I'm more of a fan of the Ultimate 1541 which does most things the Chameleon does expect for the SuperCPU. The Chameleon is just too much for my needs and much more expensive then the U1541. In the end I want to extend my old C64 and not "replace" it by a powerful device like the Chameleon.
You forgot the Flash 8. It has a bad reputation, but I used it for years. Combined with a BBGRAM 2 MB, I had 3 MB in GEOS, enough for two RAM 1581. A CMD HD and a real 1581 made the system complete. Working with an 8 MHz GEOS system was a dream. Completely stable, with the original power supply. My Flash 8 is now working with 9 MHz and got a fast EEPROM instead of the slow original EPROM.
Thanks for your video! I'd love to see super CPU games, there were a few shoot'em ups and I heard that the test drive I and II games ran smoother on super CPU
The $D030 means to emulate the VIC-II Register to switch a C128 in C64-Mode in 2MHz Mode. With the module you can do this on a real C64 and not only on a C128 in C64 Mode.
Nice video as always - thx a lot! Since I am interested in both solutions and they are in a similar price range, I would be interested in a comparison between Gideon's Ultimate64 Elite board and the Turbo Chameleon. What are the differences and which solution is better for whom?
@@TheMcflyster Since I did not put the C64 core on there … which is why the thing wouldn‘t start in cart only mode … the answer is: it uses the real C64.
If you disable the feature to copy ROMs from the 64 it would have probably worked in cart mode. The TC takes over the duties of the 6510 and will run off its own ROM images. The VIC writes are just duplicated to the VGA piece, like its just snooping the registers sort of like the ultisid does on the UII+. I don't think it even uses the C64 clock. So yes, the C64 is basically a power supply and keyboard with I/O still available to run legacy hardware accessories.
The wiki says at least some variant of this was released in 2011. I wonder if there is something wrong with your cartridge that produces the extreme SD card problems because I'd hope they would have any SD card problems in the firmware fixed by now. Or did one of their recent firmware/core updates break it?
I actually talked to them and they pretty much said every card should work except for the mini cards with the adapters. Maybe I was just unlucky. It works now, but I was about to send it back. The other thing, that the TC2 won't start without a C64 may be my own fault. I might have to put the C64 core on there ... we will see in part 2.
I really don't see the point in having additional hardware specs on the Commodore 64. E.g. a faster processor, the whole point is to play games exactly as they were on the original hardware, if you want power just use a more modern computer. The most I'd do is use a 1541 floppy drive emulator that loads from SSD, but it would still be nice to have a real 1541 floppy drive too.
"Here is an emulator you can put into your c64 to emulate your c64!!!" Excuse me... what!?! :)) There are cheaper and better options to load software... If I'll need to emulate c64 I'll use a pc I'm typing this text right now:)
Maybe I missed it, but I see that the TC supports Turbo speeds, however where does it actually emulate an actual CMD SuperCPU? If it does, can you see about demonstrating it with something that requires the SuperCPU such as the SuperCPU Kicks demo, or even Metal Dust? As well, it would be interesting to see where you can set the memory for the SuperCPU ram (which is different than simply a large ram REU cart). Thanks!
That’s not correct. When running the TC64 FPGA core as a c64 expansion cartridge, it’s simulating(replicating) a turbo 6510 CPU. It’s not simulating the 16bit CPU (WDC 65C816S) that was used in the SuperCPU accelerator. Metal Dust is programmed to run on that CPU, not a regular 6510. From the iComp product page: “Turbo function with full 6510 processor compatibility (this includes all illegal opcodes!). For the first time, a C64 accelerator does not use a 16-bit processor, but an accelerated 6510. The "Synthmark" benchmark shows that the TC64 is even faster than the former champion, the SuperCPU (TC64 scores factor 9.78, the SCPU scores 5.48). Especially applications like Geos or Pagefox gain a lot of improved usability from this speed increase.”
Since I don't have a 1541 Ultimate and we have questions in the comments what the difference is. Can you elaborate on this? As far as I see the main difference is, that the 1541U can also emulate a 1571 and a 1581?! Anything else of importance? ... and yes, the price.
Don’t see the point of such a cartridge. It has nothing to do with a C64. You could just as well rip the motherboard out of your C64 and put a Raspberry Pi with a C64 emulator in it. It can do the same and more probably.
It uses all the hardware in the C64 except the CPU and the RAM. Video comes from the original VIC2, sound comes from the original SID, original keyboard and joystick ports work. So what is the problem here?
The FPGA includes VIC2, SID, keyboard, joystick and even mouse emulation. If you connect the cadrige to a C64, you can use the internal components in paralel. So except for the User-Port (and Datasette) the cadrige can do everything without any original C64. So "it uses all the hardware in the C64 exept..." is a bit backwards. It does not use all the hardware, it just can controll the hardware, using it as I/Os in parallel to the integrated ones in the FPGA. A "normal" cartridge is used by the C64. This cartridge optionally uses the C64, but does not even need it (exept if you want a user port or connect orginal floppy drives or datasette). It´s not about bad or good, it´s just a different philosopical approch. Many people into Retro Computing like to use the original C64 hardware, and expand it. The Chameleon is a very nice hardware - but more than an expansion. It can replace most of the C64 hardware. You do not even need the C64.
@@oleurgast730 The fact remains that SID, VIC etc. are used, only the 6510 and the RAM aren‘t. Each of those chips is normally controlled by the internal 6510. With the TC connected they are controlled from there. That‘s the same with the CMD SuperCPU, and I hear nobody complain about it there. The fact that the Chameleon has a standalone mode doesn‘t change the other facts. The fact that there are emulations of SID, VIC etc. running in parallel on that FPGA won‘t change that you use mostly original hardware if you use the C64‘s video and sound outputs, plugging joysticks into the C64‘s ports and use the C64 keyboard. Nobody forces you to connect a VGA monitor or use the internal floppy emulation.
Nein es gibt auch audio und Video wieder, der Sinn ist; die microelektronik ist relativ neu! Es ist halt eine schöne Retro Spielerei, mit dem Vorteil das es stereosids, pc waves, etc. und VGA wiedergeben kann auch wenn die alte c64 Hardware mal völlig den Geist aufgibt, funktioniert es tatelos auch als Standalone Gerät.....wenn es funktioniert 😂
I'm more of a fan of the Ultimate 1541 which does most things the Chameleon does expect for the SuperCPU. The Chameleon is just too much for my needs and much more expensive then the U1541.
In the end I want to extend my old C64 and not "replace" it by a powerful device like the Chameleon.
Exactly my feelings.
You forgot the Flash 8. It has a bad reputation, but I used it for years. Combined with a BBGRAM 2 MB, I had 3 MB in GEOS, enough for two RAM 1581. A CMD HD and a real 1581 made the system complete. Working with an 8 MHz GEOS system was a dream. Completely stable, with the original power supply. My Flash 8 is now working with 9 MHz and got a fast EEPROM instead of the slow original EPROM.
That is awesome. For VIC-20 check out the new VIC-20 Dual Serial Card.
When playing outrun the first time U was always in 1rst gear. Second time around U started on second gear.
Thanks for your video! I'd love to see super CPU games, there were a few shoot'em ups and I heard that the test drive I and II games ran smoother on super CPU
It is not compatible. It emulates an 8bit core
I have one, hardly ever used it though :D
The $D030 means to emulate the VIC-II Register to switch a C128 in C64-Mode in 2MHz Mode. With the module you can do this on a real C64 and not only on a C128 in C64 Mode.
Nice video as always - thx a lot! Since I am interested in both solutions and they are in a similar price range, I would be interested in a comparison between Gideon's Ultimate64 Elite board and the Turbo Chameleon. What are the differences and which solution is better for whom?
Thanks! Since I don't have one, I could only do a spec comparison.
If you want midi then this is not the only cart you will ever need.
I didn't try it for that. These ports are not supported yet, right? Anyway, for a C64 cartridge these ports seemed to me like an odd choice.
Cool! I have a question thou. Is the Chamelon just using the C64 power and keyboard and processing all data in its own core?
@@TheMcflyster Since I did not put the C64 core on there … which is why the thing wouldn‘t start in cart only mode … the answer is: it uses the real C64.
If you disable the feature to copy ROMs from the 64 it would have probably worked in cart mode. The TC takes over the duties of the 6510 and will run off its own ROM images. The VIC writes are just duplicated to the VGA piece, like its just snooping the registers sort of like the ultisid does on the UII+. I don't think it even uses the C64 clock. So yes, the C64 is basically a power supply and keyboard with I/O still available to run legacy hardware accessories.
Maybe it could accelerate GEOS enough to make it more usable.
Thanks for the video. I actually have two TC64 V2s myself. Why? Because I must have them :)
I see your reasoning there!
@@RetroWK Looking forward to more videos from you about the TC64 V2 😊
The wiki says at least some variant of this was released in 2011. I wonder if there is something wrong with your cartridge that produces the extreme SD card problems because I'd hope they would have any SD card problems in the firmware fixed by now. Or did one of their recent firmware/core updates break it?
I actually talked to them and they pretty much said every card should work except for the mini cards with the adapters. Maybe I was just unlucky. It works now, but I was about to send it back. The other thing, that the TC2 won't start without a C64 may be my own fault. I might have to put the C64 core on there ... we will see in part 2.
I really don't see the point in having additional hardware specs on the Commodore 64. E.g. a faster processor, the whole point is to play games exactly as they were on the original hardware, if you want power just use a more modern computer. The most I'd do is use a 1541 floppy drive emulator that loads from SSD, but it would still be nice to have a real 1541 floppy drive too.
I see you point. I am happiest with my bare breadbrin and a 1541 ratteling away.
However, price is insane.
you didn't even show that it can run many other cores (Amiga, PET, C16 and many more)
That's for part 2 or 3.
Kinda late, I‘d say. I got mine on release, like 13 years ago.
Mine got lost in the mail :-)
This gives 679 on a standard c64.
10ti$="000000"
20forx=0to10000:next
30?ti
Perhaps see how much faster things run that way.
The answer is 35!!!
"Here is an emulator you can put into your c64 to emulate your c64!!!" Excuse me... what!?! :))
There are cheaper and better options to load software... If I'll need to emulate c64 I'll use a pc I'm typing this text right now:)
Maybe I missed it, but I see that the TC supports Turbo speeds, however where does it actually emulate an actual CMD SuperCPU? If it does, can you see about demonstrating it with something that requires the SuperCPU such as the SuperCPU Kicks demo, or even Metal Dust? As well, it would be interesting to see where you can set the memory for the SuperCPU ram (which is different than simply a large ram REU cart). Thanks!
That’s not correct. When running the TC64 FPGA core as a c64 expansion cartridge, it’s simulating(replicating) a turbo 6510 CPU. It’s not simulating the 16bit CPU (WDC 65C816S) that was used in the SuperCPU accelerator. Metal Dust is programmed to run on that CPU, not a regular 6510.
From the iComp product page:
“Turbo function with full 6510 processor compatibility (this includes all illegal opcodes!). For the first time, a C64 accelerator does not use a 16-bit processor, but an accelerated 6510. The "Synthmark" benchmark shows that the TC64 is even faster than the former champion, the SuperCPU (TC64 scores factor 9.78, the SCPU scores 5.48). Especially applications like Geos or Pagefox gain a lot of improved usability from this speed increase.”
@@bruce_just_ I figured it didn't. Obviously the TH-cam video name is misleading as it does not do SuperCPU regrettably.
@@bobreid4858 Yeah, it's more like hitting the 2mhz register on a 128 in 64 mode.
NO!
Too expensive, too few functions.
It has nothing on the 1541Ultimate.
Since I don't have a 1541 Ultimate and we have questions in the comments what the difference is. Can you elaborate on this? As far as I see the main difference is, that the 1541U can also emulate a 1571 and a 1581?! Anything else of importance? ... and yes, the price.
Mit der maus...
and then we remove this in the trashcan😂
I wish in any next Video some about GEOS to see with Turbochameleon thanks....😮
And its possible with GEOS Megapatch ?
With Weels runs....i m read in the net......Danke so sorry for my bad english😥🤐
Ladies? That's not very nice.
Don’t see the point of such a cartridge. It has nothing to do with a C64. You could just as well rip the motherboard out of your C64 and put a Raspberry Pi with a C64 emulator in it. It can do the same and more probably.
Unless you want to use the Userport to connect something like the old Fischertechnik interface, you are right.
It uses all the hardware in the C64 except the CPU and the RAM. Video comes from the original VIC2, sound comes from the original SID, original keyboard and joystick ports work. So what is the problem here?
The FPGA includes VIC2, SID, keyboard, joystick and even mouse emulation. If you connect the cadrige to a C64, you can use the internal components in paralel. So except for the User-Port (and Datasette) the cadrige can do everything without any original C64. So "it uses all the hardware in the C64 exept..." is a bit backwards. It does not use all the hardware, it just can controll the hardware, using it as I/Os in parallel to the integrated ones in the FPGA.
A "normal" cartridge is used by the C64. This cartridge optionally uses the C64, but does not even need it (exept if you want a user port or connect orginal floppy drives or datasette).
It´s not about bad or good, it´s just a different philosopical approch. Many people into Retro Computing like to use the original C64 hardware, and expand it. The Chameleon is a very nice hardware - but more than an expansion. It can replace most of the C64 hardware. You do not even need the C64.
@@oleurgast730 The fact remains that SID, VIC etc. are used, only the 6510 and the RAM aren‘t. Each of those chips is normally controlled by the internal 6510. With the TC connected they are controlled from there. That‘s the same with the CMD SuperCPU, and I hear nobody complain about it there. The fact that the Chameleon has a standalone mode doesn‘t change the other facts. The fact that there are emulations of SID, VIC etc. running in parallel on that FPGA won‘t change that you use mostly original hardware if you use the C64‘s video and sound outputs, plugging joysticks into the C64‘s ports and use the C64 keyboard. Nobody forces you to connect a VGA monitor or use the internal floppy emulation.
Nein es gibt auch audio und Video wieder, der Sinn ist; die microelektronik ist relativ neu!
Es ist halt eine schöne Retro Spielerei, mit dem Vorteil das es stereosids, pc waves, etc. und VGA wiedergeben
kann auch wenn die alte c64 Hardware mal völlig den Geist aufgibt, funktioniert es tatelos auch als Standalone Gerät.....wenn es funktioniert 😂