set of rules for a trick taking game he called All The King's Men, which uses 2 complete suit sets for each player in the game. I don't quite understand the scoring system, but it's amazing that someone actually tried to invent a game suitable for this giant deck of cards. There is a 120 card Rainbow expansion for this Badger Deck which I don't have, but this adds 120 suitless cards ranked from 1 to 120. I wasn't interested in that expansion, so I didn't get it. The biggest deck of cards that exists, in terms of the number of different cards you can get for it, is the Singularity Deck. I don't have it myself, but if you're interested, search for it on Google.
That’s a really interesting batch of decks you hit on here. Enjoyed reading. If you’re looking for a game with an expanded suit list and a designated way to play, I’ll recommend the Battle 54 game I touched on in this video’s end. Diceratops hasn’t done much advertising for it lately, but there is a full rule set online, a playable version on tabletop simulator on Steam, and a discord with people who play and talk about it. Highly recommend you check it out! linktr.ee/diceratopsgames
The star has always struck me as a great fifth playing card suit, but after thinking about what its symbolism I think an Eye symbol could potentially also work, and could be in the same gold coloring to make an even color spread.
Both black suits feature a flat base. Both red suits feature a pointed base. Diamonds feature no rounded bumps, hearts feature 2 bumps, spades feature 2 bumps and a base, clubs feature 3 bumps and a base. If you where to make a new red suit, it should start from a pointed base and have either 1 or 3 bumps. So something like a tear drop or a flower. A new black suit should have a flat base with either 1 or 4 bumps. Or maybe even inverted bumps, like a trident, but a simplified version kind of similar to the insignia of the Rebel Alliance from Star Wars.
The red/black split is more recent, but the juxtaposition of swords/spades and clubs against cups/hearts and coins/diamonds is older - the swords and clubs were the "masculine" suits, and the cups and coins were feminine. This also has to do with elemental associations - coins as earth, cups as water, clubs as fire, and swords as air.
Here’s my idea for a 6-suit based on patterns i saw in the original suits. For red, crescents, a crescent (🌙) with the fat side facing down. A symbol with religious and spiritual connections and meaning in the times when the original four were born. For black, the arrow, which is a dart (the polygon) with the same tail that spades and clubs have. This is simple and represents arrows as a weapon and more metaphorically precision.
Red also has to do with Blood and War. An eclipse, which classically has been considered a bad omen for many years. We could also bring up Wizards of the Coast and how they made Magic the Gathering and how they made their own suits. Based on a simple scheme of Green, Black, Red, Blue, White. I intentionally am ignoring Pokemon because they keep adding new suits.
Estate uses a 50 card deck with two jokers and 12 ranks:A23456789X(ten)F(queen)M(king) It uses dark blue clubs and orange diamonds The extended version adds green moons to the usual deck(total:62 cards)
Lines: Heart(2 curved sides):2 Diam(4 corners):4 Spade(flipped heart and base):4 Club(4 leaves and base):6 My deck's clubs use a four leaf design instead of the traditional three,the bases are T shaped
Before the clubs were a club (or a wand or a baton, or whatever other name you may have seen in tarot decks) they were polo sticks. As polo was not yet a well known sport in Europe when the suits came over they went through a variety of different stick like names
(Yes i know its an old video but i still enjoy the thought exercise) You could bring back a simplified shield pattern with two downward arches that connect at a point beneath them and call them crests or sigils. Like the patterns found on family crests&signet rings. For a secondary suit to add with them two horizontal flat lines connected by two curved lines could become scrolls or tapestries.
this was something i had a long think about a while ago, but i wanted to go deeper than simply 'what pips do i use, and what are they called', i wanted an idea of what their invented history would be as i felt that would help create something that fit relatively naturally, so i created groups each consisting of a pip, an artifact, an element, and a flora, bearing in mind existing connections, and ended up with: ♠ - Spades - Swords - Air - Leaves ♥ - Hearts - Cups - Water - can't remember what this was, suggestions welcome ♣ - Clubs - Wands - Aether - Clovers ♦ - Diamonds - Coins - Earth - Acorns ⚜ - Flowers - Bows - Fire - Lillies i think i futzed with the elements a little, pretty sure fire is usually assosiated with clubs, but as i was introducing aether, a more "mystical" element, i felt it better suited wands my choice for the fifth suite was made for two main reasons, bows feel like a natural fit in the 'artifact' section being another common and recognizable medieval item, and the Fleur de Lis has a shape that is unique, but still vaguely evokes the club, having three protrusions and a foot. it also has a similar overall shape to a bow with a knocked arrow which ties pip and artifact together quite nicely. bows also sit between the fighting and pleasure dichotomy, being used for both war and hunting the idea for this was to make a commically large Tarot deck, including every card i could find any shred of historical precedence for in basically any tarot/playing card style deck which led to suites of twenty cards each which ran something like: 1/A, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, Maid, Page, Lady, Knight, Duchess, Duke, Princess, Prince, Queen, King
Obviously if we want eight suits we should go with the Lucky Charms list: hearts, stars, horseshoes, clovers, moons, pots of gold, rainbows, and balloons.
Looney Labs of Fluxx fame sell a five-suited deck of square cards called the Zark City Deck where the fifth suit is stars. Also to note is the Everdeck, which has eight suits. The usual four, blue stars and moons, and yellow crowns and coins.
Battle fifty four, eh? A Battle with 54 cards, as in the full deck plus jokers eh? Making a card game is difficult, I've tried it- I hope for your sake it turns out good
The comprehensive rules are kinda wild. Got the chance to run through the prototype manual for them, and there tends to be spots that need hammering out in terms of complexity and weird fringe cases, but I think it'll turn out cool! Wouldn't be surprised if it becomes a kickstarter in a few years, the guys that have been developing it have been putting in a lot of effort.
6:21 "With coins otherwise called Pentacles for Italian versions." Italians call the suit of coins 'Denari,' as far as I can find. Pentacles are a 20th century English suit, designed for the Rider - Waite divination deck. This is the Tarot deck you showed in the video, and it features elaborate occult-themed illustrations by Pamela Colman Smith. It also has nothing to do with Italy other than being a descendant of Italian Tarot decks, which were designed for games and look completely different.
I had no idea that any of those others outside of hearts, diamonds, clubs, and spades had ever been a thing. Never heard any of the history of cards before this. Anyway, I like the image that pops up throughout this video of the 4 suits in off standard colors (well, 3 of the 4 are off standard) so that they're all different from each other. I've never really been one to get too into any card games to begin with anyway but on the rare occasions when I have played them for a bit it's always seemed really strange to me how two of the suits are red and two of them are black. It's just awkward. So seeing something like the dark red diamond, light blue club, red heart, and dark blue spade here feels much more visually appealing to me. That thought kinda inspires me to want to see something based off of stereotypical videogame / RPG elemental theming. Sooo... Let's say for example that you've got a deck with red flames (flame shape), blue droplets (teardrop shape), teal gusts (swirl shape), brown stones (lumpy circle shape.. or it could be mountains instead I guess), green trees (pine tree shape), yellow suns (sun shape), and purple moons (crescent moon shape). Some games might specify that you exclude all of the trees, and then the rules are set up in a way where flame beats droplet / droplet beats flame and also gust beats stone / stone beats gust and also sun beats moon / moon beats sun. (It's a game of opposites. Everything is strong against its opposite but also weak against its opposite as well.) Some games might specify that you exclude suns, moons, and stones, and then the rules are set up in a way where droplet beats flame, flame beats gust, gust beats tree, and tree beats droplet. (Circle of advantages.) Some games might specify that you exclude suns and moons, and then the rules are set up in a way where some sort of rock-paper-scissors-lizard-spock type of associations exist between flames, droplets, gusts, stones, and trees. (Web of advantages.) Some games might allow all seven suits and use sun/moon as opposites on top of having the others working in a 5-way web. Or using sun/moon as opposites while one of the others is excluded and the remaining four work in a circle. The elemental rules you select would form the foundation that other rules could be built on top of. I'd imagine that people could build up a ton of different games around such a deck.
The fleur-de-lis (I think I spelled that right) would pair nicely clad in gold with the star Nothing too complex a shape if you use the simplified version, and both it and the star are most widely shown as gold or yellow
Huh...I just got this as a recommend and I rather enjoyed it! BTW...allow me to add another deck to the 8-suited lot as one deck was released after this video was. I recently picked up something called "Heckadeck", which is a HUGE deck of playing cards complete with a bunch of games that can be played with them. The deck adds four new suits: Blue Knives and Clouds, and Green Acorns and Planets. They also went kinda crazygonuts with the additional cards they added. The suited cards have the usual 13 but also have a 0, 11, and Beast for each suit as well. There are also two suited cards called Hunters and Travellers...four Jokers, one for each color, eight cards each called Arrows and Talismans, two of each for each color...three non-suited cards called the Darkness, the Conjurer, and the Omnihedron...and finally a card called the Watcher that represents all eight suits. There is also a blank card that can used for whatever the user wants it to be as well as a card that MUST BE DESTROYED! (That last one I think was just added for a cheap way to generate social media traffic as they want you to document its destruction on social media, complete with a hashtag.)
My thought was flags. Like little wavy rectangles. Going off of the themes of war/luck vs. love/wealth, I figured a flag is kinda a symbolic transition point. Flags are the harbingers of war, but also communicate unity or loyalty to a people/cause
An idea I always had was the Cat and the Fork. The cat would be a red suit, borrowing the pointed base from hearts and diamonds, with the top being a concave angle. It would be 6 straight line segments The fork would be a black suit, and use the top from the cat and the base from the club/spade
I think the best additions would be black coins and red stars. They are both easily recognizable and simple to draw (the coin just being a circle or oval). They both follow the trend of having a number attached, as pointed out by someone else in the comments (coin is zero and star is five). The coin could represent economy, control, and society while the star could represent magics, hope, and guidance.
An alternative to the no holes rule is that you're allowed to have holes into your new suits, _but_ the catch is that the next 3 suits will have to do the same so that they'd be grouped into a new quadruplet like the original 4 with none whatsoever
![โรงเรียนห้ามรัก โดนจับได้ตาย...!! [เอิร์นไดเม่]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4u02Sbr556Q/mqdefault.jpg)
keep forgetting this is a small channel, and im convinced im watching a 100k+ youtuber
Thx TH-cam for randomly recommending me a 3 year old video, I thoroughly enjoyed it!
Fr TH-cam recommendations be digging out bangers out of nowhere
@@seandorama5932 me too lol
Holy shit you too
@@jjrobotnik what happening
@@seandorama5932ayoooo me too
Hearts: symbolize love
Spades: symbolize war and/or physical power
Clubs: symbolize luck and/or happiness
Diamonds: symbolize wealth
My ideas
Cogs: To symbolize reason
Crowns: To symbolize Power of control
Scale or a part of a scale: To symbolize morality
Stars: To symbolize faith as they kinda fall in between a cross and David's star (so it can symbolize any type of faith, not just Christianity)
Not to mention the symbol of Islam is a crescent moon with a star
⁰0zzno
Cogs, crowns, stars, all good ideas, just like shields, cups, and towers. These symbols have the same solidity and simplicity as the current four.
The scale is perhaps not simple enough as a card symbol.
The eagle, racket, and wheel symbols in the video do not work for that same reason, I think.
Stars also are associated with the ever-burning same-named fireballs of space for people who prefer the big bang.
@@Ploskkky If the scale is a semicircle with 2 lines it might work, but then the empty space issue is still there. and the cog would have to have no more than 5 teeth and no inside before things fall into the complexity issue. Maybe if its a 5 toothed cog it can be in the same color as the star. Though crowns aren't a very universal concept and are often associated less with control and more with the past now a-days while cogs are still used in modern machinery...
Black suits: Spades/Pikes ♠️ & Clubs/Clovers ♣️
Red suits: Diamonds ♦️ & Hearts ♥️
Blue suits: Stars ☆ & Moons/Crescents🌙
ooh yeah that seems good!!
Something something invent homestuck again.
I really like this as Stars just by themselves feel out of place, but with both Stars and Moons, you can do all sorts of shenanigans with cosmological/astrological symbolism.
BALATRO REFERENCE? 🃏
That's great, but maybe yellow would look better on 🌙 and ⭐️ than blue
There are an extremely small number of TH-cam channels that I actively go out of my way to make time to watch when I see they've uploaded. This channel is one of them.
Aww, Thank you!
One of my many personal grab-bag of half-finished game design projects was a playing-card-based RPG, with four stats based on the standard suits:
♡ Hearts - Charisma, resolve
◇ Diamonds - Deception, conniving
♤ Spades - Working power, endurance
♧ Clubs - Brute strength, fighting capabilities
And four new suits that each mirrored the standard four:
¤ Mind - Intelligence, smarts (Mental compared to hearts' passion)
☆ Reserve - Willpower, resolve, as well as general magic stats (Calm and thoughtful, compared to diamonds' impulse)
➹ Arrow - Reflexes, dexterity (Quick and snappy, compared to spades' slow and steady)
⛨ Shield - Bulk, resistance (Defensive constitution, compared to clubs' offensive force)
I never got too far with designing it, but I like the suits that I came up with as nice counterparts to the originals.
I have also thought of tying card suits to RPG style stats, never had any actual projects use it though. I thought of hearts being HP and diamonds as defense while spades and clubs would be speed and power. I also thought of the idea of using the joker to represent all or any of those four stats. It would probably only work for a very minimalist type of game, it is just a bit limiting to have only four stats. I feel like there is also an issue of the stats not having enough intuitive association with their assigned card suit so it could end up feeling too forced and arbitrary. There is a lot of options for what type of stat you could assign to each suit.
I think that arrow is better represented with x, it's just flying away. Very simple and symmetrical
@@ryangosling239 Ooh, I like that! Makes it fit in much more nicely with the rest.
Castle Falkenstein used cards instead of dice.
@@francisherman8982 Oh sweet, never heard of that one! Looks pretty cool from what I can see of it
Obviously the next suits after the first 4 are cherry, strawberry, orange, apple, melon, Galaxian, bell, and finally key!
Underrated
@@AlbertoCiarrocca Thank you lmao
So many circles.... though strawberries aren't a bad idea... same for re-introducing the bell
Key isnt half bad really
Don't forget the Lock
There's also a numerical trend with certain parts of the suits:
Spade has 1 point
Heart has 2 lobes
Club has 3 leaves
Diamond has 4 points
And including the most common fifth suit, Star has 5 points.
As well as Stars, I have ideas for 4 further suits:
Flowers (6 petals, shaped like a cartoon version of a daisy, 6 petals arranged at intervals of 60 degrees around a circle)
Berries (7 round parts, shaped like 7 circles packed together into a hexagon shape (2 on top, 3 in middle, 2 on bottom), like a simplified representation of a blackberry/raspberry, and as such, could be black and/or red, or a new colour like purple in a multicolour deck)
Wheels (8 spokes/segments, shaped like a circle split into 8 sectors of 45 degrees each by 8 equidistant radii from the centre to the edge)
As for 9, that would get very complicated, unless you wanted to do something like a Triforce from The Legend of Zelda, for 3 x 3 = 9 (that said, you could have as many petals or as many spokes as you like on the flower or wheel). So I have decided to go the other way for my next suit: going below 1.
Coins have _0_ points, because they're round. To distinguish from Wheels, the other round suit (and from being just a plain circle), there could be a hole in the middle like in ancient Chinese coins.
Coins and wheels are round, and thus perfectly symmetrical, and flowers and berries are both based around a central circle with six surrounding parts in a hexagonal shape, so also symmetrical. Coins reference the old suit of coins/tarot suit of pentacles, flowers and berries are remisicent of the nature themed suits of old like leaves and acorns, and wheels, as well as appearing in this video, could be taken to represent travel, motion or even technology (and from there, exploration and conquest for the "black = war" thing)
waiting for negative points... /j
Replace the wheel with the cog (filled in to avoid empty center space) for the sake of it actually having more obvious and noticeable spokes and you have something going there...
@@Solesteam the only problem I have with the cog is it would look to similar to the coin, however this could be avoided if they were different colors. I agree wheel is not good because of the empty space. I would suggest a 8 ray sun shape instead of the cog. It is different enough from the coin and a little easier to see then the cog.
technically speaking, the "major arcana" from tarot, tarock and tarocco decks (which are gaming cards first and foremost, divination came later) are already the fifth suit in french suited cards (french tarot uses french suits, as does the industrie und glück tarock deck, swiss 1JJ tarot uses italian suits, and tarocco siciliano uses Portuguese suits). To make them more balanced you can remove enough tarots/tarocks so there's as much tarots as cards per suit which might vary between the exact deck.
also, the japanese unsun karuta (based on portuguese suited cards brought there by merchants) use portuguese suits and a fifth suit of empty coins, a derivative of the latin suit of coins.
On the subject of Japanese suits, hanafuda have twelve "suits,' each themed after a month and a flower or plant associated with that month. Each suit, however, contains a comparatively small four cards each, making the set four cards smaller than a Standard 52-Card deck. Despite it being somewhat antithetical to the month-theming, I am somewhat curious as to how a thirteenth suit might be arranged for hanafuda. I propose this question only because doing so would allow for a deck to be manufactured which could easily be used as either 52-card standard deck for, say, Poker or Black Jack, or a set of hanafuda (Alternatively, just lop off either Ace or King's to accomplish the same)
@@melvinshaw7574A double nine domino pack has 55 tiles, and those are occasionally manufactured in card form. There are a few games I play with friends that use 56 domino cards, with the double 12 card added in as a joker.
The "Major Arcana" are just called the Trump suit.
Most bicycle decks only used the fool card, called it joker, and give it with a star for the suit. Seems like star was the 5th suit all along.
Honestly, a Golden Star would be the best extra symbol, it is very simple to draw.
I think a yellow star would pair well with a yellow crown, with the crown being like being 3 curved spikes on a thin horizontal rectangle
I feel like the fifth suit would either be a five pointed star, to simbolize faith, wonder and knowledge; or a water dropplet, to simbolize well... water, and is necessary for the other 4 suits to exist. They are both things that medieval people would know of and are simple to draw.
The dropplet would be nice because hearts and spades are similar, but clubs and diamons aren't. So here comes the dropplet, it is pointed like a diamond and round like a club. If would also fit really well with the chinese elements, if you consider that hearts=fire (passion burns?); diamonds=earth (whats more valuable than land); clubs=wood; spades=metal; and dropplet=water.
The star being faith and knowledge is also nice because for most of medieval history, only those in the church (or nobles) would have access to books, and stuff. If you imagine that hearts=health; spades=strength; clubs=prosperity; and diamonds=wealth; then knowledge or faith would also fit right in
I think a related subject could be when you assign unique colors to the existing french suits, for games where the suit really matters but not the matching colors, so you use a 4-color deck. I've seen green clubs and blue diamonds in poker shows. However, I kinda like the idea that "red" suits should be "warm" colors, and "black" suits should be "cool" colors. I've been playing Balatro with high contrast deck, which has blue clubs and yellow diamonds.
Ah yes, the five suits:
Spades
Hearts
Clubs
Diamonds
And the original Starwalker
The cards are annoying him. He's the original Starwalker
These suits are *Pissing* me off
I hoped to see a deltarune reference in this comment section. Not disappointed 👍
These *Suits* are *Pissing* me off. I’m the original Starwalker
CHAOS, CHAOS!
I like how the bottoms of both black suits and both red suits are largely the same and i think any new additions should follow that pattern somehow
Heck yea, I've always noticed this and thought it could be used for a magic trick
I personally like the shields and cups. I think they fit in well, given that they draw from similarities between other suits of their respective colors (shields has a pointed bottom like hearts and diamonds, cups have a tail like clubs and spades)
One huge problem I have with it is the theming between them as Shields fit more with clubs and Spades and cups fit more with the Indulgence of love and wealth
@@RakoonCD I personally feel the opposite. Cups or chalices make me think of greed and gluttony, while the protection of shields feels closer to love and prosperity. But both can be interpreted both ways, so I think they actually have a nice unifying factor.
@@tycho25 definitely, I think those designs are the best we can physically get. I tried designing some more but it kept coming back to those 6 designs. Really, the best we can do now are crosses and circles.
Stars and shields would be good enough, just as long as the shield has six sides.
In Argentina we still use the "Tarot" suits to play certain card games (the most famous one being Truco) Clubs = Basto, Coin = Oro, Swords = Espada and Cups = Copa
is no one going to acknowledge the joker? it has a unique suit, after all.
Does it even have a suit?
@@tylerboothman4496 the suit is joker
A 1 card suit.... though it could be the return of the bell if someone made an entire 13 card suit of it....
Jokers are intended to be suitless
I've seen some video games toy with this idea recently. In "Dungeons and Degenerate Gamblers", in which the suits give special rewards like coins, defense, health, and attack, there is also the Nothing suit, which is a black circle and gives no bonus. Additionally, there is the Wild suit, which is all four suits mashed into four quadrants and gives all bonuses at once. It's not really elegant, but at least the messaging is clear.
This is going to go fucking wild in my Homestuck Fan comic lore.
I would go with Stars and Roses. Stars as you described them earlier and Roses as 5 crescents curving into a shared point. The Black Suits share bases, the Red Suits share simplicity, and the stars and Roses are both Radially symmetrical
My ideas for new suits are as follows:
Planet (or Saturn) paired with star, both represent not only faith, as most gods of older religions (talking Nordic, Greek, and the like) were named after the planets, as well as the star being similar to the star of David, as well as being able to be represented by any number of points between 3 and 9 without looking cluttered, could also be a stand in for the cross, as others have pointed out, but both also represent our future, as we look towards conquering the stars and colonizing new planets. If I were to give a color to these, I would give yellow, gold, or orange.
Grapes and cups, cups could represent wealth, as you stated in your video, but it could also mean extravagance, especially if paired with the grapes from before. Wine was a popular drink of not just royals, but of commoners as well, but grape wine was usually resaved for the upper echelon of society. Grapes are commonly shown as the snacking choice of royals and gods, both now with tv and movies, but also in some older paintings of gods as well. So it could also represent royalty, or the upper echelon. The color I would give this suit is magenta, because it's light enough to be different from black, while also being clearly a different color than just light grey.
Okay! Playing card suit centered video!
Time to sift through the comments to find the Homestuck
You, my friend HAVE BECOME THE HOMESTUCK
My four ideas next suits would be would be ⭐️Stars (5 point star), ⌛️Logs (Hourglass shape, aka log glass), ⚡️Bolts (standard lightning bolts) and 🎵 Notes. The first two being navigation-esque and the latter two being energy -esque.
I could swap notes for 🔔 bells as it is also a good shape
Heraldry has several familiar shapes that commonly appear in patterns: beside diamonds and hearts, there are stars, crescents, discs (and rings), mascles (hollow diamonds), drops of liquid, fleurs de lis, martlets (little birds) …
I absolutely LOVE the Five Crowns deck. The character designs are so cool. Played it a lot in middle school
God I love this channel so much.
1:55 "national flags" shows brazilian national and state flags
As a brazilian I'm gonna enjoy that small treat
I think the shape itself can be relatively abstract, meanwhile the vaguely associated name can have a strong literal meaning that helps people remember what the shape is called
That’s part of why I think stars work so well. If you look at a literal star, it just looks like a speck in the sky. Or a large flaming ball. But the shape is associated in a very similar way to a “heart” or a “diamond” which all look nothing like their object counterpart
I disagree I think ♥️ does look like a human heart, it even has the two halves. Look at depictions of the sacred heart of Jesus and you can easily see the derivation. It's probably exactly what I would draw if asked to come up with a simplified human heart. I think people are just thrown off because of images that include the connected blood vessles.
And diamonds can be any number of shapes, and there is a cut called a lozenge which is explicitly this shape♦️. And the NATURAL structure of a diamond is octahedral, and octahedrons DO have a ♦️ shaped shaped silhouette.
I just looked this up now, but apparently in Europe before the late middle ages, diamonds were ALWAYS used in their natural octahedral state without any fancy cuts.
10:00 oh this actually kinda explains kismesissitude and stuff
There is something else in common that I didn't see truly emphasized. The suits of a specific color have traits in common. The black spades and clubs have the tails or bases on the bottom. The red hearts and diamonds both have a point on the bottom. These are opposites of each other but also are specifically on the same side of the suit symbol. If I added a 5th and 6th suit, I'd either tie them into the patterns of red and black or create a new color and pair of symbols that contrast to this existing pattern. The latter seems the harder option though.
fun fact (an obscure one) a little minigame in Super Mario Party; Suit Yourselves is related to playing cards, but only the suits. The object of the game is that all cards are flipped over all members must find a card that has the target suit. two new suits are added in the game, and for what I know are never the target suit. these are a triangle (red) and a square (black)
Tears, Clouds, Points, and Coins. For the base shapes. Star too. and Hives for hexes. Fun stuff.
Cross works. I also like suitless void card idea. Full house of voids sounds like a strong hand. Shields is nice.
My eyes lit up when I heard Fossil Fighters music!!! Great video
as a playing card collector and a aspiring cardist this was a great video to randomly get recommended to me 3 years later
Here's my idea, based on the original versions of the suits:
Gold/yellow:
-Stars/pentacles
-Cups
Silver/gray:
-Swords
-Shields
Gold can be sorted with red and silver with black.
The design of the cup is just a shield with a base, so there is a connection. (They might have a concave top, if diamonds are concave instead of straight.)
Pentacles might be circles with a hole in the shape of a star, but that would break one of the rules.
The swords would look like the flower/cross but with a longer and pointed top (or bottom).
guys we should use stars to represent romance that doesn't fall into the four quadrants
I feel like the hourglass shape is a prime candidate for a cards suit, if you fill it in it's a recognizable shape, simple to draw. I'd say it pairs well with the stars suit for a complete gold set. Plus you could dive deep into the meaning of it with "the passage of time" or something like that, which also pairs well with stars for "exploration" or "the unknown".
Halfway through the video I thought of 2 possible pips that might actually work for a fifth and sixth suit:
So you got the standard Clubs, Diams, Hearts, and Spades.
Then what I thought of was Stars and Fleur-de-lis.
Stars would be a red suit symbolizing Wisdom or Prosperity, Fleur-de-lis would be a black suit symbolizing Nature and Peace (the calm before the storm mayhaps)
Idk just food for thought. Great video!
Cups and Shields is definitely my favorite iteration of 6 suits.
I came to your channel for the crazy destiny edit but stayed for these videos. Good work!
That one set with the star being both black and red was pretty cool.
wow , you answered my question... and then went back in time to answer it
5:05 i like these a lot. they fit very well with the original designs.
My homestuck brainrot saw the numbnail and thought this was about troll romance
@10:13-.-Red stars, Black shields, Red bells (Just a circle with an extra line added), Black spears, Blue drops (doesn’t really fit into red or black), Red cups, Red triangles (invoking fire), Red pine tree, Red cross, Blue wheel.
5:39 Fatpat cards
how about a sixth suit?
edit: I need to wait until the end before commenting
Lol
When I conceived additional suits, my first instinct was stars, moons, Crowns, and shields (5 point star, a crescent, a cartoon crown similar to that of King K Rool, and shield designs similar to those shown in the video. At one point I wanted more Unique pips, so I did suns, mushrooms, tears, and bows.
Diamonds and spades have similar tops so I did the same with the heart and club by changing the clubs design to four leaves(X shaped) lol
I can’t believe I haven’t seen a mention of the 8 suited Heckadeack with the standard Hearts, Diamonds, Clubs and Spades but also swords, clouds, acorns and planets
Heckadeck didn't really get a lot of traction, even when it wound up at Barnes and Noble. It's a little too cartoony, I think. Plus it has extra cards that are weird or borderline useless, which more to ask of people who will already be thrown sideways by the new ranks and suits.
I know I'm super late to this video but I thought of four suits for a horror themed deck for fun. Skulls, a skull shape is fairly complicated but can be simplified and is easily recognisable. knives, might need to be stylised a bit but you could simplify them into being a pointed cross with a short bottom point. Blood, a teardrop shape but since it's a red suit everyone would associate it with blood. I couldn't really think of a fourth suit, I tossed around ideas like fangs or bones or even graves but I couldn't decide.
maybe a witch’s hat or broomstick?
What about fish
Real
Thx you glad I wasn’t the only one who had this strange thought
One of the only good things iFunny has given me was your channel
Not sure why youtube is bumping this _now_ but hey, good video, can't complain :)
One could have very reasonably repurposed "eagles" as a Suit of Birds. A black semicircle with a triangle tip at the top, maybe a base for a tail if you're feeling fancy. It's not much more abstract than the "spade", which I still have trouble seeing as anything but "black upside down heart" to this day :P
I saw this on r/playingcards:eight suits deck with added blue four leaf clovers(for clubs) and cups,yellow four pointed stars(for diamonds) and shields plus the traditional black spades and trefoil shaped hammers,red hearts and lozenges(tall diamonds),of which each color's latter was demolished in my version in favor of blue clubs and yellow diamonds
The cup suit is derived from spades and the shield suit is derived from hearts
Cool video bro, i did some research into this a couple years ago.
As someone who has played alot of Twisted Wonderland and watched alot of Pretty Cure, I vote just making ace cards their own special suit
There's another aspect of the four suits: numbers. When you see a diamond the number 4 pops up for the 4 sides/ points. A club brings to mind 3 for the 3 "petals" or leaves. A heart has two lobes that come to two points. And the Spade is a bit like a stylized 1. Naturally the five-pointed star for the 5th suit would make sense. The "Blue Cross" has 6 arms, so maybe a 6-armed cross for a 6th suit. Higher numbers would inherently be more difficult to design, especially for odd numbers.
The Soviet deck uses hammer and sickle for clubs,flags for spades,stars for diamonds and fists for hearts
Stars.
The game of setup has 80 tiles/cards(2x 40 cards)
Ranked 1 to 8
Suits:spades(black),clovers(purple),stars(yellow),hearts(red) and diamonds(cyan)
Alignment chart:
Evil(Spade)
Neutral(Heart Star)
Good(Diamond Clover)
I am quite an avid card fan so this video was super interesting!
Mario=Spade
Mallow=Club
Peach=Heart
Bowser=Diamond
Geno=Star
my exact thought lol
Very interesting video! You've got yourself a new subscriber 😊
Here's My Idea of a Five Set Card Suit:
Black Side:
♤The Spade of Power
♧The Clover of Luck
⛨The Shield of Perseverence
Red Side:
♡The Heart of Love
◇The Diamond of Wealth
☆The Star of Hope
I need to comment that the original 4 suits have a function to display ranking as well: the correct order is Spade, Heart, Club, then diamond. The spade has a single point on top, so it represents the 1st rank. The next is 2 bumps for the heart, 3 leaves for the clover, and 4 corners in the diamond. So a 5-pointed star and a 6-handled wheel makes a perfect use of the ranking as well. Those have always had my vote.
Great video! I love playing cards and they're one of my favourite sort of things to collect and research but interestingly I've never come across the idea of adding additional suits (outside of the Tarot's line of trumps) to the game. If I had to come up with new suits and still try to keep things nice and balanced, I'd go for golden stars and wheels to get sort of a heavenly feel with images that also relate to and mirror each other within their colour. And since I very much like the four-point balance of the traditional suits, I might just go ahead and add two more - crowns and shields in green :)
I like expanded/extended playing card decks a lot, because I always prefer to have a less regular thing in card decks. The more suits and ranks it has, and maybe some suit pairing systems (for games like an extended-like game of super solitaire), the more I like them. Unfortunately, in most cases these decks of cards are only designed for players to invent their own games or to play commercial card games with these cards instead. I'd like to see some sets of rules for extended versions of existing card games or new card game ideas included with these decks.
I have a few Fat Pack playing card decks. I like the suit structure they created for these. The box actually implies/suggests which rank order the suits have if you're planning to play an 8 suited version of trick taking games like Bridge. Specifically Bridge has this ranking system for suits where Spades is highest, followed by Hearts, Diamonds and Clubs, in that order. The Fat Pack expands on that suggestion by the order printed on the box. The order here is Spades, Hearts, Diamonds, Clubs, Roses, Axes, Tridents and Doves. I understand the thematic meaning behind these suits. The red suits represent peace and love, while the black suits represent war and conflict. However, my personal preference would have been to replace Tridents with Swords and rank the Swords higher than Axes. The Fat Pack is also very practical to play a 6-player version of Pachisi related games with cards instead of dice, such as the German game of DOG/DOG Royal, a commercial game called Sorry, the English game of Tock, the Scottish game of Stramash and the Dutch game of Keezen (a game most similar to Tock, but with slightly different card effects and rules). These games usually come with regular playing cards, but for every player in the game a suit must be in the deck, which can be a small problem when separating cards that are not included, because there are double suit sets in a game with more than 4 players, and if 2 decks are included with the game, the card backs are often different, which is not recommended. The Fat Pack has no double sets of suits, so it solves that problem. Specifically for the official/original version Keezen there are board setups and rules for an odd number of players and it can even be played by up to 8 players. The Fat Pack is perfect for use with any player count. And you can play a few good versions of 8 suited solitaire with it. The only downside, in my my opinion is that the design on the card backs is asymmetric.
I also have the 5 Crowns card game. I like it, but it's not very suitable to play other games with it, since this double deck is designed for the game in the box as it is. The card quality is okay, but could be better, in my opinion.
Two other decks I have that have not been mentioned in this video are both pre-designed decks I ordered from a print studio's webstore, such as drivethrucards.com.
The first one is the K6T Infinity deck, which comes with 234 cards containing 6 suits; Spades, Clubs, Hearts, Diamonds, Moons and 8 pointed Stars/Suns. Each suit has numbered ranks from 0 (can be treated as a Joker (either wild or suited) to 24, including a 1, two different versions (faces and chess pieces) of royal cards Jack, Cavelier, Bishop, Rook/Tower, Queen and King, an Ace and an Infinity.
The other deck is the Badger Deck, including the extended ranks sets. It is a 321 card deck consisting of 10 suits; Spades, Hearts, Diamonds, Clubs, Moons, Stars, Flowers, Bats, Pyramids and Coins. Each suit has 32 ranks, except for the Coins, which have an extra unranked Pheonix card. These ranks are 0 to 20, including a 1, Fool, Monster, Sorceress, Wizard, Hero, Jack, Princess, Queen, King, Castle and Ace. The face cards in this deck have not been ranked in a specific order, because the designer wanted the players to have total freedom of ranking them themselves, since this is just a deck to play around with in any way they like. I particularly like the design of the cards. Each suit has its own theme. The face cards show characters linked to that theme; for example ancient Egyptians for the Pyramid suit and horror characters, such as a Dracula look-alike, for the Bat suit. The numbered cards are looking good as well, with an interesting twist. The cards ranked from 11 to 20 look like the cards ranked from 1 to 10, but with a big suit symbol on the background, which has a value of 10. For example, a 16 of Clubs looks like a 6 of Clubs with a lighter giant Club symbol in the background, so the 6 small Clubs worth 1 each plus the giant background Club worth 10 make it the 16 of Clubs. Allthough this deck was designed for any playtesting and experimental purposes, its use of artwork seems to be done for players for the game of Tichu deliberately (some of the 0 cards have pictures of animals/creatures from that game printed on them, and also the Pheonix seems to be made to play Tichu. There is actually a user on BGG that has invented a set of rules for a trick taking game he called All The King's Men, which uses 2 complete suit sets for each player in the game. I don't quite understand the scoring system, but it's amazing that someone actually tried to invent a game suitable for this giant deck of cards. There is a 120 card Rainbow expansion for this Badger Deck which I don't have, but this adds 120 suitless cards ranked from 1 to 120. I wasn't interested in that expansion, so I didn't get it.
The biggest deck of cards that exists, in terms of the number of different cards you can get for it, is the Singularity Deck. I don't have it myself, but if you're interested, search for it on Google.
That’s a really interesting batch of decks you hit on here. Enjoyed reading. If you’re looking for a game with an expanded suit list and a designated way to play, I’ll recommend the Battle 54 game I touched on in this video’s end. Diceratops hasn’t done much advertising for it lately, but there is a full rule set online, a playable version on tabletop simulator on Steam, and a discord with people who play and talk about it. Highly recommend you check it out!
linktr.ee/diceratopsgames
The star has always struck me as a great fifth playing card suit, but after thinking about what its symbolism I think an Eye symbol could potentially also work, and could be in the same gold coloring to make an even color spread.
Both black suits feature a flat base.
Both red suits feature a pointed base.
Diamonds feature no rounded bumps, hearts feature 2 bumps, spades feature 2 bumps and a base, clubs feature 3 bumps and a base.
If you where to make a new red suit, it should start from a pointed base and have either 1 or 3 bumps. So something like a tear drop or a flower.
A new black suit should have a flat base with either 1 or 4 bumps. Or maybe even inverted bumps, like a trident, but a simplified version kind of similar to the insignia of the Rebel Alliance from Star Wars.
The red/black split is more recent, but the juxtaposition of swords/spades and clubs against cups/hearts and coins/diamonds is older - the swords and clubs were the "masculine" suits, and the cups and coins were feminine. This also has to do with elemental associations - coins as earth, cups as water, clubs as fire, and swords as air.
Here’s my idea for a 6-suit based on patterns i saw in the original suits.
For red, crescents, a crescent (🌙) with the fat side facing down. A symbol with religious and spiritual connections and meaning in the times when the original four were born.
For black, the arrow, which is a dart (the polygon) with the same tail that spades and clubs have. This is simple and represents arrows as a weapon and more metaphorically precision.
Your channel is amazing, i watch your vids to the end, its gud stuff. 😎
dont break the quadrants, we're not leprechauns
Red also has to do with Blood and War. An eclipse, which classically has been considered a bad omen for many years.
We could also bring up Wizards of the Coast and how they made Magic the Gathering and how they made their own suits. Based on a simple scheme of Green, Black, Red, Blue, White.
I intentionally am ignoring Pokemon because they keep adding new suits.
Are the colors in magic suits? That’s a really interesting question
I like how Balatro makes the hearts red, the clubs blue, the diamonds yellow, and the spades back
Estate uses a 50 card deck with two jokers and 12 ranks:A23456789X(ten)F(queen)M(king)
It uses dark blue clubs and orange diamonds
The extended version adds green moons to the usual deck(total:62 cards)
Lines:
Heart(2 curved sides):2
Diam(4 corners):4
Spade(flipped heart and base):4
Club(4 leaves and base):6
My deck's clubs use a four leaf design instead of the traditional three,the bases are T shaped
Some playing card decks use golden cups and coins,silver swords and batons in Southern Italy.
They use 32 cards
Rank order:as(1),2-7,fante(8)
I thought they use 40 Cards? With 32 Horse and King would be missing for each suit.
Before the clubs were a club (or a wand or a baton, or whatever other name you may have seen in tarot decks) they were polo sticks. As polo was not yet a well known sport in Europe when the suits came over they went through a variety of different stick like names
(Yes i know its an old video but i still enjoy the thought exercise)
You could bring back a simplified shield pattern with two downward arches that connect at a point beneath them and call them crests or sigils. Like the patterns found on family crests&signet rings.
For a secondary suit to add with them two horizontal flat lines connected by two curved lines could become scrolls or tapestries.
this was something i had a long think about a while ago, but i wanted to go deeper than simply 'what pips do i use, and what are they called', i wanted an idea of what their invented history would be as i felt that would help create something that fit relatively naturally, so i created groups each consisting of a pip, an artifact, an element, and a flora, bearing in mind existing connections, and ended up with:
♠ - Spades - Swords - Air - Leaves
♥ - Hearts - Cups - Water - can't remember what this was, suggestions welcome
♣ - Clubs - Wands - Aether - Clovers
♦ - Diamonds - Coins - Earth - Acorns
⚜ - Flowers - Bows - Fire - Lillies
i think i futzed with the elements a little, pretty sure fire is usually assosiated with clubs, but as i was introducing aether, a more "mystical" element, i felt it better suited wands
my choice for the fifth suite was made for two main reasons, bows feel like a natural fit in the 'artifact' section being another common and recognizable medieval item, and the Fleur de Lis has a shape that is unique, but still vaguely evokes the club, having three protrusions and a foot. it also has a similar overall shape to a bow with a knocked arrow which ties pip and artifact together quite nicely. bows also sit between the fighting and pleasure dichotomy, being used for both war and hunting
the idea for this was to make a commically large Tarot deck, including every card i could find any shred of historical precedence for in basically any tarot/playing card style deck which led to suites of twenty cards each which ran something like: 1/A, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, Maid, Page, Lady, Knight, Duchess, Duke, Princess, Prince, Queen, King
3:15 They didn't invent Monopoly, they stole it.
Also In typical American fashion
Obviously if we want eight suits we should go with the Lucky Charms list: hearts, stars, horseshoes, clovers, moons, pots of gold, rainbows, and balloons.
Looney Labs of Fluxx fame sell a five-suited deck of square cards called the Zark City Deck where the fifth suit is stars.
Also to note is the Everdeck, which has eight suits. The usual four, blue stars and moons, and yellow crowns and coins.
I don't know, I guess quadrant vacillation.
Battle fifty four, eh? A Battle with 54 cards, as in the full deck plus jokers eh? Making a card game is difficult, I've tried it- I hope for your sake it turns out good
The comprehensive rules are kinda wild. Got the chance to run through the prototype manual for them, and there tends to be spots that need hammering out in terms of complexity and weird fringe cases, but I think it'll turn out cool! Wouldn't be surprised if it becomes a kickstarter in a few years, the guys that have been developing it have been putting in a lot of effort.
6:21 "With coins otherwise called Pentacles for Italian versions." Italians call the suit of coins 'Denari,' as far as I can find.
Pentacles are a 20th century English suit, designed for the Rider - Waite divination deck. This is the Tarot deck you showed in the video, and it features elaborate occult-themed illustrations by Pamela Colman Smith. It also has nothing to do with Italy other than being a descendant of Italian Tarot decks, which were designed for games and look completely different.
I had no idea that any of those others outside of hearts, diamonds, clubs, and spades had ever been a thing. Never heard any of the history of cards before this.
Anyway, I like the image that pops up throughout this video of the 4 suits in off standard colors (well, 3 of the 4 are off standard) so that they're all different from each other. I've never really been one to get too into any card games to begin with anyway but on the rare occasions when I have played them for a bit it's always seemed really strange to me how two of the suits are red and two of them are black. It's just awkward. So seeing something like the dark red diamond, light blue club, red heart, and dark blue spade here feels much more visually appealing to me.
That thought kinda inspires me to want to see something based off of stereotypical videogame / RPG elemental theming. Sooo... Let's say for example that you've got a deck with red flames (flame shape), blue droplets (teardrop shape), teal gusts (swirl shape), brown stones (lumpy circle shape.. or it could be mountains instead I guess), green trees (pine tree shape), yellow suns (sun shape), and purple moons (crescent moon shape).
Some games might specify that you exclude all of the trees, and then the rules are set up in a way where flame beats droplet / droplet beats flame and also gust beats stone / stone beats gust and also sun beats moon / moon beats sun. (It's a game of opposites. Everything is strong against its opposite but also weak against its opposite as well.)
Some games might specify that you exclude suns, moons, and stones, and then the rules are set up in a way where droplet beats flame, flame beats gust, gust beats tree, and tree beats droplet. (Circle of advantages.)
Some games might specify that you exclude suns and moons, and then the rules are set up in a way where some sort of rock-paper-scissors-lizard-spock type of associations exist between flames, droplets, gusts, stones, and trees. (Web of advantages.)
Some games might allow all seven suits and use sun/moon as opposites on top of having the others working in a 5-way web.
Or using sun/moon as opposites while one of the others is excluded and the remaining four work in a circle.
The elemental rules you select would form the foundation that other rules could be built on top of. I'd imagine that people could build up a ton of different games around such a deck.
The fleur-de-lis (I think I spelled that right) would pair nicely clad in gold with the star
Nothing too complex a shape if you use the simplified version, and both it and the star are most widely shown as gold or yellow
How about an hourglass suit? Adds the element/concept of time.
Huh...I just got this as a recommend and I rather enjoyed it! BTW...allow me to add another deck to the 8-suited lot as one deck was released after this video was.
I recently picked up something called "Heckadeck", which is a HUGE deck of playing cards complete with a bunch of games that can be played with them. The deck adds four new suits: Blue Knives and Clouds, and Green Acorns and Planets. They also went kinda crazygonuts with the additional cards they added. The suited cards have the usual 13 but also have a 0, 11, and Beast for each suit as well. There are also two suited cards called Hunters and Travellers...four Jokers, one for each color, eight cards each called Arrows and Talismans, two of each for each color...three non-suited cards called the Darkness, the Conjurer, and the Omnihedron...and finally a card called the Watcher that represents all eight suits. There is also a blank card that can used for whatever the user wants it to be as well as a card that MUST BE DESTROYED! (That last one I think was just added for a cheap way to generate social media traffic as they want you to document its destruction on social media, complete with a hashtag.)
The fifth element is love
My thought was flags. Like little wavy rectangles.
Going off of the themes of war/luck vs. love/wealth, I figured a flag is kinda a symbolic transition point. Flags are the harbingers of war, but also communicate unity or loyalty to a people/cause
An idea I always had was the Cat and the Fork. The cat would be a red suit, borrowing the pointed base from hearts and diamonds, with the top being a concave angle. It would be 6 straight line segments
The fork would be a black suit, and use the top from the cat and the base from the club/spade
5:22 The cup and shield cards fit oddly well with the classic 4 as they follow the design shape trend of the heart and diamond vs the spade and club
I think the best additions would be black coins and red stars. They are both easily recognizable and simple to draw (the coin just being a circle or oval). They both follow the trend of having a number attached, as pointed out by someone else in the comments (coin is zero and star is five). The coin could represent economy, control, and society while the star could represent magics, hope, and guidance.
I have zero interest in playing cards but your videos are high quality so here I am
2:10 I knew this game would come up!
An alternative to the no holes rule is that you're allowed to have holes into your new suits, _but_ the catch is that the next 3 suits will have to do the same so that they'd be grouped into a new quadruplet like the original 4 with none whatsoever
UPDATE: Stardeck has teamed up with The Game Crafter, it’s now available again!